I quite like the "cartoony" or "stylized" art theme, it's just that the models and.. a lot of stuff in SWTOR simply look horrible in my opinion.
"If all you can say is... "It's awful, it's not innovative, it's ugly, it's blah.." Then you're an unimaginative and unpolished excuse for human life" -eburn
At first I was very exciting for TOR... but the more I see, the more I see a WoW clone dressed in Star Wars skin... and a large part of that IS the graphics. To me the graphics look virtually exactly the same as WoW and for me thats unacceptable. Now don't get me wrong, I don't have a problem with the WoW graphics, its a Blizzard game and those graphics are their style.. whether its Warcraft, Starcraft or Diablo.. but of course the graphics should mimic the world you are going for.. so it fit and it was fine.
However, seeing as how Bioware was making TOR.. I was expecting a lot more out of them.. or at the very least I thought they would be going a little more eye appealing.. however we don't know what influence Lucas has in this area. They may have insisted on it for broader marketability for all we know (to mass subscribers to recoup that 150mil).
The last thing I want is to play a WoW clone with a Star Wars clone and I won't. And I certainly won't pay monthly for it. Graphics is just one aspect that is seeming more and more like WoW (not to get off topic.. but the 2 sides and classes per side are starting to seal the deal.... why the hell can't the bounty hunter and smuggler be nuetral?? As I recall, the Republic wasn't too keen on smugglers so why the fuck are they aligned for TOR??). Sorry about the off topic part, I couldnt help myself.
We must remember that the game is still in development, theres still plenty of time for them to spruce up the graphics... granted we are not going to get a total overhaul and move it away from the toon-ish look.... but it can get spruced up so its LESS like WoW... and I might be willing to forgive them on graphics if they include a high amount of customization..... not just facial, but height/weight as well.
I really do hate this debates about graphics. Can we just not get past them and enjoy the GAME. I hope people who play board GAMES dont act like this. "I'm not playing with that chess set, the pieces look like crap!!"
Plus, how does this look cartoony?? Actually I was brought up in the 80's so cartoony to me has to look hand drawn. Maybe its different for kids of today?
I really do hate this debates about graphics. Can we just not get past them and enjoy the GAME. I hope people who play board GAMES dont act like this. "I'm not playing with that chess set, the pieces look like crap!!"
Plus, how does this look cartoony?? Actually I was brought up in the 80's so cartoony to me has to look hand drawn. Maybe its different for kids of today?
I think so as when I see cartoony in an MMo setting I kind of think of.
Or maybe even Champions online, but indeed the style of TOR is far from the "cartoony" as people are getting worked up over. O well they can find another game to play and enjoy themselves there.
I really do hate this debates about graphics. Can we just not get past them and enjoy the GAME. I hope people who play board GAMES dont act like this. "I'm not playing with that chess set, the pieces look like crap!!"
Plus, how does this look cartoony?? Actually I was brought up in the 80's so cartoony to me has to look hand drawn. Maybe its different for kids of today?
I think so as when I see cartoony in an MMo setting I kind of think of.
Or maybe even Champions online, but indeed the style of TOR is far from the "cartoony" as people are getting worked up over. O well they can find another game to play and enjoy themselves there.
It gets down to personal impressions and preferences, for some it isnt an issue, for others its a gamebreaker, because how a game looks is important, and if the graphics just arent up to what they were expecting.. then .. yes, they probably will go play some other game, there are games coming out with good graphics, quite a few of them before TOR even enters beta.. so.. in a years time.. when the graphics are starting to look even more dated compared to modern games.. isnt the whole issue going to be even more relevant ? at least.. to those who are affected by a games graphic style..
In my opinion, its just better if games have their own graphical styles. In this case, as you call it "cartoony", I see it allright. The human models and lightsabers could use a little remodeling, but that's pretty much it. The armors and such are funky.
I really do hate this debates about graphics. Can we just not get past them and enjoy the GAME. I hope people who play board GAMES dont act like this. "I'm not playing with that chess set, the pieces look like crap!!"
Plus, how does this look cartoony?? Actually I was brought up in the 80's so cartoony to me has to look hand drawn. Maybe its different for kids of today?
I think so as when I see cartoony in an MMo setting I kind of think of.
Or maybe even Champions online, but indeed the style of TOR is far from the "cartoony" as people are getting worked up over. O well they can find another game to play and enjoy themselves there.
It gets down to personal impressions and preferences, for some it isnt an issue, for others its a gamebreaker, because how a game looks is important, and if the graphics just arent up to what they were expecting.. then .. yes, they probably will go play some other game, there are games coming out with good graphics, quite a few of them before TOR even enters beta.. so.. in a years time.. when the graphics are starting to look even more dated compared to modern games.. isnt the whole issue going to be even more relevant ? at least.. to those who are affected by a games graphic style..
Graphics aren't really an issue (unless they are very barbaric), just look at WOW. That still has a healthy following and the graphics are very dated.
It makes me wonder, do these people that complain about the "look" of a game only interact with good looking people/objects in rl?
Don't think anyones complaining about the graphics, as they seem to be great. It's the art style i don't really care for i suppose. The human characters faces look like apes, feet are too big, as are their hands. It won't stop me from playing obviously, as gameplay is more important, but how it looks is almost as important to me. What i think doesn't really matter though as it's their game and my choice to play or not.
EQ2 SOGA models are just replacements for character models..which are what <1% of all models in game....really bad analogy, thats alot different than replacing 100% of the graphics.
and back on topic: i got no problem with graphics. graphics do not equal gameplay. The best looking games (lotro, eve, aoc, etc) i only notice the graphics for like maybe a half hour....rest of the time i dont even notice them.
Graphics, have never made a game good...it just adds on top a good game..or makes a bad game look like a good game..overall the graphics of SW:TOR look pretty decent to me...buts its the game play thats gonna make me join /stay
Played:TheRealm,FFXI,WoW,FE,Eve Playing: Nothing( stuck on a ship) Future play: FFXIV,SW:TOR
I don't like the cartoony graphics that seem to be coming with SWTOR though I understand why Bioware/LA is using them:
- Because they reduce latency
- Because they are easy to design, programme and manipulate
- Because they tie in which Lucas' god awful cartoon series which he is using as a marketing platform for his toys.
I don't like the cartoon graphics because
- They mean less immersion for me
- They mean less 'customisability'
- If the characters are cartoons then the rest of the 'world' has to be a cartoon. I prefer to play in 'a film', as it were, rather than 'a cartoon'.
It would of coruse have been possible to make a 'realistic' SWTOR - SWG was close to being 'photorealistic' though its graphics are relatively old now. There are plenty of other games, from Bioshock to ME, that show 'photorealistic' worlds are superior to 'cartoon' worlds.
So cartoony graphics ruin your immersion but playing on a computer doesn't? Using a keyboard/mouse to move and attack doesn't break your immersion. Not having smell/taste doesn't break your immersion. Hmm....
For me the models don't look cartoony at all. They don't look realistic either, but it's an mmo non of them have realistic models. Gameworld wise you can see where the compromises have been made to allow for a larger potential subscriber base. The game was never going to have infinite draw distance with realistic skyboxes and scenery, that was obvious from the start and few games do. So long as the gameplay is good, I'm not sure I'll ever notice tbh. I'll even go as far to say, if the game is smooth as a result of a lower poly count I'll be happy with the decision.
----- The person who is certain, and who claims divine warrant for his certainty, belongs now to the infancy of our species.
Graphics is not the most important thing for me, but it is pretty important none-the-less. The more realistic the graphics the better, and easier to be immersed. However, no game has yet come as far, as I truly wish. TBH all games are cartoonish still - it is getting better overall, but there is still a long way to go, and it is moving pretty slowly forward, for reasons I can understand from a sellers perspective.
Bottom line is gameplay>graphics. To me it is like with a girlfriend; what they contain is the most important, but they must be pleasing to the eye as well.
When the enemy is driven back, we have failed, and when he is cut off, encircled and dispersed, we have succeeded.
I don't like the cartoony graphics that seem to be coming with SWTOR though I understand why Bioware/LA is using them:
- Because they reduce latency
- Because they are easy to design, programme and manipulate
- Because they tie in which Lucas' god awful cartoon series which he is using as a marketing platform for his toys.
I don't like the cartoon graphics because
- They mean less immersion for me
- They mean less 'customisability'
- If the characters are cartoons then the rest of the 'world' has to be a cartoon. I prefer to play in 'a film', as it were, rather than 'a cartoon'.
It would of coruse have been possible to make a 'realistic' SWTOR - SWG was close to being 'photorealistic' though its graphics are relatively old now. There are plenty of other games, from Bioshock to ME, that show 'photorealistic' worlds are superior to 'cartoon' worlds.
So cartoony graphics ruin your immersion but playing on a computer doesn't? Using a keyboard/mouse to move and attack doesn't break your immersion. Not having smell/taste doesn't break your immersion. Hmm....
This "They mean less 'customisability'" was also completely retarded. I'm surprised the UI and taking breaks to go to the toilet aren't a concern for him. Maybe he has a hotbar in real life, hopefully he can find the log out button.
I don't like the cartoony graphics that seem to be coming with SWTOR though I understand why Bioware/LA is using them:
- Because they reduce latency
- Because they are easy to design, programme and manipulate
- Because they tie in which Lucas' god awful cartoon series which he is using as a marketing platform for his toys.
I don't like the cartoon graphics because
- They mean less immersion for me
- They mean less 'customisability'
- If the characters are cartoons then the rest of the 'world' has to be a cartoon. I prefer to play in 'a film', as it were, rather than 'a cartoon'.
It would of coruse have been possible to make a 'realistic' SWTOR - SWG was close to being 'photorealistic' though its graphics are relatively old now. There are plenty of other games, from Bioshock to ME, that show 'photorealistic' worlds are superior to 'cartoon' worlds.
So cartoony graphics ruin your immersion but playing on a computer doesn't? Using a keyboard/mouse to move and attack doesn't break your immersion. Not having smell/taste doesn't break your immersion. Hmm....
This "They mean less 'customisability'" was also completely retarded. I'm surprised the UI and taking breaks to go to the toilet aren't a concern for him. Maybe he has a hotbar in real life, hopefully he can find the log out button.
Now that you mention it...
I played ME2 for a whole weekend straight once, and on monday, speaking to my boss, I swear, every conversation I had, I saw the dialogue reticle o_o. When the boss told me she wanted me to work later, I almost chose the Renegade option...
Longing for Skyrim, The Old Republic and Mass Effect 3
They aren't making the game this way solely for the purposes of making it run better.
It's also a STYLE choice. They want the game to look the way it does, and they aren't going to let you change it simply because you want SW:ToR to look like every other game coming out.
well, by the responses so far, it does look like most (2 out of 3) people prefer a more realistic approach to graphics/avatars. Pity they didn't run a poll like this before deciding on the cartoony graphics (although I guess they decided it not for artistic reasons, but so it could run in more computers)
well, by the responses so far, it does look like most (2 out of 3) people prefer a more realistic approach to graphics/avatars. Pity they didn't run a poll like this before deciding on the cartoony graphics (although I guess they decided it not for artistic reasons, but so it could run in more computers)
I don't think you've exactly worded that correctly.
Two out of three people agree that graphics are important or nice, but most if not all say that graphics < gameplay.
As for it running on all computers, I know they said thats what they wanted, as many as possible, but to be honest, the graphic quality actually looks quite good. Style aside some of it is top notch. The environments look brilliant for starters. You've just got to get used to the player models, then you'll really start to enjoy what you see.
Longing for Skyrim, The Old Republic and Mass Effect 3
well, by the responses so far, it does look like most (2 out of 3) people prefer a more realistic approach to graphics/avatars. Pity they didn't run a poll like this before deciding on the cartoony graphics (although I guess they decided it not for artistic reasons, but so it could run in more computers)
They ARE realistic. The same way that AoC is realistic. They are ALL cartoons, just of different styles. There are just complainers on here that don't seem to like ANYTHING this game is offering but are sitting on here to troll everyone else.
well, by the responses so far, it does look like most (2 out of 3) people prefer a more realistic approach to graphics/avatars. Pity they didn't run a poll like this before deciding on the cartoony graphics (although I guess they decided it not for artistic reasons, but so it could run in more computers)
I don't think you've exactly worded that correctly.
Two out of three people agree that graphics are important or nice, but most if not all say that graphics < gameplay.
As for it running on all computers, I know they said thats what they wanted, as many as possible, but to be honest, the graphic quality actually looks quite good. Style aside some of it is top notch. The environments look brilliant for starters. You've just got to get used to the player models, then you'll really start to enjoy what you see.
No I said it correctly. 65% of the people voting so far prefer the more realistic approach instead of the cartoony approach, but obviously the cartoony approach runs in more machines (ask WoW). And you (along with 35% of the people according to the poll) prefer the cartoony graphics, but 65% don't, and that's the clear majority.
Comments
I quite like the "cartoony" or "stylized" art theme, it's just that the models and.. a lot of stuff in SWTOR simply look horrible in my opinion.
"If all you can say is... "It's awful, it's not innovative, it's ugly, it's blah.." Then you're an unimaginative and unpolished excuse for human life" -eburn
At first I was very exciting for TOR... but the more I see, the more I see a WoW clone dressed in Star Wars skin... and a large part of that IS the graphics. To me the graphics look virtually exactly the same as WoW and for me thats unacceptable. Now don't get me wrong, I don't have a problem with the WoW graphics, its a Blizzard game and those graphics are their style.. whether its Warcraft, Starcraft or Diablo.. but of course the graphics should mimic the world you are going for.. so it fit and it was fine.
However, seeing as how Bioware was making TOR.. I was expecting a lot more out of them.. or at the very least I thought they would be going a little more eye appealing.. however we don't know what influence Lucas has in this area. They may have insisted on it for broader marketability for all we know (to mass subscribers to recoup that 150mil).
The last thing I want is to play a WoW clone with a Star Wars clone and I won't. And I certainly won't pay monthly for it. Graphics is just one aspect that is seeming more and more like WoW (not to get off topic.. but the 2 sides and classes per side are starting to seal the deal.... why the hell can't the bounty hunter and smuggler be nuetral?? As I recall, the Republic wasn't too keen on smugglers so why the fuck are they aligned for TOR??). Sorry about the off topic part, I couldnt help myself.
We must remember that the game is still in development, theres still plenty of time for them to spruce up the graphics... granted we are not going to get a total overhaul and move it away from the toon-ish look.... but it can get spruced up so its LESS like WoW... and I might be willing to forgive them on graphics if they include a high amount of customization..... not just facial, but height/weight as well.
Stylized "cartoony" graphics age much much better over time than realistic graphics.
I really do hate this debates about graphics. Can we just not get past them and enjoy the GAME. I hope people who play board GAMES dont act like this. "I'm not playing with that chess set, the pieces look like crap!!"
Plus, how does this look cartoony?? Actually I was brought up in the 80's so cartoony to me has to look hand drawn. Maybe its different for kids of today?
I think so as when I see cartoony in an MMo setting I kind of think of.
http://www.station.sony.com/sonyonline/retailassets/images/retail/images/ToonTown/screenshots/toontown03.jpg
Or maybe even Champions online, but indeed the style of TOR is far from the "cartoony" as people are getting worked up over. O well they can find another game to play and enjoy themselves there.
Cartoony. Have you watched any of the videos?
http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/367/view/videos/play/1507/PAX-Demo-Video-4.html
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8e-Fl4D2NOE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E7WHHQokRGs
Here I'll grab a screenshot too...
http://darthhater.com/wp-content/gallery/screenshots/swtorwalkascreen-79.png
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer
Try a MUD today at http://www.mudconnect.com/It gets down to personal impressions and preferences, for some it isnt an issue, for others its a gamebreaker, because how a game looks is important, and if the graphics just arent up to what they were expecting.. then .. yes, they probably will go play some other game, there are games coming out with good graphics, quite a few of them before TOR even enters beta.. so.. in a years time.. when the graphics are starting to look even more dated compared to modern games.. isnt the whole issue going to be even more relevant ? at least.. to those who are affected by a games graphic style..
In my opinion, its just better if games have their own graphical styles. In this case, as you call it "cartoony", I see it allright. The human models and lightsabers could use a little remodeling, but that's pretty much it. The armors and such are funky.
Graphics aren't really an issue (unless they are very barbaric), just look at WOW. That still has a healthy following and the graphics are very dated.
It makes me wonder, do these people that complain about the "look" of a game only interact with good looking people/objects in rl?
Don't think anyones complaining about the graphics, as they seem to be great. It's the art style i don't really care for i suppose. The human characters faces look like apes, feet are too big, as are their hands. It won't stop me from playing obviously, as gameplay is more important, but how it looks is almost as important to me. What i think doesn't really matter though as it's their game and my choice to play or not.
EQ2 SOGA models are just replacements for character models..which are what <1% of all models in game....really bad analogy, thats alot different than replacing 100% of the graphics.
and back on topic: i got no problem with graphics. graphics do not equal gameplay. The best looking games (lotro, eve, aoc, etc) i only notice the graphics for like maybe a half hour....rest of the time i dont even notice them.
Graphics, have never made a game good...it just adds on top a good game..or makes a bad game look like a good game..overall the graphics of SW:TOR look pretty decent to me...buts its the game play thats gonna make me join /stay
Played:TheRealm,FFXI,WoW,FE,Eve
Playing: Nothing( stuck on a ship)
Future play: FFXIV,SW:TOR
So cartoony graphics ruin your immersion but playing on a computer doesn't? Using a keyboard/mouse to move and attack doesn't break your immersion. Not having smell/taste doesn't break your immersion. Hmm....
For me the models don't look cartoony at all. They don't look realistic either, but it's an mmo non of them have realistic models. Gameworld wise you can see where the compromises have been made to allow for a larger potential subscriber base. The game was never going to have infinite draw distance with realistic skyboxes and scenery, that was obvious from the start and few games do. So long as the gameplay is good, I'm not sure I'll ever notice tbh. I'll even go as far to say, if the game is smooth as a result of a lower poly count I'll be happy with the decision.
-----
The person who is certain, and who claims divine warrant for his certainty, belongs now to the infancy of our species.
Graphics is not the most important thing for me, but it is pretty important none-the-less. The more realistic the graphics the better, and easier to be immersed. However, no game has yet come as far, as I truly wish. TBH all games are cartoonish still - it is getting better overall, but there is still a long way to go, and it is moving pretty slowly forward, for reasons I can understand from a sellers perspective.
Bottom line is gameplay>graphics. To me it is like with a girlfriend; what they contain is the most important, but they must be pleasing to the eye as well.
When the enemy is driven back, we have failed, and when he is cut off,
encircled and dispersed, we have succeeded.
You have to like the look of a game to enjoy the game. However, when it comes to pvp relative performance is the key in any twitch based MMO.
This "They mean less 'customisability'" was also completely retarded. I'm surprised the UI and taking breaks to go to the toilet aren't a concern for him. Maybe he has a hotbar in real life, hopefully he can find the log out button.
Now that you mention it...
I played ME2 for a whole weekend straight once, and on monday, speaking to my boss, I swear, every conversation I had, I saw the dialogue reticle o_o. When the boss told me she wanted me to work later, I almost chose the Renegade option...
Longing for Skyrim, The Old Republic and Mass Effect 3
They aren't making the game this way solely for the purposes of making it run better.
It's also a STYLE choice. They want the game to look the way it does, and they aren't going to let you change it simply because you want SW:ToR to look like every other game coming out.
The graphics in this game are no more cartoony than any other MMORPG. Get over it.
well, by the responses so far, it does look like most (2 out of 3) people prefer a more realistic approach to graphics/avatars. Pity they didn't run a poll like this before deciding on the cartoony graphics (although I guess they decided it not for artistic reasons, but so it could run in more computers)
I don't think you've exactly worded that correctly.
Two out of three people agree that graphics are important or nice, but most if not all say that graphics < gameplay.
As for it running on all computers, I know they said thats what they wanted, as many as possible, but to be honest, the graphic quality actually looks quite good. Style aside some of it is top notch. The environments look brilliant for starters. You've just got to get used to the player models, then you'll really start to enjoy what you see.
Longing for Skyrim, The Old Republic and Mass Effect 3
They ARE realistic. The same way that AoC is realistic. They are ALL cartoons, just of different styles. There are just complainers on here that don't seem to like ANYTHING this game is offering but are sitting on here to troll everyone else.
I hate realism in mmos.
I would take artistic graphics like WoW & TOR over anything else.
Playing: Rift, LotRO
Waiting on: GW2, BP
No I said it correctly. 65% of the people voting so far prefer the more realistic approach instead of the cartoony approach, but obviously the cartoony approach runs in more machines (ask WoW). And you (along with 35% of the people according to the poll) prefer the cartoony graphics, but 65% don't, and that's the clear majority.