Plus - just stop allowing players to send each other any form of gold in game. Allow for gold/ISK/Adena or whatever to only be passed between characters on the "same account"(for ALT purposes). This would go a long way to stopping gold sellers in a game.
No credit trade between players? What kind of crap is that? No offense but that just seems like a horrible idea to me. I don't like dealing with auction houses, I'd prefer the gold spam to be honest, and the broken economy. I prefer being able to barter while adventuring, how SWG used to be (when It was active). Smugglers made their living off player traded credits. Awesome system IMO, regardless of the broken nature of player based economies.
Is there a major reason why players need to be able to trade money to one another ? I mean if someone is so lazy that they can't earn some money for themselves then why do some even play mmos ?
What do lazy players have to do with my post? I'm referring to placing restrictions on my game-play to fight others abusing the system. That has nothing at all, in any way to do with laziness. It's lazy on the imaginative front sure...
In as much as I see a problem with the gold farmers nowadays, I have to agree with Malickie. Bring back the player driven economy, bartering and selling crafted items instead of throwing just about everything in an AH and let it ride the proverbial wave.
The AH is more akin to the lazy players mentioned than those actively selling their wares TBH. Perhaps mixing the two, as in making only those lowly crafted items needed for quests, other crafters etc. allowed on AH and have the better crafted stuff (gear, weapons, etc.) only sellable by players. Won`t solve the gold farmers making hefty profits by crafting themselves, but would be more fun.
That sounds like a bit of a better idea, restricting trade to some sort of AH system. This would at least help, if not completely stop it. Though that has workarounds too, for example, gold seller just has you post some random piece of garbage loot up for 99999999 gold, and they buy it.
It would really take a combination of several things to work well and prevent exploiting. Unfortunately, im about to leave the office so dont have time to go into any ideas regarding that. Perhaps tomorrow.
With such a system say goodbye to old school crafting and brokering. If there's an NPC for everything who needs other players? Surely there are other ways to combat illegal RMT, that are better than placing huge restrictions on player interaction.
The problem is we're destroying ourselves (experience) instead of the enemy (Illegal RMT), with ideas like this. The key here is cut down on itemization, and the RL value of currency/items. The best way to handle that is eliminating the motivational aspects that drive illegal RMT. Game-play based on itemization.... That's what is destroying the genre for the most part, games are becoming nothing but treadmill's.
That's why no one is social anymore, it's all about the epics, and loot whoring. Remember the time when we actually played the game and it took time to accomplish much if anything? We needed players to get by, it became natural to mingle and just shoot the **** with people, because the game conditioned you for it. Everyone was just a whole hell of a lot friendlier on a community level.
Until we have something other than loot whoring to do, modern MMO's will never change.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Plus - just stop allowing players to send each other any form of gold in game. Allow for gold/ISK/Adena or whatever to only be passed between characters on the "same account"(for ALT purposes). This would go a long way to stopping gold sellers in a game.
This is a good idea. I suppose gold sellers and buyers might find away around it but without being able to transfer gold by ingame mail I cant think of how they would do it. And if you wanted to help a friend out with a few gold you could use the trade window to do that.
Plus - just stop allowing players to send each other any form of gold in game. Allow for gold/ISK/Adena or whatever to only be passed between characters on the "same account"(for ALT purposes). This would go a long way to stopping gold sellers in a game.
Some of us like playing in a world with a working economy.
Plus - just stop allowing players to send each other any form of gold in game. Allow for gold/ISK/Adena or whatever to only be passed between characters on the "same account"(for ALT purposes). This would go a long way to stopping gold sellers in a game.
This is a good idea. I suppose gold sellers and buyers might find away around it but without being able to transfer gold by ingame mail I cant think of how they would do it. And if you wanted to help a friend out with a few gold you could use the trade window to do that.
Problem, gold selling is done also by trading. They use a low lvl avatar and send you an ingame message to meet and hand it over through trade.
This may not be the best comparison, but Runescape did that and completely ruined their game and economy. Though they did many other things, this was 1 of the main things and it didn't work out well.
Is there a major reason why players need to be able to trade money to one another ? I mean if someone is so lazy that they can't earn some money for themselves then why do some even play mmos ?
I don't see how you made that leap from trade/economy to laziness. If your suggestion is that they can trade items but not money, and your reason for such a suggestion is to limit gold sellers... then wouldn't the gold sellers just sell the commodities that trade the best? It just seems you're posting a bit of a knee-jerk a reaction and not seeing the bigger picture here.
I'm just saying that there is no need for players to be able to trade currency to one another and yes there are many lazy mmo players out there that want handouts all the time. What if we had a system where noone can trade anything to one another unless it was done through an auction house ? Though I understand that no system is perfect but not being able to trade money is a idea in the right direction.
That would just be a big PITA not being able to trade anything in games.. Lets say for some reason you forgot to get arrows or something before a raid.. You run out of whatever that thing is in the middle, someone in your party does have some but oh wait you can't trade anything. So you would have to backtrack find an AH then go back. Huge time waste if you ask me.
Even not being able to trade money would suck. What if im RP a mercenary or a bodyguard type character. How am I supposed to get paid for my services? To be honest I think RMT is just something that can't really be stopped without making things harder for people who don't RMT. Which is crap, IMO id rather just deal with whats goin on now rather than not being able to trade at all.
Plus - just stop allowing players to send each other any form of gold in game. Allow for gold/ISK/Adena or whatever to only be passed between characters on the "same account"(for ALT purposes). This would go a long way to stopping gold sellers in a game.
This is a good idea. I suppose gold sellers and buyers might find away around it but without being able to transfer gold by ingame mail I cant think of how they would do it. And if you wanted to help a friend out with a few gold you could use the trade window to do that.
Problem, gold selling is done also by trading. They use a low lvl avatar and send you an ingame message to meet and hand it over through trade.
Ive heard they used a mail system but didnt know about actually meeting up and trading.
FFXI instituted a limit on the amount of gil that could be sent through the mail. So instead players went and did face to face trades with RMT in secluded spots, that of course everyone knew about. Then players set up personal shops and sold low level items to RMT for the amount they abviously bought. They also did this on the Auction House. It got to the point that every trade was monitored by GM's. So of course players basically purchased seperate accounts to do all their RMT on. All this did was inconvenience the legit players.
Plus - just stop allowing players to send each other any form of gold in game. Allow for gold/ISK/Adena or whatever to only be passed between characters on the "same account"(for ALT purposes). This would go a long way to stopping gold sellers in a game.
This is a good idea. I suppose gold sellers and buyers might find away around it but without being able to transfer gold by ingame mail I cant think of how they would do it. And if you wanted to help a friend out with a few gold you could use the trade window to do that.
Problem, gold selling is done also by trading. They use a low lvl avatar and send you an ingame message to meet and hand it over through trade.
Ive heard they used a mail system but didnt know about actually meeting up and trading.
A guildie told me that`s how he got the gold he bought online. However, about a month later someone hacked his account. lol
Dem`s the risks you take when dealing with nefarious people.
The whole MMORPG game world seems to be full of lazy players who just want to buy their way in game. There is a significant lack of motivation I see from players.
Question is is there anyway they can motivate players anymore to actually play the game and want to achieve or have players gotten to use to the hand me it all syndrome that the old style of gamers is gone.
Yeah sure some small percentage of players still enjoy raiding but many players rather sit back and play the cash shops or look to macros to do all the work. And why are there so many anti social players, all this open worlds and players rather solo or be alone.
Has anyone else seen this tide come in and stay way to long. I want the old player days back where a player was intrigued by grouping and being inclined to go out and have real fun.
I seen a few threads mention forced grouping and such, but that is not a solution. A ideal solution would be for the game company to give an incentive to players to want to really play the game and not just give up on something after the first hour. They can for starters try and crack down on gold sellers and then stop offering item/cash shops for the P2P games. Then maybe add in many rare items which are limited in the amount per server of that particular item.
It can be a combination of things but the majority of the player base of most MMORPG's are Lazy and far to anti social. Where is the pride, the pride from being able to be in your own RPG world. Your paid entertainment deserves better efforts.
LOL ... i thought you don't know you are talking about entertainment here. Don't make it sound like a job.
Entertainment .. is .. what amuses people and let them have fun. If this is not your kind of fun, find something else. I don't think anyone would want to change THEIR definition of fun just because you say so.
Plus - just stop allowing players to send each other any form of gold in game. Allow for gold/ISK/Adena or whatever to only be passed between characters on the "same account"(for ALT purposes). This would go a long way to stopping gold sellers in a game.
I had the same idea long ago, although it wouldn't work to the degree you're stating. Otherwise, you'd have to do away with any form of player-to-player selling. However, there needs to be a limit to how much you can transfer to any character except your own on a single account. It ought to be based on level, a level 1 character doesn't need 500,000 gold, period. That's clearly a gold-seller in action. The same ought to be true of gear, the level of the gear shouldn't be more than a certain level above the level of the character to keep people from buying gear. It'll also stop people from buying their way to victory by being able to pay for all the high-end gear in-game.
I've noticed more and more players declining to participate in anything that does not offer material rewards or that have any kind of a learning curve. There are still plenty of motivational players in multiplayer FPS games though; players that just want to get better at the game and don't really give a crap about rewards or unlocks. And many of the FPS games have adopted a lot of RPG elements in recent years. Which is good for me because I love both genres.
Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.
Plus - just stop allowing players to send each other any form of gold in game. Allow for gold/ISK/Adena or whatever to only be passed between characters on the "same account"(for ALT purposes). This would go a long way to stopping gold sellers in a game.
I had the same idea long ago, although it wouldn't work to the degree you're stating. Otherwise, you'd have to do away with any form of player-to-player selling. However, there needs to be a limit to how much you can transfer to any character except your own on a single account. It ought to be based on level, a level 1 character doesn't need 500,000 gold, period. That's clearly a gold-seller in action. The same ought to be true of gear, the level of the gear shouldn't be more than a certain level above the level of the character to keep people from buying gear. It'll also stop people from buying their way to victory by being able to pay for all the high-end gear in-game.
This would work for games that have guild banks built in. The ones that don't, like FFXI for example, the guild bank is usually a level 1 mule. It makes it incredibly annoying when you're dealing with hundreds of millions per week and high level items that sell slowly on the auction house. Not to mention legit guild banks being banned simply for having too much money on a level 1. Again this is due to game mechanics not allowing for a guild bank to begin with, so it's limited.
The whole MMORPG game world seems to be full of lazy players who just want to buy their way in game. There is a significant lack of motivation I see from players.
Question is is there anyway they can motivate players anymore to actually play the game and want to achieve or have players gotten to use to the hand me it all syndrome that the old style of gamers is gone.
Yeah sure some small percentage of players still enjoy raiding but many players rather sit back and play the cash shops or look to macros to do all the work. And why are there so many anti social players, all this open worlds and players rather solo or be alone.
Has anyone else seen this tide come in and stay way to long. I want the old player days back where a player was intrigued by grouping and being inclined to go out and have real fun.
I seen a few threads mention forced grouping and such, but that is not a solution. A ideal solution would be for the game company to give an incentive to players to want to really play the game and not just give up on something after the first hour. They can for starters try and crack down on gold sellers and then stop offering item/cash shops for the P2P games. Then maybe add in many rare items which are limited in the amount per server of that particular item.
It can be a combination of things but the majority of the player base of most MMORPG's are Lazy and far to anti social. Where is the pride, the pride from being able to be in your own RPG world. Your paid entertainment deserves better efforts.
While I'm sure they exist, I'm yet to meet a single player that thinks it's a good idea to buy a bunch of stuff and skill playing the game.
The sheer number of gold-sellers makes me think that there MUST be people out there buying this stuff, but like i said, i'm yet to meet even a single person that does. Everyone i know - friends, guildmates - always levels characters from start and makes money in-game. And this over 10 years of gameplay and about 30 MMORPGs worth of experience.
I've met a couple of people that have sold stuff, but no one that's bought any.
"Id rather work on something with great potential than on fulfilling a promise of mediocrity."
- Raph Koster
Tried: AO,EQ,EQ2,DAoC,SWG,AA,SB,HZ,CoX,PS,GA,TR,IV,GnH,EVE, PP,DnL,WAR,MxO,SWG,FE,VG,AoC,DDO,LoTRO,Rift,TOR,Aion,Tera,TSW,GW2,DCUO,CO,STO Favourites: AO,SWG,EVE,TR,LoTRO,TSW,EQ2, Firefall Currently Playing: ESO
The whole MMORPG game world seems to be full of lazy players who just want to buy their way in game. There is a significant lack of motivation I see from players.
Question is is there anyway they can motivate players anymore to actually play the game and want to achieve or have players gotten to use to the hand me it all syndrome that the old style of gamers is gone.
Yeah sure some small percentage of players still enjoy raiding but many players rather sit back and play the cash shops or look to macros to do all the work. And why are there so many anti social players, all this open worlds and players rather solo or be alone.
Has anyone else seen this tide come in and stay way to long. I want the old player days back where a player was intrigued by grouping and being inclined to go out and have real fun.
I seen a few threads mention forced grouping and such, but that is not a solution. A ideal solution would be for the game company to give an incentive to players to want to really play the game and not just give up on something after the first hour. They can for starters try and crack down on gold sellers and then stop offering item/cash shops for the P2P games. Then maybe add in many rare items which are limited in the amount per server of that particular item.
It can be a combination of things but the majority of the player base of most MMORPG's are Lazy and far to anti social. Where is the pride, the pride from being able to be in your own RPG world. Your paid entertainment deserves better efforts.
While I'm sure they exist, I'm yet to meet a single player that thinks it's a good idea to buy a bunch of stuff and skill playing the game.
The sheer number of gold-sellers makes me think that there MUST be people out there buying this stuff, but like i said, i'm yet to meet even a single person that does. Everyone i know - friends, guildmates - always levels characters from start and makes money in-game. And this over 10 years of gameplay and about 30 MMORPGs worth of experience.
I've met a couple of people that have sold stuff, but no one that's bought any.
Well good for having friends who are either truthful or are hiding the fact that they buy any gold, are they online friends or RL friends? Even then players look at it like a shameful thing to do so they hide it, otherwise the gold selling business wouldn't be worth over a billion total profit over all MMO games world wide now would it.
Just cause you don't know one doesn't mean it doesn't exist. And my whole thread Op isn't a rant or about gold buyers per say but the integration of buying gold and thinking I can play and get what I want and not work for it, lack of motivation.
The whole MMORPG game world seems to be full of lazy players who just want to buy their way in game. There is a significant lack of motivation I see from players.
Question is is there anyway they can motivate players anymore to actually play the game and want to achieve or have players gotten to use to the hand me it all syndrome that the old style of gamers is gone.
Yeah sure some small percentage of players still enjoy raiding but many players rather sit back and play the cash shops or look to macros to do all the work. And why are there so many anti social players, all this open worlds and players rather solo or be alone.
Has anyone else seen this tide come in and stay way to long. I want the old player days back where a player was intrigued by grouping and being inclined to go out and have real fun.
I seen a few threads mention forced grouping and such, but that is not a solution. A ideal solution would be for the game company to give an incentive to players to want to really play the game and not just give up on something after the first hour. They can for starters try and crack down on gold sellers and then stop offering item/cash shops for the P2P games. Then maybe add in many rare items which are limited in the amount per server of that particular item.
It can be a combination of things but the majority of the player base of most MMORPG's are Lazy and far to anti social. Where is the pride, the pride from being able to be in your own RPG world. Your paid entertainment deserves better efforts.
Truth be told they are still right there in the mix, the difference if one was to ask me is that again the numbers of players playing mmo's has increased exponentially since the inception of WOW so now you are looking at a much bigger pool of players to find them in. For me though I'm ultimately forced to wonder why anyone should/would care what motivates someone else in a game, I played STO from launch for maybe a month and inthat month I ha a great time while avoiding buying cash shop items etc. if the game had much more questing to do and a bit more variation I'd still be playing and enjoying it as is without spending money in the cash shop, what does it matter to me what other players do?
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Comments
In as much as I see a problem with the gold farmers nowadays, I have to agree with Malickie. Bring back the player driven economy, bartering and selling crafted items instead of throwing just about everything in an AH and let it ride the proverbial wave.
The AH is more akin to the lazy players mentioned than those actively selling their wares TBH. Perhaps mixing the two, as in making only those lowly crafted items needed for quests, other crafters etc. allowed on AH and have the better crafted stuff (gear, weapons, etc.) only sellable by players. Won`t solve the gold farmers making hefty profits by crafting themselves, but would be more fun.
With such a system say goodbye to old school crafting and brokering. If there's an NPC for everything who needs other players? Surely there are other ways to combat illegal RMT, that are better than placing huge restrictions on player interaction.
The problem is we're destroying ourselves (experience) instead of the enemy (Illegal RMT), with ideas like this. The key here is cut down on itemization, and the RL value of currency/items. The best way to handle that is eliminating the motivational aspects that drive illegal RMT. Game-play based on itemization.... That's what is destroying the genre for the most part, games are becoming nothing but treadmill's.
That's why no one is social anymore, it's all about the epics, and loot whoring. Remember the time when we actually played the game and it took time to accomplish much if anything? We needed players to get by, it became natural to mingle and just shoot the **** with people, because the game conditioned you for it. Everyone was just a whole hell of a lot friendlier on a community level.
Until we have something other than loot whoring to do, modern MMO's will never change.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
This is a good idea. I suppose gold sellers and buyers might find away around it but without being able to transfer gold by ingame mail I cant think of how they would do it. And if you wanted to help a friend out with a few gold you could use the trade window to do that.
Some of us like playing in a world with a working economy.
Give me liberty or give me lasers
Problem, gold selling is done also by trading. They use a low lvl avatar and send you an ingame message to meet and hand it over through trade.
This may not be the best comparison, but Runescape did that and completely ruined their game and economy. Though they did many other things, this was 1 of the main things and it didn't work out well.
I'll Be Back
That would just be a big PITA not being able to trade anything in games.. Lets say for some reason you forgot to get arrows or something before a raid.. You run out of whatever that thing is in the middle, someone in your party does have some but oh wait you can't trade anything. So you would have to backtrack find an AH then go back. Huge time waste if you ask me.
Even not being able to trade money would suck. What if im RP a mercenary or a bodyguard type character. How am I supposed to get paid for my services? To be honest I think RMT is just something that can't really be stopped without making things harder for people who don't RMT. Which is crap, IMO id rather just deal with whats goin on now rather than not being able to trade at all.
Ive heard they used a mail system but didnt know about actually meeting up and trading.
FFXI instituted a limit on the amount of gil that could be sent through the mail. So instead players went and did face to face trades with RMT in secluded spots, that of course everyone knew about. Then players set up personal shops and sold low level items to RMT for the amount they abviously bought. They also did this on the Auction House. It got to the point that every trade was monitored by GM's. So of course players basically purchased seperate accounts to do all their RMT on. All this did was inconvenience the legit players.
A guildie told me that`s how he got the gold he bought online. However, about a month later someone hacked his account. lol
Dem`s the risks you take when dealing with nefarious people.
LOL ... i thought you don't know you are talking about entertainment here. Don't make it sound like a job.
Entertainment .. is .. what amuses people and let them have fun. If this is not your kind of fun, find something else. I don't think anyone would want to change THEIR definition of fun just because you say so.
I had the same idea long ago, although it wouldn't work to the degree you're stating. Otherwise, you'd have to do away with any form of player-to-player selling. However, there needs to be a limit to how much you can transfer to any character except your own on a single account. It ought to be based on level, a level 1 character doesn't need 500,000 gold, period. That's clearly a gold-seller in action. The same ought to be true of gear, the level of the gear shouldn't be more than a certain level above the level of the character to keep people from buying gear. It'll also stop people from buying their way to victory by being able to pay for all the high-end gear in-game.
Played: UO, EQ, WoW, DDO, SWG, AO, CoH, EvE, TR, AoC, GW, GA, Aion, Allods, lots more
Relatively Recently (Re)Played: HL2 (all), Halo (PC, all), Batman:AA; AC, ME, BS, DA, FO3, DS, Doom (all), LFD1&2, KOTOR, Portal 1&2, Blink, Elder Scrolls (all), lots more
Now Playing: None
Hope: None
I've noticed more and more players declining to participate in anything that does not offer material rewards or that have any kind of a learning curve. There are still plenty of motivational players in multiplayer FPS games though; players that just want to get better at the game and don't really give a crap about rewards or unlocks. And many of the FPS games have adopted a lot of RPG elements in recent years. Which is good for me because I love both genres.
Vault-Tec analysts have concluded that the odds of worldwide nuclear armaggeddon this decade are 17,143,762... to 1.
This would work for games that have guild banks built in. The ones that don't, like FFXI for example, the guild bank is usually a level 1 mule. It makes it incredibly annoying when you're dealing with hundreds of millions per week and high level items that sell slowly on the auction house. Not to mention legit guild banks being banned simply for having too much money on a level 1. Again this is due to game mechanics not allowing for a guild bank to begin with, so it's limited.
While I'm sure they exist, I'm yet to meet a single player that thinks it's a good idea to buy a bunch of stuff and skill playing the game.
The sheer number of gold-sellers makes me think that there MUST be people out there buying this stuff, but like i said, i'm yet to meet even a single person that does. Everyone i know - friends, guildmates - always levels characters from start and makes money in-game. And this over 10 years of gameplay and about 30 MMORPGs worth of experience.
I've met a couple of people that have sold stuff, but no one that's bought any.
"Id rather work on something with great potential than on fulfilling a promise of mediocrity."
- Raph Koster
Tried: AO,EQ,EQ2,DAoC,SWG,AA,SB,HZ,CoX,PS,GA,TR,IV,GnH,EVE, PP,DnL,WAR,MxO,SWG,FE,VG,AoC,DDO,LoTRO,Rift,TOR,Aion,Tera,TSW,GW2,DCUO,CO,STO
Favourites: AO,SWG,EVE,TR,LoTRO,TSW,EQ2, Firefall
Currently Playing: ESO
Well good for having friends who are either truthful or are hiding the fact that they buy any gold, are they online friends or RL friends? Even then players look at it like a shameful thing to do so they hide it, otherwise the gold selling business wouldn't be worth over a billion total profit over all MMO games world wide now would it.
Just cause you don't know one doesn't mean it doesn't exist. And my whole thread Op isn't a rant or about gold buyers per say but the integration of buying gold and thinking I can play and get what I want and not work for it, lack of motivation.
Truth be told they are still right there in the mix, the difference if one was to ask me is that again the numbers of players playing mmo's has increased exponentially since the inception of WOW so now you are looking at a much bigger pool of players to find them in. For me though I'm ultimately forced to wonder why anyone should/would care what motivates someone else in a game, I played STO from launch for maybe a month and inthat month I ha a great time while avoiding buying cash shop items etc. if the game had much more questing to do and a bit more variation I'd still be playing and enjoying it as is without spending money in the cash shop, what does it matter to me what other players do?
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....