SE are making you pay for essentially what is a beta game
but they are marketting it as the finished product
this isnt the finished product
people are saying on this forums and other review sites,
this game is pretty awful.
>>>>> That's exactly what they are doing. People payed the box price for a game the CEO admitted was crap. ( using sugar coated words of course ).
>>>>> That's exactly what they did. They pounded the japan market with adverts and package deals and sold a collectors edition for a lot of money that contained a game that was reviewed on a lot of sites in the 30%-40% range and flat out called a broken and unfinished product.
>>>>> An MMO at release is expected to have a certain amount of gameplay up to the current level cap. This game certainly didn't have that content at release.
>>>>> Yes they do.
"I'm not cheap I'm incredibly subconsciously financially optimized" "The worst part of censorship is ------------------"
Check back year from now and if its still alive it might compare to FFXI of today as a product
I think that people have gotten so used to sub par releases that they forgot what "no MMO is ever finished" means. MMORPGs are not finished in a sense that the game is constantly evolving with new content, patches, expansions, balancing... stuff like that.
It's like SE released a graphic engine and added some basic gameplay fuctionality. Hell, CO had more content during alpha than FFXIV has now. The graphics are pretty sweet though.
Check back year from now and if its still alive it might compare to FFXI of today as a product
I think that people have gotten so used to sub par releases that they forgot what "no MMO is ever finished" means. MMORPGs are not finished in a sense that the game is constantly evolving with new content, patches, expansions, balancing... stuff like that.
It's like SE released a graphic engine and added some basic gameplay fuctionality. Hell, CO had more content during alpha than FFXIV has now. The graphics are pretty sweet though.
This.......An MMO is never finished but it needs to have the base game there at launch. This game does not.
Check back year from now and if its still alive it might compare to FFXI of today as a product
I think that people have gotten so used to sub par releases that they forgot what "no MMO is ever finished" means. MMORPGs are not finished in a sense that the game is constantly evolving with new content, patches, expansions, balancing... stuff like that.
It's like SE released a graphic engine and added some basic gameplay fuctionality. Hell, CO had more content during alpha than FFXIV has now. The graphics are pretty sweet though.
QFT.
When people pre-purchase games based on a few videos or a "beta", they tell the publishers and devs "We don't care about the quality of the game, we just want it!" Well to those who gotta have that brand new game the day it comes out... enjoy your $60 heaping piles of pre-purchased shit while lowering the bar for standards of what's expected in a finished product!
"There is only one thing of which I am certain, and that's nothing is certain."
Not sure how I can comment on this thread without being either a fanboy or a hater, so I'll try to be as broad as I am wide. Suffice it to say, many people will play the game regardless of the "Problems" with it because it's a perceived thing. Many people may not perceive these "issues" as "problems"
Many people may also be hopeful and play the game because there's promises of fixes on the way, or there are fixes on the way.
And many people just don't play the game because it's frustrating to them or unresponsive.
Regardless, the opinions of people on the forums shouldn't decide how or why you should enjoy the game. It should be a reference for you to fall back to when you need to when it comes time to draw your own conclusions.. After all, even SWG has hard core fans, even among new players.
~Miles "Tails" Prower out! Catch me if you can!
Come Join us at www.globalequestria.com - Meet other fans of My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic!
Not sure how I can comment on this thread without being either a fanboy or a hater, so I'll try to be as broad as I am wide. Suffice it to say, many people will play the game regardless of the "Problems" with it because it's a perceived thing. Many people may not perceive these "issues" as "problems"
Many people may also be hopeful and play the game because there's promises of fixes on the way, or there are fixes on the way.
And many people just don't play the game because it's frustrating to them or unresponsive.
Regardless, the opinions of people on the forums shouldn't decide how or why you should enjoy the game. It should be a reference for you to fall back to when you need to when it comes time to draw your own conclusions.. After all, even SWG has hard core fans, even among new players.
~Miles "Tails" Prower out! Catch me if you can!
And that is exactly why I always try the betas of every MMO I'm slightly interested in. The change between open beta to launch is almost non-existant. The game you experience in open beta is most likely going to be 99.99% the same experience at launch.
Honestly thought SE would surprise us with a nice update during open beta...you know, actually taking the suggestions and comments made on the beta boards seriously. But apparently, they were too busy "Debugging" the game....right, and I'm the King of Atlantis. They only started implementing serious changes when they realized their project, their job, their money was on the line. Arrogant SOBs needed this wake up call.
We had our monthly update a few days ago. Next one is in December and i just posted some info about NMs. NO, IT's NOT A BETA!
I still have not payed anything except the Box price.
The game is treated the same way FFXI was, reviewers are just copying each other and catering to the masses.
I remember vividly how reviewers called FFXI boring, too hard, grindfest, no solo play, no real PvP and overall a japanese game that does not appeal to the US audience. (Oh crap forgot the famous, "It's made for console so it must suck on PC" argument).
Guess they learned nothing and half of them are want to be Journalists anyways, desperately promoting their blogs and websites.
Try it for yourself and make up your own mind.
But wait, those things mostly were (and still are) true. Seems like SE is the group that failed to learn anything from the past.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
In response to your question, OP, is FFXIV in a finished state? Well, they have not actually started charging people for monthly fees yet. They've given current players two or three free months? I'd say that's a good indicator as to whether the company actually feels their product is complete or not.
Duely Noted and i agree totally to what your saying. 11 is nothing but a grindfest , boring at times and hard. SE should understatnd that you cant rely on everyone to get things done. It took me over a year to complete Chains of Promitha . With all the Shouling and begging and false promises. If it was for the level cap increase i wouldnt have completed this expansion. My honest opion is that if you wee to add simplistic game features like hot keys , simplifed map system, menu system, god awful macros, and those drama ass linkshells.
Hate to bring up the WoW comparison here, but I played WoW when it was first launched and multiple times afterwards. WoW at launch had multiple bugs, very little end-game, and several server crashes on a weekly basis. Yet here it stands today as the most successful and polished mmo in comparison to other sorry excuses for mmos that we have.
Did some of you FFXIV haters actually blindly and naively believe that SE was going to release an mmorpg with tremendous endgame content and the wealth of solo questing that you'd get from modern western games? My favorite quality about FFXI was being to jump into the game, get into a decent party, and then just camp mobs to gain some lvls before I had to leave. No need to worry about locating quest objectives, running around for an hour trying to find something or someone, or not being to find a group because everyone was too busy solo grinding for superfast questing xps. As far as I'm concerned, you can still party grind xp if you choose to do so with XIV.
I am not a fan of SE's levequest system at all, nor do I like having to repeat the same missions over and over again. However, I never intended to play FFXIV as a soloing game or one that would take me to the cap simply by quest-grinding. I do however, like the fact that I don't need to go through a long and frustrating series of solo grinding mushrooms and dying a million times to reach level 15 so that I can party at the Dunes and then die and lose my level and have to go back to grinding.
I think we should try and not judge this game so harshly and give SE some time to polish the game up and add more content. If they don't add fixes to the game in at least 3 months, then I would begin to harshly criticizes SE's game plan here. Also, for those of you who are already bored with the game and finding nothing to do, do you guys not have anything to do other than video games? No jobs, school, social life, daily commitments? I mean I find it hard myself to find the time to dedicate daily playtime for 1 game, let alone 2 or more.
Hate to bring up the WoW comparison here, but I played WoW when it was first launched and multiple times afterwards. WoW at launch had multiple bugs, very little end-game, and several server crashes on a weekly basis. Yet here it stands today as the most successful and polished mmo in comparison to other sorry excuses for mmos that we have.
Yeah but at least it had an endgame and enough quests to get you to your 50s. WoW had molton core and Onyxia at 1.1.0. not to mention strath and blackrock spire. And while you usually did have to grind some in your 50s to cap out at least WoW spawned enough mobs that there was something to grind.
I have no doubt that FFXIV will eventually be a very good game, but as it stands now, it is still a very incomplete game. There simply isn't much to do. Its like that little boy that trys to jump into the pool and falls a full body length short right here Sure everybody cuts it close and has a few hiccups at release that need to be patched quickly. But they make it into the pool. SE fell way, way short. They didn't scrap their back on the edge of the pool. They landed a very noticable body length short of it. I think they did this because someone seriously misjudged what was needed to get into the water.
Intended or not, the game simply is not complete enough for release. even with the last update. They are making great improvements. They are doing all the things they need to be doing. But as for me, I will wait until the december update and check it then. This game needs a lot more to do. Sandbox games always need more than "just enough." Not everyone enjoys every activity. Thats why you need well more than enough, so people can go do what they feel like doing. And you need to let them know that it is out there.
Hate to bring up the WoW comparison here, but I played WoW when it was first launched and multiple times afterwards. WoW at launch had multiple bugs, very little end-game, and several server crashes on a weekly basis. Yet here it stands today as the most successful and polished mmo in comparison to other sorry excuses for mmos that we have.
Intended or not, the game simply is not complete enough for release. even with the last update. They are making great improvements. They are doing all the things they need to be doing. But as for me, I will wait until the december update and check it then. This game needs a lot more to do. Sandbox games always need more than "just enough." Not everyone enjoys every activity. Thats why you need well more than enough, so people can go do what they feel like doing. And you need to let them know that it is out there.
I do agree with everything that you mentioned. I feel that FFXIV can eventually become something more than simply the potential to be good. However, it really does need to have those improvements ironed out and in place quickly or the consumer base isn't going to stick around. Heck, the consumer base already isn't sticking around past the free trial.
In a way I already knew what to expect from this game before it was even released, which is why it doesn't surprise or bother me as much that they're not where they should be in terms of content. However, I also can see how others not familiar with FFXI or who expected something much more than XI, are extremely disappointed and disheartened by SE's lack of polish with the game.
Overall, I do think that this will eventually become what the people wanted it to be. I just hope it's not too late when it actually happens. It almost feels like it's being set up for the story of the mmo that launches with several annoying bugs, lack of content, missing features and/or broken promises, but then several months the game becomes what it should have been when it was launched. The problem then is that anyone who had any interest in that game is now long gone.
Hate to bring up the WoW comparison here, but I played WoW when it was first launched and multiple times afterwards. WoW at launch had multiple bugs, very little end-game, and several server crashes on a weekly basis. Yet here it stands today as the most successful and polished mmo in comparison to other sorry excuses for mmos that we have.
WoW actually had a pretty decent endgame at launch. LRBS, UBRS, Strat, Scholo and MC were all considered end-game instances and you could raid them all, if I remember correctly. People get confused and consider endgame content only if the bosses drop purples but forgot that you had to be decked out in all blues from the other instances in order to even attempt MC.
Comments
the game had it's beta phase before launch, it's just a fail game, just horrible
>>>>> That's exactly what they are doing. People payed the box price for a game the CEO admitted was crap. ( using sugar coated words of course ).
>>>>> That's exactly what they did. They pounded the japan market with adverts and package deals and sold a collectors edition for a lot of money that contained a game that was reviewed on a lot of sites in the 30%-40% range and flat out called a broken and unfinished product.
>>>>> An MMO at release is expected to have a certain amount of gameplay up to the current level cap. This game certainly didn't have that content at release.
>>>>> Yes they do.
"I'm not cheap I'm incredibly subconsciously financially optimized"
"The worst part of censorship is ------------------"
I think that people have gotten so used to sub par releases that they forgot what "no MMO is ever finished" means. MMORPGs are not finished in a sense that the game is constantly evolving with new content, patches, expansions, balancing... stuff like that.
It's like SE released a graphic engine and added some basic gameplay fuctionality. Hell, CO had more content during alpha than FFXIV has now. The graphics are pretty sweet though.
This.......An MMO is never finished but it needs to have the base game there at launch. This game does not.
QFT.
When people pre-purchase games based on a few videos or a "beta", they tell the publishers and devs "We don't care about the quality of the game, we just want it!" Well to those who gotta have that brand new game the day it comes out... enjoy your $60 heaping piles of pre-purchased shit while lowering the bar for standards of what's expected in a finished product!
"There is only one thing of which I am certain, and that's nothing is certain."
Not sure how I can comment on this thread without being either a fanboy or a hater, so I'll try to be as broad as I am wide. Suffice it to say, many people will play the game regardless of the "Problems" with it because it's a perceived thing. Many people may not perceive these "issues" as "problems"
Many people may also be hopeful and play the game because there's promises of fixes on the way, or there are fixes on the way.
And many people just don't play the game because it's frustrating to them or unresponsive.
Regardless, the opinions of people on the forums shouldn't decide how or why you should enjoy the game. It should be a reference for you to fall back to when you need to when it comes time to draw your own conclusions.. After all, even SWG has hard core fans, even among new players.
~Miles "Tails" Prower out! Catch me if you can!
Come Join us at www.globalequestria.com - Meet other fans of My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic!
If this was Protendo (for anyone thats seen code monkeys) theyd all have commited hara kiri by now.
But I like the game.
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And that is exactly why I always try the betas of every MMO I'm slightly interested in. The change between open beta to launch is almost non-existant. The game you experience in open beta is most likely going to be 99.99% the same experience at launch.
Honestly thought SE would surprise us with a nice update during open beta...you know, actually taking the suggestions and comments made on the beta boards seriously. But apparently, they were too busy "Debugging" the game....right, and I'm the King of Atlantis. They only started implementing serious changes when they realized their project, their job, their money was on the line. Arrogant SOBs needed this wake up call.
But wait, those things mostly were (and still are) true. Seems like SE is the group that failed to learn anything from the past.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
In response to your question, OP, is FFXIV in a finished state? Well, they have not actually started charging people for monthly fees yet. They've given current players two or three free months? I'd say that's a good indicator as to whether the company actually feels their product is complete or not.
Duely Noted and i agree totally to what your saying. 11 is nothing but a grindfest , boring at times and hard. SE should understatnd that you cant rely on everyone to get things done. It took me over a year to complete Chains of Promitha . With all the Shouling and begging and false promises. If it was for the level cap increase i wouldnt have completed this expansion. My honest opion is that if you wee to add simplistic game features like hot keys , simplifed map system, menu system, god awful macros, and those drama ass linkshells.
Edgar F Greenwood
Hate to bring up the WoW comparison here, but I played WoW when it was first launched and multiple times afterwards. WoW at launch had multiple bugs, very little end-game, and several server crashes on a weekly basis. Yet here it stands today as the most successful and polished mmo in comparison to other sorry excuses for mmos that we have.
Did some of you FFXIV haters actually blindly and naively believe that SE was going to release an mmorpg with tremendous endgame content and the wealth of solo questing that you'd get from modern western games? My favorite quality about FFXI was being to jump into the game, get into a decent party, and then just camp mobs to gain some lvls before I had to leave. No need to worry about locating quest objectives, running around for an hour trying to find something or someone, or not being to find a group because everyone was too busy solo grinding for superfast questing xps. As far as I'm concerned, you can still party grind xp if you choose to do so with XIV.
I am not a fan of SE's levequest system at all, nor do I like having to repeat the same missions over and over again. However, I never intended to play FFXIV as a soloing game or one that would take me to the cap simply by quest-grinding. I do however, like the fact that I don't need to go through a long and frustrating series of solo grinding mushrooms and dying a million times to reach level 15 so that I can party at the Dunes and then die and lose my level and have to go back to grinding.
I think we should try and not judge this game so harshly and give SE some time to polish the game up and add more content. If they don't add fixes to the game in at least 3 months, then I would begin to harshly criticizes SE's game plan here. Also, for those of you who are already bored with the game and finding nothing to do, do you guys not have anything to do other than video games? No jobs, school, social life, daily commitments? I mean I find it hard myself to find the time to dedicate daily playtime for 1 game, let alone 2 or more.
Yeah but at least it had an endgame and enough quests to get you to your 50s. WoW had molton core and Onyxia at 1.1.0. not to mention strath and blackrock spire. And while you usually did have to grind some in your 50s to cap out at least WoW spawned enough mobs that there was something to grind.
I have no doubt that FFXIV will eventually be a very good game, but as it stands now, it is still a very incomplete game. There simply isn't much to do. Its like that little boy that trys to jump into the pool and falls a full body length short right here Sure everybody cuts it close and has a few hiccups at release that need to be patched quickly. But they make it into the pool. SE fell way, way short. They didn't scrap their back on the edge of the pool. They landed a very noticable body length short of it. I think they did this because someone seriously misjudged what was needed to get into the water.
Intended or not, the game simply is not complete enough for release. even with the last update. They are making great improvements. They are doing all the things they need to be doing. But as for me, I will wait until the december update and check it then. This game needs a lot more to do. Sandbox games always need more than "just enough." Not everyone enjoys every activity. Thats why you need well more than enough, so people can go do what they feel like doing. And you need to let them know that it is out there.
All die, so die well.
I do agree with everything that you mentioned. I feel that FFXIV can eventually become something more than simply the potential to be good. However, it really does need to have those improvements ironed out and in place quickly or the consumer base isn't going to stick around. Heck, the consumer base already isn't sticking around past the free trial.
In a way I already knew what to expect from this game before it was even released, which is why it doesn't surprise or bother me as much that they're not where they should be in terms of content. However, I also can see how others not familiar with FFXI or who expected something much more than XI, are extremely disappointed and disheartened by SE's lack of polish with the game.
Overall, I do think that this will eventually become what the people wanted it to be. I just hope it's not too late when it actually happens. It almost feels like it's being set up for the story of the mmo that launches with several annoying bugs, lack of content, missing features and/or broken promises, but then several months the game becomes what it should have been when it was launched. The problem then is that anyone who had any interest in that game is now long gone.
WoW actually had a pretty decent endgame at launch. LRBS, UBRS, Strat, Scholo and MC were all considered end-game instances and you could raid them all, if I remember correctly. People get confused and consider endgame content only if the bosses drop purples but forgot that you had to be decked out in all blues from the other instances in order to even attempt MC.