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I want to believe this is not WoW in space with extra stories
Amathe
Member LegendaryPosts: 7,630
Honestly. I want this game to be great. I want to play it and enjoy it for years.
But I'm having a hard time seeing how this is that much different than WoW. Can someone set me straight and help make a believer out of me? Help me understand how really fresh and new and "not-WoW" this is going to be.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
Comments
Well bugger I now see there is a thread on this. My apologies. I will go read that one.
EQ1, EQ2, SWG, SWTOR, GW, GW2 CoH, CoV, FFXI, WoW, CO, War,TSW and a slew of free trials and beta tests
You do realize WoW just copied every other game and is a mash up of all the good things about the games that came before it
If SWTOR copies WoW and has a great story that has player choices then it has already one upped WoW and has revolutionzed the MMO genre
SWTOR isent reinventing the wheel, its taking the tired old reliable wooden wheel that WoW is and pimping that ride the *** out and me as a Bioware fan absolutely love them for it
You cant just call this a WoW clone, because in WoW all you do is kill 10 bear quests to max level then start raiding, in SWTOR every quest is a story that can change depending on your dialogue choices, if you find that comparable in the least bit you clearly havent played enough MMO's to see just how far apart and diffrent they really are
This is not World of Warcraft but Star Wars: The Old Republic... Try to stop flaming this game under development. most MMO's share a basis these days as it has become required by the communicty. Look what Bioware has to offer and look at it from a positive perspective. It is easy to compare something with an old item. It is much harder to see the new features in something new if you can't distance yourself from comparing it with an old item.
Humans are compared with monkeys as they have similar things. This does not mean that we are monkeys even though we share similar behaviours..
More like 'KotOR on Internet with extra players,' really. Although the UI is very WoW, it's frankly just a UI.
That's because we're apes.
Many MMO's have a similar UI as it is user friendly.. does that make it a WoW clone ?
I'll make an exception just for you then
I was agreeing with you. Monkeys ≠ apes.
I know, monkeys are a lot cuter than apes though...
Okay.
Well, forget the space already.
Because space is having a room called "spaceship" that will serve as a loading screen to upload graphics for your next planet walk.
Space will be as absent as water in the desert. You may "think" it is there, but you'll have to imagine it as a kind of fata morgana.
Add Non player characters (NPC's) as active "players" and a few hundred prerecorded voiced over speeches and in game cinematics and ... you are ALL set :
"Go fetch me some 10 pigs on that red planet with this Holy Light sabre young paladin".
"And please don't choose another option as the 3 I am offering you standard in my prerecorded voice over quest giving."
"A. go east -- B. go west --- C. No not interested."
Of course the above sentence will take 45 seconds of epic NPC speeches.
So sad some people think this will add to the gameplay of an mmorpg .
Its embarrassing when an NPC compliments you in an MMo, the only relevant, cool and epic things come from players whispering you Grtz, mate, we did it. copyright Pilnkplonk
So sad that people think that Bioware doesn't know what it's doing when it comes to storytelling and make it work as an addition to the gameplay in a MMO.
Even sadder if people keep on trolling about a game they're not gonna be playing anyway.
For those who want actual information what is gathered from all the interviews and demos, take a look here:
Information gathered on SW TOR so far
Also this interview with Daniel Erickson is interesting, where he talks about being able to not follow the storyline but doing your own thing while playing, the massiveness of the SW TOR worlds, how when you do follow the storylines it'll be a fully unique experience per class, and how Companions can be used when you're missing a class in the group formation, like healer or dps:
Daniel Erickson interview on Viddler
NP: storytelling with ingame cinematics and enhanced dialogues will also be very much present in GW2 and TSW, so people who dislike that might very well skip those games too, just an advice.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
I too hope that you're right, but i'm not too optimistic about it; reason being, WoW took various aspects from different games and combined it into one, and made it work, there are bound to be certain similarities.
<QQ moar plz. kkthxbai.>
Before coming in and insult people for trolling...
You could first answer
Why it doesn't have space...as an active part in a Star Wars game.
And why in God's name NPC's are used as active partners in a multi mass on line game players game ?
Odd : I state FACTS and you keep calling me a troll.
I merely point out the huge unaswered questions many have: ... NPC's to serve as players and space ships that only serve to upload the next planet content ... you walk on.
Its embarrassing when an NPC compliments you in an MMo, the only relevant, cool and epic things come from players whispering you Grtz, mate, we did it. copyright Pilnkplonk
Who said I was talking about you? I was talking about trolls that keep posting in forumsection of games they don't intend to play in general, there are more of those around - I could even point you to several of those if you like, if it wouldnt get me a warning. If you don't feel you're one of those, then it's not meant for you.
Oh, btw, storytelling with ingame cinematics and enhanced dialogues will also be very much present in GW2 and TSW, so if you really dislike that you might very well skip those games too, just an advice.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Well I had a thread on this very forum about the lack of space in SW:TOR and got a warning for trolling and the thread was deleted so it shouldn't surprise you.
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http://www.thesecretworld.com/buy/
OR PM ME FOR A BUDDY KEY (need your email address).
The epic moments in an MMORPG do not come out of the mouth of a prerecorded NPC with a staged prerendered video footage.
Here and seek out what the man behind the most succesful MMO game ever has to say about that:
http://www.wow-europe.com/wowanniversary/video/?v=Jeff_Kaplan_Q2#video
Watch his last two sentences: "... but really it was the moments that the players created that stand out, more than anything, more than any moment that we could have created in the Warcraft universe. "
NPS companions, NPC talkies and prerecorded cinematics having nothing to do with an MMORPG gameplay. They even hamper the players interactions needed in an MMORPG.
Its embarrassing when an NPC compliments you in an MMo, the only relevant, cool and epic things come from players whispering you Grtz, mate, we did it. copyright Pilnkplonk
Oh, to answer your questions on a very rare occasion of showing goodwill - since my 1st post was intended to provide what is known of actual information to people who might be interested in it in this thread like the OP, not as a reply to your post:
- there is space exploration and they will add some space experiences since that is what has been mentioned, but probably no space combat a la EVE or JTL since they havent mentioned it so far. Why? If it won't be in there, then it's simple, because they haven't devoted their resources to it. SWG didn't have it at launch as well.
- Companions are more like enhanced and versatile pets, or the Heroes in GW but then without them filling up spots in the group as in GW. Which you would know if you'd actually read some more the information that was available instead to clinging what you believe SW TOR should/will be. A team of 4 can still be a team of 4 whether the players bring or don't bring the Companion pets with them; if they bring it, it'll only add more versatility in the team functioning.
And that's why you should stick to playing your WoW and not play SW TOR, GW2 or TSW or sortlike MMO's at all, since you're so blinded by those games having that game aspect that you're fully unwilling to see the other game aspects those games will also bring. They add storytelling to MMORPG each with ingame cinematics among other things, they don't replace the other game elements with it.
I don't know why I even bother, I can keep repeating it but it won't penetrate through thick skulls, and you will keep repeating your mantras whatever anyone else says.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Nope I am talking CORE MMO design here and you are all out defending a game that isn't even out ... BUT that is using OFF line solo game mechanics that simply will not work in a game where player interaction is priority NUMBER ONE.
I can express this opinion about core MMO design - or lack off - in a constructive way whenever and wherever I want without the need of calling out the word "troll".
Quite clear.
Its embarrassing when an NPC compliments you in an MMo, the only relevant, cool and epic things come from players whispering you Grtz, mate, we did it. copyright Pilnkplonk
Its funny Jeff would say that but since I think he is an idiot anyway... What Bioware is trying to do is add the RPG back into MMOs. WoW has turned the genre into action titles. YOU as the player decide NOTHING. You can pick up any class as leveling is a 3 week experience tops. You have roles and only have certain viable specs you don't pick your talents at all. And the only memories players make are "Hey man remember that time Sephiroth was high and ran into the Mimiron bombs and wiped us?... Good times". Your choices have zero impact on the world and are little more than annoyances to other players in a raidverse.
Now is what Bioware doing gonna make a better MMORPG. I'm not terribly sure, I don't think so. I do think large scale player interaction during quests is actually overrated and most people find that unnesscesary and only need a chat window to make new friends or contact their RL ones. Something has to actually feel like an epic accomplishment for you to actually care about doing it with people I think. Hopefully SWTOR can deliver that. Companions, Voice Overs and Dialogue choices are more likely to deliver that feeling than not.
Ah and here I differ because the blue is putting you OUT of the MMO every time you are occupied with them.
Everything that is too prerecorded (and don't forget VERY limited), pre arranged and pre rendered is driving you by the nose and you'll get nuts after a few weeks.
They are delivering you a single line game experience putting you even more into the solo part of the game.
Like Kaplan said; it is the overall experience that creates the story for MMo players, no need to introduce NPC heroes in an MMORPG to play with you side by side.
Just one example: they talk about ... 4 man Battlegrounds .... because each player will have his own companion along, which already makes for an "awesome " 16 (N)PC battle.
PvP with your AI NPC's. ... I see the difficulties already.
Not even talking about balance questions: 4 man dungeons ?? For what - with or without NPC's ??? If I bring them along will they be harder or equal. So in fact is it for 8 man ? or not Oh I see it will not be that important... ??
The introduction of NPC henchmen were already a disaster in GW, "Sorry guy, I need to level my NPC , no help needed tx , they just needed to delete them in the first place.
The question is deleted what? The player or your companion ?
Its embarrassing when an NPC compliments you in an MMo, the only relevant, cool and epic things come from players whispering you Grtz, mate, we did it. copyright Pilnkplonk
storytelling/voice overs/dialogues: SW TOR, TSW and GW2, all those will have it and will have lots of it. People who don't like it, there's the direction to other MMO's to play.
Gameplay besides the storylines: yes, GW2 will have it, and with SW TOR it will even be possible to go fully offtrack and ignore the storylines and do your own thing, if that's your liking.
Companions: they will be like very smart, enhanced pets as they are in other MMO's. What, pets are suddenly disastrous when it comes to group play and SW ToR?! Please, people...
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
I hope people understand that storylines and dialog don't matter in end game which is where most games die out anyway.
The problem is not the general story SETTING. Every decent MMORPG has a story SETTING and Lore. The problem comes with the individual story TELLING.
And I very much read on GW2 and that's a complete diffferent story SETTING PLAYERS are creating and changing.
There is a big difference in approach and it will cost Bioware and EA dearly in long term subs (personal opinion but I can feel the MMo waters).
Companions WILL and CAN fill in the roles of absent players. Clearly stated by Bioware. So which is it? Their version or yours? and think about the consequences...
Companions are even having a "life" and own story telling behind them and play roles to replace "healers, dps, tanks even".
Is the group content attuned for the companions or not? 2, 4 man or 8 man (or perhaps for 2 and a half man). 4 man Battlegrounds as a solution...
Pfff: this game should have been awesome. Now it is a fairy tale told by an intelligent NPC.
Topic: Even space is just story telling.
Its embarrassing when an NPC compliments you in an MMo, the only relevant, cool and epic things come from players whispering you Grtz, mate, we did it. copyright Pilnkplonk
Phrases that are getting really on my nerves as time goes :
Voice overed MMO means innovative/awesome MMO
Swtor does not copy wow because wow copied other games (but clearly TOR IS copying WoW)
Excuse that Tor is JUST enhancing well-working mechanics ...god damn it this is no excuse for such a huge budget
TOR will be the best game ever and it will change the MMO scene....*TIRED*
Its 10 months from release - things will change! ...people here really dont know what trouble is with launching an MMO
Space combat will be an expansion
The game will be well polished! ...seriously guys..where are you getting that??
Dont like it, dont tell us, dont play it ...welcome to the age of no discussion allowed
Much more content will be shown, BW is just tight-lipped ...no they arent(they showed us space ships in the time they didnt even know if they'll be customizable)
...
there are more but those are THE ones I trully hate...
Dont get me wrong Im no hater, Im just looking objectively at the game and I will play BECAUSE of the story...but that doesnt make it AAA MMO...
I like SWTOR but god dont be such a blind sheeps some of you here...
Oh and I totally forgot the "you didnt play it, dont judge(badly, good review is ok)" phrase...this is the most stupid probably
I think I actually spent way more time reading and theorycrafting about MMOs than playing them
No, they will not, not as you stated it. A team of 4 players will be a team of 4 players, whether it will be with 4 Companions or not with 4 Companions they brought along.
The way the Companions can replace a class that isn't represented is that if it's like 2 tank-like characters and 2 dps-like characters, they can bring 4 healing-type Companions that can fill in that gap of the lack of a healer.
If a group consists of 4 players, that is 2 healer types and 2 tank types, they can decide to bring all DPS-type Companions.
If they have a wellrounded group they can go for maybe 2 crowd control Companions and 2 DPS, and so on.
Bottomline: a group of players doesn't need to wait around if they miss a healer or dismiss other non-healer players if these want to join up, because with the Companions they can be flexible in their team setup to fill in their needs, in several ways.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."