I doubt this game will give WoW any serious competition. The extremely poor execution of Open Beta is not a good sign of proper management of the game. I'm afraid i have nothing to comment on the game itself since after the delay they have additionally postponed keys. The character model graphics look good as do the emotes although the customization of your toon is extremely limited if you consider what is possible in a MMO today. MMOs like APB have very detailed customizations and I find it strange that MMOs are so reluctant to have people custom make a toon to their liking. Music score is good as are the cut scenes that I have viewed. Based off the little information I've seen it appears to be an average MMO based off a famous name brand. Sort of like Pepsi or Coke coming out with a new drink but it is not as good as the original. Likely, Guild Wars 2 will be the game that comes close to competing with WoW especially considering that it won't have a subscription fee.
Your seriously going to say this game cann't compete with WoW because of its Beta performance?? You were around for WoW Beta I take it then too? I was, and I was for the live launch of WoW, and it sucked back then. When will people stop comparing Betas to 5 year old upgraded games.
Because the industry has changed since WoW was released. FFXIV is competeing with WoW, not the other way around. FFXIV, or any game company, needs to offer the polish that WoW has, or else won't stand a chance at becoming big the way everyone wants it to. There really hasn't been one game post-WoW era that has done superbly well, and that's because when you go from WoW to anything, you instantly notice a lack of polish.
WOW had 6 years to polish that gameplay. What the hell are you talking about? its unfair to compare a game in open beta with WOW.
No, it's really not in terms of actual gameplay. Sure, new games won't have near as much content, that's a given. But when it comes down to number of bugs, user friendliness, and fun factor, the bar has been raised. People will not accept a sub-par game at release anymore that slowly gets better with patches, and it's obvious by triple-A titles crashing and burning like a F2P Korean MMO. People join the new MMO and instantly compare it to WoW's polish and fun, and if it doesn't weigh in similar, they go back.
I hardly doubt that FF mmos attracts WOW players. its a very differernt kind of MMO and has nothing in common with WOW. Why would anyone who has been playing WOW for years would leaveto play Final Fantasy 14? when it appeals too very different kind of gamers?
Sure it would. A triple-A company like SquareEnix releasing a game is going to be catching attention whether it was a MMO or not. I know that many WoW players have also played FF, so why wouldn't it appeal to them? This analogy also applies to any game that has released. Why play Final Fantasy if it has a million bugs on release (not saying it will or won't) versus another MMO that has ironed these problems out and is fully functional? Those types of comparisons actually happen, and not in favor of FFXIV.
Maybe such comparisons happen but logical minds know that game is in open beta an WOW is out for 6 years. Any smart person would know its just stupid to make comparison. And those who want to use WOW as a yard stick to measure every new MMO release its better for all MMOS that such people continue to play WOW. FF has a great fan following and it doesn't need WOW's million players to be a success. FF is a very different kind of gameplay anyways, WOW players wont last here for long because of lack of easy mode.
No, I can't actually agree with all of you saying the bar has been raised. It hasn't, the expectations of the players has raised, but the development process has not. And look at the result of this shall we? Look at every launch that has come out since the players felt they knew best, and that the 'bar has been raised', every launch has been dictated by the fickle and the opinionated not the game itself. Just look at FFXIV here, they decided not to put in jump, half the people have been up in arms for months now. Why? because we have to have jump or the game sucks? No, because the players think they know what the 'new standards' are. The UI isn't the same as the supposed 'industry standard' either, god forbid they don't make it mandatory that thier game has button 1+2 mouse movement for everyone. (sorry, I have been playing online games since before the internet was born, and I still have yet to play a game using mouse for movement - its not a damn requirement, get over it). FFXIV is different than WoW, stop trying to make it the same, really. WoW is NOT the industry standard, WoW is WoW thats all it is. (and no I dont care if 11 million people play it, just because everyone does something doesn't mean its the right thing to do). Seriously sheep....bahhh...sheep!
If the bugs in the game which hasn't even gone live yet bother you, don't play it. Do you really think your not going to be bothered by them if say a week goes by? a month? a year? No...if it already bothers you it will only bother you more as time goes by. Stop stressing on it and move along. This game will succeed, because it already has a fan base willing to pay to play it. Not everyone is part of that base, nor do they need to be for it to be a success. But the fact remains, if it went live today, even with the bugs it still has, people will be paying to play it and it will go on without those that dont like it.
(DISCLAIMER - The use of the word YOU in the above post is not directed at any one person in particular, but towards those who fall into the category itself - there is no personal attack here, neither intentional nor implied.)
Based on my opinion, It definitely will not give WoW a run for it's money at all. This game is just Final Fantasy XI ver. 2.0
People who played FF XI know what I'm talking about. The characters are nearly all the same except differently named. Almost 95% of what was going on in FF XI is in this one. From linkshells, to menus, to using a gamepad, to having an external config utility for selecting your resolution.....all this stuff is the same.
Game certainly is beautiful but will not give wow a run for it's money at all. Some curious people will play it and some might stay but that's about it.
Not to derail the thread or anything,I Just wanted to touch on the system requirements. It's not the developing company's responsibility to make sure system requirements meet our system specs. They only have to give us some indication of what it takes to run the game, and by that I mean literally run it. It is our responsibility as PC gamers to facilitate our habit, that means making sure our hardware is up to par to run the games we choose play. If you choose to play PC games, then hardware upgrades are a necessary part of the hobby. I highly doubt that a majority of WoW players, who draw some kind of income haven't upgraded at least once in 6 years. My point being, devs shouldn't punish the people who have the hardware to run new graphic intensive games for the sake of those who don't.
Back on topic though I don't see FFXIV beating out sub numbers on WoW, for one because a majority of the WoW fanbase doesn't care to try new games they are content with that game. The second reason is because most gold sellers aren't going to risk a sure thing to a new game.
I doubt this game will give WoW any serious competition. The extremely poor execution of Open Beta is not a good sign of proper management of the game. I'm afraid i have nothing to comment on the game itself since after the delay they have additionally postponed keys. The character model graphics look good as do the emotes although the customization of your toon is extremely limited if you consider what is possible in a MMO today. MMOs like APB have very detailed customizations and I find it strange that MMOs are so reluctant to have people custom make a toon to their liking. Music score is good as are the cut scenes that I have viewed. Based off the little information I've seen it appears to be an average MMO based off a famous name brand. Sort of like Pepsi or Coke coming out with a new drink but it is not as good as the original. Likely, Guild Wars 2 will be the game that comes close to competing with WoW especially considering that it won't have a subscription fee.
Your seriously going to say this game cann't compete with WoW because of its Beta performance?? You were around for WoW Beta I take it then too? I was, and I was for the live launch of WoW, and it sucked back then. When will people stop comparing Betas to 5 year old upgraded games.
Because the industry has changed since WoW was released. FFXIV is competeing with WoW, not the other way around. FFXIV, or any game company, needs to offer the polish that WoW has, or else won't stand a chance at becoming big the way everyone wants it to. There really hasn't been one game post-WoW era that has done superbly well, and that's because when you go from WoW to anything, you instantly notice a lack of polish.
WOW had 6 years to polish that gameplay. What the hell are you talking about? its unfair to compare a game in open beta with WOW.
No, it's really not in terms of actual gameplay. Sure, new games won't have near as much content, that's a given. But when it comes down to number of bugs, user friendliness, and fun factor, the bar has been raised. People will not accept a sub-par game at release anymore that slowly gets better with patches, and it's obvious by triple-A titles crashing and burning like a F2P Korean MMO. People join the new MMO and instantly compare it to WoW's polish and fun, and if it doesn't weigh in similar, they go back.
I hardly doubt that FF mmos attracts WOW players. its a very differernt kind of MMO and has nothing in common with WOW. Why would anyone who has been playing WOW for years would leaveto play Final Fantasy 14? when it appeals too very different kind of gamers?
Sure it would. A triple-A company like SquareEnix releasing a game is going to be catching attention whether it was a MMO or not. I know that many WoW players have also played FF, so why wouldn't it appeal to them? This analogy also applies to any game that has released. Why play Final Fantasy if it has a million bugs on release (not saying it will or won't) versus another MMO that has ironed these problems out and is fully functional? Those types of comparisons actually happen, and not in favor of FFXIV.
Maybe such comparisons happen but logical minds know that game is in open beta an WOW is out for 6 years. Any smart person would know its just stupid to make comparison. And those who want to use WOW as a yard stick to measure every new MMO release its better for all MMOS that such people continue to play WOW. FF has a great fan following and it doesn't need WOW's million players to be a success. FF is a very different kind of gameplay anyways, WOW players wont last here for long because of lack of easy mode.
No, I can't actually agree with all of you saying the bar has been raised. It hasn't, the expectations of the players has raised, but the development process has not. And look at the result of this shall we? Look at every launch that has come out since the players felt they knew best, and that the 'bar has been raised', every launch has been dictated by the fickle and the opinionated not the game itself. Just look at FFXIV here, they decided not to put in jump, half the people have been up in arms for months now. Why? because we have to have jump or the game sucks? No, because the players think they know what the 'new standards' are. The UI isn't the same as the supposed 'industry standard' either, god forbid they don't make it mandatory that thier game has button 1+2 mouse movement for everyone. (sorry, I have been playing online games since before the internet was born, and I still have yet to play a game using mouse for movement - its not a damn requirement, get over it). FFXIV is different than WoW, stop trying to make it the same, really. WoW is NOT the industry standard, WoW is WoW thats all it is. (and no I dont care if 11 million people play it, just because everyone does something doesn't mean its the right thing to do). Seriously sheep....bahhh...sheep!
If the bugs in the game which hasn't even gone live yet bother you, don't play it. Do you really think your not going to be bothered by them if say a week goes by? a month? a year? No...if it already bothers you it will only bother you more as time goes by. Stop stressing on it and move along. This game will succeed, because it already has a fan base willing to pay to play it. Not everyone is part of that base, nor do they need to be for it to be a success. But the fact remains, if it went live today, even with the bugs it still has, people will be paying to play it and it will go on without those that dont like it.
Kaocan is hitting the nail on the head.
IMO Honestly this game is too much like WoW to kill WoW. People are tired of playing on rails. What needs to be done to succesfully kill wow is a real sandbox MMO.
The game that kills wow will not have levels.
It will probably have only a small amount of quests.
It will have player run economy.
It will not be on "rails".
Now the WoW killing argument, this has a chance to be a came that is better than WoW on many levels, and if the WoW community would stop chasing the carrots Blizzzard is dangling in front of them long enough to realize the stopped having fun they might try this new game and actually enjoy it.
Unfortunately, people will not leave WoW for fear of missing out on the next worthless piece of crap Blizzard has to offer them, to actually try a new game and experiance something new and exciting.
It's not going to be a sandbox buddy that kills WOW....your kind has been waiting for one of those games since Ultima Online.....and you'll keep waiting.
its not going to kill wow.. it is to hard for the mass public. it will never be as easy as wow.. just not how Square makes games. I am really enjoying it and will be moving from FFXI after 8 years to FFXIV. I didn't expect to like it(i thought it was gonna be to WoW like) but its just like FFXI(but way better) and for that I'm happy!
If you liked FFXI you will LOVE FFXIV. If you didn't like FFXI you might like FFXIV but I doubt it. It will have 500k-1m subs just like FFXI and milk it for all its worth. Release many expansions and addons and will do just fine. Square Enix will call it a success and in 8 years they'll make FF 19 Online.
MMO's have become almost single player RPGs that another person is running by you playing as well. There needs to be a game where you can make your own purpose.
UO people made millions by starting player run auctions, decorating house, building cities in some extents.
There needs to be a good game created that will let people experiance a sandbox MMO, and unfortunatley nowadays people don't care how much fun a game is if it doesn't look pretty.
People like you, don't know what to do when there is no end goal. With out rails you get confused and stop playing because there is no little carrot in front of your eyes.
Now the WoW killing argument, this has a chance to be a came that is better than WoW on many levels, and if the WoW community would stop chasing the carrots Blizzzard is dangling in front of them long enough to realize the stopped having fun they might try this new game and actually enjoy it.
Unfortunately, people will not leave WoW for fear of missing out on the next worthless piece of crap Blizzard has to offer them, to actually try a new game and experiance something new and exciting.
That is a laughable argument, at best.
The reason this game isn't going to kill WoW is because NO game is going to kill WoW. It's going to run it's course, plain and simple. People should really stop caring about whether a game has the potential to "kill WoW". I find it most interesting when people argue that other games are successful with a smaller userbase because the base enjoys the game, but WoW is evil because the people playing it are somehow scared of "something new", as if those people couldn't possibly be enjoying WoW somehow... lol
There is nothing new about FFXIV.
The game is beautiful, but so far I haven't found it to be harder than any other game.
I agree with you that it has the chance to be a better game than WoW on many levels, but that chance dies for me when they intentionally bork the UI and control scheme in a misguided attempt to make it somehow "different than WoW". This game was released for the PC, and yet does not accomodate the standard controls (keyboard/mouse) of a PC. In fact, it goes out of it's way to make using those controls a total pain in the ass... All in some lame attempt to make it somehow "different".
People are uncomfortable with the crappy control scheme of this game not because they are too used to playing WoW...
Keyboard/Mouse is the standard input for COMPUTERS... not just WoW...
If I want a game that forces PS3 controller style, I might as well buy a PS3.
Any game that goes out of it's way to make it uncomfortable to play deserves to die IMO, and there is no reason in the world why standard input devices for the PC should purposefully be borked, when both control schemes could have easily been implemented, making the argument moot.
Honesly... JKLI to scroll the map?! This is 2010, not 1980.
FFXIV probably won't kill WoW on the ground that WoW is an excellent lowest common denominator pleaser. MMORPG developers are past even trying to kill WoW anymore, because every time they produce a WoW clone they're beaten by the original doing it better.
But I will say that it would be really cool if FFXIV killed WoW because it would mean wannabe MMORPG producing developers would start trying to copying some far higher quality stuff, like in-game cutscenes and dynamic player economies, instead of what they usually copy from WoW, which amounts to a boring-ass GUI and being lead around by your nose by NPCs with exclaimation points floating over their heads.
This is the first mmorpg I've ever played where I've thought, "Hmm, this thing could get as huge as WoW."
Polish seems superb and it's still in Beta. The graphics, music and networking (dealing with lag and whatnot) are all top notch, really beyond top notch. I've never seen anything this polished in Beta, and I've never seen an MMORPG that looks and feels as nice as this one does period.
Top all of that off with the fact that you can play it on a ps3 and I can totally see this thing overcoming WoW.
Same here bud and if they actually let us log in into our PC accounts through the PS3 version for road trips that will be totaly awsome and it just might hurt WoW pretty good.
IMO Honestly this game is too much like WoW to kill WoW. People are tired of playing on rails. What needs to be done to succesfully kill wow is a real sandbox MMO.
The game that kills wow will not have levels.
It will probably have only a small amount of quests.
It will have player run economy.
It will not be on "rails".
Now the WoW killing argument, this has a chance to be a came that is better than WoW on many levels, and if the WoW community would stop chasing the carrots Blizzzard is dangling in front of them long enough to realize the stopped having fun they might try this new game and actually enjoy it.
Unfortunately, people will not leave WoW for fear of missing out on the next worthless piece of crap Blizzard has to offer them, to actually try a new game and experiance something new and exciting.
Sandbox will kill WOW? really? ahahahaha... thanks for the laugh.
90% of haters are begging for love. 10% just want a little attention -- Paulo Coelho
Don't know if this has been said, but I am playing in OB and I think it can't compete with wow because:
1. It has very little quests.
2. Combat is not as actiony as wow.
3. It has higher system requirements.
4. Quest givers are a bit harder to find.
These are just the things that come to me immediately.
Probably the best set of bullet points that describe why many WoW players won't play FF XIV. You could add the control scheme as a negative as well. The system reqs automatically negate many potential buyers as well.
The more I see these games release with higher end requirements the more I am lead to believe that many developers have no idea who their target audience is.
There are two groups you can negate immediately; Fanboys and Haters. Fanboys will play the game no matter what, and will do whatever it takes to play...it's probably better to call them Zealots. Haters won't play the game no matter what, the game could promise that some hot chick will come and perform sexual acts in real life, and the haters still won't play.
However, the audience you have to aim for is the potential buyers. If the system reqs are ridiculously high for a mmorpg, then you will automatically cut your potential profits by a great amount. Many mmorpg gamers don't have high end rigs, hell most people don't really want to or can invest in a high end gaming rig. Especially with this economy. Yes, there has to come a point where minimum reqs have to increase, based on the level of average technology. However, when the minimum reqs are higher than what might be considered average, you're losing money.
Gameplay>Graphics
Profits>Graphics
Blizzard did it with WoW, and look where it got them.
I think there target audience is ffxi players. ffxi did not have wow subs but the game has done very well I would say other than wow and original EQ it is the next most succesful mmo out there for having a dedicated player base and quality expansions.
I personally very much enjoy this game but it is no way going to be a wow killer it isn't geared towards anyone that enjoys wow. most people that enjoy wow would not enjoy this game. I didn't enjoy wow and i loved ffxi i am part of there target audience. They never tried to make a game that appeals to the masses. To many have failed at that attempt. What is left is to make a game for a specific group of gamers which i'm in. Thank fully a mmo i can finally enjoy again. And no pvp is even better in my opinion. Lots of group play a huge plus for me. The game will also i'm sure have great story like ffxi did. I have only been in OB for 2 days so I don't know much about the story as i have only gone through the inital story arc. But it was a decent story and the cutscenes were great looking.
So in short i guess i'm saying no it won't break more than a few hundred thousand subs but I think S.E is happy with that amount of dedicated players. They know there game won't appeal to the masses and i don't think they care. But they do know it will have enough subs to make a profit. For years to come.
Now the WoW killing argument, this has a chance to be a came that is better than WoW on many levels, and if the WoW community would stop chasing the carrots Blizzzard is dangling in front of them long enough to realize the stopped having fun they might try this new game and actually enjoy it.
Unfortunately, people will not leave WoW for fear of missing out on the next worthless piece of crap Blizzard has to offer them, to actually try a new game and experiance something new and exciting.
That is a laughable argument, at best.
The reason this game isn't going to kill WoW is because NO game is going to kill WoW. It's going to run it's course, plain and simple. People should really stop caring about whether a game has the potential to "kill WoW". I find it most interesting when people argue that other games are successful with a smaller userbase because the base enjoys the game, but WoW is evil because the people playing it are somehow scared of "something new", as if those people couldn't possibly be enjoying WoW somehow... lol
There is nothing new about FFXIV.
The game is beautiful, but so far I haven't found it to be harder than any other game.
I agree with you that it has the chance to be a better game than WoW on many levels, but that chance dies for me when they intentionally bork the UI and control scheme in a misguided attempt to make it somehow "different than WoW". This game was released for the PC, and yet does not accomodate the standard controls (keyboard/mouse) of a PC. In fact, it goes out of it's way to make using those controls a total pain in the ass... All in some lame attempt to make it somehow "different".
People are uncomfortable with the crappy control scheme of this game not because they are too used to playing WoW...
Keyboard/Mouse is the standard input for COMPUTERS... not just WoW...
If I want a game that forces PS3 controller style, I might as well buy a PS3.
Any game that goes out of it's way to make it uncomfortable to play deserves to die IMO, and there is no reason in the world why standard input devices for the PC should purposefully be borked, when both control schemes could have easily been implemented, making the argument moot.
Honesly... JKLI to scroll the map?! This is 2010, not 1980.
I'm playing the game using the keyboard only and have no issues with the controls. It is very easy to use. Yes it is different than the excepted normal pc controls and yes it was designed around a ps3 in mind but It works fine for me.
And why would they change the controls so they piss off all the ffxi players which i'm sure is there target audience.
FFXIV probably won't kill WoW on the ground that WoW is an excellent lowest common denominator pleaser. MMORPG developers are past even trying to kill WoW anymore, because every time they produce a WoW clone they're beaten by the original doing it better.
But I will say that it would be really cool if FFXIV killed WoW because it would mean wannabe MMORPG producing developers would start trying to copying some far higher quality stuff, like in-game cutscenes and dynamic player economies, instead of what they usually copy from WoW, which amounts to a boring-ass GUI and being lead around by your nose by NPCs with exclaimation points floating over their heads.
If another game "kills" WoW... It will just mean that everyone will be bitching because every new game is copying the new kid on the block.
The biggest problem with developers that try to copy Blizzard success is that none of them have the gonnads to copy the investment that Blizzard put into developing the game. Say what you want about them, but Blizzard is famous for refusing to release a game until they believe it is ready for release, to the point of near absurdity. Those companies that are trying to develop successful games never learned that lesson, for the most part. They keep trying to push games out before they're ready, and they end up making cheap knockoffs of WoW. Even games that had genuinely new ideas get forced into early release. Almost univerally, those games actually had an angle that would have been significantly different than WoW, had it been given the time to develop.
That's why I keep looking at Bioware right now. They're the only ones recently who seem to have adopted the attitude that the quality of their product is a priority over cashing in on instant monthly fees. I'm not saying that SE is releasing prematurely, though. I had hopes for this game primarily for the same reason. Square seems to want to make sure that they have a solid product to release, monthly fees be damned. After all, they already have a successful series, and a successful MMO release under their belt. They weren't in a hurry. And it makes it all the more upsetting that they seem hell bent on forcing PC users into a PS3 control scheme, when it is all so needless.
I own FFXI. I know that the control scheme here for FFXIV isn't all too different from it. Unfortunately, it was a huge mistake to go the console-control direction then, and it's an even bigger mistake now. Intuitive UI, and responsive controls, in no way makes a game somehow less challenging.
Sandbox will kill WOW? really? ahahahaha... thanks for the laugh.
It is really not about sandboxes or themeparks. It is about fun and good code, Wows only real difference from the rest is superb programming skills. You need that for any upcoming huge game.
Mechanics does not matter as long as people have fun playing the game. And the more fun the larger a game will get.
It is however true that it is a lot harder ta make a good sandbox than a good thempark, so hard in fact that the best sandbox out is only acceptable (Eve) but not great. That doesn't mean that the mechanics in itself is bad, sandbox games are few and usually made by indie devs with little or no experienced people.
Now I might sound like a sandbox fan but the fact is that I just want fun games, I don't care which mechanics a game has as long as they are well adapted to the game and are fun. And the same mechanics everyone else have used for 15 years doesn't really do that.
As for FF XIV I doubt it can go against Wow but it seems to be good enough to keep it's own faithful followers happy for a few years and I can imagine 250K western players and scores of Japanese. In Japan I easily see it beating Wow.
This is the first mmorpg I've ever played where I've thought, "Hmm, this thing could get as huge as WoW."
Polish seems superb and it's still in Beta. The graphics, music and networking (dealing with lag and whatnot) are all top notch, really beyond top notch. I've never seen anything this polished in Beta, and I've never seen an MMORPG that looks and feels as nice as this one does period.
Top all of that off with the fact that you can play it on a ps3 and I can totally see this thing overcoming WoW.
Haven't I heard this lines before? No really I think I heard of them from somewhere... just can't remember...
if the game is good enough, it will probably kill off FFXI, because that is the 'demographic' that the game is aimed at, and more than likely, the vaste majority of FFXI players will migrate to the new game. i dont really see this game drawing in any of the WoW populace, simply down to the UI. SE dont seem to understand the concept unfortunately, Blizzard embraced it and allowed modding to the games interface, i dont see SE allowing that, though the least they could do is at least give the game some decent PC controls, all i see about that side of things is complaints, and its not like it would hurt the console crowd to have decent working PC controls, unless of course, its intentional, but would a company like SE really shoot themselves in the foot over something so basic.. and if so why? it just looks to me like SE just doesnt get it, when it comes to PC MMO gaming.. which is a shame because the game itself sounds interesting.
The only real problem I so far have had is the lag (Not that odd for an game in OB or just starting) and the software mouse thing. Keyboard/mouse control aint to bad beside that. However do believe the game might be more enjoyable with a keypad. Doubt however it will give WoW a "run for it money".
The game is not simply, not hard either, but not simply WoW style.
When will all these little kids/post WoW "gamers" learn that WoW's popularity has NOTHING to do with WoW's gameplay. Its the most generic mmo ever. Blizzard are NOT awesome game designers. They good at MARKETING.
The only way FF14 can surpass WoW is if square dumps a ton of money into advertising on television in north america and europe like WoW does. Oh well, its been said millions of times, so I guess if no one gets it by now, no one ever will.
When will all these little kids/post WoW "gamers" learn that WoW's popularity has NOTHING to do with WoW's gameplay. Its the most generic mmo ever. Blizzard are NOT awesome game designers. They good at MARKETING.
The only way FF14 can surpass WoW is if square dumps a ton of money into advertising on television in north america and europe like WoW does. Oh well, its been said millions of times, so I guess if no one gets it by now, no one ever will.
That's pretty absurd.
Blizzard could dump billions into advertising, but there is no way they would retain a userbase as large as they have if people didn't actually enjoy playing the game.
WoW offers a smooth gameplay experience with extended gameplay for raiders that verges on what used to be considered challenging. It's become generic to seasoned MMO players, for sure, but a lot of people have fun playing it. The PC reqs aren't prohibitive, and it isn't hard to learn how to play it. Blizzard has learned a time-honored lesson with gaming that goes as far back as checkers. The best games have rules that are easy to learn, and strategies that ((can be)) complex.
The only real thing that any other MMO should be trying to emulate from WoW is the smooth gameplay.
i dont think it'll top wow's subs (or even really make a push at those gaudy numbers) but i do think it'll pass ffxi's top numbers, which is probably what sqEnix is shooting for.
as for what it'll do to wow, i'll say this. it will lower wow's numbers because SOME people will leave wow to play it. but really, not enough to make a dent into those numbers.
think of all the people who play wow for (as an example) the pvp. obviously these folks won't be leaving for ffxiv right?
this is coming from someone who IS in fact leaving wow to play ffxiv (so my active sub will be eve and xiv)
RIP Ribbitribbitt you are missed, kid.
Currently Playing EVE, ESO
Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and not clothed.
When will all these little kids/post WoW "gamers" learn that WoW's popularity has NOTHING to do with WoW's gameplay. Its the most generic mmo ever. Blizzard are NOT awesome game designers. They good at MARKETING.
The only way FF14 can surpass WoW is if square dumps a ton of money into advertising on television in north america and europe like WoW does. Oh well, its been said millions of times, so I guess if no one gets it by now, no one ever will.
That's pretty absurd.
Blizzard could dump billions into advertising, but there is no way they would retain a userbase as large as they have if people didn't actually enjoy playing the game.
WoW offers a smooth gameplay experience with extended gameplay for raiders that verges on what used to be considered challenging. It's become generic to seasoned MMO players, for sure, but a lot of people have fun playing it. The PC reqs aren't prohibitive, and it isn't hard to learn how to play it. Blizzard has learned a time-honored lesson with gaming that goes as far back as checkers. The best games have rules that are easy to learn, and strategies that ((can be)) complex.
The only real thing that any other MMO should be trying to emulate from WoW is the smooth gameplay.
Glad someone in this thread actually has a brain. Side, man you pretty much have been on point with all your comments in this thread. People don't play WoW because they find it fun, they play it because of marketing. I've never laughed so hard in my life.
In War - Victory. In Peace - Vigilance. In Death - Sacrifice.
First off, not all of us that play World of Warcraft are "kids". I hate when people do that.
I'm pretty certain my World of Warcraft account will remain open for a very long time, but I definitely see myself purchasing this. I'll be playing the OB this weekend for sure. After all, I did buy Aion. ugh
________________________ Two atoms walk out of a bar. The first exclaims, "Damn, I forgot my electrons." The other replies, "You sure?". The first explains, "Yea, I'm positive."
Comments
No, I can't actually agree with all of you saying the bar has been raised. It hasn't, the expectations of the players has raised, but the development process has not. And look at the result of this shall we? Look at every launch that has come out since the players felt they knew best, and that the 'bar has been raised', every launch has been dictated by the fickle and the opinionated not the game itself. Just look at FFXIV here, they decided not to put in jump, half the people have been up in arms for months now. Why? because we have to have jump or the game sucks? No, because the players think they know what the 'new standards' are. The UI isn't the same as the supposed 'industry standard' either, god forbid they don't make it mandatory that thier game has button 1+2 mouse movement for everyone. (sorry, I have been playing online games since before the internet was born, and I still have yet to play a game using mouse for movement - its not a damn requirement, get over it). FFXIV is different than WoW, stop trying to make it the same, really. WoW is NOT the industry standard, WoW is WoW thats all it is. (and no I dont care if 11 million people play it, just because everyone does something doesn't mean its the right thing to do). Seriously sheep....bahhh...sheep!
If the bugs in the game which hasn't even gone live yet bother you, don't play it. Do you really think your not going to be bothered by them if say a week goes by? a month? a year? No...if it already bothers you it will only bother you more as time goes by. Stop stressing on it and move along. This game will succeed, because it already has a fan base willing to pay to play it. Not everyone is part of that base, nor do they need to be for it to be a success. But the fact remains, if it went live today, even with the bugs it still has, people will be paying to play it and it will go on without those that dont like it.
(DISCLAIMER - The use of the word YOU in the above post is not directed at any one person in particular, but towards those who fall into the category itself - there is no personal attack here, neither intentional nor implied.)
Is it really necessary to mass quote?
Based on my opinion, It definitely will not give WoW a run for it's money at all. This game is just Final Fantasy XI ver. 2.0
People who played FF XI know what I'm talking about. The characters are nearly all the same except differently named. Almost 95% of what was going on in FF XI is in this one. From linkshells, to menus, to using a gamepad, to having an external config utility for selecting your resolution.....all this stuff is the same.
Game certainly is beautiful but will not give wow a run for it's money at all. Some curious people will play it and some might stay but that's about it.
Not to derail the thread or anything,I Just wanted to touch on the system requirements. It's not the developing company's responsibility to make sure system requirements meet our system specs. They only have to give us some indication of what it takes to run the game, and by that I mean literally run it. It is our responsibility as PC gamers to facilitate our habit, that means making sure our hardware is up to par to run the games we choose play. If you choose to play PC games, then hardware upgrades are a necessary part of the hobby. I highly doubt that a majority of WoW players, who draw some kind of income haven't upgraded at least once in 6 years. My point being, devs shouldn't punish the people who have the hardware to run new graphic intensive games for the sake of those who don't.
Back on topic though I don't see FFXIV beating out sub numbers on WoW, for one because a majority of the WoW fanbase doesn't care to try new games they are content with that game. The second reason is because most gold sellers aren't going to risk a sure thing to a new game.
Kaocan is hitting the nail on the head.
IMO Honestly this game is too much like WoW to kill WoW. People are tired of playing on rails. What needs to be done to succesfully kill wow is a real sandbox MMO.
The game that kills wow will not have levels.
It will probably have only a small amount of quests.
It will have player run economy.
It will not be on "rails".
Now the WoW killing argument, this has a chance to be a came that is better than WoW on many levels, and if the WoW community would stop chasing the carrots Blizzzard is dangling in front of them long enough to realize the stopped having fun they might try this new game and actually enjoy it.
Unfortunately, people will not leave WoW for fear of missing out on the next worthless piece of crap Blizzard has to offer them, to actually try a new game and experiance something new and exciting.
It's not going to be a sandbox buddy that kills WOW....your kind has been waiting for one of those games since Ultima Online.....and you'll keep waiting.
its not going to kill wow.. it is to hard for the mass public. it will never be as easy as wow.. just not how Square makes games. I am really enjoying it and will be moving from FFXI after 8 years to FFXIV. I didn't expect to like it(i thought it was gonna be to WoW like) but its just like FFXI(but way better) and for that I'm happy!
If you liked FFXI you will LOVE FFXIV. If you didn't like FFXI you might like FFXIV but I doubt it. It will have 500k-1m subs just like FFXI and milk it for all its worth. Release many expansions and addons and will do just fine. Square Enix will call it a success and in 8 years they'll make FF 19 Online.
My kind?
MMO's have become almost single player RPGs that another person is running by you playing as well. There needs to be a game where you can make your own purpose.
UO people made millions by starting player run auctions, decorating house, building cities in some extents.
There needs to be a good game created that will let people experiance a sandbox MMO, and unfortunatley nowadays people don't care how much fun a game is if it doesn't look pretty.
People like you, don't know what to do when there is no end goal. With out rails you get confused and stop playing because there is no little carrot in front of your eyes.
That is a laughable argument, at best.
The reason this game isn't going to kill WoW is because NO game is going to kill WoW. It's going to run it's course, plain and simple. People should really stop caring about whether a game has the potential to "kill WoW". I find it most interesting when people argue that other games are successful with a smaller userbase because the base enjoys the game, but WoW is evil because the people playing it are somehow scared of "something new", as if those people couldn't possibly be enjoying WoW somehow... lol
There is nothing new about FFXIV.
The game is beautiful, but so far I haven't found it to be harder than any other game.
I agree with you that it has the chance to be a better game than WoW on many levels, but that chance dies for me when they intentionally bork the UI and control scheme in a misguided attempt to make it somehow "different than WoW". This game was released for the PC, and yet does not accomodate the standard controls (keyboard/mouse) of a PC. In fact, it goes out of it's way to make using those controls a total pain in the ass... All in some lame attempt to make it somehow "different".
People are uncomfortable with the crappy control scheme of this game not because they are too used to playing WoW...
Keyboard/Mouse is the standard input for COMPUTERS... not just WoW...
If I want a game that forces PS3 controller style, I might as well buy a PS3.
Any game that goes out of it's way to make it uncomfortable to play deserves to die IMO, and there is no reason in the world why standard input devices for the PC should purposefully be borked, when both control schemes could have easily been implemented, making the argument moot.
Honesly... JKLI to scroll the map?! This is 2010, not 1980.
FFXIV probably won't kill WoW on the ground that WoW is an excellent lowest common denominator pleaser. MMORPG developers are past even trying to kill WoW anymore, because every time they produce a WoW clone they're beaten by the original doing it better.
But I will say that it would be really cool if FFXIV killed WoW because it would mean wannabe MMORPG producing developers would start trying to copying some far higher quality stuff, like in-game cutscenes and dynamic player economies, instead of what they usually copy from WoW, which amounts to a boring-ass GUI and being lead around by your nose by NPCs with exclaimation points floating over their heads.
Same here bud and if they actually let us log in into our PC accounts through the PS3 version for road trips that will be totaly awsome and it just might hurt WoW pretty good.
Sandbox will kill WOW? really? ahahahaha... thanks for the laugh.
90% of haters are begging for love. 10% just want a little attention -- Paulo Coelho
I think there target audience is ffxi players. ffxi did not have wow subs but the game has done very well I would say other than wow and original EQ it is the next most succesful mmo out there for having a dedicated player base and quality expansions.
I personally very much enjoy this game but it is no way going to be a wow killer it isn't geared towards anyone that enjoys wow. most people that enjoy wow would not enjoy this game. I didn't enjoy wow and i loved ffxi i am part of there target audience. They never tried to make a game that appeals to the masses. To many have failed at that attempt. What is left is to make a game for a specific group of gamers which i'm in. Thank fully a mmo i can finally enjoy again. And no pvp is even better in my opinion. Lots of group play a huge plus for me. The game will also i'm sure have great story like ffxi did. I have only been in OB for 2 days so I don't know much about the story as i have only gone through the inital story arc. But it was a decent story and the cutscenes were great looking.
So in short i guess i'm saying no it won't break more than a few hundred thousand subs but I think S.E is happy with that amount of dedicated players. They know there game won't appeal to the masses and i don't think they care. But they do know it will have enough subs to make a profit. For years to come.
I'm playing the game using the keyboard only and have no issues with the controls. It is very easy to use. Yes it is different than the excepted normal pc controls and yes it was designed around a ps3 in mind but It works fine for me.
And why would they change the controls so they piss off all the ffxi players which i'm sure is there target audience.
If another game "kills" WoW... It will just mean that everyone will be bitching because every new game is copying the new kid on the block.
The biggest problem with developers that try to copy Blizzard success is that none of them have the gonnads to copy the investment that Blizzard put into developing the game. Say what you want about them, but Blizzard is famous for refusing to release a game until they believe it is ready for release, to the point of near absurdity. Those companies that are trying to develop successful games never learned that lesson, for the most part. They keep trying to push games out before they're ready, and they end up making cheap knockoffs of WoW. Even games that had genuinely new ideas get forced into early release. Almost univerally, those games actually had an angle that would have been significantly different than WoW, had it been given the time to develop.
That's why I keep looking at Bioware right now. They're the only ones recently who seem to have adopted the attitude that the quality of their product is a priority over cashing in on instant monthly fees. I'm not saying that SE is releasing prematurely, though. I had hopes for this game primarily for the same reason. Square seems to want to make sure that they have a solid product to release, monthly fees be damned. After all, they already have a successful series, and a successful MMO release under their belt. They weren't in a hurry. And it makes it all the more upsetting that they seem hell bent on forcing PC users into a PS3 control scheme, when it is all so needless.
I own FFXI. I know that the control scheme here for FFXIV isn't all too different from it. Unfortunately, it was a huge mistake to go the console-control direction then, and it's an even bigger mistake now. Intuitive UI, and responsive controls, in no way makes a game somehow less challenging.
It is really not about sandboxes or themeparks. It is about fun and good code, Wows only real difference from the rest is superb programming skills. You need that for any upcoming huge game.
Mechanics does not matter as long as people have fun playing the game. And the more fun the larger a game will get.
It is however true that it is a lot harder ta make a good sandbox than a good thempark, so hard in fact that the best sandbox out is only acceptable (Eve) but not great. That doesn't mean that the mechanics in itself is bad, sandbox games are few and usually made by indie devs with little or no experienced people.
Now I might sound like a sandbox fan but the fact is that I just want fun games, I don't care which mechanics a game has as long as they are well adapted to the game and are fun. And the same mechanics everyone else have used for 15 years doesn't really do that.
As for FF XIV I doubt it can go against Wow but it seems to be good enough to keep it's own faithful followers happy for a few years and I can imagine 250K western players and scores of Japanese. In Japan I easily see it beating Wow.
It won't even reach 500,000 subscribers in the US. Guaranteed.
Haven't I heard this lines before? No really I think I heard of them from somewhere... just can't remember...
if the game is good enough, it will probably kill off FFXI, because that is the 'demographic' that the game is aimed at, and more than likely, the vaste majority of FFXI players will migrate to the new game. i dont really see this game drawing in any of the WoW populace, simply down to the UI. SE dont seem to understand the concept unfortunately, Blizzard embraced it and allowed modding to the games interface, i dont see SE allowing that, though the least they could do is at least give the game some decent PC controls, all i see about that side of things is complaints, and its not like it would hurt the console crowd to have decent working PC controls, unless of course, its intentional, but would a company like SE really shoot themselves in the foot over something so basic.. and if so why? it just looks to me like SE just doesnt get it, when it comes to PC MMO gaming.. which is a shame because the game itself sounds interesting.
The only real problem I so far have had is the lag (Not that odd for an game in OB or just starting) and the software mouse thing. Keyboard/mouse control aint to bad beside that. However do believe the game might be more enjoyable with a keypad. Doubt however it will give WoW a "run for it money".
The game is not simply, not hard either, but not simply WoW style.
When will all these little kids/post WoW "gamers" learn that WoW's popularity has NOTHING to do with WoW's gameplay. Its the most generic mmo ever. Blizzard are NOT awesome game designers. They good at MARKETING.
The only way FF14 can surpass WoW is if square dumps a ton of money into advertising on television in north america and europe like WoW does. Oh well, its been said millions of times, so I guess if no one gets it by now, no one ever will.
That's pretty absurd.
Blizzard could dump billions into advertising, but there is no way they would retain a userbase as large as they have if people didn't actually enjoy playing the game.
WoW offers a smooth gameplay experience with extended gameplay for raiders that verges on what used to be considered challenging. It's become generic to seasoned MMO players, for sure, but a lot of people have fun playing it. The PC reqs aren't prohibitive, and it isn't hard to learn how to play it. Blizzard has learned a time-honored lesson with gaming that goes as far back as checkers. The best games have rules that are easy to learn, and strategies that ((can be)) complex.
The only real thing that any other MMO should be trying to emulate from WoW is the smooth gameplay.
i dont think it'll top wow's subs (or even really make a push at those gaudy numbers) but i do think it'll pass ffxi's top numbers, which is probably what sqEnix is shooting for.
as for what it'll do to wow, i'll say this. it will lower wow's numbers because SOME people will leave wow to play it. but really, not enough to make a dent into those numbers.
think of all the people who play wow for (as an example) the pvp. obviously these folks won't be leaving for ffxiv right?
this is coming from someone who IS in fact leaving wow to play ffxiv (so my active sub will be eve and xiv)
RIP Ribbitribbitt you are missed, kid.
Currently Playing EVE, ESO
Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and not clothed.
Dwight D Eisenhower
My optimism wears heavy boots and is loud.
Henry Rollins
Glad someone in this thread actually has a brain. Side, man you pretty much have been on point with all your comments in this thread. People don't play WoW because they find it fun, they play it because of marketing. I've never laughed so hard in my life.
In War - Victory.
In Peace - Vigilance.
In Death - Sacrifice.
First off, not all of us that play World of Warcraft are "kids". I hate when people do that.
I'm pretty certain my World of Warcraft account will remain open for a very long time, but I definitely see myself purchasing this. I'll be playing the OB this weekend for sure. After all, I did buy Aion. ugh
________________________
Two atoms walk out of a bar. The first exclaims, "Damn, I forgot my electrons." The other replies, "You sure?". The first explains, "Yea, I'm positive."