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ToR's combat closer to CoH then anything else?
whilan
Member UncommonPosts: 3,472
Okay I hear a lot of people goin on about how combat reminds them of World of warcraft, and a while ago i actually came across a video for swtor combat as i was playing city of heroes, and it dawned on me that the combat actually doesn't mimic World of warcraft nearly as much as City of heroes. In this post i'm going to try and detail why I think it is.
Okay lets take a look at basic combat.
Here is city of heroes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UnMi7PZdcLc&feature=related
This is a blaster type character, which means they are a dps class
Now lets take a look at ToR's combat.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tUlaLP1vkM&feature=player_detailpage#t=35s
Now lets take a look at WoWs combat for a moment for reference
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iWeIJqSjGgw&feature=player_detailpage#t=172s
Which one looks more similar to?
Personally myself the way the action flows it feels closer to CoH then anything in WoW.
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Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
Comments
They are all similar, also you didn't pick the right class for wow, the hunter is the most passive one, as the pet tanks nad you just stand there and lob spells
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You have to remember, a few of the top people at BW are fans of City of Heroes.
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I've played a lot of City of Heroes, so I'll be able to tell when TOR comes out how I feel the combat is like.
For me, I can not say there is a whole big difference. What I can say, in Swtor and CoH, when the character would cast a "spell" , they seem to exhert some serious effort. In WoW on the other hand, the characters have no effort casting a spell.
But, you talking about combat mechanices so nevermind.
I have to agree with Whilan. The only way I could say TOR combat feels like WoW is when DKs were first released and it seemed like you were just juggling cooldowns- because that is exactly how TOR combat feels. So many of the abilities share a cooldown and it feels like a lifetime between attacks.
CoX combat really isn't that similar to WoW. Timing, reactions and thinking ahead are far more important in CoX than in WoW, and I'd even go as far as to say that macroing attack chains would set you at a distinct disadvantage in CoX.
TOR uses a traditional RPG combat system. There's no need to defend it against WoW just because WoW uses traditional RPG combat system too and it's cool to hate on WoW.
It does seem similar, but I like the CoH combat system. So that aint a bad thing in my eyes.
I actually also thought for a while now that SWTOR had more resemblances with CoH than with WoW, based on look and feel. But the 3 videos in the OP aren't something I could discern this from.
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Fratman: "I'm saying Spring 2012 at the earliest [for TOR release]. Anyone still clinging to 2011 is deluding themself at this point."
I did have somewhat a hard time finding vidoes, if people have better videos that more explicitly explain this. Feel free to bring em forward.
I was going for multi enemy, similar combat feel type of thing. but if someone has better. To me it does feel closer to CoH then WoW, i was unsure if the videos would show it...hopefully someone has better.
Help me Bioware, you're my only hope.
Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
But there is a need to differentiate.
More so than WoW? probably. I'd have to say, though, that the combat seems to me more like WAR than anything else. Which would also make sense, as the former Mythic guys are incharge of the combat / pvp for TOR.
There are some similarities with CoH in both games, however.
- I would choose different videos to make that comparison as well. You start off with basically a CC char, then switch to an MDPS, then to a pet-based RDPS. It's very difficult to make any comparison with the videos posted, each class plays so very differently from one another.
Having played City of Heroes since about 6 months after it's launch until the present, I have to say whilan is exactly on target in his OP. The feel of combat, with any classes, in CoH is completely different than similar classes in WoW. Just the fact that from the very beginning you are fighting multiple enemies at one time instead of the mostly head to head of WoW is different. This little aspect alone always made me feel like I had accomplished a lot more after a good battle than I ever did in WoW. Granted, the actual combat mechanics may be similar, but the feel is sooooo different.
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The LoS detection in CoX is terrible, thats one major difference right there. Attacking while moving, another major difference. Combat is much more fluid in SWTOR. It does have more similarities in the sense of the basic mechanics, though you won't be able to tell or notice much comparison between the two once tactics are involved.
Quite literally the only tactics you have in CoX is either, stun and gun, herding, or hoping your mixed PUG can corner pull. Though none of that matters now as everyone just pays for farms.
Just like Battlefield and Modern Warfare. Exactly the same combat mechanics with little differentiations, but two totally different games, even with almost identical setting. Now if one of them also had a different setting! Or even proper SP campaign and maybe RPG elements? It would still be the same combat mechanics but games from two different universes that you cant even talk about on the same day! /gasp
Did I just un-intentionally say that Mass Effect is not a Modern Warfare clone? /shrug
In the overall, I agree with the first paragraph, but the feel of the two games are still very similar. It will be nice to play a game that doesn't root you every time you use an ability though.
That second paragraph though I completely disagree with. I guess it is all in who you play with but I, and all the friends I play with regularly, avoid the farms like the plague. They are boring. Also, many fights, especially the bigger ones do require some tactics if you plan to pull them off without dying.
I will say this though, since it has gone F2P, the game seems to have gotten easier and what you are saying may be spot on in the very near future.
"If half of what you tell me is a lie, how can I believe any of it?"
True, but without things like the slotting and adjustable recharge of powers that CoH has the system will most likely not turn out to feel as similar as you may think.
It took the players a number of years to educate the dev on how to balance the game properly due do powerful power customization in CoH. SWTOR won't have that and frankly most other games are way to scared to attempt anything other than extremely predictable and staid powersets.
It might be CoH-ish. But it won't be CoH. Not by a long shot. This is why you are getting people mentioning WoW. No matter what it will still be locked down even if it has the faste pace of a CoH.
But even if they learned the lessons of just how important animation times are for DPS from CoH then they will have learned more than many developers
If those are the only tactics you can pull off in CoX then you aren't very good at the game.
Also some attacks can be done on the run.
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I'd be interested in seeing what other tactics you had in mind. These are the ones most commonly employed, even when I returned recently. I played CoX for the entire first year, then stopped playing, and came back recently. Running back through my scrapper, and my blaster, and playing a number of new toons that I started, the main "on the move" attacks, were done mostly by pets. (summoning them, then running with them and having them attack anything and everything, seen in farms) Most of my blasters skills were done while standing still. Same with my scrapper... once activated, you stop moving... the combat is not fluid at all in CoX.
I love the game, it is one of my first MMOs and possibly the one that is the nearest and dearest to my heart aside from SWG... but it isn't very strategic in regards to positioning, and while they do have cohesive teaming properties between classes, its only in the most basic form.
CoH is an old game, and what it does.. it does well. Let me know what other tactics you employ in your PvE excursions... as I always found the gameplay to be very straightforward, aside from the tricks I mentioned previously.
I don't like using farms either. I've joined a few to find out how they were doing them, as even back in the old days they had them... now ... its just terrible. Some tactics of tougher missions did revolve around teleport pulls, and smart tanking, but those were back in the day... and I haven't seen those recently. Not sure what much of the high game looks like nowadays. When I resubbed a little while back I didn't play any of the high game, I logged in to my characters.. tried playing a bit.. but found all the fun at the lower levels with new players.
I didn't really get the COH comparison. After looking over the known abilities list and videos, it looked like an "outgrowth" or modification of the D&D 3.5 inspired table top game combat system used in the original Knights of the Old Republic while removing the pausable aspect from the real time mode selected. They just don't use the terminology while using the mechanics. They may not call them feats but they are still feats... lol.