You forgot to mention that a great many people still consider WoW to be a great game, by far the best MMORPG availabe right now, and that many still are excited for Cataclym - perhaps even more so then any upcoming release.
True, right now WoW is in the pre-expansion stage and things can get a little stale.
However you are doing NOTHING other then feeding the hype machine, this trend towards over-hyping random little games and imminent failures (Tera, Rifts really? I suppose these are SO much better then AoC or WAR right?)
You are feeding the trolls and feeding the hype machine that keeps turning out bad release after bad release and making sure that WoW will always be the elephant in the room.
The problem is no one, especially not even you MMORPG.com folk, and especially not other development studios, has YET figured out why people like WoW so much, and even if they are tired of it they'll always go back, and why every new release has done nothing to kick the elephant out of the room.
And until people start realizing this, things will never change and all you'll do is continue to feed the hype for pretenders, not contenders.
BioWare is though the one studio I do have enough faith in that will truly understand what WoW did and what WoW is and have a fair shot at contending, not just pretending.
I personally think WoW is a Fine game,,, and I'm as old school as old school gets. But the reason I don't play WoW Is the Patheticly Close Minded and Naive Players,
If You Stand Against An ARMY, Stand FAST And STRONG! If Stand Against A Single MAN, Stand HARD And LONG! If Stand Against YOURSELF, What Is RIGHT Or WRONG!
I bought EQ and played it the month before WOW came out. It just wasnt' good enough game. It was that simple. I did not like Warcraft games but I played MMOs before that... I dont know where you get the idea into your head that WOW was only played by Warcraft fans.
I don't know where you get the idea in your head that I said it was "only played by Warcraft fans", considering I never said that. Come to think of it, given your response here, I wonder if you actually read what I said, or are simply taking from it what you want.
I said that a large part of its success is due to the fact that it was the next in the series of an IP that was already very successful. Hence, it had a large built-in fan-base before it even got out the door and fans of the Warcraft series would have played it even if it was a FPS.
I also noted that there are a number of other factors that made it popular that had nothing to do with players being Warcraft fans... I said the "phenomenon factor" had a lot to do with it, and that people who would otherwise not have given it a second look (ie. weren't Warcraft fans) played it just to be "part of the phenomenon". How exactly do you take "only Warcraft fans" from that?
If you want to discuss or disagree with what I say, at least respond to what I say, okay?
That said... your personal opinion of EQ is irrelevant to the fact that it was *the* game prior to WoW; and - to a number of players - still is a good game. That the creators of WoW were fans of, and inspired by EQ itself would seem to indicate that they, too, felt it was a very good game. I'm not aware of any company that is inspired to make a game modeled after something they hate.
About your "easy mode". MMOs are games.. they are NOT work... and neither are they your only life. Many of the old MMO fans consider MMORPGs to be their only life - forgetting that they should be about fun first and foremost. Thats probalby the thing that irritates ppl the most... WOW IS actually fun while many other MMOs are grindy and repetitive.
Excuse me, since when does only "easy" = "fun"? Since when does "not easy" = "work"? Perhaps for you that's the case. Perhaps for many others that's the case. But for many, it isn't. Fun is subjective and what is "work" to you *is* fun to someone else. As for the MMORPGs being people's "only life".... what an ignorant pile of tripe. There are people - many people - for whom WoW is their "only life" as well, despite it not "being work" in your opinion. There are people who spend all day playing the game, grinding away at their next piece of uber gear, or some faction, or some other goal they have. Your biased and ill-informed stereotypes fail here. Sorry.
Lets look at WAR and AOC again.. they offer pretty much the exact same questing mecanics as WOW did 3 years ago. WOW moved on and created a new lvl with flying mounts - they are still expanding on it.. at the same time AOC and WAR are still on the gound doing the same crap over and over... Still fixing what was badly broken at launch.
Well this right here just proves your ignorance of the subject beyond any doubt.
MMORPGs that came out before WoW had similar "questing mechanics". Let me reiterate that for effect: Other MMORPGs that launchd prior to WoW also had questing systems similar to it. In other words... WoW wasn't the first to have a questing system such as it has.
By virtue of the arguments you are making, you are clearly in the crowd who still believes that WoW was somehow "unique" in its design. Once again, I would refer you to the creators of WoW itself (you know.. the people who loved EQ - the game you consider "not fun" and "work" - enough that it inspired them to make WoW) who themselves have stated that what they did with WoW was took what they thought were the best ideas of other MMOs and streamlined them into their own game.
WoW brought nothing new to the genre by design. WoW was made "easy mode" by design.If both of those facts "offend" you, then perhaps you should take it up with Blizzard.
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
You forgot to mention that a great many people still consider WoW to be a great game, by far the best MMORPG availabe right now, and that many still are excited for Cataclym - perhaps even more so then any upcoming release.
True, right now WoW is in the pre-expansion stage and things can get a little stale.
However you are doing NOTHING other then feeding the hype machine, this trend towards over-hyping random little games and imminent failures (Tera, Rifts really? I suppose these are SO much better then AoC or WAR right?)
You are feeding the trolls and feeding the hype machine that keeps turning out bad release after bad release and making sure that WoW will always be the elephant in the room.
The problem is no one, especially not even you MMORPG.com folk, and especially not other development studios, has YET figured out why people like WoW so much, and even if they are tired of it they'll always go back, and why every new release has done nothing to kick the elephant out of the room.
And until people start realizing this, things will never change and all you'll do is continue to feed the hype for pretenders, not contenders.
BioWare is though the one studio I do have enough faith in that will truly understand what WoW did and what WoW is and have a fair shot at contending, not just pretending.
Why exactly is TERA a random little game and an imminent failure and how is it being overhyped?
WoW brought nothing new to the genre by design. WoW was made "easy mode" by design.If both of those facts "offend" you, then perhaps you should take it up with Blizzard.
Seriously Mike, as long as you keep publishing these kind of off arguments, you'll never understand why WOW is the elephant in the room ...
"nothing new to the genre".
You seriously believe this ? Where can I find cross server Battlegrounds? Where can I choose to do 61 leveling dungeons within 10 minutes of logging in ? Where were the millions of western paying subscribers before WOW?
Where can I see phasing techniques in high end content? Where can I go for an out of the game e-sport comeptition on ESPN?
I could fill pages and pages of these questions.
And ... it is not that a certain mechanic was "invented" before WOW, that WOW can't claim it used the technique much better and so more succeful than the original.
Question could be asked "Why did they move to a cross server BG system?" Maybe because after the initial flare wore off a lot of servers were having a hard time getting BGs to open up due to lack of interest?. "Why did they bring about the tool to allow you to hit any one of the 61 leveling dungeons with 10 minutes of logging in?" Maybe because before said tool it was near impossible to get a group to run through these dungeons specially in the lower game?"
Problem is for a game that boast so many millions of western players people were still having a hard time doing a lot of the content because it was hard to get groups. This was mostly because a majority of the playerbase was at end game and a lot of them couldnt be arsed to run through the low level stuff for the umpteenth time. In essence these changes were made to make the game easier for people to progress through the game. Today most people just camp the LFD tool because its the easiest way to progress through the levels.
While there are millions of players in the game a great majority of these players are highly anti-social. Good luck striking up a conversation with a group because it rarely happens. A dungeo run is on average 10 - 15 minutes, and aside from the occassional 'Pulling' 'AFK' 'BRB' and 'LOL' nothing is really said in chat. That is basically one of the main reasons these systems were made.
There are 3 types of people in the world. 1.) Those who make things happen 2.) Those who watch things happen 3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
There are simply no game worth playing besides WoW for a lot of people. Yeah there are some decent games but most of them are "unfinished", "unbalanced" and not what people are looking for. Im desperatly looking for a Sandbox and only game which partialy satisfy me is Darkfall and yet its not a game i want to have. A sandbox like SWG or UO or EvE (without space crap). After all its just my opinion.
Interesting, I too don't like hearing about World of Warcraft all the time. This is currently my favorite MMORPG out of the good deal i've tried within my genre of intrest. That's all that bugs me though, yes i'm sure many decent or great games are being created, but i've yet to see a really good MMO rise from the undertoe that is still within this genre. (besides DDO, a fairly nice game) I've really been waiting for something interesting to show up, that can take the place of WoW when it finally does die out. (or even succeed it)
By virtue of the arguments you are making, you are clearly in the crowd who still believes that WoW was somehow "unique" in its design. Once again, I would refer you to the creators of WoW itself (you know.. the people who loved EQ - the game you consider "not fun" and "work" - enough that it inspired them to make WoW) who themselves have stated that what they did with WoW was took what they thought were the best ideas of other MMOs and streamlined them into their own game.
WoW brought nothing new to the genre by design. WoW was made "easy mode" by design.If both of those facts "offend" you, then perhaps you should take it up with Blizzard.
Yes - WOW is unique in its overall design and execution cause it managed to put together good core RPG sysems that players want to play. They also managed to build a solid gameplay mecanics that encurrage teamplay - and they put all this onto a decent hardware platfroms and good bandwith capasity that ensured enjoyable gaming experience (in more cases than not). They also did what all Blizzard games have done through tthe years... focused on the gamer and the ability to affect the game.. be that in form or addons - in comunication - or arwork or whatever. And.. then they put in stricht rules on how to make this game as good as they possibly could before each and every patch - giving WOW the polised feel you will not find anywhere in the MMO buisness today.
Blizzard created a solid vision of a game.. They have stuck by it and expanded on it multiple times with new features that make WOW better and better. Who cares if they are the first ones to ever come up with it. I dont know who was the first guy to write a word on a piece of paper. And Im certanly not gonna call the billions of ppl that have done so since then - copycats.
Just give it up m8 - I really dont care why you bother answering my posts with these comments - I didn't like EQ or EQ2... Sooo Thats my opinion... Those games are the old dinasors... Exept that they did not do things well enough... Another company came and did that - and got the rewards.
I'm looking forward to TERA more than anything right now. It seems like it'll pull off what I sadly recently found out Spellborn screwed up. As a huge fan of fast paced combat, the game's definately gonna be tried when I can afford it, though, I do expect a full array of elitists to also play it ruining most of it. At the same time it seems like a great solo title as well, seeing as, with a good aim, anything's possible.
I dislike WoW-- every time I go on it, I feel sick to my stomach and get headaches in the first half hour, but of all the MMOs out there today, with the exception of a few very awesomely tragic titles, it's still my favorite. I don't know what it is about it, but the game has this... charm to it. I can't deny it, and because of that, I will likely be playing again in a few months. Who knows, maybe I just dislike MMOs in general now. It makes sense, seeing as a community makes an MMO, and with my general dislike towards the community of almost all MMOs forcing me to go solo, I've been driven from the genre.
People that put themselves above others put me in a bad mood. http://www.surrealtwilight.com/index.php ^Has nothing to do with that retarded Vampire Novel Series, I swear!^
[snip] And.. then they put in stricht rules on how to make this game as good as they possibly could before each and every patch - giving WOW the polised feel you will not find anywhere in the MMO buisness today.
Just out of curiosity: Is this seriously how you remember it? It's not that WoW isn't an enjoyable game or anything, but the actual norm is (or maybe used to be) this: 1) Put patch on PTR; 2) Receive a lot of bug reports; 3) Let the patch go live anyway, and come back to the bugs later...
I remember reading a study years ago about how some people are inherently more positive than others, and are thus simply unable to see various drawbacks/shortcomings. Apparently, I'm not one of those people, because where you see "a solid vision", I see a company that has backed down on the things they said they'd never do so many times, that they've now stopped saying they'll never do certain things. To me, it doesn't feel like we're discussing the same game at all, how about you?
WoW is huge and that's not going to change. That doesn't mean other games aren't fun also. There will never be a "WoW-killer" with millions upon millions of players.
Hense my recent addiction to Battlefield: BC2, and the usual S4League binges.
People that put themselves above others put me in a bad mood. http://www.surrealtwilight.com/index.php ^Has nothing to do with that retarded Vampire Novel Series, I swear!^
Yeah, the flying and gliding in Aion can be very addictive, I caught myself double tapping the spacebar when I was standing on a slope in other MMO's too to start off the gliding
Also, the facial animations in Aion are very detailed and subtle, and the character models among the most beautiful.
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
[snip] And.. then they put in stricht rules on how to make this game as good as they possibly could before each and every patch - giving WOW the polised feel you will not find anywhere in the MMO buisness today.
Just out of curiosity: Is this seriously how you remember it? It's not that WoW isn't an enjoyable game or anything, but the actual norm is (or maybe used to be) this: 1) Put patch on PTR; 2) Receive a lot of bug reports; 3) Let the patch go live anyway, and come back to the bugs later...
I remember reading a study years ago about how some people are inherently more positive than others, and are thus simply unable to see various drawbacks/shortcomings. Apparently, I'm not one of those people, because where you see "a solid vision", I see a company that has backed down on the things they said they'd never do so many times, that they've now stopped saying they'll never do certain things. To me, it doesn't feel like we're discussing the same game at all, how about you?
I have just once stumbled into a very serious bug with WOW. That was on a raid boss that reset if the tank got thrown back at the door. But then.. it happend cause of a fail safe that PREVENTS ppl to be able to pull a mob and then kill it without it able to reach them. It got fixed shortly after.
I remember this very clearly why ? Because some time later I went to play AOC and saw pretty much every single person using the kill out of reach method... And the mobs did not reset.. they just stood there and died....
And then.. I played WAR through 3 weeks of broken Choosen buffs with shields on my feet- "flying" lion beside the chopper in Altdorf- and 4 weeks of frozen scenario when someone dropped a flag into the middle (like they were supposed to do). Then EVERY person in the Scenario stood frozen in same spot .... Until they relogged or they waited the Scenario time out.
Im sorry.. but yes.. These were the next WOW killers at the time... Im sorry but you have to understand that when you have actually played a game that has a little bit of extra work put into polish.. then you start to say.. "no thank you" to these things.
WOW is the most polished MMO game out there. Partly because it also has got the most tested content with each new patch.. but THAT is both based on intrests - and also based on the fact that they actually fix the things. Maybe I should put together another report on the mobs in WAR starting zones that dissapear into walls ? I have sent that report 5 times now.. Last time it was about 4 months ago... You know what ?? Go look for them yourself.. It is always fun to play hide and seek !
Im sorry.. but yes.. These were the next WOW killers at the time... Im sorry but you have to understand that when you have actually played a game that has a little bit of extra work put into polish.. then you start to say.. "no thank you" to these things.
What you're describing now is more "better than the rest" rather than the "as good as it could possibly be" that I reacted to. I'm not contesting that the game is good, or that it's been fairly free of bugs, but not to the extent you were proposing. The AM bug, for example, was in there for years and I've no idea if it's been fixed or not. Pet pathing has always had some annoying problems. C'Thun was famously bugged for months on end, reportedly without anyone at Blizzard even being aware of it.
In my experience, my willingness to live with bugs and annoyances is directly proportional with my overall interest in the game. If the game is good enough, I'll take the bad. Some of my best gaming experiences have been in games that were lacking severely in "polish". If I'm not all that interested to begin with, any bug can trigger an outright dismissal. When I started playing WoW, I didnt mind the issues at all, but once the "honeymoon" was over, they became harder and harder to ignore. The rosy picture you (and many others) paint of the game is puzzling to me, especially since I don't know anyone (IRL or online) that haven't been critical to at least some aspects of the game or the direction it's taken... Good game? Yes. Better than the competition? Most likely. Perfect? Maybe to some, but certainly not to everyone.
There is a reason why the elephant continues to dominate the room. Most of the players that can afford monthly subscriptions...i.e. adults, want a true MMORPG model that WOW offers. It is sad that more and more development teams are looking for the "WoW killer" instead of taking cues from its success. You don't have to reinvent the wheel, especially when players such as myself don't want you to.
Too many companies are creating these pseudo MMO's which are nothing more than a 3rd person PvP slug fest. If you wan't that....go play Call of Duty.
We want co-op MMORPG's, not PVP with some leveling thrown in! What happened to teamwork, raids, etc?
Give me a new story, environment, new character classes, weapons, spells, technology...whatever, but don't change the things that work. Leave the leveling systems and skills trees alone. There is nothing wrong with them. More developers should realize this.
Games that boast PVP as their main feature, rather than an addition, will continue to fail when they are advertised as MMO's. But perhaps they really don't care. If you think about it, most of these companies only need to sell 100,000 copies to recoup their development costs. Since the games are not returnable to the store, they get to keep your money from the 50-60 dollar sale of the game, regardless of whether or not you keep a subscription.
Im sorry.. but yes.. These were the next WOW killers at the time... Im sorry but you have to understand that when you have actually played a game that has a little bit of extra work put into polish.. then you start to say.. "no thank you" to these things.
What you're describing now is more "better than the rest" rather than the "as good as it could possibly be" that I reacted to. I'm not contesting that the game is good, or that it's been fairly free of bugs, but not to the extent you were proposing. The AM bug, for example, was in there for years and I've no idea if it's been fixed or not. Pet pathing has always had some annoying problems. C'Thun was famously bugged for months on end, reportedly without anyone at Blizzard even being aware of it.
In my experience, my willingness to live with bugs and annoyances is directly proportional with my overall interest in the game. If the game is good enough, I'll take the bad. Some of my best gaming experiences have been in games that were lacking severely in "polish". If I'm not all that interested to begin with, any bug can trigger an outright dismissal. When I started playing WoW, I didnt mind the issues at all, but once the "honeymoon" was over, they became harder and harder to ignore. The rosy picture you (and many others) paint of the game is puzzling to me, especially since I don't know anyone (IRL or online) that haven't been critical to at least some aspects of the game or the direction it's taken... Good game? Yes. Better than the competition? Most likely. Perfect? Maybe to some, but certainly not to everyone.
I'm with most of what you say and I do think most of the mmo market would also be ok with some bugs and annoyances if a new game was good enough. Wow certainly had its share of bugs and annoyances at release, but people swarmed to the game because the gameplay was so good.
The real problem is that most new games have been a combination of bugs, annoyances and poor game design. This is not to say there has not been loads and loads of potential in those games, but once the honeymoon period is over they need to offer players some reason to spend their money on the new game over their old favorites. Broken, incomplete and untested gameplay just doesn't cut it anymore. The days of people funding a project post release are over.
All the potential in the world will not help a new game if it doesn't deliver a good portion of that on day 1.
There is a reason why the elephant continues to dominate the room. Most of the players that can afford monthly subscriptions...i.e. adults, want a true MMORPG model that WOW offers. It is sad that more and more development teams are looking for the "WoW killer" instead of taking cues from its success. You don't have to reinvent the wheel, especially when players such as myself don't want you to.
Too many companies are creating these pseudo MMO's which are nothing more than a 3rd person PvP slug fest. If you wan't that....go play Call of Duty.
We want co-op MMORPG's, not PVP with some leveling thrown in! What happened to teamwork, raids, etc?
Give me a new story, environment, new character classes, weapons, spells, technology...whatever, but don't change the things that work. Leave the leveling systems and skills trees alone. There is nothing wrong with them. More developers should realize this.
Games that boast PVP as their main feature, rather than an addition, will continue to fail when they are advertised as MMO's. But perhaps they really don't care. If you think about it, most of these companies only need to sell 100,000 copies to recoup their development costs. Since the games are not returnable to the store, they get to keep your money from the 50-60 dollar sale of the game, regardless of whether or not you keep a subscription.
The problem is that developers are seeing WoW moving more and more away from a 'true MMORPG' model and more toward being a game like Diablo with a ladder system tacked on. All they are really just trying to do is get ahead of Blizzard and beat them to it.
There are 3 types of people in the world. 1.) Those who make things happen 2.) Those who watch things happen 3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
It's my opinion that the only reason some people are so overprotective of WoW, is because they're scared of the big changes that're coming with these future, graphically enhanced, MMOs. I read a lot of complaints on forums for some of the new games going into testing (T.E.R.A for example), about how demanding the graphics are on their ancient PC's, and they're demanding that they tweak them for older machines. Times change, and people are wanting something fresh and new. Both in content, and visually. No one can expect to be using their 7 year old PC for the rest of forever. However, since WoW is still at the top, many people can. Because, lets face it, you can run WoW on max settings using a windows 98' with a low upgrade graphic card and 2gigs of ram.
I just think it bugs people when something nicer comes out, and they just don't have the hardware to handle it. So as soon as they try it and experience "lag" and other such problems; they blame it on the game. Then bash it and all of its players. When it isn't even the game, it's the fact that these games are being designed for modern day spec'd PCs. And all the users with the not so up-to-par machines for todays age, just can't handle it. And so they try and cook up reasons as to why everything else sucks, except their beloved elephant. Saying that the only difference are "sparkley graphics". So I hope when TERA, FF XIV, Blade and Soul, etc. come out; they force the naysayers to realized that there is something out there with just as much, if not more potential, than WoW.
I'm not saying it needs killed, but I am saying that people need to get with the modern age and stop fearing progress. It's what seperates us from monkies. As the poster said, "As a community, we can begin avoiding the elephant and see what else is in the waiting darkness, what new tricks and surprises the industry has in store."
I wouldnt give Bioware's Star wars mmorpg too much in the way of expectations. While it has a fairly good RPG developer working on it and a strong IP, that doesnt necessarily mean it will make a great mmorpg, especially one that can defeat WoW.
Maybe its just me, but the only game I see doing that is the next MMORPG Blizzard is working on. Regardless of Blizzard's budget or time in development, they have some secret recipe for success. They have raised the stakes and I'm not sure anyone else can match their hand realistically.
First off... WOW is not just big. It is big cause it has provided something that players are looking for. None of the dying "giant" before WOW ever got close to the size cause they were not as "good" games (good in terms of what ppl were looking for in MMOs"
WOW is a social game. This is a key to its success. There are alot of old school MMO gamers out here that hate WOW - cause they are not looking for socializing with other ppl to the same degree that WOW is offering.
Secondly... Bioware is now in charge of Warhammer online and all other Mythic games. Those game are stagnant and dead and no funds are put into future content for them. Thats pretty much a sign of what to come if the formula for SWTOR does not fit 100% at start. And quite frankly when you look at some of the latest Bioware RPG titles... it will not fit into what ppl are after.
WOW will always be in a leauge of its own. The reasons why noone else cares about the other MMO titles in development right now (no matter the buisness model) is that MANY companies have now tried to realise something "better" than WOW. They all failed horribly. Look at the Hype monsters of AOC and WAR... Aion is doing ok but since its not a game developed by US/EU it will never take off no matter how good it will be.
MMOs for the last 5 years have been in the shadow of an elephant? No.. they have been in the shadow of the biggest, badass, coolest looking dragon that feeds on player power. ALot of ppl get burned out ofc.. But dont blame Blizzard for it - or the lack of new features or whatever.
Games are Games... mmoRPG games should be played as "second life" - not as your only life.
Im sorry but play any game for two hours for 1 year and tell me you will not get burned out. Lets see how many will scream in anger and break their keyboards when the trader dialog in SWTOR will open up for the 50.000nd time ?
No other game in the forseeable future will be able to create a better blend of features - than what WOW has managed to. Im sorry but ppl will just have to admit that by now.
The highlighted part is a bit off. As a social game WoW has probably the least amount of socializing going on. No one hardly talks in groups (pulling, AFK, OOM, LOL, BRB =/= socializing). You even try to start a conversation in pugs and you are met with the sound of crickets for the entire 15 minutes it takes to clear the instance. The only real time you get any socializing in a group is when an item drops and people start arguing over who gets it...
The reason why WoW appealed to the numbers it did was because it was/is a 'game'. WoW trimmed out the RPG part of MMORPG a long time ago. Today its more an MMOG than an MMORPG. A mojority of people who came in with WoW are the people who wouldn't think of ever touching an MMO before because it carried the same stigma that PnP D&D carried. WoW made an MMO that was more game than MMO to appeal to these people; Tons of easily accessible items, 'everyone is a winner' game play along with the 'check your brain at the door' philosophy where the game leads you through the levels at a quick pace to end game.
There is a reason Blizard only really release sub numbers after an expansion and thats because thats when they see their peak numbers. Ever notice how they never bothered to give player numbers when China banned WoW for those 6+ months?
I have to agree with this.
Wow's true potential is in playing with friends you know IRL. The community in game is getting less and less social cause of multiple reasons. One of these is the new instance and raid search tool that simply takes you off from asking for help and look for solid partyes.
I remember how many time i was asked out to boost someone. Some of those lil nabs became best of my friends. Now this feature goes down aswell.
Players allways complain about difficulties with the game. First was the pvp system, then this, then that and wow became from what it once was a cliche mmo with 0 features except for a big explorable map that is ought to vanish aswell once flying mounts are out in cataclysm.
Overall, wow has lost everything that made it great at the start, thanks to the endless whining of noobs and the idiots at blizzard that listen to them. Even i played wow for 3 years, but now just before cataclysm i had enough of it. It has become nothing but a way too easy mass product for online nurseryes.
There is a reason Blizard only really release sub numbers after an expansion and thats because thats when they see their peak numbers. Ever notice how they never bothered to give player numbers when China banned WoW for those 6+ months?
I don't wonder. China consists of 5-6 million subs right now, that's about half or more of the current 11,5 million subs all over. Subs in China are rising, subs elsewhere are decreasing.
But Blizzard isn't unique in this, painting a bright image, that's common for MMO companies (or maybe game companies in general).
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Comments
Terrible article.
You forgot to mention that a great many people still consider WoW to be a great game, by far the best MMORPG availabe right now, and that many still are excited for Cataclym - perhaps even more so then any upcoming release.
True, right now WoW is in the pre-expansion stage and things can get a little stale.
However you are doing NOTHING other then feeding the hype machine, this trend towards over-hyping random little games and imminent failures (Tera, Rifts really? I suppose these are SO much better then AoC or WAR right?)
You are feeding the trolls and feeding the hype machine that keeps turning out bad release after bad release and making sure that WoW will always be the elephant in the room.
The problem is no one, especially not even you MMORPG.com folk, and especially not other development studios, has YET figured out why people like WoW so much, and even if they are tired of it they'll always go back, and why every new release has done nothing to kick the elephant out of the room.
And until people start realizing this, things will never change and all you'll do is continue to feed the hype for pretenders, not contenders.
BioWare is though the one studio I do have enough faith in that will truly understand what WoW did and what WoW is and have a fair shot at contending, not just pretending.
I personally think WoW is a Fine game,,, and I'm as old school as old school gets. But the reason I don't play WoW Is the Patheticly Close Minded and Naive Players,
If You Stand Against An ARMY,
Stand FAST And STRONG!
If Stand Against A Single MAN,
Stand HARD And LONG!
If Stand Against YOURSELF,
What Is RIGHT Or WRONG!
거북이는 목을 내밀 때 안 움직입니다
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
Why exactly is TERA a random little game and an imminent failure and how is it being overhyped?
Question could be asked "Why did they move to a cross server BG system?" Maybe because after the initial flare wore off a lot of servers were having a hard time getting BGs to open up due to lack of interest?. "Why did they bring about the tool to allow you to hit any one of the 61 leveling dungeons with 10 minutes of logging in?" Maybe because before said tool it was near impossible to get a group to run through these dungeons specially in the lower game?"
Problem is for a game that boast so many millions of western players people were still having a hard time doing a lot of the content because it was hard to get groups. This was mostly because a majority of the playerbase was at end game and a lot of them couldnt be arsed to run through the low level stuff for the umpteenth time. In essence these changes were made to make the game easier for people to progress through the game. Today most people just camp the LFD tool because its the easiest way to progress through the levels.
While there are millions of players in the game a great majority of these players are highly anti-social. Good luck striking up a conversation with a group because it rarely happens. A dungeo run is on average 10 - 15 minutes, and aside from the occassional 'Pulling' 'AFK' 'BRB' and 'LOL' nothing is really said in chat. That is basically one of the main reasons these systems were made.
There are 3 types of people in the world.
1.) Those who make things happen
2.) Those who watch things happen
3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
There are simply no game worth playing besides WoW for a lot of people. Yeah there are some decent games but most of them are "unfinished", "unbalanced" and not what people are looking for. Im desperatly looking for a Sandbox and only game which partialy satisfy me is Darkfall and yet its not a game i want to have. A sandbox like SWG or UO or EvE (without space crap). After all its just my opinion.
EvE doors
See the best doors on EvE-on!
Interesting, I too don't like hearing about World of Warcraft all the time. This is currently my favorite MMORPG out of the good deal i've tried within my genre of intrest. That's all that bugs me though, yes i'm sure many decent or great games are being created, but i've yet to see a really good MMO rise from the undertoe that is still within this genre. (besides DDO, a fairly nice game) I've really been waiting for something interesting to show up, that can take the place of WoW when it finally does die out. (or even succeed it)
Sorcereo's Arts! http://sorcereo.deviantart.com/
Yes - WOW is unique in its overall design and execution cause it managed to put together good core RPG sysems that players want to play. They also managed to build a solid gameplay mecanics that encurrage teamplay - and they put all this onto a decent hardware platfroms and good bandwith capasity that ensured enjoyable gaming experience (in more cases than not). They also did what all Blizzard games have done through tthe years... focused on the gamer and the ability to affect the game.. be that in form or addons - in comunication - or arwork or whatever. And.. then they put in stricht rules on how to make this game as good as they possibly could before each and every patch - giving WOW the polised feel you will not find anywhere in the MMO buisness today.
Blizzard created a solid vision of a game.. They have stuck by it and expanded on it multiple times with new features that make WOW better and better. Who cares if they are the first ones to ever come up with it. I dont know who was the first guy to write a word on a piece of paper. And Im certanly not gonna call the billions of ppl that have done so since then - copycats.
Just give it up m8 - I really dont care why you bother answering my posts with these comments - I didn't like EQ or EQ2... Sooo Thats my opinion... Those games are the old dinasors... Exept that they did not do things well enough... Another company came and did that - and got the rewards.
I'm looking forward to TERA more than anything right now. It seems like it'll pull off what I sadly recently found out Spellborn screwed up. As a huge fan of fast paced combat, the game's definately gonna be tried when I can afford it, though, I do expect a full array of elitists to also play it ruining most of it. At the same time it seems like a great solo title as well, seeing as, with a good aim, anything's possible.
I dislike WoW-- every time I go on it, I feel sick to my stomach and get headaches in the first half hour, but of all the MMOs out there today, with the exception of a few very awesomely tragic titles, it's still my favorite. I don't know what it is about it, but the game has this... charm to it. I can't deny it, and because of that, I will likely be playing again in a few months. Who knows, maybe I just dislike MMOs in general now. It makes sense, seeing as a community makes an MMO, and with my general dislike towards the community of almost all MMOs forcing me to go solo, I've been driven from the genre.
People that put themselves above others put me in a bad mood.
http://www.surrealtwilight.com/index.php
^Has nothing to do with that retarded Vampire Novel Series, I swear!^
Just out of curiosity: Is this seriously how you remember it? It's not that WoW isn't an enjoyable game or anything, but the actual norm is (or maybe used to be) this: 1) Put patch on PTR; 2) Receive a lot of bug reports; 3) Let the patch go live anyway, and come back to the bugs later...
I remember reading a study years ago about how some people are inherently more positive than others, and are thus simply unable to see various drawbacks/shortcomings. Apparently, I'm not one of those people, because where you see "a solid vision", I see a company that has backed down on the things they said they'd never do so many times, that they've now stopped saying they'll never do certain things. To me, it doesn't feel like we're discussing the same game at all, how about you?
Stop whining.
Play what you want .
WoW is huge and that's not going to change. That doesn't mean other games aren't fun also. There will never be a "WoW-killer" with millions upon millions of players.
Hense my recent addiction to Battlefield: BC2, and the usual S4League binges.
People that put themselves above others put me in a bad mood.
http://www.surrealtwilight.com/index.php
^Has nothing to do with that retarded Vampire Novel Series, I swear!^
It's called burn out.
This is the main problem with MMOs. They make us hate them, but we can't break the habit.
Yeah, the flying and gliding in Aion can be very addictive, I caught myself double tapping the spacebar when I was standing on a slope in other MMO's too to start off the gliding
Also, the facial animations in Aion are very detailed and subtle, and the character models among the most beautiful.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
I have just once stumbled into a very serious bug with WOW. That was on a raid boss that reset if the tank got thrown back at the door. But then.. it happend cause of a fail safe that PREVENTS ppl to be able to pull a mob and then kill it without it able to reach them. It got fixed shortly after.
I remember this very clearly why ? Because some time later I went to play AOC and saw pretty much every single person using the kill out of reach method... And the mobs did not reset.. they just stood there and died....
And then.. I played WAR through 3 weeks of broken Choosen buffs with shields on my feet- "flying" lion beside the chopper in Altdorf- and 4 weeks of frozen scenario when someone dropped a flag into the middle (like they were supposed to do). Then EVERY person in the Scenario stood frozen in same spot .... Until they relogged or they waited the Scenario time out.
Im sorry.. but yes.. These were the next WOW killers at the time... Im sorry but you have to understand that when you have actually played a game that has a little bit of extra work put into polish.. then you start to say.. "no thank you" to these things.
WOW is the most polished MMO game out there. Partly because it also has got the most tested content with each new patch.. but THAT is both based on intrests - and also based on the fact that they actually fix the things. Maybe I should put together another report on the mobs in WAR starting zones that dissapear into walls ? I have sent that report 5 times now.. Last time it was about 4 months ago... You know what ?? Go look for them yourself.. It is always fun to play hide and seek !
What you're describing now is more "better than the rest" rather than the "as good as it could possibly be" that I reacted to. I'm not contesting that the game is good, or that it's been fairly free of bugs, but not to the extent you were proposing. The AM bug, for example, was in there for years and I've no idea if it's been fixed or not. Pet pathing has always had some annoying problems. C'Thun was famously bugged for months on end, reportedly without anyone at Blizzard even being aware of it.
In my experience, my willingness to live with bugs and annoyances is directly proportional with my overall interest in the game. If the game is good enough, I'll take the bad. Some of my best gaming experiences have been in games that were lacking severely in "polish". If I'm not all that interested to begin with, any bug can trigger an outright dismissal. When I started playing WoW, I didnt mind the issues at all, but once the "honeymoon" was over, they became harder and harder to ignore. The rosy picture you (and many others) paint of the game is puzzling to me, especially since I don't know anyone (IRL or online) that haven't been critical to at least some aspects of the game or the direction it's taken... Good game? Yes. Better than the competition? Most likely. Perfect? Maybe to some, but certainly not to everyone.
There is a reason why the elephant continues to dominate the room. Most of the players that can afford monthly subscriptions...i.e. adults, want a true MMORPG model that WOW offers. It is sad that more and more development teams are looking for the "WoW killer" instead of taking cues from its success. You don't have to reinvent the wheel, especially when players such as myself don't want you to.
Too many companies are creating these pseudo MMO's which are nothing more than a 3rd person PvP slug fest. If you wan't that....go play Call of Duty.
We want co-op MMORPG's, not PVP with some leveling thrown in! What happened to teamwork, raids, etc?
Give me a new story, environment, new character classes, weapons, spells, technology...whatever, but don't change the things that work. Leave the leveling systems and skills trees alone. There is nothing wrong with them. More developers should realize this.
Games that boast PVP as their main feature, rather than an addition, will continue to fail when they are advertised as MMO's. But perhaps they really don't care. If you think about it, most of these companies only need to sell 100,000 copies to recoup their development costs. Since the games are not returnable to the store, they get to keep your money from the 50-60 dollar sale of the game, regardless of whether or not you keep a subscription.
I'm with most of what you say and I do think most of the mmo market would also be ok with some bugs and annoyances if a new game was good enough. Wow certainly had its share of bugs and annoyances at release, but people swarmed to the game because the gameplay was so good.
The real problem is that most new games have been a combination of bugs, annoyances and poor game design. This is not to say there has not been loads and loads of potential in those games, but once the honeymoon period is over they need to offer players some reason to spend their money on the new game over their old favorites. Broken, incomplete and untested gameplay just doesn't cut it anymore. The days of people funding a project post release are over.
All the potential in the world will not help a new game if it doesn't deliver a good portion of that on day 1.
The problem is that developers are seeing WoW moving more and more away from a 'true MMORPG' model and more toward being a game like Diablo with a ladder system tacked on. All they are really just trying to do is get ahead of Blizzard and beat them to it.
There are 3 types of people in the world.
1.) Those who make things happen
2.) Those who watch things happen
3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
Very nice article. It's so true.
It's my opinion that the only reason some people are so overprotective of WoW, is because they're scared of the big changes that're coming with these future, graphically enhanced, MMOs. I read a lot of complaints on forums for some of the new games going into testing (T.E.R.A for example), about how demanding the graphics are on their ancient PC's, and they're demanding that they tweak them for older machines. Times change, and people are wanting something fresh and new. Both in content, and visually. No one can expect to be using their 7 year old PC for the rest of forever. However, since WoW is still at the top, many people can. Because, lets face it, you can run WoW on max settings using a windows 98' with a low upgrade graphic card and 2gigs of ram.
I just think it bugs people when something nicer comes out, and they just don't have the hardware to handle it. So as soon as they try it and experience "lag" and other such problems; they blame it on the game. Then bash it and all of its players. When it isn't even the game, it's the fact that these games are being designed for modern day spec'd PCs. And all the users with the not so up-to-par machines for todays age, just can't handle it. And so they try and cook up reasons as to why everything else sucks, except their beloved elephant. Saying that the only difference are "sparkley graphics". So I hope when TERA, FF XIV, Blade and Soul, etc. come out; they force the naysayers to realized that there is something out there with just as much, if not more potential, than WoW.
I'm not saying it needs killed, but I am saying that people need to get with the modern age and stop fearing progress. It's what seperates us from monkies. As the poster said, "As a community, we can begin avoiding the elephant and see what else is in the waiting darkness, what new tricks and surprises the industry has in store."
I wouldnt give Bioware's Star wars mmorpg too much in the way of expectations. While it has a fairly good RPG developer working on it and a strong IP, that doesnt necessarily mean it will make a great mmorpg, especially one that can defeat WoW.
Maybe its just me, but the only game I see doing that is the next MMORPG Blizzard is working on. Regardless of Blizzard's budget or time in development, they have some secret recipe for success. They have raised the stakes and I'm not sure anyone else can match their hand realistically.
I have to agree with this.
Wow's true potential is in playing with friends you know IRL. The community in game is getting less and less social cause of multiple reasons. One of these is the new instance and raid search tool that simply takes you off from asking for help and look for solid partyes.
I remember how many time i was asked out to boost someone. Some of those lil nabs became best of my friends. Now this feature goes down aswell.
Players allways complain about difficulties with the game. First was the pvp system, then this, then that and wow became from what it once was a cliche mmo with 0 features except for a big explorable map that is ought to vanish aswell once flying mounts are out in cataclysm.
Overall, wow has lost everything that made it great at the start, thanks to the endless whining of noobs and the idiots at blizzard that listen to them. Even i played wow for 3 years, but now just before cataclysm i had enough of it. It has become nothing but a way too easy mass product for online nurseryes.
I don't wonder. China consists of 5-6 million subs right now, that's about half or more of the current 11,5 million subs all over. Subs in China are rising, subs elsewhere are decreasing.
But Blizzard isn't unique in this, painting a bright image, that's common for MMO companies (or maybe game companies in general).
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."