I downloaded and played this weekend, only got to level 6 because its just quest quest quest ow boring, its boring being the saviour of the world from the very moment you make your character, its boring going from NPC to NPC questing, only thing good about the game is its actually quite difficult in that you do die alot if you dont use them potions.
Been playing mortal online which is totally different and im bored of that too, what can i try next? honestly theres no "feel" anymore, i havnt played an mmorpg in ages iv played two this week and im crapped out already!
Cant be bored of the genre can i?
Ex. myth of soma, legend of mir, mu online and eudemons online player.
Current game : Runescape (until pc build is complete)
I downloaded and played this weekend, only got to level 6 because its just quest quest quest ow boring, its boring being the saviour of the world from the very moment you make your character, its boring going from NPC to NPC questing, only thing good about the game is its actually quite difficult in that you do die alot if you dont use them potions.
Been playing mortal online which is totally different and im bored of that too, what can i try next? honestly theres no "feel" anymore, i havnt played an mmorpg in ages iv played two this week and im crapped out already!
Cant be bored of the genre can i?
Seems that your are bored to whole genre.Or you got high hopes about the game,and u got shotted down?
I downloaded and played this weekend, only got to level 6 because its just quest quest quest ow boring, its boring being the saviour of the world from the very moment you make your character, its boring going from NPC to NPC questing, only thing good about the game is its actually quite difficult in that you do die alot if you dont use them potions.
Been playing mortal online which is totally different and im bored of that too, what can i try next? honestly theres no "feel" anymore, i havnt played an mmorpg in ages iv played two this week and im crapped out already!
Cant be bored of the genre can i?
There are still so many similarities between one MMO to the next that I think it is very easy to get bored and tired of the genre. There have been a few times over the past decade of MMOs where I went back to other games for a couple months, then it felt good to pop back in an MMO awhile later and I enjoyed it again. It sounds like that break might be what you need. There are a lot of good games out there right now in any genre to enjoy.
Ive capped several chars in lotro, but the game stops there for me. Just cant enjoy the mindless runs of instances for gear.
The fact that you cant run raids unless you have this class and that class.(The holy trinity starts to get old).
The fact that you have to run said raid eleventy times over and over again....
There must be something else....
Agreed.
MMOs should either have a lot longer before you enter the endgame or they need a lot more options for the endgame. Raiding, group dungeons, daily quests and battlegrounds is not enough to do. Nothing wrong with any of them but there really should be more options than that.
Ive capped several chars in lotro, but the game stops there for me. Just cant enjoy the mindless runs of instances for gear.
The fact that you cant run raids unless you have this class and that class.(The holy trinity starts to get old).
The fact that you have to run said raid eleventy times over and over again....
There must be something else....
Agreed.
MMOs should either have a lot longer before you enter the endgame or they need a lot more options for the endgame. Raiding, group dungeons, daily quests and battlegrounds is not enough to do. Nothing wrong with any of them but there really should be more options than that.
While i do agree with you, what is it that players want more, i hear alot of people say they want something else, but none of them come up with anything, and i myself don't really know what else they should implement but still feel like there must be something else.
Ive capped several chars in lotro, but the game stops there for me. Just cant enjoy the mindless runs of instances for gear.
The fact that you cant run raids unless you have this class and that class.(The holy trinity starts to get old).
The fact that you have to run said raid eleventy times over and over again....
There must be something else....
This is exactly where I am at with any MMO right now. I don't enjoy endgame raiding for several reasons. I don't fault the developers for how they've designed it because I've seen a lot of people enjoy it. I just know that I don't. I love the design of leveling in MMOs though, regardless of how I do it. It doesn't matter too much to me if it's by PVP, crafting, quests, or just grinding mobs, etc. I really enjoy any of those methods, but count me out when it degenerates in to playing the same instances over and over ad nauseam. So I've just learned that when I get a character to max level, it's time to either level another character or switch MMOs. That's been work really well to sustain my interest with the genre.
Ive capped several chars in lotro, but the game stops there for me. Just cant enjoy the mindless runs of instances for gear.
The fact that you cant run raids unless you have this class and that class.(The holy trinity starts to get old).
The fact that you have to run said raid eleventy times over and over again....
There must be something else....
Agreed.
MMOs should either have a lot longer before you enter the endgame or they need a lot more options for the endgame. Raiding, group dungeons, daily quests and battlegrounds is not enough to do. Nothing wrong with any of them but there really should be more options than that.
While i do agree with you, what is it that players want more, i hear alot of people say they want something else, but none of them come up with anything, and i myself don't really know what else they should implement but still feel like there must be something else.
I think part of it is definitely the leveling curve, because MMOs are getting increasingly easy to reach endgame that some of us don't enjoy. I think maybe something like extra advancement options or maybe no maximum level might help, although that creates the problem of some players being left behind by veterans. I kinda enjoy the idea of swapping out classes so you can level all of them on one character, but that gets old too. Maybe players of the genre just need to play other games until an expansion comes along? We're still putting considerably more hours in to MMOs then other genres of games, so I think there is just a point where even MMOs get old or fall behind on content when we wish they wouldn't. Maybe MMO companies can just hire more people to get content out faster as MMOs get more profitable? Or maybe more of us just have to look at endgame in MMOs as a 'game over' until the next expansion because that's the content we enjoy the most.
then you have plenty to do. problem is, people rush to the max level and expect there to be this grand pile of content... 1.5 months from launch? Gimme a break. I haven't hit max yet, and I'm not worried about it either. Once I do hit max, yes I will work towards maxing out my gear, then I'm going to work towards organizing large scale pvp battles in the world, maybe even set up some pvp games to play, so long as those playing respect the rules (heh, right... you never know though, worked in SWG) then it could be a killer good time.
It also doesn't help that many people play 6+ hours a day, get burned out, quit, and write bad reviews.
In all fairness, many people enjoy those activities so they're having a good time. But if a person is looking for something that doesn't involve collecting acheivements or gear grinding, Rift isn't their game.
Everything you posted in yellow is moot. The essence of MMORPGs is pointless. Crafting a longsword has as much impact as building a castle, or destroying a boss in an instance. That being said, the degree of importance varies from person to person. In one instance, I had a CO-GM in WoW who was obsessed with pets. It was what she considered fun, and fruitful to gather as many pets as she could. Going as far as to pay real cash for them.
Me? I like pets, but I can go on without them. The point is, you can't argue these "points" as facts and have a place to stand. MMORPGs means different things to different people. What you like in a MMORPG can't be argued as fact anymore than what you dislike in a MMORPG can't be argued as fact. You should present your options as opinions and make no allusion to the contrary.
"But if a person is looking for something that doesn't involve collecting acheivements or gear grinding, Rift isn't their game." is especially insulting to gamers. I do not wish to take sides, but you might as well be arguing why a Black Xbox is better than a white one. It has just as much meaning in the context of things.
~Miles "Tails" Prower out! Catch me if you can!
I agree with most of your post.
But regarding the original post: No one should have to go complete collections or achievements just to have something to do, those things have always been optional and something a small portion of the playerbase actually focuses on as a primary form of content.
In truth, I spent the greatest portion of my Level 85 character's lifespan in WoW unlocking achievements and doing dailies. Since Raid content only resets once a week and after you have a boss on farm the thrill of raiding diminishes, one could argue that the little things are all you really have to look forward to in any MMORPG.
I think creating content that is fulfiling and rewarding to players of Max level will always be a challenge. Throwing raids out is the general consensus amongst MMORPGs of this type, but it may not always be the answer.
Dailies, Guild Content, PvP content, Fluff.. It all can't be done in one patch. The result is many people feel that one patch was a "waste of developer time" and get angry.
In short. You can't please everyone, but I'm sure research and staying in touch with the community can help create a positive atmosphere from each major content patch.
~Miles "Tails" Prower out! Catch me if you can!
Come Join us at www.globalequestria.com - Meet other fans of My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic!
Great polished game, and leveling to 50 was super fun for me. Then I got to 50 and my options were WFs, and dungeons.
Same model as other games. Why not put out more solo content at 50? AAs? Something else to do besides get the latest gear. I can gear grind in any game I want. That is not an 'end-game' I am seeking.
WFs are fun and all, but if that's al the game offers at 50 then it's not worth it.
I would stay far away from this game unless you are wanting a game similar to WoW.
We need origianality at level 50, or we need something to strive for outside of gear at 50.
To be fair to lotro and WOW their end game contents far exceeds anything rift has to offer. Rift is one boring as hell game and now we are seeing the fanboys who didn't want to listen to any of the beta/alpha testers who actually told them how boring and sterile rift is.
I have noticed many of the avid fanboys on these forum who were shouting defending rift against all odds and now they come back with their tales between their legs forgetting their pathetic obssession with a game that is no better than most FTP MMO.
Polished it may be but it's a polished load of crap.
Ive capped several chars in lotro, but the game stops there for me. Just cant enjoy the mindless runs of instances for gear.
The fact that you cant run raids unless you have this class and that class.(The holy trinity starts to get old).
The fact that you have to run said raid eleventy times over and over again....
There must be something else....
Agreed.
MMOs should either have a lot longer before you enter the endgame or they need a lot more options for the endgame. Raiding, group dungeons, daily quests and battlegrounds is not enough to do. Nothing wrong with any of them but there really should be more options than that.
It's not that there aren't other options for content at endgame. It's that options other than repeating the same thing over and over again require a lot of actual content. "End Game" really means "we ran out of time to produce content, so you can do this a hundred times until you quit or we add more content".
This is one of the reasons I have to laugh at people who deliberately rush to end game. The leveling process IS the game, end game is just for masochists who like enduring repetition in order to earn some sense of achievment.
I guess we all fell into a trap, wanting enough quest content to level up on with out having to grind. It would be awesome if MMO developers could actually produce enough content so that leveling, with out mob grinding, would be a process that takes several months. However, they stick to the "quest to the cap" ideal, even if they only have enough content for a few weeks.
Great polished game, and leveling to 50 was super fun for me. Then I got to 50 and my options were WFs, and dungeons.
Same model as other games. Why not put out more solo content at 50? AAs? Something else to do besides get the latest gear. I can gear grind in any game I want. That is not an 'end-game' I am seeking.
WFs are fun and all, but if that's al the game offers at 50 then it's not worth it.
I would stay far away from this game unless you are wanting a game similar to WoW.
We need origianality at level 50, or we need something to strive for outside of gear at 50.
To be fair to lotro and WOW their end game contents far exceeds anything rift has to offer. Rift is one boring as hell game and now we are seeing the fanboys who didn't want to listen to any of the beta/alpha testers who actually told them how boring and sterile rift is.
I have noticed many of the avid fanboys on these forum who were shouting defending rift against all odds and now they come back with their tales between their legs forgetting their pathetic obssession with a game that is no better than most FTP MMO.
Polished it may be but it's a polished load of crap.
I defended the game myself, however, I was clear that my expectations were that the game would provide enough content for a month and that anything beyond that would be a pleasant surprise. Well, my initial intuition was about right. By the end of week 5, I was done. I got many, many hours of play out of it, so it was worth the box price, but nothing worth paying $15 a month for once you've hit the level cap.
I probably would have been able to get a couple more months out of the game, but the fact that alts have to follow the same exact leveling path killed any replayability for me.
Everyone has different preferences for what they want in an MMO. I actually like a lot about Rift, but IMO, the game launched with a third the land mass and a forth the content it would have needed to provide a worthwhile, extended game play experience. Plus, I feel that Trion has horribly managed post launch tweaks and development. (For instance, you can't rely on Rifts to be a major source of content, then make sourceshards and sourcestones so hard to aquire that players can't actually buy Rift currency armor and weapons before they completely outlevel the gear).
Oh, might as well throw this one in there as well. Factional PvP games with only TWO factions does NOT work! However, a third faction would have required more content and it's clear that Trion was just unable to churn out enough content with in the monetary and temporal budgets.
It's not that there aren't other options for content at endgame. It's that options other than repeating the same thing over and over again require a lot of actual content. "End Game" really means "we ran out of time to produce content, so you can do this a hundred times until you quit or we add more content".
This is one of the reasons I have to laugh at people who deliberately rush to end game. The leveling process IS the game, end game is just for masochists who like enduring repetition in order to earn some sense of achievment.
I guess we all fell into a trap, wanting enough quest content to level up on with out having to grind. It would be awesome if MMO developers could actually produce enough content so that leveling, with out mob grinding, would be a process that takes several months. However, they stick to the "quest to the cap" ideal, even if they only have enough content for a few weeks.
1. Quest grinding is even dumber than grinding mobs - because you delude yourself in enjoying content, while it is just a replacement for social gameplay - "Can't talk to people, talking to NPC's is my best social skill"... A quest would be interesting, if you have one quest that you follow for a week or a month, but not following 20 quest-arrows. Did you actually read all the nice quest texts?
2. Most people rush to the endgame, because the quest/solo stuff before is just dumb, boring, idiotic. They expect the soul of a MMO (i.e. social interaction in groups/guilds) to be in the endgame. Unfortunately Rift is copying here the worst aspects of WoW, War and other failures in human evolution (i.e. all the stuff that destroyed the community), e.g. solo-daily quests, pickup-rift-groups, easytobeat-dungeons (though calling them expert and raid - loughable).
then you have plenty to do. problem is, people rush to the max level and expect there to be this grand pile of content... 1.5 months from launch? Gimme a break. I haven't hit max yet, and I'm not worried about it either. Once I do hit max, yes I will work towards maxing out my gear, then I'm going to work towards organizing large scale pvp battles in the world, maybe even set up some pvp games to play, so long as those playing respect the rules (heh, right... you never know though, worked in SWG) then it could be a killer good time.
It also doesn't help that many people play 6+ hours a day, get burned out, quit, and write bad reviews.
In all fairness, many people enjoy those activities so they're having a good time. But if a person is looking for something that doesn't involve collecting acheivements or gear grinding, Rift isn't their game.
Everything you posted in yellow is moot. The essence of MMORPGs is pointless. Crafting a longsword has as much impact as building a castle, or destroying a boss in an instance. That being said, the degree of importance varies from person to person. In one instance, I had a CO-GM in WoW who was obsessed with pets. It was what she considered fun, and fruitful to gather as many pets as she could. Going as far as to pay real cash for them.
Me? I like pets, but I can go on without them. The point is, you can't argue these "points" as facts and have a place to stand. MMORPGs means different things to different people. What you like in a MMORPG can't be argued as fact anymore than what you dislike in a MMORPG can't be argued as fact. You should present your options as opinions and make no allusion to the contrary.
Taking control of a castle, keep, territory and denying access to all others is the only fun and meaningful experience (for me) in an MMORPG. Everything else you mentioned is pointless (again, to me), its just a petty game mechanics. You enjoy "collecting things" such as acheivements, gear or pets, great, I hear stamp collecting can be fun too.
Building a castle (or spacestation) can have quite an impact in a game world and is a far greater achievement than crafting a longsword, though some MMO's let crafters build truely unique and powerful items and it did add some meaning to the achievement.
"But if a person is looking for something that doesn't involve collecting acheivements or gear grinding, Rift isn't their game." is especially insulting to gamers. I do not wish to take sides, but you might as well be arguing why a Black Xbox is better than a white one. It has just as much meaning in the context of things.
There was nothing insulting about my statement, Rift is a game that bases much of its accomplishements(and content) on the collection of things, (pretty much a fact by the way) and if you enjoy collecting things, you've found a new home. But if controlling territory is your goal, this is not the place for you.
~Miles "Tails" Prower out! Catch me if you can!
I'm sorry I didn't start my post with a disclaimer, "everything hereafter is strictly the opinion/preferences of the author and in no way should be construed as a fact"
But I generally leave it up to the reader to discern fact from opinion.
The thread I responded to basically said... "there's nothing to do in Rift" to which someone else replied "sure there is, you can do these 6 or 7 collection activities". Since I find collection activities largely meaningless, I responded thusly.
Sure, some folks may enjoy those activities, in fact, judging from the success of games such as WOW and others that is what is preferred by most gamers (sort of real life I suppose)..
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
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"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
30-50 hours per week isn't casual playing, its a full time job.
8-12 hrs a week, now that's pretty casual.
Rfit does a good job catering to the more casual player, I can imagine a person playing 40+ hrs a week burning out the content of most MMORPG's pretty quickly.
If I only played 8-12 hours a week or only had time for that much gaming, I wouldn't even touch an MMO. Quite stupid right there. Me and all my friends are older players, ranging from 25-50 in age, have lives (I'm married with kids), full time jobs and I still manage to fit in 30 hours a week in an MMO easy.
So splitting your time (almost in half) in an MMO, and the time with your kids and wife isn't stupid, but playing an MMO 12 hours a week is? ok...
And thats if you don't do anything but spend time with your family while you have that "free" time..
If I didn't have time, I wouldn't touch an MMO and stick to my other favorite genre, first person shooters which are far less time consuming unless you have an addiction.
And it's my life, I do what I want. I have a great gf that doesn't require me being up her ass all the time and she sits at her own computer less than 2 ft away from me usually chatting it up on FB or working.. She has her hobbies and I have mine. I spend roughly 30 hours maybe. Weekends, sometimes more. You live in a weird world if you need to supervise everything in your life. Not everyone has to be that way. And they aren't preschool kids. I didn't even play MMOs at all during that time. Didn't even know what a MUD was. I got into MMOs when I actually wanted to settle and be an my introverted self again. Cause that's really what I enjoy. You put values in different things then that's your life, have fun with it. But don't come in here being high almighty cause I like to put more time on my game. It's no different than me being out in my garage restoring my camaro or traveling. I game. That's what I do now other than waste time here sometimes when I'm just researching some other games and such. But it's stupid. You only have 8 hours, then maybe Rift is the game for you for sure, but the majority I'm sure will want more.
Honestly, i could care less what you do with your life, and I really don't need a play by play. I was just commenting on your interpitation of stupid in regards to this conversation, I found it a little odd.
Your previous statement was 30 hours EASY.
It is easy. If I was playing a game that would take more, it wouldn't be that big of a deal. Some weeks could be able to, some weeks won't. But 8-12 is far below any reasonable time for an MMO unless you wanna just play around in the lower levels. Even Rift doesn't allow that very well cause lower zones will be covered with invasions so therefore creating harder times to those that level slower. And you don't have to read the play by play. I do think it's crazy/stupid whatever, if you can't commit to an MMO a little more then a monthly subscription MMO is really not for that person. Cause I really don't wanna hear the whining in the game, best stick with F2Ps then cause you'll probably never have to really buy into anything cause you'll never reach max level where you'll have to pay-to-win.
And besides, the point of the casual was more a frame of mind, not how many hours they spend. We already established that before you go poking around previous posts at comments. I had an ex guildy in my last MMO that played easy 40 hours cause he played at his business he owned all day (usually) and after a whole year never had a max level char. So do I consider him hardcore because he played 40+ hours? Hardcore maybe in time, but not hardcore in attitude in game. I'm pretty sure if a player with a hardcore attitude that still only plays 8-12 hours a week could be max level in Rift within a couple week easy.
I downloaded and played this weekend, only got to level 6 because its just quest quest quest ow boring, its boring being the saviour of the world from the very moment you make your character, its boring going from NPC to NPC questing, only thing good about the game is its actually quite difficult in that you do die alot if you dont use them potions.
Been playing mortal online which is totally different and im bored of that too, what can i try next? honestly theres no "feel" anymore, i havnt played an mmorpg in ages iv played two this week and im crapped out already!
Cant be bored of the genre can i?
I think it's the games, I think they are all crap now for the most part. I think the communities are gone, etc. They turned most into a theme park style play and most of them just don't really immerse you into the game anymore. They just wanna zip you through for reasons I don't know. Rift is a prime example of that. Boring combat and quests that you don't even have to bother reading to do and much of the same old crap.
I think your best bet is to wait till GW2 and give that one a go. Seems to be a bit more groundbreaking and something new. Looks like it will cater to all facets of the MMO world as well. Will just have to see.
Ive capped several chars in lotro, but the game stops there for me. Just cant enjoy the mindless runs of instances for gear.
The fact that you cant run raids unless you have this class and that class.(The holy trinity starts to get old).
The fact that you have to run said raid eleventy times over and over again....
There must be something else....
Agreed.
MMOs should either have a lot longer before you enter the endgame or they need a lot more options for the endgame. Raiding, group dungeons, daily quests and battlegrounds is not enough to do. Nothing wrong with any of them but there really should be more options than that.
While i do agree with you, what is it that players want more, i hear alot of people say they want something else, but none of them come up with anything, and i myself don't really know what else they should implement but still feel like there must be something else.
I was hoping for a lot more engaging quests. Simply by engaging, you could probably remove the quest helper functionality of the game and probably improve them by 50% right there alone. Quests should be well written, they shouldn't make someone go all way across two zones, talk to someone, then walk all way back (unless it's very important for the story it's telling.), quests also shouldn't be linear and personally, other than the start zone, I don't think quests should even be shown with markers above characters heads. I like to figure stuff out. It's why I play RPGs!!!!! There's nothing to explore, find out, etc. it's just like a shooting gallery sort of how it is now. Areas should be larger than Rift, for sure. Now I really don't know about Vanguard big, but should still be much bigger than Rift. Simply just kill about 30 levels. Make the game with 20 levels but least 20 harder levels and make it where a lot of the stuff is mixed in zones, not the zones being level 10-20 then you never go back to them again.. I could go on and on about this. I have tons of fixes and changes I'd like to see and I do think I speak for a lot of people. But that's me. I know some people like this kind of game only thing is, it's been done over and over. It's time for something a little more in-depth and lot mire immersive.
I agree, but I don't know that I really blame Trion. For some sick reason, there are people out there that seem to really like this type of end game. Me? Not a chance. I just don't understand how people can enjoy doing the same fucking dungeon over and over and over again.... What else is there? Honestly, I'm not sure myself, and that's why I don't just jump on blaming the devs. For me, that's what Alts are for. Levelling is what is fun. I enjoy the exploration and the progressio.
I agree, but I don't know that I really blame Trion. For some sick reason, there are people out there that seem to really like this type of end game. Me? Not a chance. I just don't understand how people can enjoy doing the same fucking dungeon over and over and over again.... What else is there? Honestly, I'm not sure myself, and that's why I don't just jump on blaming the devs. For me, that's what Alts are for. Levelling is what is fun. I enjoy the exploration and the progressio.
I like doing the same (raid) dungeons over and over again, as long as there are mobs that we have not beaten yet. Afterwards it's just boring. Progression is the fun, oh yeah.
I agree, but I don't know that I really blame Trion. For some sick reason, there are people out there that seem to really like this type of end game. Me? Not a chance. I just don't understand how people can enjoy doing the same fucking dungeon over and over and over again.... What else is there? Honestly, I'm not sure myself, and that's why I don't just jump on blaming the devs. For me, that's what Alts are for. Levelling is what is fun. I enjoy the exploration and the progressio.
Highly agree... I mean, I can do something over and over. I've done it before learning instances like MC when Vanilla WoW was first out. I think it was easy really but had a guild that had to learn how to do it all. So there was a small learning curve then when everyone got the hang of it, had to run it several times to get people geared to move to BWL. Even if I was already geared with the full set from MC, I ran it over and over to help others so we could progress. That was fine for me. But how it is now for most these games, the content is too easy. Like said, I raid only 2 nights a week currently on WoW and we beat it all. (Well, we still got heroics version of raids we haven't finished yet. but it's lackluster compared to facing a new boss no one knows or seen before.)
The main problem is that Rift is a little too easy to level up in. They should make it happen somewhat slower, a lot of people hit endgame during the month following launch, myself included. I don't think they anticipated that. They weren't exactly ready with a good endgame content package.
At that level I realized I am getting close to the level cap, and what am I gonna be doing? expert dungeons or warfronts? No thank you... So I left and never looked back.
Sad thing is thats all there is to do in any MMO it seems, you rush to cap and raid, I hate raiding I mean ok yah its fun, but I dont wanna be on a schedule and come on the same days every week to do the same dungeons... I wanna be able to explore the game and fight monsters with and with out people whenever I login, not at certain times every week!
Wish there was a game that appealed to that aspect, but it looks like nothing does.
I agree, but I don't know that I really blame Trion. For some sick reason, there are people out there that seem to really like this type of end game. Me? Not a chance. I just don't understand how people can enjoy doing the same fucking dungeon over and over and over again.... What else is there? Honestly, I'm not sure myself, and that's why I don't just jump on blaming the devs. For me, that's what Alts are for. Levelling is what is fun. I enjoy the exploration and the progressio.
It is not so odd, what is odd is that almost all MMOs have so few things to choose to do in the endgame.
The options are endless but we still get either doing dungeons until you get good gear and then raid or to do battlegrounds.
That totally blows, if MMOs want to keep their players they will need to improve the endgame and add more options. We already did the same endgame for many years.
They can keep the raids and battlegrounds for the people liking it but I think even the biggest fans of those things wont mind some more things to do.
It will be interesting to see how GW2 will do, it is trying something rather different.
Comments
I agree, I also really don't care what people do with their life. Who am I to judge?
What I don't agree with is when someone equals playing 40+ hours per week as "casual", when it's clearly not.
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- PANTERA at HELLFEST 2023
I downloaded and played this weekend, only got to level 6 because its just quest quest quest ow boring, its boring being the saviour of the world from the very moment you make your character, its boring going from NPC to NPC questing, only thing good about the game is its actually quite difficult in that you do die alot if you dont use them potions.
Been playing mortal online which is totally different and im bored of that too, what can i try next? honestly theres no "feel" anymore, i havnt played an mmorpg in ages iv played two this week and im crapped out already!
Cant be bored of the genre can i?
Ex. myth of soma, legend of mir, mu online and eudemons online player.
Current game : Runescape (until pc build is complete)
Seems that your are bored to whole genre.Or you got high hopes about the game,and u got shotted down?
There are still so many similarities between one MMO to the next that I think it is very easy to get bored and tired of the genre. There have been a few times over the past decade of MMOs where I went back to other games for a couple months, then it felt good to pop back in an MMO awhile later and I enjoyed it again. It sounds like that break might be what you need. There are a lot of good games out there right now in any genre to enjoy.
Ive capped several chars in lotro, but the game stops there for me. Just cant enjoy the mindless runs of instances for gear.
The fact that you cant run raids unless you have this class and that class.(The holy trinity starts to get old).
The fact that you have to run said raid eleventy times over and over again....
There must be something else....
Hauken Stormchaser
I want pre-CU back
Station.com : We got your game
Yeah?, Well i want it back!!!
Agreed.
MMOs should either have a lot longer before you enter the endgame or they need a lot more options for the endgame. Raiding, group dungeons, daily quests and battlegrounds is not enough to do. Nothing wrong with any of them but there really should be more options than that.
While i do agree with you, what is it that players want more, i hear alot of people say they want something else, but none of them come up with anything, and i myself don't really know what else they should implement but still feel like there must be something else.
This is exactly where I am at with any MMO right now. I don't enjoy endgame raiding for several reasons. I don't fault the developers for how they've designed it because I've seen a lot of people enjoy it. I just know that I don't. I love the design of leveling in MMOs though, regardless of how I do it. It doesn't matter too much to me if it's by PVP, crafting, quests, or just grinding mobs, etc. I really enjoy any of those methods, but count me out when it degenerates in to playing the same instances over and over ad nauseam. So I've just learned that when I get a character to max level, it's time to either level another character or switch MMOs. That's been work really well to sustain my interest with the genre.
I think part of it is definitely the leveling curve, because MMOs are getting increasingly easy to reach endgame that some of us don't enjoy. I think maybe something like extra advancement options or maybe no maximum level might help, although that creates the problem of some players being left behind by veterans. I kinda enjoy the idea of swapping out classes so you can level all of them on one character, but that gets old too. Maybe players of the genre just need to play other games until an expansion comes along? We're still putting considerably more hours in to MMOs then other genres of games, so I think there is just a point where even MMOs get old or fall behind on content when we wish they wouldn't. Maybe MMO companies can just hire more people to get content out faster as MMOs get more profitable? Or maybe more of us just have to look at endgame in MMOs as a 'game over' until the next expansion because that's the content we enjoy the most.
In truth, I spent the greatest portion of my Level 85 character's lifespan in WoW unlocking achievements and doing dailies. Since Raid content only resets once a week and after you have a boss on farm the thrill of raiding diminishes, one could argue that the little things are all you really have to look forward to in any MMORPG.
I think creating content that is fulfiling and rewarding to players of Max level will always be a challenge. Throwing raids out is the general consensus amongst MMORPGs of this type, but it may not always be the answer.
Dailies, Guild Content, PvP content, Fluff.. It all can't be done in one patch. The result is many people feel that one patch was a "waste of developer time" and get angry.
In short. You can't please everyone, but I'm sure research and staying in touch with the community can help create a positive atmosphere from each major content patch.
~Miles "Tails" Prower out! Catch me if you can!
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To be fair to lotro and WOW their end game contents far exceeds anything rift has to offer. Rift is one boring as hell game and now we are seeing the fanboys who didn't want to listen to any of the beta/alpha testers who actually told them how boring and sterile rift is.
I have noticed many of the avid fanboys on these forum who were shouting defending rift against all odds and now they come back with their tales between their legs forgetting their pathetic obssession with a game that is no better than most FTP MMO.
Polished it may be but it's a polished load of crap.
It's not that there aren't other options for content at endgame. It's that options other than repeating the same thing over and over again require a lot of actual content. "End Game" really means "we ran out of time to produce content, so you can do this a hundred times until you quit or we add more content".
This is one of the reasons I have to laugh at people who deliberately rush to end game. The leveling process IS the game, end game is just for masochists who like enduring repetition in order to earn some sense of achievment.
I guess we all fell into a trap, wanting enough quest content to level up on with out having to grind. It would be awesome if MMO developers could actually produce enough content so that leveling, with out mob grinding, would be a process that takes several months. However, they stick to the "quest to the cap" ideal, even if they only have enough content for a few weeks.
Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated
I defended the game myself, however, I was clear that my expectations were that the game would provide enough content for a month and that anything beyond that would be a pleasant surprise. Well, my initial intuition was about right. By the end of week 5, I was done. I got many, many hours of play out of it, so it was worth the box price, but nothing worth paying $15 a month for once you've hit the level cap.
I probably would have been able to get a couple more months out of the game, but the fact that alts have to follow the same exact leveling path killed any replayability for me.
Everyone has different preferences for what they want in an MMO. I actually like a lot about Rift, but IMO, the game launched with a third the land mass and a forth the content it would have needed to provide a worthwhile, extended game play experience. Plus, I feel that Trion has horribly managed post launch tweaks and development. (For instance, you can't rely on Rifts to be a major source of content, then make sourceshards and sourcestones so hard to aquire that players can't actually buy Rift currency armor and weapons before they completely outlevel the gear).
Oh, might as well throw this one in there as well. Factional PvP games with only TWO factions does NOT work! However, a third faction would have required more content and it's clear that Trion was just unable to churn out enough content with in the monetary and temporal budgets.
Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated
1. Quest grinding is even dumber than grinding mobs - because you delude yourself in enjoying content, while it is just a replacement for social gameplay - "Can't talk to people, talking to NPC's is my best social skill"... A quest would be interesting, if you have one quest that you follow for a week or a month, but not following 20 quest-arrows. Did you actually read all the nice quest texts?
2. Most people rush to the endgame, because the quest/solo stuff before is just dumb, boring, idiotic. They expect the soul of a MMO (i.e. social interaction in groups/guilds) to be in the endgame. Unfortunately Rift is copying here the worst aspects of WoW, War and other failures in human evolution (i.e. all the stuff that destroyed the community), e.g. solo-daily quests, pickup-rift-groups, easytobeat-dungeons (though calling them expert and raid - loughable).
There is a great article about how missing social interaction kills all the fun in the wow-clones: http://rupturadraconis.de/gilde/index.php?articles-show-27
Currently playing: EverQuest
Waiting for Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen
I think they should have made leveling take longer in Rift. It's to quick getting to max level. Just my opinion.
I'm sorry I didn't start my post with a disclaimer, "everything hereafter is strictly the opinion/preferences of the author and in no way should be construed as a fact"
But I generally leave it up to the reader to discern fact from opinion.
The thread I responded to basically said... "there's nothing to do in Rift" to which someone else replied "sure there is, you can do these 6 or 7 collection activities". Since I find collection activities largely meaningless, I responded thusly.
Sure, some folks may enjoy those activities, in fact, judging from the success of games such as WOW and others that is what is preferred by most gamers (sort of real life I suppose)..
Just not me.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
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Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
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"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
It is easy. If I was playing a game that would take more, it wouldn't be that big of a deal. Some weeks could be able to, some weeks won't. But 8-12 is far below any reasonable time for an MMO unless you wanna just play around in the lower levels. Even Rift doesn't allow that very well cause lower zones will be covered with invasions so therefore creating harder times to those that level slower. And you don't have to read the play by play. I do think it's crazy/stupid whatever, if you can't commit to an MMO a little more then a monthly subscription MMO is really not for that person. Cause I really don't wanna hear the whining in the game, best stick with F2Ps then cause you'll probably never have to really buy into anything cause you'll never reach max level where you'll have to pay-to-win.
And besides, the point of the casual was more a frame of mind, not how many hours they spend. We already established that before you go poking around previous posts at comments. I had an ex guildy in my last MMO that played easy 40 hours cause he played at his business he owned all day (usually) and after a whole year never had a max level char. So do I consider him hardcore because he played 40+ hours? Hardcore maybe in time, but not hardcore in attitude in game. I'm pretty sure if a player with a hardcore attitude that still only plays 8-12 hours a week could be max level in Rift within a couple week easy.
I think it's the games, I think they are all crap now for the most part. I think the communities are gone, etc. They turned most into a theme park style play and most of them just don't really immerse you into the game anymore. They just wanna zip you through for reasons I don't know. Rift is a prime example of that. Boring combat and quests that you don't even have to bother reading to do and much of the same old crap.
I think your best bet is to wait till GW2 and give that one a go. Seems to be a bit more groundbreaking and something new. Looks like it will cater to all facets of the MMO world as well. Will just have to see.
I was hoping for a lot more engaging quests. Simply by engaging, you could probably remove the quest helper functionality of the game and probably improve them by 50% right there alone. Quests should be well written, they shouldn't make someone go all way across two zones, talk to someone, then walk all way back (unless it's very important for the story it's telling.), quests also shouldn't be linear and personally, other than the start zone, I don't think quests should even be shown with markers above characters heads. I like to figure stuff out. It's why I play RPGs!!!!! There's nothing to explore, find out, etc. it's just like a shooting gallery sort of how it is now. Areas should be larger than Rift, for sure. Now I really don't know about Vanguard big, but should still be much bigger than Rift. Simply just kill about 30 levels. Make the game with 20 levels but least 20 harder levels and make it where a lot of the stuff is mixed in zones, not the zones being level 10-20 then you never go back to them again.. I could go on and on about this. I have tons of fixes and changes I'd like to see and I do think I speak for a lot of people. But that's me. I know some people like this kind of game only thing is, it's been done over and over. It's time for something a little more in-depth and lot mire immersive.
I agree, but I don't know that I really blame Trion. For some sick reason, there are people out there that seem to really like this type of end game. Me? Not a chance. I just don't understand how people can enjoy doing the same fucking dungeon over and over and over again.... What else is there? Honestly, I'm not sure myself, and that's why I don't just jump on blaming the devs. For me, that's what Alts are for. Levelling is what is fun. I enjoy the exploration and the progressio.
I like doing the same (raid) dungeons over and over again, as long as there are mobs that we have not beaten yet. Afterwards it's just boring. Progression is the fun, oh yeah.
Currently playing: EverQuest
Waiting for Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen
Highly agree... I mean, I can do something over and over. I've done it before learning instances like MC when Vanilla WoW was first out. I think it was easy really but had a guild that had to learn how to do it all. So there was a small learning curve then when everyone got the hang of it, had to run it several times to get people geared to move to BWL. Even if I was already geared with the full set from MC, I ran it over and over to help others so we could progress. That was fine for me. But how it is now for most these games, the content is too easy. Like said, I raid only 2 nights a week currently on WoW and we beat it all. (Well, we still got heroics version of raids we haven't finished yet. but it's lackluster compared to facing a new boss no one knows or seen before.)
The main problem is that Rift is a little too easy to level up in. They should make it happen somewhat slower, a lot of people hit endgame during the month following launch, myself included. I don't think they anticipated that. They weren't exactly ready with a good endgame content package.
I felt the same way around level 34 :O
At that level I realized I am getting close to the level cap, and what am I gonna be doing? expert dungeons or warfronts? No thank you... So I left and never looked back.
Sad thing is thats all there is to do in any MMO it seems, you rush to cap and raid, I hate raiding I mean ok yah its fun, but I dont wanna be on a schedule and come on the same days every week to do the same dungeons... I wanna be able to explore the game and fight monsters with and with out people whenever I login, not at certain times every week!
Wish there was a game that appealed to that aspect, but it looks like nothing does.
It is not so odd, what is odd is that almost all MMOs have so few things to choose to do in the endgame.
The options are endless but we still get either doing dungeons until you get good gear and then raid or to do battlegrounds.
That totally blows, if MMOs want to keep their players they will need to improve the endgame and add more options. We already did the same endgame for many years.
They can keep the raids and battlegrounds for the people liking it but I think even the biggest fans of those things wont mind some more things to do.
It will be interesting to see how GW2 will do, it is trying something rather different.