I wish people would quit using the Firefly reference. Aside from the "west in space" vague analong, saying this is like Firefly is like comparing WoW to the Lord of the Rings books. They both have elves, dwarves etc, but that is about where the similarity ends.
Certainly is early days - and a lot of the articles on WildStar are based on the press presentation that Carbine gave. However, if you can gel with the cartoon look (and it took me aback at first, though it's grown on me) then the demo shown at PAX and gamescom had a lot going for it.
Even at the low levels, the Explorer path allowed for impact on gameplay (a solo instance toards the end of the demo allowed you to call in snipers).
As to a class system not allowing depth... I don't know. Sure, perhaps not as much depth as a class-less system but if you bake in some branching skill trees and a Champions Online-esque Advantage Points system then you could see something reasonable (to my mind).
At the end of the day, it's a wait and see situation - the devs aren't fresh out the gate but the IP is - they can mold it to create the game they want. So can we.
For those interested in the game, I'd invite you over to one of the few WildStar fansites (like WildStar Central, but a fuller list is here) where there is extensive video, interview and review footage (as well as other articles) to help you make up your mind.
Me? I'm looking forward to the game - it shows promise and a month ago we didn't know a thing about it!
They managed to do exactly what I dont want. To be restricted into one of those paths. In any game, Im never just a fighter, explorer, scientist or settler. The last thing I want is being forced to to chose between those.
And whats with the Firefly reference all the time? The setting in this game has nothing to do with Firefly. Just picking bits out of the series context and then saying 'see, its like Firefly' is ridiculous.
Oh and they managed to make a for me uninteresting artstyle. This doesnt happen often to me, because I have a very broad taste in this department.
I agree with others that this game just asks for a classless skillsystem for this kind of gameplay depth.
Why do I have the feeling that it will be another "personal epic" story that is really shared with every other character in the game?
Why do I have the feeling that the class progression will be as linear as everything else post-WoW?
Why am I anticipating instanced PvP (Battlegrounds)?
I want a game that has depth, e.g., player cities, world housing, huge worlds (real exploration), etc. Not a sandbox, but a blend of Theme Park and Sandbox.
alas I doubt a AAA studio will ever make a game for us We seem to be a tiny minority and not worth their big budgets. So I would not hold out hope
lol@ those who can't play games with cartoony graphics
I don't know about ‘can't play,’ but everyone has a range of art styles that work for them, and I don't see how it's inconcievable that this particular art style isn't a magical one-size-fits-all.
The ubiquity of it is what annoys me. More correctly, gamers' ignorance of the ubiquity of it. Every time another MMO that looks like this is revealed, I see all these, ‘Finally, a game that doesn't try to be realistic!’ and I'm left wondering where these mythical trying-to-be-realistic games are, because there's a drought of them from where I'm standing.
Favorites: EQ, EVE | Playing: None. Mostly VR and strategy | Anticipating: CU, Pantheon
Sigh, I got excited when I read about the developer staff, sven more so when talking about giving the players a game "they" want.
Personally, I want a classless system built around how you play (similar to the mechanics of console rpgs). I want an old school feel, with a new twist. I miss the feel of EQ without the headaches it wrought. I want changing environments to keep it "new" where players control the outcome of their world. I want interactive combat, not button mashing combo breaking combat.
I wish it all the best with this, I was goering for something, innovative.
the writing and acting made it come off like a kids WB saturday morning cartoon intended for 8 year olds
That's actually a good thing, for me at least, as I really like Pixar. I have yet to see the trailer.
Same here....love love Pixar and I'm a 48 year old mother of 3 adult children, so.....whatever. Not every gamer is a macho testosterone driven beast that wants realistic blood, guts, and gore graphics. I think the graphic style for this game is endearing. I love it. I'm looking forward to more information on this game and will consider adding it to my diverse list of "must plays" alongside the likes of TSW and GW2.
Variety should exist in MMOs since variety exists in gamers. We can all like DIFFERENT things and it still be okay.
Reminds me of Runescape with more indepth story and paths... Graphics are different... But, since it has been out for really only a couple weeks I'll give it a break. I'll just have to hammer it later. My hype went from 9 to 3 on this one.
Love the art style. Very well done presentation and if they really do give a full experience to all those paths it's going to be an amazing game. NCsoft's portolio is looking better and better here in the west.
A few things are interesting, but I am not really excited for this game. It would have been much more interesting if it was a sandbox and we could travel anywhere.
Currently Play: ? Occasionally Play: Champions, Pirates of the Burning Sea, WOW, EVE ONLINE
Is there no excape from the WOW like graphic style ?
I spend less than a minute considering any game that suggests that graphics lineage. I just can't handle a company who thinks its players like playing cartoon characters. Obviously some do...I certainly don't.
Originally posted by Disdena "But how will they deliver the deepest MMO ever? By listening to the players and by remembering to make the game they want to play."
Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. This expression needs to die in a fire, the sooner the better.
Let me guess, the servers are hosted in an underground bunker just so they can say they never lied.
Please, spare me the marketing pitch and deliver the game, then I MIGHT take a look at it.
Can't believe suckers still fall for the "ours will be different than those others that said the same thing" crap that every dev company spews before launching clone #1637940323638.
-Letting Derek Smart work on your game is like letting Osama bin Laden work in the White House. Something will burn.- -And on the 8th day, man created God.-
Listening to players has lead to what we have today, because what that in reality means is looking at what the majority of players do most, and then cut the "useless" stuff while targeting the game to those players. Wupti you have WoW.
Take this idea a bit further and you have story driven games that are so audience targeted that the freedom that a mmorpg should give you is mostly gone.
On the other hand, players have good input it is just important see through the narrow minded ideas and understand what players actually want. You get nowhere without a game designer with a dream but enough reality to make it happen, and if you have one THEN you can start listening to players.
The way this is written I read it as another orchestrated story adventure, now with multiple paths to take. The deepest mmorpg ever.. that sound like a bold claim when you are up against huge mmorpgs with expansions and years on their backs. We hear this kind of stuff all the time, but none have really been able to deliver much of their claims. I think we need some developer to take action and surprice us by making that thought trough concept that gives loads of content and a deep game for relatively little resources.
What I don't get is.. what is it with some people being so hung up cartoon-like graphics. It's been compared to Pixar's style... Does that mean these people won't watch Pixar movies either?
What's the big deal? It's a graphics/animation style. It's not like a guy's masculinity is being challenged if they enjoy it... Or maybe it is for/to some people, and that's the problem. They don't want their friends to laugh at or tease them, or something.
saw the same thing even with game consoles. I saw people who refused to buy a GameCube - even though there were games they wanted to play on it - because it was "too colorful", they wanted the "badass looking" XBox or PS2. Again... Who cares? Is it the games you're buying the system for, or how it looks?
People get way hung up on superficial things.
.....
As for Wildstar... I'm definitely watching it. Though, I'm doubtful that they're going to "change entire design elements" based on player feedback, and still expect to create "the deepest MMO ever", unless they draw a very strict and defined line that they will absolutely not cross, no matter how many people "demand" it.
For all the complaining we see from people claiming, they want a grander and deeper MMO experience, time and again, once such a game is released, or even just announced, you immediately start seeing the threads pop up... "X is too involved", "Y is too complicated", "Z takes too long".. "'A' should be simpler", "Make B less detailed, we don't care about the lore"...
You'll see WoW referenced time and again as having some feature, and because WoW is so popular, Wildstar should have it, too... I mean,t hey want to be successful... don't they?". Often, those very same people will then be complaining that the game is too similar, doesn't stand out enough and is "just another knock-off" after they've gotten exactly what they asked for.
This is happening in the official FFXIV forums. People are referencing WoW left and right for "how FFXIV should do things"... More instancing, faster leveling, more mounts/flying mounts, random party/dungeon finder with automatic teleport to the dungeon, etc. etc. And in case after case, these people are citing WoW as their reference.
It's great that the Wildstar team is taking feedback and willing to make changes... Hopefully they stick to their guns and don't start making concessions to the "we want we want we want" crowd... or they'll end up with just another shallow, derivative example of "more of the same".
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
The Eldan are the race in WildStar. The Eldar are the Games Workshop property.
I believe the "deep" that Carbine are referring to is doable, but as many have said it does remain to be seen.
However, I can't recall a game that has a branching questline based on un-signposted player action (rather than just conversation dialog choices) and this is what Carbine are planning according to their press presentations.
I'm all for reserving judgement, but also coming at a game from a position of knowledge (hence my repeated recommendation of WildStar Central, where you can view the press presentation and some interesting developer interviews).
Carbine have also said they are very open to working with their potential playerbase - adding in what works, and removing what doesn't. Even at this early stage they are watching and listening to fansites - what people like and don't like.
Get involved, and maybe help shape a game you want to play.
Comments
I hope this is more sandboxey. I really want some in depth crafting to go along with everything else theyre promising here.
----ITS A TRAP!!!----
I wish people would quit using the Firefly reference. Aside from the "west in space" vague analong, saying this is like Firefly is like comparing WoW to the Lord of the Rings books. They both have elves, dwarves etc, but that is about where the similarity ends.
*puts his pretty blue bonnet back on*
Certainly is early days - and a lot of the articles on WildStar are based on the press presentation that Carbine gave. However, if you can gel with the cartoon look (and it took me aback at first, though it's grown on me) then the demo shown at PAX and gamescom had a lot going for it.
Even at the low levels, the Explorer path allowed for impact on gameplay (a solo instance toards the end of the demo allowed you to call in snipers).
As to a class system not allowing depth... I don't know. Sure, perhaps not as much depth as a class-less system but if you bake in some branching skill trees and a Champions Online-esque Advantage Points system then you could see something reasonable (to my mind).
At the end of the day, it's a wait and see situation - the devs aren't fresh out the gate but the IP is - they can mold it to create the game they want. So can we.
For those interested in the game, I'd invite you over to one of the few WildStar fansites (like WildStar Central, but a fuller list is here) where there is extensive video, interview and review footage (as well as other articles) to help you make up your mind.
Me? I'm looking forward to the game - it shows promise and a month ago we didn't know a thing about it!
--
Admin @ http://wildstar-central.com/
ZapRobo (PlanetSide 2) | Zap-Robo (The Secret World)
@Master Zaprobo (City of Heroes) | Zaphod@Zap-Robo (Star Trek Online)
They managed to do exactly what I dont want. To be restricted into one of those paths. In any game, Im never just a fighter, explorer, scientist or settler. The last thing I want is being forced to to chose between those.
And whats with the Firefly reference all the time? The setting in this game has nothing to do with Firefly. Just picking bits out of the series context and then saying 'see, its like Firefly' is ridiculous.
Oh and they managed to make a for me uninteresting artstyle. This doesnt happen often to me, because I have a very broad taste in this department.
I agree with others that this game just asks for a classless skillsystem for this kind of gameplay depth.
Ultima online man XD
Bolc claim when all they have really announced is a dual advancement system that starts from level 1.
I wait to see the actual implimentation before I start considering this anything along the line of the depth of oldschool mmos.
alas I doubt a AAA studio will ever make a game for us
We seem to be a tiny minority and not worth their big budgets. So I would not hold out hope
This is the only game I'm looking forward to release. It sounds very, very fun!
I don't know about ‘can't play,’ but everyone has a range of art styles that work for them, and I don't see how it's inconcievable that this particular art style isn't a magical one-size-fits-all.
The ubiquity of it is what annoys me. More correctly, gamers' ignorance of the ubiquity of it. Every time another MMO that looks like this is revealed, I see all these, ‘Finally, a game that doesn't try to be realistic!’ and I'm left wondering where these mythical trying-to-be-realistic games are, because there's a drought of them from where I'm standing.
Personally, I want a classless system built around how you play (similar to the mechanics of console rpgs).
I want an old school feel, with a new twist. I miss the feel of EQ without the headaches it wrought.
I want changing environments to keep it "new" where players control the outcome of their world.
I want interactive combat, not button mashing combo breaking combat.
I wish it all the best with this, I was goering for something, innovative.
Same here....love love Pixar and I'm a 48 year old mother of 3 adult children, so.....whatever. Not every gamer is a macho testosterone driven beast that wants realistic blood, guts, and gore graphics. I think the graphic style for this game is endearing. I love it. I'm looking forward to more information on this game and will consider adding it to my diverse list of "must plays" alongside the likes of TSW and GW2.
Variety should exist in MMOs since variety exists in gamers. We can all like DIFFERENT things and it still be okay.
President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club
Bah, who am I kidding. This game will suck, just like every other MMO out there within the past few years.
Since WoW, it's all variants on the WoW theme and everything else bombed!
Reminds me of Runescape with more indepth story and paths... Graphics are different... But, since it has been out for really only a couple weeks I'll give it a break. I'll just have to hammer it later. My hype went from 9 to 3 on this one.
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/innovation
Call me jaded, if you will, but this game will turn out to be just another generic themepark MMO game.
The developer's words are very ambitious. Unfortunately ambition takes a back seat to expected profit and the release schedule.
"There is as yet insufficient data for a meaningful answer."
Love the art style. Very well done presentation and if they really do give a full experience to all those paths it's going to be an amazing game. NCsoft's portolio is looking better and better here in the west.
"But how will they deliver the deepest MMO ever? By listening to the players and by remembering to make the game they want to play."
Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. This expression needs to die in a fire, the sooner the better.
A few things are interesting, but I am not really excited for this game. It would have been much more interesting if it was a sandbox and we could travel anywhere.
Currently Play: ?
Occasionally Play: Champions, Pirates of the Burning Sea, WOW, EVE ONLINE
Is there no excape from the WOW like graphic style ?
I spend less than a minute considering any game that suggests that graphics lineage. I just can't handle a company who thinks its players like playing cartoon characters. Obviously some do...I certainly don't.
What IP would GW have ripped off Eldar from?
"The deepest MMO ever".
Let me guess, the servers are hosted in an underground bunker just so they can say they never lied.
Please, spare me the marketing pitch and deliver the game, then I MIGHT take a look at it.
Can't believe suckers still fall for the "ours will be different than those others that said the same thing" crap that every dev company spews before launching clone #1637940323638.
-Letting Derek Smart work on your game is like letting Osama bin Laden work in the White House. Something will burn.-
-And on the 8th day, man created God.-
Listening to players has lead to what we have today, because what that in reality means is looking at what the majority of players do most, and then cut the "useless" stuff while targeting the game to those players. Wupti you have WoW.
Take this idea a bit further and you have story driven games that are so audience targeted that the freedom that a mmorpg should give you is mostly gone.
On the other hand, players have good input it is just important see through the narrow minded ideas and understand what players actually want. You get nowhere without a game designer with a dream but enough reality to make it happen, and if you have one THEN you can start listening to players.
The way this is written I read it as another orchestrated story adventure, now with multiple paths to take. The deepest mmorpg ever.. that sound like a bold claim when you are up against huge mmorpgs with expansions and years on their backs. We hear this kind of stuff all the time, but none have really been able to deliver much of their claims. I think we need some developer to take action and surprice us by making that thought trough concept that gives loads of content and a deep game for relatively little resources.
"I am my connectome" https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HA7GwKXfJB0
What I don't get is.. what is it with some people being so hung up cartoon-like graphics. It's been compared to Pixar's style... Does that mean these people won't watch Pixar movies either?
What's the big deal? It's a graphics/animation style. It's not like a guy's masculinity is being challenged if they enjoy it... Or maybe it is for/to some people, and that's the problem. They don't want their friends to laugh at or tease them, or something.
saw the same thing even with game consoles. I saw people who refused to buy a GameCube - even though there were games they wanted to play on it - because it was "too colorful", they wanted the "badass looking" XBox or PS2. Again... Who cares? Is it the games you're buying the system for, or how it looks?
People get way hung up on superficial things.
.....
As for Wildstar... I'm definitely watching it. Though, I'm doubtful that they're going to "change entire design elements" based on player feedback, and still expect to create "the deepest MMO ever", unless they draw a very strict and defined line that they will absolutely not cross, no matter how many people "demand" it.
For all the complaining we see from people claiming, they want a grander and deeper MMO experience, time and again, once such a game is released, or even just announced, you immediately start seeing the threads pop up... "X is too involved", "Y is too complicated", "Z takes too long".. "'A' should be simpler", "Make B less detailed, we don't care about the lore"...
You'll see WoW referenced time and again as having some feature, and because WoW is so popular, Wildstar should have it, too... I mean,t hey want to be successful... don't they?". Often, those very same people will then be complaining that the game is too similar, doesn't stand out enough and is "just another knock-off" after they've gotten exactly what they asked for.
This is happening in the official FFXIV forums. People are referencing WoW left and right for "how FFXIV should do things"... More instancing, faster leveling, more mounts/flying mounts, random party/dungeon finder with automatic teleport to the dungeon, etc. etc. And in case after case, these people are citing WoW as their reference.
It's great that the Wildstar team is taking feedback and willing to make changes... Hopefully they stick to their guns and don't start making concessions to the "we want we want we want" crowd... or they'll end up with just another shallow, derivative example of "more of the same".
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
Few talking points here...
The Eldan are the race in WildStar. The Eldar are the Games Workshop property.
I believe the "deep" that Carbine are referring to is doable, but as many have said it does remain to be seen.
However, I can't recall a game that has a branching questline based on un-signposted player action (rather than just conversation dialog choices) and this is what Carbine are planning according to their press presentations.
I'm all for reserving judgement, but also coming at a game from a position of knowledge (hence my repeated recommendation of WildStar Central, where you can view the press presentation and some interesting developer interviews).
Carbine have also said they are very open to working with their potential playerbase - adding in what works, and removing what doesn't. Even at this early stage they are watching and listening to fansites - what people like and don't like.
Get involved, and maybe help shape a game you want to play.
--
Admin @ http://wildstar-central.com/
ZapRobo (PlanetSide 2) | Zap-Robo (The Secret World)
@Master Zaprobo (City of Heroes) | Zaphod@Zap-Robo (Star Trek Online)