I chose for free once per 45 days. Playing on an extremely low or high population server kills an MMO more than pretty much anything else does for me and it really is unavoidable without having some sort of transfer system in place. Some guilds are just going to pick servers that end up being duds and if they don't want to re-roll they are just stuck with it in most games and usually the players just quit the game. As an example some of the Rift servers are completely dead now and Trion isn't going to admit to it and start merging just 2 months after release.
The only real reason why server switching shouldn't be completely free and open is WvW. All the rest is holier than thou pontificating. If you like your server and the folks there then just stay there. There is no reason why you should force anyone to stay if they, for whatever reason, want to be somewhere else. And all the "proper mmo" arguents are BS. Who the heck are you to tell me how I should play the game I bought just as you did? For example, I like making alts, I'm an altoholic and I derive more pleasure from that than from sticking to a single character for years and years. I feel I get to know the world and the game better that way. You got a problem with that?
That being said, WvW is another matter entirely and there is a real danger of people server-hopping to winning servers and thus abusing the game.
However, ANet already hinted at a solution. There were numerous mentions about a year ago that there are going to be TWO ways of switching servers. One would be a "visit" where you just come over to some other server and participate in PvE ONLY. The second way would be your old-skool changing server where you switch your "home" server and you can fight for its glory in WvW. I imagine the cost of actual home-server switching are going to be comparable to what we're used to in mmos so far with added limitation that you can't move to a server your world is currently at war with. The other part, "visiting" I imagine to be fairly free with maybe a very limited coodown if that.
Personally I don't see a reason why "home" transfers should be severely limited or paid. Some kind of a cooldown (say a month) would be quite enough. The vast majority of players won't move servers constantly. Folks generally like to stay in familiar settings. Introducing some kind of draconian penalties in order to hinder a few malcontents and thes hurt much more decent people with valid reasons to move ocassionally reminds me of TSA's "no child is young enough to be a terrorist" policy regarding invasive pat-downs.
I'm going to go with free but you can only do it once a fortnight. That system makes the most sense to me. Not restrictive, and yet it doesn't allow for abusing WvWvW. GW2, like GW, isn't a place for WoW-like cooldowns/restrictions. I understand the need for some form of restriction, but it's very easy to go overboard.
I think the Guild Wars fanbase are a spoiled bunch and the devs caved to unrealistic childish demands to appease GW1 Fanbase that had a similar mechanic. This isnt guild wars 1 however, GW2 is a full fledged MMO.
I think that this is entirely incorrect. One company doing something different doesn't entire fanbase is "a spoiled bunch" and their expectations are "unrealistic" and "childish."
I'd tread carefully from here on out if I were you.
Dont talk like were in a dark alley and you are some how giving some vague semblance of a threat.
I'll season my words with a little more salt and reword what I wrote
"I think ArenaNet in all their wisdom had such a catered too group of gamers, some would call this spoiled (no monthly fees, everyone on one server, play with all your friends, anywhere) that they tried to cater to every feature that GW1 players had and feature them in GW2. However, its a different game, with a complete different system, that doesnt work. I think its a have your cake and eat it too kind of situation and its completely unrealistic."
Even though I am not crazy with the direction its taking, I hope they figure something out that makes sense. The way it sounds now, its not a deal breaker for me, but I am not completely psyched about it either.
I think you should be able to transfer to a server for free, with something like a 48hr transfer cooldown, as a visitor. So you can group with friends and do PvE content (e.g. Dungeons) with them and structured PvP but whenever you try to enter WvWvW, you'll only be able to play on your home/original server. So in order to transfer fully, you'll have to pay a small transfer fee. Maybe they could also give 1 free full server transfer aswell.
That sounds like an interesting idea.
I think the Guild Wars fanbase are a spoiled bunch and the devs caved to unrealistic childish demands to appease GW1 Fanbase that had a similar mechanic. This isnt guild wars 1 however, GW2 is a full fledged MMO.
There a smart bunch and they have already committed themselves, I am sure they will think of something that makes sense. My ultimate fear is that there is so much moving, that you dont even get to make any true rivalries, and people who you like and expect to be on are doing something else, somewhere else. Guilds that you got used to seeing, nope there on another server now. I would hate to see that. It loses the sense of community imo.
Again, what stops all the leet PvP'ers to all end up on one server, dominating everyone in every WvWvW match?
The leet PVPers from GW1 will see WvWvW as something casual.Its also a hybrid of PVE and PVP, with PVE goals.
The 5vs5 areans will be their main game. It will also be the most balanced of all PVP in GW2. Just like in GW1 where 8vs8 was the main PVP game and alliance battle just something for PVEers to enjoy (not my thoughts, but their take on this anyway).
Also Guild Wars 2 PVP will still be about Guild vs Guild.
Then I welcome Non Guild Wars Leet PvP'ers, specifically the people who loved the Realm Vs Realm of Dark Ages of Camelot.
The only real reason why server switching shouldn't be completely free and open is WvW. All the rest is holier than thou pontificating. If you like your server and the folks there then just stay there. There is no reason why you should force anyone to stay if they, for whatever reason, want to be somewhere else. And all the "proper mmo" arguents are BS. Who the heck are you to tell me how I should play the game I bought just as you did? For example, I like making alts, I'm an altoholic and I derive more pleasure from that than from sticking to a single character for years and years. I feel I get to know the world and the game better that way. You got a problem with that?
That being said, WvW is another matter entirely and there is a real danger of people server-hopping to winning servers and thus abusing the game.
However, ANet already hinted at a solution. There were numerous mentions about a year ago that there are going to be TWO ways of switching servers. One would be a "visit" where you just come over to some other server and participate in PvE ONLY. The second way would be your old-skool changing server where you switch your "home" server and you can fight for its glory in WvW. I imagine the cost of actual home-server switching are going to be comparable to what we're used to in mmos so far with added limitation that you can't move to a server your world is currently at war with. The other part, "visiting" I imagine to be fairly free with maybe a very limited coodown if that.
Personally I don't see a reason why "home" transfers should be severely limited or paid. Some kind of a cooldown (say a month) would be quite enough. The vast majority of players won't move servers constantly. Folks generally like to stay in familiar settings. Introducing some kind of draconian penalties in order to hinder a few malcontents and thes hurt much more decent people with valid reasons to move ocassionally reminds me of TSA's "no child is young enough to be a terrorist" policy regarding invasive pat-downs.
I would like a solution in the way you described where you can visit any server for PVE, but not for WvWvW (green part). Or maybe also for WvWvW, but then with a cooldown or something before you can take part in WvWvW on the server you transferred to.
I think you should be able to transfer to a server for free, with something like a 48hr transfer cooldown, as a visitor. So you can group with friends and do PvE content (e.g. Dungeons) with them and structured PvP but whenever you try to enter WvWvW, you'll only be able to play on your home/original server. So in order to transfer fully, you'll have to pay a small transfer fee. Maybe they could also give 1 free full server transfer aswell.
That sounds like an interesting idea.
I think the Guild Wars fanbase are a spoiled bunch and the devs caved to unrealistic childish demands to appease GW1 Fanbase that had a similar mechanic. This isnt guild wars 1 however, GW2 is a full fledged MMO.
There a smart bunch and they have already committed themselves, I am sure they will think of something that makes sense. My ultimate fear is that there is so much moving, that you dont even get to make any true rivalries, and people who you like and expect to be on are doing something else, somewhere else. Guilds that you got used to seeing, nope there on another server now. I would hate to see that. It loses the sense of community imo.
Again, what stops all the leet PvP'ers to all end up on one server, dominating everyone in every WvWvW match?
The leet PVPers from GW1 will see WvWvW as something casual.Its also a hybrid of PVE and PVP, with PVE goals.
The 5vs5 areans will be their main game. It will also be the most balanced of all PVP in GW2. Just like in GW1 where 8vs8 was the main PVP game and alliance battle just something for PVEers to enjoy (not my thoughts, but their take on this anyway).
Also Guild Wars 2 PVP will still be about Guild vs Guild.
Then I welcome Non Guild Wars Leet PvP'ers, specifically the people who loved the Realm Vs Realm of Dark Ages of Camelot.
Heh, then you will see the same epeen wars in chat and on forums like in GW1 between players that prefer alliance battles against the ones that prefer Guild vs Guild PVP
There probably will be some restricting factor for changing world to do WvWvW. But I dont expect they will do the same for PVE. Hopefully just some cooldown period for WvWvW if you switch world.
I just couldnt get into arena in WoW and Guildwars felt the same way. Give me some WIDE open spaces where terrain plays an advantage and surprise plays a role as well. You cant have that in Arena type matches where the terrain and space played in is limited.
And to whoever thought it would be a good idea to make it as close to FPS matchups, uh, no thank you.
I just couldnt get into arena in WoW and Guildwars felt the same way. Give me some WIDE open spaces where terrain plays an advantage and surprise plays a role as well. You cant have that in Arena type matches where the terrain and space played in is limited.
And to whoever thought it would be a good idea to make it as close to FPS matchups, uh, no thank you.
There are some fundamental differences between arena PVP in guild wars and WoW. One obvious difference is that GW isnt about gear.
That aside, guildhall maps are not that small and terrain definately plays an important role.
Im not saying that arena PVP is better or more fun then WvWvW or the other way around, but you act as if its too simple and doesnt allow tactics and good team coordination. If you only look at the teambuilds and how teams play (can check it in observe mode) , you would see that its all about skill and team coordination. PVP'ers who like Guild vs Guild PVP in GW, like tournaments and the ladder system. It comes as close to e-sports in a MMO as you can get. They are not interested in steamrolling PVE'ers.
I voted Free(45day), but I think a cooldown between transfers should actually be longer though.
I hate that if your server suddenly dies off for some unseen reason, you must pay out more in order to even continue enjoying your game.
Transfers should be free, since the reason you are wanting to switch is/was usually out of your control, I don't see why anyone should have the right to charge more money for someone to enjoy their game.
Seeing that transfers cost the company money because it involves employees and they have to do the leg work.
So I say make it free for the first 3 months of account activation, then charge a fee after that.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
You do realise that these things are incredibly easy to have completely automated, right? Even the Blizzard server switching is 100% automated, they only intervene if there are problems.
Consider that realm switching in Guild Wars 1 and Champions Online is free and immediate, the only difference with WoW was an artificial wait time. ArenaNet could make it immediate if they so desired. But I can see the point of having a short artificially imposed wait for the PvP fans. I could live with that, despite not ever planning on doing PvP.
I have definitely been in situations where I was on a nearly dead server and wanted to switch out, but I didn't want to switch out cause of the silly 20 dollar transfer fee. The fact is, what people said before me is the case: Server transfers are a joke to make automated and I'm sure that is what every big name mmo does. So therefore, the $20 fee is a complete rip-off.
I would much prefer to see free transfers for both realm vs realm stuff and PvE. My take on this is - from a previous interview the devs stated they plan to make the realm vs realm last about 2 weeks for each realm. I'm going to assume that all realm vs realm switching will occur at the same time. Therefore, the player will have a timer where they can't participate in realm vs realm until that 2 week period expires. It could expire in 1 day, meaning the player only has to wait 1 day to realm vs realm(since the server switch for realm vs realm is about to occur), or it could expire in two weeks if the server switch just occured. You can always switch back to your home realm also, but you will have that realm vs realm timer on you no matter what. Also, there should be a short timer - maybe 1-4 hours, where you cannot switch servers after you have done a server switch. This would allow for 2 things. First, it would allow servers to not be bogged down with tons of server switches, and second, it would prevent any kind of griefing indirectly related to realm vs realm.
So yea, that is my take on server switching. Make it free and allow it to happen at almost any time, but don't let RvR griefing occur!
Again, what stops all the leet PvP'ers to all end up on one server, dominating everyone in every WvWvW match?
because they are in for the challenge and fun. thats the thing that makes them leet. in any pvp based game where there is server imbalance they are the first ones to cry for free/paid transfers to move to the weak side.
the ones who who will try to move to the winning side will be the ones who suck at pvp and want the epic loots( will there be any i wonder?) which will make the system more balanced.
i'm a guildwars fan; are you calling me spoiled and childish?
edit. oh, i said free transfer with the 2 week cooldown.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it." Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
I think the Guild Wars fanbase are a spoiled bunch and the devs caved to unrealistic childish demands to appease GW1 Fanbase that had a similar mechanic. This isnt guild wars 1 however, GW2 is a full fledged MMO.
I think that this is entirely incorrect. One company doing something different doesn't entire fanbase is "a spoiled bunch" and their expectations are "unrealistic" and "childish."
I'd tread carefully from here on out if I were you.
Dont talk like were in a dark alley and you are some how giving some vague semblance of a threat.
I'll season my words with a little more salt and reword what I wrote
"I think ArenaNet in all their wisdom had such a catered too group of gamers, some would call this spoiled (no monthly fees, everyone on one server, play with all your friends, anywhere) that they tried to cater to every feature that GW1 players had and feature them in GW2. However, its a different game, with a complete different system, that doesnt work. I think its a have your cake and eat it too kind of situation and its completely unrealistic."
Even though I am not crazy with the direction its taking, I hope they figure something out that makes sense. The way it sounds now, its not a deal breaker for me, but I am not completely psyched about it either.
Ok so your calling us spoiled? Look at the guy who doesn't get what he wants and calls other people who do get what they want spoiled. They will think of a solution that is fair and just because you would pay doesnt mean others would. Don't ruin others experience for your own. Who's spoiled now?
Our expectations are reasonable because we know Anet can deliver. What's wrong if we expect more from a company that doesn't just think of customers as cash cows?
Free with no cooldown. But with no bonuses gained from the WvW unless you've spent atleast X (3-7 days maybe) amount of time in that server - or no advantages until the next WvW cycle.
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been-Wayne Gretzky
in GW1 you could play on whatever server you wanted. don't see any reason for this to change now.. if they did.. it would be a step backwards.. which.. i don't see happening.. and whats the problem with changing servers anyway?
in GW1 you could play on whatever server you wanted. don't see any reason for this to change now.. if they did.. it would be a step backwards.. which.. i don't see happening.. and whats the problem with changing servers anyway?
My guess is it would be a problem because when people hear of server groupings for WvWvW and who has the advantage in the groupings players would immediately flock to the winning server. Imagine that occurring each time the servers are regrouped.
in GW1 you could play on whatever server you wanted. don't see any reason for this to change now.. if they did.. it would be a step backwards.. which.. i don't see happening.. and whats the problem with changing servers anyway?
My guess is it would be a problem because when people hear of server groupings for WvWvW and who has the advantage in the groupings players would immediately flock to the winning server. Imagine that occurring each time the servers are regrouped.
My comment about having a 'home server' would fix all of that, really.
Unless you're suggesting people would join a winning server JUST so they can help other people win, when it doesn't benefit them in any way whatsoever.
Comments
I chose for free once per 45 days. Playing on an extremely low or high population server kills an MMO more than pretty much anything else does for me and it really is unavoidable without having some sort of transfer system in place. Some guilds are just going to pick servers that end up being duds and if they don't want to re-roll they are just stuck with it in most games and usually the players just quit the game. As an example some of the Rift servers are completely dead now and Trion isn't going to admit to it and start merging just 2 months after release.
lack of imagination in this poll...
none of above
The only real reason why server switching shouldn't be completely free and open is WvW. All the rest is holier than thou pontificating. If you like your server and the folks there then just stay there. There is no reason why you should force anyone to stay if they, for whatever reason, want to be somewhere else. And all the "proper mmo" arguents are BS. Who the heck are you to tell me how I should play the game I bought just as you did? For example, I like making alts, I'm an altoholic and I derive more pleasure from that than from sticking to a single character for years and years. I feel I get to know the world and the game better that way. You got a problem with that?
That being said, WvW is another matter entirely and there is a real danger of people server-hopping to winning servers and thus abusing the game.
However, ANet already hinted at a solution. There were numerous mentions about a year ago that there are going to be TWO ways of switching servers. One would be a "visit" where you just come over to some other server and participate in PvE ONLY. The second way would be your old-skool changing server where you switch your "home" server and you can fight for its glory in WvW. I imagine the cost of actual home-server switching are going to be comparable to what we're used to in mmos so far with added limitation that you can't move to a server your world is currently at war with. The other part, "visiting" I imagine to be fairly free with maybe a very limited coodown if that.
Personally I don't see a reason why "home" transfers should be severely limited or paid. Some kind of a cooldown (say a month) would be quite enough. The vast majority of players won't move servers constantly. Folks generally like to stay in familiar settings. Introducing some kind of draconian penalties in order to hinder a few malcontents and thes hurt much more decent people with valid reasons to move ocassionally reminds me of TSA's "no child is young enough to be a terrorist" policy regarding invasive pat-downs.
I'm going to go with free but you can only do it once a fortnight. That system makes the most sense to me. Not restrictive, and yet it doesn't allow for abusing WvWvW. GW2, like GW, isn't a place for WoW-like cooldowns/restrictions. I understand the need for some form of restriction, but it's very easy to go overboard.
I'll season my words with a little more salt and reword what I wrote
"I think ArenaNet in all their wisdom had such a catered too group of gamers, some would call this spoiled (no monthly fees, everyone on one server, play with all your friends, anywhere) that they tried to cater to every feature that GW1 players had and feature them in GW2. However, its a different game, with a complete different system, that doesnt work. I think its a have your cake and eat it too kind of situation and its completely unrealistic."
Even though I am not crazy with the direction its taking, I hope they figure something out that makes sense. The way it sounds now, its not a deal breaker for me, but I am not completely psyched about it either.
Then I welcome Non Guild Wars Leet PvP'ers, specifically the people who loved the Realm Vs Realm of Dark Ages of Camelot.
I would like a solution in the way you described where you can visit any server for PVE, but not for WvWvW (green part). Or maybe also for WvWvW, but then with a cooldown or something before you can take part in WvWvW on the server you transferred to.
Heh, then you will see the same epeen wars in chat and on forums like in GW1 between players that prefer alliance battles against the ones that prefer Guild vs Guild PVP
There probably will be some restricting factor for changing world to do WvWvW. But I dont expect they will do the same for PVE. Hopefully just some cooldown period for WvWvW if you switch world.
I just couldnt get into arena in WoW and Guildwars felt the same way. Give me some WIDE open spaces where terrain plays an advantage and surprise plays a role as well. You cant have that in Arena type matches where the terrain and space played in is limited.
And to whoever thought it would be a good idea to make it as close to FPS matchups, uh, no thank you.
There are some fundamental differences between arena PVP in guild wars and WoW. One obvious difference is that GW isnt about gear.
That aside, guildhall maps are not that small and terrain definately plays an important role.
Im not saying that arena PVP is better or more fun then WvWvW or the other way around, but you act as if its too simple and doesnt allow tactics and good team coordination. If you only look at the teambuilds and how teams play (can check it in observe mode) , you would see that its all about skill and team coordination. PVP'ers who like Guild vs Guild PVP in GW, like tournaments and the ladder system. It comes as close to e-sports in a MMO as you can get. They are not interested in steamrolling PVE'ers.
I really disliked the PvP in a box that was WoW arena, Guild Wars was a bit better than that for sure.
free with the 45 day cooldown
I voted Free(45day), but I think a cooldown between transfers should actually be longer though.
I hate that if your server suddenly dies off for some unseen reason, you must pay out more in order to even continue enjoying your game.
Transfers should be free, since the reason you are wanting to switch is/was usually out of your control, I don't see why anyone should have the right to charge more money for someone to enjoy their game.
Just reroll. Its not supposed to take very long to hit lvl cap.
Seeing that transfers cost the company money because it involves employees and they have to do the leg work.
So I say make it free for the first 3 months of account activation, then charge a fee after that.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
You do realise that these things are incredibly easy to have completely automated, right? Even the Blizzard server switching is 100% automated, they only intervene if there are problems.
Consider that realm switching in Guild Wars 1 and Champions Online is free and immediate, the only difference with WoW was an artificial wait time. ArenaNet could make it immediate if they so desired. But I can see the point of having a short artificially imposed wait for the PvP fans. I could live with that, despite not ever planning on doing PvP.
I have definitely been in situations where I was on a nearly dead server and wanted to switch out, but I didn't want to switch out cause of the silly 20 dollar transfer fee. The fact is, what people said before me is the case: Server transfers are a joke to make automated and I'm sure that is what every big name mmo does. So therefore, the $20 fee is a complete rip-off.
I would much prefer to see free transfers for both realm vs realm stuff and PvE. My take on this is - from a previous interview the devs stated they plan to make the realm vs realm last about 2 weeks for each realm. I'm going to assume that all realm vs realm switching will occur at the same time. Therefore, the player will have a timer where they can't participate in realm vs realm until that 2 week period expires. It could expire in 1 day, meaning the player only has to wait 1 day to realm vs realm(since the server switch for realm vs realm is about to occur), or it could expire in two weeks if the server switch just occured. You can always switch back to your home realm also, but you will have that realm vs realm timer on you no matter what. Also, there should be a short timer - maybe 1-4 hours, where you cannot switch servers after you have done a server switch. This would allow for 2 things. First, it would allow servers to not be bogged down with tons of server switches, and second, it would prevent any kind of griefing indirectly related to realm vs realm.
So yea, that is my take on server switching. Make it free and allow it to happen at almost any time, but don't let RvR griefing occur!
because they are in for the challenge and fun. thats the thing that makes them leet. in any pvp based game where there is server imbalance they are the first ones to cry for free/paid transfers to move to the weak side.
the ones who who will try to move to the winning side will be the ones who suck at pvp and want the epic loots( will there be any i wonder?) which will make the system more balanced.
i'm a guildwars fan; are you calling me spoiled and childish?
edit. oh, i said free transfer with the 2 week cooldown.
I need more vespene gas.
Paid, as often as you wish.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it." Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
WTF? No subscription fee?
As many have mentioned before me. Free, with a cooldown to avoid pvp imbalance. Personally I don't care, knowing I'm not much of a PVP'er.
scribble scribble scribble
No. Just no. Paid transfers is ridiculous. This goes against ArenaNet's philosophy of being able to play with your friends whenever you want.
I think this would be a huge price to pay ONLY because of the Mists as in GvG this won't be a problem.
Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.
Free with no cooldown. But with no bonuses gained from the WvW unless you've spent atleast X (3-7 days maybe) amount of time in that server - or no advantages until the next WvW cycle.
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky
in GW1 you could play on whatever server you wanted. don't see any reason for this to change now.. if they did.. it would be a step backwards.. which.. i don't see happening.. and whats the problem with changing servers anyway?
My guess is it would be a problem because when people hear of server groupings for WvWvW and who has the advantage in the groupings players would immediately flock to the winning server. Imagine that occurring each time the servers are regrouped.
My comment about having a 'home server' would fix all of that, really.
Unless you're suggesting people would join a winning server JUST so they can help other people win, when it doesn't benefit them in any way whatsoever.