Lotro has 1 serious problem : no new content since Mirkwood . At the beginning we had new areas, free of charge, 3 X/ year. A new area by year is not enough. a lot of players stopped because of very low production of new content.
This is my thought as well. Mirkwood was too little too late. My contention has been that instead of using time and resourses for steady expansions Turbine used these resources to rework DDO and let LOTRO fall into tedium and then, once again, spend time and money on a new model for it as well. Whether it was intentional or not they allowed LOTRO to become stale to the point of losing subs then decided to use the DDO model on it as well. Well, it is what it is and will continue without my involvement, to what end remains to be seen.
WOW isnt great because it has 12 million players. WOW has 12 million players because its great.
Lotro has now one serious problem : We have no new content since Mirkwood . At the beginning we had new areas, free of charge, 3 times a year. A new area by year is not enough. a lot of players stopped because of actual very very low production. One new area by year is not enough. Usually I'm against F2P, but I hope F2P model is going to save this game. Nothing new for pvp for years, nothing new for housing for years... This game has a lot of potential.
Didn't Mirkwood launch in Dec.? Which probably means from then they have been working on the f2p model which can explain the lack of new content released since then but at any rate I doubt that with an expansion released that soon things got so bad they had to rush a f2p model out the door.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Why? Probably to take advantage of certain type of gamer's mental problems as far as financial management goes.
They can scam a lot more money out of said people. Businesses like the f2p model due to that. Players like the f2p model.. because they get a free game to play, paid for by said unstable people.
Why? Probably to take advantage of certain type of gamer's mental problems as far as financial management goes.
They can scam a lot more money out of said people. Businesses like the f2p model due to that. Players like the f2p model.. because they get a free game to play, paid for by said unstable people.
The only problem with your theory though is if you play the free version of LOTRO you don't get access to any actual content just a character and the ability to walk around and attack mobs hence there is no free content. So that kind of invalidates your statement that the people who may possibly spend hundreds of dollars a month on the game are paying for those who chose not to to get content because if you don't pay you don't get the content anyway.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Lotro has now one serious problem : We have no new content since Mirkwood . At the beginning we had new areas, free of charge, 3 times a year. A new area by year is not enough. a lot of players stopped because of actual very very low production. One new area by year is not enough. Usually I'm against F2P, but I hope F2P model is going to save this game. Nothing new for pvp for years, nothing new for housing for years... This game has a lot of potential.
Didn't Mirkwood launch in Dec.? Which probably means from then they have been working on the f2p model which can explain the lack of new content released since then but at any rate I doubt that with an expansion released that soon things got so bad they had to rush a f2p model out the door.
Mirkwood wasnt much of an xpac. Small area with 5 levels tacked on. Content in the game was sparse after Moria. My personal opinion is that they let the game decline knowing, while denying, that LOTRO was going F2P quite sometime before it was announced.
WOW isnt great because it has 12 million players. WOW has 12 million players because its great.
Lotro has now one serious problem : We have no new content since Mirkwood . At the beginning we had new areas, free of charge, 3 times a year. A new area by year is not enough. a lot of players stopped because of actual very very low production. One new area by year is not enough. Usually I'm against F2P, but I hope F2P model is going to save this game. Nothing new for pvp for years, nothing new for housing for years... This game has a lot of potential.
Didn't Mirkwood launch in Dec.? Which probably means from then they have been working on the f2p model which can explain the lack of new content released since then but at any rate I doubt that with an expansion released that soon things got so bad they had to rush a f2p model out the door.
Mirkwood wasnt much of an xpac. Small area with 5 levels tacked on. Content in the game was sparse after Moria. My personal opinion is that they let the game decline knowing, while denying, that LOTRO was going F2P quite sometime before it was announced.
*sighs* ok so it didn't meet your "standards" to be called an expansion, I tend to go with if they market it is one call it one and it adds new content that makes it an expansion. If it needs to meet your own personal definition maybe you should tell us exactly what you define as one especially before using the word in your post.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Ooh boy. This argument again. Not disagreeing but I got so sick of hearing people make the OPs complaints about his game back in its beta stages.
Turbine is under the thumb of the owners of the Tolkein Estate. Even if Turbine had wanted to develop the game to where you could play an evil faction, the IPs owners would not have let them. We can argue all day long about coulda/woulda/shoulda, but the cold hard fact is that the IP's ownders just aren't going to change their minds. So that makes LOTRO a niche game. And honestly I feel that the game not being like Wow is its biggest charm.
I don't think they are making LOTRO FTP because the game is dying. Stagnating yes, but not dying. I feel they are doing it to try to bring in some fresh players because most of their player base are lifers who have already paid as much into the game as they are ever going to. Sadly I don't think its going to work. This kind of game just doesn't seem to appeal to the new generation of MMO players.
Also I feel they made a drastic mistake on how they did their beta for the new FTP hybrid model. They are giving testers enough store tokens to buy anything they desire. That will work great at finding flaws with the cash shop but it isn't going to address how new players who don't want to spend any money are going to view the game. It is already off most gamers lists because as I stated previously, it is a very different animal from games such as Wow.
They've had a free trial for quite some time. It doesn't look to have garnered much interest. Allowing people who steered clear of it to play a much emptier version of it for free isn't going to win many hearts and minds. And from the grumblings I've heard already it just might chase off the loyal fan base they did manage to capture.
If you can't dazzle 'em with brilliance, riddle 'em with bullets
When some of us were yelling that the devs wasted on Lotro on of the best opportunities to make something similar AT LEAST to wow's lvl and quality ,compete in player's base numbers (subs)some others were getting frustrated and yelling NO! Lotro must be pve ! no pvp at all! there is pvp at lotro already (the monster thingie) ,,,
Now we are getting justified cause very few players left to play lotro and it went free EXACTLY like DDO.
Very few players left to play....
Must be the reason they are opening new servers and have hired more community and support staff.
So, what particular brand of tin foil is your favorite?
When a game is going well in subs there is no reason for it to make it free. If a game goes free it means it goes lower and lower in subs and they make it free to attract more peeps.
The game is not going to be free.
Funny how some of you complain that Turbine is scamming their lifers because it's making the game "free", while others complain that Turbine is scamming people into thinking it's free while dollaring them to death.
They're going to have a sub model, and an ala' carte' model. Nothing more. Nothing less.
Except if you're a lifetime subscriber you don't have access to all the content because some of it is locked away inside item shop and you have a finite supply of tokens, so despite buying lifetime subscription to the game you don't have access to all the content.
Simply not true.
---------- "Anyone posting on this forum is not an average user, and there for any opinions about the game are going to be overly critical compared to an average users opinions." - Me
"Hello person posting on a site specifically for MMO's in a thread on a sub forum specifically for a particular game talking about meta features and making comparisons to other titles in the genre, and their meta features.
Lotro has now one serious problem : We have no new content since Mirkwood . At the beginning we had new areas, free of charge, 3 times a year. A new area by year is not enough. a lot of players stopped because of actual very very low production. One new area by year is not enough. Usually I'm against F2P, but I hope F2P model is going to save this game. Nothing new for pvp for years, nothing new for housing for years... This game has a lot of potential.
Didn't Mirkwood launch in Dec.? Which probably means from then they have been working on the f2p model which can explain the lack of new content released since then but at any rate I doubt that with an expansion released that soon things got so bad they had to rush a f2p model out the door.
Mirkwood wasnt much of an xpac. Small area with 5 levels tacked on. Content in the game was sparse after Moria. My personal opinion is that they let the game decline knowing, while denying, that LOTRO was going F2P quite sometime before it was announced.
*sighs* ok so it didn't meet your "standards" to be called an expansion, I tend to go with if they market it is one call it one and it adds new content that makes it an expansion. If it needs to meet your own personal definition maybe you should tell us exactly what you define as one especially before using the word in your post.
Okay...go take your meds and read all this again, SLOWLY. The point he is making here is: Very little new content due to the devs working on the free model. Maybe the game was headed there some time BEFORE the announcement.
NOT what he thinks an expansion is. Stop trying to point fingers and name call. THEN you might bring some interesting and INTELLIGENT discussion to the table.
Lotro has now one serious problem : We have no new content since Mirkwood . At the beginning we had new areas, free of charge, 3 times a year. A new area by year is not enough. a lot of players stopped because of actual very very low production. One new area by year is not enough. Usually I'm against F2P, but I hope F2P model is going to save this game. Nothing new for pvp for years, nothing new for housing for years... This game has a lot of potential.
Didn't Mirkwood launch in Dec.? Which probably means from then they have been working on the f2p model which can explain the lack of new content released since then but at any rate I doubt that with an expansion released that soon things got so bad they had to rush a f2p model out the door.
Mirkwood wasnt much of an xpac. Small area with 5 levels tacked on. Content in the game was sparse after Moria. My personal opinion is that they let the game decline knowing, while denying, that LOTRO was going F2P quite sometime before it was announced.
*sighs* ok so it didn't meet your "standards" to be called an expansion, I tend to go with if they market it is one call it one and it adds new content that makes it an expansion. If it needs to meet your own personal definition maybe you should tell us exactly what you define as one especially before using the word in your post.
Moria was an expansion, BC in WOW was an expansion. Mirlwood was an area the size of Forachel with, as said, an extra 5 levles thrown in. You can defend it all you want to but Mirkwood was a joke. Turbine new damned well this game going F2P long before it was announced and just threw the players a bone in hopes of keeping them happy until they were set to announce it.
WOW isnt great because it has 12 million players. WOW has 12 million players because its great.
Ooh boy. This argument again. Not disagreeing but I got so sick of hearing people make the OPs complaints about his game back in its beta stages.
Turbine is under the thumb of the owners of the Tolkein Estate. Even if Turbine had wanted to develop the game to where you could play an evil faction, the IPs owners would not have let them. We can argue all day long about coulda/woulda/shoulda, but the cold hard fact is that the IP's ownders just aren't going to change their minds. So that makes LOTRO a niche game. And honestly I feel that the game not being like Wow is its biggest charm.
I don't think they are making LOTRO FTP because the game is dying. Stagnating yes, but not dying. I feel they are doing it to try to bring in some fresh players because most of their player base are lifers who have already paid as much into the game as they are ever going to. Sadly I don't think its going to work. This kind of game just doesn't seem to appeal to the new generation of MMO players.
Also I feel they made a drastic mistake on how they did their beta for the new FTP hybrid model. They are giving testers enough store tokens to buy anything they desire. That will work great at finding flaws with the cash shop but it isn't going to address how new players who don't want to spend any money are going to view the game. It is already off most gamers lists because as I stated previously, it is a very different animal from games such as Wow.
They've had a free trial for quite some time. It doesn't look to have garnered much interest. Allowing people who steered clear of it to play a much emptier version of it for free isn't going to win many hearts and minds. And from the grumblings I've heard already it just might chase off the loyal fan base they did manage to capture.
Good post and I too wonder exactly how this is going to work out for them, I don't think though it will have to great an effect on the already playing population as most of us are going to continue to sub thus getting what we are used to getting but I do wonder what the point of allowing people to make toons only to walk around and fight mobs will do. LOTRO wasn't and isn't built as modularly as DDO is and hopefully that doesn't change just for the f2p.
But one point made that alot of these anti f2p people should begin to look at before making proclamations is that there is no content in LOTRO f2p model just access to the game world hence no one is paying for anyone elses content atleast not to the point where it doesn't cost you something everyone will have to either sub or purchase something for the actual questing and such in game.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Lotro has now one serious problem : We have no new content since Mirkwood . At the beginning we had new areas, free of charge, 3 times a year. A new area by year is not enough. a lot of players stopped because of actual very very low production. One new area by year is not enough. Usually I'm against F2P, but I hope F2P model is going to save this game. Nothing new for pvp for years, nothing new for housing for years... This game has a lot of potential.
Didn't Mirkwood launch in Dec.? Which probably means from then they have been working on the f2p model which can explain the lack of new content released since then but at any rate I doubt that with an expansion released that soon things got so bad they had to rush a f2p model out the door.
Mirkwood wasnt much of an xpac. Small area with 5 levels tacked on. Content in the game was sparse after Moria. My personal opinion is that they let the game decline knowing, while denying, that LOTRO was going F2P quite sometime before it was announced.
*sighs* ok so it didn't meet your "standards" to be called an expansion, I tend to go with if they market it is one call it one and it adds new content that makes it an expansion. If it needs to meet your own personal definition maybe you should tell us exactly what you define as one especially before using the word in your post.
Moria was an expansion, BC in WOW was an expansion. Mirlwood was an area the size of Forachel with, as said, an extra 5 levles thrown in. You can defend it all you want to but Mirkwood was a joke. Turbine new damned well this game going F2P long before it was announced and just threw the players a bone in hopes of keeping them happy until they were set to announce it.
I'm speaking about solid concepts you are speaking about perception the only thing I'm defending is making sense when you post something, if something doesn't meet your personal standards then you should be including your definition and whenever you use the word "like" you are not defining something you are describing it (like Moria, like BC).
I never said Mirkwood was a GOOD expansion I'm just sick of people especially on these boards adding their own meaning to words that are pretty black and white cut and dried and when called on it only then to save face letting us in on the fact that said topic doesn't meet the standards they set it's the same as the term "MMORPG".
Regardless of how you slice it this argument is being based on a very low probability even in that Turbine hasn't come out with new content (even though Mirk was launched in Dec) and that somehow in that little time the game has been able to tank bad enough to now make it easier for them to launch the f2p hybrid model.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
When some of us were yelling that the devs wasted on Lotro on of the best opportunities to make something similar AT LEAST to wow's lvl and quality ,compete in player's base numbers (subs)some others were getting frustrated and yelling NO! Lotro must be pve ! no pvp at all! there is pvp at lotro already (the monster thingie) ,,,
Now we are getting justified cause very few players left to play lotro and it went free EXACTLY like DDO.
Very few players left to play....
Must be the reason they are opening new servers and have hired more community and support staff.
So, what particular brand of tin foil is your favorite?
When a game is going well in subs there is no reason for it to make it free. If a game goes free it means it goes lower and lower in subs and they make it free to attract more peeps.
The game is not going to be free.
Funny how some of you complain that Turbine is scamming their lifers because it's making the game "free", while others complain that Turbine is scamming people into thinking it's free while dollaring them to death.
They're going to have a sub model, and an ala' carte' model. Nothing more. Nothing less.
Except if you're a lifetime subscriber you don't have access to all the content because some of it is locked away inside item shop and you have a finite supply of tokens, so despite buying lifetime subscription to the game you don't have access to all the content.
It really is a shame. LotRO could have been something great but the devs just wanted it to be a WoW clone instead. Anyone remember Middle Earth Online?
Ummm what do you have to offer as proof that "content" is going to be locked away in cash shops? As I understand it I am not a lifer but do plan on continuing my month to month sub and as such I have access to all the same content I have access to the day before the f2p launch which for me is Mines of Moria since I haven't gotten Mirkwood yet.
In addition to having full access to every part of the game I had access to I also get free turbine points every month that the free to play people will have to pruchase then use to access the content I get for my regular monthly sub fee.
I think maybe you just haven't gotten over your whole Middle Earth Online thing.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Lotro has now one serious problem : We have no new content since Mirkwood . At the beginning we had new areas, free of charge, 3 times a year. A new area by year is not enough. a lot of players stopped because of actual very very low production. One new area by year is not enough. Usually I'm against F2P, but I hope F2P model is going to save this game. Nothing new for pvp for years, nothing new for housing for years... This game has a lot of potential.
Didn't Mirkwood launch in Dec.? Which probably means from then they have been working on the f2p model which can explain the lack of new content released since then but at any rate I doubt that with an expansion released that soon things got so bad they had to rush a f2p model out the door.
Mirkwood wasnt much of an xpac. Small area with 5 levels tacked on. Content in the game was sparse after Moria. My personal opinion is that they let the game decline knowing, while denying, that LOTRO was going F2P quite sometime before it was announced.
*sighs* ok so it didn't meet your "standards" to be called an expansion, I tend to go with if they market it is one call it one and it adds new content that makes it an expansion. If it needs to meet your own personal definition maybe you should tell us exactly what you define as one especially before using the word in your post.
Moria was an expansion, BC in WOW was an expansion. Mirlwood was an area the size of Forachel with, as said, an extra 5 levles thrown in. You can defend it all you want to but Mirkwood was a joke. Turbine new damned well this game going F2P long before it was announced and just threw the players a bone in hopes of keeping them happy until they were set to announce it.
I'm speaking about solid concepts you are speaking about perception the only thing I'm defending is making sense when you post something, if something doesn't meet your personal standards then you should be including your definition and whenever you use the word "like" you are not defining something you are describing it (like Moria, like BC).
I never said Mirkwood was a GOOD expansion I'm just sick of people especially on these boards adding their own meaning to words that are pretty black and white cut and dried and when called on it only then to save face letting us in on the fact that said topic doesn't meet the standards they set it's the same as the term "MMORPG".
Regardless of how you slice it this argument is being based on a very low probability even in that Turbine hasn't come out with new content (even though Mirk was launched in Dec) and that somehow in that little time the game has been able to tank bad enough to now make it easier for them to launch the f2p hybrid model.
Do you happen to recall when Moria launched? If so you can then perhaps put it into perspective. People were leaving the game before MIrkwood launched. I would think some returned to play it and then left again. Its not like it had enough content to keep people interested for long especially knowing the time from Moria to Mirkwood and what Mirkwood consists of. My solid concept is that Mirkwood is something Turbine had patched in for nothing in the past and now they sell as an xpac.
WOW isnt great because it has 12 million players. WOW has 12 million players because its great.
Lotro has now one serious problem : We have no new content since Mirkwood . At the beginning we had new areas, free of charge, 3 times a year. A new area by year is not enough. a lot of players stopped because of actual very very low production. One new area by year is not enough. Usually I'm against F2P, but I hope F2P model is going to save this game. Nothing new for pvp for years, nothing new for housing for years... This game has a lot of potential.
Didn't Mirkwood launch in Dec.? Which probably means from then they have been working on the f2p model which can explain the lack of new content released since then but at any rate I doubt that with an expansion released that soon things got so bad they had to rush a f2p model out the door.
Mirkwood wasnt much of an xpac. Small area with 5 levels tacked on. Content in the game was sparse after Moria. My personal opinion is that they let the game decline knowing, while denying, that LOTRO was going F2P quite sometime before it was announced.
*sighs* ok so it didn't meet your "standards" to be called an expansion, I tend to go with if they market it is one call it one and it adds new content that makes it an expansion. If it needs to meet your own personal definition maybe you should tell us exactly what you define as one especially before using the word in your post.
Moria was an expansion, BC in WOW was an expansion. Mirlwood was an area the size of Forachel with, as said, an extra 5 levles thrown in. You can defend it all you want to but Mirkwood was a joke. Turbine new damned well this game going F2P long before it was announced and just threw the players a bone in hopes of keeping them happy until they were set to announce it.
I'm speaking about solid concepts you are speaking about perception the only thing I'm defending is making sense when you post something, if something doesn't meet your personal standards then you should be including your definition and whenever you use the word "like" you are not defining something you are describing it (like Moria, like BC).
I never said Mirkwood was a GOOD expansion I'm just sick of people especially on these boards adding their own meaning to words that are pretty black and white cut and dried and when called on it only then to save face letting us in on the fact that said topic doesn't meet the standards they set it's the same as the term "MMORPG".
Regardless of how you slice it this argument is being based on a very low probability even in that Turbine hasn't come out with new content (even though Mirk was launched in Dec) and that somehow in that little time the game has been able to tank bad enough to now make it easier for them to launch the f2p hybrid model.
Do you happen to recall when Moria launched? If so you can then perhaps put it into perspective. People were leaving the game before MIrkwood launched. I would think some returned to play it and then left again. Its not like it had enough content to keep people interested for long especially knowing the time from Moria to Mirkwood and what Mirkwood consists of. My solid concept is that Mirkwood is something Turbine had patched in for nothing in the past and now they sell as an xpac.
Your "solid concept" can be explained using one word "opinion". Yes I remember when Moria came out I also remember a vast majority of the playerbase didn't like the mines themselves and many people skip over them so I can state an "opinion" that then it makes Moria and Mirkwood equal but I won't I'm just going with the thoght that this entire line of thought is too far fetched to be believed, that they haven't released any content in a really long time and allowed the game to tank on purpose so they can then make it free to play.
I'm going to stick with maybe the content schedule was changed because Mirkwood didn't bring in alot of new players and missed some old ones too (myself included) and since they got a 500% increase in players for DDO why not do the same with LOTRO and see what happens. Makes far more sense than the notion that somehow they just sat on there hands waiting for the game to tank.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
For an MMO to be an expansion it has to add in some new features. Moria added in LI's and Mirkwood added in Skirmishes.
So, Mirkwood technically IS an expansion, just not as large as Moria.
IMO Mirkwood was an attempt to deliver smaller expac's to players for a smaller chunk of cash in order to boost their income over time to help support future development. I think this approach failed based on player feedback on the expansion and limited uptake and this was a deciding factor for them to convert to the Hybrid model instead based on the success of DDO's conversion.
Lotro has now one serious problem : We have no new content since Mirkwood . At the beginning we had new areas, free of charge, 3 times a year. A new area by year is not enough. a lot of players stopped because of actual very very low production. One new area by year is not enough. Usually I'm against F2P, but I hope F2P model is going to save this game. Nothing new for pvp for years, nothing new for housing for years... This game has a lot of potential.
Didn't Mirkwood launch in Dec.? Which probably means from then they have been working on the f2p model which can explain the lack of new content released since then but at any rate I doubt that with an expansion released that soon things got so bad they had to rush a f2p model out the door.
Mirkwood wasnt much of an xpac. Small area with 5 levels tacked on. Content in the game was sparse after Moria. My personal opinion is that they let the game decline knowing, while denying, that LOTRO was going F2P quite sometime before it was announced.
*sighs* ok so it didn't meet your "standards" to be called an expansion, I tend to go with if they market it is one call it one and it adds new content that makes it an expansion. If it needs to meet your own personal definition maybe you should tell us exactly what you define as one especially before using the word in your post.
Moria was an expansion, BC in WOW was an expansion. Mirlwood was an area the size of Forachel with, as said, an extra 5 levles thrown in. You can defend it all you want to but Mirkwood was a joke. Turbine new damned well this game going F2P long before it was announced and just threw the players a bone in hopes of keeping them happy until they were set to announce it.
It also was not priced like other, larger expansions.
---------- "Anyone posting on this forum is not an average user, and there for any opinions about the game are going to be overly critical compared to an average users opinions." - Me
"Hello person posting on a site specifically for MMO's in a thread on a sub forum specifically for a particular game talking about meta features and making comparisons to other titles in the genre, and their meta features.
It also was not priced like other, larger expansions.
In many cases, not priced at all.
Folks like me who were on the $30/3 months plan* got it for free. Lifers got it for free if they bought the adventurers pack.
In contrast, AoC people who wanted RotG free had to buy a 6 month sub at like, 80 bucks. Most other games don't offer these kinds of deals at all.
I could say I was disappointed in SoM, but then I'm disappointed that the game doesn't double in size every year. It's just that I also happen to be realistic.
*Any LotRO subscriber that is NOT on this plan, you must absolutely despise having money.
1) Pretty much EVERYTHING anyone posts here is an OPINION and should be assumed as such. Anyone with reading comprhension should get this. Unless some-one specificaly mentions that they are posting a "fact"....or calls out something which clearly is verifiable with hard data... i.e. "there are 150,233 current subscribers".... there is no need to jump all over them telling them they are only posting an "opinion". You are just being pedantic and derailing the conversation. We all understand that it's an opinion... that doesn't make it somehow unrelavent to the conversation. Give the guy posting the "Mirkwood was not a real expansion" a break.... I think we all understand that he was being FIGURATIVE not litteral... you are free to disagree with him...but I think we all get that he was basicaly saying "Mirkwood didn't have much content for something that was being labeled as an expansion". A sentiment which I actualy agree with.
2) We really DON'T KNOW how the F2P option will end up affecting the game or it's current subscribers (of which I happen to be one) in the LONG TERM. We know that as subscribers we aren't going to be charged to access any of the EXISTING CONTENT that we already have access to, nor the new area they are opening with F2P. We DON'T KNOW if we can expect the same sort of free content updates in future (i.e. Forochel) as we have in the past...or if they are going to nickle and diming us to death with them on top of our subscription fees. We do know what is currently in the RMT shop (in beta) and how many points our subscription buys us per month. I'm personaly troubled by some of the items for offer in the RMT shop and how they might effect game play....as are a number of people. We DON'T really know what things Turbine will put there in future, how much they'll cost, how they'll effect the game or how much real play-experience buying power our monthly points will translate into. This all is completely upto Turbine.
The existance of the RMT shop and the F2P model certainly open the POSSIBILTY of wrecking game play and the atmosphere in ways that didn't exist without them. It also opens the POSSIBILTY for Turbine to end up nickle and diming it's monthly subscribers and lifers...and ultimately make us end up paying more for fewer services then we had before. Ok it's fair to say "This hasn't happened yet, don't accuse them of something until it happens." However it's not fair to pretend that opening up the RMT shop and F2P options don't open up the opportunity to bring all sorts of woe to the game that didn't exist without them. Anyone that denies that is simply being wilfully ignorant or is on some-ones viral marketing payroll. It's all up to what Turbine DOES, not SAYS, from here on out. Any claims of "oh it's Turbine, trust them, look what their history"... are pretty much voided by the change in management and more important the change in OWNERSHIP. Lots of things happen when companies change hands. Furthermore, alot of us have been left with a pretty bad taste in our mouths of how they handled the whole F2P/Management change things so far...and where the resources to fund it might have been drawn from.
3) At the risk of being accused of being pedantic myself.... it is not the "Tolkien Estate" (a.k.a. Christopher Tolkien) who they licenesed the IP from but "Tolkien Enterprises" (a.k.a Saul Zaentz company) . The only reasons I mention this is because the two entities seem to have very different attitudes in terms of protectiveness over Tolkiens works and because it limits the portions of the IP that CAN be covered by the license. Zaentz owns the rights to Lord of the Rings and Hobbit, so those are in, but any of Tolkiens other Middle Earth based work is still held by Cristopher Tolkien...so not covered by the license Turbine has.
Lotro has now one serious problem : We have no new content since Mirkwood . At the beginning we had new areas, free of charge, 3 times a year. A new area by year is not enough. a lot of players stopped because of actual very very low production. One new area by year is not enough. Usually I'm against F2P, but I hope F2P model is going to save this game. Nothing new for pvp for years, nothing new for housing for years... This game has a lot of potential.
Didn't Mirkwood launch in Dec.? Which probably means from then they have been working on the f2p model which can explain the lack of new content released since then but at any rate I doubt that with an expansion released that soon things got so bad they had to rush a f2p model out the door.
Mirkwood wasnt much of an xpac. Small area with 5 levels tacked on. Content in the game was sparse after Moria. My personal opinion is that they let the game decline knowing, while denying, that LOTRO was going F2P quite sometime before it was announced.
*sighs* ok so it didn't meet your "standards" to be called an expansion, I tend to go with if they market it is one call it one and it adds new content that makes it an expansion. If it needs to meet your own personal definition maybe you should tell us exactly what you define as one especially before using the word in your post.
Moria was an expansion, BC in WOW was an expansion. Mirlwood was an area the size of Forachel with, as said, an extra 5 levles thrown in. You can defend it all you want to but Mirkwood was a joke. Turbine new damned well this game going F2P long before it was announced and just threw the players a bone in hopes of keeping them happy until they were set to announce it.
I'm speaking about solid concepts you are speaking about perception the only thing I'm defending is making sense when you post something, if something doesn't meet your personal standards then you should be including your definition and whenever you use the word "like" you are not defining something you are describing it (like Moria, like BC).
I never said Mirkwood was a GOOD expansion I'm just sick of people especially on these boards adding their own meaning to words that are pretty black and white cut and dried and when called on it only then to save face letting us in on the fact that said topic doesn't meet the standards they set it's the same as the term "MMORPG".
Regardless of how you slice it this argument is being based on a very low probability even in that Turbine hasn't come out with new content (even though Mirk was launched in Dec) and that somehow in that little time the game has been able to tank bad enough to now make it easier for them to launch the f2p hybrid model.
Do you happen to recall when Moria launched? If so you can then perhaps put it into perspective. People were leaving the game before MIrkwood launched. I would think some returned to play it and then left again. Its not like it had enough content to keep people interested for long especially knowing the time from Moria to Mirkwood and what Mirkwood consists of. My solid concept is that Mirkwood is something Turbine had patched in for nothing in the past and now they sell as an xpac.
Your "solid concept" can be explained using one word "opinion". Yes I remember when Moria came out I also remember a vast majority of the playerbase didn't like the mines themselves and many people skip over them so I can state an "opinion" that then it makes Moria and Mirkwood equal but I won't I'm just going with the thoght that this entire line of thought is too far fetched to be believed, that they haven't released any content in a really long time and allowed the game to tank on purpose so they can then make it free to play.
I'm going to stick with maybe the content schedule was changed because Mirkwood didn't bring in alot of new players and missed some old ones too (myself included) and since they got a 500% increase in players for DDO why not do the same with LOTRO and see what happens. Makes far more sense than the notion that somehow they just sat on there hands waiting for the game to tank.
I don't think you get what he is trying to say. I don't think he is trying to say that they tried to astro-turf subs on purpose so they could turn around and justify going F2P due to declining subs. Although I have personaly witnessed executives within a company do EXACTLY such things in order to justify changes that they already wanted to make.... so it DOES happen more then you would expect. It generaly only happens when the executive in question only has limited power over the companies direction (i.e. they are some-one other then the CEO, or have to answer to a Board that are holding tight reign over them) or some-one they need to answer to and they need to manufacture something to push the decision the way that want it...or justification to cover themselves to stockholders/owners in case the decision turns out badly.
I think he is simply saying that Turbine decided a long time ago that it wanted to go F2P. Had limited resources to devote to the game and decided to short content development of resources so that they could funnel those resources to fund the F2P project. Tried to keep it quiet that they were doing that. Then when Mirkwood came along, rather then release it as a free content update for everyone, only released it for free to multi-month plans and lifers... so that they could A) Get some revenue from 1 month people who would buy it outright Spur more people to switch to a multi-month plan. This would give them an influx of capital which they could use to further fund the F2P project.
In other words, they knew that they were shorting the immediate health of the game under the sub model in order to be able to fund the Vision(TM) of the F2P model. It's the sort of things companies do all the time. Nothing really sinister about it. Sometimes it works out brilliantly, other times it blows up in thier faces. Which way this ends up here remains to be seen.
Of course for folks like me who really hate the F2P model and were disappointed with the lack of resources Turbine seemed to be devoting to the game, it does end up leaving a bitter taste in the mouth.
Note, this is pure conjecture. It might be utter fantasy and the reality could be very different. It just dovetails well with the way things look from the outside.
Also I feel they made a drastic mistake on how they did their beta for the new FTP hybrid model. They are giving testers enough store tokens to buy anything they desire. That will work great at finding flaws with the cash shop but it isn't going to address how new players who don't want to spend any money are going to view the game.
Very true. I think I've gotten 3500? 4500? free points as a tester. Great for beating the snot out of the store but not very realistic unless they plan on offering a special 4500 pts for $9.95 deal.
The other thing they didn't test was us Premium players which are going to be a good chunk of the players coming back to check it out. Or they did think about it and decided they didn't want to put up with the flames that would come from it. I'd say out of the 3 different groups, we're the one's that will take it in the shorts the most (if you're under lvl 50).
Being in the middle of a zone (when you dropped), then coming back and finding out you're locked out of the rest of that zone will not be a pleasant experience for most.
Being in the middle of a zone (when you dropped), then coming back and finding out you're locked out of the rest of that zone will not be a pleasant experience for most.
Can't happen. Whether free or subbed, you have to buy Moria to access the locked zones. If you bought Moria, you have those areas, and can come and go as you please.
Everywhere else, you are free to roam with a free account, you just can't access the quests and other content.
If you're in a non-free instance, you'll get kicked out just like you would, now.
Being in the middle of a zone (when you dropped), then coming back and finding out you're locked out of the rest of that zone will not be a pleasant experience for most.
Can't happen. Whether free or subbed, you have to buy Moria to access the locked zones. If you bought Moria, you have those areas, and can come and go as you please.
Everywhere else, you are free to roam with a free account, you just can't access the quests and other content.
If you're in a non-free instance, you'll get kicked out just like you would, now.
Ummmm ..... who mentioned Moria? I did say the 'under lvl 50' crowd. Buying Moria only gets you Moria, it has nothing to do with North Downs, Lorelands, Trollshaws etc.....
Didn't think I needed to spell it out but, if you are had a quest in your log when you dropped (i.e. middle of a zone), then under the F2p / Premium rules you can finish that quest but will not be able to take any new quests in that zone (i.e. you're locked out of the rest of that zone) unless you buy the buy - thus opening up all the quests in the zone.
It also was not priced like other, larger expansions.
In many cases, not priced at all.
Folks like me who were on the $30/3 months plan* got it for free. Lifers got it for free if they bought the adventurers pack.
In contrast, AoC people who wanted RotG free had to buy a 6 month sub at like, 80 bucks. Most other games don't offer these kinds of deals at all.
I could say I was disappointed in SoM, but then I'm disappointed that the game doesn't double in size every year. It's just that I also happen to be realistic.
*Any LotRO subscriber that is NOT on this plan, you must absolutely despise having money.
I was subbed to LotRO for four months Nov 2009 to Feb 2010. During that time I paid $40.00.
For the first $10.00 I got the basic game at that point (Angmar and Moria) and one month of subscription time. Then when I went on the 3 month subscription for $30.00 I got the Mirkwood expansion.
So it looks like when LotRO goes f2p I will be able to play the first 65 levels of the game with full content indefinitely for my past $40.00 payment (with the only costs I can forsee really needing to pay for being unlocking storage or character space).
Lotro has now one serious problem : We have no new content since Mirkwood . At the beginning we had new areas, free of charge, 3 times a year. A new area by year is not enough. a lot of players stopped because of actual very very low production. One new area by year is not enough. Usually I'm against F2P, but I hope F2P model is going to save this game. Nothing new for pvp for years, nothing new for housing for years... This game has a lot of potential.
Didn't Mirkwood launch in Dec.? Which probably means from then they have been working on the f2p model which can explain the lack of new content released since then but at any rate I doubt that with an expansion released that soon things got so bad they had to rush a f2p model out the door.
Mirkwood wasnt much of an xpac. Small area with 5 levels tacked on. Content in the game was sparse after Moria. My personal opinion is that they let the game decline knowing, while denying, that LOTRO was going F2P quite sometime before it was announced.
*sighs* ok so it didn't meet your "standards" to be called an expansion, I tend to go with if they market it is one call it one and it adds new content that makes it an expansion. If it needs to meet your own personal definition maybe you should tell us exactly what you define as one especially before using the word in your post.
Moria was an expansion, BC in WOW was an expansion. Mirlwood was an area the size of Forachel with, as said, an extra 5 levles thrown in. You can defend it all you want to but Mirkwood was a joke. Turbine new damned well this game going F2P long before it was announced and just threw the players a bone in hopes of keeping them happy until they were set to announce it.
I'm speaking about solid concepts you are speaking about perception the only thing I'm defending is making sense when you post something, if something doesn't meet your personal standards then you should be including your definition and whenever you use the word "like" you are not defining something you are describing it (like Moria, like BC).
I never said Mirkwood was a GOOD expansion I'm just sick of people especially on these boards adding their own meaning to words that are pretty black and white cut and dried and when called on it only then to save face letting us in on the fact that said topic doesn't meet the standards they set it's the same as the term "MMORPG".
Regardless of how you slice it this argument is being based on a very low probability even in that Turbine hasn't come out with new content (even though Mirk was launched in Dec) and that somehow in that little time the game has been able to tank bad enough to now make it easier for them to launch the f2p hybrid model.
Do you happen to recall when Moria launched? If so you can then perhaps put it into perspective. People were leaving the game before MIrkwood launched. I would think some returned to play it and then left again. Its not like it had enough content to keep people interested for long especially knowing the time from Moria to Mirkwood and what Mirkwood consists of. My solid concept is that Mirkwood is something Turbine had patched in for nothing in the past and now they sell as an xpac.
Your "solid concept" can be explained using one word "opinion". Yes I remember when Moria came out I also remember a vast majority of the playerbase didn't like the mines themselves and many people skip over them so I can state an "opinion" that then it makes Moria and Mirkwood equal but I won't I'm just going with the thoght that this entire line of thought is too far fetched to be believed, that they haven't released any content in a really long time and allowed the game to tank on purpose so they can then make it free to play.
I'm going to stick with maybe the content schedule was changed because Mirkwood didn't bring in alot of new players and missed some old ones too (myself included) and since they got a 500% increase in players for DDO why not do the same with LOTRO and see what happens. Makes far more sense than the notion that somehow they just sat on there hands waiting for the game to tank.
Ok my opinion is just my opinion and yours is a solid concept.
WOW isnt great because it has 12 million players. WOW has 12 million players because its great.
Comments
This is my thought as well. Mirkwood was too little too late. My contention has been that instead of using time and resourses for steady expansions Turbine used these resources to rework DDO and let LOTRO fall into tedium and then, once again, spend time and money on a new model for it as well. Whether it was intentional or not they allowed LOTRO to become stale to the point of losing subs then decided to use the DDO model on it as well. Well, it is what it is and will continue without my involvement, to what end remains to be seen.
WOW isnt great because it has 12 million players. WOW has 12 million players because its great.
Didn't Mirkwood launch in Dec.? Which probably means from then they have been working on the f2p model which can explain the lack of new content released since then but at any rate I doubt that with an expansion released that soon things got so bad they had to rush a f2p model out the door.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Why? Probably to take advantage of certain type of gamer's mental problems as far as financial management goes.
They can scam a lot more money out of said people. Businesses like the f2p model due to that. Players like the f2p model.. because they get a free game to play, paid for by said unstable people.
The only problem with your theory though is if you play the free version of LOTRO you don't get access to any actual content just a character and the ability to walk around and attack mobs hence there is no free content. So that kind of invalidates your statement that the people who may possibly spend hundreds of dollars a month on the game are paying for those who chose not to to get content because if you don't pay you don't get the content anyway.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Mirkwood wasnt much of an xpac. Small area with 5 levels tacked on. Content in the game was sparse after Moria. My personal opinion is that they let the game decline knowing, while denying, that LOTRO was going F2P quite sometime before it was announced.
WOW isnt great because it has 12 million players. WOW has 12 million players because its great.
*sighs* ok so it didn't meet your "standards" to be called an expansion, I tend to go with if they market it is one call it one and it adds new content that makes it an expansion. If it needs to meet your own personal definition maybe you should tell us exactly what you define as one especially before using the word in your post.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Ooh boy. This argument again. Not disagreeing but I got so sick of hearing people make the OPs complaints about his game back in its beta stages.
Turbine is under the thumb of the owners of the Tolkein Estate. Even if Turbine had wanted to develop the game to where you could play an evil faction, the IPs owners would not have let them. We can argue all day long about coulda/woulda/shoulda, but the cold hard fact is that the IP's ownders just aren't going to change their minds. So that makes LOTRO a niche game. And honestly I feel that the game not being like Wow is its biggest charm.
I don't think they are making LOTRO FTP because the game is dying. Stagnating yes, but not dying. I feel they are doing it to try to bring in some fresh players because most of their player base are lifers who have already paid as much into the game as they are ever going to. Sadly I don't think its going to work. This kind of game just doesn't seem to appeal to the new generation of MMO players.
Also I feel they made a drastic mistake on how they did their beta for the new FTP hybrid model. They are giving testers enough store tokens to buy anything they desire. That will work great at finding flaws with the cash shop but it isn't going to address how new players who don't want to spend any money are going to view the game. It is already off most gamers lists because as I stated previously, it is a very different animal from games such as Wow.
They've had a free trial for quite some time. It doesn't look to have garnered much interest. Allowing people who steered clear of it to play a much emptier version of it for free isn't going to win many hearts and minds. And from the grumblings I've heard already it just might chase off the loyal fan base they did manage to capture.
If you can't dazzle 'em with brilliance, riddle 'em with bullets
Simply not true.
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"Anyone posting on this forum is not an average user, and there for any opinions about the game are going to be overly critical compared to an average users opinions." - Me
"No, your wrong.." - Random user #123
"Hello person posting on a site specifically for MMO's in a thread on a sub forum specifically for a particular game talking about meta features and making comparisons to other titles in the genre, and their meta features.
How are you?" -Me
Okay...go take your meds and read all this again, SLOWLY. The point he is making here is: Very little new content due to the devs working on the free model. Maybe the game was headed there some time BEFORE the announcement.
NOT what he thinks an expansion is. Stop trying to point fingers and name call. THEN you might bring some interesting and INTELLIGENT discussion to the table.
Moria was an expansion, BC in WOW was an expansion. Mirlwood was an area the size of Forachel with, as said, an extra 5 levles thrown in. You can defend it all you want to but Mirkwood was a joke. Turbine new damned well this game going F2P long before it was announced and just threw the players a bone in hopes of keeping them happy until they were set to announce it.
WOW isnt great because it has 12 million players. WOW has 12 million players because its great.
Good post and I too wonder exactly how this is going to work out for them, I don't think though it will have to great an effect on the already playing population as most of us are going to continue to sub thus getting what we are used to getting but I do wonder what the point of allowing people to make toons only to walk around and fight mobs will do. LOTRO wasn't and isn't built as modularly as DDO is and hopefully that doesn't change just for the f2p.
But one point made that alot of these anti f2p people should begin to look at before making proclamations is that there is no content in LOTRO f2p model just access to the game world hence no one is paying for anyone elses content atleast not to the point where it doesn't cost you something everyone will have to either sub or purchase something for the actual questing and such in game.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
I'm speaking about solid concepts you are speaking about perception the only thing I'm defending is making sense when you post something, if something doesn't meet your personal standards then you should be including your definition and whenever you use the word "like" you are not defining something you are describing it (like Moria, like BC).
I never said Mirkwood was a GOOD expansion I'm just sick of people especially on these boards adding their own meaning to words that are pretty black and white cut and dried and when called on it only then to save face letting us in on the fact that said topic doesn't meet the standards they set it's the same as the term "MMORPG".
Regardless of how you slice it this argument is being based on a very low probability even in that Turbine hasn't come out with new content (even though Mirk was launched in Dec) and that somehow in that little time the game has been able to tank bad enough to now make it easier for them to launch the f2p hybrid model.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Ummm what do you have to offer as proof that "content" is going to be locked away in cash shops? As I understand it I am not a lifer but do plan on continuing my month to month sub and as such I have access to all the same content I have access to the day before the f2p launch which for me is Mines of Moria since I haven't gotten Mirkwood yet.
In addition to having full access to every part of the game I had access to I also get free turbine points every month that the free to play people will have to pruchase then use to access the content I get for my regular monthly sub fee.
I think maybe you just haven't gotten over your whole Middle Earth Online thing.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
Do you happen to recall when Moria launched? If so you can then perhaps put it into perspective. People were leaving the game before MIrkwood launched. I would think some returned to play it and then left again. Its not like it had enough content to keep people interested for long especially knowing the time from Moria to Mirkwood and what Mirkwood consists of. My solid concept is that Mirkwood is something Turbine had patched in for nothing in the past and now they sell as an xpac.
WOW isnt great because it has 12 million players. WOW has 12 million players because its great.
Your "solid concept" can be explained using one word "opinion". Yes I remember when Moria came out I also remember a vast majority of the playerbase didn't like the mines themselves and many people skip over them so I can state an "opinion" that then it makes Moria and Mirkwood equal but I won't I'm just going with the thoght that this entire line of thought is too far fetched to be believed, that they haven't released any content in a really long time and allowed the game to tank on purpose so they can then make it free to play.
I'm going to stick with maybe the content schedule was changed because Mirkwood didn't bring in alot of new players and missed some old ones too (myself included) and since they got a 500% increase in players for DDO why not do the same with LOTRO and see what happens. Makes far more sense than the notion that somehow they just sat on there hands waiting for the game to tank.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
For an MMO to be an expansion it has to add in some new features. Moria added in LI's and Mirkwood added in Skirmishes.
So, Mirkwood technically IS an expansion, just not as large as Moria.
IMO Mirkwood was an attempt to deliver smaller expac's to players for a smaller chunk of cash in order to boost their income over time to help support future development. I think this approach failed based on player feedback on the expansion and limited uptake and this was a deciding factor for them to convert to the Hybrid model instead based on the success of DDO's conversion.
It also was not priced like other, larger expansions.
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"Anyone posting on this forum is not an average user, and there for any opinions about the game are going to be overly critical compared to an average users opinions." - Me
"No, your wrong.." - Random user #123
"Hello person posting on a site specifically for MMO's in a thread on a sub forum specifically for a particular game talking about meta features and making comparisons to other titles in the genre, and their meta features.
How are you?" -Me
In many cases, not priced at all.
Folks like me who were on the $30/3 months plan* got it for free. Lifers got it for free if they bought the adventurers pack.
In contrast, AoC people who wanted RotG free had to buy a 6 month sub at like, 80 bucks. Most other games don't offer these kinds of deals at all.
I could say I was disappointed in SoM, but then I'm disappointed that the game doesn't double in size every year. It's just that I also happen to be realistic.
*Any LotRO subscriber that is NOT on this plan, you must absolutely despise having money.
1) Pretty much EVERYTHING anyone posts here is an OPINION and should be assumed as such. Anyone with reading comprhension should get this. Unless some-one specificaly mentions that they are posting a "fact"....or calls out something which clearly is verifiable with hard data... i.e. "there are 150,233 current subscribers".... there is no need to jump all over them telling them they are only posting an "opinion". You are just being pedantic and derailing the conversation. We all understand that it's an opinion... that doesn't make it somehow unrelavent to the conversation. Give the guy posting the "Mirkwood was not a real expansion" a break.... I think we all understand that he was being FIGURATIVE not litteral... you are free to disagree with him...but I think we all get that he was basicaly saying "Mirkwood didn't have much content for something that was being labeled as an expansion". A sentiment which I actualy agree with.
2) We really DON'T KNOW how the F2P option will end up affecting the game or it's current subscribers (of which I happen to be one) in the LONG TERM. We know that as subscribers we aren't going to be charged to access any of the EXISTING CONTENT that we already have access to, nor the new area they are opening with F2P. We DON'T KNOW if we can expect the same sort of free content updates in future (i.e. Forochel) as we have in the past...or if they are going to nickle and diming us to death with them on top of our subscription fees. We do know what is currently in the RMT shop (in beta) and how many points our subscription buys us per month. I'm personaly troubled by some of the items for offer in the RMT shop and how they might effect game play....as are a number of people. We DON'T really know what things Turbine will put there in future, how much they'll cost, how they'll effect the game or how much real play-experience buying power our monthly points will translate into. This all is completely upto Turbine.
The existance of the RMT shop and the F2P model certainly open the POSSIBILTY of wrecking game play and the atmosphere in ways that didn't exist without them. It also opens the POSSIBILTY for Turbine to end up nickle and diming it's monthly subscribers and lifers...and ultimately make us end up paying more for fewer services then we had before. Ok it's fair to say "This hasn't happened yet, don't accuse them of something until it happens." However it's not fair to pretend that opening up the RMT shop and F2P options don't open up the opportunity to bring all sorts of woe to the game that didn't exist without them. Anyone that denies that is simply being wilfully ignorant or is on some-ones viral marketing payroll. It's all up to what Turbine DOES, not SAYS, from here on out. Any claims of "oh it's Turbine, trust them, look what their history"... are pretty much voided by the change in management and more important the change in OWNERSHIP. Lots of things happen when companies change hands. Furthermore, alot of us have been left with a pretty bad taste in our mouths of how they handled the whole F2P/Management change things so far...and where the resources to fund it might have been drawn from.
3) At the risk of being accused of being pedantic myself.... it is not the "Tolkien Estate" (a.k.a. Christopher Tolkien) who they licenesed the IP from but "Tolkien Enterprises" (a.k.a Saul Zaentz company) . The only reasons I mention this is because the two entities seem to have very different attitudes in terms of protectiveness over Tolkiens works and because it limits the portions of the IP that CAN be covered by the license. Zaentz owns the rights to Lord of the Rings and Hobbit, so those are in, but any of Tolkiens other Middle Earth based work is still held by Cristopher Tolkien...so not covered by the license Turbine has.
I don't think you get what he is trying to say. I don't think he is trying to say that they tried to astro-turf subs on purpose so they could turn around and justify going F2P due to declining subs. Although I have personaly witnessed executives within a company do EXACTLY such things in order to justify changes that they already wanted to make.... so it DOES happen more then you would expect. It generaly only happens when the executive in question only has limited power over the companies direction (i.e. they are some-one other then the CEO, or have to answer to a Board that are holding tight reign over them) or some-one they need to answer to and they need to manufacture something to push the decision the way that want it...or justification to cover themselves to stockholders/owners in case the decision turns out badly.
I think he is simply saying that Turbine decided a long time ago that it wanted to go F2P. Had limited resources to devote to the game and decided to short content development of resources so that they could funnel those resources to fund the F2P project. Tried to keep it quiet that they were doing that. Then when Mirkwood came along, rather then release it as a free content update for everyone, only released it for free to multi-month plans and lifers... so that they could A) Get some revenue from 1 month people who would buy it outright
Spur more people to switch to a multi-month plan. This would give them an influx of capital which they could use to further fund the F2P project.
In other words, they knew that they were shorting the immediate health of the game under the sub model in order to be able to fund the Vision(TM) of the F2P model. It's the sort of things companies do all the time. Nothing really sinister about it. Sometimes it works out brilliantly, other times it blows up in thier faces. Which way this ends up here remains to be seen.
Of course for folks like me who really hate the F2P model and were disappointed with the lack of resources Turbine seemed to be devoting to the game, it does end up leaving a bitter taste in the mouth.
Note, this is pure conjecture. It might be utter fantasy and the reality could be very different. It just dovetails well with the way things look from the outside.
Very true. I think I've gotten 3500? 4500? free points as a tester. Great for beating the snot out of the store but not very realistic unless they plan on offering a special 4500 pts for $9.95 deal.
The other thing they didn't test was us Premium players which are going to be a good chunk of the players coming back to check it out. Or they did think about it and decided they didn't want to put up with the flames that would come from it. I'd say out of the 3 different groups, we're the one's that will take it in the shorts the most (if you're under lvl 50).
Being in the middle of a zone (when you dropped), then coming back and finding out you're locked out of the rest of that zone will not be a pleasant experience for most.
SWG (pre-cu) - AoC (pre-f2p) - PotBS (pre-boarder) - DDO - LotRO (pre-f2p) - STO (pre-f2p) - GnH (beta tester) - SWTOR - Neverwinter
Can't happen. Whether free or subbed, you have to buy Moria to access the locked zones. If you bought Moria, you have those areas, and can come and go as you please.
Everywhere else, you are free to roam with a free account, you just can't access the quests and other content.
If you're in a non-free instance, you'll get kicked out just like you would, now.
Ummmm ..... who mentioned Moria? I did say the 'under lvl 50' crowd. Buying Moria only gets you Moria, it has nothing to do with North Downs, Lorelands, Trollshaws etc.....
Didn't think I needed to spell it out but, if you are had a quest in your log when you dropped (i.e. middle of a zone), then under the F2p / Premium rules you can finish that quest but will not be able to take any new quests in that zone (i.e. you're locked out of the rest of that zone) unless you buy the buy - thus opening up all the quests in the zone.
SWG (pre-cu) - AoC (pre-f2p) - PotBS (pre-boarder) - DDO - LotRO (pre-f2p) - STO (pre-f2p) - GnH (beta tester) - SWTOR - Neverwinter
I was subbed to LotRO for four months Nov 2009 to Feb 2010. During that time I paid $40.00.
For the first $10.00 I got the basic game at that point (Angmar and Moria) and one month of subscription time. Then when I went on the 3 month subscription for $30.00 I got the Mirkwood expansion.
So it looks like when LotRO goes f2p I will be able to play the first 65 levels of the game with full content indefinitely for my past $40.00 payment (with the only costs I can forsee really needing to pay for being unlocking storage or character space).
That just seems like an incredible deal.
Ok my opinion is just my opinion and yours is a solid concept.
WOW isnt great because it has 12 million players. WOW has 12 million players because its great.