First, I want to say that I think we have really different things that we like and dislike about mmorpg's so what makes you skeptical about GW2 is very different from what makes me skeptical.
Part of what makes me skeptical is that there is just nothing interesting about any of the gameplay videos I've seen. At least to me. It looks kind of slow, kind of silly, not exciting. Again - this is my opinion and some will disagree, but when I see some dumb video showing simple physics in Archeage, I get much more jazzed than I have watching any of the action and combat videos I've seen coming out of GW2.
[...]
My biggest concern involves, directly but even more indirectly, the thing that has actually hyped so many about this game - the lack of a dedicated healer.
First I'd like to say that GW2 isn't going to be for everyone. It's really for people that the previous set of MMOs wasn't for, and anyone else who'd like to come along for the ride. So, if what you genuinely like about playing MMOs is being a needed, fundamental part of any group, having your chat light up when you log on because nobody could go on without you, and seeing people begging for someone of your particular job type over chat, then GW2 is less for you than any of the people who hated all of the above; who hated begging LFH, who hated waiting an hour to go on a dungeon run, who had to roll an alt so that they could play with their friends or guild because there was a shortage of healers, etc.
However, if you like helping people in a pinch, and being that last-ditch savior preventing a dungeon wipe, and being known for being awesome at what you do, there is still such a place for you in GW2. As you well know, ANet did say, don't belittle support by calling it healing. They consider it an honored role whose place is still vitally important in GW2.
As for combat, if what you're looking for is FPS-style reticle-aimed combat with collision detection, well, yeah. GW2 isn't that. It mixes up traditional skillbar-based tab-target combat because you can cast on the move and dodge or block attacks (without an RNG to determine whether you miss or dodge successfully), can physically get between a foe and ally to intercept attacks, and the like, but it isn't ArchAge, and it isn't Darkfall. Hey, I love the way ArcheAge looks too, but not one of the other features of that game appeal to me, so I'm here instead of there.
Also, I'll freely admit that there's a reason I don't play FPS's and that's because I am neither skilled at, nor do I enjoy, twitch-based accuracy-dependent combat. I'll find dodge-rolling in GW2 hard enough as it is, TYVM!
wait a simple duel button is on th wishlist you guys were just done telling us how its an combat focused game yet you cant duel another player?
"you still have to explore a bit".....................a bit? its supposed to be the best exploration mmorpg eva....
this whole game is just hype stacked on hype with a few little game play vids thrown in
trully guys someone come share with us what makes gw2 worth the hype? whats innovative? whats outstanding!
what is gonna make this game stand out above all else?
If the features that GW2 brings to the table aren't features you, personally are looking forward to, who can possibly tell you what makes the game stand out? If the features GW2 is presenting are, to YOU, the opposite of what is fun for YOU in a game, you will not see the appeal to those who differ from you.
I can guarantee you that for me, these are the features that make GW2 appealing over all others. It's not that ANet has decided a batch of features for the sake of being different, but that they have decided to make a game that minimizes the possibility for people to grief one another, and maximizes the possibility for people to have fun with little time investment, at every moment. This definition of "fun" varies from person to person, but ANet's definition of fun and MY definition of fun (and those who are looking most forward to GW2) are similar.
So, in short: dynamic events, the ability to participate in the open world without having to consult your quest log compared to someone else to see if you're on the same stage, not having to compete for nodes and quest mobs, not having to run half an hour accross the world to meet a friend, not having to AFK on a flight path to get to a dungeon, not having to risk being killed in the open world by another player while questing/harvesting/afk-ing, not having to LFHealer or LFTank before starting any content, not having to form a group to have fun (but being able to do so effortlessly), not having to put a dungeon on farm mode to equip oneself in armor that is 1% better than anything else in the game, having skills and weapons that make sense underwater, where guns and fireballs wouldn't work......
These are things that make GW2 different and stand out. These are the things that fans are looking forward to. If these factors sound like a nightmare to you, keep in mind GW2 isn't for everyone. It's for those who feel the above are good things.
an answer with no hype you sir are win. first one to actualy read my post with out there eyes all full of hype.
see theres a few things i like in there i like the not being able to use fireballs etc under water thats really nice...dynamic events yerp i like them too.
the no pvp should be dealt with by pvp and non pvp servers very strange idea that one.
no competing for resoucres? well good luck trying to sell anything crafted..
and why would you wana be able to solo the entire game...why would you not wana get a group to get better armor?
whats with all the instant gratifaction stuff? theres gonna be nothing to do by max lvl whats gonna be the point to keep playing. this is a really strange way to go..
I guess they really are catering to a very select group of gw1 players..
anyway thanx for an actual answer. I will probably now give it a miss as most of those "features" i would consider problems.
I like to work for things in my games..I dont wana be given things easily whats the point.
why would you want all those things made easy mode dont gw players like a challange? they dont like to put in time or effort?
well for all the people wanting extreme easy mode mmorpg i guess this ones for you..i for one like risk,competition and progression.
for all those BUT the avid gw player this is gonna be a major flop. maybe im a bit elitist but i like to work for my stuff i want it to be hard as hell for others to get my gear i wana be the best tank on the server etc...
if this is how it comes out GW2 is gonna be the baby of the mmorpg scene making games like champions online look hard lmao
I really hope most of those "features" dont make it into the game..we dont need dev companys making mmorpg's easyier lol..this is catering for the whiners who i would personaly like to grill over some charcoals.
(maybe they are making a game for the whiner?)
if so they should serve it with cheese:)
The features in GW2 are based on ArenaNet's development philosophy and are consistent to the features that were in GW1 (though implemented differently, for example, the prevalent instancing in GW1 was there to prevent the killstealing that occurs in other MMOs, the immersion-breaking of having a boss pop up right after you killed it, etc.). It has sold 7 million copies across three chapters and an expansion and done better than the publishers had imagined... enough so that GW2 was greenlit and given wide berth to develop with a 200+ crew and release when it's ready.
So, could be you're wrong about the size of the audience that would enjoy such a game . Fortunately for you, there are plenty of other games that make you work and grind and force you to group for your incrementally superior rewards and grind newbies and carebears into dust! This is just the one that won't.
First, I want to say that I think we have really different things that we like and dislike about mmorpg's so what makes you skeptical about GW2 is very different from what makes me skeptical.
Part of what makes me skeptical is that there is just nothing interesting about any of the gameplay videos I've seen. At least to me. It looks kind of slow, kind of silly, not exciting. Again - this is my opinion and some will disagree, but when I see some dumb video showing simple physics in Archeage, I get much more jazzed than I have watching any of the action and combat videos I've seen coming out of GW2.
[...]
My biggest concern involves, directly but even more indirectly, the thing that has actually hyped so many about this game - the lack of a dedicated healer.
First I'd like to say that GW2 isn't going to be for everyone. It's really for people that the previous set of MMOs wasn't for, and anyone else who'd like to come along for the ride. So, if what you genuinely like about playing MMOs is being a needed, fundamental part of any group, having your chat light up when you log on because nobody could go on without you, and seeing people begging for someone of your particular job type over chat, then GW2 is less for you than any of the people who hated all of the above; who hated begging LFH, who hated waiting an hour to go on a dungeon run, who had to roll an alt so that they could play with their friends or guild because there was a shortage of healers, etc.
That does not describe me.
However, if you like helping people in a pinch, and being that last-ditch savior preventing a dungeon wipe, and being known for being awesome at what you do, there is still such a place for you in GW2. As you well know, ANet did say, don't belittle support by calling it healing. They consider it an honored role whose place is still vitally important in GW2.
That does describe me. And I like doing that as a healer.
As for combat, if what you're looking for is FPS-style reticle-aimed combat with collision detection, well, yeah. GW2 isn't that. It mixes up traditional skillbar-based tab-target combat because you can cast on the move and dodge or block attacks (without an RNG to determine whether you miss or dodge successfully), can physically get between a foe and ally to intercept attacks, and the like,
That sounds fun!
but it isn't ArchAge, and it isn't Darkfall. Hey, I love the way ArcheAge looks too, but not one of the other features of that game appeal to me, so I'm here instead of there.
Also, I'll freely admit that there's a reason I don't play FPS's and that's because I am neither skilled at, nor do I enjoy, twitch-based accuracy-dependent combat. I'll find dodge-rolling in GW2 hard enough as it is, TYVM!
That describes me as well! If we both end up liking GW2 we need to get into a guild together!
I hope GW2 will be for me. I hope any new game will be for me because I love games and want to play something fun and different. You didn't really address any of my actual concerns, though. Not that you should have but I'm still trying to figure out why you quoted me.
I was pleasantly surprised when I went from Apprentice to full 5 star Elite in under 2 months. I was pleasantly surprised again when I went from Elite to just barely Hardcore in 2 weeks. Apprentice, here I come!
wait a simple duel button is on th wishlist you guys were just done telling us how its an combat focused game yet you cant duel another player?
"you still have to explore a bit".....................a bit? its supposed to be the best exploration mmorpg eva....
this whole game is just hype stacked on hype with a few little game play vids thrown in
trully guys someone come share with us what makes gw2 worth the hype? whats innovative? whats outstanding!
what is gonna make this game stand out above all else?
If the features that GW2 brings to the table aren't features you, personally are looking forward to, who can possibly tell you what makes the game stand out? If the features GW2 is presenting are, to YOU, the opposite of what is fun for YOU in a game, you will not see the appeal to those who differ from you.
I can guarantee you that for me, these are the features that make GW2 appealing over all others. It's not that ANet has decided a batch of features for the sake of being different, but that they have decided to make a game that minimizes the possibility for people to grief one another, and maximizes the possibility for people to have fun with little time investment, at every moment. This definition of "fun" varies from person to person, but ANet's definition of fun and MY definition of fun (and those who are looking most forward to GW2) are similar.
So, in short: dynamic events, the ability to participate in the open world without having to consult your quest log compared to someone else to see if you're on the same stage, not having to compete for nodes and quest mobs, not having to run half an hour accross the world to meet a friend, not having to AFK on a flight path to get to a dungeon, not having to risk being killed in the open world by another player while questing/harvesting/afk-ing, not having to LFHealer or LFTank before starting any content, not having to form a group to have fun (but being able to do so effortlessly), not having to put a dungeon on farm mode to equip oneself in armor that is 1% better than anything else in the game, having skills and weapons that make sense underwater, where guns and fireballs wouldn't work......
These are things that make GW2 different and stand out. These are the things that fans are looking forward to. If these factors sound like a nightmare to you, keep in mind GW2 isn't for everyone. It's for those who feel the above are good things.
an answer with no hype you sir are win. first one to actualy read my post with out there eyes all full of hype.
see theres a few things i like in there i like the not being able to use fireballs etc under water thats really nice...dynamic events yerp i like them too.
the no pvp should be dealt with by pvp and non pvp servers very strange idea that one.
no competing for resoucres? well good luck trying to sell anything crafted..
and why would you wana be able to solo the entire game...why would you not wana get a group to get better armor?
whats with all the instant gratifaction stuff? theres gonna be nothing to do by max lvl whats gonna be the point to keep playing. this is a really strange way to go..
I guess they really are catering to a very select group of gw1 players..
anyway thanx for an actual answer. I will probably now give it a miss as most of those "features" i would consider problems.
I like to work for things in my games..I dont wana be given things easily whats the point.
why would you want all those things made easy mode dont gw players like a challange? they dont like to put in time or effort?
well for all the people wanting extreme easy mode mmorpg i guess this ones for you..i for one like risk,competition and progression.
for all those BUT the avid gw player this is gonna be a major flop. maybe im a bit elitist but i like to work for my stuff i want it to be hard as hell for others to get my gear i wana be the best tank on the server etc...
if this is how it comes out GW2 is gonna be the baby of the mmorpg scene making games like champions online look hard lmao
I really hope most of those "features" dont make it into the game..we dont need dev companys making mmorpg's easyier lol..this is catering for the whiners who i would personaly like to grill over some charcoals.
(maybe they are making a game for the whiner?)
if so they should serve it with cheese:)
With all due respect, I don't think you're giving the game the benefit of the doubt. Or you're seeing something is different and drawing a conclusion that it won't work rather than asking a followup question on how that could work.
For instance, you say "no competing for resoucres? well good luck trying to sell anything crafted.." when hearing about node sharing, but you're not giving ArenaNet some credit for making a change to the node system and not following through with how that would affect the crafting system. Maybe nodes are much rarer to make up for everybody being able to whack them. Maybe recipes take a larger number of raw materials. Maybe nodes drop one ore for everybody instead of four to one person. Maybe nodes have rare drops that are the real limiting factor to recipes. We don't know, there isn't enough crafting info released yet.
I think what it comes down to is that a lot of us fans believe that they'll find a way to make it work or they wouldn't be doing it this way. Or maybe those of us who have done a ton of research on the game can think back to a page or an interview where a feature is explained in more detail than you're aware of.
Your post is too long to address all the points, but I'd say the same thing to you and anybody else...We're here because we like the game and we'd like nothing better than to help other people understand why we like it so much. If someone honesty wants to know more and has a question, we'll answer it. But if they've already made up their mind that the game will suck, we probably won't.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it."-Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
If one reads the design manifestos and watches the videos, one would think of GW2 as the Holy Grail and the coming of the Savior. Now while I am still very excited about GW2, so to get to known about the GW world and background I started to play GW1. Which rose some questions or skepticism about some things.
a) By and large IMVPO GW1 is no MMO at all, but merely a single player action game like Diablo with an Online Lobby. Sorry if that offends GW1 players, but that's how I feel about it. (It shouldn't offend anybody, Anet didn't sell it as an MMO but a CORPG instead) So for me, GW2 is ANets first MMO. (I won't discuss this, I simply state it.) Now the thing is: GW1 has only one sphere of gaming: killing stuff. And where just recently I wrote how Rift was an all time low with having just combat and nothing else... it sort of is making me raise my eyebrows and re-watching the GW2 videos. So my question is: how can we expect GW2 to be a MMO with more than just combat? I am just asking. I mean, I know GW2 won't be a sandbox, but I still expect of a MMO spheres of gaming which are not "kill kill kill". Like the LOTRO music system, like the fishing, like the many things you could do in blasts of the past? Because so far I have not seen any video or sceenshot or overview on GW2 that showed me anything else but combat, and that would be a serious dent IMVPO.
b) Ok, I must say this here clearly: BOY DO I HATE THE GW1 reward/loot system. My two main chars are not level 16 (of 20), which is a considerable part of the main content, and I am still in the same looking armour. Now you see, in GW1, you can't buy armour, there are NO auction houses (heck not even mail boxes!), and you CAN'T just buy armor from a NPC. You have to get materials too. Which is SO expensive, that after 16 levels of questing I had only just enough money for ONE armour piece, the chest piece, and then all my 4 plat were spent, because I had to buy all the materials too. I PROFOUNDLY hate the loot/reward system of GW. What I expect of a gaming sessing, MMO or not, is that I sometimes get some new shiny. Some new shoulder pads, some new cool helmet or whatever. And here... nada. You never loot gear you can wear, only gear you and dissect into materials and then add to some crafting stuff. It's just cumbersome, complicated and you are stuck with the same looking pieces all the time. I just hate that. I want those small cool reward feelings of getting some new shiny here and there, some stuff to motivate me to keep me going. And in this the entire system of GW1 just SUCKED. Sorry.
EDIT: I think it is so counter productive for fun. I mean, what is essentially all gaming about? Smashing chests and barrels to see whats inside. Maybe there is some cool stuff in there. Thats a very simple but basic motivator in a game, and taking that away is IMVPO a very ridiculous idea. Just getting money and mats or "tokens" to get stuff just isn't the same than waiting with glee for some luck to get a rare drop or what. It just is not replacement for this excitement what maybe will drop with some luck.
c) No mounts. GOD I was at times SO TIRED of walking, I mean, I know in GW1 you can teleport to the hubs, but some zones are so big, you walk them all back and fro, and its just sooooo tiresome. Now I read GW2 was not supposed to have mounts, even though it is an open world, and I must admit that KINDA blew me. I mean, ok I admit I am lazy. I want to get to places fast and not with uber slow walk mode all the time. Sue me. But having no mounts in open world of GW2 just sounds... lame.
There. Maybe some folks how followed GW2 more than I did can comment on this or clarify. Keep in mind this is MY opinion. Take it or leave it.
Guild Wars was designed around collecting skills to improve builds, rather then collecting armor. Sure, you could still go out and gather the mats to make armor, but there wasn't a great disparity between the armor stats. The armor, was mostly cosmetic, and when you wanted to get that cool armor, it took alot of work to acheive it, and farming for materials on the uber armor was not an easy task. You had to have the skills to do your job, and be part of a group of people that had the skills they needed. I myself thought it was a pretty good way to balance things between hardcore players, and the casual players.
At lvl 16 however, you haven't really experienced much of the game (maybe 30% at best), and I've talked with several people that felt the same as you. It's a different design then the traditional MMO. It really focused more on skill, and skills then the proverbial carrot on a stick of better gear. When you hit level 20, you don't have all the skills, not even half of them, and you can't get them all. You have to continue to level (you don't actually hit lvl 21, but you gain a skillpoint, so you can add another skill)
Titles are the other GW1 carrot. There are a ton of titles to acheive, and they are not easy. Survivor is a title that you can acheive after getting around 140,600xp without dying (lvl 20). The next tier for the same title, you need 587,500xp and the final tier (Legendary Survivor) requires 1,337,500xp without ever dying. There is also the festival events like Rollerbeetle racing, Dragon Arena, Snowball Fights, etc.
As for mounts, I have to agree. I do enjoy having mounts in a game, even if they aren't needed as such.
GW2 is implimenting a new system for crafting, which looks interesting and definately more then what was in GW1. GW2 is adding alot of different activities as well, and some of the game mechanics aren't about combat as well.
GW2 is going to build off of the best parts of GW1, and I think that if people can break away from the D&D-esque style of MMO gameplay, then they will really enjoy GW2. It definately will be different. I know that alot of people will like it, but I also know that some people won't. The best thing to do, is read the thread "what we know about GW2" as was suggested earlier.
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
If one reads the design manifestos and watches the videos, one would think of GW2 as the Holy Grail and the coming of the Savior. Now while I am still very excited about GW2, so to get to known about the GW world and background I started to play GW1. Which rose some questions or skepticism about some things.
a) By and large IMVPO GW1 is no MMO at all, but merely a single player action game like Diablo with an Online Lobby.
b) Ok, I must say this here clearly: BOY DO I HATE THE GW1 reward/loot system.
c) No mounts. GOD I was at times SO TIRED of walking, I mean, I know in GW1 you can teleport to the hubs, but some zones are so big, you walk them all back and fro, and its just sooooo tiresome. Now I read GW2 was not supposed to have mounts, even though it is an open world, and I must admit that KINDA blew me. I mean, ok I admit I am lazy. I want to get to places fast and not with uber slow walk mode all the time. Sue me. But having no mounts in open world of GW2 just sounds... lame.
Well, I left little parts of your message, so it's easier to understand what I'm responding to.
A. First of all, everybody who's a sane fan of GW already knows this. Nobody (Other than some very confused people) are surprised that GW isn't an MMORPG. If you look at the boxes, you cannot find 'MMORPG' anywhere. I'm not sure why some people always feel a need to start off by saying the first GW wasn't an MMORPG. Oh well.
Secondly, there's non-combat things to do... just offhand, you can water cows! Collect bunny rabbits! Put out fires. Fetch water for sad ogres! You can explore, and find sekrit things! There is at least one personal storyline quest that is based off of answering riddles!
There's crafting, and a marketplace. Uhm, and every town has at least a few activities. Now, granted, many of these are combat, or combat-esque (Bar brawl, keg ball, snowball fights), but there's other things like a giant music-machine and a shooting gallery. The latter two are in the human city alone, so even if there was only 2 non-combat activities per city, that would be 12 non-combat minigames. Thassalot. Dunno how many there will actually be, but we'll find out! I know in GW they had races (Think Mario Kart style...) with rollerbeetles, so I wouldn't be too surprised if there was at least ONE kind of racing game...
If you're hardcore, you can go find signs written in Guild Wars 2 languages, then translate them, because they're apparently all translatable! Go decipher those cryptic alphabets!
Also, if you can't spend at least an hour playing with armor and the three dye channels, you're hardly a man. Real men like pretty colors.
B. I could take this comment a little more seriously if you didn't clearly demonstrate that you didn't actually UNDERSTAND the loot system at all (You sold all your loot? ). It's honestly more fun when you know what's going on! I was always getting all giddy when I'd find pieces of stuff that I could disassemble to help mix and match my ultimate item! I mean, how exciting is it to find that perfect poisoning hilt for your sword, after all that searching? This isn't the system they're using for GW2, anyway, but the system of GW1 was more fun if you knew what was happening and why what you were getting was good or bad. (Oh, and as Eyelolled mentioned right above me, lots of it was about collecting skills! A well-skilled person in GW was way more awesome.)
C. If it makes you feel better, up until about a month ago, they weren't even sure they'd have walking. Yes, you'll be running! A lot.
Also, with your weapons sheathed you run quite a bit faster. It's sort of like having a mount, but without having to explain why something that should be increasing your combat ability (Mounted combat, whoo!) is instead stopping you from fighting at all (Ow, I got hit while riding my horse, now I have to jump off). I'd like mounts if they implemented a proper mounted combat system, but they can't put EVERYTHING in the game at once, and that would be a lot of work.
So rejoice. You have all the extra speed of mounts, you just don't have the appearance. Unless... you want a mount... just for the looks. Then sorry. :<
(Honestly, I'm not surprised GW2 people don't ride mounts, even in character. Everything is either slower (Like a Dolyak) than a person, too small (Let me just... climb onto this bird... whose back I just snapped...), too ornery (As soon as it stops biting my crotch I'll climb right on its back and go somewhere!) or too extinct (I've only ever seen horses as undead or made out of stars.) Humans on Earth are so screwed over by our planet. If we didn't have horses and such, I'm sure we would have invented teleporting too.)
If one reads the design manifestos and watches the videos, one would think of GW2 as the Holy Grail and the coming of the Savior. Now while I am still very excited about GW2, so to get to known about the GW world and background I started to play GW1. Which rose some questions or skepticism about some things.
a) By and large IMVPO GW1 is no MMO at all, but merely a single player action game like Diablo with an Online Lobby. Sorry if that offends GW1 players, but that's how I feel about it. So for me, GW2 is ANets first MMO. (I won't discuss this, I simply state it.) Now the thing is: GW1 has only one sphere of gaming: killing stuff. And where just recently I wrote how Rift was an all time low with having just combat and nothing else... it sort of is making me raise my eyebrows and re-watching the GW2 videos. So my question is: how can we expect GW2 to be a MMO with more than just combat? I am just asking. I mean, I know GW2 won't be a sandbox, but I still expect of a MMO spheres of gaming which are not "kill kill kill". Like the LOTRO music system, like the fishing, like the many things you could do in blasts of the past? Because so far I have not seen any video or sceenshot or overview on GW2 that showed me anything else but combat, and that would be a serious dent IMVPO.
b) Ok, I must say this here clearly: BOY DO I HATE THE GW1 reward/loot system. My two main chars are not level 16 (of 20), which is a considerable part of the main content, and I am still in the same looking armour. Now you see, in GW1, you can't buy armour, there are NO auction houses (heck not even mail boxes!), and you CAN'T just buy armor from a NPC. You have to get materials too. Which is SO expensive, that after 16 levels of questing I had only just enough money for ONE armour piece, the chest piece, and then all my 4 plat were spent, because I had to buy all the materials too. I PROFOUNDLY hate the loot/reward system of GW. What I expect of a gaming sessing, MMO or not, is that I sometimes get some new shiny. Some new shoulder pads, some new cool helmet or whatever. And here... nada. You never loot gear you can wear, only gear you and dissect into materials and then add to some crafting stuff. It's just cumbersome, complicated and you are stuck with the same looking pieces all the time. I just hate that. I want those small cool reward feelings of getting some new shiny here and there, some stuff to motivate me to keep me going. And in this the entire system of GW1 just SUCKED. Sorry.
EDIT: I think it is so counter productive for fun. I mean, what is essentially all gaming about? Smashing chests and barrels to see whats inside. Maybe there is some cool stuff in there. Thats a very simple but basic motivator in a game, and taking that away is IMVPO a very ridiculous idea. Just getting money and mats or "tokens" to get stuff just isn't the same than waiting with glee for some luck to get a rare drop or what. It just is not replacement for this excitement what maybe will drop with some luck.
c) No mounts. GOD I was at times SO TIRED of walking, I mean, I know in GW1 you can teleport to the hubs, but some zones are so big, you walk them all back and fro, and its just sooooo tiresome. Now I read GW2 was not supposed to have mounts, even though it is an open world, and I must admit that KINDA blew me. I mean, ok I admit I am lazy. I want to get to places fast and not with uber slow walk mode all the time. Sue me. But having no mounts in open world of GW2 just sounds... lame.
There. Maybe some folks how followed GW2 more than I did can comment on this or clarify. Keep in mind this is MY opinion. Take it or leave it.
If one reads the design manifestos and watches the videos, one would think of GW2 as the Holy Grail and the coming of the Savior. Now while I am still very excited about GW2, so to get to known about the GW world and background I started to play GW1. Which rose some questions or skepticism about some things.
a) By and large IMVPO GW1 is no MMO at all, but merely a single player action game like Diablo with an Online Lobby.
b) Ok, I must say this here clearly: BOY DO I HATE THE GW1 reward/loot system.
c) No mounts. GOD I was at times SO TIRED of walking, I mean, I know in GW1 you can teleport to the hubs, but some zones are so big, you walk them all back and fro, and its just sooooo tiresome. Now I read GW2 was not supposed to have mounts, even though it is an open world, and I must admit that KINDA blew me. I mean, ok I admit I am lazy. I want to get to places fast and not with uber slow walk mode all the time. Sue me. But having no mounts in open world of GW2 just sounds... lame.
Well, I left little parts of your message, so it's easier to understand what I'm responding to.
A. First of all, everybody who's a sane fan of GW already knows this. Nobody (Other than some very confused people) are surprised that GW isn't an MMORPG. If you look at the boxes, you cannot find 'MMORPG' anywhere. I'm not sure why some people always feel a need to start off by saying the first GW wasn't an MMORPG. Oh well.
Secondly, there's non-combat things to do... just offhand, you can water cows! Collect bunny rabbits! Put out fires. Fetch water for sad ogres! You can explore, and find sekrit things! There is at least one personal storyline quest that is based off of answering riddles!
There's crafting, and a marketplace. Uhm, and every town has at least a few activities. Now, granted, many of these are combat, or combat-esque (Bar brawl, keg ball, snowball fights), but there's other things like a giant music-machine and a shooting gallery. The latter two are in the human city alone, so even if there was only 2 non-combat activities per city, that would be 12 non-combat minigames. Thassalot. Dunno how many there will actually be, but we'll find out! I know in GW they had races (Think Mario Kart style...) with rollerbeetles, so I wouldn't be too surprised if there was at least ONE kind of racing game...
If you're hardcore, you can go find signs written in Guild Wars 2 languages, then translate them, because they're apparently all translatable! Go decipher those cryptic alphabets!
Also, if you can't spend at least an hour playing with armor and the three dye channels, you're hardly a man. Real men like pretty colors.
B. I could take this comment a little more seriously if you didn't clearly demonstrate that you didn't actually UNDERSTAND the loot system at all (You sold all your loot? ). It's honestly more fun when you know what's going on! I was always getting all giddy when I'd find pieces of stuff that I could disassemble to help mix and match my ultimate item! I mean, how exciting is it to find that perfect poisoning hilt for your sword, after all that searching? This isn't the system they're using for GW2, anyway, but the system of GW1 was more fun if you knew what was happening and why what you were getting was good or bad. (Oh, and as Eyelolled mentioned right above me, lots of it was about collecting skills! A well-skilled person in GW was way more awesome.)
C. If it makes you feel better, up until about a month ago, they weren't even sure they'd have walking. Yes, you'll be running! A lot.
Also, with your weapons sheathed you run quite a bit faster. It's sort of like having a mount, but without having to explain why something that should be increasing your combat ability (Mounted combat, whoo!) is instead stopping you from fighting at all (Ow, I got hit while riding my horse, now I have to jump off). I'd like mounts if they implemented a proper mounted combat system, but they can't put EVERYTHING in the game at once, and that would be a lot of work.
So rejoice. You have all the extra speed of mounts, you just don't have the appearance. Unless... you want a mount... just for the looks. Then sorry. :<
(Honestly, I'm not surprised GW2 people don't ride mounts, even in character. Everything is either slower (Like a Dolyak) than a person, too small (Let me just... climb onto this bird... whose back I just snapped...), too ornery (As soon as it stops biting my crotch I'll climb right on its back and go somewhere!) or too extinct (I've only ever seen horses as undead or made out of stars.) Humans on Earth are so screwed over by our planet. If we didn't have horses and such, I'm sure we would have invented teleporting too.)
You know I hate to craft. Or gather material. Or seek collection NPCs somewhere deep in the jungle.
Call me a WOW-tard, but I just love the fun and childish glee just to have luck and a cool drop, like a new armour piece or what. Or have some quest which rewards me with a nice piece of gear. I was just SO TIRED of all this ... THINKING needed in GW. 75 piece of this 25 piece of that and the 325 sources you possibly get it with identification kits and whatnots... SHEESH. Sorry if I sound lazy to you... but I just want to be hero, get my loot or reward I can wear, and of story. I just loathe this complicated tinkering.
You see, my life is complicated and demanding. So when I go play a MMO... I want to escape overmuch thinking, planning and calculating. I DONT want to calculate how many items of X can be salvaged into Y to use amont Z of it PLUS... well you get the idea. I know it sounds like a dork, but it makes my brain explode! All this thinking and planning for a simple gear piece. I just feel getting angry only writing about it!
Each to his tho. I wish they'd offer both. Crafting stuff for tinkerers and plain rewards and drops for heroic style players.
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
You see, my life is complicated and demanding. So when I go play a MMO... I want to escape overmuch thinking, planning and calculating. I DONT want to calculate how many items of X can be salvaged into Y to use amont Z of it PLUS... well you get the idea. I know it sounds like a dork, but it makes my brain explode! All this thinking and planning for a simple gear piece. I just feel getting angry only writing about it!
Each to his tho. I wish they'd offer both. Crafting stuff for tinkerers and plain rewards and drops for heroic style players.
Yeah, but I'm just saying the system is WORSE if you got to level 16 and couldn't even afford an armor set. That's beyond 'dislike the system', that's 'didn't understand what the system was'
Now, you can simultaneously not have understood it AND not like it now that you know what it is.
Luckily for you, GW2 allows you to get loot from drops, by buying it, or by crafting it!
So they do offer both. :T
Hopefully you're not too annoyed that dungeons drop tokens though. No hoping you're lucky, you're lucky automatically.
You know I hate to craft. Or gather material. Or seek collection NPCs somewhere deep in the jungle.
Call me a WOW-tard, but I just love the fun and childish glee just to have luck and a cool drop, like a new armour piece or what. Or have some quest which rewards me with a nice piece of gear. I was just SO TIRED of all this ... THINKING needed in GW. 75 piece of this 25 piece of that and the 325 sources you possibly get it with identification kits and whatnots... SHEESH. Sorry if I sound lazy to you... but I just want to be hero, get my loot or reward I can wear, and of story. I just loathe this complicated tinkering.
You see, my life is complicated and demanding. So when I go play a MMO... I want to escape overmuch thinking, planning and calculating. I DONT want to calculate how many items of X can be salvaged into Y to use amont Z of it PLUS... well you get the idea. I know it sounds like a dork, but it makes my brain explode! All this thinking and planning for a simple gear piece. I just feel getting angry only writing about it!
Each to his tho. I wish they'd offer both. Crafting stuff for tinkerers and plain rewards and drops for heroic style players.
Well I would have to say that GW2 may not be for you. At least I hope not, because if they dumbed the game down to the point of not having to think, then the game wouldn't be for me. I can't understand the fun of doing something mindless, which is probably why WoW isn't for me, but I found GW to be engaging. I don't want that to change. So I hope that you find the game you're looking for, I just hope it isn't GW2.
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
Im just having a hard time taking a guy seriously who talks about GW1 having a lack of challenge when there only lvl 16. Game doesnt even really start till you hit 20. Unlike other games 95% of the content is endgame of GW. Dont even talk about pretending to know anything about its difficulty until you are doing titan quests, or realm of torment, or at least Hard Mode of anything. You havent even completed the storyline yet. Hell id be surprised if your even far enough along to have full size 8 man groups yet.
GW doesnt start off asuming your an avid mmo player. They dont even pretend its an mmo. So yes they gradually scale things up and give people plenty of time to get used to things before they toss them into depths(at least in the prophecies campaighn).
Ive played lots of mmo's but never have i played anything as challenging as GW. Its the game where you cant just outlevel/outgear your challenges. You actually have to be skilled. When you hit max lvl(20), youll be fighting things that way outlevel(think lvl 28-32) and outnumber you consistently so you will have no choice but to either get good, or go no furthur. You cant just be 1 person out of 25 or 40 and have the rest of the 24-39 people carry your sorry ass while you just follow along. If you dont pull your weight, your team will notice (without an add on program).
It is also a game where there answer to making things difficult isnt just to increase the mobs hp/damage. Mobs will attack you with coordination and skill combinations. They will use teamwork just as your group is expected to. There is no tank and spank aggro mechanic in place in GW. Mobs will choose there targets based on the weakness of there targets HP and defense and position. They will move out of AOE's or stay and attempt to kill you anyway if they think they can kill you before they drop. The Monster AI is the best in GW of any ive ever played And that is why it is a challenge.
Hell most of the mmo's i play since, i will intentionally handicap myself just to make things a challenge, like not wearing top end gear. Otherwise compared to GW the mobs bore me to tears because there so stupid and offer no real challenge. Its all just memorizing patterns and taking advantage of sad mechanics like aggro control or some one shot kill gimmick. Most mmo players are more in love with the idea of having some magic loot that will make them a god, rather than gaining the skill of said god independent of fabled loot.
Im just having a hard time taking a guy seriously who talks about GW1 having a lack of challenge when there only lvl 16. Game doesnt even really start till you hit 20. Unlike other games 95% of the content is endgame of GW. Dont even talk about pretending to know anything about its difficulty until you are doing titan quests, or realm of torment, or at least Hard Mode of anything. You havent even completed the storyline yet. Hell id be surprised if your even far enough along to have full size 8 man groups yet.
GW doesnt start off asuming your an avid mmo player. They dont even pretend its an mmo. So yes they gradually scale things up and give people plenty of time to get used to things before they toss them into depths(at least in the prophecies campaighn).
Ive played lots of mmo's but never have i played anything as challenging as GW. Its the game where you cant just outlevel/outgear your challenges. You actually have to be skilled. When you hit max lvl(20), youll be fighting things that way outlevel(think lvl 28-32) and outnumber you consistently so you will have no choice but to either get good, or go no furthur. You cant just be 1 person out of 25 or 40 and have the rest of the 24-39 people carry your sorry ass while you just follow along. If you dont pull your weight, your team will notice (without an add on program).
It is also a game where there answer to making things difficult isnt just to increase the mobs hp/damage. Mobs will attack you with coordination and skill combinations. They will use teamwork just as your group is expected to. There is no tank and spank aggro mechanic in place in GW. Mobs will choose there targets based on the weakness of there targets HP and defense and position. They will move out of AOE's or stay and attempt to kill you anyway if they think they can kill you before they drop. The Monster AI is the best in GW of any ive ever played And that is why it is a challenge.
Hell most of the mmo's i play since, i will intentionally handicap myself just to make things a challenge, like not wearing top end gear. Otherwise compared to GW the mobs bore me to tears because there so stupid and offer no real challenge. Its all just memorizing patterns and taking advantage of sad mechanics like aggro control or some one shot kill gimmick. Most mmo players are more in love with the idea of having some magic loot that will make them a god, rather than gaining the skill of said god independent of fabled loot.
Good Post, Thank you.
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
[...] You see, my life is complicated and demanding. So when I go play a MMO... I want to escape overmuch thinking, planning and calculating.
Yeah, I can barely feel a change of pace when I log in to those extremely complicated MMO crafting simulations. Please dumb down the genre - it has become overly complex.
so to get to known about the GW world and background I started to play GW1. Which rose some questions or skepticism about some things.
If you want to look at Guild Wars to figure out how GW2 is going to turn out, you shouldn't focus on what Arenanet did in that game. You should focus on how well they did what they did.
Arenanet was smart with GW. They were careful to not bite off more than they could chew. The problem with most mmos is the the devs try to do -everything-. Very few development teams have the manpower and resources to pull that off. Arenanet didn't, and unlike most dev teams, they actually realised they didn't. So they made a fairly limitted game. Despite some issues, overall they succeeded pretty well in what they did.
7 million GW box sales later, they have the resources to make a broader game. Time will tell how well they did what they did this time, but things are looking good, IMO.
I personally would love to see some footage of non combat activites. The combat looks great n all, but this game doesnt seem like an mmorpg yet. Show me somebody making something, or socializing, or discovering a secret area or event. Show me the stuff that makes this game more than just god of war online.
I think other's have said it better than I have, so I'm taking out my post.
To sum up, GW2 isn't going to be for everyone. The focus is on very different things than most MMOs. If you are looking for the next traditional MMO, GW2 will not be it. If you want to try a new type of MMO, GW2 is trying to offer that.
I personally would love to see some footage of non combat activites. The combat looks great n all, but this game doesnt seem like an mmorpg yet. Show me somebody making something, or socializing, or discovering a secret area or event. Show me the stuff that makes this game more than just god of war online.
While I agree with Foomerang on this point because I am sure we are all ready to hear the other side of the game, I will point out that had they given us the non-combat and crafting info first we would have heard people doubting the combat side of it. IMO Anet is releasing the info that appeals to the majority and covers a great portion of any game, the combat. Also as has been mentioned before, they are releasing the info that is working in the game now. When I hear from the Devs that this is how the information is drizzling out, I have faith that the information on the crafting and exploration that they have touched on is gonna be there when it's ready to be revealed, not before. Until they show me otherwise. That's not to say whatever they go with is gonna be the best there is was and ever will be, but I will say if they show as much detail in that side of the game as they seem to be in the stuff we have seen, I'll be very happy.
I only read part of the OP, to be honest, but I felt a need to say THIS after reading what I read:
1) GW1 was not, is not, and never WILL be an MMO. ArenaNet has never CLAIMED it to be an MMO either. So if you played it expecting an MMO, that's YOUR bad, not theirs.
2) GW2 is not going to be "just like" GW1. First of all, GW2 WILL be an MMO. Secondly, there are assorted other things that have been done differently. See below for more details:
I personally would love to see some footage of non combat activites. The combat looks great n all, but this game doesnt seem like an mmorpg yet. Show me somebody making something, or socializing, or discovering a secret area or event. Show me the stuff that makes this game more than just god of war online.
Generally speaking, people don't really socialize at demo stations, and I'm not even sure what an exciting preview video of socializing would look like. Demonstrating emotes and sitting?
They have shown footage of picking up bunnies and watering cows. That's non-combat!
They've also shown the crafting screens... and there's a couple videos of people just wandering around and exploring and finding things like hidden shrines, or interesting views in the city, like looking at the shooting gallery (Which wasn't operational)
Most people use their demo time to fight though, and that's where most of the video footage has come from.
Originally posted by Meowhead Originally posted by Foomerang I personally would love to see some footage of non combat activites. The combat looks great n all, but this game doesnt seem like an mmorpg yet. Show me somebody making something, or socializing, or discovering a secret area or event. Show me the stuff that makes this game more than just god of war online.
Generally speaking, people don't really socialize at demo stations, and I'm not even sure what an exciting preview video of socializing would look like. Demonstrating emotes and sitting? They have shown footage of picking up bunnies and watering cows. That's non-combat! They've also shown the crafting screens... and there's a couple videos of people just wandering around and exploring and finding things like hidden shrines, or interesting views in the city, like looking at the shooting gallery (Which wasn't operational) Most people use their demo time to fight though, and that's where most of the video footage has come from. Yes I understand why we arent seeing this stuff. But that doesnt really make it ok for them to gloss over other aspects of their game imo. Show me all the "boring" stuff plase
Yes I understand why we arent seeing this stuff. But that doesnt really make it ok for them to gloss over other aspects of their game imo. Show me all the "boring" stuff plase
To be honest, when I heard in one of the many many reporter comments after Guild Wars Fan Day that they got to see Keg Ball, I was all 'Stop showing me underwater stuff and dungeons, I've seen that, I want to see Keg Ball!'
I'm hoping they have some of the minigames in the next demo, and some brave souls waste their time playing it, and filming it.
Because I'm probably keeping up with every obscure snippet of news more so than you, I'm AWARE of all these peripheral things, but it's not just Arenanet... it's the fans who appear to think that I wouldn't enjoy watching an hour long video of somebody picking up bunnies and weeding crops.
Though I have seen some videos where the people are just exploring... running around here and there, finding old landmarks and new ones. I'm pretty comfortable believing there's exploring going on, and they've mentioned it in the blog...
... and they do some nice flybys of the cities to suggest they're big enough to look around in, but other than that, I'm not sure how they'd do an OFFICIAL 'here's a video of exploring' video. That also seems to me like generally a more personal experience of enjoyment, not so much one that is good for showing off.
I would like to see the same sort of things you would, I'm just not sure they'll be shown so early. :T (THough they did ANNOUNCE minigames really early, they just haven't really shown any.)
I have raised very poignent arguments about probably flaws in GW2 and most people have just ignored them because they are completely gorged on what the developers have told them.
To address one point: How do you think GW 2 is going to be an explorers paradise compared to....let's say Rift?
Rift had zone puzzles and zone loot you could dig up if you actually went looking for it. So far GW 2 hasn't mentioned anything of even this nature.
What EXACTLY is GW 2 offering that nobody else already has? Nothing. Not one freaking thing. They have claimed all this originality, but I'm not buying the bs they're selling.
Comments
First I'd like to say that GW2 isn't going to be for everyone. It's really for people that the previous set of MMOs wasn't for, and anyone else who'd like to come along for the ride. So, if what you genuinely like about playing MMOs is being a needed, fundamental part of any group, having your chat light up when you log on because nobody could go on without you, and seeing people begging for someone of your particular job type over chat, then GW2 is less for you than any of the people who hated all of the above; who hated begging LFH, who hated waiting an hour to go on a dungeon run, who had to roll an alt so that they could play with their friends or guild because there was a shortage of healers, etc.
However, if you like helping people in a pinch, and being that last-ditch savior preventing a dungeon wipe, and being known for being awesome at what you do, there is still such a place for you in GW2. As you well know, ANet did say, don't belittle support by calling it healing. They consider it an honored role whose place is still vitally important in GW2.
As for combat, if what you're looking for is FPS-style reticle-aimed combat with collision detection, well, yeah. GW2 isn't that. It mixes up traditional skillbar-based tab-target combat because you can cast on the move and dodge or block attacks (without an RNG to determine whether you miss or dodge successfully), can physically get between a foe and ally to intercept attacks, and the like, but it isn't ArchAge, and it isn't Darkfall. Hey, I love the way ArcheAge looks too, but not one of the other features of that game appeal to me, so I'm here instead of there.
Also, I'll freely admit that there's a reason I don't play FPS's and that's because I am neither skilled at, nor do I enjoy, twitch-based accuracy-dependent combat. I'll find dodge-rolling in GW2 hard enough as it is, TYVM!
The features in GW2 are based on ArenaNet's development philosophy and are consistent to the features that were in GW1 (though implemented differently, for example, the prevalent instancing in GW1 was there to prevent the killstealing that occurs in other MMOs, the immersion-breaking of having a boss pop up right after you killed it, etc.). It has sold 7 million copies across three chapters and an expansion and done better than the publishers had imagined... enough so that GW2 was greenlit and given wide berth to develop with a 200+ crew and release when it's ready.
So, could be you're wrong about the size of the audience that would enjoy such a game
. Fortunately for you, there are plenty of other games that make you work and grind and force you to group for your incrementally superior rewards and grind newbies and carebears into dust! This is just the one that won't.
P.S. I'm a ma'am.
I was pleasantly surprised when I went from Apprentice to full 5 star Elite in under 2 months. I was pleasantly surprised again when I went from Elite to just barely Hardcore in 2 weeks. Apprentice, here I come!
With all due respect, I don't think you're giving the game the benefit of the doubt. Or you're seeing something is different and drawing a conclusion that it won't work rather than asking a followup question on how that could work.
For instance, you say "no competing for resoucres? well good luck trying to sell anything crafted.." when hearing about node sharing, but you're not giving ArenaNet some credit for making a change to the node system and not following through with how that would affect the crafting system. Maybe nodes are much rarer to make up for everybody being able to whack them. Maybe recipes take a larger number of raw materials. Maybe nodes drop one ore for everybody instead of four to one person. Maybe nodes have rare drops that are the real limiting factor to recipes. We don't know, there isn't enough crafting info released yet.
I think what it comes down to is that a lot of us fans believe that they'll find a way to make it work or they wouldn't be doing it this way. Or maybe those of us who have done a ton of research on the game can think back to a page or an interview where a feature is explained in more detail than you're aware of.
Your post is too long to address all the points, but I'd say the same thing to you and anybody else...We're here because we like the game and we'd like nothing better than to help other people understand why we like it so much. If someone honesty wants to know more and has a question, we'll answer it. But if they've already made up their mind that the game will suck, we probably won't.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it." -Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
Guild Wars was designed around collecting skills to improve builds, rather then collecting armor. Sure, you could still go out and gather the mats to make armor, but there wasn't a great disparity between the armor stats. The armor, was mostly cosmetic, and when you wanted to get that cool armor, it took alot of work to acheive it, and farming for materials on the uber armor was not an easy task. You had to have the skills to do your job, and be part of a group of people that had the skills they needed. I myself thought it was a pretty good way to balance things between hardcore players, and the casual players.
At lvl 16 however, you haven't really experienced much of the game (maybe 30% at best), and I've talked with several people that felt the same as you. It's a different design then the traditional MMO. It really focused more on skill, and skills then the proverbial carrot on a stick of better gear. When you hit level 20, you don't have all the skills, not even half of them, and you can't get them all. You have to continue to level (you don't actually hit lvl 21, but you gain a skillpoint, so you can add another skill)
Titles are the other GW1 carrot. There are a ton of titles to acheive, and they are not easy. Survivor is a title that you can acheive after getting around 140,600xp without dying (lvl 20). The next tier for the same title, you need 587,500xp and the final tier (Legendary Survivor) requires 1,337,500xp without ever dying. There is also the festival events like Rollerbeetle racing, Dragon Arena, Snowball Fights, etc.
As for mounts, I have to agree. I do enjoy having mounts in a game, even if they aren't needed as such.
GW2 is implimenting a new system for crafting, which looks interesting and definately more then what was in GW1. GW2 is adding alot of different activities as well, and some of the game mechanics aren't about combat as well.
GW2 is going to build off of the best parts of GW1, and I think that if people can break away from the D&D-esque style of MMO gameplay, then they will really enjoy GW2. It definately will be different. I know that alot of people will like it, but I also know that some people won't. The best thing to do, is read the thread "what we know about GW2" as was suggested earlier.
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
I don't hate much, but I hate Apple© with a passion. If Steve Jobs was alive, I would punch him in the face.
Well, I left little parts of your message, so it's easier to understand what I'm responding to.
A. First of all, everybody who's a sane fan of GW already knows this. Nobody (Other than some very confused people) are surprised that GW isn't an MMORPG. If you look at the boxes, you cannot find 'MMORPG' anywhere. I'm not sure why some people always feel a need to start off by saying the first GW wasn't an MMORPG.
Oh well.
Secondly, there's non-combat things to do... just offhand, you can water cows! Collect bunny rabbits! Put out fires. Fetch water for sad ogres! You can explore, and find sekrit things! There is at least one personal storyline quest that is based off of answering riddles!
There's crafting, and a marketplace. Uhm, and every town has at least a few activities. Now, granted, many of these are combat, or combat-esque (Bar brawl, keg ball, snowball fights), but there's other things like a giant music-machine and a shooting gallery. The latter two are in the human city alone, so even if there was only 2 non-combat activities per city, that would be 12 non-combat minigames. Thassalot. Dunno how many there will actually be, but we'll find out! I know in GW they had races (Think Mario Kart style...) with rollerbeetles, so I wouldn't be too surprised if there was at least ONE kind of racing game...
If you're hardcore, you can go find signs written in Guild Wars 2 languages, then translate them, because they're apparently all translatable! Go decipher those cryptic alphabets!
Also, if you can't spend at least an hour playing with armor and the three dye channels, you're hardly a man. Real men like pretty colors.
B. I could take this comment a little more seriously if you didn't clearly demonstrate that you didn't actually UNDERSTAND the loot system at all (You sold all your loot?
). 
It's honestly more fun when you know what's going on! I was always getting all giddy when I'd find pieces of stuff that I could disassemble to help mix and match my ultimate item! I mean, how exciting is it to find that perfect poisoning hilt for your sword, after all that searching? 
This isn't the system they're using for GW2, anyway, but the system of GW1 was more fun if you knew what was happening and why what you were getting was good or bad. 
(Oh, and as Eyelolled mentioned right above me, lots of it was about collecting skills! A well-skilled person in GW was way more awesome.)
C. If it makes you feel better, up until about a month ago, they weren't even sure they'd have walking. Yes, you'll be running! A lot.
Also, with your weapons sheathed you run quite a bit faster. It's sort of like having a mount, but without having to explain why something that should be increasing your combat ability (Mounted combat, whoo!) is instead stopping you from fighting at all (Ow, I got hit while riding my horse, now I have to jump off). I'd like mounts if they implemented a proper mounted combat system, but they can't put EVERYTHING in the game at once, and that would be a lot of work.
So rejoice. You have all the extra speed of mounts, you just don't have the appearance. Unless... you want a mount... just for the looks. Then sorry. :<
(Honestly, I'm not surprised GW2 people don't ride mounts, even in character. Everything is either slower (Like a Dolyak) than a person, too small (Let me just... climb onto this bird... whose back I just snapped...), too ornery (As soon as it stops biting my crotch I'll climb right on its back and go somewhere!) or too extinct (I've only ever seen horses as undead or made out of stars.) Humans on Earth are so screwed over by our planet. If we didn't have horses and such, I'm sure we would have invented teleporting too.)
Gogo, we need moar Bob's powah in this thread
"It has potential"
-Second most used phrase on existence
"It sucks"
-Most used phrase on existence
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NzEqJAg8460
You know I hate to craft. Or gather material. Or seek collection NPCs somewhere deep in the jungle.
Call me a WOW-tard, but I just love the fun and childish glee just to have luck and a cool drop, like a new armour piece or what. Or have some quest which rewards me with a nice piece of gear. I was just SO TIRED of all this ... THINKING needed in GW. 75 piece of this 25 piece of that and the 325 sources you possibly get it with identification kits and whatnots... SHEESH. Sorry if I sound lazy to you... but I just want to be hero, get my loot or reward I can wear, and of story. I just loathe this complicated tinkering.
You see, my life is complicated and demanding. So when I go play a MMO... I want to escape overmuch thinking, planning and calculating. I DONT want to calculate how many items of X can be salvaged into Y to use amont Z of it PLUS... well you get the idea. I know it sounds like a dork, but it makes my brain explode! All this thinking and planning for a simple gear piece. I just feel getting angry only writing about it!
Each to his tho. I wish they'd offer both. Crafting stuff for tinkerers and plain rewards and drops for heroic style players.
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
Yeah, but I'm just saying the system is WORSE if you got to level 16 and couldn't even afford an armor set.
That's beyond 'dislike the system', that's 'didn't understand what the system was'
Now, you can simultaneously not have understood it AND not like it now that you know what it is.
Luckily for you, GW2 allows you to get loot from drops, by buying it, or by crafting it!
So they do offer both. :T
Hopefully you're not too annoyed that dungeons drop tokens though. No hoping you're lucky, you're lucky automatically.
Well I would have to say that GW2 may not be for you. At least I hope not, because if they dumbed the game down to the point of not having to think, then the game wouldn't be for me. I can't understand the fun of doing something mindless, which is probably why WoW isn't for me, but I found GW to be engaging. I don't want that to change. So I hope that you find the game you're looking for, I just hope it isn't GW2.
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
I don't hate much, but I hate Apple© with a passion. If Steve Jobs was alive, I would punch him in the face.
Im just having a hard time taking a guy seriously who talks about GW1 having a lack of challenge when there only lvl 16. Game doesnt even really start till you hit 20. Unlike other games 95% of the content is endgame of GW. Dont even talk about pretending to know anything about its difficulty until you are doing titan quests, or realm of torment, or at least Hard Mode of anything. You havent even completed the storyline yet. Hell id be surprised if your even far enough along to have full size 8 man groups yet.
GW doesnt start off asuming your an avid mmo player. They dont even pretend its an mmo. So yes they gradually scale things up and give people plenty of time to get used to things before they toss them into depths(at least in the prophecies campaighn).
Ive played lots of mmo's but never have i played anything as challenging as GW. Its the game where you cant just outlevel/outgear your challenges. You actually have to be skilled. When you hit max lvl(20), youll be fighting things that way outlevel(think lvl 28-32) and outnumber you consistently so you will have no choice but to either get good, or go no furthur. You cant just be 1 person out of 25 or 40 and have the rest of the 24-39 people carry your sorry ass while you just follow along. If you dont pull your weight, your team will notice (without an add on program).
It is also a game where there answer to making things difficult isnt just to increase the mobs hp/damage. Mobs will attack you with coordination and skill combinations. They will use teamwork just as your group is expected to. There is no tank and spank aggro mechanic in place in GW. Mobs will choose there targets based on the weakness of there targets HP and defense and position. They will move out of AOE's or stay and attempt to kill you anyway if they think they can kill you before they drop. The Monster AI is the best in GW of any ive ever played And that is why it is a challenge.
Hell most of the mmo's i play since, i will intentionally handicap myself just to make things a challenge, like not wearing top end gear. Otherwise compared to GW the mobs bore me to tears because there so stupid and offer no real challenge. Its all just memorizing patterns and taking advantage of sad mechanics like aggro control or some one shot kill gimmick. Most mmo players are more in love with the idea of having some magic loot that will make them a god, rather than gaining the skill of said god independent of fabled loot.
Good Post, Thank you.
All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.
I get banned in the forums for games I love, so lets see if I do better in the forums for games I hate.
I enjoy the serenity of not caring what your opinion is.
I don't hate much, but I hate Apple© with a passion. If Steve Jobs was alive, I would punch him in the face.
Yeah, I can barely feel a change of pace when I log in to those extremely complicated MMO crafting simulations. Please dumb down the genre - it has become overly complex.
If you want to look at Guild Wars to figure out how GW2 is going to turn out, you shouldn't focus on what Arenanet did in that game. You should focus on how well they did what they did.
Arenanet was smart with GW. They were careful to not bite off more than they could chew. The problem with most mmos is the the devs try to do -everything-. Very few development teams have the manpower and resources to pull that off. Arenanet didn't, and unlike most dev teams, they actually realised they didn't. So they made a fairly limitted game. Despite some issues, overall they succeeded pretty well in what they did.
7 million GW box sales later, they have the resources to make a broader game. Time will tell how well they did what they did this time, but things are looking good, IMO.
I personally would love to see some footage of non combat activites. The combat looks great n all, but this game doesnt seem like an mmorpg yet. Show me somebody making something, or socializing, or discovering a secret area or event. Show me the stuff that makes this game more than just god of war online.
*EDITED*
I think other's have said it better than I have, so I'm taking out my post.
To sum up, GW2 isn't going to be for everyone. The focus is on very different things than most MMOs. If you are looking for the next traditional MMO, GW2 will not be it. If you want to try a new type of MMO, GW2 is trying to offer that.
While I agree with Foomerang on this point because I am sure we are all ready to hear the other side of the game, I will point out that had they given us the non-combat and crafting info first we would have heard people doubting the combat side of it. IMO Anet is releasing the info that appeals to the majority and covers a great portion of any game, the combat. Also as has been mentioned before, they are releasing the info that is working in the game now. When I hear from the Devs that this is how the information is drizzling out, I have faith that the information on the crafting and exploration that they have touched on is gonna be there when it's ready to be revealed, not before. Until they show me otherwise. That's not to say whatever they go with is gonna be the best there is was and ever will be, but I will say if they show as much detail in that side of the game as they seem to be in the stuff we have seen, I'll be very happy.
RIP Jimmy "The Rev" Sullivan and Paul Gray.
I only read part of the OP, to be honest, but I felt a need to say THIS after reading what I read:
1) GW1 was not, is not, and never WILL be an MMO. ArenaNet has never CLAIMED it to be an MMO either. So if you played it expecting an MMO, that's YOUR bad, not theirs.
2) GW2 is not going to be "just like" GW1. First of all, GW2 WILL be an MMO. Secondly, there are assorted other things that have been done differently. See below for more details:
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/287180/page/1
That should answer a good many of your questions and even demonstrate much with videos of gameplay already present in the game.
President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club
Generally speaking, people don't really socialize at demo stations, and I'm not even sure what an exciting preview video of socializing would look like. Demonstrating emotes and sitting?
They have shown footage of picking up bunnies and watering cows. That's non-combat!
They've also shown the crafting screens... and there's a couple videos of people just wandering around and exploring and finding things like hidden shrines, or interesting views in the city, like looking at the shooting gallery (Which wasn't operational)
Most people use their demo time to fight though, and that's where most of the video footage has come from.
They have shown footage of picking up bunnies and watering cows. That's non-combat!
They've also shown the crafting screens... and there's a couple videos of people just wandering around and exploring and finding things like hidden shrines, or interesting views in the city, like looking at the shooting gallery (Which wasn't operational)
Most people use their demo time to fight though, and that's where most of the video footage has come from.
Yes I understand why we arent seeing this stuff. But that doesnt really make it ok for them to gloss over other aspects of their game imo. Show me all the "boring" stuff plase
To be honest, when I heard in one of the many many reporter comments after Guild Wars Fan Day that they got to see Keg Ball, I was all 'Stop showing me underwater stuff and dungeons, I've seen that, I want to see Keg Ball!'
I'm hoping they have some of the minigames in the next demo, and some brave souls waste their time playing it, and filming it.
Because I'm probably keeping up with every obscure snippet of news more so than you, I'm AWARE of all these peripheral things, but it's not just Arenanet... it's the fans who appear to think that I wouldn't enjoy watching an hour long video of somebody picking up bunnies and weeding crops.
Though I have seen some videos where the people are just exploring... running around here and there, finding old landmarks and new ones. I'm pretty comfortable believing there's exploring going on, and they've mentioned it in the blog...
... and they do some nice flybys of the cities to suggest they're big enough to look around in, but other than that, I'm not sure how they'd do an OFFICIAL 'here's a video of exploring' video. That also seems to me like generally a more personal experience of enjoyment, not so much one that is good for showing off.
I would like to see the same sort of things you would, I'm just not sure they'll be shown so early. :T (THough they did ANNOUNCE minigames really early, they just haven't really shown any.)
Well i will finally get to test this game out for myself in about a month at pax. I will definitely do a write up here wih some impressions.
Wear a head camera!
< Then go do non-fighting things.
All I have to say is this:
I have raised very poignent arguments about probably flaws in GW2 and most people have just ignored them because they are completely gorged on what the developers have told them.
To address one point: How do you think GW 2 is going to be an explorers paradise compared to....let's say Rift?
Rift had zone puzzles and zone loot you could dig up if you actually went looking for it. So far GW 2 hasn't mentioned anything of even this nature.
What EXACTLY is GW 2 offering that nobody else already has? Nothing. Not one freaking thing. They have claimed all this originality, but I'm not buying the bs they're selling.