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MMORPG.COM News: Mourning Removed
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This is a very interesting observation. Of course it's far to easy to find signs when one is looking for them to say they prove anything, but there sure are a lot of "indications" of foul play in this case.
EDIT: Spellig
None of this ever would have happened had mourning been able to withstand criticism. It appears to me that they just cracked under the pressure.
Every game faces unfair comments sometimes even posted by children(this is in fact still a video game). Now if the Staff at a gaming company isnt professional enough to either shrug it off and/or debate and debunk false statements then in my honest opinion it just doesnt deserve to be on any list. If this wouldnt have happened here on mmorpg it would have happened on another forum or site as it was obviously mishandled by mourning staff who let their egos get in the way of healthy development.
[quote]Originally posted by Odenathus
[b]I think that what mmorpg.com did was up to them. Their domain, their forums, their lists.
However, this thread is, nothing more than an invitation to flame Mourning.
[/quote]
Or a invitation for people that were never invovled in mmorpg.com to come and flame the site because the mourning boards think that this decision is "unbeliveable".
I pointed this out before but shouldn't this be changed already? I'm not trying to say anything against MMORPG staff as I have previously said the actions of Mourning folks would essentially ensure I would never buy that game. However, the above statement as it now stands is false, and hurts other sites that are competitors of MMORPG.com. Quite simply the statement needs to be changed or Mourning should be restored and such removal of any game should not occur. I can understand not giving a game a forum, heck, I support removal of the Mourning forum. I even agree that MMORPG should remove Mourning from their site if that is their decision, but then the effects of that action must be taken into account.
Now, I will play devil's advocate. If I was a competitor site to MMORPG.com, I would take the removal statement, and the above statement, and file a claim for losses against MMORPG under the idea that the claims are no longer true and that such untrue claims are deceiving people who might otherwise be on my site.
In this bit of advice I am trying to help MMORPG.com and it's staff. Please understand I am not in any way saying I would personally take such an action as, heck I'm no one special. Just giving out free advice, which coincidentally matches my opinion (as unheard as that may be) that all the games know should still be listed. Heck, put a big disclaimer on the listing saying "the staff of MMORPG.com does not support or endorse this game and recommends based on our opinions to avoid this game and it's publisher". I would whole-heartedly support that and add my own comment if comments were allowed for that listing to say I agree with the staff.
Personally after reading all 43 somthing pages, I think 1 - the admins should get the stories straight, 2 should cover all games whether they like them or not, and 3, only remove a game with the developers explicit permission. It seems to me that the Admins of MMORPG.com have conflicting posts, that start around page 3, where one admin says 1 thing and then another says another thing and things just get hazy after that.
get the stories straight, MMORPG.com shouldn't contribute bad or ill feelings towards the games if you have bad mojo about them, and just let peple draw thier own conclusions.
The admins and mods at mmorpg.com have never shown me at all that they were fair. And you know what why should they be? People need to realize that we frequent this board out of our own free will because the content they provide is good. Some people however got the delusion that this site belongs to them and that the admins and mods somehow owe them something just because they choose to look at this site. This site is provided as a service for free, a lot of us (myself included at times) take that for granted. Some people know I don't have a great love for the people who run this site, but they provide great content and I'm pleased they didn't allow themselves to be bullied around by a developer.
Bottom line, this is their board and their site, they should be able to do with it as they please.. If someone pisses them off, they should have the right to react like anyone one of us would. Why would you want to promote the product of some group of people that are complete jerks?
Now if we were subscribers and actually paid for the content on this site then sure I think we'd have a right to be up in arms, but the mods don't owe us anything. It's a two way street, they give us content, we show up to read it. What gives us the right beyond that to demand anything further? If you want to read about mourning, the best place to look would be their official website. But to ask a site like mmorpg.com to continue to support a company that behaves unprofessional to them is just plain ridiculous. No one here, not one single person would behave differently in a similar situation.
SG
Originally posted by Wickes
BTW, Saragoth, it's just a guess ... but I'd bet you were banned for bad language.
I can't say I feel the issue is of such a nature that the staff all needs to tell the story the exact same way. I've also read all 43 pages, and have not found such a level of inconsisty as to raise more suspicion than is already there (considering the nature of this case).
I personally resent the type of wording used in your third piont. It's hostile. It's fully possible to make ethical decisions without "the developers explicit permission". Demanding that a media ask you for permission to do anything (save when it comes to your personal life) is as unethical as that media complying with someone elses demand and fucks you over as a result. (pardon the language.)
I agree on your second point however.
Why is it that unless you pay someone money you can't expect them to conduct themselves in a proper fashion? I can't say I subscribe to that point of view.
I was one that talked and defended mourning for sometime then just dropped out of it because well as many have said "flame wars"... wasn't worth the time. But to be honest MMorpg.com . When I found your site I was only looking for a place for a complete listing of all morphs that are coming out. But seeing now that you have dropped mourning and another title (which there is no reason even to start up about that one) you have lost a reader. There are other sites poping up all over. I did love your organization and reviews here but now, knowing this, it just shows me that you will "edit" when u see fit.
you should have as other said, let it be, closed the forum part and let it sit in the list. At least it would show you list them all, but now you don't . So your an incomplete site that can be manipulated anytime you see fit. Eh I guess any site can do that, but IGN for one , I can find it all there. Thou it's not as nicly organized as it is here. If you do change your tune and agree to at least keep the posting and the text up, I would stick it out. But if you hold your stance, that is your choice, but I do beleive it hurts you more then it helps. BTW IGE I never cared in any fashion, it's adverstiment and those that say it's a problem are probably the people using it. LOL they wouldn't be a big success if NO gamers used them so oviously people are.
Good call on that 
"The monster created isn't by the company that makes the game, it's by the fans that make it something it never was"
Which other MMORPG are you referring to as "another title"? I'm not aware of any other MMORPG we've taken off the list for reasons other than it has shut down. If a MMORPG you know of is not on the list (other than Mourning) feel free to email us regarding this.
*Notice: The views expressed in this post are solely those of the author... got sick of holding backspace.
-----------------------------------------
ParaTrooper, That guy that used to mod the MMORPG.com forums.
I am just guessing here - but this user might be referring to when we pulled Shattered Galaxy off our list. We did this because it was really a MMORTS and not a MMORPG. We did not research it well enough when we added it to our list - and after many members of the community brought it to our attention we decided that it did not fit our specific genre. I don't think you can compare the two...but I guess some people like reaching for straws.
I have read almost all the posts in this topic - and there are many, many good points - from both sides. There is also a lot of pointless flaming - but for the most part I am impressed at how well everyone has kept it together - it is already 1000% more peaceful than any WoW vs EQ2 topic
I will be concluding my daily observation of this topic - I might follow up on it much later but for now it is becoming a "dead horse". We have absorbed many of your thoughts and opinions and will use them to form our future decisions.
I will not rule out that Mourning could re-appear on our list someday - but at this time we cannot justify doing this.
Thank you very much for sharing your opinions with us.
- MMORPG.COM Staff -
The dead know only one thing: it is better to be alive.
WoW 4 teh win. Lets all agree Mourning SuX.
I'm sorry but this statement combined with the fact that the site still says "ALL MMORPG GAMES KNOWN" does more for discreditting this site than anything thus far. It can't be both ways, you either need the complete list or that statement and any like it on the site need to be removed just as immediately as the game was removed from the list.
I pointed this out before but shouldn't this be changed already? I'm not trying to say anything against MMORPG staff as I have previously said the actions of Mourning folks would essentially ensure I would never buy that game. However, the above statement as it now stands is false, and hurts other sites that are competitors of MMORPG.com. Quite simply the statement needs to be changed or Mourning should be restored and such removal of any game should not occur. I can understand not giving a game a forum, heck, I support removal of the Mourning forum. I even agree that MMORPG should remove Mourning from their site if that is their decision, but then the effects of that action must be taken into account.
Now, I will play devil's advocate. If I was a competitor site to MMORPG.com, I would take the removal statement, and the above statement, and file a claim for losses against MMORPG under the idea that the claims are no longer true and that such untrue claims are deceiving people who might otherwise be on my site.
In this bit of advice I am trying to help MMORPG.com and it's staff. Please understand I am not in any way saying I would personally take such an action as, heck I'm no one special. Just giving out free advice, which coincidentally matches my opinion (as unheard as that may be) that all the games know should still be listed. Heck, put a big disclaimer on the listing saying "the staff of MMORPG.com does not support or endorse this game and recommends based on our opinions to avoid this game and it's publisher". I would whole-heartedly support that and add my own comment if comments were allowed for that listing to say I agree with the staff.
Actually, your missing something....
I think this alone gets the game removed from the list. What kind of "nice web site" treats people like the developers over there?
Removing a game from this site is bad only for the company making the game. As a reader I'd support the decision simply because it's your site, your choice as to how you want to deal with something you provide as a free service (with ads, yes, but they don't cost the reader much).
Regarding the entire issue, I have to point out that I'm apalled by the behavior of the Mourning staff, As someone who has happened on this without all the background, everything I can see linked or mentioned from both sides shows a startling lack of professional conduct by Limitless Horizons. Poor English skills aside (and while I'm aware the vocal staff member is Romanian, when you're catering to a primarily English-speaking fanbase you provide a PR/Media outlet that speaks fluently and coherently in English - I doubt Blizzard released WoW over in Korea with the headliner "U BUY RANG RANG' in Korean), the attitude and use of slang and insults are redline indicators that this game is going south if not in production then in management,
Someone pointed out that word of mouth is a big thing, and readers may be shallow, like me and the bunch of gamers I know that were linked to this debacle. We see the attitudes and poor conduct displayed by the Mourning staff, on their own site, and instantly shy away. You lose fence sitters that way. This is why companies cannot afford to just cut loose, no matter how personally frustrated or angry with the situation they've become. A guy can build a thousand bridges, but if he kicks a puppy once he's remembered as a jackass.
Yeah, I've never posted before. I'm one of those lurkers that reads the site and doesn't often bother with the forums.
Well for a first post its very well said. I can't wait to see how you post with alittle more practice.
- Scaris
"What happened to you, Star Wars Galaxies? You used to look like Leia. Not quite gold bikini Leia (more like bad-British-accent-and-cinnamon-bun-hair Leia), but still Leia nonetheless. Now you look like Chewbacca." - Computer Gaming World
I'm sorry but this statement combined with the fact that the site still says "ALL MMORPG GAMES KNOWN" does more for discreditting this site than anything thus far. It can't be both ways, you either need the complete list or that statement and any like it on the site need to be removed just as immediately as the game was removed from the list.Shattered Galaxy was not ammorpg...thus it was removed.
Mourning was removed due to the behavior of their publisher.
People who have to create conspiracy and hate threads to further a cause lacks in intellectual comprehension of diversity.
I agree, Shattered Galaxy is not a MMORPG. Heck, even they say it.
I was more referring to the Mourning issue. Mounring is a known game. The list does say ALL MMORPG GAMES KNOWN. It does not say ALL MMORPG GAMES KNOWN EXCEPT THOSE WHERE WE THINK THE DEVS ARE JERKS. While I do agree they are jerks, the game is known about and portends to a MMORPG thus far, and the site does say ALL. To make such a claim while at the same time not listing a game is wrong. Then to say the topic is a "dead horse" while keeping the claim of ALL is even more wrong and I pointed out elsewhere dangerous to the site overall.
Mourning might smell like a mmorpg, look like a mmorpg, it may even have some tasty mmorpg in it. But over all I wouldn't call it a mmorpg, so let it go. We are better off with out mourning being around. They should just rename it Horizons 2, yes it is that bad.
I find it funny a game called Horizon is worthless and now a company named Horizon is worthless. You can't make stuff like this up.
Take no thought of who is right or wrong or who is better than. Be not for or against.
Bruce Lee
I will not get into a flame war where I put Mourning against DnL. One comment though: sometime during last year I posted here on mmorpg.com a message stating that wish will be canceled. Maybe it was blind luck that Wish DID got cancelled a month later but I do not think so. This is the only comment I will make on what you stated here regarding the fact that he is not a developer.
Andrei Gireada
*rubs eyes in disbelief*
So your ok with coming here to post speculation about Wish - but you draw the line when other speculate about Mourning ?????????????????
UNF*CKENBELIVEABLE
I guess there are still a few words in english your struggling with huh ? The first of which would be GROSS and the second would be http://dictionary.reference.com/search?r=2&q=hypocrisy
Man Im surprised you can look at yourself in a mirror
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"MMOs, for people that like think chatting is like a skill or something, rotflol"
http://purepwnage.com
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"Far away across the field, the tolling of the iron bell, calls the faithful to their knees. To hear the softly spoken magic spell" Pink Floyd-Dark Side of the Moon
Yes we should just ignore everyone else and do what this version/incarnation of someone impersonating someone else says we should do
Why didnt I think of that
Ill be listing a clue on Ebay later... Id advise you to bid early
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"MMOs, for people that like think chatting is like a skill or something, rotflol"
http://purepwnage.com
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"Far away across the field, the tolling of the iron bell, calls the faithful to their knees. To hear the softly spoken magic spell" Pink Floyd-Dark Side of the Moon
ok guys, let's not have this thread get outta hand with the flames
People who have to create conspiracy and hate threads to further a cause lacks in intellectual comprehension of diversity.