You dont get to post you "opinion" in list form on a "journalistic" (those quotes need to be bold and glowing!) website and not have it be criticized.
And you don't get to bandy about words like "criticized" and get away with not knowing what criticism is. Saying "that is one bad list" is NOT criticism. It's a thinly veiled insult in the form of a nondescriptive label. Carrying on a mature conversation in a forum actually requires mature and thoughtful posting. You'd do well to retract and apologize from your indefensible first statement if you care to actually gain any sort of credibility for future posts. So far, all I see is a lot of backtracking and rationalizing. Humility is something you would benefit from greatly.
But back to the original article. Those might not have been my choices, but whatever, it was interesting to see why someone else enjoyed the games he did. If nothing else, it gave me a different perspective on games I've played, and some I have not. Thanks!
Well my list was done based entirely on how much I've gone back to a game over and over:
1. LOTRO
2. SWG (I keep hoping)
3. Horizons/Istaria
4. EQ II
5. STO
Games I've played one time:
1. WOW
2. Anarchy Online
3. Eve (I need to have an avatar that moves)
4. UO (I need WASD and not isometric)
5. EQ (after playing EQII my hubby tried to get me to play EQI - ugh)
6. Aion (economy wacked out)
7. A bunch of others that were what I call trials (I played less than a month).
Basically my first MMO was SWG - I love sci fi but have real problems with all the sci fi games out there in one way or another. Currently getting my fix by playing LOTRO mixed in with the occasional foray into STO, not perfect but it works for now.
We'll see what SWTOR does, I refuse to go anywhere near their site until launch just so I don't get my hopes up. I'm not only leery due to SWG but really feel that the whole Star Wars universe has lost its sense of humor and ratcheted up its self importance. I loved Episodes 4, 5, 6 and wouldn't care if 1,2,3 were destroyed forever.
Edit: Sheesh how could I have forgotten WOW - played EQII first then switched to WOW shortly after launch about the time the EQII servers went down (I think this was when all SOE servers were down during some kind of power problem in their San Diego facility).
There is a reason why it is called "Bill's Top Ten P2P MMOs" and not "The Best Top Ten MMOs" it's opinionated and was meant to be. This goes one step further than the usual "this game blows" "this game rocks" shit you see everyday on the forums. He actually *gasp* I know it! Explains why his choices are his choices.
While I don't agree with the choices he has made, it is just that, his choices. And while it pains me to see WoW #1 in someone's eyes I know that 6mil+ see WoW as #1 in their eyes.
Overall thanks for the explanations gives me a taste or a look rather inside the MMO part of Bill's brain.
Fair enough, but what is the value in Bill's or Ted's or Fred's top 10 list if it is just that, their fav 10 games? Any top 10 list has to be the composers attempt at an objective listing or it is of zero value to the world. And in that context the list was a total joke and should never have been offered as content on a gaming website.
There is a reason why it is called "Bill's Top Ten P2P MMOs" and not "The Best Top Ten MMOs" it's opinionated and was meant to be. This goes one step further than the usual "this game blows" "this game rocks" shit you see everyday on the forums. He actually *gasp* I know it! Explains why his choices are his choices.
While I don't agree with the choices he has made, it is just that, his choices. And while it pains me to see WoW #1 in someone's eyes I know that 6mil+ see WoW as #1 in their eyes.
Overall thanks for the explanations gives me a taste or a look rather inside the MMO part of Bill's brain.
Fair enough, but what is the value in Bill's or Ted's or Fred's top 10 list if it is just that, their fav 10 games? Any top 10 list has to be the composers attempt at an objective listing or it is of zero value to the world. And in that context the list was a total joke and should never have been offered as content on a gaming website.
Some people want to hear other's opinions and views. I read the articles here because the authors always state their opinions on matters. It's not just an automaton, completely objective MMOG news site.
Some people want to hear other's opinions and views. I read the articles here because the authors always state their opinions on matters. It's not just an automaton, completely objective MMOG news site.
So well said... this is why I read stuff on MMORPG. it's very interesting to hear what's being said, even if i generally don't agree.
PS: I have played4 online games (3 MMOs, 1 browser based strategy) in the last 6 years - me being 19 yo now. Sorry, but can't make a Top 10
Anyways, games I played: Anarchy Online (great, but old and grindy). Age of Conan (a good game, but sucky immersion). Fallen Earth (i will tell you what I think when I unsubscribe)
SF
Originally posted by nethaniah
Seriously Farmville? Yeah I think it's great. In a World where half our population is dying of hunger the more fortunate half is spending their time harvesting food that doesn't exist.
I agree with many of the people saying this is a flat our terrible list, and it is.
Warhammer number 2? Seriously. Age of Conan number 3? Champions Online even being on the list? Auto Assault a game that failed miserably and isn't even in operation?
What kind of list was this???
Yes as with every list you have to put WoW in number 1 spot for pure success.
Yes Ultima Online should be on lists like this, so should Asheron's Call. Asheron's Call continues to be a different kind of game and is approaching 11 years running and still pushing their game forward.
I was never a huge fan of Everquest, but I did play it for a bit in it's early days. But Everquest should still be on the list because it was the first MMO to go class based/quest based system which is now the standard for modern MMOs.
I hated Eve but it should be on lists like this because it covers a whole different market of people and does very good at what it does.
Dark Age of Camelot was when I really got into PvP (I did PvP during almost all my time in UO, but they kept ruining the dynamics there). Realm vs Realm was brought into the world and it was great (Yes EQ had a realm vs realm style server first, and it was fun while it lasted but the player base never really got behind it).
Overall that list was an abomination. Might as well have stuck STO and Alganon on there to make it perfect.
"Fair enough, but what is the value in Bill's or Ted's or Fred's top 10 list if it is just that, their fav 10 games? Any top 10 list has to be the composers attempt at an objective listing or it is of zero value to the world. And in that context the list was a total joke and should never have been offered as content on a gaming website."
Not wanting to get banned from this site I won't bother with the multitude of negative thoughts that came when I read the drivel you posted other than to say grow up. Too bad all these angry kids repeatedly go out of their way to point out to the world they have never picked up a real, non-electronic magazine or newspaper. Even the most prestigious newspapers in the world have an opinion page. Even the most well respected publications have Editor's Choice pieces. Why? Because its fun to see what people who bring you news actually think.
If it wasn't for the other ten thousand 'my personal favorites' lists that get flamed by every aggrieved nerd it wouldn't be so bad but dang, the hate flows steadily sometimes. I liked the list for what it was. He explained why he chose what he did and his explanations make sense. The most 'excitement' I've had in MMOs include 2 on his list in my personal top 3. Auto assault was boring from an MMO standpoint of depth, but the short time I spent there was a blast. It didn't have enough to keep me going past a few months but what I did experience before I got burnt out was more fun than anything else I've experienced besides RVR in DAOC.
MMOs that I had the most fun playing. My list being a top 5 is only because all of the other games I tried out never had any 'fun' for me. I actually regretted quiting each of the first 4 because I truly wanted the good times to continue only to be hemmed up by something that finally took the fun away. And even though I quit these games for one reason or another, I will always have great memories of the time I spent there.
Really surprised EvE isn't on that list; i agree with some rankings for the MMOs on that list, but no Eve? Now I dislike EvE but I can see how its a really good game but just not my cup of tea. Regardless with all the popularity and love about the game from the sandbox crazy peeps I find it odd not being up there.
Man... people sure do whine a lot here, i'm surprised half the community hasn't developed a stomach ulcer of some sort yet. It's just video games guys, nothing to get in a fuss over.
Anyways, I haven't actually played all of those games on your list. I've only been playing MMOs since about 2002 and can think of only a handful of P2P ones I tried.
WoW and Final Fantasy XI would be at the top of my list. Although I have played Aion, Warhammer, EVE, and LotR, I never went ahead and purchsed a subscription to them after the initial trial/beta.
Uninstall your wordprocessor - you are no longer worthy to run it. Unplug your modem - we can't have you infecting others on the internet with your madness.
WH made me love PvP - but it is gravely flawed. If it is truly the second-best MMO, then the industry is in far graver condition than even I suspect.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
I am wondering why you put Warhammer online at number 2.
I am not saying you are wrong or anything, but that was the most surprising out of the 10 entries. I was wondering you could elaborate a little bit on why that ranked number 2 over so many other games.
I played it at release and while I really liked it during beta, at launch it was a very underwhelming experience.
Nahhh what’s really funny is the people complaining about the other people stating an opinion. That cracks me up, trying to be all Seeing Eye. Then stepping on others opinions makes you better? ... Still cracks me up.
I guess he could write an article and not have anyone post about it. Ohhhh that is what we are doing aren’t we. As for my favorite game EvE... if you havnt played that game by now you have issues. And no it’s not everyone’s cup of tea, because it takes more to figure out the game. This keeps most of the wow kids away; witch is the biggest plus in my book. A few of them game should not make any list, don’t care whose writing what about whom.
I went in expecting a somewhat objective analysis of the best mmos, but as soon as I saw #10, I knew I was in for some weird shit. And the rest of the article didnt disappoint. I mean, I know arguing taste is a bit silly, but cmon, this list has to be for the lolz.
If you stand VERY still, and close your eyes, after a minute you can actually FEEL the universe revolving around PvP.
Comments
And you don't get to bandy about words like "criticized" and get away with not knowing what criticism is. Saying "that is one bad list" is NOT criticism. It's a thinly veiled insult in the form of a nondescriptive label. Carrying on a mature conversation in a forum actually requires mature and thoughtful posting. You'd do well to retract and apologize from your indefensible first statement if you care to actually gain any sort of credibility for future posts. So far, all I see is a lot of backtracking and rationalizing. Humility is something you would benefit from greatly.
But back to the original article. Those might not have been my choices, but whatever, it was interesting to see why someone else enjoyed the games he did. If nothing else, it gave me a different perspective on games I've played, and some I have not. Thanks!
Well my list was done based entirely on how much I've gone back to a game over and over:
1. LOTRO
2. SWG (I keep hoping)
3. Horizons/Istaria
4. EQ II
5. STO
Games I've played one time:
1. WOW
2. Anarchy Online
3. Eve (I need to have an avatar that moves)
4. UO (I need WASD and not isometric)
5. EQ (after playing EQII my hubby tried to get me to play EQI - ugh)
6. Aion (economy wacked out)
7. A bunch of others that were what I call trials (I played less than a month).
Basically my first MMO was SWG - I love sci fi but have real problems with all the sci fi games out there in one way or another. Currently getting my fix by playing LOTRO mixed in with the occasional foray into STO, not perfect but it works for now.
We'll see what SWTOR does, I refuse to go anywhere near their site until launch just so I don't get my hopes up. I'm not only leery due to SWG but really feel that the whole Star Wars universe has lost its sense of humor and ratcheted up its self importance. I loved Episodes 4, 5, 6 and wouldn't care if 1,2,3 were destroyed forever.
Edit: Sheesh how could I have forgotten WOW - played EQII first then switched to WOW shortly after launch about the time the EQII servers went down (I think this was when all SOE servers were down during some kind of power problem in their San Diego facility).
Fair enough, but what is the value in Bill's or Ted's or Fred's top 10 list if it is just that, their fav 10 games? Any top 10 list has to be the composers attempt at an objective listing or it is of zero value to the world. And in that context the list was a total joke and should never have been offered as content on a gaming website.
--------------------------------
Achiever 60.00%, Socializer 53.00%, Killer 47.00%, Explorer 40.00%
Intel Core i7 Quad, Intel X58 SLi, 6G Corsair XMS DDR3, Intel X-25 SSD, 3 WD Velociraptor SATA SuperTrak SAS EX8650 Array, OCZ 1250W PS, GTX 295, xFi, 32" 1080p LCD
My list!
1. Ultima Online
2. Everquest
5. World of Warcraft
3. The Lord of the Rings Online
4. EVE Online (EVE is a freaking awesome game, but I prefer high fantasy for my MMOs)
--From here on it's hard to select games as they're on my "eh" list by this point.
6. Dungeons & Dragons Online (Used to be P2P so thought it could fit here.)
7. The Matrix Online (I love how much actual role playing there was in this role playing game -- but the game itself was lacking.)
8. Everquest 2 (It's alright, but MMO sequels just seem so... wrong...)
9. Star Wars Galaxies
10. City of Heroes/Villains (I spent more time and had more fun creating and designing my character than I did actually playing the game.)
Some people want to hear other's opinions and views. I read the articles here because the authors always state their opinions on matters. It's not just an automaton, completely objective MMOG news site.
Not a very good list, no EvE but Auto Assault in there??
well mine would be.
1. EvE (Sandbox, best ingame economy and 1 server. Also continuous growing subscribers)
2. LOTRO
3. Planetside (wish i had the chance to play it)
4. SWG (pre nge)
5. WoW
6. Dark Age of Camelot
7. Aion
8. FFXI
9. Everquest 2
10. WAR
So well said... this is why I read stuff on MMORPG. it's very interesting to hear what's being said, even if i generally don't agree.
PS: I have played 4 online games (3 MMOs, 1 browser based strategy) in the last 6 years - me being 19 yo now. Sorry, but can't make a Top 10
Anyways, games I played: Anarchy Online (great, but old and grindy). Age of Conan (a good game, but sucky immersion). Fallen Earth (i will tell you what I think when I unsubscribe)
SF
I agree with many of the people saying this is a flat our terrible list, and it is.
Warhammer number 2? Seriously. Age of Conan number 3? Champions Online even being on the list? Auto Assault a game that failed miserably and isn't even in operation?
What kind of list was this???
Yes as with every list you have to put WoW in number 1 spot for pure success.
Yes Ultima Online should be on lists like this, so should Asheron's Call. Asheron's Call continues to be a different kind of game and is approaching 11 years running and still pushing their game forward.
I was never a huge fan of Everquest, but I did play it for a bit in it's early days. But Everquest should still be on the list because it was the first MMO to go class based/quest based system which is now the standard for modern MMOs.
I hated Eve but it should be on lists like this because it covers a whole different market of people and does very good at what it does.
Dark Age of Camelot was when I really got into PvP (I did PvP during almost all my time in UO, but they kept ruining the dynamics there). Realm vs Realm was brought into the world and it was great (Yes EQ had a realm vs realm style server first, and it was fun while it lasted but the player base never really got behind it).
Overall that list was an abomination. Might as well have stuck STO and Alganon on there to make it perfect.
"Fair enough, but what is the value in Bill's or Ted's or Fred's top 10 list if it is just that, their fav 10 games? Any top 10 list has to be the composers attempt at an objective listing or it is of zero value to the world. And in that context the list was a total joke and should never have been offered as content on a gaming website."
Not wanting to get banned from this site I won't bother with the multitude of negative thoughts that came when I read the drivel you posted other than to say grow up. Too bad all these angry kids repeatedly go out of their way to point out to the world they have never picked up a real, non-electronic magazine or newspaper. Even the most prestigious newspapers in the world have an opinion page. Even the most well respected publications have Editor's Choice pieces. Why? Because its fun to see what people who bring you news actually think.
If it wasn't for the other ten thousand 'my personal favorites' lists that get flamed by every aggrieved nerd it wouldn't be so bad but dang, the hate flows steadily sometimes. I liked the list for what it was. He explained why he chose what he did and his explanations make sense. The most 'excitement' I've had in MMOs include 2 on his list in my personal top 3. Auto assault was boring from an MMO standpoint of depth, but the short time I spent there was a blast. It didn't have enough to keep me going past a few months but what I did experience before I got burnt out was more fun than anything else I've experienced besides RVR in DAOC.
MMOs that I had the most fun playing. My list being a top 5 is only because all of the other games I tried out never had any 'fun' for me. I actually regretted quiting each of the first 4 because I truly wanted the good times to continue only to be hemmed up by something that finally took the fun away. And even though I quit these games for one reason or another, I will always have great memories of the time I spent there.
1 DAOC Quit when populations died
2 Auto Assault quit when the content ended
3 Warhammer quit to play #4
4 FFXI quit when there wasn't any way for me to solo any more
5 AOC just started playing and loving it
Would "wow. that is one great list." have gotten the same response?
littlemonkey
My top three would be:
1-Lord of the rings online
2-World of Warcraft
3- Warhammer online
Would not even think about putting AoC in above 5.
Really surprised EvE isn't on that list; i agree with some rankings for the MMOs on that list, but no Eve? Now I dislike EvE but I can see how its a really good game but just not my cup of tea. Regardless with all the popularity and love about the game from the sandbox crazy peeps I find it odd not being up there.
EVE isnt on the list because he probably hasnt played it or he did and didnt like it at all.
its his list stupids
1. EQ1 (prior to SOE ruining it)
2. Nexus: Kingdom of the Winds (this game broke my MMO cherry)
3. Age of Conan
4. LOTRO (music mode ftw!!!!)
5. Warhammer, endless free trial!!
6. Fallen Earth, great idea, shitty gameplay
7. EQ2, i liked a lot of the features they had at launch, but now its all stripped down to wow status
8. DAoC, only played it for a month at launch
9. Vanguard, coulda been a contenda! but failed
10. WOW, I hate it so god damn much. but my friend always drags my ass back to it when i burn out on other games
EVE should be in there somewhere...
Opinion or not, I agree. I don't want to insult either so I'll leave it at that also 8 )
"I'm not cheap I'm incredibly subconsciously financially optimized"
"The worst part of censorship is ------------------"
Man... people sure do whine a lot here, i'm surprised half the community hasn't developed a stomach ulcer of some sort yet. It's just video games guys, nothing to get in a fuss over.
Anyways, I haven't actually played all of those games on your list. I've only been playing MMOs since about 2002 and can think of only a handful of P2P ones I tried.
WoW and Final Fantasy XI would be at the top of my list. Although I have played Aion, Warhammer, EVE, and LotR, I never went ahead and purchsed a subscription to them after the initial trial/beta.
You know, this is one of the most unprofessional responses I've ever seen made by an editor. It's disappointing.
FFS! Warhammer Online #2?
Uninstall your wordprocessor - you are no longer worthy to run it. Unplug your modem - we can't have you infecting others on the internet with your madness.
WH made me love PvP - but it is gravely flawed. If it is truly the second-best MMO, then the industry is in far graver condition than even I suspect.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
Not in the least surprising to me.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
Yup. STO is a better game than WH Online.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
Maybe Bill didn't like STO.
I am wondering why you put Warhammer online at number 2.
I am not saying you are wrong or anything, but that was the most surprising out of the 10 entries. I was wondering you could elaborate a little bit on why that ranked number 2 over so many other games.
I played it at release and while I really liked it during beta, at launch it was a very underwhelming experience.
Nahhh what’s really funny is the people complaining about the other people stating an opinion. That cracks me up, trying to be all Seeing Eye. Then stepping on others opinions makes you better? ... Still cracks me up.
I guess he could write an article and not have anyone post about it. Ohhhh that is what we are doing aren’t we. As for my favorite game EvE... if you havnt played that game by now you have issues. And no it’s not everyone’s cup of tea, because it takes more to figure out the game. This keeps most of the wow kids away; witch is the biggest plus in my book. A few of them game should not make any list, don’t care whose writing what about whom.
I went in expecting a somewhat objective analysis of the best mmos, but as soon as I saw #10, I knew I was in for some weird shit. And the rest of the article didnt disappoint. I mean, I know arguing taste is a bit silly, but cmon, this list has to be for the lolz.
If you stand VERY still, and close your eyes, after a minute you can actually FEEL the universe revolving around PvP.
I'm sorry but this top10 list actually screams at the top of its lungs "DISS ME! DISS ME NOW!"