"During the first half of 2011, net sales amounted to 1,519,290 SEK "
1,519,290 SEK = $240,000 USD
$240,000 USD / 6 months = $ 40,000 a month
$40,000 USD / $16.40 monthly fee = maximum of 2439 paying accounts per month. The actual number of accounts will be lower due to revenue generated my new copy sales.
Seems this report puts the whole 3000 vs 5000 player thing to rest.
3-Feb ….. 120418 ….. 3257
3-Mar ….. 123272 ….. 2854
3-Apr ….. 126131 ….. 2859
3-May ….. 128771 ….. 2640
3-Jun ….. 131348 ….. 2577
3-Jul ….. 134538 ….. 3190
average 2896 for the 6 months in question reducing the discrepancy to 457 (15-18%)
There are then several things that can throw off your estimate of the number of paying accounts: facebook discounts; you rounding down from $240,748 to $240,000; fluctuating exchange rates between a minimum of 3 currencies (US dollars, SEK, and Euros) the fact that billing is done through a 3rd party (which takes a cut)
Throw all that into the mix, and it doesn't seem that the financial statement invalidates estimates based on the transaction numbers.
P.S. Back in May, the "break even" number that was being thrown around was 1500 new subscriptions. not 500
"During the first half of 2011, net sales amounted to 1,519,290 SEK "
1,519,290 SEK = $240,000 USD
$240,000 USD / 6 months = $ 40,000 a month
$40,000 USD / $16.40 monthly fee = maximum of 2439 paying accounts per month. The actual number of accounts will be lower due to revenue generated my new copy sales.
Seems this report puts the whole 3000 vs 5000 player thing to rest.
3-Feb ….. 120418 ….. 3257
3-Mar ….. 123272 ….. 2854
3-Apr ….. 126131 ….. 2859
3-May ….. 128771 ….. 2640
3-Jun ….. 131348 ….. 2577
3-Jul ….. 134538 ….. 3190
average 2896 for the 6 months in question reducing the discrepancy to 457 (15-18%)
There are then several things that can throw off your estimate of the number of paying accounts: facebook discounts; you rounding down from $240,748 to $240,000; fluctuating exchange rates between a minimum of 3 currencies (US dollars, SEK, and Euros) the fact that billing is done through a 3rd party (which takes a cut)
Throw all that into the mix, and it doesn't seem that the financial statement invalidates estimates based on the transaction numbers.
P.S. Back in May, the "break even" number that was being thrown around was 1500 new subscriptions. not 500
Um yeah they needed 1500 then fired most of the staff and then has needed 500 for 2 quarterlys.. Or do you not remember right after they said they needed 1500 they fired most of the staff?
I like what you did with the transaction numbers and trying to bring it back to that.. I am sure there are tons of facebook discounts.. Why don't you Osssimyboy ask in the general chat for us if the transaction numbers mean anything instead of all this voodoo economics. I am sure you being a good and honest and true MO supporter, you will get a response.
Um yeah they needed 1500 then fired most of the staff and then has needed 500 for 2 quarterlys.. Or do you not remember right after they said they needed 1500 they fired most of the staff?
Well, if your income doesn't meet your expenses, you can increase your income or you can cut expenses. Firing some (not most) of your staff is certainly one valid way of cutting expenses. We already know that they laid off a few people several months ago.
I'm just noting that the "break even" number is lower than it was, unlike what the OP (and others) have said.
"They need 500 new players to reach break even. That's exactly what they said at the beginning of the year report, which makes me think they have the same number of players as at the beginning of 2011, as of June 2011."
Originally posted by pockets666
I like what you did with the transaction numbers and trying to bring it back to that.. I am sure there are tons of facebook discounts.. Why don't you Osssimyboy ask in the general chat for us if the transaction numbers mean anything instead of all this voodoo economics. I am sure you being a good and honest and true MO supporter, you will get a response.
You act as if I'm the first to mention it. That is where the 3000-5000 came from. Cases in point below.
Originally posted by pockets666
Well you know what this can officially to bed right?
The post Lumi had on the official forums saying the subs went from 2300 to 5000 in the matter of a couple months..
we can call that one officially dead right??
Originally posted by HanoverZ
Seems this report puts the whole 3000 vs 5000 player thing to rest.
I know that the Facebook discount is a fairly small factor, but it's not as if I said it was the only one.
P.S. Osssimyboy? Is that intended to be an insult, or are you unable to spell Osmunda? If it's meant as an insult or commentary of some sort, you'll have to explain, cause I just don't get it. It sounds like "awesome, my boy", but somehow I doubt that is what you mean.
Um yeah they needed 1500 then fired most of the staff and then has needed 500 for 2 quarterlys.. Or do you not remember right after they said they needed 1500 they fired most of the staff?
Well, if your income doesn't meet your expenses, you can increase your income or you can cut expenses. Firing some (not most) of your staff is certainly one valid way of cutting expenses. We already know that they laid off a few people several months ago.
I'm just noting that the "break even" number is lower than it was, unlike what the OP (and others) have said.
"They need 500 new players to reach break even. That's exactly what they said at the beginning of the year report, which makes me think they have the same number of players as at the beginning of 2011, as of June 2011."
Originally posted by pockets666
I like what you did with the transaction numbers and trying to bring it back to that.. I am sure there are tons of facebook discounts.. Why don't you Osssimyboy ask in the general chat for us if the transaction numbers mean anything instead of all this voodoo economics. I am sure you being a good and honest and true MO supporter, you will get a response.
You act as if I'm the first to mention it. That is where the 3000-5000 came from. Cases in point below.
Originally posted by pockets666
Well you know what this can officially to bed right?
The post Lumi had on the official forums saying the subs went from 2300 to 5000 in the matter of a couple months..
we can call that one officially dead right??
Originally posted by HanoverZ
Seems this report puts the whole 3000 vs 5000 player thing to rest.
I know that the Facebook discount is a fairly small factor, but it's not as if I said it was the only one.
P.S. Osssimyboy? Is that intended to be an insult, or are you unable to spell Osmunda? If it's meant as an insult or commentary of some sort, you'll have to explain, cause I just don't get it. It sounds like "awesome, my boy", but somehow I doubt that is what you mean.
They went from a staff of 12-14 to 3-5 in my book that is most not some. You know half to more than half would be most right?
I agree if your income does not meet your expenses you need to downsize. But you were trying to say they gained 1000 memebers instead of saying that they only need 500 now because they downsized. When you follow the quarterlys they give no fact to gaining 1000 new members. I am sure if MO gained that many members in a quarter it would be a bullet point.
Also did you just glean over me asking you to ask in the offcial forums what the transaction counter actually means. Because you and me can speculate all we want, that does not make it fact. I know I do not work in the SV accounting department, do you?
Until then I am going to go with the quarterlys which all are losing money and all do not say there was a pop increase and a couple of them even say the pop has pretty much stayed the same for months.
Um yeah they needed 1500 then fired most of the staff and then has needed 500 for 2 quarterlys.. Or do you not remember right after they said they needed 1500 they fired most of the staff?
Well, if your income doesn't meet your expenses, you can increase your income or you can cut expenses. Firing some (not most) of your staff is certainly one valid way of cutting expenses. We already know that they laid off a few people several months ago.
I'm just noting that the "break even" number is lower than it was, unlike what the OP (and others) have said.
"They need 500 new players to reach break even. That's exactly what they said at the beginning of the year report, which makes me think they have the same number of players as at the beginning of 2011, as of June 2011."
Originally posted by pockets666
I like what you did with the transaction numbers and trying to bring it back to that.. I am sure there are tons of facebook discounts.. Why don't you Osssimyboy ask in the general chat for us if the transaction numbers mean anything instead of all this voodoo economics. I am sure you being a good and honest and true MO supporter, you will get a response.
You act as if I'm the first to mention it. That is where the 3000-5000 came from. Cases in point below.
Originally posted by pockets666
Well you know what this can officially to bed right?
The post Lumi had on the official forums saying the subs went from 2300 to 5000 in the matter of a couple months..
we can call that one officially dead right??
Originally posted by HanoverZ
Seems this report puts the whole 3000 vs 5000 player thing to rest.
I know that the Facebook discount is a fairly small factor, but it's not as if I said it was the only one.
P.S. Osssimyboy? Is that intended to be an insult, or are you unable to spell Osmunda? If it's meant as an insult or commentary of some sort, you'll have to explain, cause I just don't get it. It sounds like "awesome, my boy", but somehow I doubt that is what you mean.
Well, I double-checked, and you're right that it was higher in March--I must have remembered it wrong. Their break-even then was 1000, not 1500 players though.
An interesting thing to note is that their sales from Q1 to Q2 2011 decreased from 810K SEK to 700K SEK, or about 125K USD to 110K USD, and their net loss increased from Q1 to Q2 from 775K SEK to 1.1 million SEK. As a sidenote, note they lose more money each quarter than they actually get in revenue. These guys are nowhere near solvent--I'm not sure I'd take their "only need 500 more players" thing at face value... It seems like it's probably hugely stretching the truth, like the "forum accounts as an indicator of popularity" thing
How you increase losses Q on Q, yet decrease your breakeven point, is beyond me, unless the firings happened very recently. I suspect they have little more cutting they can do, though.
Um yeah they needed 1500 then fired most of the staff and then has needed 500 for 2 quarterlys.. Or do you not remember right after they said they needed 1500 they fired most of the staff?
Well, if your income doesn't meet your expenses, you can increase your income or you can cut expenses. Firing some (not most) of your staff is certainly one valid way of cutting expenses. We already know that they laid off a few people several months ago.
I'm just noting that the "break even" number is lower than it was, unlike what the OP (and others) have said.
"They need 500 new players to reach break even. That's exactly what they said at the beginning of the year report, which makes me think they have the same number of players as at the beginning of 2011, as of June 2011."
Originally posted by pockets666
I like what you did with the transaction numbers and trying to bring it back to that.. I am sure there are tons of facebook discounts.. Why don't you Osssimyboy ask in the general chat for us if the transaction numbers mean anything instead of all this voodoo economics. I am sure you being a good and honest and true MO supporter, you will get a response.
You act as if I'm the first to mention it. That is where the 3000-5000 came from. Cases in point below.
Originally posted by pockets666
Well you know what this can officially to bed right?
The post Lumi had on the official forums saying the subs went from 2300 to 5000 in the matter of a couple months..
we can call that one officially dead right??
Originally posted by HanoverZ
Seems this report puts the whole 3000 vs 5000 player thing to rest.
I know that the Facebook discount is a fairly small factor, but it's not as if I said it was the only one.
P.S. Osssimyboy? Is that intended to be an insult, or are you unable to spell Osmunda? If it's meant as an insult or commentary of some sort, you'll have to explain, cause I just don't get it. It sounds like "awesome, my boy", but somehow I doubt that is what you mean.
Well, I double-checked, and you're right that it was higher in March--I must have remembered it wrong. Their break-even then was 1000, not 1500 players though.
An interesting thing to note is that their sales from Q1 to Q2 2011 decreased from 810K SEK to 700K SEK, or about 125K USD to 110K USD, and their net loss increased from Q1 to Q2 from 775K SEK to 1.1 million SEK. As a sidenote, note they lose more money each quarter than they actually get in revenue. These guys are nowhere near solvent--I'm not sure I'd take their "only need 500 more players" thing at face value... It seems like it's probably hugely stretching the truth, like the "forum accounts as an indicator of popularity" thing
How you increase losses Q on Q, yet decrease your breakeven point, is beyond me, unless the firings happened very recently. I suspect they have little more cutting they can do, though.
I am pretty sure they downsized Q1. As to all of the FACTS you are talking about. It all points to the pop declining not increasing like all the bots try to say. Like I said again I will rely on the quarterlys for facts. Not someone saying the pop is BOOMING!! Obviously the quarterlys say it is not.
Sales are decreasing and net loss is increasing. Maybe the bots meant the net loss is BOOMING and not the pop?
They went from a staff of 12-14 to 3-5 in my book that is most not some. You know half to more than half would be most right?
I agree if your income does not meet your expenses you need to downsize. But you were trying to say they gained 1000 memebers instead of saying that they only need 500 now because they downsized. When you follow the quarterlys they give no fact to gaining 1000 new members. I am sure if MO gained that many members in a quarter it would be a bullet point.
Also did you just glean over me asking you to ask in the offcial forums what the transaction counter actually means. Because you and me can speculate all we want, that does not make it fact. I know I do not work in the SV accounting department, do you?
Until then I am going to go with the quarterlys which all are losing money and all do not say there was a pop increase and a couple of them even say the pop has pretty much stayed the same for months.
Anthony Morales, Emil Jones, Erik Lindgren, Fredrik Metcalf, Hannu Kokkonen, Henrik Nystrom, Mats Persson, Paratus,Patrik Jarleston,Sebastian Persson, Wiktor Ohman
That is the people on the Dev tracker list that are still red-name on the forums. By my count they went from 18-20 to 12. The financial report may list the current number of employees, but unless you can show me something that says 3-5 I'd have to say you're making up your numbers.
For the purposes of the financial report, (i.e. through July 1st) I did not suggest that they gained 1000 member (or 500 as w4ffl3 pointed out), just that they had narrowed the gap between income and expenses. Any gain of 1000 would be in July/August if we go by the transaction numbers.
I did not glean(?) over your suggestion. For the most part game companies don't release that kind of information unless it is exceptionally good, so i doubt they would say.
They went from a staff of 12-14 to 3-5 in my book that is most not some. You know half to more than half would be most right?
I agree if your income does not meet your expenses you need to downsize. But you were trying to say they gained 1000 memebers instead of saying that they only need 500 now because they downsized. When you follow the quarterlys they give no fact to gaining 1000 new members. I am sure if MO gained that many members in a quarter it would be a bullet point.
Also did you just glean over me asking you to ask in the offcial forums what the transaction counter actually means. Because you and me can speculate all we want, that does not make it fact. I know I do not work in the SV accounting department, do you?
Until then I am going to go with the quarterlys which all are losing money and all do not say there was a pop increase and a couple of them even say the pop has pretty much stayed the same for months.
Anthony Morales, Emil Jones, Erik Lindgren, Fredrik Metcalf, Hannu Kokkonen, Henrik Nystrom, Mats Persson, Paratus,Patrik Jarleston,Sebastian Persson, Wiktor Ohman
That is the people on the Dev tracker list that are still red-name on the forums. By my count they went from 18-20 to 12. The financial report may list the current number of employees, but unless you can show me something that says 3-5 I'd have to say you're making up your numbers.
For the purposes of the financial report, (i.e. through July 1st) I did not suggest that they gained 1000 member (or 500 as w4ffl3 pointed out), just that they had narrowed the gap between income and expenses. Any gain of 1000 would be in July/August if we go by the transaction numbers.
I did not glean(?) over your suggestion. For the most part game companies don't release that kind of information unless it is exceptionally good, so i doubt they would say.
gleanVerb/gl?n/
1. Extract (information) from various sources.
2. Collect gradually and bit by bit
gleanVerb/gl?n/
1. Extract (information) from various sources.
2. Collect gradually and bit by bit
Exactly are you still gradually collecting that sentence? I know it is tuff business seeing actual fact that the pop is not actually booming. So I will let you pick on my vocab.
SV and MO are suffering, badly. They are in need of subscriptions and for the most part, it seems that they can't retain any even after a big content patch and cutting a lot of weight off their team.
You want to play the numbers games, it's kind of irrelevant; this entire company has been held up by the CEO's "daddy". It's a pathetic way to run a business, and yet, it continues. The CEO has proven himself unethical, untruthful, immoral and basically a petty thief. So again as I've said, it is not a question of if, but when SV shuts its doors. And the gaming world as a whole will be better to know that people like Henrik, Sebastian, and anybody else associated with MO won't ever have a future in the gaming world ever again.
edit: ugh, was responding to a hatepost a couple pages ago, there's too many hateposts in the meantime for my comment to be relevant. I thought I could delete posts here?
edit: ugh, was responding to a hatepost a couple pages ago, there's too many hateposts in the meantime for my comment to be relevant. I thought I could delete posts here?
Sorry man no hate here. Only good ole fact. FACT MO's pop is not booming like the bots have been saying.
Sorry man no hate here. Only good ole fact. FACT MO's pop is not booming like the bots have been saying.
MOs population during this report isn't really important, they obviously dont have enough people playing. Does it really matter what the number? I only brough it up to show the relationship between current vs future players needed for Starvault to break-even. A game with say 20000 people getting another 1200 isnt much of a stretch. A game like MO with 3000 people getting another 1200 in a month seems out of the realm of possibliity.
2700, 3000, or 5000... They are still short roughly 1200 players or $20000 a month
Agreed... and if there is some statement made that might be a "grey area" we can always have the MO Community Manager pop in and set the record straight for us!
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Didn't sv say they were 500 subs short from breaking even in previous financial report? Sounds business gibberish As a tax scheme. Anyways mortal outlived that faxion heavenhell game and from what I see in game I only see a gradual increase in subs like eve had.
Didn't sv say they were 500 subs short from breaking even in previous financial report? Sounds business gibberish As a tax scheme. Anyways mortal outlived that faxion heavenhell game and from what I see in game I only see a gradual increase in subs like eve had.
Unfortunately, MO isn't remotely close to the "gradual increase in subs that EVE had". One year after launch, EVE was showing peak player loads of 6-7K players logged-in SIMULTANEOUSLY !
The fact that SV have reduced their paid staff significantly in the first half of this year will also have an impact on the game in the future. It's a stretch to believe that those staff members did not contribute anything to the development effort. Even if they were all making coffee, it means that the remaining staff now have to make their own, which will reduce their coding time
So, directly or indirectly, the game will suffer if a sizeable chunk of employees are laid-off. Perhaps the billing will suffer (double-billing fiasco, anyone ?). Perhaps the art dept. will have to significantly reduce their output, leading to fewer new items/systems being introduced in future ? Perhaps customer service will take a dive (if that's possible at all, hehe) ?
I'd be inclined to say that the staff reduction was a last-ditch attempt to make "the books look more attractive" to a potential buyer or investor. It's no coincidence that SV's efforts in finding "partner's" has been so active in the last few months.
MO and DF (and soon Archeage) all compete for the same small slice of MMO players (i.e. full-loot FFA-PvP fans). Even PlanetSide2 might pull some of these players away when it launches. DF2 is, by all accounts, already well into development, and they're starting from a reasonably stable (compared to MO) code base in DF.
Dawn was the "big expansion" that had the best chance of dramatically increasing MO's subs. That appears to have been a failure. There's not going to be another big expansion for quite a while, given that the staff numbers are now significantly reduced.
Didn't sv say they were 500 subs short from breaking even in previous financial report? Sounds business gibberish As a tax scheme. Anyways mortal outlived that faxion heavenhell game and from what I see in game I only see a gradual increase in subs like eve had.
Unfortunately, MO isn't remotely close to the "gradual increase in subs that EVE had". One year after launch, EVE was showing peak player loads of 6-7K players logged-in SIMULTANEOUSLY !
The fact that SV have reduced their paid staff significantly in the first half of this year will also have an impact on the game in the future. It's a stretch to believe that those staff members did not contribute anything to the development effort. Even if they were all making coffee, it means that the remaining staff now have to make their own, which will reduce their coding time
So, directly or indirectly, the game will suffer if a sizeable chunk of employees are laid-off. Perhaps the billing will suffer (double-billing fiasco, anyone ?). Perhaps the art dept. will have to significantly reduce their output, leading to fewer new items/systems being introduced in future ? Perhaps customer service will take a dive (if that's possible at all, hehe) ?
I'd be inclined to say that the staff reduction was a last-ditch attempt to make "the books look more attractive" to a potential buyer or investor. It's no coincidence that SV's efforts in finding "partner's" has been so active in the last few months.
MO and DF (and soon Archeage) all compete for the same small slice of MMO players (i.e. full-loot FFA-PvP fans). Even PlanetSide2 might pull some of these players away when it launches. DF2 is, by all accounts, already well into development, and they're starting from a reasonably stable (compared to MO) code base in DF.
Dawn was the "big expansion" that had the best chance of dramatically increasing MO's subs. That appears to have been a failure. There's not going to be another big expansion for quite a while, given that the staff numbers are now significantly reduced.
Dark days ahead for MO....
if i recall arche age doesnt have full loot. thats why i lost interest in it.
Also dawn is meant to be the start to a overhaul of mortal online. reason why its named dawn, is because its the start of a new "chapter in mortal online" they sill got the advanced AI and new stuff to come. you could say dawn is coming in parts still. also the GUI overhaul will be coming aswell, not to mention another addition to magic.
this has all be confirmed public infomation. so im just stating the facts. I could tell you more stuff which will be coming but i leave that to be a surprise, and its not like anyone would believe what i say. so we all just have to wait and see.
pretty much dawn is the start to mortal online becoming more complete in its core mechinics.
I highly doubt there are going to be any dark times soon. there are many new players joining, my entire guild of around 12 people consists of new players, and we been up and running for nearly a week now and I have met many new players.
there so many new guilds popping up as well, if anything i feel the big guilds are dying while new ones are currently rising.
The fact that SV have reduced their paid staff significantly in the first half of this year will also have an impact on the game in the future. It's a stretch to believe that those staff members did not contribute anything to the development effort. Even if they were all making coffee, it means that the remaining staff now have to make their own, which will reduce their coding time
Dark days ahead for MO....
That point is very much true.
Also would like to add that since SV are working with a skeleton crew of devs and the-server-restart-button-pushers, they cannot afford more than a handful of mods and GMs, without resorting to pay them with free gametime and lets face it free gametime in a failboat like MO isnt going to pay the bills or fill the gas IRL.
Only option they are left with is to give some of their players GM powers and hope these people help the community as volunteers and dont abuse their power. And we all know how that is working out. If it wasnt enough that jackass mods/counsellors were alienating what few players this game has left with biased decisions, the infamous CEO doesnt seem to give a rat's ass about how sharply his game is nosediving towards the ground by not stepping up and taking charge of the situation like a genuine person and not a shoddy businessman.
Any sane person running SV would have filed for bankruptcy ages ago, but Henrik is in a very painful predicament of his own doing; he has invested too much of daddy's money into this so he cant just pull out, count his losses and move on in life. But he has chosen to run the company into the ground until every spare dime and dollar has been burnt and gone. So Im guessing we might yet see another financial report for the next quarter since Henrik is always ready to Beg(asking players to buy out shares on facebook page aye?), Borrow(from daddy ofcourse) and Steal(from MO's playerbase like he has been doing right from launch) to keep this poor game running until its last breath.
Didn't sv say they were 500 subs short from breaking even in previous financial report? Sounds business gibberish As a tax scheme. Anyways mortal outlived that faxion heavenhell game and from what I see in game I only see a gradual increase in subs like eve had.
Unfortunately, MO isn't remotely close to the "gradual increase in subs that EVE had". One year after launch, EVE was showing peak player loads of 6-7K players logged-in SIMULTANEOUSLY !
The fact that SV have reduced their paid staff significantly in the first half of this year will also have an impact on the game in the future. It's a stretch to believe that those staff members did not contribute anything to the development effort. Even if they were all making coffee, it means that the remaining staff now have to make their own, which will reduce their coding time
So, directly or indirectly, the game will suffer if a sizeable chunk of employees are laid-off. Perhaps the billing will suffer (double-billing fiasco, anyone ?). Perhaps the art dept. will have to significantly reduce their output, leading to fewer new items/systems being introduced in future ? Perhaps customer service will take a dive (if that's possible at all, hehe) ?
I'd be inclined to say that the staff reduction was a last-ditch attempt to make "the books look more attractive" to a potential buyer or investor. It's no coincidence that SV's efforts in finding "partner's" has been so active in the last few months.
MO and DF (and soon Archeage) all compete for the same small slice of MMO players (i.e. full-loot FFA-PvP fans). Even PlanetSide2 might pull some of these players away when it launches. DF2 is, by all accounts, already well into development, and they're starting from a reasonably stable (compared to MO) code base in DF.
Dawn was the "big expansion" that had the best chance of dramatically increasing MO's subs. That appears to have been a failure. There's not going to be another big expansion for quite a while, given that the staff numbers are now significantly reduced.
Dark days ahead for MO....
if i recall arche age doesnt have full loot. thats why i lost interest in it.
Also dawn is meant to be the start to a overhaul of mortal online. reason why its named dawn, is because its the start of a new "chapter in mortal online" they sill got the advanced AI and new stuff to come. you could say dawn is coming in parts still. also the GUI overhaul will be coming aswell, not to mention another addition to magic.
this has all be confirmed public infomation. so im just stating the facts. I could tell you more stuff which will be coming but i leave that to be a surprise, and its not like anyone would believe what i say. so we all just have to wait and see.
pretty much dawn is the start to mortal online becoming more complete in its core mechinics.
I highly doubt there are going to be any dark times soon. there are many new players joining, my entire guild of around 12 people consists of new players, and we been up and running for nearly a week now and I have met many new players.
there so many new guilds popping up as well, if anything i feel the big guilds are dying while new ones are currently rising.
Come on Angel, They have been working on AI since beta don't you remember the EPIC patch was suppiosed to fix it shit?? I know it is public fact they said they are working on AI and all the rest of that crap they have been saying it for 16 months now so it is droned into everyone's head. Working on it and it being done and working are two different pigs.
"I highly doubt there are going to be any dark times soon. there are many new players joining, my entire guild of around 12 people consists of new players, and we been up and running for nearly a week now and I have met many new players."
I do not know if that is a sneaky way of saying the pop is on the rise. READ the numbers because it isn't. You are right there is like 20 guilds with 5-10 people in it. Remember when there was 20 guilds with 40+ members in it? What Angel is not saying is alot of the guilds in the recent war just broke up or members quit and made their own small guilds. I will go with the cold hard facts of the quarterly showing in black and white MO has not had a steady increase in pop . Read it man.
"another addition to magic." Come on angel I know you have been playing long enough. Do you not remember when they said 13 magic schools are done and coded ready to be put in??
Also dawn is meant to be the start to a overhaul of mortal online. reason why its named dawn, is because its the start of a new "chapter in mortal online" they sill got the advanced AI and new stuff to come. you could say dawn is coming in parts still. also the GUI overhaul will be coming aswell, not to mention another addition to magic.
this has all be confirmed public infomation. so im just stating the facts.
<snip>
Yes, these "facts" are all confirmed promises by SV. Just a few of the many promises they have made over the last 2 years...
So, "Dawn", which was probably developed at least halfway by the 20 original staff members, is only the start of much bigger things to come ?
And these "much bigger things to come" will be developed, tested and delivered by the remaining drastically reduced staff at SV ?
Good to see that the smaller the company gets, the greater their promises of output of quality and quantity becomes !
Comments
Nice, and here I was afraid I'd have to wait til next quarter to read through financial reports.
Nah brah you can read it now and see the pop is not BOOOMING like the bots have been saying.
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5056/5405334463_871abcda69_z.jpg
3-Feb ….. 120418 ….. 3257
3-Mar ….. 123272 ….. 2854
3-Apr ….. 126131 ….. 2859
3-May ….. 128771 ….. 2640
3-Jun ….. 131348 ….. 2577
3-Jul ….. 134538 ….. 3190
average 2896 for the 6 months in question reducing the discrepancy to 457 (15-18%)
There are then several things that can throw off your estimate of the number of paying accounts: facebook discounts; you rounding down from $ 240,748 to $240,000; fluctuating exchange rates between a minimum of 3 currencies (US dollars, SEK, and Euros) the fact that billing is done through a 3rd party (which takes a cut)
Throw all that into the mix, and it doesn't seem that the financial statement invalidates estimates based on the transaction numbers.
P.S. Back in May, the "break even" number that was being thrown around was 1500 new subscriptions. not 500
Um yeah they needed 1500 then fired most of the staff and then has needed 500 for 2 quarterlys.. Or do you not remember right after they said they needed 1500 they fired most of the staff?
I like what you did with the transaction numbers and trying to bring it back to that.. I am sure there are tons of facebook discounts.. Why don't you Osssimyboy ask in the general chat for us if the transaction numbers mean anything instead of all this voodoo economics. I am sure you being a good and honest and true MO supporter, you will get a response.
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5056/5405334463_871abcda69_z.jpg
By law, if you spend money, you have to reflect it in the company accounts. There is no need to speculate, read the company reports.
Well, if your income doesn't meet your expenses, you can increase your income or you can cut expenses. Firing some (not most) of your staff is certainly one valid way of cutting expenses. We already know that they laid off a few people several months ago.
I'm just noting that the "break even" number is lower than it was, unlike what the OP (and others) have said.
"They need 500 new players to reach break even. That's exactly what they said at the beginning of the year report, which makes me think they have the same number of players as at the beginning of 2011, as of June 2011."
You act as if I'm the first to mention it. That is where the 3000-5000 came from. Cases in point below.
I know that the Facebook discount is a fairly small factor, but it's not as if I said it was the only one.
P.S. Osssimyboy? Is that intended to be an insult, or are you unable to spell Osmunda? If it's meant as an insult or commentary of some sort, you'll have to explain, cause I just don't get it. It sounds like "awesome, my boy", but somehow I doubt that is what you mean.
They went from a staff of 12-14 to 3-5 in my book that is most not some. You know half to more than half would be most right?
I agree if your income does not meet your expenses you need to downsize. But you were trying to say they gained 1000 memebers instead of saying that they only need 500 now because they downsized. When you follow the quarterlys they give no fact to gaining 1000 new members. I am sure if MO gained that many members in a quarter it would be a bullet point.
Also did you just glean over me asking you to ask in the offcial forums what the transaction counter actually means. Because you and me can speculate all we want, that does not make it fact. I know I do not work in the SV accounting department, do you?
Until then I am going to go with the quarterlys which all are losing money and all do not say there was a pop increase and a couple of them even say the pop has pretty much stayed the same for months.
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5056/5405334463_871abcda69_z.jpg
Well, I double-checked, and you're right that it was higher in March--I must have remembered it wrong. Their break-even then was 1000, not 1500 players though.
An interesting thing to note is that their sales from Q1 to Q2 2011 decreased from 810K SEK to 700K SEK, or about 125K USD to 110K USD, and their net loss increased from Q1 to Q2 from 775K SEK to 1.1 million SEK. As a sidenote, note they lose more money each quarter than they actually get in revenue. These guys are nowhere near solvent--I'm not sure I'd take their "only need 500 more players" thing at face value... It seems like it's probably hugely stretching the truth, like the "forum accounts as an indicator of popularity" thing
How you increase losses Q on Q, yet decrease your breakeven point, is beyond me, unless the firings happened very recently. I suspect they have little more cutting they can do, though.
I am pretty sure they downsized Q1. As to all of the FACTS you are talking about. It all points to the pop declining not increasing like all the bots try to say. Like I said again I will rely on the quarterlys for facts. Not someone saying the pop is BOOMING!! Obviously the quarterlys say it is not.
Sales are decreasing and net loss is increasing. Maybe the bots meant the net loss is BOOMING and not the pop?
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5056/5405334463_871abcda69_z.jpg
Anthony Morales, Emil Jones, Erik Lindgren, Fredrik Metcalf, Hannu Kokkonen, Henrik Nystrom, Mats Persson, Paratus,Patrik Jarleston,Sebastian Persson, Wiktor Ohman
That is the people on the Dev tracker list that are still red-name on the forums. By my count they went from 18-20 to 12. The financial report may list the current number of employees, but unless you can show me something that says 3-5 I'd have to say you're making up your numbers.
For the purposes of the financial report, (i.e. through July 1st) I did not suggest that they gained 1000 member (or 500 as w4ffl3 pointed out), just that they had narrowed the gap between income and expenses. Any gain of 1000 would be in July/August if we go by the transaction numbers.
I did not glean(?) over your suggestion. For the most part game companies don't release that kind of information unless it is exceptionally good, so i doubt they would say.
gleanVerb/gl?n/
1. Extract (information) from various sources.
2. Collect gradually and bit by bit
gleanVerb/gl?n/
1. Extract (information) from various sources.
2. Collect gradually and bit by bit
Exactly are you still gradually collecting that sentence? I know it is tuff business seeing actual fact that the pop is not actually booming. So I will let you pick on my vocab.
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5056/5405334463_871abcda69_z.jpg
I am unsure why this is even such a big deal.
SV and MO are suffering, badly. They are in need of subscriptions and for the most part, it seems that they can't retain any even after a big content patch and cutting a lot of weight off their team.
You want to play the numbers games, it's kind of irrelevant; this entire company has been held up by the CEO's "daddy". It's a pathetic way to run a business, and yet, it continues. The CEO has proven himself unethical, untruthful, immoral and basically a petty thief. So again as I've said, it is not a question of if, but when SV shuts its doors. And the gaming world as a whole will be better to know that people like Henrik, Sebastian, and anybody else associated with MO won't ever have a future in the gaming world ever again.
Based on this report, Starvault doesnt have the money to make it until next quarter. They had $65000 cash in June, they are loosing $20000 a month.
I win!!! LOL@U
meh
edit: ugh, was responding to a hatepost a couple pages ago, there's too many hateposts in the meantime for my comment to be relevant. I thought I could delete posts here?
Sorry man no hate here. Only good ole fact. FACT MO's pop is not booming like the bots have been saying.
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5056/5405334463_871abcda69_z.jpg
MOs population during this report isn't really important, they obviously dont have enough people playing. Does it really matter what the number? I only brough it up to show the relationship between current vs future players needed for Starvault to break-even. A game with say 20000 people getting another 1200 isnt much of a stretch. A game like MO with 3000 people getting another 1200 in a month seems out of the realm of possibliity.
2700, 3000, or 5000... They are still short roughly 1200 players or $20000 a month
Lets stick to the facts listed in the report.
I win!!! LOL@U
Agreed... and if there is some statement made that might be a "grey area" we can always have the MO Community Manager pop in and set the record straight for us!
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
I think it DAWNed to many, that this company is just incapable of producing a proper and working game.
Unfortunately, MO isn't remotely close to the "gradual increase in subs that EVE had". One year after launch, EVE was showing peak player loads of 6-7K players logged-in SIMULTANEOUSLY !
The fact that SV have reduced their paid staff significantly in the first half of this year will also have an impact on the game in the future. It's a stretch to believe that those staff members did not contribute anything to the development effort. Even if they were all making coffee, it means that the remaining staff now have to make their own, which will reduce their coding time
So, directly or indirectly, the game will suffer if a sizeable chunk of employees are laid-off. Perhaps the billing will suffer (double-billing fiasco, anyone ?). Perhaps the art dept. will have to significantly reduce their output, leading to fewer new items/systems being introduced in future ? Perhaps customer service will take a dive (if that's possible at all, hehe) ?
I'd be inclined to say that the staff reduction was a last-ditch attempt to make "the books look more attractive" to a potential buyer or investor. It's no coincidence that SV's efforts in finding "partner's" has been so active in the last few months.
MO and DF (and soon Archeage) all compete for the same small slice of MMO players (i.e. full-loot FFA-PvP fans). Even PlanetSide2 might pull some of these players away when it launches. DF2 is, by all accounts, already well into development, and they're starting from a reasonably stable (compared to MO) code base in DF.
Dawn was the "big expansion" that had the best chance of dramatically increasing MO's subs. That appears to have been a failure. There's not going to be another big expansion for quite a while, given that the staff numbers are now significantly reduced.
Dark days ahead for MO....
if i recall arche age doesnt have full loot. thats why i lost interest in it.
Also dawn is meant to be the start to a overhaul of mortal online. reason why its named dawn, is because its the start of a new "chapter in mortal online" they sill got the advanced AI and new stuff to come. you could say dawn is coming in parts still. also the GUI overhaul will be coming aswell, not to mention another addition to magic.
this has all be confirmed public infomation. so im just stating the facts. I could tell you more stuff which will be coming but i leave that to be a surprise, and its not like anyone would believe what i say. so we all just have to wait and see.
pretty much dawn is the start to mortal online becoming more complete in its core mechinics.
I highly doubt there are going to be any dark times soon. there are many new players joining, my entire guild of around 12 people consists of new players, and we been up and running for nearly a week now and I have met many new players.
there so many new guilds popping up as well, if anything i feel the big guilds are dying while new ones are currently rising.
That point is very much true.
Also would like to add that since SV are working with a skeleton crew of devs and the-server-restart-button-pushers, they cannot afford more than a handful of mods and GMs, without resorting to pay them with free gametime and lets face it free gametime in a failboat like MO isnt going to pay the bills or fill the gas IRL.
Only option they are left with is to give some of their players GM powers and hope these people help the community as volunteers and dont abuse their power. And we all know how that is working out. If it wasnt enough that jackass mods/counsellors were alienating what few players this game has left with biased decisions, the infamous CEO doesnt seem to give a rat's ass about how sharply his game is nosediving towards the ground by not stepping up and taking charge of the situation like a genuine person and not a shoddy businessman.
Any sane person running SV would have filed for bankruptcy ages ago, but Henrik is in a very painful predicament of his own doing; he has invested too much of daddy's money into this so he cant just pull out, count his losses and move on in life. But he has chosen to run the company into the ground until every spare dime and dollar has been burnt and gone. So Im guessing we might yet see another financial report for the next quarter since Henrik is always ready to Beg(asking players to buy out shares on facebook page aye?), Borrow(from daddy ofcourse) and Steal(from MO's playerbase like he has been doing right from launch) to keep this poor game running until its last breath.
Come on Angel, They have been working on AI since beta don't you remember the EPIC patch was suppiosed to fix it shit?? I know it is public fact they said they are working on AI and all the rest of that crap they have been saying it for 16 months now so it is droned into everyone's head. Working on it and it being done and working are two different pigs.
"I highly doubt there are going to be any dark times soon. there are many new players joining, my entire guild of around 12 people consists of new players, and we been up and running for nearly a week now and I have met many new players."
I do not know if that is a sneaky way of saying the pop is on the rise. READ the numbers because it isn't. You are right there is like 20 guilds with 5-10 people in it. Remember when there was 20 guilds with 40+ members in it? What Angel is not saying is alot of the guilds in the recent war just broke up or members quit and made their own small guilds. I will go with the cold hard facts of the quarterly showing in black and white MO has not had a steady increase in pop . Read it man.
"another addition to magic." Come on angel I know you have been playing long enough. Do you not remember when they said 13 magic schools are done and coded ready to be put in??
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5056/5405334463_871abcda69_z.jpg
Yes, these "facts" are all confirmed promises by SV. Just a few of the many promises they have made over the last 2 years...
So, "Dawn", which was probably developed at least halfway by the 20 original staff members, is only the start of much bigger things to come ?
And these "much bigger things to come" will be developed, tested and delivered by the remaining drastically reduced staff at SV ?
Good to see that the smaller the company gets, the greater their promises of output of quality and quantity becomes !