I haven't finished this thing yet, but let me say--outstanding. Right now I'm about 16 minutes in; I've already scoured the videos, so the footage (at least with respect to the game world) isn't really new to me.
One grievance, so far: Where's her quiver? Between shots she reaches over her shoulder--which is spectacular and a necessary step toward realism--but at least what I'm seeing right now (around the 15-16 minute mark), I can't see a quiver. Now I don't expect ANet, for all their genius, to actually be able to animate someone drawing an arrow and loosing it in a way that would be consistent across a bunch of skills and in an open environment where other animation scripts are competing; but if you're going to draw, you need something to draw from. Are quivers equipment? That would make more sense, if there's an actual model for them, and she doesn't have one equipped. Anyway, just happened to notice.
The other thing I like is that the grind (grind isn't a swear word--grind is grind, neither good nor bad in itself) seems like a healthy mix between old school and new school; as someone who honestly preferred the camp-style leveling experience (e.g., EQ1 and FFXI) to the constant motion kill-ten-rats and return style (e.g., WOW), this is the closest thing I've seen to where I'd like to be. I can see myself and my friends showing up at that worm field and just making ourselves at home (depending, of course, on respawn rates and how soon we'd pass up the content, not to mention what conditions surround repeating dynamic events), but I can also see people jumping from each dynamic quest to the next in rapid succession.
try not to make this thread into a TOR vs GW2 thread please please.
Btw nice video link....i always wonder why arena net doesn't capture a sample gameplay video with software like fraps or something and share it with the world. I mean the video in this thread is good but it's still capture by a camera to a computer screen. Which imo distord the colour and looses detail level as well.
Below is a few handy trick to avoid getting into TOR vs GW2 argument in a thread or whatever offtopic we're trying to avoid.
-don't bring in comparison with TOR
-stop defending gw2 to trolling post Eg gw2 is gw with better graphic, gw2 is WAR+ffxiv
-if you want to criticize gw2 do so in a fact base and well research manner and not TOR have better story than GW2 because it's bioware (both game haven't came out and you guys are passing judgement on story plot? and because it's bioware? wow...if this is not call fanboism i don't know what is)
My problem with what i saw in the video is that the character movement and lip sync in cutscene is horrible and yes no quiver and arrow is lame. But frankly and realistically i don't expect them to change much for launch as imo what they show in the demo is the best of what they have to offer....expecting a miracle fix to all the flaw in the demo will be pure speculation and will overhype the game creating an expectation that will never be fulfill by arena net. So please refrain from saying that this is just a work in progress and i'm sure the final product will not have this problem. As from the way i see it arena net have more important issue to address to eg. getting all the dynamic event in the whole game world to work properly and churning out the class and balancing the gameplay etc etc.
After watching that video, the PVE looks great and the art/movement is awesome. I'm quite impressed with it, from what I see in that video, though I can't help but wonder...will melee characters be fodder in pve? Having to manage their own health might leave them having a bit of a time trying to not only be aware of their positioning and not take excessive damage, but pull out (and get away) when the hp gets low and the self heal is on recharge? Ranged dps seems like you'll have a much greater chance to survive an encounter rather than looking at it from the "downed" perspective and hoping to get back on your feet.
Furthermore, the skills are still just as terrible as they were when they first announced them. Half of your skills decided by your weapon. One more used for self heal. This leaves a choice of one elite (from 4-8 per class, iirc), and 3 utility skills. The difference between two of a class seems so much less than in GW. Look, a staff ele, just like the next staff ele. No split classes might be easier to balance, but it kills the customization that was a trademark of the original game. If you want a bar of crap, you can do it, perhaps that's what your guild needs you to run or maybe you're just bad. When developers try to develop away the players ability to fail or put together a crappy character, they push too far, and its excessive coddling. Perhaps frontline characters are fine with having a bar that's the same as the next bar, but midliners/backline (will there be a backline/frontline, or just gvg midliners?) might not need those weapon related skills, and want/could use different set ups.
The skills are where this game falls behind the original. Don't force me to take the skills the devs want to cover half my bar, leave the bar open to player choice, and dammit...put a healing class back in the game. Some of us like that, and further the gvg implications of not having a healer seem quite bad. I do think that not requiring a healer in many areas seems good, but as someone who has been a pvp player of many games since 2003, it sounds like crap.
All in all, I almost want to buy it, it's a very pretty game. If the skill set up wasn't so awful, I would. Just not worth the investment though, as it stands, even without a monthly fee.
1. Weapons allow different skills to be slotted: So characters can have access to melee and ranged damage. Traits/Utility will boost melee skills etc. Soldiers appear to be frontline professions.
2. http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/298180/The-Skill-Bar-Discussion.html for a look at the number of skills available. You can do the combinations possible and it's still impressive. It should be i) more possible for the devs to balance the skills ii) ensure that there is greater % of effective builds and less useless builds than in GW. Fewer but still a lot of builds possible it seems?
I don't think you can compare the type of story telling in ToR vs. GW2, ToR's story will be classic Bioware story, which is awesome to most people, while GW2's story doesn't seem quite as impressive. Furthermore, GW2's story is completely linear while ToR's story is branched so to speak and there's no way GW2 has as much VO as ToR (not sure if that's good or bad). In all honesty, making a dynamic world isn't that hard, I'm sorry but randomized content won't likely be as good nor as hard as making a full AAA mmo structured around 8 story lines that converge into a single universe.
Don't get me wrong, I'm anticipating both MMOs but I just don't think GW2 will be as great as some people make it out to be but we'll just have to wait and hope for the best.
I noticed that nobody caught this part.
Couple of things:
"GW2's story is completely linear."
Not true. Here is a post from A-Net:
Your story begins when you create a character. The choices you make at the beginning of the game - race, profession, and biographical details - set your character on a customized story track. But it doesn't end there - as you adventure, the decisions you make spin off into new storylines and new directions. Your character's story reflects your interest and your choices - no two players will have the same experience."
Also check out this link for an overview on Guild Wars 2's NON-Linear story.
Next:
"There's no way GW2 has as much VO as ToR"
And this is based on? Here is a post from A-Net:
Early on during Guild Wars 2 development, we discussed how much voice we wanted in the game. Everyone agreed that simply recording cinematics wasn’t enough, but how much would we need to immerse players in our world? We thought about the kinds of experiences we’d had in our favorite audio-heavy games like Grand Theft Auto IV, and we started paying attention to all the different ways that they employed voice-over to not only tell an engaging tale, but to literally surround you with sound. We talked about our planned content types, how we wanted to use audio in combat scenarios, and the different ways that we could both entertain and educate players about our world. We made a decision that, quite frankly, questioned our sanity.
We’re voicing the equivalent of more than 60 feature-length films.
another thing i notice dev talk about for their dynamic event is that if you decided to ignore the village being attack, the village may get destroyed opening new event to retake and rebuild it. This imo is what makes the dynamic event different from Warhammer online PQ. I can imagine if i start the game 6 month after the launch....the area around newbie area maybe very diff from what we see now in the demo due to destruction by the bandit, worms, centaur etc etc. This is what i read out of the dev statement but please correct me if i got it wrong.
1. Weapons allow different skills to be slotted: So characters can have access to melee and ranged damage. Traits/Utility will boost melee skills etc. Soldiers appear to be frontline professions.
2. http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/298180/The-Skill-Bar-Discussion.html for a look at the number of skills available. You can do the combinations possible and it's still impressive. It should be i) more possible for the devs to balance the skills ii) ensure that there is greater % of effective builds and less useless builds than in GW. Fewer but still a lot of builds possible it seems?
Overalll it's interesting to see what ArenaNet are trying to improve and if they will succeed? I think they have a good chance of doing so.
1. No, weapons come with different skills set by the weapon, they don not allow you to reset 5 skills to whatever you want each time you swap them out, just to whatever the weapon you're swapping to has available for you. Thus, every Joes Hammer will have the same skills as every other Joes Hammer, for example. If I want different skills, perhaps I'll switch to the Bow of Pokey Stick Flinging to enjoy the same 5 skills as every other person using the Bow of Pokey Stick Flinging. Boring. Thanks devs for deciding that, to use Joes Hammer I am required to fill half my bar with what you want instead of giving the choice to the player. It'll be lots of fun to be max level and realize that you rolled the wrong race for pvp, and have to reroll, too.
2. I've read that already. You and I both know that, much like GW1 (and every other online game) within a few months of release, many skills will be deemed not worth putting on the bar. The lack of customization of the bars in GW2 will only add to that. Bring the good skills, leave the mediocre or situational behind-you only have a few slots where you can pick and choose, don't waste them. It'll be lots of fun to be max level and realize that you rolled the wrong race for pvp and have to reroll, too (lets face it, all traits won't be created equal, and some will rise above the others. Top tier pvp will require top tier traits)
3. I've seen that too. The impression I got from it for pvp was "lure the other team into preprotting player A, then switch and spike player B into the ground". With the main heal being the one players use on themselves, which shouldn't be too tough to shutdown, frontliners are in serious jeopardy. Lure the prot elsewhere, then knock and burn the warrior. You're stuck in enemy lines and nobody has the skills to make the red bars go up significantly enough to counteract it.
I feel that I poorly conveyed my point, at least on #3. Regardless, I still think that several of the changes between 1 and 2 are major errors in judgement on behalf of the idiot in charge of the GW2 production. If they don't have a red bar filler on the back burner able to be patched in quickly, I don't see gvg or similar being nearly as competative as it has been in GW1. Which is a shame.
1. Weapons allow different skills to be slotted: So characters can have access to melee and ranged damage. Traits/Utility will boost melee skills etc. Soldiers appear to be frontline professions.
2. http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/298180/The-Skill-Bar-Discussion.html for a look at the number of skills available. You can do the combinations possible and it's still impressive. It should be i) more possible for the devs to balance the skills ii) ensure that there is greater % of effective builds and less useless builds than in GW. Fewer but still a lot of builds possible it seems?
Overalll it's interesting to see what ArenaNet are trying to improve and if they will succeed? I think they have a good chance of doing so.
1. No, weapons come with different skills set by the weapon, they don not allow you to reset 5 skills to whatever you want each time you swap them out, just to whatever the weapon you're swapping to has available for you. Thus, every Joes Hammer will have the same skills as every other Joes Hammer, for example. If I want different skills, perhaps I'll switch to the Bow of Pokey Stick Flinging to enjoy the same 5 skills as every other person using the Bow of Pokey Stick Flinging. Boring. Thanks devs for deciding that, to use Joes Hammer I am required to fill half my bar with what you want instead of giving the choice to the player. It'll be lots of fun to be max level and realize that you rolled the wrong race for pvp, and have to reroll, too.
2. I've read that already. You and I both know that, much like GW1 (and every other online game) within a few months of release, many skills will be deemed not worth putting on the bar. The lack of customization of the bars in GW2 will only add to that. Bring the good skills, leave the mediocre or situational behind-you only have a few slots where you can pick and choose, don't waste them. It'll be lots of fun to be max level and realize that you rolled the wrong race for pvp and have to reroll, too (lets face it, all traits won't be created equal, and some will rise above the others. Top tier pvp will require top tier traits)
3. I've seen that too. The impression I got from it for pvp was "lure the other team into preprotting player A, then switch and spike player B into the ground". With the main heal being the one players use on themselves, which shouldn't be too tough to shutdown, frontliners are in serious jeopardy. Lure the prot elsewhere, then knock and burn the warrior. You're stuck in enemy lines and nobody has the skills to make the red bars go up significantly enough to counteract it.
I feel that I poorly conveyed my point, at least on #3. Regardless, I still think that several of the changes between 1 and 2 are major errors in judgement on behalf of the idiot in charge of the GW2 production. If they don't have a red bar filler on the back burner able to be patched in quickly, I don't see gvg or similar being nearly as competative as it has been in GW1. Which is a shame.
You seem up to speed on the current info on gw2 combat - that's cool. : )
1. With weapons, I was suggesting that damage as a category is not split between classes that are either rdps or mdps but by x2 weapon choices in combat (x number out of combat) you can do either forms of damage with one or the other weapon and will have different damage effects also for each of the 5 skills per weapon: eg: std, aoe, dot etc etc... this compares favorably to another game's combat that I enjoyed eg WAR and is sooooo much more flexible - it's a relief! I did not play gw and so cannot compare to that game (probably just as well) As for frontline and team coordination I took a guess soldiers (x2) will easily fit that role due to heavy armour??
2. The skills are apparently considerably less than gw but then that might mean the balance is considerably better and that the total of good/bad builds is also considerably improved? For pvp (structured) levels are normalized and there is not enough info on the racial skills yet concerning what their effect will be? In fact racial skills may very well end up being redundant in pvp but spectacular in pve, I'd hazard thinking or just re-skins of existing skills. I think the weapons idea reminds me of weapons in FPS games, pull out the flame-thrower, or sniper etc and that's sorta appealing especially with the targetting and range estimated and movement of combat suggested as seen a little bit in the vids, too? ^ ^
3. Almost zero info on pvp so far, but I'm most optimistic about gw2 here than any other feature, considering some of the design ideas floated about in a few interviews move in a direction suggested by tf2, lol eg.
1. Weapons allow different skills to be slotted: So characters can have access to melee and ranged damage. Traits/Utility will boost melee skills etc. Soldiers appear to be frontline professions.
2. http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/298180/The-Skill-Bar-Discussion.html for a look at the number of skills available. You can do the combinations possible and it's still impressive. It should be i) more possible for the devs to balance the skills ii) ensure that there is greater % of effective builds and less useless builds than in GW. Fewer but still a lot of builds possible it seems?
Overalll it's interesting to see what ArenaNet are trying to improve and if they will succeed? I think they have a good chance of doing so.
1. No, weapons come with different skills set by the weapon, they don not allow you to reset 5 skills to whatever you want each time you swap them out, just to whatever the weapon you're swapping to has available for you. Thus, every Joes Hammer will have the same skills as every other Joes Hammer, for example. If I want different skills, perhaps I'll switch to the Bow of Pokey Stick Flinging to enjoy the same 5 skills as every other person using the Bow of Pokey Stick Flinging. Boring. Thanks devs for deciding that, to use Joes Hammer I am required to fill half my bar with what you want instead of giving the choice to the player. It'll be lots of fun to be max level and realize that you rolled the wrong race for pvp, and have to reroll, too.
2. I've read that already. You and I both know that, much like GW1 (and every other online game) within a few months of release, many skills will be deemed not worth putting on the bar. The lack of customization of the bars in GW2 will only add to that. Bring the good skills, leave the mediocre or situational behind-you only have a few slots where you can pick and choose, don't waste them. It'll be lots of fun to be max level and realize that you rolled the wrong race for pvp and have to reroll, too (lets face it, all traits won't be created equal, and some will rise above the others. Top tier pvp will require top tier traits)
3. I've seen that too. The impression I got from it for pvp was "lure the other team into preprotting player A, then switch and spike player B into the ground". With the main heal being the one players use on themselves, which shouldn't be too tough to shutdown, frontliners are in serious jeopardy. Lure the prot elsewhere, then knock and burn the warrior. You're stuck in enemy lines and nobody has the skills to make the red bars go up significantly enough to counteract it.
I feel that I poorly conveyed my point, at least on #3. Regardless, I still think that several of the changes between 1 and 2 are major errors in judgement on behalf of the idiot in charge of the GW2 production. If they don't have a red bar filler on the back burner able to be patched in quickly, I don't see gvg or similar being nearly as competative as it has been in GW1. Which is a shame.
It's pretty obvious that gw2 will be very different from gw1. And while i miss the amount of build customization allowed in gw1 it's not going to be the same in gw2.
Yes it's more simple for average player. But with the proper teamwork and trait customization i'm sure it still have some dept in it. Cheer up the dev is just trying to make the game funner for everybody and make the pvp more accessible to the public as compare to gw 1 which is quite limited to hardcore pvp player.
In gw1 pvp basically is group skill 60% base on build combo plus 10% coordination 30% how to counter opponent uber combo. Now in gw2 it's 40% base on skill choice and trait plus 40% based on personal skill and coordination and 20% on smart play to counter enemy strategy. The new gw2 combat system to me is easy to hook it up and play decently but hard to really master it, compare with gw1 where it's hard to formulate a winning group build. Above is just my 2cent and observation and by all mean not the absolute truth.
As for the healer thingy...even in gw1 the popular trend in high lv pvp last i keep track around a year ago is base on hybrid class build, meaning there are still dedicated healer but other hybrid class will pitch in with lesser healing responsiblity when healer are being focus fire.
Don't feel sad hookie, the world will change whether we like it or not, it's how we deal with the changes that's important.
With weapons, it's my understanding that the abilities will be the same for all weapons of that type for that class. A warrior using Bow of Pointy Sticks will have the same 5 abilies as a warrior using Bow of Fiery Death. A ranger using a bow will have 5 different abilties. That being said, there is a lot of room for customization in Traits. Here are two articles that unfortunately don't go into as much detail as I would like.
But judging by the one article, it seems like in addition to the 10 skills, there will be 5-6 traits you can select (out of the 100 available to your profession), that increase damage, reduce cooldowns, increase chance to crit, stuff like that. I think I remember reading somewhere that you can give your skills the chance to cause bleeds, but I can't find it.
The idea is that even if you and someone else are both using the same weapon(s), traits give you a chance to have a totally different playstyle.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it."-Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
Thanks OP for posting this. That video just confirmed by expectations. GW2 is going to be a real winner. Back when I cancelled my FFXIV pre-order (after experiencing the open beta), I put the money on the GW2 pre-order, even though there wasn't a release date. I am stoked for this game!
With weapons, it's my understanding that the abilities will be the same for all weapons of that type for that class. A warrior using Bow of Pointy Sticks will have the same 5 abilies as a warrior using Bow of Fiery Death. A ranger using a bow will have 5 different abilties. That being said, there is a lot of room for customization in Traits. Here are two articles that unfortunately don't go into as much detail as I would like.
But judging by the one article, it seems like in addition to the 10 skills, there will be 5-6 traits you can select (out of the 100 available to your profession), that increase damage, reduce cooldowns, increase chance to crit, stuff like that. I think I remember reading somewhere that you can give your skills the chance to cause bleeds, but I can't find it.
The idea is that even if you and someone else are both using the same weapon(s), traits give you a chance to have a totally different playstyle.
Traits are actually not quite increased damage, reduced colldowns, ect. They are more about changing how the skills and the profession work. There is a Warrior sword trait that adds bleeding to every attack, a trait for the ele's water staff that makes Water Trident heal adjacent allies. That is what they are about, more often than not, rather than simply messing with the stats.
It just looks like a quest driven single player game, which is only enforced by the fact there are no dedicated healer/cc types. There was no interaction with other players in that video, no grouping, the usual solo game stuff was in there with the usual arrow pointing you to the next quest location. The combat was too fast and out of combat healing allowed you to run from one mob to the next without a care - this kills the ability to interact with other players as all you see is the next target and not the person next to you, which is going to make forming a community hard.
While the game does look nice, it's just going to be another solo grind by the look of it. Not something I want from an MMORPG.
With weapons, it's my understanding that the abilities will be the same for all weapons of that type for that class. A warrior using Bow of Pointy Sticks will have the same 5 abilies as a warrior using Bow of Fiery Death. A ranger using a bow will have 5 different abilties. That being said, there is a lot of room for customization in Traits. Here are two articles that unfortunately don't go into as much detail as I would like.
But judging by the one article, it seems like in addition to the 10 skills, there will be 5-6 traits you can select (out of the 100 available to your profession), that increase damage, reduce cooldowns, increase chance to crit, stuff like that. I think I remember reading somewhere that you can give your skills the chance to cause bleeds, but I can't find it.
The idea is that even if you and someone else are both using the same weapon(s), traits give you a chance to have a totally different playstyle.
Traits are actually not quite increased damage, reduced colldowns, ect. They are more about changing how the skills and the profession work. There is a Warrior sword trait that adds bleeding to every attack, a trait for the ele's water staff that makes Water Trident heal adjacent allies. That is what they are about, more often than not, rather than simply messing with the stats.
Thanks for clarifying that. That is what I believe as well. I was just using the examples from the one post, which unfortunately make it seem a little too straightforward. I just found the article where I was reading about adding bleeds, I should have looked harder.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it."-Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
It just looks like a quest driven single player game, which is only enforced by the fact there are no dedicated healer/cc types. There was no interaction with other players in that video, no grouping, the usual solo game stuff was in there with the usual arrow pointing you to the next quest location. The combat was too fast and out of combat healing allowed you to run from one mob to the next without a care - this kills the ability to interact with other players as all you see is the next target and not the person next to you, which is going to make forming a community hard.
While the game does look nice, it's just going to be another solo grind by the look of it. Not something I want from an MMORPG.
Oh ye of little research.
It has been confirmed that they made things easier for the purposes of the demo. A huge part of their design philosophy is that they want to scale people down when they go to lower level zones in order for them to not ruin events by 1-shotting things. In videos you can see a charr elementalist 1 and 2 shotting same level mobs. It won't be like that on release.
The game has no quests. It has events which run whether players are there or not. Centaurs will attack a village. If players are there and can stop them, they can repel the centaurs which will lead to another event to attack a centaur outpost. If players aren't there or fail, they burn the village down and kill everybody. This will lead to an event to retake the town and rez the NPCs. If no players want to do that, that event can run forever.
Also, you NEVER have to talk to any NPCs to get quests. They have a variety of systems to let you know where events are, such as "New Event Nearby" messages, or some NPC running down the road screaming that the broodmother is attacking, or Scouts who will show you a lot of locations of NPCs on the map and then gray the map out again, just to give you some direction. Some NPCs might have markers over their heads because people have been conditioned by regular MMOs to talk to people with markers over their heads, but you never have to. You can talk to a woman who will tell you she's sick and that they're poisoning the well, or you can just see the green clouds, decide something is wrong, and investigate.
These events are designed to be purely cooperative. No killstealing, everybody gets loot, they scale up in difficulty with participation. The idea is that people want to play MMOs and be part of something, but they don't always don't want to be social. But after they take on an event, the event might chain to another one. So grouped and ungrouped players will head down the road together to the next one. It doesn't force people to group, but it encourages people to be social because they naturally will be hanging out together for an extended period.
There's also supposed to be 100s of cross profession combos. So far we've only seen examples of elementalists putting up fire walls or electrical fields that cause projectiles shot through them to do extra elemental damage, or heard about using knockbacks to launch mobs into the fire wall. These are supposed to be very visual, enabling natural cooperation. You see a fire wall, you run behind it to shoot. Warrior puts down a banner where those rangers are standing to buff them. Etc.
I would suggest just going to www.guildwars2.com and watching the manifesto video, and reading the articles at the top in The Game section. The sticky at the top of this forum has a wealth of information as well. This is the video I got most of the dynamic event information from, but it's probably not the best introduction to the game.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it."-Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
I am somewhat irritated by a lot of MMO's camera handling... I really love how GW2 camera seems to autofollow the Characers.. IF you stand on top of the hill it automatically tilts up a but so you can look out over the valley below, IF the road heads up the camera tilts down a bit so you can look up to where the road leads you and enjoy the scenery..
Seems this is what was missing in many MMO's
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
I am somewhat irritated by a lot of MMO's camera handling... I really love how GW2 camera seems to autofollow the Characers.. IF you stand on top of the hill it automatically tilts up a but so you can look out over the valley below, IF the road heads up the camera tilts down a bit so you can look up to where the road leads you and enjoy the scenery..
Seems this is what was missing in many MMO's
You can do this in almost any triple A mmo just check out the settings lol
I am somewhat irritated by a lot of MMO's camera handling... I really love how GW2 camera seems to autofollow the Characers.. IF you stand on top of the hill it automatically tilts up a but so you can look out over the valley below, IF the road heads up the camera tilts down a bit so you can look up to where the road leads you and enjoy the scenery..
Seems this is what was missing in many MMO's
You can do this in almost any triple A mmo just check out the settings lol
Not totally automated
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
graphics look great and questing fun. I think it is a bit cheesy how fast that ranger can fire off arrows though haha
lol watch Legolas in lord of the rings and you might not find it so cheesy lol. As the hero of the story its only right that you should have some experience with your weapon :]
Comments
I haven't finished this thing yet, but let me say--outstanding. Right now I'm about 16 minutes in; I've already scoured the videos, so the footage (at least with respect to the game world) isn't really new to me.
One grievance, so far: Where's her quiver? Between shots she reaches over her shoulder--which is spectacular and a necessary step toward realism--but at least what I'm seeing right now (around the 15-16 minute mark), I can't see a quiver. Now I don't expect ANet, for all their genius, to actually be able to animate someone drawing an arrow and loosing it in a way that would be consistent across a bunch of skills and in an open environment where other animation scripts are competing; but if you're going to draw, you need something to draw from. Are quivers equipment? That would make more sense, if there's an actual model for them, and she doesn't have one equipped. Anyway, just happened to notice.
The other thing I like is that the grind (grind isn't a swear word--grind is grind, neither good nor bad in itself) seems like a healthy mix between old school and new school; as someone who honestly preferred the camp-style leveling experience (e.g., EQ1 and FFXI) to the constant motion kill-ten-rats and return style (e.g., WOW), this is the closest thing I've seen to where I'd like to be. I can see myself and my friends showing up at that worm field and just making ourselves at home (depending, of course, on respawn rates and how soon we'd pass up the content, not to mention what conditions surround repeating dynamic events), but I can also see people jumping from each dynamic quest to the next in rapid succession.
Probably more to come.
... The dog was tanking for her [SQUEAL!]
Peace and safety.
try not to make this thread into a TOR vs GW2 thread please please.
Btw nice video link....i always wonder why arena net doesn't capture a sample gameplay video with software like fraps or something and share it with the world. I mean the video in this thread is good but it's still capture by a camera to a computer screen. Which imo distord the colour and looses detail level as well.
Below is a few handy trick to avoid getting into TOR vs GW2 argument in a thread or whatever offtopic we're trying to avoid.
-don't bring in comparison with TOR
-stop defending gw2 to trolling post Eg gw2 is gw with better graphic, gw2 is WAR+ffxiv
-if you want to criticize gw2 do so in a fact base and well research manner and not TOR have better story than GW2 because it's bioware (both game haven't came out and you guys are passing judgement on story plot? and because it's bioware? wow...if this is not call fanboism i don't know what is)
My problem with what i saw in the video is that the character movement and lip sync in cutscene is horrible and yes no quiver and arrow is lame. But frankly and realistically i don't expect them to change much for launch as imo what they show in the demo is the best of what they have to offer....expecting a miracle fix to all the flaw in the demo will be pure speculation and will overhype the game creating an expectation that will never be fulfill by arena net. So please refrain from saying that this is just a work in progress and i'm sure the final product will not have this problem. As from the way i see it arena net have more important issue to address to eg. getting all the dynamic event in the whole game world to work properly and churning out the class and balancing the gameplay etc etc.
After watching that video, the PVE looks great and the art/movement is awesome. I'm quite impressed with it, from what I see in that video, though I can't help but wonder...will melee characters be fodder in pve? Having to manage their own health might leave them having a bit of a time trying to not only be aware of their positioning and not take excessive damage, but pull out (and get away) when the hp gets low and the self heal is on recharge? Ranged dps seems like you'll have a much greater chance to survive an encounter rather than looking at it from the "downed" perspective and hoping to get back on your feet.
Furthermore, the skills are still just as terrible as they were when they first announced them. Half of your skills decided by your weapon. One more used for self heal. This leaves a choice of one elite (from 4-8 per class, iirc), and 3 utility skills. The difference between two of a class seems so much less than in GW. Look, a staff ele, just like the next staff ele. No split classes might be easier to balance, but it kills the customization that was a trademark of the original game. If you want a bar of crap, you can do it, perhaps that's what your guild needs you to run or maybe you're just bad. When developers try to develop away the players ability to fail or put together a crappy character, they push too far, and its excessive coddling. Perhaps frontline characters are fine with having a bar that's the same as the next bar, but midliners/backline (will there be a backline/frontline, or just gvg midliners?) might not need those weapon related skills, and want/could use different set ups.
The skills are where this game falls behind the original. Don't force me to take the skills the devs want to cover half my bar, leave the bar open to player choice, and dammit...put a healing class back in the game. Some of us like that, and further the gvg implications of not having a healer seem quite bad. I do think that not requiring a healer in many areas seems good, but as someone who has been a pvp player of many games since 2003, it sounds like crap.
All in all, I almost want to buy it, it's a very pretty game. If the skill set up wasn't so awful, I would. Just not worth the investment though, as it stands, even without a monthly fee.
1. Weapons allow different skills to be slotted: So characters can have access to melee and ranged damage. Traits/Utility will boost melee skills etc. Soldiers appear to be frontline professions.
2. http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/298180/The-Skill-Bar-Discussion.html for a look at the number of skills available. You can do the combinations possible and it's still impressive. It should be i) more possible for the devs to balance the skills ii) ensure that there is greater % of effective builds and less useless builds than in GW. Fewer but still a lot of builds possible it seems?
3. See http://www.guildwars2.com/en/the-game/combat/healing-death/ for more on why healers are now Support. Healers directly or indirectly ruined too many games for me.
Overalll it's interesting to see what ArenaNet are trying to improve and if they will succeed? I think they have a good chance of doing so.
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1014633/Classic-Game-Postmortem
I noticed that nobody caught this part.
Couple of things:
"GW2's story is completely linear."
Not true. Here is a post from A-Net:
Your story begins when you create a character. The choices you make at the beginning of the game - race, profession, and biographical details - set your character on a customized story track. But it doesn't end there - as you adventure, the decisions you make spin off into new storylines and new directions. Your character's story reflects your interest and your choices - no two players will have the same experience."
Also check out this link for an overview on Guild Wars 2's NON-Linear story.
Next:
"There's no way GW2 has as much VO as ToR"
And this is based on? Here is a post from A-Net:
Early on during Guild Wars 2 development, we discussed how much voice we wanted in the game. Everyone agreed that simply recording cinematics wasn’t enough, but how much would we need to immerse players in our world? We thought about the kinds of experiences we’d had in our favorite audio-heavy games like Grand Theft Auto IV, and we started paying attention to all the different ways that they employed voice-over to not only tell an engaging tale, but to literally surround you with sound. We talked about our planned content types, how we wanted to use audio in combat scenarios, and the different ways that we could both entertain and educate players about our world. We made a decision that, quite frankly, questioned our sanity.
We’re voicing the equivalent of more than 60 feature-length films.
Here's a link for you to read up further on this.
None of this information is difficult to find as its on their official site...
"Everyone dies. It is how one lives that matters."
Artemis Entreri (R.A. Salvatore)
"P.S. MAKE NO DEALS WITH THE WOLF." -Durzo Blint-
"But, there is one they fear.
In their tongue, he is Dovahkiin -- Dragonborn!" -Game of the Century-
nice info rbc13183
another thing i notice dev talk about for their dynamic event is that if you decided to ignore the village being attack, the village may get destroyed opening new event to retake and rebuild it. This imo is what makes the dynamic event different from Warhammer online PQ. I can imagine if i start the game 6 month after the launch....the area around newbie area maybe very diff from what we see now in the demo due to destruction by the bandit, worms, centaur etc etc. This is what i read out of the dev statement but please correct me if i got it wrong.
1. No, weapons come with different skills set by the weapon, they don not allow you to reset 5 skills to whatever you want each time you swap them out, just to whatever the weapon you're swapping to has available for you. Thus, every Joes Hammer will have the same skills as every other Joes Hammer, for example. If I want different skills, perhaps I'll switch to the Bow of Pokey Stick Flinging to enjoy the same 5 skills as every other person using the Bow of Pokey Stick Flinging. Boring. Thanks devs for deciding that, to use Joes Hammer I am required to fill half my bar with what you want instead of giving the choice to the player. It'll be lots of fun to be max level and realize that you rolled the wrong race for pvp, and have to reroll, too.
2. I've read that already. You and I both know that, much like GW1 (and every other online game) within a few months of release, many skills will be deemed not worth putting on the bar. The lack of customization of the bars in GW2 will only add to that. Bring the good skills, leave the mediocre or situational behind-you only have a few slots where you can pick and choose, don't waste them. It'll be lots of fun to be max level and realize that you rolled the wrong race for pvp and have to reroll, too (lets face it, all traits won't be created equal, and some will rise above the others. Top tier pvp will require top tier traits)
3. I've seen that too. The impression I got from it for pvp was "lure the other team into preprotting player A, then switch and spike player B into the ground". With the main heal being the one players use on themselves, which shouldn't be too tough to shutdown, frontliners are in serious jeopardy. Lure the prot elsewhere, then knock and burn the warrior. You're stuck in enemy lines and nobody has the skills to make the red bars go up significantly enough to counteract it.
I feel that I poorly conveyed my point, at least on #3. Regardless, I still think that several of the changes between 1 and 2 are major errors in judgement on behalf of the idiot in charge of the GW2 production. If they don't have a red bar filler on the back burner able to be patched in quickly, I don't see gvg or similar being nearly as competative as it has been in GW1. Which is a shame.
You seem up to speed on the current info on gw2 combat - that's cool. : )
1. With weapons, I was suggesting that damage as a category is not split between classes that are either rdps or mdps but by x2 weapon choices in combat (x number out of combat) you can do either forms of damage with one or the other weapon and will have different damage effects also for each of the 5 skills per weapon: eg: std, aoe, dot etc etc... this compares favorably to another game's combat that I enjoyed eg WAR and is sooooo much more flexible - it's a relief! I did not play gw and so cannot compare to that game (probably just as well) As for frontline and team coordination I took a guess soldiers (x2) will easily fit that role due to heavy armour??
2. The skills are apparently considerably less than gw but then that might mean the balance is considerably better and that the total of good/bad builds is also considerably improved? For pvp (structured) levels are normalized and there is not enough info on the racial skills yet concerning what their effect will be? In fact racial skills may very well end up being redundant in pvp but spectacular in pve, I'd hazard thinking or just re-skins of existing skills. I think the weapons idea reminds me of weapons in FPS games, pull out the flame-thrower, or sniper etc and that's sorta appealing especially with the targetting and range estimated and movement of combat suggested as seen a little bit in the vids, too? ^ ^
3. Almost zero info on pvp so far, but I'm most optimistic about gw2 here than any other feature, considering some of the design ideas floated about in a few interviews move in a direction suggested by tf2, lol eg.
http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1014633/Classic-Game-Postmortem
It's pretty obvious that gw2 will be very different from gw1. And while i miss the amount of build customization allowed in gw1 it's not going to be the same in gw2.
Yes it's more simple for average player. But with the proper teamwork and trait customization i'm sure it still have some dept in it. Cheer up the dev is just trying to make the game funner for everybody and make the pvp more accessible to the public as compare to gw 1 which is quite limited to hardcore pvp player.
In gw1 pvp basically is group skill 60% base on build combo plus 10% coordination 30% how to counter opponent uber combo. Now in gw2 it's 40% base on skill choice and trait plus 40% based on personal skill and coordination and 20% on smart play to counter enemy strategy. The new gw2 combat system to me is easy to hook it up and play decently but hard to really master it, compare with gw1 where it's hard to formulate a winning group build. Above is just my 2cent and observation and by all mean not the absolute truth.
As for the healer thingy...even in gw1 the popular trend in high lv pvp last i keep track around a year ago is base on hybrid class build, meaning there are still dedicated healer but other hybrid class will pitch in with lesser healing responsiblity when healer are being focus fire.
Don't feel sad hookie, the world will change whether we like it or not, it's how we deal with the changes that's important.
With weapons, it's my understanding that the abilities will be the same for all weapons of that type for that class. A warrior using Bow of Pointy Sticks will have the same 5 abilies as a warrior using Bow of Fiery Death. A ranger using a bow will have 5 different abilties. That being said, there is a lot of room for customization in Traits. Here are two articles that unfortunately don't go into as much detail as I would like.
http://www.tentonhammer.com/gw2/features/interviews/traits
http://www.guildwars2.com/en/the-game/combat/traits-overview/
But judging by the one article, it seems like in addition to the 10 skills, there will be 5-6 traits you can select (out of the 100 available to your profession), that increase damage, reduce cooldowns, increase chance to crit, stuff like that. I think I remember reading somewhere that you can give your skills the chance to cause bleeds, but I can't find it.
The idea is that even if you and someone else are both using the same weapon(s), traits give you a chance to have a totally different playstyle.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it." -Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
Thanks OP for posting this. That video just confirmed by expectations. GW2 is going to be a real winner. Back when I cancelled my FFXIV pre-order (after experiencing the open beta), I put the money on the GW2 pre-order, even though there wasn't a release date. I am stoked for this game!
...
Ok, color me impressed.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4
Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
Traits are actually not quite increased damage, reduced colldowns, ect. They are more about changing how the skills and the profession work. There is a Warrior sword trait that adds bleeding to every attack, a trait for the ele's water staff that makes Water Trident heal adjacent allies. That is what they are about, more often than not, rather than simply messing with the stats.
Disagreement Heirarchy
Oh ye of little research.
Thanks for clarifying that. That is what I believe as well. I was just using the examples from the one post, which unfortunately make it seem a little too straightforward. I just found the article where I was reading about adding bleeds, I should have looked harder.
http://www.pcgamer.com/2010/06/12/guild-wars-2-devs-talk-warrior-and-traits/
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it." -Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
It has been confirmed that they made things easier for the purposes of the demo. A huge part of their design philosophy is that they want to scale people down when they go to lower level zones in order for them to not ruin events by 1-shotting things. In videos you can see a charr elementalist 1 and 2 shotting same level mobs. It won't be like that on release.
The game has no quests. It has events which run whether players are there or not. Centaurs will attack a village. If players are there and can stop them, they can repel the centaurs which will lead to another event to attack a centaur outpost. If players aren't there or fail, they burn the village down and kill everybody. This will lead to an event to retake the town and rez the NPCs. If no players want to do that, that event can run forever.
Also, you NEVER have to talk to any NPCs to get quests. They have a variety of systems to let you know where events are, such as "New Event Nearby" messages, or some NPC running down the road screaming that the broodmother is attacking, or Scouts who will show you a lot of locations of NPCs on the map and then gray the map out again, just to give you some direction. Some NPCs might have markers over their heads because people have been conditioned by regular MMOs to talk to people with markers over their heads, but you never have to. You can talk to a woman who will tell you she's sick and that they're poisoning the well, or you can just see the green clouds, decide something is wrong, and investigate.
These events are designed to be purely cooperative. No killstealing, everybody gets loot, they scale up in difficulty with participation. The idea is that people want to play MMOs and be part of something, but they don't always don't want to be social. But after they take on an event, the event might chain to another one. So grouped and ungrouped players will head down the road together to the next one. It doesn't force people to group, but it encourages people to be social because they naturally will be hanging out together for an extended period.
There's also supposed to be 100s of cross profession combos. So far we've only seen examples of elementalists putting up fire walls or electrical fields that cause projectiles shot through them to do extra elemental damage, or heard about using knockbacks to launch mobs into the fire wall. These are supposed to be very visual, enabling natural cooperation. You see a fire wall, you run behind it to shoot. Warrior puts down a banner where those rangers are standing to buff them. Etc.
I would suggest just going to www.guildwars2.com and watching the manifesto video, and reading the articles at the top in The Game section. The sticky at the top of this forum has a wealth of information as well. This is the video I got most of the dynamic event information from, but it's probably not the best introduction to the game.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it." -Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
I just rewatched some of this video...
I am somewhat irritated by a lot of MMO's camera handling... I really love how GW2 camera seems to autofollow the Characers.. IF you stand on top of the hill it automatically tilts up a but so you can look out over the valley below, IF the road heads up the camera tilts down a bit so you can look up to where the road leads you and enjoy the scenery..
Seems this is what was missing in many MMO's
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
You can do this in almost any triple A mmo just check out the settings lol
Not totally automated
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
Damn the game looks good
I know! I cant wait.
Love a-net and they do a great job so I hope this game lives up to the hype :-)
The Demo was looking great, I did watch the whole video and enjoyed it.
Loved the action and bgm when the the village was under attack and getting to a boss fight in less than 10 minutes.
Awesome
graphics look great and questing fun. I think it is a bit cheesy how fast that ranger can fire off arrows though haha
*_*
lol watch Legolas in lord of the rings and you might not find it so cheesy lol. As the hero of the story its only right that you should have some experience with your weapon :]
This game is going to be the most amazing game on the market next to tera and rift. Blade and soul looks decent also!!!