(From Alpha.... the combat speed in this video is much slower than the new combat, but at least you get to see someone who actually knows how to play and give the game a little justice).
Thanks for posting the link. So the combat is slow and boring even with an experienced player. Good to have the comparison. Now I can't blame Stradden for being a noob, but FF for being the most overhyped unorignal boring piece of schlock to get spewed out of the MMO stamper lately. This certainly will be the next WoW killer just like WAR and Aion were, oh wait...
All the alpha stuff shows you is that combat isn't just a case of pressing 1button over an over, which is what is possible in WoW PvE. Wait till release when you can see the final thing I think!
Many of u said its too slow and u rather stick with more action based combat which i think is fine and in the end just personal preferences....but correct me now if i am wrong here but does it really hurt to use tactic in your fights actually plan your steps and do it right instead of being a berserk er all the time??
And guys lets be honest here what we get from most mmos has nothing to do with how u would fight in rl in rl u r planing your moves u r not just rushing in and swing your fists as fast as possible. (at least not if u plan to win tho lol)
While i would have to agree that the fight speed shown might have been too slow even for a more tactic based fighting do i believe that a lot of that could be changed with the proper use of skills and a better planing of your stamina bar (at least i hope so) talking of which i just LOVE the stamina idea that's an awesome feature which is well known for rpgs and hopefully over long time will make its way into MMORPGs in general as well.
erh no you would plan your tactics before the actual fight.
but yes MMOs always were terrible action games, and one reason I ve liked them....FFXIV could be my "new love". tho think will stick to guildwars2. not cause of gameplay, but rl situation...no matter how much you try to keep that thing out of the door :
Well u can roughly plan what u would like to do in the upcoming fight but unless u posses the power of looking into the future ull always have to react and change your strategy during the actual battle.
mainly twitch based, and act from what tactics you have already planned upfront. ofc Im not soldier at all, but you do not get afew minutes to try plan your moves when its a matter of life and death...for you or your opponent
edit: my point just being dont mix real life with video games, no one would play a game that tried to be real life like anyways, its the game most want to get a break from....even if with real life friends.
Ok, i know this was just a demo, and i really hope its not what the real combat will actually look like... but that just seemed pretty awful. Im all for using strategy and tactics in combat vs button smashing, but wtf was with mobs just standing there doing absolutely nothing most of the time. What strategy or tactics are involved in walking up to a mob and getting in several very slow paced attacks while they simply stand there and don't react to your attacks. Hell most of them seemed to be completely oblivious to the fact that they were even being attacked and just continued doing whatever they were doing while getting smakced from behind with a sword.
The combat mechanics themselves dont need to be actiony, as i said i enjoy tactical gameplay too, but at least give some semblance of action & reaction from the mobs. Im really hoping that it was just setup this way for the demo, but i fthis is basically the finished product of the combat the game is just going to get extremely boring very fast.
I must repectfully agree this is one boring video....
Graphics gives me horrible flashbacks from Aion,
The controls I hope are a lot better for the average person, than the one doing the gaming had no clue...
It really looks like it lacks "some thing" else..I just can't put my finger on it.
Come on SE, don't let me down...
from one not being used to controllers. yes they were annoying, but doesnt take long to get used to, just as it were in alpha there were no point in having the mouse at all. you d be able to tab through mobs faster than move the hand to the mouse and manual target....took some time for me to just leave the damn mouse alone.
it is how I see the guy on the video. just had to use the mouse to control the camera. which seems to continue to be a problem in the beta build they used on the show.
I waited in line at E3 for 45 mins the first day to find out that their demo was having problems and I couldn't play it. It consisted of me grouping up with 2 other people, getting a shared quest and no combat.
Now that they've actually put out some combat video of it working... I'm even less impressed. Wow.. a quest to kill crabs? Seriously guys? This is the best you can do for a demo at E3?
When are developers going to learn to do something new than give us the same grocery list of junk that every other MMO gives us.
I waited in line at E3 for 45 mins the first day to find out that their demo was having problems and I couldn't play it. It consisted of me grouping up with 2 other people, getting a shared quest and no combat.
Now that they've actually put out some combat video of it working... I'm even less impressed. Wow.. a quest to kill crabs? Seriously guys? This is the best you can do for a demo at E3?
When are developers going to learn to do something new than give us the same grocery list of junk that every other MMO gives us.
yeap will try avoid guild leves as much as possible....am certain there will be alot more in game than those, its SE´s way of accept ppl want the ability to solo, and not have to explore for the "real" quests and what else you d be able to find in the game - atleast how I see it.
reason why they put so much time into showing it....yes you can do the regular kill 10 rats quests if you want to.....sad to see you actually seem to gain something from them, and more than you would just from do the exploring. but then I might be wrong on that point. just doesnt seem so, so far.
The FFXI Online combat has always been about tactics instead of button mashing like most other mmos. So if youa re looking for a button masher then this isn't it. I enjoyed the combat in FFXI and I'm sure I will in FFXIV as well.
Just figured I'd point out to some people that this is gameplay at a very low level (i.e. newb level). The combat speed will pick up at higher levels if FFXI is anything to go by and these battles don't do much to demonstrate the tactical side of the game since they're meant to be easy for a new player to get to grips with.
Like others have said, it doesn't look interesting to an outside viewer because you are not engaged in the thought processes of the combat system. The entertainment with FF games comes from the planning and execution on the part of the player, not flashy animations and button mashing.
I think the 'anti-WoW' description someone used earlier is perfect actually. This game is designed to appeal to people who want a playstyle entirely different to WoW.
Look at this video starting at around 2:00 minutes....
Same demo from E3 but with someone who actually knows what they're doing.
Okay, I watched that video.
Does it look pretty? Yes, very pretty.
Does it look like combat would be fun to engage in? Not at all.
And to say there are no tactics in other MMOs is just plain silly. Slow turn-based gaming does not = tactics. Most MMOs require you to use varying tactics for each class to get the most out of them. That they're happening in a far more exciting and realistic fashion than these FFXIV videos does not make those fun MMOs any less enjoyable. Most, in fact, would say the opposite.
slow doesn't = Strategic... The skills he was explainging, the different gauges you need to pay attention to in order to pull of different types of skills DOES = strategy. Henche a slightly slower pace than some might be used to.
It looks great in my opinion though whoever was controlling the character sucked big time.
I too think the fighting is at a good pace. It seems faster than FFXI but it could because they were buffed. Still having more gauges to pay attention to adds more stratgey and I like that. I perfer slower at strategic to fast button mashing. There are good faster paced games though like Guild Wars so i'm not knocking it. I think this fighting style fits nicely.
And it looks AMAZINGLY BEAUTIFUL. I never thought I'd find a cave so pretty looking. ^^
slow doesn't = Strategic... The skills he was explainging, the different gauges you need to pay attention to in order to pull of different types of skills DOES = strategy. Henche a slightly slower pace than some might be used to.
It looks great in my opinion though whoever was controlling the character sucked big time.
I too think the fighting is at a good pace. It seems faster than FFXI but it could because they were buffed. Still having more gauges to pay attention to adds more stratgey and I like that. I perfer slower at strategic to fast button mashing. There are good faster paced games though like Guild Wars so i'm not knocking it. I think this fighting style fits nicely.
And it looks AMAZINGLY BEAUTIFUL. I never thought I'd find a cave so pretty looking. ^^
he skills he was explainging, the different gauges you need to pay attention to in order to pull of different types of skills DOES = strategy.
I think thats where part of the devider is. To me thats no different than babysitting cooldowns.
I mean personally the strategies and tactics you use to defeat mobs are the ones the devs created. I mean they design in a way that there is a certain way to beat the encounter, mob or w/e. There's little room for creativity on the players side to develop there own strategies and tactics. Which means it's less about strategy and tactics and more about finding out how the devs intended for this to be beat.
This is why I don't consider it an MMO revolving around tactics and strategy. I mean once you learn how the devs intended for you to beat something, you use that same method on it every time and you will win unless someone forgets a step.
So, I guess to me it's not so much about strategy and tactics but more about finding and remembering the steps that have been assigned to that specific encounter w/e it may be.
Look at this video starting at around 2:00 minutes....
Same demo from E3 but with someone who actually knows what they're doing.
Okay, I watched that video.
Does it look pretty? Yes, very pretty.
Does it look like combat would be fun to engage in? Not at all.
And to say there are no tactics in other MMOs is just plain silly. Slow turn-based gaming does not = tactics. Most MMOs require you to use varying tactics for each class to get the most out of them. That they're happening in a far more exciting and realistic fashion than these FFXIV videos does not make those fun MMOs any less enjoyable. Most, in fact, would say the opposite.
To anwer your question whether the combat looked fun in the Beta Video I posted... yeah it did.
It's personal taste... this isn't an objective thing. There's a lot of negativity revolving around the combat because 99% of all the mmo's on the market are twitchbased. People seem to think that all mmo's should have that or else "they suck!"
As someone who played WoW, FFXI, and a dozen other current mmos (Aion, Aoc,Warhammer, Allods, LoTRO), I can safely say that FFXI was the most memorable and fun.
I'm an FF fan, so FFXIV being similar to consol FF's in terms of limit moves and abilities, it's right up my ally. Conversely, I think WoW based combat is one step away from giving people seizures and carpel tunnel syndrome.
Just figured I'd point out to some people that this is gameplay at a very low level (i.e. newb level). The combat speed will pick up at higher levels if FFXI is anything to go by and these battles don't do much to demonstrate the tactical side of the game since they're meant to be easy for a new player to get to grips with.
Like others have said, it doesn't look interesting to an outside viewer because you are not engaged in the thought processes of the combat system. The entertainment with FF games comes from the planning and execution on the part of the player, not flashy animations and button mashing.
I think the 'anti-WoW' description someone used earlier is perfect actually. This game is designed to appeal to people who want a playstyle entirely different to WoW.
noo its not newb lvl this. you start out with 1 ability and very fast get 2. you have about 1 ability around every 5 class lvl- just how it seemed to me, not a solid fact. so this would actually be at a rather high lvl. cant say how far into the game this is.. but its for sure not at the start of the game at all.
edit: for what I can see the guy got the whole ability bar filled, cant see with what but if only class specific skills he would be around lvl 40 class lvls. not sure what hte game caps at when released..
I also think the reason some people in this thread are put off by FFXIV'S combat is because the only alternative for the last 5+ years has been WoW and Wow clones. Wow clones include Aion, Aoc, Warhammer, Lotro.
What I mean by wow clones is that 30+ abilities that you use every "global cooldown" or whenever the cooldown is up. all these different MMO'S play essentially the same. Unlike WoW and Wow clones, FFXIV is FUNDAMENTALLY different. It's more of a consol game turned into an MMO. I played FFXI on a controller and keyboard. Controller was by far my favorite.
So I guess, I'm very happy that one company out of hundreds is not going the WoW route. When you play FFXIV, you will never get the feeling that it's a WoW clone... that is for certain. I don't think you can say that for any other game, other than EvE or Fallen Earth.
Don't get me wrong, I loved Vanilla WoW... I am enjoying AoC right now, and LoTRO was awesome too. But, am I glad now that a company is something really different... something that I loved in the past? You Bet!
FFXI had 500k Subscriber base for 7 years. IT exited before wow, during wow, and after wow more so than any other mmo that's come after it. There's a huge market for this type of gameplay that people absolutely love. If you want twitch based gameplay.... every other game will offer you what you want, including SWTOR (soon enough).
Do you guys even know how the combat works? Each time an attack is used the stamina bar slowly depletes (but its constantly recharging at a certain rate). That second video posted shows how fast the combat is, but the more attacks you use the faster the bar goes down, meaning you may reach a point where you can not attack for a couple of seconds. Attacking slower however means you will be able to attack for longer. The speed of the combat depends on how the player decides to use their spells and abilities.
Holy crap that was frustrating to watch. Maybe next time get someone to play the game who hasn't just managed to pull himself out of a well for the first time since birth.
Joined 2004 - I can't believe I've been a MMORPG.com member for 20 years! Get off my lawn!
All of you idiots insulting the guy need to shut up. Final Fantasy has the WORST controls in the world. So its safe to bet FF14 also sucks. Square enix proved they sucked at making mmo, so maybe they'll do better. The only reason anyone will play this is because of the final fantasy name. With out it, its just another generic fantasy game that doesnt nothing new at all.
When I first learned of FFXIV, being a former SE fanboy, I flipped out and got all giddy. I just don't think I have it in me to play this game. I don't want to play FFXI ver. 2.0 which is what this looks like to me. The only game that has my attention is Tera, and that is only because of the fast paced combat system and the possibility of skill driven gameplay.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
It's in between the two. Alpha ended, but beta hasn't begun yet. A transition phase.
Also, lol at anyone judging the combat from this.
Thanks much.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
Comments
AMEN brother!
mainly twitch based, and act from what tactics you have already planned upfront. ofc Im not soldier at all, but you do not get afew minutes to try plan your moves when its a matter of life and death...for you or your opponent
edit: my point just being dont mix real life with video games, no one would play a game that tried to be real life like anyways, its the game most want to get a break from....even if with real life friends.
Ok, i know this was just a demo, and i really hope its not what the real combat will actually look like... but that just seemed pretty awful. Im all for using strategy and tactics in combat vs button smashing, but wtf was with mobs just standing there doing absolutely nothing most of the time. What strategy or tactics are involved in walking up to a mob and getting in several very slow paced attacks while they simply stand there and don't react to your attacks. Hell most of them seemed to be completely oblivious to the fact that they were even being attacked and just continued doing whatever they were doing while getting smakced from behind with a sword.
The combat mechanics themselves dont need to be actiony, as i said i enjoy tactical gameplay too, but at least give some semblance of action & reaction from the mobs. Im really hoping that it was just setup this way for the demo, but i fthis is basically the finished product of the combat the game is just going to get extremely boring very fast.
from one not being used to controllers. yes they were annoying, but doesnt take long to get used to, just as it were in alpha there were no point in having the mouse at all. you d be able to tab through mobs faster than move the hand to the mouse and manual target....took some time for me to just leave the damn mouse alone.
it is how I see the guy on the video. just had to use the mouse to control the camera. which seems to continue to be a problem in the beta build they used on the show.
So they finally got this piece of junk working?
I waited in line at E3 for 45 mins the first day to find out that their demo was having problems and I couldn't play it. It consisted of me grouping up with 2 other people, getting a shared quest and no combat.
Now that they've actually put out some combat video of it working... I'm even less impressed. Wow.. a quest to kill crabs? Seriously guys? This is the best you can do for a demo at E3?
When are developers going to learn to do something new than give us the same grocery list of junk that every other MMO gives us.
yeap will try avoid guild leves as much as possible....am certain there will be alot more in game than those, its SE´s way of accept ppl want the ability to solo, and not have to explore for the "real" quests and what else you d be able to find in the game - atleast how I see it.
reason why they put so much time into showing it....yes you can do the regular kill 10 rats quests if you want to.....sad to see you actually seem to gain something from them, and more than you would just from do the exploring. but then I might be wrong on that point. just doesnt seem so, so far.
The FFXI Online combat has always been about tactics instead of button mashing like most other mmos. So if youa re looking for a button masher then this isn't it. I enjoyed the combat in FFXI and I'm sure I will in FFXIV as well.
Just figured I'd point out to some people that this is gameplay at a very low level (i.e. newb level). The combat speed will pick up at higher levels if FFXI is anything to go by and these battles don't do much to demonstrate the tactical side of the game since they're meant to be easy for a new player to get to grips with.
Like others have said, it doesn't look interesting to an outside viewer because you are not engaged in the thought processes of the combat system. The entertainment with FF games comes from the planning and execution on the part of the player, not flashy animations and button mashing.
I think the 'anti-WoW' description someone used earlier is perfect actually. This game is designed to appeal to people who want a playstyle entirely different to WoW.
It annoys me when, for whatever reason, the animation and damage dealt don't sync up and you can walk through objects.
--------
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The most awesomest after school special T-shirt:
Front: UNO Chemistry Club
Back: /\OH --> Bad Decisions
Okay, I watched that video.
Does it look pretty? Yes, very pretty.
Does it look like combat would be fun to engage in? Not at all.
And to say there are no tactics in other MMOs is just plain silly. Slow turn-based gaming does not = tactics. Most MMOs require you to use varying tactics for each class to get the most out of them. That they're happening in a far more exciting and realistic fashion than these FFXIV videos does not make those fun MMOs any less enjoyable. Most, in fact, would say the opposite.
slow doesn't = Strategic... The skills he was explainging, the different gauges you need to pay attention to in order to pull of different types of skills DOES = strategy. Henche a slightly slower pace than some might be used to.
It looks great in my opinion though whoever was controlling the character sucked big time.
I too think the fighting is at a good pace. It seems faster than FFXI but it could because they were buffed. Still having more gauges to pay attention to adds more stratgey and I like that. I perfer slower at strategic to fast button mashing. There are good faster paced games though like Guild Wars so i'm not knocking it. I think this fighting style fits nicely.
And it looks AMAZINGLY BEAUTIFUL. I never thought I'd find a cave so pretty looking. ^^
he skills he was explainging, the different gauges you need to pay attention to in order to pull of different types of skills DOES = strategy.
I think thats where part of the devider is. To me thats no different than babysitting cooldowns.
I mean personally the strategies and tactics you use to defeat mobs are the ones the devs created. I mean they design in a way that there is a certain way to beat the encounter, mob or w/e. There's little room for creativity on the players side to develop there own strategies and tactics. Which means it's less about strategy and tactics and more about finding out how the devs intended for this to be beat.
This is why I don't consider it an MMO revolving around tactics and strategy. I mean once you learn how the devs intended for you to beat something, you use that same method on it every time and you will win unless someone forgets a step.
So, I guess to me it's not so much about strategy and tactics but more about finding and remembering the steps that have been assigned to that specific encounter w/e it may be.
To anwer your question whether the combat looked fun in the Beta Video I posted... yeah it did.
It's personal taste... this isn't an objective thing. There's a lot of negativity revolving around the combat because 99% of all the mmo's on the market are twitchbased. People seem to think that all mmo's should have that or else "they suck!"
As someone who played WoW, FFXI, and a dozen other current mmos (Aion, Aoc,Warhammer, Allods, LoTRO), I can safely say that FFXI was the most memorable and fun.
I'm an FF fan, so FFXIV being similar to consol FF's in terms of limit moves and abilities, it's right up my ally. Conversely, I think WoW based combat is one step away from giving people seizures and carpel tunnel syndrome.
To each his own.
noo its not newb lvl this. you start out with 1 ability and very fast get 2. you have about 1 ability around every 5 class lvl- just how it seemed to me, not a solid fact. so this would actually be at a rather high lvl. cant say how far into the game this is.. but its for sure not at the start of the game at all.
edit: for what I can see the guy got the whole ability bar filled, cant see with what but if only class specific skills he would be around lvl 40 class lvls. not sure what hte game caps at when released..
I also think the reason some people in this thread are put off by FFXIV'S combat is because the only alternative for the last 5+ years has been WoW and Wow clones. Wow clones include Aion, Aoc, Warhammer, Lotro.
What I mean by wow clones is that 30+ abilities that you use every "global cooldown" or whenever the cooldown is up. all these different MMO'S play essentially the same. Unlike WoW and Wow clones, FFXIV is FUNDAMENTALLY different. It's more of a consol game turned into an MMO. I played FFXI on a controller and keyboard. Controller was by far my favorite.
So I guess, I'm very happy that one company out of hundreds is not going the WoW route. When you play FFXIV, you will never get the feeling that it's a WoW clone... that is for certain. I don't think you can say that for any other game, other than EvE or Fallen Earth.
Don't get me wrong, I loved Vanilla WoW... I am enjoying AoC right now, and LoTRO was awesome too. But, am I glad now that a company is something really different... something that I loved in the past? You Bet!
FFXI had 500k Subscriber base for 7 years. IT exited before wow, during wow, and after wow more so than any other mmo that's come after it. There's a huge market for this type of gameplay that people absolutely love. If you want twitch based gameplay.... every other game will offer you what you want, including SWTOR (soon enough).
Looks great when compared to FFXI, an 8 year old game.
Looks dull when compared to GW2, Rift, TOR.
I was so excited when we heard rumors of this game in 2006. The bar has been raised since and i'm honestly no longer looking forward to this.
Do you guys even know how the combat works? Each time an attack is used the stamina bar slowly depletes (but its constantly recharging at a certain rate). That second video posted shows how fast the combat is, but the more attacks you use the faster the bar goes down, meaning you may reach a point where you can not attack for a couple of seconds. Attacking slower however means you will be able to attack for longer. The speed of the combat depends on how the player decides to use their spells and abilities.
Holy crap that was frustrating to watch. Maybe next time get someone to play the game who hasn't just managed to pull himself out of a well for the first time since birth.
Joined 2004 - I can't believe I've been a MMORPG.com member for 20 years! Get off my lawn!
All of you idiots insulting the guy need to shut up. Final Fantasy has the WORST controls in the world. So its safe to bet FF14 also sucks. Square enix proved they sucked at making mmo, so maybe they'll do better. The only reason anyone will play this is because of the final fantasy name. With out it, its just another generic fantasy game that doesnt nothing new at all.
That dumbass playing the toon should be fired...How smart do you have to be to press a few keybuttons.....
Retard is retarded.....geez
When I first learned of FFXIV, being a former SE fanboy, I flipped out and got all giddy. I just don't think I have it in me to play this game. I don't want to play FFXI ver. 2.0 which is what this looks like to me. The only game that has my attention is Tera, and that is only because of the fast paced combat system and the possibility of skill driven gameplay.
Is FFXIV still in Alpha or did it just go Beta ?
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
It's in between the two. Alpha ended, but beta hasn't begun yet. A transition phase.
Also, lol at anyone judging the combat from this.
Thanks much.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
Every video and interview I see about this game always has them saying a bunch of stuff and yet providing absolutely no new information what-so-ever.
I hope this game is really good, and has story and quests to play through rather than just kill 50000 mobs a day.