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F2P bills on rampage
and_rea
Member Posts: 20
You know, the f2p model was born in order to make players able to play a game without any fee, and made its incomes by cash shop. Nothing new here, so what changed as today?
Everything changed! Really a lot! Over last years, the pressure made on players on using cash shop is rampaging, until the point you now, in some games, need to rely on it even for the most trivial and temporary things.
Sure thing, publishers needs an income to pay the bills, and CS is the only resource. But, are still players willing to pay bills far more grater than a full year P2P subscription, to be able play the given game at levels more than the casual player?
As today, I see in various games forums more and more concerns about the game balance, and about the fact (in some games) you can't reach certain levels if you don't rely exclusively on CS items (this sometime called p2w, pay to win, games).
This is really different than some years ago, CS was an help to speedup the character progression, and a shortcut for endgame items, you paying some buck for something you have to pay 2 weeks of your time if you wanna craft it yourself.
I don't wanna give out games names, but a publisher, in the past, was able to push its CS prices so high that had in return a really mad playerbase who revolted back to them, and they were forced go back their CS pricing. After this, all other publishers learnt the lesson, and now applying a different tactic: keep in CS some items you HAVE to buy, to progress the game or continue your endgame, but you aren't aware of them, until you reach certain levels, making you to choose at that point, if use your wallet, or quit the game.
Fact is, as today, if you want keep on the top of your f2p game of choose, you have to be prepared to pay more (and much more) than a full year p2p subscription.
Am I wrong? Is situation better than I reported above? Let me know your thoughts!
Cheers^^
Comments
Aren't aware of them until you reach certain level is the exact point they are relying on. So don't try out any new f2p game until the reviews come back on what the need to buy items are. That way you avoid being trapped into buying them.
I tried Allods and when I realised what it was I dumped it faster than a hot potato.
The point of no return is when you already get hooked to the game and are justifying spending money and more money. It is like the nice boots I saw the other day and my conversation with my husband about buying them. F2P games are like that boot. You get to a point where you simply feel you cannot live without that boot in your wardrobe then it is already too late.
I don't like the f2p for the simple fact that when you add it up you are probably going to be spending more money than had you bought the game and paid a monthly sub. If it was more comparable or less, that would be an inducement. But feeling manipulated into buying stuff to advance feels sleazy to me, even though I know they are a company trying to make money.
In the other news i am playing LOTRO completely free. Never payed a dime since it went F2P
I even bought Mirkwood expansion with points i made ingame.
It really depends on your playstyle/playtime. My most played F2P game is Atlantica Online. You can easily get to lvl100 without using CS. But latter you have 2 choices grind for weeks/months or spend thousands to get to top. It has way too huge gap in medium and high level players (there is might which calculates your teams power, medium is 500k-1.2M, high is above that (numbers may be bit incorrect as played long time ago)). As medium player you will make 200-500M/month, as high level player you will make 1-2BILLIONS/WEEK. You can buy CS items for game money but simpliest needs is Warrior Pack (see enemies hp/telport/check what is in enemy formation and something I forget) and Blessing License (150% damage, 110% exp and def), both costs ~1,5B/month if using game money. So if you are high level game is really free, if you are medium level you will grind for months to get to high level if you dont spend real money. It is really annoying and thats why I quit. It is pure PAY TO WIN system for new players/casual players...
Companies do need to make money, so they try every psychological trick in the book to try and make us spend. Oh well.
"Nothing in life is free."
<TBA>
i love riot games for league of legends, you can obtain anything in game without spending any money at all. they mostly sells skins for the champions in their store.
i tried Alods, at level 10 i realized that i need to use CS items to remove Rez sickness, i just quit there. RoM clearly Pay to win game.
Quality in F2P is not as good as P2P, but if you spend on CS items then you end up spending a lot more then sub base A game. its so easy to get in to F2P games and at the end when you have already spent like months then you realize you do need CS items, there are alternatives but they are extreme grind fest.
Thank you for the replies!
I agree, letting you addicted so much you go to spend your money, it is business and I will not discuss it, we players just needs be "on our feets" and be on alert when the expenses will go too much beyond our limits.
Here you touched the main point! When we have alternatives, it means we still can choose if take a shortcut by money, or get the long road. The issue who arise in these days is, players will get now to a point they have NO alternatives. Just for one example, imagine the endgame of a PvP title, in which a CS item is a must to survive a battle, and without it, your victory chances are nil. Make it not tradeable, make it temporary, and we have a P2W.I mentioned above, about "tradeable" CS. If CS items being tradeable, we always have some chance to choose how to get it, as long as someone in needs of ingame cash, will buy it for us. But this is slightly different than the main topic, who is not about the pressure on using CS (I repeat, it is fine a company tries to make incomes, they are not charities) but, it is about the amount of money they want keep out our buckets today, that is going to be really high, compared to the item benefits and compared to the yearly fee of a p2p game.
This is the road I am feeling nowadays F2P industry is going to follow.
Cheers^^
You got 3 kinds of players.
1. Players that like their character to represent time played, which is mobs killed and quests completed. That's your subscription player. My character gets more powerful when I kill mobs, or do quests. At 15 bucks a month, it's cheap, cheap, cheap, no matter how fast or slow I gain levels/skills/power. This is your typical WoW player.
2. Players that like their character to represent how much money they spend on it. It's my money, and my character, and I'll increase my character's level/skill/power at whatever rate I want to. If I want to go fast, I'll buy tons of xp potions, and gear that regenerates mana, and stuff like that.
3. Players that for many reasons, will not spend money on an MMO. Maybe they are broke, dont' have good credit so no credit card, to young and parents won't let them, or they just dont' feel they get enough value from teh game to pay.
These players will play a F2P game, until they get to the point where it's really hard unless you buy items in the cash shop, and then they will quit, and go play another F2P game.
You won't get any money from them, not in a sub game, not in a cash shop.
None of these players are going away, and games for these players are not going away, unless WoW goes and is never replaced.
So, I don't see it as PAY TO WIN! You dont' win anything.
I see it as, I like to increase my character with time, or I like to increase my character with money.
I like to increase my character with time, not money. So I won't play F2P cash shop games. Others love to increase thier character with money, and HATE to do it with time, so they play cash shop games.
So if that continues and everyone played that way, LotR:O would profit how?
Depends really on how it is managed. I pay the same sub in LotR as I did before it went f2p. So nothing really changed for me except due to my sub coming with points every month, I used them to purchase Mirkwood which before the transition I would have paid separately for in addition to my monthly sub.
Granted Rings isn't the norm. Although one would hope more may consider a hybrid model format. Least in my opinion, if done properly I think it can benefit everyone involved.
Granted if done wrong it can be the final nail in the proverbial coffin.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
By people like me that simply do not have the time or find it enjoyable grinding out all those points. All the more power to them if they enjoy doing that. Not my cup of tea though.
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
The point of a F2P game isn't to let people play free. It's to draw a community large enough, so that people who do use the cash shop have something to do.
Practice doesn't make perfect, practice makes permanent.
"At one point technology meant making tech that could get to the moon, now it means making tech that could get you a taxi."
This ^^ I'm currently subbed to LoTR:O because I enjoy the gameplay and the extras I get from subbing (skirmishes and extra auction house space immediately come to mind)- I guess I don't understand the issue with completely F2P games because I have enough willpower that if a game becomes too pricy or unenjoyable I stop playing. It's really not that hard. Games are not an investment nor are the characters we play in them, they are simply a pasttime.
My problem with f2p games is that they essentially place a stranglehold on the game's development. Pretty much every neat or nifty update gets automatically shunted over to the cash shop. People call it 'pay2win' and similar names, but I think it's closer to 'pay2convenience' for the most part. You pay them so that you can avoid the sinkholes they purposely place in the game for that very reason.
Let me remind you that Lotro has a CS in which you can buy stats or heal pots with no cooldown. Also, there are things you can only get via CS.
Some are better than others. I am enjoying League of Legends alot and only paid 10 euros to get a couple of new champions for variety.
But some others, like Entropia, are much more extreme. Or so I heard.
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Yeah, I don't get the interest in that game. I tried it and I didn't find it to be fun or engrossing in the least.
Then again there are plenty that cannot stand my games of choice either so...
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
Oh I understand that and I've looked at quite a few of the things that are in the cash shop, but the only things I've personally ever bought is more vault space and that came with the turbine points I get just for subscribing. However, if I choose not to subscribe for a few months, I still have those items and what not that I purchased with the points and I can continue to log into the game and play.
Perhaps I am an atypical player but I've not found any items in the cash shop that have been necessary to continue playing. This stops at content expansions of course, but only EvE to my knowledge gives completely free content expansions (and I only know that from hearsay on these forums). To be quite honest, I see most of the items in the LoTR:O CS to be completely unnecessary for gameplay, but even if this were not the case the currency for the cash shop can be earned by playing the game so even then I don't see an issue.
This is awesome sauce from a developers standpoint. If you pay 15 bucks a month, I have to keep you happy for 10 months to make 150 bucks.
If you are on a cash shop game, I can make the same money from you in 2 months, and if you're not happy after that, who gives a crap? I already got your money.
IF everyone played that way but plenty still subscribe p2p.
I'm a premium Lotro player, once subbed not now...and I've spent 50-75 bucks only cause it was mad money. I do see how in Lotro F2P players can get screwed by the system. For instance, after the starter, free, areas the only options you have for free are Bree and Lone Lands..now...if you dont spend any money on game you find you need several things...Trait slot..95 points a pop...theres 3 I believe you'll haver to buy...then lets say you whip through Bree and Lone Lands...maybe you have 300ish Turbine points...whats next. Turbine followed the DDO F2P style but made 1 mistake...the prices for stuff, needed stuff like quest packs and all are way too expensive and nned to become more realistic in balance with what you can aquire/use for turbine points. And lets look at backpack space..OMG...unreal...495 to get 1 bag for account wide...but you fill bags fast, real fast in Lotro and the price is too way out for the turbine points gained. Bank space, same..shared storage for account..ungodly...at least make the Points one can earn in any F2P game realistic to the shop prices...make it cash heavy and it becomes a hardship...grinding wont help a disgruntled player at all. My 2 copper/isk/gold....
Mmmmmmm Boots, Wardrobe ...
I'll definitely agree with the price of buying turbine points outright being completely unworth it, which is why I'll sub for three months at a time for thirty bucks- still far cheaper than $180 a year and I get 500 points for each month I am subbed- and iirc subbing for even one month gets you all five bagslots which remain on all your characters even after you stop subbing. Shared space is also ridiculously high, so I don't use it.
The way their CS is implemented and the choice to sub or not is just a system that works much better for me, ymmv.
Boots? No offence but unless those boots had some crazy stats I think this is a chick thing
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