No one is innovative when you discount the innovations they do make. Making story decisions that matter is new to the MMO genre, but there seem to be plenty of people that completely ignore this. Maybe it isn't your cup of tea because you hate role-playing, but you should at least admit it is an innovation.
You don't want to start a role-playing discussion with someone who is displeased with a WoW-like predefined, guided and repetitive storyline quest mechanics cleverly disguised with a multiple choice NPC dialogues that offer nothing more than to define you as good, bad or neutral.
No one is innovative when you discount the innovations they do make. Making story decisions that matter is new to the MMO genre, but there seem to be plenty of people that completely ignore this. Maybe it isn't your cup of tea because you hate role-playing, but you should at least admit it is an innovation.
You don't want to start a role-playing discussion with someone who is displeased with a WoW-like predefined, guided and repetitive storyline quest mechanics cleverly disguised with a multiple choice NPC dialogues that offer nothing more than to define you as good, bad or neutral.
Yeah, because they don't do things like killing NPCs or letting them live, and they don't change how a story plays out...OH WAIT THEY DO!
Yeah, because they don't do things like killing NPCs or letting them live, and they don't change how a story plays out...OH WAIT THEY DO!
I've played a few Bioware games now, and while the endings can change to some extent, the basic flow remains the same no matter what choice you make. The fact that there may or may not be certain characters in an ending battle does not change the fact that that battle will occur no matter what you do. Whether you can play a game in A-B-C order or B-A-C order doesn't change the fact that A, B, C wil still occur. I am not saying that having choices that make small amounts of differences (in game or epilogue wise) is a bad thing, because it's not. But let's not overplay what Bioware typically does. They don't really change the story, the story remains fairly intact and static no matter how you start and end it even if the choices you make offers some new or different takes any particular story element.
parrotpholk-Because we all know the miracle patch fairy shows up the night before release and sprinkles magic dust on the server to make it allllll better.
Yeah, because they don't do things like killing NPCs or letting them live, and they don't change how a story plays out...OH WAIT THEY DO!
I've played a few Bioware games now, and while the endings can change to some extent, the basic flow remains the same no matter what choice you make. The fact that there may or may not be certain characters in an ending battle does not change the fact that that battle will occur no matter what you do. Whether you can play a game in A-B-C order or B-A-C order doesn't change the fact that A, B, C wil still occur. I am not saying that having choices that make small amounts of differences (in game or epilogue wise) is a bad thing, because it's not. But let's not overplay what Bioware typically does. They don't really change the story, the story remains fairly intact and static no matter how you start and end it even if the choices you make offers some new or different takes any particular story element.
Yeah, like real life, some stuff happens anyway. Though, if you had actually played a lot of Bioware games, you'd know you can avoid some battles. You expect there should be a dialogue option that stops the war or something? I think that's fairly unrealistic.
There are BIG things that you decide in such games. Who will be king and other such stuff. There are a lot more small things you decide. That's pretty consistent with how real life works, and so to me that's a pretty realistic system. You are ONE MAN, reacting and interacting with a world that lives without you. Is there room for improvement in how Bioware does these things? Of course, but acting like everything must be trivial is silly and not true of past Bioware offerings which have done a lot to foster choices that matter. Deciding to kill someone and later their family tries to avenge them isn't trivial when you could go the other way. There will be many choices that matter.
As a side note, they make a distinction between "fluff" choices that don't have significant consequences other than how you say something and big choices that result in someone living or dying, a battle happening, etc.
Someone call for the author? Seraphina here, what can I do y'all for?
If you are the author of ths massively hands on article/report or whatever you want to call it, feel free to read this discussion and contribute whatever you like. I have no idea what you mean by "call for the author".
I am! (And, also, for future thread reference, I'm a she. ) And I meant that many of you seem to have questions, and you're free to ask me about anything. I don't exactly hide, and it's not exactly hard to speak with me. ^_^
Well, it just seems everyone keeps guessing what I'm thinking, but I can wholeheartedly tell you what I was thinking. There's lots of speculation here! However, the truth is a lot less complicated.
First of all, as others have said, I saw 1 level of the game. 1 level. Heck, it was one quest. The whole idea of this article was to get all of the things I saw during this one quest onto paper. I wanted to go over everything I saw, both bad and good. However, because this is in a very limited early build, everything I noted is subject to change -- both the bad and the good.
This is not a review -- it is a list. It's a window into what the game looks like right now.
Many people here seem to be quick to judge it based on this brief window into the development. You're quick to use my words to both praise and condemn the title, based on your current beliefs of the game. Simply put, you find what you want to hear in my article, and then use it to back up your preconceived notions. It's pretty much inevitable.
Some have also speculated on my opinion of the game. I can tell you that while I wasn't impressed with everything I saw, I did like the package as a whole. I think I made it clear in my article that the game didn't blow me out of the water. It didn't shock me with an amazing look into the Star Wars universe. It didn't grab me and scream, "I'M AN AMAZING GAME, LOOK AT ME, PLAY ME NOW!" It was simply a good game, and I would certainly buy it and play it.
But that's solely my opinion. If you're a Star Wars fan, then you pretty much want to be all over this game. If you're not too keen on the whole Star Wars idea, then maybe you should do some more research to make sure this game is for you. If you hate Star Wars, then you might just want to stay away from this game entirely, unless you really like some of the mechanics being presented. There's a wide variety of opinions here that can be found in this one article, and none of them are wrong or misguided.
My goal here is for you to use my words and my descriptions and form an opinion for yourselves. I'm not trying to lead you one way or the other. It's simply a description, and nothing more.
I like you a lot right now.
When you were playing did you see any other players running around in the world with you?
Someone call for the author? Seraphina here, what can I do y'all for?
If you are the author of ths massively hands on article/report or whatever you want to call it, feel free to read this discussion and contribute whatever you like. I have no idea what you mean by "call for the author".
I am! (And, also, for future thread reference, I'm a she. ) And I meant that many of you seem to have questions, and you're free to ask me about anything. I don't exactly hide, and it's not exactly hard to speak with me. ^_^
Well, it just seems everyone keeps guessing what I'm thinking, but I can wholeheartedly tell you what I was thinking. There's lots of speculation here! However, the truth is a lot less complicated.
First of all, as others have said, I saw 1 level of the game. 1 level. Heck, it was one quest. The whole idea of this article was to get all of the things I saw during this one quest onto paper. I wanted to go over everything I saw, both bad and good. However, because this is in a very limited early build, everything I noted is subject to change -- both the bad and the good.
This is not a review -- it is a list. It's a window into what the game looks like right now.
Many people here seem to be quick to judge it based on this brief window into the development. You're quick to use my words to both praise and condemn the title, based on your current beliefs of the game. Simply put, you find what you want to hear in my article, and then use it to back up your preconceived notions. It's pretty much inevitable.
Some have also speculated on my opinion of the game. I can tell you that while I wasn't impressed with everything I saw, I did like the package as a whole. I think I made it clear in my article that the game didn't blow me out of the water. It didn't shock me with an amazing look into the Star Wars universe. It didn't grab me and scream, "I'M AN AMAZING GAME, LOOK AT ME, PLAY ME NOW!" It was simply a good game, and I would certainly buy it and play it.
But that's solely my opinion. If you're a Star Wars fan, then you pretty much want to be all over this game. If you're not too keen on the whole Star Wars idea, then maybe you should do some more research to make sure this game is for you. If you hate Star Wars, then you might just want to stay away from this game entirely, unless you really like some of the mechanics being presented. There's a wide variety of opinions here that can be found in this one article, and none of them are wrong or misguided.
My goal here is for you to use my words and my descriptions and form an opinion for yourselves. I'm not trying to lead you one way or the other. It's simply a description, and nothing more.
I like you a lot right now.
When you were playing did you see any other players running around in the world with you?
I would like to know a little about that too. I kind of took the comment about too bad it's an MMO, or along those lines, to mean that it didn't fit the bill. And one of the points I was trying to make earlier was that in an E3 test, just how Massive could the player base be, to judge whether it fits the bill as an MMO.
Yeah, like real life, some stuff happens anyway. Though, if you had actually played a lot of Bioware games, you'd know you can avoid some battles. You expect there should be a dialogue option that stops the war or something? I think that's fairly unrealistic.
There are BIG things that you decide in such games. Who will be king and other such stuff. There are a lot more small things you decide. That's pretty consistent with how real life works, and so to me that's a pretty realistic system. You are ONE MAN, reacting and interacting with a world that lives without you. Is there room for improvement in how Bioware does these things? Of course, but acting like everything must be trivial is silly and not true of past Bioware offerings which have done a lot to foster choices that matter. Deciding to kill someone and later their family tries to avenge them isn't trivial when you could go the other way. There will be many choices that matter.
As a side note, they make a distinction between "fluff" choices that don't have significant consequences other than how you say something and big choices that result in someone living or dying, a battle happening, etc.
It's not an IF. If you want me to take your word for it, you need to take mine for it. I HAVE played several Bioware games. The main battles cannot be avoided. Even if you know betrayal is coming, you cannot avoid it. Even if you know you are walking into a trap, you have to walk into it. I am not talking about sidequests here. There are set battles, set events, and you will never be able to rewrite those. I don't care that you can take path A or path B to get point C, you will still wind up at point C. And no, I don't think they aer as BIG as you say they are. And actually, I am ONE WOMAN interacting in the world. Hey you think deciding who is on Team A and who is on Team B is a huge decision, that's your choice. To me, deciding if Team A and Team B even need to meet up would be a BIG decision.
parrotpholk-Because we all know the miracle patch fairy shows up the night before release and sprinkles magic dust on the server to make it allllll better.
So, in short, don't get yourself super hyped about this game. It's not amazingly innovative or a complete genre changer. It's not re-inventing the wheel, but it is taking that wheel and giving it the gold plating it needs.
Finally! A dose of realism! I think TOR has the potential to be a fun game and I'll probably be trying it out, but to read some of the fan posts really makes me think that some people are setting themselves up for serious disappointment. I hope TOR does well after the initial release and we see what the actual population will be after the 90 day rollercoaster of subscriptions stabilizes.
You are playing a video game. By definition that means you are not hardcore.
So, in short, don't get yourself super hyped about this game. It's not amazingly innovative or a complete genre changer. It's not re-inventing the wheel, but it is taking that wheel and giving it the gold plating it needs.
Finally! A dose of realism! I think TOR has the potential to be a fun game and I'll probably be trying it out, but to read some of the fan posts really makes me think that some people are setting themselves up for serious disappointment. I hope TOR does well after the initial release and we see what the actual population will be after the 90 day rollercoaster of subscriptions stabilizes.
If this game plays half as good as any Bioware game out there , then i`ll be a happy camper. Add the ability to party up with other people and bam , I`m an even happier camper now.
I wouldn't say thats a bad review, I think that's the way it should be done. It makes sense for someone who has played an alpha build to comment on what they like and what they don't. It sounded to me like he was saying that the game is ultimately fun and neat, and there are a couple things he'd change.
Yeah, like real life, some stuff happens anyway. Though, if you had actually played a lot of Bioware games, you'd know you can avoid some battles. You expect there should be a dialogue option that stops the war or something? I think that's fairly unrealistic.
There are BIG things that you decide in such games. Who will be king and other such stuff. There are a lot more small things you decide. That's pretty consistent with how real life works, and so to me that's a pretty realistic system. You are ONE MAN, reacting and interacting with a world that lives without you. Is there room for improvement in how Bioware does these things? Of course, but acting like everything must be trivial is silly and not true of past Bioware offerings which have done a lot to foster choices that matter. Deciding to kill someone and later their family tries to avenge them isn't trivial when you could go the other way. There will be many choices that matter.
As a side note, they make a distinction between "fluff" choices that don't have significant consequences other than how you say something and big choices that result in someone living or dying, a battle happening, etc.
It's not an IF. If you want me to take your word for it, you need to take mine for it. I HAVE played several Bioware games. The main battles cannot be avoided. Even if you know betrayal is coming, you cannot avoid it. Even if you know you are walking into a trap, you have to walk into it. I am not talking about sidequests here. There are set battles, set events, and you will never be able to rewrite those. I don't care that you can take path A or path B to get point C, you will still wind up at point C. And no, I don't think they aer as BIG as you say they are. And actually, I am ONE WOMAN interacting in the world. Hey you think deciding who is on Team A and who is on Team B is a huge decision, that's your choice. To me, deciding if Team A and Team B even need to meet up would be a BIG decision.
This is exactly how I felt playing BW games. They make fun RPGs but it is still only about one story that can play out in few slightly different ways.
This hands on is completely not valid....Just glancing at the article, i noticed she mentioned that med packs are used automatically. This is completely and utterly false...this right here tells me that the article writer is looking too objectively at the game. She also does not take into consideration that the game is NOT FINISHED. If the wheel is "gold plated" now 10 months before release, I can wait to see what it is like when it is FINISHED.
Seraphina's quote "the automatic use of medipacks. (See: Health potions.) Should your character die from an incoming attack, a medipack will be automatically consumed to save you, should it not be on cooldown. This saves you from having to rapidly dive for your medipack key, or from the occasional bout of stupidity that we're all known to suffer from (i.e., not looking at your health bar)."
OFFICIAL Bioware Quote from Sean Dahlberg- "I am unsure why Seraphina thought so but Medpacs do not automatically inject when you are near low life. It may have been on her hotbar and she clicked it (we usually set them up in the #9 slot) but medpacs do not currently go off on their own and there is no discussion of making them do such a thing.
If it did that, some of the demo teams probably wouldn't have wiped during our live multiplayer demos"
If Bioware keeps cranking out content for Dragon Age, I won't be playing MMO's for a while anyway.
Your still playing that? Most of the DLC takes me a few hours to go through.
I'm glad he says the graphics look better when your actually playing the game because that has to be my biggest gripe right now. Though I cant imagine them looking much better than their Bioware made videos. You would think those would be made on the max graphics.
If Bioware keeps cranking out content for Dragon Age, I won't be playing MMO's for a while anyway.
Your still playing that? Most of the DLC takes me a few hours to go through.
I'm glad he says the graphics look better when your actually playing the game because that has to be my biggest gripe right now. Though I cant imagine them looking much better than their Bioware made videos. You would think those would be made on the max graphics.
I am taking my sweet time with it. I explore every square inch of the maps. And, I plan on doing it again with all of the classes.
If Bioware keeps cranking out content for Dragon Age, I won't be playing MMO's for a while anyway.
Your still playing that? Most of the DLC takes me a few hours to go through.
I'm glad he says the graphics look better when your actually playing the game because that has to be my biggest gripe right now. Though I cant imagine them looking much better than their Bioware made videos. You would think those would be made on the max graphics.
I am taking my sweet time with it. I explore every square inch of the maps. And, I plan on doing it again with all of the classes.
A bit off topic but dragon age does feel different from the point of view of different classes. And different races. There is a lot of replayability there.
I've played through DA about 4 or 5 times and discovered a few quests here and there that I never knew of. If one can put themselves in the position of their character the world reall can feel more than just a few maps.
I trust SWToR will be similiar.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
If Bioware keeps cranking out content for Dragon Age, I won't be playing MMO's for a while anyway.
Your still playing that? Most of the DLC takes me a few hours to go through.
I'm glad he says the graphics look better when your actually playing the game because that has to be my biggest gripe right now. Though I cant imagine them looking much better than their Bioware made videos. You would think those would be made on the max graphics.
I am taking my sweet time with it. I explore every square inch of the maps. And, I plan on doing it again with all of the classes.
A bit off topic but dragon age does feel different from the point of view of different classes. And different races. There is a lot of replayability there.
I've played through DA about 4 or 5 times and discovered a few quests here and there that I never knew of. If one can put themselves in the position of their character the world reall can feel more than just a few maps.
I trust SWToR will be similiar.
First time I beat DA I did it on hard with my rogue and the second time I did it on nightmare with my mage. Second time around was actually easier because i knew how to play the game and I was a blood mage. What really made the game easy was using Alistar with full juggernaught armor which I was able to use to get his resistances to elements maxed and with his abilities he couldnt be knocked down. He was unkillable. My only problem is I wish the game had been harder. Both my rogue and especially my mage are gods.
A bit off topic but dragon age does feel different from the point of view of different classes. And different races. There is a lot of replayability there.
I've played through DA about 4 or 5 times and discovered a few quests here and there that I never knew of. If one can put themselves in the position of their character the world reall can feel more than just a few maps.
I trust SWToR will be similiar.
I don't think it's off topic at all to discuss the games Bioware is currently doing. I am enjoying DA still, and just started playing with ME2 and enjoyed their past games. I have a lot of respet for Bioware as a developer, and I think their games are solid, entertaining, challenging and has a certain amount of flexibility that former RPGs, and some current ones, don't have. I have no complaints with them really except EA tends to be a greed machine so that's something to look out for.
The thing is, I am sold on them as a single-player game creator. I enjoyed NWN multiplayer but NWN2 multiplayer was a major let down, at least for my group. My main question is, how are they, or are they going to to be able, to bring this all together in a massive online format? The stories, the character developing, dialogue choices, i want to see that presented in a meaningful way that a group of people will not only enjoy it, but come back for more day after day. That question hasn't quite been answered yet. It might be awhile before that question is answered, and that's okay with me. I can tell you if they create a DA type RPG game with a multiplayer aspect, i'd buy that game but i wouldn't pay a monthly fee to access that. I need solid growing MMO content for a monthly fee.
parrotpholk-Because we all know the miracle patch fairy shows up the night before release and sprinkles magic dust on the server to make it allllll better.
The thing is, I am sold on them as a single-player game creator. I enjoyed NWN multiplayer but NWN2 multiplayer was a major let down, at least for my group.
The thing is, I am sold on them as a single-player game creator. I enjoyed NWN multiplayer but NWN2 multiplayer was a major let down, at least for my group.
Go get your NWN2 box.
Now tell me who made it.
I don't need the box. I know it was Obsidian that was behind NWN2., but they also used Bioware as a consultant, and if you pay close attention, the forums are on Bioware's forums. Now you can say hey they didn't build it from the ground up, and you would be correct. HOWEVER, they didn't not sever the link, and that was their choice. NWN official expansions also had problems with multiplayer.
parrotpholk-Because we all know the miracle patch fairy shows up the night before release and sprinkles magic dust on the server to make it allllll better.
The thing is, I am sold on them as a single-player game creator. I enjoyed NWN multiplayer but NWN2 multiplayer was a major let down, at least for my group.
Go get your NWN2 box.
Now tell me who made it.
I don't need the box. I know it was Obsidian that was behind NWN2., but they also used Bioware as a consultant, and if you pay close attention, the forums are on Bioware's forums. Now you can say hey they didn't build it from the ground up, and you would be correct. HOWEVER, they didn't not sever the link, and that was their choice. NWN official expansions also had problems with multiplayer.
NWN2 was not made by Bioware. That's that. It's not their fault if it ended up badly. So they consulted on it, that doesn't make it their fault that it was kinda bad. Blaming them for it is ridiculous, especially since you just propose they should have made some big PR fuss blasting Obsidian (essentially that's what you are saying). It's not like Bioware's involvement is advertised on the box or anything. The situation is certainly not even remotely comparable to TOR.
AFAIK, the expansions for NWN had no multiplayer problems or at least none that lasted, unless you are refering to the official campaigns, but I don't think any of those were designed with MP in mind. The game itself was, which is different.
Yeah, like real life, some stuff happens anyway. Though, if you had actually played a lot of Bioware games, you'd know you can avoid some battles. You expect there should be a dialogue option that stops the war or something? I think that's fairly unrealistic.
There are BIG things that you decide in such games. Who will be king and other such stuff. There are a lot more small things you decide. That's pretty consistent with how real life works, and so to me that's a pretty realistic system. You are ONE MAN, reacting and interacting with a world that lives without you. Is there room for improvement in how Bioware does these things? Of course, but acting like everything must be trivial is silly and not true of past Bioware offerings which have done a lot to foster choices that matter. Deciding to kill someone and later their family tries to avenge them isn't trivial when you could go the other way. There will be many choices that matter.
As a side note, they make a distinction between "fluff" choices that don't have significant consequences other than how you say something and big choices that result in someone living or dying, a battle happening, etc.
It's not an IF. If you want me to take your word for it, you need to take mine for it. I HAVE played several Bioware games. The main battles cannot be avoided. Even if you know betrayal is coming, you cannot avoid it. Even if you know you are walking into a trap, you have to walk into it. I am not talking about sidequests here. There are set battles, set events, and you will never be able to rewrite those. I don't care that you can take path A or path B to get point C, you will still wind up at point C. And no, I don't think they aer as BIG as you say they are. And actually, I am ONE WOMAN interacting in the world. Hey you think deciding who is on Team A and who is on Team B is a huge decision, that's your choice. To me, deciding if Team A and Team B even need to meet up would be a BIG decision.
1. Central plot problems can't be avoided. That's true. They also involve massive/powerful forces that you couldn't realistically avoid anyhow. I don't see your problem with this. As for betrayals, I don't recall any you could realistically forsee coming. There are certain fixed points that you can make decisions about how you approach, but you'll end up there sooner or later. That's a lot like real life, imho.
2. There are other big decisions you can decide though. Deciding who will become king, whether you'll kill a hated enemy or not, etc are big things you decide.
3. I really don't care what your gender is. Nor am I interested in getting in a debate on grammar.
1. Central plot problems can't be avoided. That's true. They also involve massive/powerful forces that you couldn't realistically avoid anyhow. I don't see your problem with this. As for betrayals, I don't recall any you could realistically forsee coming. There are certain fixed points that you can make decisions about how you approach, but you'll end up there sooner or later. That's a lot like real life, imho.
2. There are other big decisions you can decide though. Deciding who will become king, whether you'll kill a hated enemy or not, etc are big things you decide.
3. I really don't care what your gender is. Nor am I interested in getting in a debate on grammar.
1. You're kidding right? You didn't see the betrayals coming? Seriously? Bioware writes okay stories, but they're not that good. You can see their twists a mile away. I won't put spoilers on this board, but I saw the betrayals in NWN, DA and ME2, and those are the ones that come to mind in ten seconds or less.
2. Those are decisions that pretty much take place, the results of, after the game, not during. Again, i won't put spoilers here, but after you make these so called big decisions, you're pretty much done with the area or the game. You're not actually going to see anything evolve because of your decision while still playing the game. A couple of missing characters from a house or a forest is not really watching an area change.
3. You were the one that put it in big GIANT LETTERS so i just copied you. You seem to have some sort of chip on your shoulder. It's not my fault you take your own writing style and get hot and bothered by it when someone uses it counter to your posts.
parrotpholk-Because we all know the miracle patch fairy shows up the night before release and sprinkles magic dust on the server to make it allllll better.
1. Central plot problems can't be avoided. That's true. They also involve massive/powerful forces that you couldn't realistically avoid anyhow. I don't see your problem with this. As for betrayals, I don't recall any you could realistically forsee coming. There are certain fixed points that you can make decisions about how you approach, but you'll end up there sooner or later. That's a lot like real life, imho.
2. There are other big decisions you can decide though. Deciding who will become king, whether you'll kill a hated enemy or not, etc are big things you decide.
3. I really don't care what your gender is. Nor am I interested in getting in a debate on grammar.
1. You're kidding right? You didn't see the betrayals coming? Seriously? Bioware writes okay stories, but they're not that good. You can see their twists a mile away. I won't put spoilers on this board, but I saw the betrayals in NWN, DA and ME2, and those are the ones that come to mind in ten seconds or less.
2. Those are decisions that pretty much take place, the results of, after the game, not during. Again, i won't put spoilers here, but after you make these so called big decisions, you're pretty much done with the area or the game. You're not actually going to see anything evolve because of your decision while still playing the game. A couple of missing characters from a house or a forest is not really watching an area change.
3. You were the one that put it in big GIANT LETTERS so i just copied you. You seem to have some sort of chip on your shoulder. It's not my fault you take your own writing style and get hot and bothered by it when someone uses it counter to your posts.
1. Well, I was thinking of Yoshimo. From a character perspective, I don't see how you can see the betrayal in DA coming, unless you are paranoid.
2. Of course, that argument doesn't work with TOR since it is ongoing and they've commented on how players will affect how things evolve, and I don't think it is accurate for all events in other Bioware games. Certainly there are many examples of owning and building up structures/homes/estates. There are also characters you can pick up or not and can result in side quests you otherwise wouldn't get -- and some people require entire side quests to do if you choose. Others won't stick around if you behave a certain way or have certain people. Certainly there's a lot of involvement on the level of human interaction and you DO see that evolve as well including change the sort of person a companion is. The vast majority of this is already confirmed to be in TOR in one way or another, and again, since TOR doesn't end you'll see the long-term effects of other things.
Also, like I said above, the Devs have said players will affect how the worlds evolve and they are very careful about what they say.
Beyond all these, even if we take your more negative approach, what is in such games is a vast, vast improvement over what we've seen in past MMOs. It's a big, innovative step.
3. A small comment does not a chip on my shoulder make. *sigh* You're kind of tedious -- if I have any sort of chip on my shoulder, I assure you it is only related to you and your posts. In my original comment, the "man" wasn't referring to anyone in particular, and was capitalized to emphasize how player choice is important. Your use seemed to only be there to emphasize that you are female, so it struck me as odd.
1. Well, I was thinking of Yoshimo. From a character perspective, I don't see how you can see the betrayal in DA coming, unless you are paranoid.
2. Of course, that argument doesn't work with TOR since it is ongoing and they've commented on how players will affect how things evolve, and I don't think it is accurate for all events in other Bioware games. Certainly there are many examples of owning and building up structures/homes/estates. There are also characters you can pick up or not and can result in side quests you otherwise wouldn't get -- and some people require entire side quests to do if you choose. Others won't stick around if you behave a certain way or have certain people. Certainly there's a lot of involvement on the level of human interaction and you DO see that evolve as well including change the sort of person a companion is. The vast majority of this is already confirmed to be in TOR in one way or another, and again, since TOR doesn't end you'll see the long-term effects of other things.
Also, like I said above, the Devs have said players will affect how the worlds evolve and they are very careful about what they say.
Beyond all these, even if we take your more negative approach, what is in such games is a vast, vast improvement over what we've seen in past MMOs. It's a big, innovative step.
3. A small comment does not a chip on my shoulder make. *sigh* You're kind of tedious -- if I have any sort of chip on my shoulder, I assure you it is only related to you and your posts. In my original comment, the "man" wasn't referring to anyone in particular, and was capitalized to emphasize how player choice is important. Your use seemed to only be there to emphasize that you are female, so it struck me as odd.
1. I read books and watch movies. DA was obvious to a lot of people as it was a classic setup device.
2. Developers comment on a lot of stuff they never get around to doing, or can't finish, or even successfully implement. What Bioware says doesn't matter; it's what they can do. I want to see what they can do in an MMORPG enviroment. You're thinking small again about change and big decisions when you change to you makes you think what about what you can get your companions to do. There are certain games Bioware makes where you completey change the power structure of an area. The characters slightly change, the enviroment, pretty much not at all. Bioware tends to keep the actual area static, even in an single player RPG.
3. Actually I was referring to the fact i played A WOMAN in the game, and happen to be a woman. Since its a singplayer game, OF COURSE one person matters regardless. Assume whatever you like, I find a good deal of your comments to be rude and arrogant, that strikes me as odd.
parrotpholk-Because we all know the miracle patch fairy shows up the night before release and sprinkles magic dust on the server to make it allllll better.
Comments
You don't want to start a role-playing discussion with someone who is displeased with a WoW-like predefined, guided and repetitive storyline quest mechanics cleverly disguised with a multiple choice NPC dialogues that offer nothing more than to define you as good, bad or neutral.
Yeah, because they don't do things like killing NPCs or letting them live, and they don't change how a story plays out...OH WAIT THEY DO!
I've played a few Bioware games now, and while the endings can change to some extent, the basic flow remains the same no matter what choice you make. The fact that there may or may not be certain characters in an ending battle does not change the fact that that battle will occur no matter what you do. Whether you can play a game in A-B-C order or B-A-C order doesn't change the fact that A, B, C wil still occur. I am not saying that having choices that make small amounts of differences (in game or epilogue wise) is a bad thing, because it's not. But let's not overplay what Bioware typically does. They don't really change the story, the story remains fairly intact and static no matter how you start and end it even if the choices you make offers some new or different takes any particular story element.
parrotpholk-Because we all know the miracle patch fairy shows up the night before release and sprinkles magic dust on the server to make it allllll better.
Yeah, like real life, some stuff happens anyway. Though, if you had actually played a lot of Bioware games, you'd know you can avoid some battles. You expect there should be a dialogue option that stops the war or something? I think that's fairly unrealistic.
There are BIG things that you decide in such games. Who will be king and other such stuff. There are a lot more small things you decide. That's pretty consistent with how real life works, and so to me that's a pretty realistic system. You are ONE MAN, reacting and interacting with a world that lives without you. Is there room for improvement in how Bioware does these things? Of course, but acting like everything must be trivial is silly and not true of past Bioware offerings which have done a lot to foster choices that matter. Deciding to kill someone and later their family tries to avenge them isn't trivial when you could go the other way. There will be many choices that matter.
As a side note, they make a distinction between "fluff" choices that don't have significant consequences other than how you say something and big choices that result in someone living or dying, a battle happening, etc.
I like you a lot right now.
When you were playing did you see any other players running around in the world with you?
I would like to know a little about that too. I kind of took the comment about too bad it's an MMO, or along those lines, to mean that it didn't fit the bill. And one of the points I was trying to make earlier was that in an E3 test, just how Massive could the player base be, to judge whether it fits the bill as an MMO.
It's not an IF. If you want me to take your word for it, you need to take mine for it. I HAVE played several Bioware games. The main battles cannot be avoided. Even if you know betrayal is coming, you cannot avoid it. Even if you know you are walking into a trap, you have to walk into it. I am not talking about sidequests here. There are set battles, set events, and you will never be able to rewrite those. I don't care that you can take path A or path B to get point C, you will still wind up at point C. And no, I don't think they aer as BIG as you say they are. And actually, I am ONE WOMAN interacting in the world. Hey you think deciding who is on Team A and who is on Team B is a huge decision, that's your choice. To me, deciding if Team A and Team B even need to meet up would be a BIG decision.
parrotpholk-Because we all know the miracle patch fairy shows up the night before release and sprinkles magic dust on the server to make it allllll better.
Finally! A dose of realism! I think TOR has the potential to be a fun game and I'll probably be trying it out, but to read some of the fan posts really makes me think that some people are setting themselves up for serious disappointment. I hope TOR does well after the initial release and we see what the actual population will be after the 90 day rollercoaster of subscriptions stabilizes.
You are playing a video game. By definition that means you are not hardcore.
If this game plays half as good as any Bioware game out there , then i`ll be a happy camper. Add the ability to party up with other people and bam , I`m an even happier camper now.
I wouldn't say thats a bad review, I think that's the way it should be done. It makes sense for someone who has played an alpha build to comment on what they like and what they don't. It sounded to me like he was saying that the game is ultimately fun and neat, and there are a couple things he'd change.
This is exactly how I felt playing BW games. They make fun RPGs but it is still only about one story that can play out in few slightly different ways.
If Bioware keeps cranking out content for Dragon Age, I won't be playing MMO's for a while anyway.
This hands on is completely not valid....Just glancing at the article, i noticed she mentioned that med packs are used automatically. This is completely and utterly false...this right here tells me that the article writer is looking too objectively at the game. She also does not take into consideration that the game is NOT FINISHED. If the wheel is "gold plated" now 10 months before release, I can wait to see what it is like when it is FINISHED.
Seraphina's quote "the automatic use of medipacks. (See: Health potions.) Should your character die from an incoming attack, a medipack will be automatically consumed to save you, should it not be on cooldown. This saves you from having to rapidly dive for your medipack key, or from the occasional bout of stupidity that we're all known to suffer from (i.e., not looking at your health bar)."
OFFICIAL Bioware Quote from Sean Dahlberg- "I am unsure why Seraphina thought so but Medpacs do not automatically inject when you are near low life. It may have been on her hotbar and she clicked it (we usually set them up in the #9 slot) but medpacs do not currently go off on their own and there is no discussion of making them do such a thing.
If it did that, some of the demo teams probably wouldn't have wiped during our live multiplayer demos"
Your still playing that? Most of the DLC takes me a few hours to go through.
I'm glad he says the graphics look better when your actually playing the game because that has to be my biggest gripe right now. Though I cant imagine them looking much better than their Bioware made videos. You would think those would be made on the max graphics.
I am taking my sweet time with it. I explore every square inch of the maps. And, I plan on doing it again with all of the classes.
A bit off topic but dragon age does feel different from the point of view of different classes. And different races. There is a lot of replayability there.
I've played through DA about 4 or 5 times and discovered a few quests here and there that I never knew of. If one can put themselves in the position of their character the world reall can feel more than just a few maps.
I trust SWToR will be similiar.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
First time I beat DA I did it on hard with my rogue and the second time I did it on nightmare with my mage. Second time around was actually easier because i knew how to play the game and I was a blood mage. What really made the game easy was using Alistar with full juggernaught armor which I was able to use to get his resistances to elements maxed and with his abilities he couldnt be knocked down. He was unkillable. My only problem is I wish the game had been harder. Both my rogue and especially my mage are gods.
I don't think it's off topic at all to discuss the games Bioware is currently doing. I am enjoying DA still, and just started playing with ME2 and enjoyed their past games. I have a lot of respet for Bioware as a developer, and I think their games are solid, entertaining, challenging and has a certain amount of flexibility that former RPGs, and some current ones, don't have. I have no complaints with them really except EA tends to be a greed machine so that's something to look out for.
The thing is, I am sold on them as a single-player game creator. I enjoyed NWN multiplayer but NWN2 multiplayer was a major let down, at least for my group. My main question is, how are they, or are they going to to be able, to bring this all together in a massive online format? The stories, the character developing, dialogue choices, i want to see that presented in a meaningful way that a group of people will not only enjoy it, but come back for more day after day. That question hasn't quite been answered yet. It might be awhile before that question is answered, and that's okay with me. I can tell you if they create a DA type RPG game with a multiplayer aspect, i'd buy that game but i wouldn't pay a monthly fee to access that. I need solid growing MMO content for a monthly fee.
parrotpholk-Because we all know the miracle patch fairy shows up the night before release and sprinkles magic dust on the server to make it allllll better.
Go get your NWN2 box.
Now tell me who made it.
I don't need the box. I know it was Obsidian that was behind NWN2., but they also used Bioware as a consultant, and if you pay close attention, the forums are on Bioware's forums. Now you can say hey they didn't build it from the ground up, and you would be correct. HOWEVER, they didn't not sever the link, and that was their choice. NWN official expansions also had problems with multiplayer.
parrotpholk-Because we all know the miracle patch fairy shows up the night before release and sprinkles magic dust on the server to make it allllll better.
NWN2 was not made by Bioware. That's that. It's not their fault if it ended up badly. So they consulted on it, that doesn't make it their fault that it was kinda bad. Blaming them for it is ridiculous, especially since you just propose they should have made some big PR fuss blasting Obsidian (essentially that's what you are saying). It's not like Bioware's involvement is advertised on the box or anything. The situation is certainly not even remotely comparable to TOR.
AFAIK, the expansions for NWN had no multiplayer problems or at least none that lasted, unless you are refering to the official campaigns, but I don't think any of those were designed with MP in mind. The game itself was, which is different.
1. Central plot problems can't be avoided. That's true. They also involve massive/powerful forces that you couldn't realistically avoid anyhow. I don't see your problem with this. As for betrayals, I don't recall any you could realistically forsee coming. There are certain fixed points that you can make decisions about how you approach, but you'll end up there sooner or later. That's a lot like real life, imho.
2. There are other big decisions you can decide though. Deciding who will become king, whether you'll kill a hated enemy or not, etc are big things you decide.
3. I really don't care what your gender is. Nor am I interested in getting in a debate on grammar.
1. You're kidding right? You didn't see the betrayals coming? Seriously? Bioware writes okay stories, but they're not that good. You can see their twists a mile away. I won't put spoilers on this board, but I saw the betrayals in NWN, DA and ME2, and those are the ones that come to mind in ten seconds or less.
2. Those are decisions that pretty much take place, the results of, after the game, not during. Again, i won't put spoilers here, but after you make these so called big decisions, you're pretty much done with the area or the game. You're not actually going to see anything evolve because of your decision while still playing the game. A couple of missing characters from a house or a forest is not really watching an area change.
3. You were the one that put it in big GIANT LETTERS so i just copied you. You seem to have some sort of chip on your shoulder. It's not my fault you take your own writing style and get hot and bothered by it when someone uses it counter to your posts.
parrotpholk-Because we all know the miracle patch fairy shows up the night before release and sprinkles magic dust on the server to make it allllll better.
1. Well, I was thinking of Yoshimo. From a character perspective, I don't see how you can see the betrayal in DA coming, unless you are paranoid.
2. Of course, that argument doesn't work with TOR since it is ongoing and they've commented on how players will affect how things evolve, and I don't think it is accurate for all events in other Bioware games. Certainly there are many examples of owning and building up structures/homes/estates. There are also characters you can pick up or not and can result in side quests you otherwise wouldn't get -- and some people require entire side quests to do if you choose. Others won't stick around if you behave a certain way or have certain people. Certainly there's a lot of involvement on the level of human interaction and you DO see that evolve as well including change the sort of person a companion is. The vast majority of this is already confirmed to be in TOR in one way or another, and again, since TOR doesn't end you'll see the long-term effects of other things.
Also, like I said above, the Devs have said players will affect how the worlds evolve and they are very careful about what they say.
Beyond all these, even if we take your more negative approach, what is in such games is a vast, vast improvement over what we've seen in past MMOs. It's a big, innovative step.
3. A small comment does not a chip on my shoulder make. *sigh* You're kind of tedious -- if I have any sort of chip on my shoulder, I assure you it is only related to you and your posts. In my original comment, the "man" wasn't referring to anyone in particular, and was capitalized to emphasize how player choice is important. Your use seemed to only be there to emphasize that you are female, so it struck me as odd.
1. I read books and watch movies. DA was obvious to a lot of people as it was a classic setup device.
2. Developers comment on a lot of stuff they never get around to doing, or can't finish, or even successfully implement. What Bioware says doesn't matter; it's what they can do. I want to see what they can do in an MMORPG enviroment. You're thinking small again about change and big decisions when you change to you makes you think what about what you can get your companions to do. There are certain games Bioware makes where you completey change the power structure of an area. The characters slightly change, the enviroment, pretty much not at all. Bioware tends to keep the actual area static, even in an single player RPG.
3. Actually I was referring to the fact i played A WOMAN in the game, and happen to be a woman. Since its a singplayer game, OF COURSE one person matters regardless. Assume whatever you like, I find a good deal of your comments to be rude and arrogant, that strikes me as odd.
parrotpholk-Because we all know the miracle patch fairy shows up the night before release and sprinkles magic dust on the server to make it allllll better.