Except that there have already been a WHOLE LOAD of good first impressions.
This is the problem here.
People have staked their sides right from the outset and essentially, intentionally, ignored what has come before so they can fix themselves to news that supports a view point that they have had right from the outset.
And if you are saying that you didn't have a viewpoint right at the outset and this is the first "impressions" news you have seen then take heart: there have been many write ups that have already given the SWToR experience a hearty "thumbs up".
What going to happen is this. and you can set your watch on this.
Players on both sides are going to gather whatever bits of news and footage support their sides right up to launch and argue themselves hoarse. Many players are going to give the "I doubt this will make 300k sales" arguments. Probably because they can't possibly imagine that anyone else couldn't possibly not agree with their opinion. Oh, incidentlaly the top two movies of last week were Rio and Tyler Perry's Madea's big happy family. go figure on taste.
It's then going to sell way over a million easily from very eager people who are already chomping at the bit to play this one.
You are then going to get the same polarizing reviews after the launch. Whether or not SWToR is going to be able to keep those subs is another thing but I suspect it will be a hit in the short term.
This is going to be a polarzing game and I will also state that the people who are probably going to get the most enjoyment out of it are not going to be the old school die hard mmo gamer types or the people who are bothered by cut scenes in games.
Originally posted by ArcheAge Well UK PC Gamer May edition wrote this after their 48 time with the game..
I wont bother quoting the rest.
While I fully support anyone sharing their own opinion, just have a quick look at where he is coming from: Here is our resident writer, and his background is pretty strong in first person shooters. Battlefield 3, Bulletstorm, Black Op's, Hawken, Modern Warfare are all on the first page. If you go thru his 12 pages of things he's written, very few are MMO's.
To me, that's the point of view of someone who is coming to the genre without a lot of experience in it. So the marketing lines of heroic combat and such dont appeal to him, is it heroic compared to run and gun first person action? No, probably not. Is it faster, fluid and heroic when you compare it to other MMO's? Maybe (and yes, the faster and more fluid was definitely my impression when I played it at Pax East, but I compared it to MMO's, not to first person shooters.)
Acutally Gamebreaker TV had a pretty good episode going over the article, and Larry Everett from Massively made a pretty accurate comment when he said something to the effect of "the preview would look different if we did, because it would come from an MMO player point of view."
Anyhow, game needs all sorts of players, and to bring in people who dont currently play MMO's. It's always interesting to see how they perceive things, even if I disagree with much of what they say. Game isnt for everyone, never thought it would be either.
A good rule of thumb, if anyone says something like this;
"Why bounty hunters can’t reap the benefits of crouching behind a crate to avoid bullets is as big a mystery as why lightsabers can’t even cut through un-armoured enemies on a single strike." (by the way, by the laws of physics lightsabers are impossible so please don't question the "realism" of lightsabers).
It is best to instantly dismiss them. There is no MMO out there that will satisfy them.
A lightsaber should be able to kill anything with one hit? The same can be said with an arrow to the face, a two-handed sword to the face, a fireball to the face, a face to the face....the list goes on.
Bounty hunters don't use cover the same reason, in WoW, warriors use rage, rogues use energy/combo points, warlocks use soul shards/mana. It's called a class mechanic.
Originally posted by frunze Is he anti-MMOs in general? I didn't see that. The reviewer in PC Ganer UK was supposed to be anti-MMO but it tunred out he was a big EQ2/WOW/AOC/EVE etc game.
I'll call shens on the obvious un-truth.
Here is what he's done. Bulletstorm, Crysis 3, Black Op's, Modern Warfare, in 12 pages of articles he's done, I dont see a single one on EQ2, WoW, AoC or EvE, I do see a couple of interviews with the folks on GW2 however.
Folks, you've been trolled. Sign-up date as today, every post in this thread, c'mon now!
Well UK PC Gamer May edition wrote this after their 48 time with the game..
Plot Figures.
The visual effects of combat between eight players are fast,flashy and tough to read,but the actual business of killing people is SLOW. That means it may have some tactical depth at higher levels of skill and coordination,but it isn't hugely satisfying to play.
A lot of the compromises and oddities of The Old Republic come from BioWare's determination not to let anything get in the way of them telling a traditional,singleplayer RPG story.
It makes grouping up awkward-if you play different classes,you can't both make story progress together. If you play the same class,the story makes less sense and you have clone companions.
But if BioWare had sacrificed the story-driven aspect of their game,there wouldn't be much reason to play The Old Republic. Other MMOs have BETTER COMBAT MODELS and more IMPRESSIVE WORLDS.
Instead, they've gone with an awkward fit,but one i do want to play.
Early on,it's painful. The Old Republic has a cover system,but oddly it's restricted to certain classes. The Bounty Hunter isn't one of them,so when you've only got a few abilities you're really just standing there in a large open area hitting number keys.
I've heard BioWare call this `heroic combat`, but I wasn't really feeling it. When i hid behind a nearby wall to cool off during a boss fight,the boss couldn't figure out how to get to me and immediately went into `evade` mode, rendering him invincible and healing all the damage I'd dealt so far.
He did not play 48 hours, if that's what you're thinking! And what he wrote is just his opinion, which doesn't represent a majority! All the people or almost everyone who got to play the game this past weekend for hours... said the planets/environments and the graphics of the game are stunning. They also said the combat is awesome and some even said it was the best combat they ever had in an MMO!
You can call them fanboys or whatever you like, but you can't ignore all the positive previews about the game. It happened in GAMESCON 2010, PAX PRIME 2010, PAX EAST 2011, GB UK EVENT and now in the fan summit.
Btw it's a shame Mr Tom Francis didn't pointed out which MMO's he was talking about, im curious... since he seems to have zero experience with online games.
Did i say he played for 48 hours,nope i didn't, put your glasses on and actually read what i said.
And you can't ignore negative previews,seems you like many others can't handle negative reviews.
Again, put your glasses on.
Well UK PC Gamer May edition wrote this aftertheir 48 time with the game..
If you weren't talking about HOURS then next time, explain better. Because you know, people got to be in BIOWARE studio for 2 days.
The negative previews are minor, there are 60+ preview of this game since last year or something like that. And only a few were negative. I can handle negative previews as long they are constructive, what i can't handle is mindless idiots ranting about a game and a genre that they don't understand. Like the guy who wrote this article, his MMO experience seems to be zero. They must have thought "star wars game with story, must be like in the movies"... right.
Take the dragone age or mass effect games. Some people absolutely despise them. and just for the movie moments alone.
Some people (like me) don't like latest Bioware games in general, even if they loved early pre-EA acquisition Bioware games. We expect ground-breaking stuff, like Baldur's Gate series, and lately we get something like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMcVZQI6ybw
If SWTOR would be made by any no-name studio, it would not be judged so harsh.
First it was the PC Gamer article guy not liking this much at all and now this. I don't know but it sounds like good first impressions are not happening here. I am starting to think that 2012 will seem more likely for The Old Republic.
Except that there have already been a WHOLE LOAD of good first impressions.
This is the problem here.
People have staked their sides right from the outset and essentially, intentionally, ignored what has come before so they can fix themselves to news that supports a view point that they have had right from the outset.
And if you are saying that you didn't have a viewpoint right at the outset and this is the first "impressions" news you have seen then take heart: there have been many write ups that have already given the SWToR experience a hearty "thumbs up".
What going to happen is this. and you can set your watch on this.
Players on both sides are going to gather whatever bits of news and footage support their sides right up to launch and argue themselves hoarse. Many players are going to give the "I doubt this will make 300k sales" arguments. Probably because they can't possibly imagine that anyone else couldn't possibly not agree with their opinion. Oh, incidentlaly the top two movies of last week were Rio and Tyler Perry's Madea's big happy family. go figure on taste.
It's then going to sell way over a million easily from very eager people who are already chomping at the bit to play this one.
You are then going to get the same polarizing reviews after the launch. Whether or not SWToR is going to be able to keep those subs is another thing but I suspect it will be a hit in the short term.
This is going to be a polarzing game and I will also state that the people who are probably going to get the most enjoyment out of it are not going to be the old school die hard mmo gamer types or the people who are bothered by cut scenes in games.
As always, good points Sovrath
It's a form of forum pvp for bored posters and MMO gamers that are between MMO's.
Personally I don't mind much if people like or dislike an MMO passionately, what is annoying is the 'trenching' mentality, where people are so set in their viewpoint that they refuse to acknowledge solid and sound arguments from the other side, only fixated on arguments that support their own view and taste and thus heavily biased.
Recognising and acknowledging both positive and negative aspects of MMO's and their gameplay objectively is an art that few people seem to be interested in.
Then again, it has some good entertainment value, polarized discussions.
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Is he anti-MMOs in general? I didn't see that. The reviewer in PC Ganer UK was supposed to be anti-MMO but it tunred out he was a big EQ2/WOW/AOC/EVE etc game.
I'll call shens on the obvious un-truth.
Here is what he's done. Bulletstorm, Crysis 3, Black Op's, Modern Warfare, in 12 pages of articles he's done, I dont see a single one on EQ2, WoW, AoC or EvE, I do see a couple of interviews with the folks on GW2 however.
Folks, you've been trolled. Sign-up date as today, every post in this thread, c'mon now!
but..but..but its friday. we need Something to argue about over the weekend.
So a guy who called Rift "Refreshing and Exciting" says SWTOR is the most dull thing ever, that makes me wonder just how boring SWTOR really is, cause Rift ..... "Was neither of these things"
Finished in red for you :P....
But yea that is very interesting. Rift was refreshing and exciting for a month...(for those who have never played warhammer online)
I found the review to be interesting, but really what I expected the game to be. Nothing really new and exciting, lackluster and such. I still will check out the game and hopefully stay for longer than a month or two and not leave after the short time like most people do these days. But we will see.
If this MMO stinks, then there goes Bioware's "awesome rep"...
So if their rep goes down the tube...who do we have left that still has at least some credibility left tied to their name?
I am entitled to my opinions, misspellings, and grammatical errors.
Originally posted by gaou Originally posted by Baikal
Originally posted by frunze Is he anti-MMOs in general? I didn't see that. The reviewer in PC Ganer UK was supposed to be anti-MMO but it tunred out he was a big EQ2/WOW/AOC/EVE etc game.
I'll call shens on the obvious un-truth. Here is what he's done. Bulletstorm, Crysis 3, Black Op's, Modern Warfare, in 12 pages of articles he's done, I dont see a single one on EQ2, WoW, AoC or EvE, I do see a couple of interviews with the folks on GW2 however. Folks, you've been trolled. Sign-up date as today, every post in this thread, c'mon now! but..but..but its friday. we need Something to argue you about over the weekend.
Take the dragone age or mass effect games. Some people absolutely despise them. and just for the movie moments alone.
Some people (like me) don't like latest Bioware games in general, even if they loved early pre-EA acquisition Bioware games. We expect ground-breaking stuff, like Baldur's Gate series, and lately we get something like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMcVZQI6ybw
If SWTOR would be made by any no-name studio, it would not be judged so harsh.
I disagree because of how important story is to their game. there are very few studios that do story as well as bioware, and i think very few people would support a game boasting as much story as this one is, if it was some no-name studio. but thats just my opinion.
Well UK PC Gamer May edition wrote this after their 48 time with the game..
Plot Figures.
The visual effects of combat between eight players are fast,flashy and tough to read,but the actual business of killing people is SLOW. That means it may have some tactical depth at higher levels of skill and coordination,but it isn't hugely satisfying to play.
A lot of the compromises and oddities of The Old Republic come from BioWare's determination not to let anything get in the way of them telling a traditional,singleplayer RPG story.
It makes grouping up awkward-if you play different classes,you can't both make story progress together. If you play the same class,the story makes less sense and you have clone companions.
But if BioWare had sacrificed the story-driven aspect of their game,there wouldn't be much reason to play The Old Republic. Other MMOs have BETTER COMBAT MODELS and more IMPRESSIVE WORLDS.
Instead, they've gone with an awkward fit,but one i do want to play.
Early on,it's painful. The Old Republic has a cover system,but oddly it's restricted to certain classes. The Bounty Hunter isn't one of them,so when you've only got a few abilities you're really just standing there in a large open area hitting number keys.
I've heard BioWare call this `heroic combat`, but I wasn't really feeling it. When i hid behind a nearby wall to cool off during a boss fight,the boss couldn't figure out how to get to me and immediately went into `evade` mode, rendering him invincible and healing all the damage I'd dealt so far.
He did not play 48 hours, if that's what you're thinking! And what he wrote is just his opinion, which doesn't represent a majority! All the people or almost everyone who got to play the game this past weekend for hours... said the planets/environments and the graphics of the game are stunning. They also said the combat is awesome and some even said it was the best combat they ever had in an MMO!
You can call them fanboys or whatever you like, but you can't ignore all the positive previews about the game. It happened in GAMESCON 2010, PAX PRIME 2010, PAX EAST 2011, GB UK EVENT and now in the fan summit.
Btw it's a shame Mr Tom Francis didn't pointed out which MMO's he was talking about, im curious... since he seems to have zero experience with online games.
{mod edit}
Well UK PC Gamer May edition wrote this aftertheir 48 time with the game..
If you weren't talking about HOURS then next time, explain better. Because you know, people got to be in BIOWARE studio for 2 days.
The negative previews are minor, there are 60+ preview of this game since last year or something like that. And only a few were negative. I can handle negative previews as long they are constructive, what i can't handle is mindless idiots ranting about a game and a genre that they don't understand. Like the guy who wrote this article, his MMO experience seems to be zero. They must have thought "star wars game with story, must be like in the movies"... right.
{mod edit}
{mod edit}
You're missing the point! It's was like their 3rd or 4th time with the game, they did play for TWO days but in small sessions of 7/9 hours. It's not their 48 time with the game, they didn't had 48 hours hands-on with the game. Get it now?! Like i said, next time explain it better or try not to make random numbers!
And i will say again, i can handle negative previews, what i can't handle is mindless people and ridiculous expectations.
I agree with you that negative reviews should just be taken for what it's worth, it's obvious that not everyone likes the same game or book or movie etc.
What I disagree with or find more annoying (because of its repetitiveness) is how some people with an anti-TOR sentiment are always so eager to jump on any negative news that they can find, make it look big and ignore every positive news there is in an almost autistic way. There's no objectivity or even attempt in taking a more balanced viewpoint.
Which, when looked at objectively, is that the vast majority of previews and reports is predominantly positive about SWTOR.
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
I don think the masses really want different. If SWTOR is polished and relatively bug free it will sell like hot cakes even if its just WoW in space.
Playing: PO, EVE Waiting for: WoD Favourite MMOs: VG, EVE, FE and DDO Any person who expresses rage and loathing for an MMO is preposterous. He or she is like a person who has put on full armor and attacked a hot fudge sundae.
Originally posted by gaou I disagree because of how important story is to their game. there are very few studios that do story as well as bioware, and i think very few people would support a game boasting as much story as this one is, if it was some no-name studio. but thats just my opinion.
I'd agree with that.
One of the reasons I'm interested to see what Ragnar Tornquist is doing with The Secret World. To me, he's been a storyteller, and his blog on the topic is really interesting. Bioware may be betting the biggest on story, but they arent the only one who felt that was a path worth taking.
(With the proviso that TSW is doing a lot of things differently, but they do share that a focus on story.)
I'm starting to wonder about reviews on MMORPGs in general, anymore. These games aren't meant to be reviewed after 2 days of play but to be fair from 1 month to 3 to give an accurate assessment.
I'm also starting to think that I just don't agree with critics of all things entertainment, not just movie/song critics. I can now apply my prejudice to the gaming world as well. Soooo many times have I gone to see a movie or hear a song that is touted as great or horrible by critics and I find the experience the complete opposite of what they espoused.
I remember playing Warhammer Online for a few hours a month or 2 before it launched. I look back and think, what would I have said if I had to report my experience? I guarantee my perception of the game for that small amount of playtime did NOT equal my perception of the game 3 months after launch.
My point is, take any "review" with a grain of salt and be prepared to make up your own mind when the game launches.
Thanks to this article, the obscure site will probably get more hits in next few days than it normally gets in a month. If it had been positive or even neutral, nobody would have cared or probably even care to mention it.
This.
I'm glad I don't pay attention to reviews much, unless they are all saying the same thing...which they are not about SWTOR.
Well see, my point has been made from earlier. Look at all this debate, in a couple of hours we have 10 pages of arguing about the stupid article. Guess what? HE ACCOMPLISHED WHAT HE WANTED, and everyone is talking about the site and the article, mission accomplished I would say.
Have Played: FFXI, WoW, Aion, DCUO Waiting For: TSW, World of Darkness, SWTOR Currently Playing: KOTOR Tried: Matrix Online, Rift, Xsyon, LOTRO, EVE, Guild Wars
Not all those who wander are lost. -J.R.R. Tolkien
Recognising and acknowledging both positive and negative aspects of MMO's and their gameplay objectively is an art that few people seem to be interested in.
thanks!
And that really is the point, looking past the smoke and mirrors and finding out what is the "truth" seems to be an art that is overlooked. Having said that, it really is more about which truth resonates with the receiver, provided that it is being presented in a way that is more about delving into what the item "is" as opposed to just giving opinions so that some reviewer can create a persona.
One of the reviewers I reall like is "movie Bob" on the Escapist. Now, I don't always agree with his reviews, especially when it becomes clear where he is coming from. What I DO like is that he is always fast to indicate that he might not be the intended audience, he gives examples and backs them up with more examples, and he sometimes will give a review that is based on his opinion and then based on what he thinks the intended audience would like.
THAT is the way a review should be.
Right now I could easily review any number of movies or books or music or games based on what I like. But I would feel uncomfortable giving that review because I know full well that what I like is NOT what other people might like.
I would much prefer to give a dual review indicating what I like/hate, why I like/hate it and then assess whether or not the particular subject is successful based on what it is trying to be within the genre it resides in.
It's always ok to hate things. It's better to give detail as to why one hates these things.
We already know that there are people who despise the latest Bioware creations. And though I have my criticisms I actually liked them. Including DA2. But I also fully know that DA2 was a different type of story and not one that might readily resonate with the player who expects to be the big hero doing the big deeds.
We've become so used to being that sole guy who drops the ring into the fire that being anything else sometimes doesn't feel quite right.
I saw this game at Pax East first hand. I couldn't wait in line to play because it was a HUGE line and I was on crutches and it was really hot as the area was just really warm with bodies. But I carefully watched the game play, the large screen playing cut scenes and more importantly the players. Some were concentrating very hard, some were having a blast and some were clearly in the "ok what else do you have" group.
Given my brief amount of time there I can say that more people than not were into the experience. And the excitement was palpable. Of course these were fans at a convention so that will help weigh the experience one way or another.
I also know that based on personal experience, whenever I experienced something (mostly when I was younger) that I "already knew that I was going to hate" even though I never experienced it before, I more often than not hated it. It's like I was ready to hate it I just needed the first hand experience so that I could fuel that hate.
Now that I'm older a a small bit wiser (and more foolish) I've learned to take things on their own merits without forcing my preconceived notions on what they should and shouldn't be.
surprisingly enough, this also works exceptionally well with people . Would would have thunk it!
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
One of the reasons I'm interested to see what Ragnar Tornquist is doing with The Secret World. To me, he's been a storyteller, and his blog on the topic is really interesting. Bioware may be betting the biggest on story, but they arent the only one who felt that was a path worth taking.
(With the proviso that TSW is doing a lot of things differently, but they do share that a focus on story.)
Don't forget ANet with Personal Story in GW2, they also said about it just like BW people that they wanted to bring back the RPG in MMORPG
They wouldn't add it to GW2 if they didn't think story was a good addition and missing in MMORPG's of these days.
Originally posted by elocke
I'm starting to wonder about reviews on MMORPGs in general, anymore. These games aren't meant to be reviewed after 2 days of play but to be fair from 1 month to 3 to give an accurate assessment.
I remember playing Warhammer Online for a few hours a month or 2 before it launched. I look back and think, what would I have said if I had to report my experience? I guarantee my perception of the game for that small amount of playtime did NOT equal my perception of the game 3 months after launch.
I agree, MMORPG's should have a 2nd review after 2-3 months, because in contrast to singleplayer games, the gameplay in the leveling part of the game can be totally different from gameplay in the mid to higher levels and in the endgame content, gameplay in the first 50-70 hours doesn't have to be the same as gameplay after the first 150 hours, in fact that's often the case in MMO's.
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums: Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Bioware has made a lot of noise about how it has infused a series of deep, immersive, epic stories into its upcoming long-ago and far-away MMO – and how those stories set The Old Republic apart from any other MMO. The stories that The Old Republic tell will keep players engaged and involved in a genre which all too often comes down to collecting nerf livers and skipping dialog text.
Well, supposedly, anyway. Our opinion of The Old Republic, formed over two solid days of playing, is that it’s one of the most boring titles we’ve ever had to endure. It’s plain and staid and deathly dull. It’s both exactly the same as every other MMO we've played, but at the same time so much worse because it promises so much more. ...
Uh-oh.
Ohhmy gosh, really? Thats sad to read at this stage, but I really respect the seemingly honesty.
I will none-the-less purchase this game and play it out as I have every other mmo in the past 15-years. Whether I stick it out by forking over $15/months past my second month, is yet to be seen.
Originally posted by sJenksFTW Well see, my point has been made from earlier. Look at all this debate, in a couple of hours we have 10 pages of arguing about the stupid article. Guess what? HE ACCOMPLISHED WHAT HE WANTED, and everyone is talking about the site and the article, mission accomplished I would say.
You could apply the same thing to the OP who posted it, started it, and bailed. If stirring up debate is your kind of thing, more power to you, I understand that they have medicines that can help though.....
Comments
QFT Such a smart guy, that Sovrath.
I wont bother quoting the rest.
While I fully support anyone sharing their own opinion, just have a quick look at where he is coming from: Here is our resident writer, and his background is pretty strong in first person shooters. Battlefield 3, Bulletstorm, Black Op's, Hawken, Modern Warfare are all on the first page. If you go thru his 12 pages of things he's written, very few are MMO's.
To me, that's the point of view of someone who is coming to the genre without a lot of experience in it. So the marketing lines of heroic combat and such dont appeal to him, is it heroic compared to run and gun first person action? No, probably not. Is it faster, fluid and heroic when you compare it to other MMO's? Maybe (and yes, the faster and more fluid was definitely my impression when I played it at Pax East, but I compared it to MMO's, not to first person shooters.)
Acutally Gamebreaker TV had a pretty good episode going over the article, and Larry Everett from Massively made a pretty accurate comment when he said something to the effect of "the preview would look different if we did, because it would come from an MMO player point of view."
Anyhow, game needs all sorts of players, and to bring in people who dont currently play MMO's. It's always interesting to see how they perceive things, even if I disagree with much of what they say. Game isnt for everyone, never thought it would be either.
A good rule of thumb, if anyone says something like this;
"Why bounty hunters can’t reap the benefits of crouching behind a crate to avoid bullets is as big a mystery as why lightsabers can’t even cut through un-armoured enemies on a single strike." (by the way, by the laws of physics lightsabers are impossible so please don't question the "realism" of lightsabers).
It is best to instantly dismiss them. There is no MMO out there that will satisfy them.
A lightsaber should be able to kill anything with one hit? The same can be said with an arrow to the face, a two-handed sword to the face, a fireball to the face, a face to the face....the list goes on.
Bounty hunters don't use cover the same reason, in WoW, warriors use rage, rogues use energy/combo points, warlocks use soul shards/mana. It's called a class mechanic.
I'm also closer than I appear when seen in a rearview mirror.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
By the way, one screenshot he uses is from 2008 (assassin droid one)
http://www.swtor.com/media/screens?page=24
I trust that review about as much as I would trust any review about TOR from this or any other site. Not at all.
I'll call shens on the obvious un-truth.
Here is what he's done. Bulletstorm, Crysis 3, Black Op's, Modern Warfare, in 12 pages of articles he's done, I dont see a single one on EQ2, WoW, AoC or EvE, I do see a couple of interviews with the folks on GW2 however.
Folks, you've been trolled. Sign-up date as today, every post in this thread, c'mon now!
Well UK PC Gamer May edition wrote this after their 48 time with the game..
If you weren't talking about HOURS then next time, explain better. Because you know, people got to be in BIOWARE studio for 2 days.
The negative previews are minor, there are 60+ preview of this game since last year or something like that. And only a few were negative. I can handle negative previews as long they are constructive, what i can't handle is mindless idiots ranting about a game and a genre that they don't understand. Like the guy who wrote this article, his MMO experience seems to be zero. They must have thought "star wars game with story, must be like in the movies"... right.
Oh almost forgot, put your glasses on.
Some people (like me) don't like latest Bioware games in general, even if they loved early pre-EA acquisition Bioware games. We expect ground-breaking stuff, like Baldur's Gate series, and lately we get something like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMcVZQI6ybw
If SWTOR would be made by any no-name studio, it would not be judged so harsh.
As always, good points Sovrath
It's a form of forum pvp for bored posters and MMO gamers that are between MMO's.
Personally I don't mind much if people like or dislike an MMO passionately, what is annoying is the 'trenching' mentality, where people are so set in their viewpoint that they refuse to acknowledge solid and sound arguments from the other side, only fixated on arguments that support their own view and taste and thus heavily biased.
Recognising and acknowledging both positive and negative aspects of MMO's and their gameplay objectively is an art that few people seem to be interested in.
Then again, it has some good entertainment value, polarized discussions.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
but..but..but its friday. we need Something to argue about over the weekend.
Finished in red for you :P....
But yea that is very interesting. Rift was refreshing and exciting for a month...(for those who have never played warhammer online)
I found the review to be interesting, but really what I expected the game to be. Nothing really new and exciting, lackluster and such. I still will check out the game and hopefully stay for longer than a month or two and not leave after the short time like most people do these days. But we will see.
If this MMO stinks, then there goes Bioware's "awesome rep"...
So if their rep goes down the tube...who do we have left that still has at least some credibility left tied to their name?
I am entitled to my opinions, misspellings, and grammatical errors.
I'll call shens on the obvious un-truth.
Here is what he's done. Bulletstorm, Crysis 3, Black Op's, Modern Warfare, in 12 pages of articles he's done, I dont see a single one on EQ2, WoW, AoC or EvE, I do see a couple of interviews with the folks on GW2 however.
Folks, you've been trolled. Sign-up date as today, every post in this thread, c'mon now!
but..but..but its friday. we need Something to argue you about over the weekend.
Hehe, good point!
I disagree because of how important story is to their game. there are very few studios that do story as well as bioware, and i think very few people would support a game boasting as much story as this one is, if it was some no-name studio. but thats just my opinion.
You're missing the point! It's was like their 3rd or 4th time with the game, they did play for TWO days but in small sessions of 7/9 hours. It's not their 48 time with the game, they didn't had 48 hours hands-on with the game. Get it now?! Like i said, next time explain it better or try not to make random numbers!
And i will say again, i can handle negative previews, what i can't handle is mindless people and ridiculous expectations.
Have a nice day.
I agree with you that negative reviews should just be taken for what it's worth, it's obvious that not everyone likes the same game or book or movie etc.
What I disagree with or find more annoying (because of its repetitiveness) is how some people with an anti-TOR sentiment are always so eager to jump on any negative news that they can find, make it look big and ignore every positive news there is in an almost autistic way. There's no objectivity or even attempt in taking a more balanced viewpoint.
Which, when looked at objectively, is that the vast majority of previews and reports is predominantly positive about SWTOR.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
I don think the masses really want different. If SWTOR is polished and relatively bug free it will sell like hot cakes even if its just WoW in space.
Playing: PO, EVE
Waiting for: WoD
Favourite MMOs: VG, EVE, FE and DDO
Any person who expresses rage and loathing for an MMO is preposterous. He or she is like a person who has put on full armor and attacked a hot fudge sundae.
I'd agree with that.
One of the reasons I'm interested to see what Ragnar Tornquist is doing with The Secret World. To me, he's been a storyteller, and his blog on the topic is really interesting. Bioware may be betting the biggest on story, but they arent the only one who felt that was a path worth taking.
(With the proviso that TSW is doing a lot of things differently, but they do share that a focus on story.)
I'm starting to wonder about reviews on MMORPGs in general, anymore. These games aren't meant to be reviewed after 2 days of play but to be fair from 1 month to 3 to give an accurate assessment.
I'm also starting to think that I just don't agree with critics of all things entertainment, not just movie/song critics. I can now apply my prejudice to the gaming world as well. Soooo many times have I gone to see a movie or hear a song that is touted as great or horrible by critics and I find the experience the complete opposite of what they espoused.
I remember playing Warhammer Online for a few hours a month or 2 before it launched. I look back and think, what would I have said if I had to report my experience? I guarantee my perception of the game for that small amount of playtime did NOT equal my perception of the game 3 months after launch.
My point is, take any "review" with a grain of salt and be prepared to make up your own mind when the game launches.
This.
I'm glad I don't pay attention to reviews much, unless they are all saying the same thing...which they are not about SWTOR.
Well see, my point has been made from earlier. Look at all this debate, in a couple of hours we have 10 pages of arguing about the stupid article. Guess what? HE ACCOMPLISHED WHAT HE WANTED, and everyone is talking about the site and the article, mission accomplished I would say.
Have Played: FFXI, WoW, Aion, DCUO
Waiting For: TSW, World of Darkness, SWTOR
Currently Playing: KOTOR
Tried: Matrix Online, Rift, Xsyon, LOTRO, EVE, Guild Wars
Not all those who wander are lost.
-J.R.R. Tolkien
thanks!
And that really is the point, looking past the smoke and mirrors and finding out what is the "truth" seems to be an art that is overlooked. Having said that, it really is more about which truth resonates with the receiver, provided that it is being presented in a way that is more about delving into what the item "is" as opposed to just giving opinions so that some reviewer can create a persona.
One of the reviewers I reall like is "movie Bob" on the Escapist. Now, I don't always agree with his reviews, especially when it becomes clear where he is coming from. What I DO like is that he is always fast to indicate that he might not be the intended audience, he gives examples and backs them up with more examples, and he sometimes will give a review that is based on his opinion and then based on what he thinks the intended audience would like.
THAT is the way a review should be.
Right now I could easily review any number of movies or books or music or games based on what I like. But I would feel uncomfortable giving that review because I know full well that what I like is NOT what other people might like.
I would much prefer to give a dual review indicating what I like/hate, why I like/hate it and then assess whether or not the particular subject is successful based on what it is trying to be within the genre it resides in.
It's always ok to hate things. It's better to give detail as to why one hates these things.
We already know that there are people who despise the latest Bioware creations. And though I have my criticisms I actually liked them. Including DA2. But I also fully know that DA2 was a different type of story and not one that might readily resonate with the player who expects to be the big hero doing the big deeds.
We've become so used to being that sole guy who drops the ring into the fire that being anything else sometimes doesn't feel quite right.
I saw this game at Pax East first hand. I couldn't wait in line to play because it was a HUGE line and I was on crutches and it was really hot as the area was just really warm with bodies. But I carefully watched the game play, the large screen playing cut scenes and more importantly the players. Some were concentrating very hard, some were having a blast and some were clearly in the "ok what else do you have" group.
Given my brief amount of time there I can say that more people than not were into the experience. And the excitement was palpable. Of course these were fans at a convention so that will help weigh the experience one way or another.
I also know that based on personal experience, whenever I experienced something (mostly when I was younger) that I "already knew that I was going to hate" even though I never experienced it before, I more often than not hated it. It's like I was ready to hate it I just needed the first hand experience so that I could fuel that hate.
Now that I'm older a a small bit wiser (and more foolish) I've learned to take things on their own merits without forcing my preconceived notions on what they should and shouldn't be.
surprisingly enough, this also works exceptionally well with people . Would would have thunk it!
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Don't forget ANet with Personal Story in GW2, they also said about it just like BW people that they wanted to bring back the RPG in MMORPG
They wouldn't add it to GW2 if they didn't think story was a good addition and missing in MMORPG's of these days.
I agree, MMORPG's should have a 2nd review after 2-3 months, because in contrast to singleplayer games, the gameplay in the leveling part of the game can be totally different from gameplay in the mid to higher levels and in the endgame content, gameplay in the first 50-70 hours doesn't have to be the same as gameplay after the first 150 hours, in fact that's often the case in MMO's.
The ACTUAL size of MMORPG worlds: a comparison list between MMO's
The ease with which predictions are made on these forums:
Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
Ohhmy gosh, really? Thats sad to read at this stage, but I really respect the seemingly honesty.
I will none-the-less purchase this game and play it out as I have every other mmo in the past 15-years. Whether I stick it out by forking over $15/months past my second month, is yet to be seen.
You could apply the same thing to the OP who posted it, started it, and bailed. If stirring up debate is your kind of thing, more power to you, I understand that they have medicines that can help though.....
Note, I'm not meaning the person I quoted!