Enough of the sword and sorcery stuff. Time to get more creative IMO. Wild Wild West, Sci-Fi, modern day, alternate reality, post apocalypse...anything but another sword swinging game.
Sort of want...
Changing the setting of an mmo is not creative, simply making WoW in cowboy boots is not innovating in anyway. But yes, there are too many games with fuggin elves in at the moment. More adult themed (no i don't mean Leisure Suit Larry Online), gritty, modern day, sandbox mmo's ftw.
I think a wild west MMO would be intresting. Fight over grasing land etc.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Enough of the sword and sorcery stuff. Time to get more creative IMO. Wild Wild West, Sci-Fi, modern day, alternate reality, post apocalypse...anything but another sword swinging game.
Sort of want...
Changing the setting of an mmo is not creative, simply making WoW in cowboy boots is not innovating in anyway. But yes, there are too many games with fuggin elves in at the moment. More adult themed (no i don't mean Leisure Suit Larry Online), gritty, modern day, sandbox mmo's ftw.
I think a wild west MMO would be intresting. Fight over grasing land etc.
Indeed, depending on the actual game mechanics a wild west mmo would be very cool i'm sure. Plus you could save alot on the art department and base it off Sergio Leone westerns which have a palette consisting of only two colours; brown and yellowish brown
"Come and have a look at what you could have won."
Take a look at the general lack of success in non-fantasy RPG MMOs and you might have a clue why you don't see more of them.
Anarchy Online - widely regarded as one of the worst launches in MMO history, limped along for years with under 30k subs, barely upticked after adding a free to play option
WW2OL - another contender for the "worst launch of all time" award, limps along with few subscribers and little dev work
Auto Assault - closed
Tabula Rasa - closed
SWG - "iconic" IP that never really got past 250k subs and then had the NGE debacle
EVE - long life span, but a very niche game and not a runaway success subscription-wise
Jumpgate - near flop
Fallen Earth - solid game that none the less seems to be seriously struggling; has laid off most devs, done multiple "please come back" promos and massively slashed sub fees.
Various Superhero/comic games - the only success stories of the lot and none of those wildly so
There may be others I missed, but not many and none that were successful.
I'm leaving all the FPS/RTS thingies out of it of course.
I'm not saying it is impossible or even that it shouldn't be done; but given that most non-fantasy MMORPGs have been flops and none have really done even as well as say EQ or DAoC it is easy to see why there aren't more being made. I expect the new "wave" of vampire, cybergoth and generally teen-angst driven genre games might change that though.
Originally posted by Ihmotepp Originally posted by Normike The hallmark of an Elder Scrolls game is that leveling is skill based. If you swing your sword alot you will become a warrior, if you electrocute your enemies with lightning from your fingers alot then you will become a better wizard. That's what people like about Elder Scrolls. But skill based levelling isn't popular in the top MMOs.
This actually is what I did NOT like about Elder Scrolls. I liked the world, not the skill system. I find use it to improve it skill systems to be very unnatural and contrived. I do this in those systems all the time, and I bet you do to. I have developed a skill, so it does good damage, like say sword swinging. But I want some range damage too, like a ranged spell. So, what do I do when I encounter a mob? I COULD easily kill it with my sword, which would be the logical in character thing to do. BUT, to raise my spell skill, I'll hit it over and over with a weak spell to raise my spell skill. Why in the world would my character do that? Because of the game system, and that's the only way to raise the skill. Kinda breaks the immersion, that I use my weaker skill instead of my most powerful, just to raise skills. I prefer getting skill points, and spending them on skills I want.
You are forgetting or ignoring the fact that this is how you would get better at something in the real world. Therefore, in character, if your character wanted to get better at something, they would have to do it until they got good at it. You cannot shoot a bow over and over and over for however long and suddenly become very good at spellcasting. That does not make any sense.
This type of progression system is the ONLY one that makes good logical sense (not to deny that a level based kill for exp system isn't fun sometimes). You do something, you get better at it. That is how skills work. That is the only way skills work. Try getting good at something by doing something else, and see how that works out for you.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it." Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
Morrorwind and Oblivion were deeply flawed in some parts, particularly in regards to extremely clunky combat, class arrangement and character progression. Most of these flaws are overlooked, if not completely irrelevant, in a single player game, but would be glaringly huge problems in an MMO. On top of which are the number of elements that just simply won't work in a MP game - Oblivion's engine is too clunky for drawing lots of models in a single location, enemies can't level scale in the open world, environmental decorations are too exposed and quite simply the game lacks any single time consuming activity besides exploration. Something that runs out of steam quickly in an MMO where there are hundreds of thousands of explores all operating simultaneously, charting every inch of the terrain.
Of course the basic assumption is a development studio would obviously be able to repair these types of loopholes before moving the game forward into a new genre, but it's also not a gimmie. Since it's a hypothetical question I can say Nay based on my current experience. Bathesda has yet to show me they know how an MMO is made or know how to construct its mechanics from scratch.
I'm not saying they can't, or even that I don't have some faith they can, just simply that there isn't any evidence, based on their current RPG titles, that they can make a worthwhile MMO yet. But either way, it's just a guess. Only time will tell.
The morning sun has vanquished the horrible night.
Spot on. TES universe far exceeds any other fantasy media output since Tolkien. As I said in the OP the lore is vast and provides a well established platform for an MMO to sprout out of. When I was playing Morrowind I often thought how great it would be to actually play a bandit and hide around bridges extorting money of travelers, or leading a charge up through the blight to banish Dagoth Ur…Well take it one step further and let player pick sides in an evolving story. Imagine if the House of Dagoth was an actual playable faction! Big PvP potential and lots of fun.
With a TES MMO release they’d have to provide a huge map for play. All factions, well that leads to big wars and an evolving story based on in game actions. Well that’s what I would like to see of a TES MMO anyway.
And come on lets face it TES elves are not your standard legolas types now.
I agree. Does Bethesda have the ability to pull something like this off? Might they just do it based on the potential for major success? Well It’s a disturbing thought to be honest. I’d want to see something spectacular from them as my expectations would be very high if they went ahead and like you said there would be a lot of restructuring to perform. If they can’t commit themselves then I’d still be happy with an offline ES V.
Enough of the sword and sorcery stuff. Time to get more creative IMO. Wild Wild West, Sci-Fi, modern day, alternate reality, post apocalypse...anything but another sword swinging game.
I'm in for a Wild, Wild, West setting. (The TV show. Not the crapping movie!) Western style with "high tech" western period gadgets.
An Oblivion MMO would be great. Even on a small scale (a thousand or so per server) would be great. There is a great world, great backstory, and better yet, nice fleshed out NPC's. ]
I'll be the first to admit I was not a huge fan of the levelling system and the skill system progression. And on top of that, the character models came close to ruining it for me.
All that aside, the game itself is great. There would be a lot of nuances they have to fix (theft, economy, etc.), and also they would need to add more cooperative dungeons and quests. But if they did, it would be one for the ages.
Yes, we need another fantasy MMO. What we don't need is another fantasy setting like the Elder Scrolls.
It is just sad that whenever we hear the term "fantasy", the first thing that comes to mind are the usual orcs and elves. Fantasy used to mean imagination. Unfortunately RPG developers, especially western RPG developers, have sucked all imagination out of the fantasy genre with their tolkien and dungeons and dragons knock offs.
I agree. However, when someone tries to make a game setting that is not the standard elves- and orcs-type, it usually does poorly. For example: the Asheron's Call games, Ryzom, Chronicles of Spellborn - these have non-standard settings. AC2 is dead, Ryzom died and was resurrected with a small playerbase, and Spellborn is about to be closed. Look at Atriarch - a very non-standard setting, but the game has never even made it to beta
AC1 is as fantasy as you can get and it's been going for 10 years.
Take a look at the general lack of success in non-fantasy RPG MMOs and you might have a clue why you don't see more of them.
Anarchy Online - widely regarded as one of the worst launches in MMO history, limped along for years with under 30k subs, barely upticked after adding a free to play option
WW2OL - another contender for the "worst launch of all time" award, limps along with few subscribers and little dev work
Auto Assault - closed
Tabula Rasa - closed
SWG - "iconic" IP that never really got past 250k subs and then had the NGE debacle
EVE - long life span, but a very niche game and not a runaway success subscription-wise
Jumpgate - near flop
Fallen Earth - solid game that none the less seems to be seriously struggling; has laid off most devs, done multiple "please come back" promos and massively slashed sub fees.
Various Superhero/comic games - the only success stories of the lot and none of those wildly so
But few fantasy MMOs went that well either. Eve is still one of the largest games around. And to be fair did most of the games on your list suck and where horrible bug ridden. Eve is a lot larger than CoH ever been.
With a good setting made by a competent developer (CCP is the only one you mention that could be called competent) you can make a non fantasy MMO huge.
CCPs World of darkness online and the Zombie MMO Jeff Strain is working (for X-Box) on both have good potential of being hits. TOR will be large, few people doubt that (large = 1 million subs).
But most MMOs fails, particularly the crappy ones and that is the only thing you proved. There are many potential genres for MMOs like historical, western, horror and so on but no one made a fun game like that yet, if someone will there will be players too.
I can number many fantasy MMOs that went down the crapper too and only a handful successes.
Im in danger of redirecting my own thread by saying this but anything outside of fantasy or sci fi is going to be niche. Now although i dont have a problem with that, how many game developers are looking to go for the small scale MMO? I'd like to see a WW1 based MMO, or a pirates circa 1700 MMO. Would it popular, no way!
Elder Scrolls has always been a pillar of the fantasy game world, beyond the tripe the east has coughed up from their consumption ridden lungs. If any fantasy back ground had a chance at providing an immersive experience it would be TES.
but if this comes out I'll be first to try and get into beta and get into the game. I just don't see it working well in the mmo genre, and this has less to do with tes and more to do with mmo's. Some have already given their reasons for why tes is great and how that won't fit into a mmo genre so I'll give my big reason.
MODS
Imho the greatest thing about oblivion was the number of mods that could make the game suite you perfectly. As a lover of both mysticism and alchemy the mods I have really make these skills something great. Alchemy mods take you from 4 tools to 6, change the interface to allow better mass production and to search for specific effects under the ingredients you own, they also add hundreds of new and old (from the other games) ingredients and other nice tricks to make alchemy a real proffesion you can rely on rather than just a mini proffession. Making a single uber poision from over 20 ingredients specificaly designed to take out a single enemy is rather fun for me. The thought of going back to normal default alchemy doesn't sound that fun at all.
Now I would absolutely love bethesda if they found a way to implement at least some modding into an mmo but looking at the rest of the mmo industry I just don't see it happening.
Some other things that may not go to well in the translation
Books
Player housing
Theifing (actual theif going around random (player?) houses and stealing stuff)
MINOR SPOILER WARNING
Ok currently I'm reading through the book, and I've noticed a few things have changed about the world of tes. the books set 40 years after and a few things have happened such as SPOILER empire losing control of argonia and a few other territories, vivec (the city) and large parts of morrowind being destroyed END SPOILER. If I recall correctly their is another book in the works, which means these books could be a bridge to take us from oblivion to mmo but I think the world will be a bit different than what we knew.
END SPOILER
If you havn't already get the books, their pretty cheap and you can download them from amazon for kindle straight to your pc.
but if this comes out I'll be first to try and get into beta and get into the game. I just don't see it working well in the mmo genre, and this has less to do with tes and more to do with mmo's. Some have already given their reasons for why tes is great and how that won't fit into a mmo genre so I'll give my big reason.
MODS
Imho the greatest thing about oblivion was the number of mods that could make the game suite you perfectly. As a lover of both mysticism and alchemy the mods I have really make these skills something great. Alchemy mods take you from 4 tools to 6, change the interface to allow better mass production and to search for specific effects under the ingredients you own, they also add hundreds of new and old (from the other games) ingredients and other nice tricks to make alchemy a real proffesion you can rely on rather than just a mini proffession. Making a single uber poision from over 20 ingredients specificaly designed to take out a single enemy is rather fun for me. The thought of going back to normal default alchemy doesn't sound that fun at all.
Now I would absolutely love bethesda if they found a way to implement at least some modding into an mmo but looking at the rest of the mmo industry I just don't see it happening.
Some other things that may not go to well in the translation
Books
Player housing
Theifing (actual theif going around random (player?) houses and stealing stuff)
MINOR SPOILER WARNING
Ok currently I'm reading through the book, and I've noticed a few things have changed about the world of tes. the books set 40 years after and a few things have happened such as SPOILER empire losing control of argonia and a few other territories, vivec (the city) and large parts of morrowind being destroyed END SPOILER. If I recall correctly their is another book in the works, which means these books could be a bridge to take us from oblivion to mmo but I think the world will be a bit different than what we knew.
END SPOILER
If you havn't already get the books, their pretty cheap and you can download them from amazon for kindle straight to your pc.
Been looking for a good read for a while now. And i totally forgot about the TES novels. Soon as I get back home i'll have them on route to me. Oh and come on, MMO thieving! That would be Khajiit heaven! Imagine the fun of actaully thieving from a real player instead of an AI! Bumping in to someone in a crowd and pick pocketing them! Of course the game needs counter measures for this but i can't think of any better way to enhance the TES thief experience than to be able to steal off of real players.
NO idea whether they could make a good MMO. Obviously, I love Fallout 3 and I found Oblivion to be pretty big and innovative. But I don't take that as any guarantee that they can make a good MMO.
NO idea whether they could make a good MMO. Obviously, I love Fallout 3 and I found Oblivion to be pretty big and innovative. But I don't take that as any guarantee that they can make a good MMO.
I agree. That they can make immersive single player worlds does not mean they can replicate that success in the MMO market where so many have failed. I hold hope that if it were to happen it would be done with the attention they pay their other games.
Of course lets not get carried away here. Everything we are talking about is based on pure rumor. I'd be just as happy with a single player follow up to oblivion.
but if this comes out I'll be first to try and get into beta and get into the game. I just don't see it working well in the mmo genre, and this has less to do with tes and more to do with mmo's. Some have already given their reasons for why tes is great and how that won't fit into a mmo genre so I'll give my big reason.
MODS
Imho the greatest thing about oblivion was the number of mods that could make the game suite you perfectly. As a lover of both mysticism and alchemy the mods I have really make these skills something great. Alchemy mods take you from 4 tools to 6, change the interface to allow better mass production and to search for specific effects under the ingredients you own, they also add hundreds of new and old (from the other games) ingredients and other nice tricks to make alchemy a real proffesion you can rely on rather than just a mini proffession. Making a single uber poision from over 20 ingredients specificaly designed to take out a single enemy is rather fun for me. The thought of going back to normal default alchemy doesn't sound that fun at all.
Now I would absolutely love bethesda if they found a way to implement at least some modding into an mmo but looking at the rest of the mmo industry I just don't see it happening.
Some other things that may not go to well in the translation
Books
Player housing
Theifing (actual theif going around random (player?) houses and stealing stuff)
MINOR SPOILER WARNING
Ok currently I'm reading through the book, and I've noticed a few things have changed about the world of tes. the books set 40 years after and a few things have happened such as SPOILER empire losing control of argonia and a few other territories, vivec (the city) and large parts of morrowind being destroyed END SPOILER. If I recall correctly their is another book in the works, which means these books could be a bridge to take us from oblivion to mmo but I think the world will be a bit different than what we knew.
END SPOILER
If you havn't already get the books, their pretty cheap and you can download them from amazon for kindle straight to your pc.
Wow I didn't know they had TES novels. [ Orders them now ]
I like having the option of slaughtering entire cities just because I felt like it. There is no need to turn it into a game full of rules, where freedom becomes secondary. Only way I see this working is if Bethesda isn't blinded by delusions of grandeur, I would hate to see them turn TES into a generic fantasy MMO, stick to the freedom and be satisfied with their current fanbase. If they can do that, I'd play it.
i really doubt it will be a mmo because i read an interview at eurogamer a week ( or less ) ago and they said that the new game will be like your playing the game on a new console (modified fallout 3 engine or something ) so if you think about it logicaly it will be a SP game with a probable implementation of co op.... actually very probable XD
With a good setting made by a competent developer (CCP is the only one you mention that could be called competent) you can make a non fantasy MMO huge.
CCPs World of darkness online and the Zombie MMO Jeff Strain is working (for X-Box) on both have good potential of being hits. TOR will be large, few people doubt that (large = 1 million subs).
I'm not trying to "prove" anything here; I'm just pointing out that before an MMO studio does anything else it has to sell investors on the concept and that it is a lot easier to "go traditional" where you at least do have a FEW successes to point to and say "we're going to do that". Of course they can still flop, but it is an easier pitch than "we're going to make this game unlike anything out there, so give us money".
I think if Fallen Earth manages to stagger out of its present malaise (since it is basically a solid game) and some of the new World of Darkness/Goth Near-future/Secret World type games manage to not suck (or at least not suck as badly as the last round of MMORPGs do) then you will see more of non-traditional genre games.
I don't count SWTOR in there because I believe that it is not really a traditional MMORPG. That is also the other issue here, I'm not sure games outside the fantasy genre are going to bear any real resemblence to the "classic RPG" model at all; it is far too tempting to make an MMOFPS, MSORPG, MMORTS or MMO-Flight Sim (or whatever) when you move away from the fantasy model. I also think the genre as a whole is moving away from massive, shared and persistent worlds to basically single player stand alone games that incorporate chat hubs and instanced "session" group play.
I would be excited about this type of game from Bethesda. I am always looking to play as many MMOs as possible. I like the developer because I have enjoyed the Fallout games and Oblivion thus far. I believe that getting to play an elder scrolls-based MMO would be an interesting thing to try out.
Nay. Elder scrolls is one the best franchises that have been made. I don't want a bunch of people mucking it up. Not everything has to be turned into an MMo.
QFT. Elder Scrolls have been and should always be IMO a singlerplayer experience. That is what Bethesda is great at and we need those people to give us great singleplayer RPG's. In The Elder Scrolls you had the chance to be not only a hero but THE hero. And you could be the villain if you wanted to. In an mmo you one hero among thousands of other heroes and it kind of removes one of the core aspects of The Elder Scrolls.
Even if they do make an Elder Scrolls MMO it could never be Elder Scrolls because some aspects just doesn't fit it. How many MMO's allows you to kill every single NPC in the game without them respawning. How many mmo's have merchants with limited amounts of money. How many mmo's have a main storyline that you could ignore if you wanted to and do something completely else. What about ressurection? I have never come across anything like that in my Elder Scrolls experience which means they would have reinvent the lore to fit the needs of a modern mmo.
Comments
I think a wild west MMO would be intresting. Fight over grasing land etc.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
Indeed, depending on the actual game mechanics a wild west mmo would be very cool i'm sure. Plus you could save alot on the art department and base it off Sergio Leone westerns which have a palette consisting of only two colours; brown and yellowish brown
"Come and have a look at what you could have won."
Take a look at the general lack of success in non-fantasy RPG MMOs and you might have a clue why you don't see more of them.
Anarchy Online - widely regarded as one of the worst launches in MMO history, limped along for years with under 30k subs, barely upticked after adding a free to play option
WW2OL - another contender for the "worst launch of all time" award, limps along with few subscribers and little dev work
Auto Assault - closed
Tabula Rasa - closed
SWG - "iconic" IP that never really got past 250k subs and then had the NGE debacle
EVE - long life span, but a very niche game and not a runaway success subscription-wise
Jumpgate - near flop
Fallen Earth - solid game that none the less seems to be seriously struggling; has laid off most devs, done multiple "please come back" promos and massively slashed sub fees.
Various Superhero/comic games - the only success stories of the lot and none of those wildly so
There may be others I missed, but not many and none that were successful.
I'm leaving all the FPS/RTS thingies out of it of course.
I'm not saying it is impossible or even that it shouldn't be done; but given that most non-fantasy MMORPGs have been flops and none have really done even as well as say EQ or DAoC it is easy to see why there aren't more being made. I expect the new "wave" of vampire, cybergoth and generally teen-angst driven genre games might change that though.
This actually is what I did NOT like about Elder Scrolls. I liked the world, not the skill system.
I find use it to improve it skill systems to be very unnatural and contrived.
I do this in those systems all the time, and I bet you do to.
I have developed a skill, so it does good damage, like say sword swinging.
But I want some range damage too, like a ranged spell.
So, what do I do when I encounter a mob?
I COULD easily kill it with my sword, which would be the logical in character thing to do.
BUT, to raise my spell skill, I'll hit it over and over with a weak spell to raise my spell skill.
Why in the world would my character do that? Because of the game system, and that's the only way to raise the skill. Kinda breaks the immersion, that I use my weaker skill instead of my most powerful, just to raise skills.
I prefer getting skill points, and spending them on skills I want.
You are forgetting or ignoring the fact that this is how you would get better at something in the real world. Therefore, in character, if your character wanted to get better at something, they would have to do it until they got good at it. You cannot shoot a bow over and over and over for however long and suddenly become very good at spellcasting. That does not make any sense.
This type of progression system is the ONLY one that makes good logical sense (not to deny that a level based kill for exp system isn't fun sometimes). You do something, you get better at it. That is how skills work. That is the only way skills work. Try getting good at something by doing something else, and see how that works out for you.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it." Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
WTF? No subscription fee?
Morrorwind and Oblivion were deeply flawed in some parts, particularly in regards to extremely clunky combat, class arrangement and character progression. Most of these flaws are overlooked, if not completely irrelevant, in a single player game, but would be glaringly huge problems in an MMO. On top of which are the number of elements that just simply won't work in a MP game - Oblivion's engine is too clunky for drawing lots of models in a single location, enemies can't level scale in the open world, environmental decorations are too exposed and quite simply the game lacks any single time consuming activity besides exploration. Something that runs out of steam quickly in an MMO where there are hundreds of thousands of explores all operating simultaneously, charting every inch of the terrain.
Of course the basic assumption is a development studio would obviously be able to repair these types of loopholes before moving the game forward into a new genre, but it's also not a gimmie. Since it's a hypothetical question I can say Nay based on my current experience. Bathesda has yet to show me they know how an MMO is made or know how to construct its mechanics from scratch.
I'm not saying they can't, or even that I don't have some faith they can, just simply that there isn't any evidence, based on their current RPG titles, that they can make a worthwhile MMO yet. But either way, it's just a guess. Only time will tell.
The morning sun has vanquished the horrible night.
The lawsuit was about the rights to Fallout mmo ip which interplay is working on Project V13
i would give it a try
@scottns
Yes, yes we do because we need a good one for a change. Quality not quantity is the rule here.
@bloodaxes
Totally agree, elderscrolls brought real strategy to the RPG genre and it can do it again with the MMO
@Sovrath/ 3DG.E
A part of me sympathizes with your post. I hold in me the trepidation that a flop might bring to the elder scrolls Stella reputation.
@Gameloading
Spot on. TES universe far exceeds any other fantasy media output since Tolkien. As I said in the OP the lore is vast and provides a well established platform for an MMO to sprout out of. When I was playing Morrowind I often thought how great it would be to actually play a bandit and hide around bridges extorting money of travelers, or leading a charge up through the blight to banish Dagoth Ur…Well take it one step further and let player pick sides in an evolving story. Imagine if the House of Dagoth was an actual playable faction! Big PvP potential and lots of fun.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
With a TES MMO release they’d have to provide a huge map for play. All factions, well that leads to big wars and an evolving story based on in game actions. Well that’s what I would like to see of a TES MMO anyway.
And come on lets face it TES elves are not your standard legolas types now.
@Zarcob
I agree. Does Bethesda have the ability to pull something like this off? Might they just do it based on the potential for major success? Well It’s a disturbing thought to be honest. I’d want to see something spectacular from them as my expectations would be very high if they went ahead and like you said there would be a lot of restructuring to perform. If they can’t commit themselves then I’d still be happy with an offline ES V.
@Asheram
So they where struggling with a fallout mmo. What was the resolution? Or is it still disputed.
I'm in for a Wild, Wild, West setting. (The TV show. Not the crapping movie!) Western style with "high tech" western period gadgets.
An Oblivion MMO would be great. Even on a small scale (a thousand or so per server) would be great. There is a great world, great backstory, and better yet, nice fleshed out NPC's. ]
I'll be the first to admit I was not a huge fan of the levelling system and the skill system progression. And on top of that, the character models came close to ruining it for me.
All that aside, the game itself is great. There would be a lot of nuances they have to fix (theft, economy, etc.), and also they would need to add more cooperative dungeons and quests. But if they did, it would be one for the ages.
Yes to a elderscrolls mmo made by cryptic!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! i also believe that camel joe is secretly santa clause....
AC1 is as fantasy as you can get and it's been going for 10 years.
But few fantasy MMOs went that well either. Eve is still one of the largest games around. And to be fair did most of the games on your list suck and where horrible bug ridden. Eve is a lot larger than CoH ever been.
With a good setting made by a competent developer (CCP is the only one you mention that could be called competent) you can make a non fantasy MMO huge.
CCPs World of darkness online and the Zombie MMO Jeff Strain is working (for X-Box) on both have good potential of being hits. TOR will be large, few people doubt that (large = 1 million subs).
But most MMOs fails, particularly the crappy ones and that is the only thing you proved. There are many potential genres for MMOs like historical, western, horror and so on but no one made a fun game like that yet, if someone will there will be players too.
I can number many fantasy MMOs that went down the crapper too and only a handful successes.
Im in danger of redirecting my own thread by saying this but anything outside of fantasy or sci fi is going to be niche. Now although i dont have a problem with that, how many game developers are looking to go for the small scale MMO? I'd like to see a WW1 based MMO, or a pirates circa 1700 MMO. Would it popular, no way!
Elder Scrolls has always been a pillar of the fantasy game world, beyond the tripe the east has coughed up from their consumption ridden lungs. If any fantasy back ground had a chance at providing an immersive experience it would be TES.
I'd say nay
but if this comes out I'll be first to try and get into beta and get into the game. I just don't see it working well in the mmo genre, and this has less to do with tes and more to do with mmo's. Some have already given their reasons for why tes is great and how that won't fit into a mmo genre so I'll give my big reason.
MODS
Imho the greatest thing about oblivion was the number of mods that could make the game suite you perfectly. As a lover of both mysticism and alchemy the mods I have really make these skills something great. Alchemy mods take you from 4 tools to 6, change the interface to allow better mass production and to search for specific effects under the ingredients you own, they also add hundreds of new and old (from the other games) ingredients and other nice tricks to make alchemy a real proffesion you can rely on rather than just a mini proffession. Making a single uber poision from over 20 ingredients specificaly designed to take out a single enemy is rather fun for me. The thought of going back to normal default alchemy doesn't sound that fun at all.
Now I would absolutely love bethesda if they found a way to implement at least some modding into an mmo but looking at the rest of the mmo industry I just don't see it happening.
Some other things that may not go to well in the translation
Books
Player housing
Theifing (actual theif going around random (player?) houses and stealing stuff)
MINOR SPOILER WARNING
Ok currently I'm reading through the book, and I've noticed a few things have changed about the world of tes. the books set 40 years after and a few things have happened such as SPOILER empire losing control of argonia and a few other territories, vivec (the city) and large parts of morrowind being destroyed END SPOILER. If I recall correctly their is another book in the works, which means these books could be a bridge to take us from oblivion to mmo but I think the world will be a bit different than what we knew.
END SPOILER
If you havn't already get the books, their pretty cheap and you can download them from amazon for kindle straight to your pc.
Into the breach meatbags
Been looking for a good read for a while now. And i totally forgot about the TES novels. Soon as I get back home i'll have them on route to me. Oh and come on, MMO thieving! That would be Khajiit heaven! Imagine the fun of actaully thieving from a real player instead of an AI! Bumping in to someone in a crowd and pick pocketing them! Of course the game needs counter measures for this but i can't think of any better way to enhance the TES thief experience than to be able to steal off of real players.
NO idea whether they could make a good MMO. Obviously, I love Fallout 3 and I found Oblivion to be pretty big and innovative. But I don't take that as any guarantee that they can make a good MMO.
I agree. That they can make immersive single player worlds does not mean they can replicate that success in the MMO market where so many have failed. I hold hope that if it were to happen it would be done with the attention they pay their other games.
Of course lets not get carried away here. Everything we are talking about is based on pure rumor. I'd be just as happy with a single player follow up to oblivion.
Wow I didn't know they had TES novels. [ Orders them now ]
No
I like having the option of slaughtering entire cities just because I felt like it. There is no need to turn it into a game full of rules, where freedom becomes secondary. Only way I see this working is if Bethesda isn't blinded by delusions of grandeur, I would hate to see them turn TES into a generic fantasy MMO, stick to the freedom and be satisfied with their current fanbase. If they can do that, I'd play it.
i really doubt it will be a mmo because i read an interview at eurogamer a week ( or less ) ago and they said that the new game will be like your playing the game on a new console (modified fallout 3 engine or something ) so if you think about it logicaly it will be a SP game with a probable implementation of co op.... actually very probable XD
I'm not trying to "prove" anything here; I'm just pointing out that before an MMO studio does anything else it has to sell investors on the concept and that it is a lot easier to "go traditional" where you at least do have a FEW successes to point to and say "we're going to do that". Of course they can still flop, but it is an easier pitch than "we're going to make this game unlike anything out there, so give us money".
I think if Fallen Earth manages to stagger out of its present malaise (since it is basically a solid game) and some of the new World of Darkness/Goth Near-future/Secret World type games manage to not suck (or at least not suck as badly as the last round of MMORPGs do) then you will see more of non-traditional genre games.
I don't count SWTOR in there because I believe that it is not really a traditional MMORPG. That is also the other issue here, I'm not sure games outside the fantasy genre are going to bear any real resemblence to the "classic RPG" model at all; it is far too tempting to make an MMOFPS, MSORPG, MMORTS or MMO-Flight Sim (or whatever) when you move away from the fantasy model. I also think the genre as a whole is moving away from massive, shared and persistent worlds to basically single player stand alone games that incorporate chat hubs and instanced "session" group play.
I would be excited about this type of game from Bethesda. I am always looking to play as many MMOs as possible. I like the developer because I have enjoyed the Fallout games and Oblivion thus far. I believe that getting to play an elder scrolls-based MMO would be an interesting thing to try out.
www.ryzom.com
QFT. Elder Scrolls have been and should always be IMO a singlerplayer experience. That is what Bethesda is great at and we need those people to give us great singleplayer RPG's. In The Elder Scrolls you had the chance to be not only a hero but THE hero. And you could be the villain if you wanted to. In an mmo you one hero among thousands of other heroes and it kind of removes one of the core aspects of The Elder Scrolls.
Even if they do make an Elder Scrolls MMO it could never be Elder Scrolls because some aspects just doesn't fit it. How many MMO's allows you to kill every single NPC in the game without them respawning. How many mmo's have merchants with limited amounts of money. How many mmo's have a main storyline that you could ignore if you wanted to and do something completely else. What about ressurection? I have never come across anything like that in my Elder Scrolls experience which means they would have reinvent the lore to fit the needs of a modern mmo.
Nay I say.
I'd play it: IF they'd follow the franchise's strong points and really truly carefully considered the nuances of the MMO experience.
That isn't easy.
I kill other players because they're smarter than AI, sometimes.