Posting excessive positive comments or baiting others to respond in a negative manner is considered trolling on the MMORPG.com forums.
For example: If there is one game that you did enjoy, voicing your opinion is encouraged. Posting this opinion in every thread concerning that game to the point that it disrupts all other conversation is not tolerated.
I think the intended meaning of the rule is to keep people from getting personal and throwing insults. ; )
It doesn't matter which side of the discussion you're on (there are always 2 sides) you still have to be courteous to the people who believe different than you. Even if it's about a game you like or think you may like that doesn't give anyone the ability to auto discredit them on a public forum. LoL
Heh. You're writing your own ROC now? You're funny.
... still doesn't make it theirs, you know . However you spin it, mmorpg.com's definition of trolling still is this:
Posting excessive negative comments or baiting others to respond in a negative manner is considered trolling on the MMORPG.com forums.
For example: If there is one game that you did not enjoy, voicing your opinion is encouraged. Posting this opinion in every thread concerning that game to the point that it disrupts all other conversation is not tolerated.
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
While spoony is a bit fanatic about it, I do have to agree with him on many of his points. I will ask this though, for the fans that are still going to be playing this game; Have we seen anything other than guildleaves and crafting to look forward to in this game? The main storyline seems okay, but not enough to really carry the game. FFXI had lots of random things you could do if you didn't want to lvl or craft. Reputation missions, summon quests, etc.
I dont get it, summoner wasnt even available in FF11 until further down the line, let alone "summon quests ect" .... Faction Leve Quests are like Reputation quests in this game so thats already there....
It doesnt make any sense to say something so baseless when all you get is the starting areas of a freaking beta!? beta or no... STARTING AREAS!
Sorry, what did I have to do in World of Warcraft between levels 1-20 .... o hthats right, go from A-B killing monsters with fed ex quests, only without any presentable story and a craft system that mayaswell reward you for breathing.
what do you want? MMOs always reserve the majority content for later levels....
Could you possibly concider calming down for a second. I asked a simple question and you're already jumping down my throat, making WoW comparison, and calling me 'baseless' for asking a question. (you may want to look up how that word is used in a sentence)
I know summons were added later, but we didn't have to be the paid guinny pigs for the last MMO. Now it seems we are doing just that. However, it was still content that added just that much more to the game. What I was asking was if there's anything more than the marathon-style quests they have in the game (not including the crafting quests), in which you basically just visit a camp, pop a quest, and then you / your friends just rush towards the blinking dots on your map.
This is fine for leveling, but it's not very emmersive. It makes the game feel like a single-player game. I know there are storyline quests, but so far I haven't been too impressed with them, and I'm wondering how long before that quest line runs out (I'm assuming they aren't repeatable).
To sum things up, while FFXI had quests that were basically a rush to some monster / goal (which is how guildleaves work atm), there were also quests that added more immersion to the game / made you explore the world. Finding hidden treasures, unlocking dungeons, finding keys, etc. This new FFXIV seems to be lacking those elements, and I just have to wonder what's left, once you get through the levels. Are there advanced job quests, quests to unlock new areas, etc? Something to add more adventure into this game? Because as fun as the leaves can be, they just don't carry the game for me.
I dont know why I have to calm down? didnt even mean to come off as tense, and for the record, what you are saying, IS baseless! "FFXIV doesnt seem to have any of these" ... neither did FF11 in the first 20 levels of the game, or on release.... so why is FFXIV expected to give you premium content at low levels? no other MMO really does either.
Its baseless because you dont know whats in the retail game and whats beyond level 20, therefore you cant claim these things are not in game, or wether or not the leves will get more interesting.
Its common sense to assume they will.
Comparing an 8 year old game to a pre-release. I dont think alot of you appreaciate how much of an investment making an MMO from scratch is. WoW had nothing but quest grinding on release, no BGs, PvP that crashed out world servers or lagged individual players, a handful of dungeons and no raids.... nobody complained, we did the core of the game, which was leveling and just eagerly awaited this stuff.
I did a level 10 leve last night with some friends and we came up on this flying baby looking thing. It saw us and ran into a cave that went pretty deep. When we turned a corner chasing it suddenly two wolves were summoned and the imp began casting. A meteor fell on our ranger one shotting him and the wolves jumped on our little Lalafell tank. We all died but that was the first time I thought, "wow this game could actually get exciting down the road." I don't believe leves are going to be the only thing carrying this game but they probably won't be a boring part either. So far I've noticed the leves are pretty random, even in their rewards.
I don't mean to sound like a fanboy or stir up any hate but I just wanted to point something out. I don't need something flashy with every detail laid out before me. I like to discover things, enjoy a challenge, and watch a good story unfold. I'm not saying FFXIV is guaranteed to have all of this but I certainly hope it will.
While spoony is a bit fanatic about it, I do have to agree with him on many of his points. I will ask this though, for the fans that are still going to be playing this game; Have we seen anything other than guildleaves and crafting to look forward to in this game? The main storyline seems okay, but not enough to really carry the game. FFXI had lots of random things you could do if you didn't want to lvl or craft. Reputation missions, summon quests, etc.
I dont get it, summoner wasnt even available in FF11 until further down the line, let alone "summon quests ect" .... Faction Leve Quests are like Reputation quests in this game so thats already there....
It doesnt make any sense to say something so baseless when all you get is the starting areas of a freaking beta!? beta or no... STARTING AREAS!
Sorry, what did I have to do in World of Warcraft between levels 1-20 .... o hthats right, go from A-B killing monsters with fed ex quests, only without any presentable story and a craft system that mayaswell reward you for breathing.
what do you want? MMOs always reserve the majority content for later levels....
Could you possibly concider calming down for a second. I asked a simple question and you're already jumping down my throat, making WoW comparison, and calling me 'baseless' for asking a question. (you may want to look up how that word is used in a sentence)
I know summons were added later, but we didn't have to be the paid guinny pigs for the last MMO. Now it seems we are doing just that. However, it was still content that added just that much more to the game. What I was asking was if there's anything more than the marathon-style quests they have in the game (not including the crafting quests), in which you basically just visit a camp, pop a quest, and then you / your friends just rush towards the blinking dots on your map.
This is fine for leveling, but it's not very emmersive. It makes the game feel like a single-player game. I know there are storyline quests, but so far I haven't been too impressed with them, and I'm wondering how long before that quest line runs out (I'm assuming they aren't repeatable).
To sum things up, while FFXI had quests that were basically a rush to some monster / goal (which is how guildleaves work atm), there were also quests that added more immersion to the game / made you explore the world. Finding hidden treasures, unlocking dungeons, finding keys, etc. This new FFXIV seems to be lacking those elements, and I just have to wonder what's left, once you get through the levels. Are there advanced job quests, quests to unlock new areas, etc? Something to add more adventure into this game? Because as fun as the leaves can be, they just don't carry the game for me.
I dont know why I have to calm down? didnt even mean to come off as tense, and for the record, what you are saying, IS baseless! "FFXIV doesnt seem to have any of these" ... neither did FF11 in the first 20 levels of the game, or on release.... so why is FFXIV expected to give you premium content at low levels? no other MMO really does either.
Its baseless because you dont know whats in the retail game and whats beyond level 20, therefore you cant claim these things are not in game, or wether or not the leves will get more interesting.
Its common sense to assume they will.
Comparing an 8 year old game to a pre-release. I dont think alot of you appreaciate how much of an investment making an MMO from scratch is. WoW had nothing but quest grinding on release, no BGs, PvP that crashed out world servers or lagged individual players, a handful of dungeons and no raids.... nobody complained, we did the core of the game, which was leveling and just eagerly awaited this stuff.
I did a level 10 leve last night with some friends and we came up on this flying baby looking thing. It saw us and ran into a cave that went pretty deep. When we turned a corner chasing it suddenly two wolves were summoned and the imp began casting. A meteor fell on our ranger one shotting him and the wolves jumped on our little Lalafell tank. We all died but that was the first time I thought, "wow this game could actually get exciting down the road." I don't believe leves are going to be the only thing carrying this game but they probably won't be a boring part either. So far I've noticed the leves are pretty random, even in their rewards.
I don't mean to sound like a fanboy or stir up any hate but I just wanted to point something out. I don't need something flashy with every detail laid out before me. I like to discover things, enjoy a challenge, and watch a good story unfold. I'm not saying FFXIV is guaranteed to have all of this but I certainly hope it will.
Imp leves (the evil babies) are your standard run of the mill Bronze (noob, starting, easiest level of difficulty) guildleves.
There were only a few Silver guildleves in the Open Beta and they were much harder, I also didn't see any of them below rank 20. Guess what comes after Silver?
Not to mention that most people in beta did not even touch faction leves which are exponentially more involving than mere battleleves.
Oh and then there is also class quests, city quests, faction quests (not the same as the faction guildleves), limit quests in the future, and a multitude of other quests, events, behests, NM's and more.
From my past experience most MMO start out boring and get a lot more interesting as they build. I'd never judge a game based on it's tutorial. It either does one of two things. it blows you out of the water with it's "cool" factor or is boring as heck, neither are what is going to be happening in the next 40 hours that you play of the real game. Ones boring and the other will be a let down after you get into the game itself.
I didn't care for his so called review. First off he is way too emotional to give an honest review. Second he glossed over a lot of the details about the game and the things he did say were a plus was like he had to say that in order to stop people from saying hes not being fair (IE whiiiile the graphics are good). Also he puts a lot of stock into what the people do at pax regarding the drinks and interviews. If he was reviewing the pax fair that would be fine but hes reviewing the games. drinks and dev talks are not part of the game last time i checked, also the 30 min timer is not a plus in my opinion, 15 mins and you know what the game is like, more then that and it's just stalling the line. if your the 6th person behind your 3 hours before you get your turn. if you got in at 12, your going to be playing the game at 3:00. I could get in 4 other games in the time it took me to get to that one game.
Of course this is just my opinion but if he was a great reviewer i wouldn't have stopped out of sheer cringe value about 1/3 through. Something about him just bashing a game into the ground making it sound like the worse thing ever puts me off.
While i don't think FF14 is the best game ever it is playable and enjoyable. somethings need to be fixed (mouse and general lag)but it is still enjoyable. I played GW1 for about 4 hours and stopped, just lost interest. I'll wait till i see what GW2 is like before i pick up a copy myself. i'd prefer to see for myself and not let others tell me what a great game it is.
Help me Bioware, you're my only hope.
Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
I will tell you, I don't like Spoony, I never liked his review etc, but I've got to admit he seemed to nail that one on the spot.
Seriously guys. Look :
1. During the close beta the problems with the mouse and the UI and other stuff was there. Yes? Well yes it seems so.
2. Between the Closed Beta and the Open beta and during the time of the Closed beta they didn't change any of those problems.
3. They didn't seem to change anything major during the Open Beta either.
Well aside from making those big promises that the final version which will be out a week from now will have eveyrhing fixed etc.
Aside from that SE told us that this game is ment to be casual-friendly. So far the UI seems to be to complex to fit into the "casual" category, the absence of any indicators that would point out to whom we should talk and who to ignore does not favor in this "casual friendly" list either. The crafitng isn't all that casual too ( which isn't a bad thing, since it brings some fresh air to crafting professions in mmo). But overall unless SE has a different term for casual-friendly somewhere up in their headquarters in Japan, they do not seem to deliver thir promiss at the moment.
Next goes the system of limiting the amount of grinding a person does. No matter how many cool videos the fans will produce the system does seem to be limiting the players choices. For example : if a player wants to be a 100% gladiator he will be limited in his freedom of making one because of exp. limits set by SE and he will progress slower in achieving his goal then those who will mix their classes, thus mixing classes becomes a mandatory thing. Considering the fact that the player will have to pay a montlhy fee this can be seen as a flaw.
Then I would like to adress the issue of the Open Beta. While it's main objective was to stress the servers. It would seem logical for SE to show some contet that could potentially intrigue and thus get new subscribers who got into the beta just to check the game out ( and there was a considerable amount of those people, like in every other mmo there is). Instead SE showed a small, a very small glimple of the story, some crafting and very-very generic levequests. While it does seem ( as we can see in this form) that such a move created some followers that are now hooked up and will play the game it also made a ton of people to turn away from the game ( once again, as seen in this and other forums).
Naturally I'm not an oracle to fortell the future and see if the promisses that SE made will be there on day 1 of the game, and will there be any major improvements during the first couple of month so I won't make any predictions if the game will fail or get a major succes, but mr. Spoony did have a point, and as you can see there ARE people that think like him, so such an opinion have the same perfect right for exictense as the positive ones.
And P.S. Fan, unless the promisses that the developer made are already set in stone and can be shown, it is NOT a strong argument to counter the arguments of the trolls of this form, because you basicly talking about something that you did not see and did not try and don't even know if it really exists aside the world of promisses from the developer. Don't be childish and just wait till release date, otherwise this fanboy-troll battle starts to be a mess.
And for the trolls -> ok we heard the complaing a million times, thats more then enough, wait till the official release and see what's it going to be like. Seriously you're like an old women fighing in the grosery store.
FFXIV is an acquired taste..... Something can be genuinely great but never have mainstream appeal. FFXIV is also more cultural in its implementation than any other mmo, other than FFXI.
The games like "Ico" and "Shadow of the Collossus" were artistic master pieces and yet no one played them. The movie "No county for old men" won best picture and no body in the mainstream even saw it.
People need to get over themselves. They need to understand that some games are just different. People who don't know any better mistake "different" for "bad."
FFXI was the same way. It existed before Wow, during, and continues to exist. 80% of the MMO community said how horrible it was and how they couldn't understand why people even played it. The complained about the UI, the sluggishness, the combat, the fact that it was a PS2 port, etc etc. That didn't stop it from being one of the best MMO's of all time (objectively speaking).
FFXIV is the same way. Some people just absolutely love it for what it has to offer. Amazing music, deep story, deep crafting, great dialogue, immersion, and old school feel, freedom of making hybrid classes, etc etc. And no, it doesn't mean you have to agree that FFXIV offers that, but only understand that it offers that to other people.
Most of you just plain focus on the UI and can't look past it. The UI is old, but for many many many many of us, it just doesn't even matter and unlike you, we realize it is a compromise for the PS3... it is what it is because it has to reacha balance between ps3 users and pc users. If that doesn't sit well with you, just move on, like an adult.
We have faith in SE becuase of their track record with FFXI. In FFXI we got constant content updates for free. We got stable servers and virtually no lag. We know FFXIV will be the same way. As for content in FFXIV, it has more than FFXI did when it came out in Japan in 2002. It has more content then did WoW, or any other mmo that came out. People are expecting to slay dragons at lvl 10, when they never did that in any other mmo.
For those fo you that hate this game, just move on. Leave these forums for those of us who can use it more constructively. So that we can ask and provide help. So that we can share our great experiences. So that we can post our guides. Get over yourselves and accept the fact that there are people who genuinely like this game. We're not pretending. We really really like this game and it shouldnt matter to you or to us whether someone else shares that like/dislike.
I honestly don't see what the redeeming value of constantly bashing a game you don't intend on playing. Let the game get released. Let credible sources actually REVIEW the RELEASED GAME. NOT review and BETA of an INCOMPLETE GAME. so that way, people who are sincerely on the fence can get an objective review to make the decision for themselves. Bashing a game like this just makes you look bad.
As for this Spoony guy, I havn't seen his video... but it's not a review.. it can't be... it's just a very shallow preview. Take it for what it's worth.....nothing.
Next goes the system of limiting the amount of grinding a person does. No matter how many cool videos the fans will produce the system does seem to be limiting the players choices. For example : if a player wants to be a 100% gladiator he will be limited in his freedom of making one because of exp. limits set by SE and he will progress slower in achieving his goal then those who will mix their classes, thus mixing classes becomes a mandatory thing. Considering the fact that the player will have to pay a montlhy fee this can be seen as a flaw.
Im sorry but ffxiv wants you to be more than one class, it bases your development on that fact, if you 100% gladiator, i dont want you in my party, ever, because your a GIMP
And think back to ffxi, remember how long it took to find a party? Esp if you started in 06 or 07? Because everyone was already maxed out, now i wont have that issue will i? There will be someone or other people at the same level that will party with me.
On top of that, why would SE want a community that wil get to level 50 in 2 weeks and quit because they outplayed the game?
Then I would like to adress the issue of the Open Beta. While it's main objective was to stress the servers. It would seem logical for SE to show some contet that could potentially intrigue and thus get new subscribers who got into the beta just to check the game out ( and there was a considerable amount of those people, like in every other mmo there is). Instead SE showed a small, a very small glimple of the story, some crafting and very-very generic levequests. While it does seem ( as we can see in this form) that such a move created some followers that are now hooked up and will play the game it also made a ton of people to turn away from the game ( once again, as seen in this and other forums).
Again, why would SE do this? They dont want you to burn out in the beta, when retail comes, we get all of the story, all the quests, all the crafts ect. Tell me one game that was a RPG that did not start out slow with a MEH story?
The point of the open beta was to stress the servers and find bugs, thats what all betas are for, always. thats why they call it a beta TEST
God bless America a nation who knows how to make great games.
Whoops, wrong forum. Here you go, buddy. Shoot, posting that here, somebody'd think you were just trolling us or something, but hey, mistakes happen.
Originally posted by Hrayr2148
FFXIV is an acquired taste..... Something can be genuinely great but never have mainstream appeal. FFXIV is also more cultural in its implementation than any other mmo, other than FFXI.
The games like "Ico" and "Shadow of the Collossus" were artistic master pieces and yet no one played them. The movie "No county for old men" won best picture and no body in the mainstream even saw it.
People need to get over themselves. They need to understand that some games are just different. People who don't know any better mistake "different" for "bad."
FFXI was the same way. It existed before Wow, during, and continues to exist. 80% of the MMO community said how horrible it was and how they couldn't understand why people even played it. The complained about the UI, the sluggishness, the combat, the fact that it was a PS2 port, etc etc. That didn't stop it from being one of the best MMO's of all time (objectively speaking).
FFXIV is the same way. Some people just absolutely love it for what it has to offer. Amazing music, deep story, deep crafting, great dialogue, immersion, and old school feel, freedom of making hybrid classes, etc etc. And no, it doesn't mean you have to agree that FFXIV offers that, but only understand that it offers that to other people.
Most of you just plain focus on the UI and can't look past it. The UI is old, but for many many many many of us, it just doesn't even matter and unlike you, we realize it is a compromise for the PS3... it is what it is because it has to reacha balance between ps3 users and pc users. If that doesn't sit well with you, just move on, like an adult.
We have faith in SE becuase of their track record with FFXI. In FFXI we got constant content updates for free. We got stable servers and virtually no lag. We know FFXIV will be the same way. As for content in FFXIV, it has more than FFXI did when it came out in Japan in 2002. It has more content then did WoW, or any other mmo that came out. People are expecting to slay dragons at lvl 10, when they never did that in any other mmo.
For those fo you that hate this game, just move on. Leave these forums for those of us who can use it more constructively. So that we can ask and provide help. So that we can share our great experiences. So that we can post our guides. Get over yourselves and accept the fact that there are people who genuinely like this game. We're not pretending. We really really like this game and it shouldnt matter to you or to us whether someone else shares that like/dislike.
I honestly don't see what the redeeming value of constantly bashing a game you don't intend on playing. Let the game get released. Let credible sources actually REVIEW the RELEASED GAME. NOT review and BETA of an INCOMPLETE GAME. so that way, people who are sincerely on the fence can get an objective review to make the decision for themselves. Bashing a game like this just makes you look bad.
As for this Spoony guy, I havn't seen his video... but it's not a review.. it can't be... it's just a very shallow preview. Take it for what it's worth.....nothing.
Hear, hear. I agree on all points.
FFXIV isn't for everyone, but this does not diminish it is a great game.
There's a number of great masterpieces throughout the age that were nonetheless not all that popular.
There's been a lot of mistaking "different" for "bad" around here, and that's just a travesty.
We've already seen this kind of rejection of FFXI, and it actually ended up doing very well - in fact, even better than the most similar MMORPGs before it.
FFXIV will likely follow suit.
I really can't sympathise with people who can't see a gamepad-friendly UI as being well designed - it's harder to design a gamepad UI than it is a point and click one.
Square-Enix is not new to MMORPGs, their previous one was excellent, we've every reason to believe they'll continue the trend.
People who want this game to be something else should move on, that's not going to change, and you're just annoying those of us who do like it for what it is.
The game should not be judged in beta, heck the beta client is about 1/3rd the size of the footprint reported in the system requirements (15gb install + 6gb download versus ~8.5gb beta client). Furhermore, it will continue to be improved!
(Well, okay, a minor quibble about that Spoonyguy thing at the end since because you haven't seen the video. I have seen his video, it's not much other than overexaggeratory comedy relief, which you can see in the rest of his work is essentially what he does for his one man Internet show.)
God bless America a nation who knows how to make great games.
and these "great games" would be.....? (readies notepad of bewilderment)
America a nation who really knows how to make mindless drivel.
see to me that 2nd one sounds more accurate.
Ok when it comes to MMOs America hasn't made any good games since the era of Ultima Online and the first EverQuest but GuildWars 2 seems to be really good and it's being made by Americans.
All those memories will be lost in time, like tears in the rain.
Funny how the best MMORPGs ever made are the ones you've yet to play. The MMORPG.com hype meter reflects this constantly.
Now, it's not that Guild Wars 2 couldn't be rather nice, but honestly I don't consider it to be in the same genre as Final Fantasy XIV. Heck, the original Guild Wars can only charitably be called an MMORPG, even the developers themselves agree that the highly instanced nature makes that rather sketchy.
Funny how the best MMORPGs ever made are the ones you've yet to play. The MMORPG.com hype meter reflects this constantly.
Or the ones that YOU have yet to play.
I know that you have a dream of playing a midget in a pajamas but can't you just come to your senses and realize thanJapanese games are best left to the Japanese.
Addressing your edited post: Ah but GuildWars 2 is a fullblown MMORPG and no more instanced than that game from Blizzard which should not be named and no monthly fee... yes thats right.
All those memories will be lost in time, like tears in the rain.
Funny how the best MMORPGs ever made are the ones you've yet to play. The MMORPG.com hype meter reflects this constantly.
Or the ones that YOU have yet to play.
I know that you have a dream of playing a midget in a pajamas but can't you just come to your senses and realize that Japanese games are best left to the Japanese.
Anywho, if you're dead set on lambasting Japanese games as being inferior products, you're just making yourself look like a rube. They're up there on a list of all time best games, quite comfortably with the big boys. They play more video games per capita than anyone else outside of perhaps South Korea. If you don't like their interfaces, you're just quibbling over cultural differences.
In any case, I imagine Guild Wars 2 will diminish considerably in hype once enough people play it to realize reality doesn't match their wildest dreams. Final Fantasy XIV will likely slowly creep up the hype meter over the coming years as more and more people actually have computers capable of running it comfortably.
Funny how the best MMORPGs ever made are the ones you've yet to play. The MMORPG.com hype meter reflects this constantly.
Or the ones that YOU have yet to play.
I know that you have a dream of playing a midget in a pajamas but can't you just come to your senses and realize that Japanese games are best left to the Japanese.
Not everyone is so xenophobic, in fact millions of people around the world love the series so you are just trolling. Final Fantasy is not based on Japanese culture either, it draws influence from Western fantasy/history much more than it does Japan's. Also most RPG's have a midget race it isn't really a "Japanese" thing.
So you don't enjoy Japanese video games? Wow that's great but you are clearly in the minority in the world and the history of gaming.
Pretty much how I feel and the funny thing is the cities are also dead in the beta.
Looks like a common guy screaming at his mic. I dont know if the review is good or not becouse I haven't tried the game, but he loose all the credibility I can give to a reviewer the first time he screams. Looks like a childs tv show.
Funny how the best MMORPGs ever made are the ones you've yet to play. The MMORPG.com hype meter reflects this constantly.
Or the ones that YOU have yet to play.
I know that you have a dream of playing a midget in a pajamas but can't you just come to your senses and realize that Japanese games are best left to the Japanese.
Not everyone is so xenophobic, in fact millions of people around the world love the series so you are just trolling. Final Fantasy is not based on Japanese culture either, it draws influence from Western fantasy/history much more than it does Japan's. Also most RPG's have a midget race it isn't really a "Japanese" thing.
So you don't enjoy Japanese video games? Wow that's great but you are clearly in the minority in the world and the history of gaming.
Have people forgotten about Nintendo/Famicom and how it pretty much saved the gaming industry? Pretty goddamn sure that was Japanese.
I wouldn't even give Xsyon or Mortal Online such review. Each game has its flaws and he has no right to call girly screaming and fanboy reviewing of complete another game in his video a real game "review". That Spoony has no selfrespect whatsoever and he is by far the shittiest reviewer I've seen.
"Only in quiet waters do things mirror themselves undistorted. Only in a quiet mind is adequate perception of the world." Hans Margolius
I do not think SE had the western market in mind when creating this game. Clearly it is a poorly ported game meant to be played on a console. SE can say that the game is being made with the PC in mind all they want, but the beta says otherwise. From the UI to the controls - this game was meant to be played with a controller. If you like playing with a controller this game is right up your alley. If you prefer playing this game with a keyboard and mouse - forget it. It is a gorgeous game though, no denying that.
I do not think SE had the western market in mind when creating this game. Clearly it is a poorly ported game meant to be played on a console. SE can say that the game is being made with the PC in mind all they want, but the beta says otherwise. From the UI to the controls - this game was meant to be played with a controller. If you like playing with a controller this game is right up your alley. If you prefer playing this game with a keyboard and mouse - forget it. It is a gorgeous game though, no denying that.
Less than half of the people playing FFXIV are playing with a controller. I'm sorry about whatever your issue with the controls is, but most people are playing with keyboard, or keyboard+mouse and not having a problem with it.
Here let me make things easier and save people time. It's an MMO. It's full of anime weaboos and is built by the same company that made a 20 hour boss battle. Square is as bad as SOE with customer service.
Ahhhh wrong.
See this is why there are some who are persistent in squashing BS that has long since been proven bogus. Because there are those who will continue to parrot it as though it were fact.
SE never made a 20 hour boss battle. They made a boss battle that a large group of people spent 18 hours on because they didn't have the common sense to realize they were doing something wrong or stop sooner. Instead, they kept plugging away at it.
The only change SE made to Pandemonium Warden - the fight you're referring to - was to make it auto-despawn after 2 hours. Yes... 2. Not 20. SE had to put a virtual baby-sitter on that fight because, clearly, some people playing their game didn't possess enough sense or personal responsibility to know when to stop by themselves.
Guess what?
The first group to take it down did so in 1 hour and 55 minutes.
It's not SE's responsibility that a group of gamers didn't have the common-sense to call it quits long before any of them started "feeling sick". But yet, it's compltely typical of the "no accountability", "it's always someone else's fault" mindset so many possess these days to blame it on them anyway.
They went to the fight, they were clearly doing something very wrong and none of them stopped to think "gee, maybe we're just not doing this right?". Of course not, because in the conceit of gamers who seem to assume they're "always" doing something right, the only "logical conclusion" (to them) is that SE had made a boss that took 18+ hours to defeat. And so the blame-fest began.
Just as they claimed that Absolute Virtue is impossible simply because they couldn't conceive the fact that they simply hadn't figured him out yet. It couldn't be that they were doing something wrong.. No no no.. SE simply made him "impossible to beat".
As for Spoony... He has openly admitted in previous vids that he loves bashing the FF series purely to get under its fans' collective skin. Yes... he's essentially trolling in video form. Otherwise, a large portion of his vids are satire... that's it. Some of it's definitely informational, some of it's even entertaining (his review of The Thing is quite funny, IMO, having played it myself). But he definitely is a bit full of himself, places his own opinions in very high regard and... well... enjoys getting a rise out of people.
From what I saw of the video and read about it otherwise... Seems he's just doing his thing.
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
I only got two pages into this thread. Give me a break there's nothing wrong with the review it's a harsh view on the game and from what we sall it's accurate. Even the melee class doing damage at the beginning seemed like he was bored as fuck doing damage to the mobs. As far as teh mobs looking like they gave a flying f he was also dead on there they we're sitting in place not doing a damn thing as far as i could tell. Why is the singleplayer final fantasy a better combat system than the mmo. it's /facegrenade./
I like to watch the various reviews pro or con, because I believe everyone has the right to be heard. The only aspect of this review that I felt was accurate was that SE could have picked a better 'showcase' for the expo. Beyond that, the ranting lost me. I did however watch the full review and nothing changed. Sure he 'signed up for 2 play sessions'. So what? How do we know what he did or did not do while waiting. For all we know (and after this video I tend to think) he was making excessive negative commentary while waiting and the booth folks turned him away.
The end result is that if people want to convince me of something, dropping 'F' bombs and rabid ranting isn't going to do it. Present your facts, state them clearly and openly and don't color with your personal opinions.
'Just the facts ma'am.' (Dragnet if anyone remembers it).
I do not think SE had the western market in mind when creating this game. Clearly it is a poorly ported game meant to be played on a console. SE can say that the game is being made with the PC in mind all they want, but the beta says otherwise. From the UI to the controls - this game was meant to be played with a controller. If you like playing with a controller this game is right up your alley. If you prefer playing this game with a keyboard and mouse - forget it. It is a gorgeous game though, no denying that.
I'm playing it just fine on PC, using keyboard only.
A friend of mine is playing it just fine with keyboard and mouse. I have as well.
I've also played with a gamepad.
Every single means was perfectly do-able, and none of them were difficult to figure out. Just a matter of remembering the keys/buttons - like in any game.
In fact... to me, the gamepad is the least ideal option simply because:
1. I have to put the gamepad down to type, then pick it back up.
- On keyboard only, my hands are already where they need to be and everything is within fingers' reach.
2. I have to manually move the cursor across my hotbar to get to each skill, then use it.
- On keyboard only, I have to press 1-0, Alt + 1-0 or Ctrl + 1-0; combat is easy.
3. I can rotate and manuever my character just as well with keyboard only as I can with gamepad... perhaps even better in some circumstances.
4. I can navigate my character using the movement keys with my left hand, turning corners, etc, and then open the menu, browse my inventory, review quests, etc... with my right hand. You can actually multi-task using keyboard only. Not so easy with gamepad.
And, no, I'm not "simply accepting whatever SE throws at me". I'm able to play XIV just as well as I can play any other game with its respective controls.
So... again, knowing that I'm playing the same Beta as everyone else, knowing that I'm playing the game in the same condition with everyone else, with the same lag as everyone else, etc.. and that I'm able to do all these things perfectly fine - and that there's certainly nothing "super-human" about me - I can't help but take it that people are expressing ill-informed opinions, are having knee-jerk reactions to something new, or are otherwise overstating the situation for the sake of making it sound worse than it is.
Mileage may vary, of course.
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
Comments
Heh. You're writing your own ROC now? You're funny.
... still doesn't make it theirs, you know
. However you spin it, mmorpg.com's definition of trolling still is this:
Posting excessive negative comments or baiting others to respond in a negative manner is considered trolling on the MMORPG.com forums.
For example: If there is one game that you did not enjoy, voicing your opinion is encouraged. Posting this opinion in every thread concerning that game to the point that it disrupts all other conversation is not tolerated.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
I did a level 10 leve last night with some friends and we came up on this flying baby looking thing. It saw us and ran into a cave that went pretty deep. When we turned a corner chasing it suddenly two wolves were summoned and the imp began casting. A meteor fell on our ranger one shotting him and the wolves jumped on our little Lalafell tank. We all died but that was the first time I thought, "wow this game could actually get exciting down the road." I don't believe leves are going to be the only thing carrying this game but they probably won't be a boring part either. So far I've noticed the leves are pretty random, even in their rewards.
I don't mean to sound like a fanboy or stir up any hate but I just wanted to point something out. I don't need something flashy with every detail laid out before me. I like to discover things, enjoy a challenge, and watch a good story unfold. I'm not saying FFXIV is guaranteed to have all of this but I certainly hope it will.
Imp leves (the evil babies) are your standard run of the mill Bronze (noob, starting, easiest level of difficulty) guildleves.
There were only a few Silver guildleves in the Open Beta and they were much harder, I also didn't see any of them below rank 20. Guess what comes after Silver?
Not to mention that most people in beta did not even touch faction leves which are exponentially more involving than mere battleleves.
Oh and then there is also class quests, city quests, faction quests (not the same as the faction guildleves), limit quests in the future, and a multitude of other quests, events, behests, NM's and more.
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From my past experience most MMO start out boring and get a lot more interesting as they build. I'd never judge a game based on it's tutorial. It either does one of two things. it blows you out of the water with it's "cool" factor or is boring as heck, neither are what is going to be happening in the next 40 hours that you play of the real game. Ones boring and the other will be a let down after you get into the game itself.
I didn't care for his so called review. First off he is way too emotional to give an honest review. Second he glossed over a lot of the details about the game and the things he did say were a plus was like he had to say that in order to stop people from saying hes not being fair (IE whiiiile the graphics are good). Also he puts a lot of stock into what the people do at pax regarding the drinks and interviews. If he was reviewing the pax fair that would be fine but hes reviewing the games. drinks and dev talks are not part of the game last time i checked, also the 30 min timer is not a plus in my opinion, 15 mins and you know what the game is like, more then that and it's just stalling the line. if your the 6th person behind your 3 hours before you get your turn. if you got in at 12, your going to be playing the game at 3:00. I could get in 4 other games in the time it took me to get to that one game.
Of course this is just my opinion but if he was a great reviewer i wouldn't have stopped out of sheer cringe value about 1/3 through. Something about him just bashing a game into the ground making it sound like the worse thing ever puts me off.
While i don't think FF14 is the best game ever it is playable and enjoyable. somethings need to be fixed (mouse and general lag)but it is still enjoyable. I played GW1 for about 4 hours and stopped, just lost interest. I'll wait till i see what GW2 is like before i pick up a copy myself. i'd prefer to see for myself and not let others tell me what a great game it is.
Help me Bioware, you're my only hope.
Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
I will tell you, I don't like Spoony, I never liked his review etc, but I've got to admit he seemed to nail that one on the spot.
Seriously guys. Look :
1. During the close beta the problems with the mouse and the UI and other stuff was there. Yes? Well yes it seems so.
2. Between the Closed Beta and the Open beta and during the time of the Closed beta they didn't change any of those problems.
3. They didn't seem to change anything major during the Open Beta either.
Well aside from making those big promises that the final version which will be out a week from now will have eveyrhing fixed etc.
Aside from that SE told us that this game is ment to be casual-friendly. So far the UI seems to be to complex to fit into the "casual" category, the absence of any indicators that would point out to whom we should talk and who to ignore does not favor in this "casual friendly" list either. The crafitng isn't all that casual too ( which isn't a bad thing, since it brings some fresh air to crafting professions in mmo). But overall unless SE has a different term for casual-friendly somewhere up in their headquarters in Japan, they do not seem to deliver thir promiss at the moment.
Next goes the system of limiting the amount of grinding a person does. No matter how many cool videos the fans will produce the system does seem to be limiting the players choices. For example : if a player wants to be a 100% gladiator he will be limited in his freedom of making one because of exp. limits set by SE and he will progress slower in achieving his goal then those who will mix their classes, thus mixing classes becomes a mandatory thing. Considering the fact that the player will have to pay a montlhy fee this can be seen as a flaw.
Then I would like to adress the issue of the Open Beta. While it's main objective was to stress the servers. It would seem logical for SE to show some contet that could potentially intrigue and thus get new subscribers who got into the beta just to check the game out ( and there was a considerable amount of those people, like in every other mmo there is). Instead SE showed a small, a very small glimple of the story, some crafting and very-very generic levequests. While it does seem ( as we can see in this form) that such a move created some followers that are now hooked up and will play the game it also made a ton of people to turn away from the game ( once again, as seen in this and other forums).
Naturally I'm not an oracle to fortell the future and see if the promisses that SE made will be there on day 1 of the game, and will there be any major improvements during the first couple of month so I won't make any predictions if the game will fail or get a major succes, but mr. Spoony did have a point, and as you can see there ARE people that think like him, so such an opinion have the same perfect right for exictense as the positive ones.
And P.S. Fan, unless the promisses that the developer made are already set in stone and can be shown, it is NOT a strong argument to counter the arguments of the trolls of this form, because you basicly talking about something that you did not see and did not try and don't even know if it really exists aside the world of promisses from the developer. Don't be childish and just wait till release date, otherwise this fanboy-troll battle starts to be a mess.
And for the trolls -> ok we heard the complaing a million times, thats more then enough, wait till the official release and see what's it going to be like. Seriously you're like an old women fighing in the grosery store.
FFXIV is an acquired taste..... Something can be genuinely great but never have mainstream appeal. FFXIV is also more cultural in its implementation than any other mmo, other than FFXI.
The games like "Ico" and "Shadow of the Collossus" were artistic master pieces and yet no one played them. The movie "No county for old men" won best picture and no body in the mainstream even saw it.
People need to get over themselves. They need to understand that some games are just different. People who don't know any better mistake "different" for "bad."
FFXI was the same way. It existed before Wow, during, and continues to exist. 80% of the MMO community said how horrible it was and how they couldn't understand why people even played it. The complained about the UI, the sluggishness, the combat, the fact that it was a PS2 port, etc etc. That didn't stop it from being one of the best MMO's of all time (objectively speaking).
FFXIV is the same way. Some people just absolutely love it for what it has to offer. Amazing music, deep story, deep crafting, great dialogue, immersion, and old school feel, freedom of making hybrid classes, etc etc. And no, it doesn't mean you have to agree that FFXIV offers that, but only understand that it offers that to other people.
Most of you just plain focus on the UI and can't look past it. The UI is old, but for many many many many of us, it just doesn't even matter and unlike you, we realize it is a compromise for the PS3... it is what it is because it has to reacha balance between ps3 users and pc users. If that doesn't sit well with you, just move on, like an adult.
We have faith in SE becuase of their track record with FFXI. In FFXI we got constant content updates for free. We got stable servers and virtually no lag. We know FFXIV will be the same way. As for content in FFXIV, it has more than FFXI did when it came out in Japan in 2002. It has more content then did WoW, or any other mmo that came out. People are expecting to slay dragons at lvl 10, when they never did that in any other mmo.
For those fo you that hate this game, just move on. Leave these forums for those of us who can use it more constructively. So that we can ask and provide help. So that we can share our great experiences. So that we can post our guides. Get over yourselves and accept the fact that there are people who genuinely like this game. We're not pretending. We really really like this game and it shouldnt matter to you or to us whether someone else shares that like/dislike.
I honestly don't see what the redeeming value of constantly bashing a game you don't intend on playing. Let the game get released. Let credible sources actually REVIEW the RELEASED GAME. NOT review and BETA of an INCOMPLETE GAME. so that way, people who are sincerely on the fence can get an objective review to make the decision for themselves. Bashing a game like this just makes you look bad.
As for this Spoony guy, I havn't seen his video... but it's not a review.. it can't be... it's just a very shallow preview. Take it for what it's worth.....nothing.
GuildWars 2 yeeeeaaaah!
God bless America a nation who knows how to make great games.
All those memories will be lost in time, like tears in the rain.
Whoops, wrong forum. Here you go, buddy. Shoot, posting that here, somebody'd think you were just trolling us or something, but hey, mistakes happen.
Hear, hear. I agree on all points.
FFXIV isn't for everyone, but this does not diminish it is a great game.
There's a number of great masterpieces throughout the age that were nonetheless not all that popular.
There's been a lot of mistaking "different" for "bad" around here, and that's just a travesty.
We've already seen this kind of rejection of FFXI, and it actually ended up doing very well - in fact, even better than the most similar MMORPGs before it.
FFXIV will likely follow suit.
I really can't sympathise with people who can't see a gamepad-friendly UI as being well designed - it's harder to design a gamepad UI than it is a point and click one.
Square-Enix is not new to MMORPGs, their previous one was excellent, we've every reason to believe they'll continue the trend.
People who want this game to be something else should move on, that's not going to change, and you're just annoying those of us who do like it for what it is.
The game should not be judged in beta, heck the beta client is about 1/3rd the size of the footprint reported in the system requirements (15gb install + 6gb download versus ~8.5gb beta client). Furhermore, it will continue to be improved!
(Well, okay, a minor quibble about that Spoonyguy thing at the end since because you haven't seen the video. I have seen his video, it's not much other than overexaggeratory comedy relief, which you can see in the rest of his work is essentially what he does for his one man Internet show.)
and these "great games" would be.....? (readies notepad of bewilderment)
America a nation who really knows how to make mindless drivel.
see to me that 2nd one sounds more accurate.
Ok when it comes to MMOs America hasn't made any good games since the era of Ultima Online and the first EverQuest but GuildWars 2 seems to be really good and it's being made by Americans.
All those memories will be lost in time, like tears in the rain.
Funny how the best MMORPGs ever made are the ones you've yet to play. The MMORPG.com hype meter reflects this constantly.
Now, it's not that Guild Wars 2 couldn't be rather nice, but honestly I don't consider it to be in the same genre as Final Fantasy XIV. Heck, the original Guild Wars can only charitably be called an MMORPG, even the developers themselves agree that the highly instanced nature makes that rather sketchy.
Or the ones that YOU have yet to play.
I know that you have a dream of playing a midget in a pajamas but can't you just come to your senses and realize thanJapanese games are best left to the Japanese.
Addressing your edited post: Ah but GuildWars 2 is a fullblown MMORPG and no more instanced than that game from Blizzard which should not be named and no monthly fee... yes thats right.
All those memories will be lost in time, like tears in the rain.
Nonsense. If I was intending to play a midget in pajamas, its not like I couldn't do that in Guild Wars 2 as well.
Anywho, if you're dead set on lambasting Japanese games as being inferior products, you're just making yourself look like a rube. They're up there on a list of all time best games, quite comfortably with the big boys. They play more video games per capita than anyone else outside of perhaps South Korea. If you don't like their interfaces, you're just quibbling over cultural differences.
In any case, I imagine Guild Wars 2 will diminish considerably in hype once enough people play it to realize reality doesn't match their wildest dreams. Final Fantasy XIV will likely slowly creep up the hype meter over the coming years as more and more people actually have computers capable of running it comfortably.
Not everyone is so xenophobic, in fact millions of people around the world love the series so you are just trolling. Final Fantasy is not based on Japanese culture either, it draws influence from Western fantasy/history much more than it does Japan's. Also most RPG's have a midget race it isn't really a "Japanese" thing.
So you don't enjoy Japanese video games? Wow that's great but you are clearly in the minority in the world and the history of gaming.
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Looks like a common guy screaming at his mic. I dont know if the review is good or not becouse I haven't tried the game, but he loose all the credibility I can give to a reviewer the first time he screams. Looks like a childs tv show.
Have people forgotten about Nintendo/Famicom and how it pretty much saved the gaming industry? Pretty goddamn sure that was Japanese.
Amazing spoony video..and true also..
I wouldn't even give Xsyon or Mortal Online such review. Each game has its flaws and he has no right to call girly screaming and fanboy reviewing of complete another game in his video a real game "review". That Spoony has no selfrespect whatsoever and he is by far the shittiest reviewer I've seen.
"Only in quiet waters do things mirror themselves undistorted.
Only in a quiet mind is adequate perception of the world."
Hans Margolius
I do not think SE had the western market in mind when creating this game. Clearly it is a poorly ported game meant to be played on a console. SE can say that the game is being made with the PC in mind all they want, but the beta says otherwise. From the UI to the controls - this game was meant to be played with a controller. If you like playing with a controller this game is right up your alley. If you prefer playing this game with a keyboard and mouse - forget it. It is a gorgeous game though, no denying that.
Less than half of the people playing FFXIV are playing with a controller. I'm sorry about whatever your issue with the controls is, but most people are playing with keyboard, or keyboard+mouse and not having a problem with it.
http://xivpads.com/?1595680
http://guildwork.com/users/murugan
Ahhhh wrong.
See this is why there are some who are persistent in squashing BS that has long since been proven bogus. Because there are those who will continue to parrot it as though it were fact.
SE never made a 20 hour boss battle. They made a boss battle that a large group of people spent 18 hours on because they didn't have the common sense to realize they were doing something wrong or stop sooner. Instead, they kept plugging away at it.
The only change SE made to Pandemonium Warden - the fight you're referring to - was to make it auto-despawn after 2 hours. Yes... 2. Not 20. SE had to put a virtual baby-sitter on that fight because, clearly, some people playing their game didn't possess enough sense or personal responsibility to know when to stop by themselves.
Guess what?
The first group to take it down did so in 1 hour and 55 minutes.
It's not SE's responsibility that a group of gamers didn't have the common-sense to call it quits long before any of them started "feeling sick". But yet, it's compltely typical of the "no accountability", "it's always someone else's fault" mindset so many possess these days to blame it on them anyway.
They went to the fight, they were clearly doing something very wrong and none of them stopped to think "gee, maybe we're just not doing this right?". Of course not, because in the conceit of gamers who seem to assume they're "always" doing something right, the only "logical conclusion" (to them) is that SE had made a boss that took 18+ hours to defeat. And so the blame-fest began.
Just as they claimed that Absolute Virtue is impossible simply because they couldn't conceive the fact that they simply hadn't figured him out yet. It couldn't be that they were doing something wrong.. No no no.. SE simply made him "impossible to beat".
As for Spoony... He has openly admitted in previous vids that he loves bashing the FF series purely to get under its fans' collective skin. Yes... he's essentially trolling in video form. Otherwise, a large portion of his vids are satire... that's it. Some of it's definitely informational, some of it's even entertaining (his review of The Thing is quite funny, IMO, having played it myself). But he definitely is a bit full of himself, places his own opinions in very high regard and... well... enjoys getting a rise out of people.
From what I saw of the video and read about it otherwise... Seems he's just doing his thing.
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
I only got two pages into this thread. Give me a break there's nothing wrong with the review it's a harsh view on the game and from what we sall it's accurate. Even the melee class doing damage at the beginning seemed like he was bored as fuck doing damage to the mobs. As far as teh mobs looking like they gave a flying f he was also dead on there they we're sitting in place not doing a damn thing as far as i could tell. Why is the singleplayer final fantasy a better combat system than the mmo. it's /facegrenade./
I like to watch the various reviews pro or con, because I believe everyone has the right to be heard. The only aspect of this review that I felt was accurate was that SE could have picked a better 'showcase' for the expo. Beyond that, the ranting lost me. I did however watch the full review and nothing changed. Sure he 'signed up for 2 play sessions'. So what? How do we know what he did or did not do while waiting. For all we know (and after this video I tend to think) he was making excessive negative commentary while waiting and the booth folks turned him away.
The end result is that if people want to convince me of something, dropping 'F' bombs and rabid ranting isn't going to do it. Present your facts, state them clearly and openly and don't color with your personal opinions.
'Just the facts ma'am.' (Dragnet if anyone remembers it).
I'm playing it just fine on PC, using keyboard only.
A friend of mine is playing it just fine with keyboard and mouse. I have as well.
I've also played with a gamepad.
Every single means was perfectly do-able, and none of them were difficult to figure out. Just a matter of remembering the keys/buttons - like in any game.
In fact... to me, the gamepad is the least ideal option simply because:
1. I have to put the gamepad down to type, then pick it back up.
- On keyboard only, my hands are already where they need to be and everything is within fingers' reach.
2. I have to manually move the cursor across my hotbar to get to each skill, then use it.
- On keyboard only, I have to press 1-0, Alt + 1-0 or Ctrl + 1-0; combat is easy.
3. I can rotate and manuever my character just as well with keyboard only as I can with gamepad... perhaps even better in some circumstances.
4. I can navigate my character using the movement keys with my left hand, turning corners, etc, and then open the menu, browse my inventory, review quests, etc... with my right hand. You can actually multi-task using keyboard only. Not so easy with gamepad.
And, no, I'm not "simply accepting whatever SE throws at me". I'm able to play XIV just as well as I can play any other game with its respective controls.
So... again, knowing that I'm playing the same Beta as everyone else, knowing that I'm playing the game in the same condition with everyone else, with the same lag as everyone else, etc.. and that I'm able to do all these things perfectly fine - and that there's certainly nothing "super-human" about me - I can't help but take it that people are expressing ill-informed opinions, are having knee-jerk reactions to something new, or are otherwise overstating the situation for the sake of making it sound worse than it is.
Mileage may vary, of course.
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops