Howdy, Stranger!
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Quick Links
When I think Jedi....
Mordeath
Member Posts: 131
I think this...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgvzSDcCH4g
Not this... (just another of 4 equal classes, you know alongside the trooper!)
http://www.swtor.com/info/holonet/classes
"When everyone is special, no one is" - Buddy Pine (aka Syndrome)
Comments
Jedi == tank
Well shave my back and call me an elf! -- Oghren
I don't get your argument.
First you compare a single player game to an MMO which seems a bit odd, then you imply a game with 8 classes in is less unique than a game with only one. So if unleashed 2 was an MMO wouldnt that mean everyone would play a single Jedi.
Maybe I misunderstood what you was trying to say.
Trooper is Tank , Jedi Knight is DPS as stated by James Ohlen Creative Director and Lead Designer.
i watched the e3 videos and the bioware guy they inteviewed said jedi was tank.
.
he also said something about speccing into different areas ala a WoW warrior
Well shave my back and call me an elf! -- Oghren
This game is full of grey. While Trooper may be the main "Tank" class, he has teeth. He can do damage. Similarly, the Jedi will have tanking capabilities, but will be better at DPS. This means you don't have to wait for a Trooper if you have a Knight in your group.
Trooper - 70% Tank, 30% DPS? Jedi - 70% DPS, 30% Tank? We don't know the real percentages, but that's basically what it is. Consular, from what I've seen, seems like 80% Heal, 20% DPS, and Smuggler is a Jack-of-All-Trades: mainly CC and DPS with a few backup heals thrown in.
I think it was Dallas who said there were multiple classes that can tank. I'm not for sure if it will require both the specialization and gear or if it's possible to either or. We know that the Juggernaut Sith Warrior is prone to withstanding a beating, so I imagine the specializations for sure will make a difference.
i'm pretty sure he said the trooper was tanking, not that it is the tank class. I think the jedi was with have the same diversification as the sith warrior, we just happened to see a Jedi specced as DPS.
I see Jedi more like Paladin Rogues
The only game that actually represented powers of light side like they are supposed to be was Jedi Knight series.
Mind Trick = Invisibility ( mental ) lesser enemies simply dont see Jedi at all , or dont want to attack him
Self heal = Yes, Jedi can heal using force - as opposed to dark side that can harm using force
Absorb = Jedi can absorb force powers ( lighting, push,choke) and transfer them to force energy
Speed = Jedi can accelerate themself to incredible speeds
...
So Rogue because they can surgically strike key enemies , and Paladin because they can self heal and absorb damage.
Sith are mor focused on damage. So they are kind of Tank / Berserker / Necromancers
With powers like : Harm , Rage , Lightning , Choke
Force Unleashed is probably the last thing I think about when it comes to Jedi, given the protagonist could destroy any other jedi/sith ever with the moves he pulls off with ease.
I don't mind the TOR Jedi at all, they seem a little more reasonable (maybe minus the stopping lightsaber with hands and jedi hadoukens in the recent trailer).
If I had the Force, I wouldn't be as cool as any of them anyhow, I'd settle for just being able to pull the remote to me when its on the floor, or feed me potato chips so my fingers don't get greasy.
@ Lobotomist
I think the Dark Forces/JK series was also a great depiction of the Jedi/Sith.
Good thoughts.
You, good sir, should win the award for "Best Use of a Fictional Power." Beats me using an Imperator Titan to destroy the local DMV.
I think the OP's problem is that they have this conception portrayed in certain games and in the first 3 made SW films that a Jedi / Sith is all powerful and everyone else is weaker than them. But this isn't necessarily the case. It purely depends on the circumstances of the context in which they are portrayed.
For instance, when theres 1000 jedi running around, the concept of a jedi is no longer unique. Consequently the role is portrayed more like a standard melee one of an infantry soldier with some special talents. However, if there's only a handful left, then their uniqueness is exaggerated and their status becomes elevated above all others.
This is were the likes of SWG Pre-CU and SW:FU differ to the SWG we have now and SWTOR. In the former games, the Jedi / Sith are presented as higher up in the heirachy, but in the latter games they are presented as a role that is on a par with others in terms of potency.
To be honest, I don't see a problem with it. But I suppose its purely down to the individual, it might be a culture shock to some people.
Top 10 Most Misused Words in MMO's
Am I the only one who understands the OP?
Jedi are NOT balanced. The cinematic that showed a footsoldier SHOULDER CHARGE THREE SITH LORDS, was beyond dumb. This is not Star Wars.
Consider this: Do you think that the soldiers of today are more sophisticated and capable than soldiers 1000 years ago?
Likewise, a Sith Lord in the Star Wars film era may be considered much more powerful than those 1000's of years earlier. Meaning that other "classes" may not be as fearful of jedi's and sith and are therefore more prone to be able to tackle them (or at least try).
Top 10 Most Misused Words in MMO's
How do you know they were Sith Lords?
That's wrong. They weren't "lords", they were common footsoldiers, we know how well footsoldiers fair against elite commandoes, right? He charged ONE sith main character, Malgus, I think? That commando that rushed them was a main character as well, from the comic. They are both elite. If you think a jedi or sith is the best of the best, remember that there are many ways to beat a force user. We've seen it, read it and played it (remember Atton Rand?)
I think too many people have the misconception that force users are the end-all-be-all of Star Wars. There are some elite individuals throughout the Star Wars universe that show this to be false. Commandoes, smugglers, spies (and such like agents) and ofcourse bounty hunters have all been able to defeat jedi. Try the expanded unverse as well, good stuff in there. So get that dumb misconception out of your head right now. It's going to be a level playing field, I hope.
Edit: I forgot to mention Mandalorians, they seemed to fair well against jedi.
The logic works both ways, then footsoldiers would not be as powerful a thousand years ago.
The point is moot though, because its quite clear that the Jedi fight the exact same way, and with the over the top force powers, it could be argued they are MORE powerful, not less.
If you sacrifice the story for balance, why bother even making an MMO based on that IP? While SWG had a TERRIBLE Jedi system, at least it didn't totally destroy the lore.
And no, he didn't charge one. He charged straight at two, who watched him come, and then he just ducks and flipped both over his shoulder. Charged straight at a lightsaber. Were the Sith knights suddenly struck by retardation? And then he tackled a sith lord, which, wasn't that bad, until you consider, if the sith was powerful enough to do the crazy moves he had been doing, he should have sensed someone blindly rushing him.
Agreed. Thats basically my point. SWG Pre-CU and other Star Wars games portrayed the Jedi / Sith as an elevated class above all others.
Whereas SWG post-CU and SWTOR portray them on a more level playing field with the rest. I expect more to complain about this both before and after launch. Their complaints are unwarranted though. This is a different game to the others.
Top 10 Most Misused Words in MMO's
As has mentioned before, Jedi's and Sith are NOT all-powerful classes like they are portrayed as in certain other games such as SW:FU. Plenty of fiction has been written which contradicts this concept. It all depends on the story and the context.
No one is sacrificing story for balance here. Its just YOUR pre-conception of what a Jedi / Sith should be is what is under question. And that pre-conception is based on specific other games. People need to learn to get that conception out of their heads, because it won't be applicable in specific regards to the Jedi / Sith classes in SWTOR. Its a more level playing field.
Top 10 Most Misused Words in MMO's
We're not going to start delving into non connon fan fiction or we'd be here all day. Let's go by what the six Star Wars movies have shown us. That by and large, the most powerful force in the Galaxy. It takes large numbers, or incredibly unique individuals to best them.
Unless every other character in SWTOR is at the skill level of Boba Fett (in which case, that would render Boba Fett, as a character, not unique at all) then the Jedi should be higher than the rest.
Here is my point if you watch the trailer.
A Jedi is an ultimate bad ass. Not some dude who is on par with a smuggler or trooper. Seriously, a jedi ( or sith ) can destroy mass quantities of stuff. By dumbing down the jedi to be on par with other classes they are less "special" because for 1) anyone can be one and 2) the other classes are on par with them. That was my point, jedi's are the epitome of uber, they are not the same as troopers or smugglers or even bounty hunters for that matter.
Especially not in that trailer when a Jedi literally destroyed a giant rock face with one force push.
Garvon, you are basing your entire conception of a jedi on a particular set of fiction and not others. Whole books have been written which give more depth to the Star Wars universe than what those films do. Games have been written portraying the Jedi and Sith from various points of view.
If you want to narrow your perception of what a Jedi or Sith should be then you have no one else to blame but yourself.
1000's of years prior to Vader things were very much different. The point is that you cannot apply the preconceptions formed from the Star Wars films to an era that takes place 1000's of years earlier.
Anyhow,SWTOR is what it is. Just because you want to see Jedi / Sith portrayed as all-powerful based on select fiction, doesn't mean that they have to be. I don't agree with your point of view so we'll have to agree to disagree on this. If you don't like how the Jedi and Sith are on a more level playing field with other classes, then I guess you won't be playing the game. In that case, its pointless discussing this at all.
Top 10 Most Misused Words in MMO's
First off, if you can pick and choose what obscure pieces of fan fiction you want to decide is "real" Star Wars you can. I'm going to stick with the official portrayal that everyone else knows and recognizes to be true.
Second, 1000s of years before Vader, things were not very different at all.
If you've ever played KOTOR 1 and 2, you know, the games this MMORPG is based off of, the Jedi and Sith were STILL all powerful forces of destruction, and were NOT on par with normal people.
Sorry if I come across as harsh, but you're only seeing the side you want to.
For the thousandth time this is a GAME, second of all this is thousands of years before the movies and as you can see both technology and the force are at a high level. Yes Based off and continuation of...but is part of the Expanded Universe of starwars and has alot of things that you dont see in the movies, and new force powers are one of them.
But hey if you want to play a game where the jedi have like 4 powers, be my guest.
The Elite special forces trooper, much like the mandalorians who fought the jedi for some time are use to Jedi/Sith. The troops there are apprentices for the most part not lords..there was one Lord and that was Malgus a main character, which took two other main characters too keep at bay.
These are NOT players, this is a storyline trailer...with a few bits of game added in.