On another note, even if you are "good" at FPS games, they're so infested with cheaters that you'll always get "wtfpwned" in some situations regardless of how good you are. The good thing is that the cheaters are often really bad players without their cheat, so you can outwit them. But in a 1-on-1 face-to-face encounter, you'll get brutally raped almost every time, if you didn't manage to get that once-a-day lucky 0.1s reaction headshot.
What you describe in BF3, where you get the first shot in and then seemily get killed in 1 shot after you pumped half a mag in to the opponent, i experience quite allot as well. Some of them have insane skills, others have a lucky shot, and a few cheats. I've been playing FPS games allot during the years and when i think back to my younger days, i know for sure that i would kick my older ass brutally if i matched up against myself 10-12 years ago.
One factor is to always make sure that you run the game smoothly, in at least 40 FPS, preferably more (50-60). Running at 20-30 FPS gives you a huge disadvantage against someone running at 50-60 FPS.
If you want to keep playing BF3, look for a class you enjoy. Not all of them require insane twitch-skills. You can do loads of good from a safe distance, or by just being smart. Practice some sniping and you can pop peoples heads from 300-1000m (even more). Go with the machine gunner and and bi-pod, stay in the back and supply ammo and suppressive fire for your team. As an engineer you can focus on viechles, both air an ground, with either the rocket launchers or mines/C4 charges, and repair your allied viechles. There's your brainwork. Find solid sniping spots, strategicly place mines for tanks or hide well untill you get a clear shot with a rocket launcher, etc. And then there are the viechles. All of them are pretty much "protected" against twitch with added "chunkines"/limits to the mouse movement of their guns. A tank can only turn the cannon so fast. A plane or hellicopter is more about being able to actually fly good, flank your opponents and drop flares at the right time, none which requires insanely fast mouse movements. A joystick can make it one hell of an experience.
BF games in general have a fairly steep learning curve, but once you get in to it, it's a blast. Just take the hits in the beginning, and eventually it'll loosen up. One weekend isn't much experience in BF3. Give it 3-4 weekends and you'll start to get with the flow.
I don't remember anyone in my life telling me I had to be good at a game to have fun.
"If you have to be good at it to have fun, your not playing a game but rather a sport."
Any competing game is a sport. Really.
Please name a game where you compete with another player, he is very good, you are very bad, and both you and he have fun. Just one game.
This depends on the person IMO, I suck at basketball, I'm short and most of my friends are tall so of course i lose in one on one quite a bit. Either way win or lose I have a a lot of fun playing.
And basketball is a sport by definition.
Yes, it depends on a person; but the starting question was specifically from the point of view of a person who doesn't find it fun to lose - who doesn't enjoy "sports".
But then I started to think about why I prefer MMOPRGs/SPRPGs to action/adventure games. I direct the character's actions - rather than being responsible for them directly.
If the character has an ability that does A - I direct the character to carry out said action. It is not a case that I have to do a complicated series of actions for the ability to take place. I'm playing the character - it's a RPG. I'm not doing the action - it's not an action/adventure game.
*snip snip*
EXACTLY! So, this is really the point I was trying to express, with some extra detail of course. I guess in a competitive atmosphere, I do not want to be responsibly for the actions themselves. I want to have a character that knows how to do it, and I want to just direct him or her when to execute these actions.
I never had to learn how to sword fight when I played melee characters in MMORPGs. I just had to know when to command my character to use their sword skills on a target.
Hmm... now I'm wondering why there aren't any military MMORPGs. Seems like there's a following. Would be refreshing having a character that I built, itemized/geared, customized and progressed from the ground up in a modern or historic war setting that has a bunch of cool abilities that I DIRECT instead of having to learn myself. I guess it comes back to me just not being a natural FPS'er. I don't have the interest in learning how to be the best shot on the field. The soldier I'm playing should already know how to aim and fire. I just want to select targets and direct what to do with them. /shrug
I used to play a lot of FPS... between original Halo and Halo 2 and Counterstrike and orignal Medal of Honor etc. I played a lot of FPS on both console and PC and I was good. Really good.
Now? I'm awful.
BF3 sometimes I do really well, sometimes I just get smoked. Hell, even playing through the single player in BF3 or the Gears of War series, I am just terrible - I die all the time on the easiest difficulty setting!
Halo 3 was really the last FPS I was really good at, though I did OK in COD:Black Ops online.
BF is much, much more difficult then many other online FPS due simply to the mechanics. It is not at all forgiving of mistakes.
In what seems like only a few short years I've just about completely lost that "competitive edge" for online FPS.
MMO PvP is slow enough for me to still WTF pwn people thankfully lol.
So yeah, OP, I feel ya...
I'm a lot more into cooperative online play then competitive. Perhaps it really is a measure of age?
Yes, it depends on a person; but the starting question was specifically from the point of view of a person who doesn't find it fun to lose - who doesn't enjoy "sports".
True but the point I am making is that it depends on the individual, I have fun PVPing win or lose, have fun playing FPS win or lose. It really boils down to whether a person only has fun if they win, I'm not that person.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
I appreciate them. I've read every reply so far and I like that most of you understand where I'm coming from and didn't immediately jump to 'noob gtfo' statements.
I will continue to try and find my niche within BF3 (afterall, I did BUY it. can't return it so I better make the best of it) --- I don't have high hopes though. It just really doesn't feel like a game I will have the patience to stick with if it's going to take weeks of getting owned before I start to get the hang of it. Again, I don't see the fun in being of no use to my team, and being the lowest on a killboard that determines my progression every map.
I hate to say it, but I've never missed vanilla-wow so much. Even BC wow was great for me in terms of PVP. Dropping down off my flying mount into a group of alliance and killing them all because I prioritized my skills and abilities better, properly spreading out crowd control, using the aggro range of mobs to my advantage, and set hotkeys in a more organic and accessible way than they did meant I had a good chance when outnumbered, and felt gratified when I won, as well as feeling less-discouraged when I lost.
WoW was for damn sure not my first MMORPG, but it did have a great world-pvp flavor to it before it transformed into a glorified lobby game.
On another note, even if you are "good" at FPS games, they're so infested with cheaters that you'll always get "wtfpwned" in some situations regardless of how good you are. The good thing is that the cheaters are often really bad players without their cheat, so you can outwit them. But in a 1-on-1 face-to-face encounter, you'll get brutally raped almost every time, if you didn't manage to get that once-a-day lucky 0.1s reaction headshot.
I hate this crap, I've seen one cheater since I started playing BF3. I've seen more than my fair share of people claiming that someone else is cheating and sometimes it's me their yelling at.
How do you tell if someone is cheating? they insta one shot everyone from across the map.
Maybe someone is radar hacking or crap but I doubt it.
There are more bad players that think their the wtfpwneveryone that guy must be hacking if he beat me, than there are cheaters.
------------------------------------------------- Achiever 20.00%, Explorer 86.67%, Killer 60.00%, Socializer 33.33%
In what seems like only a few short years I've just about completely lost that "competitive edge" for online FPS.
MMO PvP is slow enough for me to still WTF pwn people thankfully lol.
So yeah, OP, I feel ya...
I'm a lot more into cooperative online play then competitive. Perhaps it really is a measure of age?
Indeed it is, BadSpock. Although, I don't think I've completely lost my competitive edge, but its definitely fading out.
I too enjoy cooperative online play far more than being constantly competitive. I still love the concept of PVP, but not as much because I want to make someone else feel bad, or make myself feel better, but because of the natural dynamic of it. AI is far from catching up to the exciting feedback/reaction that comes from playing with and against other players. PVE simply bores the life out of me in almost every MMORPG title (where as PVE = nothing more than raiding and dungeons)
But yeah, I guess I'm getting old. what a shame...
There are more bad players that think their the wtfpwneveryone that guy must be hacking if he beat me, than there are cheaters.
True.
I had that problem in CoD: Black Ops - but I really think the culprit was latency.
Maybe it was mine, maybe it was theirs, but on my screen I'd see myself splatter them with multiple rounds before they even got a shot off, then I'd die and be all WTF but then in the kill cam they obviously shot first.
Was very frustrating.
In that very real sense, are all online FPS truly Pay to Win as the guy/gal with the fastest internet connection will always have the advantage?
Well, FPS's are like competitive sports. Either you have talent or you practice a lot (or both). However, past a certain age, it becomes rather difficult to get into a competitive sport unless you are very talented.
Some tips, however, would be to start off with a very competitive FPS like Counter Strike: Source. If you can own in CS, you can own in any FPS.
Also, gear matters A LOT. Get an excellent mouse (Razer DeathAdder). Get an excellent mouse pad (large, hard surface mats from Razer). Get an excellent sound system (audiophile headphones + gamer soundcard). Get an excellent keyboard (Logitech, Razer, or go for mechanicals). Get an excellent computer and internet service (Lag = mortal enemy). Get an excellent chair (you'll be sitting on it for more than you can imagine). Get an excellent monitor (24" is the considered the sweet spot). Get an excellent microphone (communication is key to success).
Finally, there are a couple of rules that always passover from game to game:
1. Never rush in without checking the safety of the situation.
2. Always remain calm. Never let your emotions alter your gameplay.
3. Always think about what the enemy would do, or how the enemy would react in a certain situation.
4. Never fire unnecessary rounds. Try to maintain the element of surprise (These rounds can be used as a decoy, however).
5. Killing is good, but surviving is even better. Don't go to insane lengths just to get that extra kill.
6. Always be wary of your position and your teammates' position. If the frontlines shift, you have to shift accordingly.
7. Stick with a single gun, learn it, love it, own it. Then, move to other guns.
I could give you more tips, but I'm running out of time. Even though my post is rather off-topic, I hope you learn from my tips.
I was using a Cyborg Mechanical keyboard until two of the keys stopped working. Using a Dell basic black keyboard now and don't see any difference in performance whatsoever
I have a great sound system
I have a nice HD monitor (22" not 24" but still fine for me)
very good internet connection with no lag issues
decent rig not the best, but still running the game at a good framerate with game settings on high
I hate counter strike -- wall/map/radar hacks and bunny-hoppers made the game feel completely ridiculous
In response to everything else you said: Sounds like a sport that I have to practice. I can understand that. But, as you said, the older we get the harder it is to be good at sports esp. when we don't usually play them.
I've always been able to grasp MMORPGs within days. Sometimes, depending on the game, I could even grasp it within minutes or hours. Grasping in terms of understanding the controls and executing the movements and character actions exactly as intended. The weeks and months and even years that I would put into a single MMORPG was for progression of my character, not to "learn how not to get stomped every time I got into combat" -- That right there is why I feel I'm just not an FPS player. I'm not going to be like the new mmo-crowd and demand from the devs that they CHANGE the nature of a successful and already present genre of games. I'm more inclined to give it my best, and then walk away if it doesn't offer what I want.
Still, the graphics and detail in BF3 are hard to ignore, and I'm tempted to just run around looking for good hiding spots to watch the battle go down instead of actually trying to jump in and get kills (get killed, over and over and over, really)
OP: Regardless of BF3 or not, an FPS is just like any other multiplayer game. It'll take practice to get any good. Once you play more, you get a better feel of the pacing, speed, map layout, etc. You'll eventually learn the hard way the little things you need to do.
Patience. Patience in learning the nuances of the FPS, and of course patience to reign yourself in from charging headlong into a firefight. Doing that in BF3 will get you killed in horrible ways.
I'm an old BF gamer myself (BF2, BF2142) and I suck in BF3. My Kill/Death scores were horrible, but I at least remembered to stick with and support my squad. Do that at the bare minimum, and you'll get points for at least helping support your squad and team. Remember that you can get points outside of putting a bullet through someone. BF games are team and objective based FPS titles. Eventually you'll get better. I've always gotten the majority of my points for seizing, defending objectives on top of support actions (replenish ammo, rez, health packs, spotting targets, etc). But after enough combat, my Kill/Death is getting closer now to "even."
It was the same for me with the other 2 BF games I played. Eventually on those I became really good and was a difference maker. But only after alot of playtime.
"I have only two out of my company and 20 out of some other company. We need support, but it is almost suicide to try to get it here as we are swept by machine gun fire and a constant barrage is on us. I have no one on my left and only a few on my right. I will hold." (First Lieutenant Clifton B. Cates, US Marine Corps, Soissons, 19 July 1918)
I was using a Cyborg Mechanical keyboard until two of the keys stopped working. Using a Dell basic black keyboard now and don't see any difference in performance whatsoever
I have a great sound system
I have a nice HD monitor (22" not 24" but still fine for me)
very good internet connection with no lag issues
decent rig not the best, but still running the game at a good framerate with game settings on high
I hate counter strike -- wall/map/radar hacks and bunny-hoppers made the game feel completely ridiculous
In response to everything else you said: Sounds like a sport that I have to practice. I can understand that. But, as you said, the older we get the harder it is to be good at sports esp. when we don't usually play them.
I've always been able to grasp MMORPGs within days. Sometimes, depending on the game, I could even grasp it within minutes or hours. Grasping in terms of understanding the controls and executing the movements and character actions exactly as intended. The weeks and months and even years that I would put into a single MMORPG was for progression of my character, not to "learn how not to get stomped every time I got into combat" -- That right there is why I feel I'm just not an FPS player. I'm not going to be like the new mmo-crowd and demand from the devs that they CHANGE the nature of a successful and already present genre of games. I'm more inclined to give it my best, and then walk away if it doesn't offer what I want.
Still, the graphics and detail in BF3 are hard to ignore, and I'm tempted to just run around looking for good hiding spots to watch the battle go down instead of actually trying to jump in and get kills (get killed, over and over and over, really)
Thing is, Battlefield 3 isn't the best FPS to start off with. It may have nice graphics and sound effects, but the overall gameplay experience is too hectic, chaotic, and disorganized to really master the ways of playing FPS's. You need to play in a more controlled, more contained, and more focused environment to really train the essentials of the genre's gameplay.
I have to admit though, I rarely see any hackers in CS:S and if I do, an admin is always there to ban them. Also, bunny hopping doesn't really work in CS:S, as your aim loses precision if you jump and fire.
I love FPS PvP, and a huge fan. Matter of fact I need to head to gamestop at midnight to pick up MW3. I wish MMO's would take note.
You dont see someone with a sniper rifle running around like he has a machine gun. Everything is NOT equal, there are strenghts and weeknesses to which ever weapon you choose, and the FPS crowd is well aware of this. Yet MMO's cant seem to figure this out. Everything has to be equal when in reality it should not be like that. If your a mage you shouldnt be able to go toe to toe with a warrior up close and personal. But then again a warrior shouldnt be able to stand its ground at a distance vs a mage.
Even worse than the above example, the gear in mmo PvP has entirly way to much bearing on the outcome of PvP. You hope in a fps match, Everyone is roughly on the same playing ground, sure theres some guns you can unlock and such but thats really no advantage at all if any. I know CoD MW series had some perks that gave some big advantages, but it really wasnt that hard to unlock them. You didnt have to spend hours upon hours raiding to unlock those perks, unlike in MMO's where if you dont have the top teir gear from raiding, and hoping your guild leader lets you get the drops, you cant compete.
Dont even get me started on player skills in mmo pvp vs fps pvp. FPS pvp is light years ahead of mmo pvp, in terms of player skill.
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore) Now Playing: N/A Worst MMO: FFXIV Favorite MMO: FFXI
Just takes a lot of practice. When you first picked up an MMORPG, did you know exactly what to do after a weekend of playing? Nah. Look, I am pretty terrible at most FPS when I start them, but after a couple weeks I start doing a lot better, sometimes after a few days. Once you learn the maps, the weapons, your capabilities, you will start doing a lot better. Maybe not 38 kills and 2 deaths better, but you wont be on the bottom of the list anymore and you will become an asset to your team.
Also...sick of seeing this...HACKING IS WAAAAAAAAAAAAY OVERBLOWN in almost all games. Sure I have seen it, but it's either been dealt with quickly by a server admin, or I was on some backwater server with no admins. I've even seen server admins abuse their power and 'hack' so to speak (seen this a lot in TF2) but this is pretty rare too. I've played CS:S for a long time and very, very rarely come across someone hacking, and when they do they are usually dealt with pretty quick. If not, I just leave the server. I know for a while after I started playing Counterstrike, the first one, I thought everyone was hacking. Well, turns out they weren't they were just better than me
Thing is too, that FPS games are not all about twitch. It's about knowing the map, having EXCELLENT situational awareness and knowing the capabilities of you, your teamates/oppnenents and your chosen class/weapons. When you walk around a corner and you are dead before you can blink, it's not because the guy that killed you has the reflexes of a cat, it's that he just knew the map better than you, could sense you were there. Just takes practice. In the end though, it's just a game. If you aren't having fun, go do something else. No need to over-analyse the situation.
I was kinda hoping that BF3 would be able to hold me over 'till SWTOR... nope. I tried to get into it, I really did. I'm not really sure what it is... part of me wants to say that I found the game to be completely shallow. I used to play Quake or Unreal deathmatchs for countless hours, and it doesn't get more shallow than that... but it was FUN! Most of these new FPS games just aren't for me I guess.
I never imagined FPS games to be on this massive scale. I started from LAN games (Counter-Strike and DOTA) then eventually moved to Sandbox RPGs (Morrowind and Oblivion) then went to ARPGs (Diablo 2 and Torchlight) and then moved to MMORPGs (Cabal, LoL, and Hellgate). I didn't really jump genres, but I did follow a certain flow.
@topic: Some people are good at FPS and other twitch-based game. It's reality. But on the other hand, if one is determined, one can still compete with these talented folks. The problem with these folks is usually, they are too careless with the gameplay and do not respect it. What I mean is, most of these people do not study the game and just head off to battle to kill people. In time, people with respect for the game and the gameplay who take time to study the game will be able to catch up to the talented folks' super kills in FPS games.
On another note, even if you are "good" at FPS games, they're so infested with cheaters that you'll always get "wtfpwned" in some situations regardless of how good you are. The good thing is that the cheaters are often really bad players without their cheat, so you can outwit them. But in a 1-on-1 face-to-face encounter, you'll get brutally raped almost every time, if you didn't manage to get that once-a-day lucky 0.1s reaction headshot.
I hate this crap, I've seen one cheater since I started playing BF3. I've seen more than my fair share of people claiming that someone else is cheating and sometimes it's me their yelling at.
How do you tell if someone is cheating? they insta one shot everyone from across the map.
Maybe someone is radar hacking or crap but I doubt it.
There are more bad players that think their the wtfpwneveryone that guy must be hacking if he beat me, than there are cheaters.
just go take a look at some of the sites selling bf3 hacks and their forum activity. no wait! just go look at some of the hacking community sites that have free bf3 hacks. i wont post a link but you can find them in the 5 seconds it takes u to type the most obvious words in google. now come back here and say it again. if you still doubt me try using wallhack urself and check out those hackers staring at you through walls in game.
i guarantee you there's there's at least one hacker for every 3 games that u play. there are tons of hacks that are hard to tell for a normal user, not just the obvious 12 year old aimbotting. to name a few, they are: cham/esp wall hack, radar, no spread, no recoil, and bullet draw. any one of these gives the average noob a HUGE, and i mean HUGEEEEEEEEEEE advantage over their non hacking opponents... hell even aimbots can be very hard to tell if the aimbotter is smart about it
On another note, even if you are "good" at FPS games, they're so infested with cheaters that you'll always get "wtfpwned" in some situations regardless of how good you are. The good thing is that the cheaters are often really bad players without their cheat, so you can outwit them. But in a 1-on-1 face-to-face encounter, you'll get brutally raped almost every time, if you didn't manage to get that once-a-day lucky 0.1s reaction headshot.
I hate this crap, I've seen one cheater since I started playing BF3. I've seen more than my fair share of people claiming that someone else is cheating and sometimes it's me their yelling at.
How do you tell if someone is cheating? they insta one shot everyone from across the map.
Maybe someone is radar hacking or crap but I doubt it.
There are more bad players that think their the wtfpwneveryone that guy must be hacking if he beat me, than there are cheaters.
As i said, some are just insanely good. And if you've missed all the cheaters, good for you. I see the "X was kicked for hacking" once or more in the chat log in almost every game i play. Even tho many do get kicked, they could have been running around for a good while before they're busted. And everyone insn't so dumb that they insta-shoot everyone across the entire map. The "better" cheats are subtle, and helps you just enough to get the upper edge. It's not a whine, it's a fact, and i've learned to live with it. Heck i was constantly kicked myself accused for aimbotting in the original Unreal Tournament when running the Insta Gib mod. I was just too good at it and most didn't stand a chance, so i've seen both sides of the coin.
So, you can choose to hate the haters, or you can accept it and learn to kick their ass anyway. The one strong upper hand you have against cheaters is that they have bad judgement by default.
You are playing FPS for some weeks and want to compete on the level of people who played different FPS for decades? It's not that you are "not FPS person", it's just that you can't just get the ball first time in your life and compete with even mediocre player who played the game for decade. Those things take skill, you know.
It's not that your mouse is slow. It's that you don't know instinctively where you should point it a every given moment, so you need to think about it and then move it much further than people who play the game for years. It's not that you need to rush or not to rush, it's that you can't, at a glance, evaluate the situation and your tactical position, advantages and timing, and know, when to rush and when not to rush; when to risk and when not to risk.
I have a pretty bad reaction time, but I have nice tactical feeling of the battlefield, even if I say so myself, so I play on equal terms with much faster "twitchy" players. But it took some serious time - months of playing - to develop that sense.
As for memorizing the map - there is simply no alternative. Those who know the terrain have inherent tactical and strategic advantage over those who don't. That's why in real-life military always memorise map, watch photos, build mockups of areas of operations and train in them...
Now, about balancing. That is a very valid point. Those who have low win/lose ration have to be grouped together, to help them play with their peers and have fun. There should be, probably, "champions" or "rating" regime where should be no such matching, but in everyday, random battles it MUST exist; there is no reason for it not to be.
My eyes roll from your eyes rolling,
If you think any FPS has ANYTHING TO DO WITH REAL LIFE COMBAT YOU HAD BEEN PLAYING VIDEO TOO LONG !
Yes, sitting in front of your computer has nothing to do with anything :
1) First your reaction time is nothing to real life.
2) Getting over the Fear Factor is by far the most hardest to over come of anything when hunting game or people. Its called buck fever. Its the shock of your reactions when you encounter your target. Your adrenalin flows, your breathing changes, and your mindset is never what you expect no mater what you prepare for !!!!!
3) Nerve, do you really think you can kill a human ?.....You will say yes, but when your faced with it would you. This would be ten fold if you spend all your time playing video games.
4) Can you really sit and wait six hours for the perfect shot. Do you know how crazy your mind wonders, and your thinking changes when waiting ?
5) do you really think you know how people will react to a gun shot ?......Do you think it's like a video game ?
6) Are you prepared for the aftermath of even just shooting one round, and are you prepared for retaliation ?
7) better 360 view in RL
8) Do you know how to read noises, such as wildlife vs. Humans ? Do you know how to distinguish between a simple squirrel or a human ?
9) are you really a good shot, Have you ever really shot a hand gun ?...It takes a lot of practice to even hit 12" pie plate at 25 yards !
This is only off the top of my head. If I had time I could list at least 10 more differences....Video Gamers !!!
I dont only suck at it, but I also DONT GIVE A **** DAMN about getting better. Its just no fun. Even if I would be uber, I would still be bored to tears by FPS.
In the end, I want every game to be a bit like chess, where you have to THINK before you move. FPS arent like that at all.
Originally posted by gimmesome
Honestly, this is kind of where I started to question my friends who are always hooked on the fotm FPS at any given time. I ask "what's the point of doing the same 5 maps over and over?" and "you suck dude. I haven't seen you kill anyone yet. You are willing to deal with this over and over until you just remember the spawn points and the hiding spots? once you get to that point, won't you be bored of playing the same maps/scenerios anyway?"
Reminds me of how I saw Tetris and Diablo 2.
I was always amazed about people who keep playing these games for hours, days, weeks, months ... what the heck ? No idea how they keep themselves motivated. I always want a new story, a new opponent, a new area, and a ***load of abilities where I have to think what I have to do next.
Comments
On another note, even if you are "good" at FPS games, they're so infested with cheaters that you'll always get "wtfpwned" in some situations regardless of how good you are. The good thing is that the cheaters are often really bad players without their cheat, so you can outwit them. But in a 1-on-1 face-to-face encounter, you'll get brutally raped almost every time, if you didn't manage to get that once-a-day lucky 0.1s reaction headshot.
What you describe in BF3, where you get the first shot in and then seemily get killed in 1 shot after you pumped half a mag in to the opponent, i experience quite allot as well. Some of them have insane skills, others have a lucky shot, and a few cheats. I've been playing FPS games allot during the years and when i think back to my younger days, i know for sure that i would kick my older ass brutally if i matched up against myself 10-12 years ago.
One factor is to always make sure that you run the game smoothly, in at least 40 FPS, preferably more (50-60). Running at 20-30 FPS gives you a huge disadvantage against someone running at 50-60 FPS.
If you want to keep playing BF3, look for a class you enjoy. Not all of them require insane twitch-skills. You can do loads of good from a safe distance, or by just being smart. Practice some sniping and you can pop peoples heads from 300-1000m (even more). Go with the machine gunner and and bi-pod, stay in the back and supply ammo and suppressive fire for your team. As an engineer you can focus on viechles, both air an ground, with either the rocket launchers or mines/C4 charges, and repair your allied viechles. There's your brainwork. Find solid sniping spots, strategicly place mines for tanks or hide well untill you get a clear shot with a rocket launcher, etc. And then there are the viechles. All of them are pretty much "protected" against twitch with added "chunkines"/limits to the mouse movement of their guns. A tank can only turn the cannon so fast. A plane or hellicopter is more about being able to actually fly good, flank your opponents and drop flares at the right time, none which requires insanely fast mouse movements. A joystick can make it one hell of an experience.
BF games in general have a fairly steep learning curve, but once you get in to it, it's a blast. Just take the hits in the beginning, and eventually it'll loosen up. One weekend isn't much experience in BF3. Give it 3-4 weekends and you'll start to get with the flow.
Have fun!
And basketball is a sport by definition.
Yes, it depends on a person; but the starting question was specifically from the point of view of a person who doesn't find it fun to lose - who doesn't enjoy "sports".
EXACTLY! So, this is really the point I was trying to express, with some extra detail of course. I guess in a competitive atmosphere, I do not want to be responsibly for the actions themselves. I want to have a character that knows how to do it, and I want to just direct him or her when to execute these actions.
I never had to learn how to sword fight when I played melee characters in MMORPGs. I just had to know when to command my character to use their sword skills on a target.
Hmm... now I'm wondering why there aren't any military MMORPGs. Seems like there's a following. Would be refreshing having a character that I built, itemized/geared, customized and progressed from the ground up in a modern or historic war setting that has a bunch of cool abilities that I DIRECT instead of having to learn myself. I guess it comes back to me just not being a natural FPS'er. I don't have the interest in learning how to be the best shot on the field. The soldier I'm playing should already know how to aim and fire. I just want to select targets and direct what to do with them. /shrug
I used to play a lot of FPS... between original Halo and Halo 2 and Counterstrike and orignal Medal of Honor etc. I played a lot of FPS on both console and PC and I was good. Really good.
Now? I'm awful.
BF3 sometimes I do really well, sometimes I just get smoked. Hell, even playing through the single player in BF3 or the Gears of War series, I am just terrible - I die all the time on the easiest difficulty setting!
Halo 3 was really the last FPS I was really good at, though I did OK in COD:Black Ops online.
BF is much, much more difficult then many other online FPS due simply to the mechanics. It is not at all forgiving of mistakes.
In what seems like only a few short years I've just about completely lost that "competitive edge" for online FPS.
MMO PvP is slow enough for me to still WTF pwn people thankfully lol.
So yeah, OP, I feel ya...
I'm a lot more into cooperative online play then competitive. Perhaps it really is a measure of age?
True but the point I am making is that it depends on the individual, I have fun PVPing win or lose, have fun playing FPS win or lose. It really boils down to whether a person only has fun if they win, I'm not that person.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Good replies here, guys.
I appreciate them. I've read every reply so far and I like that most of you understand where I'm coming from and didn't immediately jump to 'noob gtfo' statements.
I will continue to try and find my niche within BF3 (afterall, I did BUY it. can't return it so I better make the best of it) --- I don't have high hopes though. It just really doesn't feel like a game I will have the patience to stick with if it's going to take weeks of getting owned before I start to get the hang of it. Again, I don't see the fun in being of no use to my team, and being the lowest on a killboard that determines my progression every map.
I hate to say it, but I've never missed vanilla-wow so much. Even BC wow was great for me in terms of PVP. Dropping down off my flying mount into a group of alliance and killing them all because I prioritized my skills and abilities better, properly spreading out crowd control, using the aggro range of mobs to my advantage, and set hotkeys in a more organic and accessible way than they did meant I had a good chance when outnumbered, and felt gratified when I won, as well as feeling less-discouraged when I lost.
WoW was for damn sure not my first MMORPG, but it did have a great world-pvp flavor to it before it transformed into a glorified lobby game.
I hate this crap, I've seen one cheater since I started playing BF3. I've seen more than my fair share of people claiming that someone else is cheating and sometimes it's me their yelling at.
How do you tell if someone is cheating? they insta one shot everyone from across the map.
Maybe someone is radar hacking or crap but I doubt it.
There are more bad players that think their the wtfpwneveryone that guy must be hacking if he beat me, than there are cheaters.
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Achiever 20.00%, Explorer 86.67%, Killer 60.00%, Socializer 33.33%
EKSA
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Indeed it is, BadSpock. Although, I don't think I've completely lost my competitive edge, but its definitely fading out.
I too enjoy cooperative online play far more than being constantly competitive. I still love the concept of PVP, but not as much because I want to make someone else feel bad, or make myself feel better, but because of the natural dynamic of it. AI is far from catching up to the exciting feedback/reaction that comes from playing with and against other players. PVE simply bores the life out of me in almost every MMORPG title (where as PVE = nothing more than raiding and dungeons)
But yeah, I guess I'm getting old. what a shame...
True.
I had that problem in CoD: Black Ops - but I really think the culprit was latency.
Maybe it was mine, maybe it was theirs, but on my screen I'd see myself splatter them with multiple rounds before they even got a shot off, then I'd die and be all WTF but then in the kill cam they obviously shot first.
Was very frustrating.
In that very real sense, are all online FPS truly Pay to Win as the guy/gal with the fastest internet connection will always have the advantage?
DISCUSS
Just wait until you get even older and rustier and MMORPGs seem too fast and frantic for you. (Even the oldschool ones)
I hope you love board games (I do, thankfully! I'm already prepared for a retirement full of chess!)
Well, FPS's are like competitive sports. Either you have talent or you practice a lot (or both). However, past a certain age, it becomes rather difficult to get into a competitive sport unless you are very talented.
Some tips, however, would be to start off with a very competitive FPS like Counter Strike: Source. If you can own in CS, you can own in any FPS.
Also, gear matters A LOT. Get an excellent mouse (Razer DeathAdder). Get an excellent mouse pad (large, hard surface mats from Razer). Get an excellent sound system (audiophile headphones + gamer soundcard). Get an excellent keyboard (Logitech, Razer, or go for mechanicals). Get an excellent computer and internet service (Lag = mortal enemy). Get an excellent chair (you'll be sitting on it for more than you can imagine). Get an excellent monitor (24" is the considered the sweet spot). Get an excellent microphone (communication is key to success).
Finally, there are a couple of rules that always passover from game to game:
1. Never rush in without checking the safety of the situation.
2. Always remain calm. Never let your emotions alter your gameplay.
3. Always think about what the enemy would do, or how the enemy would react in a certain situation.
4. Never fire unnecessary rounds. Try to maintain the element of surprise (These rounds can be used as a decoy, however).
5. Killing is good, but surviving is even better. Don't go to insane lengths just to get that extra kill.
6. Always be wary of your position and your teammates' position. If the frontlines shift, you have to shift accordingly.
7. Stick with a single gun, learn it, love it, own it. Then, move to other guns.
I could give you more tips, but I'm running out of time. Even though my post is rather off-topic, I hope you learn from my tips.
@ ;stealthbr :
I have a Razer mouse
I was using a Cyborg Mechanical keyboard until two of the keys stopped working. Using a Dell basic black keyboard now and don't see any difference in performance whatsoever
I have a great sound system
I have a nice HD monitor (22" not 24" but still fine for me)
very good internet connection with no lag issues
decent rig not the best, but still running the game at a good framerate with game settings on high
I hate counter strike -- wall/map/radar hacks and bunny-hoppers made the game feel completely ridiculous
In response to everything else you said: Sounds like a sport that I have to practice. I can understand that. But, as you said, the older we get the harder it is to be good at sports esp. when we don't usually play them.
I've always been able to grasp MMORPGs within days. Sometimes, depending on the game, I could even grasp it within minutes or hours. Grasping in terms of understanding the controls and executing the movements and character actions exactly as intended. The weeks and months and even years that I would put into a single MMORPG was for progression of my character, not to "learn how not to get stomped every time I got into combat" -- That right there is why I feel I'm just not an FPS player. I'm not going to be like the new mmo-crowd and demand from the devs that they CHANGE the nature of a successful and already present genre of games. I'm more inclined to give it my best, and then walk away if it doesn't offer what I want.
Still, the graphics and detail in BF3 are hard to ignore, and I'm tempted to just run around looking for good hiding spots to watch the battle go down instead of actually trying to jump in and get kills (get killed, over and over and over, really)
OP: Regardless of BF3 or not, an FPS is just like any other multiplayer game. It'll take practice to get any good. Once you play more, you get a better feel of the pacing, speed, map layout, etc. You'll eventually learn the hard way the little things you need to do.
Patience. Patience in learning the nuances of the FPS, and of course patience to reign yourself in from charging headlong into a firefight. Doing that in BF3 will get you killed in horrible ways.
I'm an old BF gamer myself (BF2, BF2142) and I suck in BF3. My Kill/Death scores were horrible, but I at least remembered to stick with and support my squad. Do that at the bare minimum, and you'll get points for at least helping support your squad and team. Remember that you can get points outside of putting a bullet through someone. BF games are team and objective based FPS titles. Eventually you'll get better. I've always gotten the majority of my points for seizing, defending objectives on top of support actions (replenish ammo, rez, health packs, spotting targets, etc). But after enough combat, my Kill/Death is getting closer now to "even."
It was the same for me with the other 2 BF games I played. Eventually on those I became really good and was a difference maker. But only after alot of playtime.
"I have only two out of my company and 20 out of some other company. We need support, but it is almost suicide to try to get it here as we are swept by machine gun fire and a constant barrage is on us. I have no one on my left and only a few on my right. I will hold." (First Lieutenant Clifton B. Cates, US Marine Corps, Soissons, 19 July 1918)
Thing is, Battlefield 3 isn't the best FPS to start off with. It may have nice graphics and sound effects, but the overall gameplay experience is too hectic, chaotic, and disorganized to really master the ways of playing FPS's. You need to play in a more controlled, more contained, and more focused environment to really train the essentials of the genre's gameplay.
I have to admit though, I rarely see any hackers in CS:S and if I do, an admin is always there to ban them. Also, bunny hopping doesn't really work in CS:S, as your aim loses precision if you jump and fire.
I love FPS PvP, and a huge fan. Matter of fact I need to head to gamestop at midnight to pick up MW3. I wish MMO's would take note.
You dont see someone with a sniper rifle running around like he has a machine gun. Everything is NOT equal, there are strenghts and weeknesses to which ever weapon you choose, and the FPS crowd is well aware of this. Yet MMO's cant seem to figure this out. Everything has to be equal when in reality it should not be like that. If your a mage you shouldnt be able to go toe to toe with a warrior up close and personal. But then again a warrior shouldnt be able to stand its ground at a distance vs a mage.
Even worse than the above example, the gear in mmo PvP has entirly way to much bearing on the outcome of PvP. You hope in a fps match, Everyone is roughly on the same playing ground, sure theres some guns you can unlock and such but thats really no advantage at all if any. I know CoD MW series had some perks that gave some big advantages, but it really wasnt that hard to unlock them. You didnt have to spend hours upon hours raiding to unlock those perks, unlike in MMO's where if you dont have the top teir gear from raiding, and hoping your guild leader lets you get the drops, you cant compete.
Dont even get me started on player skills in mmo pvp vs fps pvp. FPS pvp is light years ahead of mmo pvp, in terms of player skill.
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore)
Now Playing: N/A
Worst MMO: FFXIV
Favorite MMO: FFXI
Just takes a lot of practice. When you first picked up an MMORPG, did you know exactly what to do after a weekend of playing? Nah. Look, I am pretty terrible at most FPS when I start them, but after a couple weeks I start doing a lot better, sometimes after a few days. Once you learn the maps, the weapons, your capabilities, you will start doing a lot better. Maybe not 38 kills and 2 deaths better, but you wont be on the bottom of the list anymore and you will become an asset to your team.
Also...sick of seeing this...HACKING IS WAAAAAAAAAAAAY OVERBLOWN in almost all games. Sure I have seen it, but it's either been dealt with quickly by a server admin, or I was on some backwater server with no admins. I've even seen server admins abuse their power and 'hack' so to speak (seen this a lot in TF2) but this is pretty rare too. I've played CS:S for a long time and very, very rarely come across someone hacking, and when they do they are usually dealt with pretty quick. If not, I just leave the server. I know for a while after I started playing Counterstrike, the first one, I thought everyone was hacking. Well, turns out they weren't they were just better than me
Thing is too, that FPS games are not all about twitch. It's about knowing the map, having EXCELLENT situational awareness and knowing the capabilities of you, your teamates/oppnenents and your chosen class/weapons. When you walk around a corner and you are dead before you can blink, it's not because the guy that killed you has the reflexes of a cat, it's that he just knew the map better than you, could sense you were there. Just takes practice. In the end though, it's just a game. If you aren't having fun, go do something else. No need to over-analyse the situation.
I was kinda hoping that BF3 would be able to hold me over 'till SWTOR... nope. I tried to get into it, I really did. I'm not really sure what it is... part of me wants to say that I found the game to be completely shallow. I used to play Quake or Unreal deathmatchs for countless hours, and it doesn't get more shallow than that... but it was FUN! Most of these new FPS games just aren't for me I guess.
I never imagined FPS games to be on this massive scale. I started from LAN games (Counter-Strike and DOTA) then eventually moved to Sandbox RPGs (Morrowind and Oblivion) then went to ARPGs (Diablo 2 and Torchlight) and then moved to MMORPGs (Cabal, LoL, and Hellgate). I didn't really jump genres, but I did follow a certain flow.
@topic: Some people are good at FPS and other twitch-based game. It's reality. But on the other hand, if one is determined, one can still compete with these talented folks. The problem with these folks is usually, they are too careless with the gameplay and do not respect it. What I mean is, most of these people do not study the game and just head off to battle to kill people. In time, people with respect for the game and the gameplay who take time to study the game will be able to catch up to the talented folks' super kills in FPS games.
My Blog About Hellgate Global, an ARPG/FPS hybrid MMO:
http://kashiewannaplay.wordpress.com/
Hellgate Global Official Fan Blog
http://t3funhellgate.wordpress.com/
Currently Playing: Hellgate Global, LoL, Skyrim, Morrowind
Recently Played: Cardmon Hero, Cabal, Oblivion
Have to say, on the FPS angle of the discussion - this thread needs this link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zuzaxlddWbk
Have seen this commercial for MW3 on TV a few times - I still laugh each time.
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
Explorer: 87%, Killer: 67%, Achiever: 27%, Socializer: 20%
I suppose that captures the essence of fps noobs like myself really well
Although I've played plenty of fps games over the years, the amount of "I suck"
Clearly keeps me in nub-status
Thx for the link
just go take a look at some of the sites selling bf3 hacks and their forum activity. no wait! just go look at some of the hacking community sites that have free bf3 hacks. i wont post a link but you can find them in the 5 seconds it takes u to type the most obvious words in google. now come back here and say it again. if you still doubt me try using wallhack urself and check out those hackers staring at you through walls in game.
i guarantee you there's there's at least one hacker for every 3 games that u play. there are tons of hacks that are hard to tell for a normal user, not just the obvious 12 year old aimbotting. to name a few, they are: cham/esp wall hack, radar, no spread, no recoil, and bullet draw. any one of these gives the average noob a HUGE, and i mean HUGEEEEEEEEEEE advantage over their non hacking opponents... hell even aimbots can be very hard to tell if the aimbotter is smart about it
As i said, some are just insanely good. And if you've missed all the cheaters, good for you. I see the "X was kicked for hacking" once or more in the chat log in almost every game i play. Even tho many do get kicked, they could have been running around for a good while before they're busted. And everyone insn't so dumb that they insta-shoot everyone across the entire map. The "better" cheats are subtle, and helps you just enough to get the upper edge. It's not a whine, it's a fact, and i've learned to live with it. Heck i was constantly kicked myself accused for aimbotting in the original Unreal Tournament when running the Insta Gib mod. I was just too good at it and most didn't stand a chance, so i've seen both sides of the coin.
So, you can choose to hate the haters, or you can accept it and learn to kick their ass anyway. The one strong upper hand you have against cheaters is that they have bad judgement by default.
My eyes roll from your eyes rolling,
If you think any FPS has ANYTHING TO DO WITH REAL LIFE COMBAT YOU HAD BEEN PLAYING VIDEO TOO LONG !
Yes, sitting in front of your computer has nothing to do with anything :
1) First your reaction time is nothing to real life.
2) Getting over the Fear Factor is by far the most hardest to over come of anything when hunting game or people. Its called buck fever. Its the shock of your reactions when you encounter your target. Your adrenalin flows, your breathing changes, and your mindset is never what you expect no mater what you prepare for !!!!!
3) Nerve, do you really think you can kill a human ?.....You will say yes, but when your faced with it would you. This would be ten fold if you spend all your time playing video games.
4) Can you really sit and wait six hours for the perfect shot. Do you know how crazy your mind wonders, and your thinking changes when waiting ?
5) do you really think you know how people will react to a gun shot ?......Do you think it's like a video game ?
6) Are you prepared for the aftermath of even just shooting one round, and are you prepared for retaliation ?
7) better 360 view in RL
8) Do you know how to read noises, such as wildlife vs. Humans ? Do you know how to distinguish between a simple squirrel or a human ?
9) are you really a good shot, Have you ever really shot a hand gun ?...It takes a lot of practice to even hit 12" pie plate at 25 yards !
This is only off the top of my head. If I had time I could list at least 10 more differences....Video Gamers !!!
Get PAYDAY: The Heist via Steam. Sony FPS Bank Heist FPS. Only $20 and pretty entertaining...and tough.
Well, its worse for me.
I dont only suck at it, but I also DONT GIVE A **** DAMN about getting better. Its just no fun. Even if I would be uber, I would still be bored to tears by FPS.
In the end, I want every game to be a bit like chess, where you have to THINK before you move. FPS arent like that at all.
Reminds me of how I saw Tetris and Diablo 2.
I was always amazed about people who keep playing these games for hours, days, weeks, months ... what the heck ? No idea how they keep themselves motivated. I always want a new story, a new opponent, a new area, and a ***load of abilities where I have to think what I have to do next.