Ill admit, it has been a while but lower prices on any of these dont make any of these an advantage. Again, pvp unlock packs do not give your pve capable charachters any skills/items. It is only for pvp toons and your customizable heroes only. And buying the mercenary hero upgrades just lets you use your alts in place of you heroes. Seeing as how your heroes have access to everything your alts do, this is again no real advantage. I would even argue that it is also a waste of money.
I think you're confusing the PvP Item Unlock with the Skill Unlocks.
Go to the NCSoft site, click Store, click Guild Wars, scroll down through the items, click More Info on them.
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
That was the goal of the game, to unlock skills. Some of you people I will never understand. If the goal of the game is to capture skills, but you buy all the skills instead, than you just bought yourself the end of the game. What's the point?
That's like buying a single player game than purchasing the end-game cinematics so you can declare, "I won," 5 minutes after purchasing the game, then put the game on a shelf cause you won and it's over.
Good question djjazzy. pay to win has as many different explanations as sandbox/themepark, hardcore/casual...
I mean, what do you win if you pay? Do you win the game?
Some say you win an advantage over the other person. The advantage could be skills, or items... Others say that pay to win is skipping levels or faster leveling through xp boosts or what not. Some say that getting a fluff item in a cs that is a random in the world is p2w because likely it would have taken longer in the game world to get it.
Basically all p2w is is 1. A derogatory term used by people who don't like cash shops and/or 2. When you get something in a cash shop that may or may not offer an advantage.
Venge
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
That was the goal of the game, to unlock skills. Some of you people I will never understand. If the goal of the game is to capture skills, but you buy all the skills instead, than you just bought yourself the end of the game. What's the point?
That's like buying a single player game than purchasing the end-game cinematics so you can declare, "I won," 5 minutes after purchasing the game, then put the game on a shelf cause you won and it's over.
Different people play for different reasons.
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
I honestly couldn't tell you whether or not the skill packs give an advamtage. Haven't played since beta. Maybe its like fe where there is no real advantage... oh well. I just want a fun game and don't really care about the payment model. I'll choose whether what they are asking is worthit or not
Well the skill packs were certainly better in a convience sort of way. Although you still had to buy the skills for your character from the trainers in game. Honestly the only good value from the skills packs was for pvp. If you didn't want to bother with pve at all then certainly the pvp skill pack was a good deal.
I'd say the only questionable item for sale are the recent mercs they put in there. But with the game as old as it is I don't see it as a big deal.
For Guild Wars 2, I am struggling to think of something they could sell that would be "Pay 2 Win". It's not a gear driven game, so that's out. Everything is scaled so you really wouldn't have an advantage anyway. For competitive pvp you already will be max level, with max gear and all of the skills so there isn't anything there that they could sell.
If all I wanted to do was play end game things and didn't care about the journey to end game I would be tempted to buy whatever skill packs.
I'll use WoW as an example. If I had managed to get 1+ alts to end game and decided I like doing the end game, I would be very tempted to buy my way to end game to do the things I liked and skip the parts I didn't like.
edit - fortunately or unfortunately as you see fit, I've never actually gotten to end game on any game I've played, MMO or spg. They just get so repetitive I need to stop. Then when I start again I usually start at the beginning. The beginning of games just seems more fun to me.
edit2 - again a WoW example. I remember way back when first mounts were level 40. I had just gotten my character to lvl 40 and a mount and training was around 90 gold or something. Took me a week or grinding trash mobs to get that gold, was the most boring, mind-numbing unfun bit of play I've ever had. Swore I would never play a game like that again.
I don't mind working hard or long in a game, BUT I play games for entertainment. If they want to make the game long and hard, it by god better be fun - in hindsight I would rather have just bought that first mount.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
That was the goal of the game, to unlock skills. Some of you people I will never understand. If the goal of the game is to capture skills, but you buy all the skills instead, than you just bought yourself the end of the game. What's the point?
That's like buying a single player game than purchasing the end-game cinematics so you can declare, "I won," 5 minutes after purchasing the game, then put the game on a shelf cause you won and it's over.
Different people play for different reasons.
They're not "play"ing at all, they bought themselves the end of the game.
gosh ignorant people should'nt talk about stuff they don't know.
GW1 Skill Unlock don't give your Played Character any skill if you want it for your character you have to go capture or train it only affect Heroes and PvP Only Character.
Now GW1 End game is not to Collect skill far from that it's to get Diferent Prestige armor and Title.
Buying Mercenary pack is completly stupid it's to use your alt as heroes so yea beside having the armor look you don't get anything else (and yet you can change your heroes Armor Set so yea... waste of cash totaly lol)
Now to Stay in topic GW2 won't be p2w i you got that totaly out of nowhere. And no even if they sell Exp Pot that not a advantage hey look i lvl faster then the other but yea im kinda alone at my lvl i can't do the big stuff that give good stuff so i have bad stuff im useless untill a few other join my lvl.
gosh ignorant people should'nt talk about stuff they don't know.
GW1 Skill Unlock don't give your Played Character any skill if you want it for your character you have to go capture or train it only affect Heroes and PvP Only Character.
Now GW1 End game is not to Collect skill far from that it's to get Diferent Prestige armor and Title.
Buying Mercenary pack is completly stupid it's to use your alt as heroes so yea beside having the armor look you don't get anything else (and yet you can change your heroes Armor Set so yea... waste of cash totaly lol)
The minority wastes their time with prestige armor or PVP, the majority like me played to unlock skills for our characters and heros in PvE and when the majority like me was bored with that the majority like me created alts.
I think we should be clear as to what Pay to Win actually implies. In my eyes pay to win is where players who do decide to pay an amount gets an improvement which cannot be obtained in game. For example in Caesary a browser based city building/war game has items which allow you to lvl up past the free lvl cap. At this point a paying player has an advantage that the non paying player cannot possibly obtain in game.
I mainly played guild wars PvE start to end and only got into casual pvp in there but at no point in time did i feel that another player had any advantage over me who had not spent an extra cent on top of the expansions.
The skills i couldn't obtain through pve (rarer elite skills in faraway places - feast of corruption I hate you) were easily obtained using PVP in-game currency.
I see these items as more of a 'I don't play the PVE i just want the skills' or 'I don't want to buy that expansion but those skills would be kick ass'.
Play for fun. Play to win. Play for perfection. Play with friends. Play in another world. Why do you play?
The minority wastes their time with prestige armor or PVP, the majority like me played to unlock skills for our characters and heros in PvE and when the majority like me was bored with that the majority like me created alts.
lol wouhouu collecting skill was fun when your new and knew nothing bout the game once you know it better and you got a good build skill went your last priority untill you get to the point you need multiple build for pvp farming and all around pve so yea even if you wanted to collect all the skill you needed for let's say 3-4 build it would take what maybe 1or 2 day of normal play time ?
GW1 is all about farming Prestige (armor and title) and PvP mostly GvG Factions (Lux or Kurz) with the other pvp type to fill in if you get bored with the other.
That's like saying the majority of WoW player play to fill their talent tree, instead of tackling hard raids and get better gear.
The majority of WOW players play to fill their talent tree instead of tackling hard raids and get raid gear. Yup.
The majority of players do not raid, they create alts like I did, cause I'm in the majority. The majority of players in WOW like I did are also on PvE servers.
com on i wasn't talking about the wow part any1 can tell the majority don't raid ... wow is as become World of Casual Craft the game so easy with so nothing to do too easy acces to anything blizz did too much hand holding for wow (and yea i can say wow is easy yes i did FL and Bot/BwD and anything you want prior there nerf on hard mode full clear etc...)
Now you can't compare WoW and GW they both have diff goal and gameplay. The fact is GW is open to even Casual they can do anything a HArdcore player would do the difference is the time it will take to max a title or get a new armor .
Been so long since I've played GW1, but doesn't GW1 have some sort of 'pay for PVP skills' or something?
Not saying it is 'P2W' as that definition is up to the individual, but to say GW1 doesn't have anything that'll give you an advantage is factually false.
Advantage in this case would be 'time'.
Gdemami - Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.
Been so long since I've played GW1, but doesn't GW1 have some sort of 'pay for PVP skills' or something?
Not saying it is 'P2W' as that definition is up to the individual, but to say GW1 doesn't have anything that'll give you an advantage is factually false.
Advantage in this case would be 'time'.
Only for PvP only characters, so no. People usually don't go PvP before they unlocked their skills in PvE, so there's not many people who buy skills, so it was not a problem.
Anyone who believe gw2 will be p2w are ignorant. The game is not designed for that. It opposes the very foundations of the game, something like this would collapse it. Devs had said in MANY interviews that cash shop will be purely cosmetical. WHY CAN'T YOU ACCEPT THAT?
Comments
I think you're confusing the PvP Item Unlock with the Skill Unlocks.
Go to the NCSoft site, click Store, click Guild Wars, scroll down through the items, click More Info on them.
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
Explorer: 87%, Killer: 67%, Achiever: 27%, Socializer: 20%
That was the goal of the game, to unlock skills. Some of you people I will never understand. If the goal of the game is to capture skills, but you buy all the skills instead, than you just bought yourself the end of the game. What's the point?
That's like buying a single player game than purchasing the end-game cinematics so you can declare, "I won," 5 minutes after purchasing the game, then put the game on a shelf cause you won and it's over.
Wut?
Some say you win an advantage over the other person. The advantage could be skills, or items... Others say that pay to win is skipping levels or faster leveling through xp boosts or what not. Some say that getting a fluff item in a cs that is a random in the world is p2w because likely it would have taken longer in the game world to get it.
Basically all p2w is is 1. A derogatory term used by people who don't like cash shops and/or 2. When you get something in a cash shop that may or may not offer an advantage.
Venge
Different people play for different reasons.
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
Explorer: 87%, Killer: 67%, Achiever: 27%, Socializer: 20%
Just want to say...much better title for the thread than the old one.
I miss the MMORPG genre. Will a developer ever make one again?
Explorer: 87%, Killer: 67%, Achiever: 27%, Socializer: 20%
Well the skill packs were certainly better in a convience sort of way. Although you still had to buy the skills for your character from the trainers in game. Honestly the only good value from the skills packs was for pvp. If you didn't want to bother with pve at all then certainly the pvp skill pack was a good deal.
I'd say the only questionable item for sale are the recent mercs they put in there. But with the game as old as it is I don't see it as a big deal.
For Guild Wars 2, I am struggling to think of something they could sell that would be "Pay 2 Win". It's not a gear driven game, so that's out. Everything is scaled so you really wouldn't have an advantage anyway. For competitive pvp you already will be max level, with max gear and all of the skills so there isn't anything there that they could sell.
Anyway, just my 2 cents on the matter.
If all I wanted to do was play end game things and didn't care about the journey to end game I would be tempted to buy whatever skill packs.
I'll use WoW as an example. If I had managed to get 1+ alts to end game and decided I like doing the end game, I would be very tempted to buy my way to end game to do the things I liked and skip the parts I didn't like.
edit - fortunately or unfortunately as you see fit, I've never actually gotten to end game on any game I've played, MMO or spg. They just get so repetitive I need to stop. Then when I start again I usually start at the beginning. The beginning of games just seems more fun to me.
edit2 - again a WoW example. I remember way back when first mounts were level 40. I had just gotten my character to lvl 40 and a mount and training was around 90 gold or something. Took me a week or grinding trash mobs to get that gold, was the most boring, mind-numbing unfun bit of play I've ever had. Swore I would never play a game like that again.
I don't mind working hard or long in a game, BUT I play games for entertainment. If they want to make the game long and hard, it by god better be fun - in hindsight I would rather have just bought that first mount.
They're not "play"ing at all, they bought themselves the end of the game.
Wut?
The point of GW wasn't to unlock skills, it was to use them to great effect in PvP matches
Barely anyone PVP'ed. Most players PVE'ed. And the goal in PVE was to unlock skills.
Wut?
gosh ignorant people should'nt talk about stuff they don't know.
GW1 Skill Unlock don't give your Played Character any skill if you want it for your character you have to go capture or train it only affect Heroes and PvP Only Character.
Now GW1 End game is not to Collect skill far from that it's to get Diferent Prestige armor and Title.
Buying Mercenary pack is completly stupid it's to use your alt as heroes so yea beside having the armor look you don't get anything else (and yet you can change your heroes Armor Set so yea... waste of cash totaly lol)
Now to Stay in topic GW2 won't be p2w i you got that totaly out of nowhere. And no even if they sell Exp Pot that not a advantage hey look i lvl faster then the other but yea im kinda alone at my lvl i can't do the big stuff that give good stuff so i have bad stuff im useless untill a few other join my lvl.
No.
The minority wastes their time with prestige armor or PVP, the majority like me played to unlock skills for our characters and heros in PvE and when the majority like me was bored with that the majority like me created alts.
Wut?
How do you know it was the majority? Just because you play it that way doesn't mean it's a majority.
That's like saying the majority of WoW player play to fill their talent tree, instead of tackling hard raids and get better gear.
I think we should be clear as to what Pay to Win actually implies. In my eyes pay to win is where players who do decide to pay an amount gets an improvement which cannot be obtained in game. For example in Caesary a browser based city building/war game has items which allow you to lvl up past the free lvl cap. At this point a paying player has an advantage that the non paying player cannot possibly obtain in game.
I mainly played guild wars PvE start to end and only got into casual pvp in there but at no point in time did i feel that another player had any advantage over me who had not spent an extra cent on top of the expansions.
The skills i couldn't obtain through pve (rarer elite skills in faraway places - feast of corruption I hate you) were easily obtained using PVP in-game currency.
I see these items as more of a 'I don't play the PVE i just want the skills' or 'I don't want to buy that expansion but those skills would be kick ass'.
Play for fun. Play to win. Play for perfection. Play with friends. Play in another world. Why do you play?
Show proof or it didn't happen.
SexuaLobster's Grease Portal
lol wouhouu collecting skill was fun when your new and knew nothing bout the game once you know it better and you got a good build skill went your last priority untill you get to the point you need multiple build for pvp farming and all around pve so yea even if you wanted to collect all the skill you needed for let's say 3-4 build it would take what maybe 1or 2 day of normal play time ?
GW1 is all about farming Prestige (armor and title) and PvP mostly GvG Factions (Lux or Kurz) with the other pvp type to fill in if you get bored with the other.
The majority of WOW players play to fill their talent tree instead of tackling hard raids and get raid gear. Yup.
The majority of players do not raid, they create alts like I did, cause I'm in the majority.
The majority of players in WOW like I did are also on PvE servers.
Wut?
Any game on the market could turn p2w. That's when you vote with your wallet and move on.
com on i wasn't talking about the wow part any1 can tell the majority don't raid ... wow is as become World of Casual Craft the game so easy with so nothing to do too easy acces to anything blizz did too much hand holding for wow (and yea i can say wow is easy yes i did FL and Bot/BwD and anything you want prior there nerf on hard mode full clear etc...)
Now you can't compare WoW and GW they both have diff goal and gameplay. The fact is GW is open to even Casual they can do anything a HArdcore player would do the difference is the time it will take to max a title or get a new armor .
Guild Wars 1.
/Thread over
I thought we were talking about MMO here.
Well in that case,
Dothack rpg from the PS2 also wasnt P2W, and also wasnt a MMO, but similar to a MMO, so it fits this discussion as well
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
Been so long since I've played GW1, but doesn't GW1 have some sort of 'pay for PVP skills' or something?
Not saying it is 'P2W' as that definition is up to the individual, but to say GW1 doesn't have anything that'll give you an advantage is factually false.
Advantage in this case would be 'time'.
Gdemami -
Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.
Only for PvP only characters, so no. People usually don't go PvP before they unlocked their skills in PvE, so there's not many people who buy skills, so it was not a problem.
Anyone who believe gw2 will be p2w are ignorant. The game is not designed for that. It opposes the very foundations of the game, something like this would collapse it. Devs had said in MANY interviews that cash shop will be purely cosmetical. WHY CAN'T YOU ACCEPT THAT?
Guild Wars 2 Youtube Croatian Maniacs
My Guild Wars titles