when i first played DF i was looking for that first person view experience (much like Oblivion) so i jumped in and was all stoked when i tried archery it was just awesome.....
magic was cool but some horrendous sounds, and i mean horrendous. mana missle was like a really loud bathtub draining....
and then came melee and i was like WTF?! what is this? 3rd person crap totaly ruined the immersio that magic/archery provided. it was as if i was playing 2 games and had to keep switching from one to the other eveyr time i wanted to use melee. i mean, i dont mind the option to go 3rd person, but the absolute absence of first person was a huge turn off. it was just odd (not to mention the character models are not that good).
i never really got over it either. still now days i wish they had a first person melee option.
i LOVE darkfall i played it and loved it but i quit due to the harassment of the local pop. A newb wich i was starting out and was always being camped by high lvl eliet jackasses that have nothign better to do than make new players life hell so they dont play it no more. any they wonder why no one plays the game?
Because Darkfall is nothing like the Elder Scrolls and it feels more like Morrowind in areas like graphics and character animations, and whilst I love Morrowind and still play it on occasion I am not eager to pick up any other games that feel dated.
(Morrowind was actually dated in those respects when it was launched to)
Currently playing:
EVE online (Ruining low sec one hotdrop at a time)
Gravity Rush, Dishonoured: The Knife of Dunwall.
(Waiting for) Metro: Last Light, Company of Heroes II.
For those of you complaining about Darkfall's community and it being nothing but griefers and all that, you probably havent played in awhile. I started playing a few months ago and quickly became a member of 1 of several clans in an alliance of anti-griefers & newbie helpers made up of a couple hundred players. We've been getting our fair share of grief from the asshats because of our stance on anti-griefing but with the help of some very good vets in the alliance and a lot of new players being trained & assisted by them we have been quickly growing in numbers and power. We also have several shared holdings which are open to anyone who wishes to live there in peace, but those who cause problems are put on the KoS list and quickly swarmed by members from multiple clans in the area. Our alliance has also been taking holdings from some of the griefing clans as well as taking their griefing out of their hides through asset destruction and draining their mines & groves throughout the day if they insist on griefing the alliance and new players in the area.
Anyway, if Im right and you havent played in awhile you may want to check out the current state of things this weekend. Theyre doing 4x skill gains & increased loot weekend as well as reactivating all old accounts for the event. Check out the blog post about it here: http://www.darkfallonline.com/blog/fast-skill-up-weekend-details/
For those of you complaining about Darkfall's community and it being nothing but griefers and all that, you probably havent played in awhile. I started playing a few months ago and quickly became a member of 1 of several clans in an alliance of anti-griefers & newbie helpers made up of a couple hundred players. We've been getting our fair share of grief from the asshats because of our stance on anti-griefing but with the help of some very good vets in the alliance and a lot of new players being trained & assisted by them we have been quickly growing in numbers and power. We also have several shared holdings which are open to anyone who wishes to live there in peace, but those who cause problems are put on the KoS list and quickly swarmed by members from multiple clans in the area. Our alliance has also been taking holdings from some of the griefing clans as well as taking their griefing out of their hides through asset destruction and draining their mines & groves throughout the day if they insist on griefing the alliance and new players in the area.
Anyway, if Im right and you havent played in awhile you may want to check out the current state of things this weekend. Theyre doing 4x skill gains & increased loot weekend as well as reactivating all old accounts for the event. Check out the blog post about it here: http://www.darkfallonline.com/blog/fast-skill-up-weekend-details/
This is good to hear.
In the days of Ultima Online circa 97-99 and on Darktide of AC, philosophical differences between guilds helped a great deal in balancing the griefing aspect of FFA looting MMO's. For reasons I can speculate upon, that went out the window in DFO. If it's surfacing as posted above, great. This is actually far more of a critical aspect of what would have made DFO more fun for many, but has been lacking grossly since its release.
Regarding the OP, I have no idea why people assume he's trolling or whatever. I see his point. DFO and other MMO's would be more like Skyrim and more like a Skyrim MMO "IF" the developers did more of what OSI did back in the day of UO and actually roamed the land as characters to create unscripted content. If AV did that and had more sand that UO had in addition to placing skill caps on characters like UO did, like Syrim does, it would be a much better game.
-CC
"Lately it occurs to me, what a long, strange trip it's been". -Hunter
Isnt that the same thing as the Bandits in Skyrim?!
its the same thing!! they kill you without question
The difference being the intent; single player RPG worlds contain AI that is hostile but not with the intent of searching you out, ganking you, stealing your stuff, camping your corpse and forcing you to concede. Quite the opposite infact, you can recover your defeat by reloading. You can, if YOU choose, come back to that impass at a later time when you are more able to overcome.
Generally speaking, IMO, FFA full loot PVP centric mmorpgs are for those who enjoy raining on people's parade, kicking sandcastles and being "antisocial" in an anonomous manner.
again thats the same thing as Skyrim..
Thief- "Give me yo shit fool!!!!"
Player - "Fuc No MotherF-er!!! you can steal this hammer up that boney dark elf ass of yours bitch!!!"
player and Thief fights
winner loots
I like how you compare the intelligence level of griefers with that of a scripted AI.
they both playing the same role. both want to take your shit.
the bandit doesnt live by morals or rules(laws).
in video games, the gankers are Anonymous and hide behind a PC. so they also dont have morals nor rules against not attacking players.
except for the fact that in skyrim
1) the bandit is not some powergrinding lowlife that I have no chance against like most gankers are in Darkfall
2) if i die to the bandit i start back at my last save and really don't lose anything (unless i haven't saved in a while)
so no its not really the same, give me the option to "save" in darkfall and i bet you would have more players.
my cousin has been trying to get me into Darkfall for the past month (he just started playing it) and I did i loaded up the free trial and you know what the difference is. In Skyrim people play for the adventure and the exploration and finding cool ****. In darkfall people play to grief other players and kill.
sorry but DF would be more popular if it was not FFA PVP, the first sandbox game like DF that has consensual PVP will see a huge influx of gamers. sorry but many people don't want to run around looking over there shoulder because they are worried about being ganked. Nor do they want to do (like my cousin) go find some remote area of the world to "skill up". thats terrible game design and sorry but for MANY FFA PVP is terrible game design.
i get everything from skyrim that i would get from darkfall or any other sandbox without all the a**hat and dip***t PKers that come with FFA PVP. so you all can stay in darkfall gank each other with the other 100 or so players it has, ill keep to my skyrim.
why doesnt Darkfall satisfy the crowd that want a Elder Scroll MMO?
what is Darkfall lacking as a sandbox, that Skyrim has?
I been seeing a lot of talk about Skyrim here being compared to MMORPG. but what confuses me,,, I dont see anything in Skyrim that isnt alreayd standard in sandbox MMO, let alone themepark MMO as well.
fill me in somebody
Well, the basic thing Bethesda have that Aventurine lacks is good programmers.
There is a whole lot longer list (everything from graphics to crafting) but with bad coding a MMO can only become small at best.
If Avi would have made a singleplayer game that matches Skyrim feature for feature it still wouldn't become a hit.
It is BTW the same reason Wow won over EQ2, both games launched more or less the same time and EQ2 had many people standing in line for it, but Wow won anyways.
For me its the combination of exploring and danger. ihave playd mmorpg since eq1 and non after have been worthy of exploring.
I can explore in em but i find no enjoyment doeing so. Skyrim i spend all my time exploring, i try to do quest but i always get sidetrackd by something i just need to check out.
Dunno about darkfall but there aint 1 themepark that can offer me what skyrim does.
If you lockd every village/city in Skyrim to levels and restricted you from moveing from that area until most/all quest are done you have todays mmorpg sandbox or theme park alike. If this was the case for Skyrim i wouldt like it half as much
For me its the combination of exploring and danger. ihave playd mmorpg since eq1 and non after have been worthy of exploring.
I can explore in em but i find no enjoyment doeing so. Skyrim i spend all my time exploring, i try to do quest but i always get sidetrackd by something i just need to check out.
Dunno about darkfall but there aint 1 themepark that can offer me what skyrim does.
If you lockd every village/city in Skyrim to levels and restricted you from moveing from that area until most/all quest are done you have todays mmorpg sandbox or theme park alike. If this was the case for Skyrim i wouldt like it half as much
Exploration have always been one of ES best features yes, Daggerfall is still the largest RPG ever made for that matter. Old MMOs like EQ and AC actually did that pretty well too but modern MMOs are a far too small and linear for that.
You need a certain world size to make exploration work at all, and constant zooning really kills the mode for it.
But you might consider taking a look on Vanguard, it is the only modern MMO that makes it at least acceptable.
grafix stink / gameplay / UI / controls / population / pvp ..it all stinks imo and im a huge pvp fan..why soo many left shadowbane to play this id never understand other than shadowbane being shutdown
skyrim / elder scrolls kills this game in its sleep and is better in every way mention up above..if elder scrolls would ever become a mmo it would be the greatest thing sence sliced bread and if they added pvp id do something like this..
Full loot FFA PvP. It is not as popular as some seem to believe, and the proponents generally want to label it as "hardcore" to set themselves up on a pedestal.
I don't know about anyone else, but I think most people who enjoy Skyrim would not do so if there were much higher level monsters actively hunting them down and would lose all their gear when killed.
Full loot FFA PvP. It is not as popular as some seem to believe, and the proponents generally want to label it as "hardcore" to set themselves up on a pedestal.
I don't know about anyone else, but I think most people who enjoy Skyrim would not do so if there were much higher level monsters actively hunting them down and would lose all their gear when killed.
That certainly don't help, but I don't think it is the main issue for the game.
The mix of bad programmers and people who can't really make a good UI makes sure that DF wouldn't sell without full loot either.
The idea of Darkfall ain't bad, but the game just isn't made well enough. Blaming the thing on a single feature just isn't right here.
why doesnt Darkfall satisfy the crowd that want a Elder Scroll MMO?
what is Darkfall lacking as a sandbox, that Skyrim has?
I been seeing a lot of talk about Skyrim here being compared to MMORPG. but what confuses me,,, I dont see anything in Skyrim that isnt alreayd standard in sandbox MMO, let alone themepark MMO as well.
fill me in somebody
For some reason, this quote comes to mind:
Bentsen: Senator, I served with Jack Kennedy, I knew Jack Kennedy, Jack Kennedy was a friend of mine. Senator, you're no Jack Kennedy
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what
it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience
because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in
the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you
playing an MMORPG?"
Full loot FFA PvP. It is not as popular as some seem to believe, and the proponents generally want to label it as "hardcore" to set themselves up on a pedestal.
I don't know about anyone else, but I think most people who enjoy Skyrim would not do so if there were much higher level monsters actively hunting them down and would lose all their gear when killed.
That certainly don't help, but I don't think it is the main issue for the game.
The mix of bad programmers and people who can't really make a good UI makes sure that DF wouldn't sell without full loot either.
The idea of Darkfall ain't bad, but the game just isn't made well enough. Blaming the thing on a single feature just isn't right here.
I disagree the FFA PVP is the main issue. I think a lot more people would be playing DF if they weren't worried about getting ganked anytime they leave town.
people like danger but people don't want to feel like prey.
for me what puts me off darkfall is the grind, i hate grind i dont want to buy an mmo to have to grind for 3 months and pay for it just to start being able to enjoy it. I like pvp i like the danger aspect and risk vs reward of free open world pvp. But darkfall plays like a deathmatch fantasy game yet in order to become a part of that deathmatch you must grind like your playing a hardcore korean mmo.
It goes compeltely agaisnt the very nature of the game, to have to grind to be viable in a game thats all about pvp. if there was little to no grind like MO then i would be playing it, but i dotn have the time or patience to grind in an mmo and i beleive that goes for a large portion of the mmo community. I have no doubt that darkfall is fun when you have your skills grinded high and your pvping on a regular basis but it shouldnt be such a chore getting there.
there are 2 types of mmo, imitators and innovaters.
1. EVERYBODY cheat / macro / afk skillgain and close to nothing is done about it.
2. It is impossible to play this game without third party software that automates the UI rubishness and you are forced to self-buff with 10 spells before any fight...
3. Everybody turn shadows off to see enemies from far away. Making it impossible for people to turn shadows off in Darkfall is a must, imo.
"Only in quiet waters do things mirror themselves undistorted. Only in a quiet mind is adequate perception of the world." Hans Margolius
Because for 1: the game is fairly crappy, 2: the game is open pvp which bascally means high level ganking newbies all day since they'll run from anyone who can put up a fight. 3: The game is full looting which deters even more people from wasting their time with it. I don't mind open pvp if I am not penalized item wise for getting killed. Its why I liked daoc and rising force onlines pvp so much. You cannot have a mmo without solid pve, its like a unwritten rule, almost all open pvp games never do well compared to mostly pve games. I played darkfall, never got ganked but I found the gameplay horrendously boring and it just was not fun at all.
Being a pessimist is a win-win pattern of thinking. If you're a pessimist (I'll admit that I am!) you're either:
A. Proven right (if something bad happens)
or
B. Pleasantly surprised (if something good happens)
Because for 1: the game is fairly crappy, 2: the game is open pvp which bascally means high level ganking newbies all day since they'll run from anyone who can put up a fight. 3: The game is full looting which deters even more people from wasting their time with it. I don't mind open pvp if I am not penalized item wise for getting killed. Its why I liked daoc and rising force onlines pvp so much. You cannot have a mmo without solid pve, its like a unwritten rule, almost all open pvp games never do well compared to mostly pve games. I played darkfall, never got ganked but I found the gameplay horrendously boring and it just was not fun at all.
So in your opening sentence you make an assumption about high levels preying on new players, then in your final sentence you contradict your first sentence by explaining that you were never once ganked while you played....
As usual, a common misconception made by people who do not enjoy FFA PvP and need a way to justify that dislike without actually admitting that the playstyle is not for them.
I've killed players on a character with two week old skills, I've killed players on a character with one day old skills. It doesn't matter which character I use, people are still going to cry and claim that it was a vet preying on a noob.
Because for 1: the game is fairly crappy, 2: the game is open pvp which bascally means high level ganking newbies all day since they'll run from anyone who can put up a fight. 3: The game is full looting which deters even more people from wasting their time with it. I don't mind open pvp if I am not penalized item wise for getting killed. Its why I liked daoc and rising force onlines pvp so much. You cannot have a mmo without solid pve, its like a unwritten rule, almost all open pvp games never do well compared to mostly pve games. I played darkfall, never got ganked but I found the gameplay horrendously boring and it just was not fun at all.
So in your opening sentence you make an assumption about high levels preying on new players, then in your final sentence you contradict your first sentence by explaining that you were never once ganked while you played....
As usual, a common misconception made by people who do not enjoy FFA PvP and need a way to justify that dislike without actually admitting that the playstyle is not for them.
I've killed players on a character with two week old skills, I've killed players on a character with one day old skills. It doesn't matter which character I use, people are still going to cry and claim that it was a vet preying on a noob.
...the strength of your skills isn't the only thing that makes you a "noob". For example, just knowing what skills to use in comparison to a new player makes all the difference. On top of that, it doesn't take repeated ganking to deter the majority here... all it takes is a couple times of losing items you felt were really important, or actually getting killed by someone you had no chance of beating just to be looted by them so they can take stuff they obviously didn't need....
I file FFA PvP.... I have played darkfall, but not for very long.. but I did spend a large amount of time recently in Fallen Earth. The major difference, fallen earth had other things to do that took away from the monotony of finding things to do in Darkfall, AND you didn't have to worry about losing all your shit.
quests. darkfall has virtually no quests and in skyrim quests are one of there strongest points
If someone is talking in general chat in a language you dont understand, chances are they're not talking to you. So chill out and stop bitching about it!
Because skyrim doesn't have any competition from other players that makes people realise they suck at the game and therefore less people blaming the game for why they suck. If skyrim was an mmo there would be just as much, if not more complaining about it.
Also, skyrim isn't a sandbox, it is a themepark that calls itself a sandbox.
After playing Darkfall I find single player games like skyrim to be boring. Darkfall seems to cater to those who prefer their game to be hardcore and skyrim caters to the majority demographic of gamers - instant gratification easymoders who like eye candy.
There are so many DF rejects who STILL don't "get it" and are in denial that DF wasn't designed for them. If you think DF is a game is a game where the focus is maxing your character so you can go around ganking newbies, you are ignorant.
After playing skyrim, I really found it boring. No possibility of danger lurking around every corner. No competition with other players. No meaningful death, no meaningful victories. Leading you, like a dog, to the prize.
This is the difference between the people Darkfall was meant for and the DF rejects who cry that game is fundamentally flawed and needs to change to accomomdate their narrow minded POV.
I think an Elder Scrolls MMO is definately possible, it would unfortunately require huge resources and time to make it worthy of the Elder Scrolls title.
Darkfall unfortunately simply didn't have the resources to make the game what we truelly wanted, that in conjuction with some design mistakes is what has kept me away from it.
So how would an Elder Scrolls MMO work? First off, anything is possible with proper thought, testing and tons of time and money. So anyone saying that an Elder Scrolls MMO would never work is simply Wrong!!!
It is how it is designed and developed is what will make or break any game.
So how would we solve some of the things?
Persistant world
This is a must in any MMORPG. The game would need to keep moving and keep changing, random events need to be exactly that (random). They need to happen but in different locations and different times and effect different people throughout the world.
Killing a character and then they come back
A simple character generation engine perhaps could cover this. If you kill Mr David Cameron for example to complete a quest or just for the fun of it then a new character needs to spawn with new features, new name, new clothes etc... and not necessarily be a requirement of that quest but of other quests perhaps. They may not spawn in the same location but elsewhere within the world.
Repeatable quests
As mentioned before, quests need to be dynamic and move about the gaming world and never be the same. If I enter a house in Westfall and speak to meet Mrs Queen of the world and complete a quest for her. That quest should be gone, and the quest generator should then add a new one to someone else, somewhere else within the world.
The World
Needs to be massive, absolutely huge to fill the different NCP's.
Where do we fit in?
All players start at unique locations throughout the world, not in the same place. They start the game with an NCP spawning explaining the controls and what they can do and provide directions to the nearest settlement. Then they disappear. This would be the only phasing element of the game. Other players would not see the NPC.
What about the story?
The story and it's quest will all be part of the game but not the dominant part of it, it would be an element that players can enjoy but wouldn't be the sole area that players can enjoy.
What about me?
Each player will have sort of a chronicles and it catalogues the character type, personality, acheivements, etc...
What about greiving?
Killing a player within a city will get you arrested and subject to a large fine, since money is the only thing people really care about in game a hefty fine should deter people.
Outside of the city, if players are grived they can report them to guards or place a bounty on there head for other players to pick up. They would also take a reputation hit with the law enforcement for that city, thus if they do it too many times, there rep will be too bad and guards will attack them regardless.
Gear
Important but not as important as other MMO's, gear should give you some benefits but shouldnt be the battle decider.
Levels
Gone, don't exist.
Skills
Each character has skill sets and these build up over time the more you do something. However, these only give you an advantage, if someone with 100 skills in heavy armour, dressed in elite gear gets stabbed in the head by a new player just starting. They die!!!
No health!!
Controversial but the health bar is gone!!! I would go for a more realistic approach, for example, you get stabbed in the arm you dont die but cannot carry a sword in that arm. Healers will heal body areas and cannot do it instantly.
Forget DPS, Tank and healer
Not all MMORPG's have to follow this model. This is Elder Scrolls so the combat would work just like in the single player. You could fight like this but perhaps have other options.
Just a few ideas I have got, sorry part of it went from an Elder Scrolls MMO to my idea of a good MMO but you get the general idea.
That would be fun!
I keep making threads to make Darkfall more like that. Random repeatable quests for example . .. the no health thing would be hard as hell though. Starting a character all over after one death would be insane LOL they would have to make the grind so that an end character could be attainable after 3 days or something or else nothing but macroed characters would be waiting for you as you try and start out.
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Comments
personaly for me it was the melee combat.
when i first played DF i was looking for that first person view experience (much like Oblivion) so i jumped in and was all stoked when i tried archery it was just awesome.....
magic was cool but some horrendous sounds, and i mean horrendous. mana missle was like a really loud bathtub draining....
and then came melee and i was like WTF?! what is this? 3rd person crap totaly ruined the immersio that magic/archery provided. it was as if i was playing 2 games and had to keep switching from one to the other eveyr time i wanted to use melee. i mean, i dont mind the option to go 3rd person, but the absolute absence of first person was a huge turn off. it was just odd (not to mention the character models are not that good).
i never really got over it either. still now days i wish they had a first person melee option.
The Elder Scrolls title.
+Polish
Played - M59, EQOA, EQ, EQ2, PS, SWG[Favorite], DAoC, UO, RS, MXO, CoH/CoV, TR, FFXI, FoM, WoW, Eve, Rift, SWTOR, TSW.
Playing - PS2, AoW, GW2
i LOVE darkfall i played it and loved it but i quit due to the harassment of the local pop. A newb wich i was starting out and was always being camped by high lvl eliet jackasses that have nothign better to do than make new players life hell so they dont play it no more. any they wonder why no one plays the game?
Because Darkfall is nothing like the Elder Scrolls and it feels more like Morrowind in areas like graphics and character animations, and whilst I love Morrowind and still play it on occasion I am not eager to pick up any other games that feel dated.
(Morrowind was actually dated in those respects when it was launched to)
Currently playing:
EVE online (Ruining low sec one hotdrop at a time)
Gravity Rush,
Dishonoured: The Knife of Dunwall.
(Waiting for) Metro: Last Light,
Company of Heroes II.
For those of you complaining about Darkfall's community and it being nothing but griefers and all that, you probably havent played in awhile. I started playing a few months ago and quickly became a member of 1 of several clans in an alliance of anti-griefers & newbie helpers made up of a couple hundred players. We've been getting our fair share of grief from the asshats because of our stance on anti-griefing but with the help of some very good vets in the alliance and a lot of new players being trained & assisted by them we have been quickly growing in numbers and power. We also have several shared holdings which are open to anyone who wishes to live there in peace, but those who cause problems are put on the KoS list and quickly swarmed by members from multiple clans in the area. Our alliance has also been taking holdings from some of the griefing clans as well as taking their griefing out of their hides through asset destruction and draining their mines & groves throughout the day if they insist on griefing the alliance and new players in the area.
Anyway, if Im right and you havent played in awhile you may want to check out the current state of things this weekend. Theyre doing 4x skill gains & increased loot weekend as well as reactivating all old accounts for the event. Check out the blog post about it here: http://www.darkfallonline.com/blog/fast-skill-up-weekend-details/
This is good to hear.
In the days of Ultima Online circa 97-99 and on Darktide of AC, philosophical differences between guilds helped a great deal in balancing the griefing aspect of FFA looting MMO's. For reasons I can speculate upon, that went out the window in DFO. If it's surfacing as posted above, great. This is actually far more of a critical aspect of what would have made DFO more fun for many, but has been lacking grossly since its release.
Regarding the OP, I have no idea why people assume he's trolling or whatever. I see his point. DFO and other MMO's would be more like Skyrim and more like a Skyrim MMO "IF" the developers did more of what OSI did back in the day of UO and actually roamed the land as characters to create unscripted content. If AV did that and had more sand that UO had in addition to placing skill caps on characters like UO did, like Syrim does, it would be a much better game.
-CC
"Lately it occurs to me,
what a long, strange trip it's been". -Hunter
except for the fact that in skyrim
1) the bandit is not some powergrinding lowlife that I have no chance against like most gankers are in Darkfall
2) if i die to the bandit i start back at my last save and really don't lose anything (unless i haven't saved in a while)
so no its not really the same, give me the option to "save" in darkfall and i bet you would have more players.
my cousin has been trying to get me into Darkfall for the past month (he just started playing it) and I did i loaded up the free trial and you know what the difference is. In Skyrim people play for the adventure and the exploration and finding cool ****. In darkfall people play to grief other players and kill.
sorry but DF would be more popular if it was not FFA PVP, the first sandbox game like DF that has consensual PVP will see a huge influx of gamers. sorry but many people don't want to run around looking over there shoulder because they are worried about being ganked. Nor do they want to do (like my cousin) go find some remote area of the world to "skill up". thats terrible game design and sorry but for MANY FFA PVP is terrible game design.
i get everything from skyrim that i would get from darkfall or any other sandbox without all the a**hat and dip***t PKers that come with FFA PVP. so you all can stay in darkfall gank each other with the other 100 or so players it has, ill keep to my skyrim.
Well, the basic thing Bethesda have that Aventurine lacks is good programmers.
There is a whole lot longer list (everything from graphics to crafting) but with bad coding a MMO can only become small at best.
If Avi would have made a singleplayer game that matches Skyrim feature for feature it still wouldn't become a hit.
It is BTW the same reason Wow won over EQ2, both games launched more or less the same time and EQ2 had many people standing in line for it, but Wow won anyways.
I can explore in em but i find no enjoyment doeing so. Skyrim i spend all my time exploring, i try to do quest but i always get sidetrackd by something i just need to check out.
Dunno about darkfall but there aint 1 themepark that can offer me what skyrim does.
If you lockd every village/city in Skyrim to levels and restricted you from moveing from that area until most/all quest are done you have todays mmorpg sandbox or theme park alike. If this was the case for Skyrim i wouldt like it half as much
Exploration have always been one of ES best features yes, Daggerfall is still the largest RPG ever made for that matter. Old MMOs like EQ and AC actually did that pretty well too but modern MMOs are a far too small and linear for that.
You need a certain world size to make exploration work at all, and constant zooning really kills the mode for it.
But you might consider taking a look on Vanguard, it is the only modern MMO that makes it at least acceptable.
cuz darkfall stinks the high heavens
grafix stink / gameplay / UI / controls / population / pvp ..it all stinks imo and im a huge pvp fan..why soo many left shadowbane to play this id never understand other than shadowbane being shutdown
skyrim / elder scrolls kills this game in its sleep and is better in every way mention up above..if elder scrolls would ever become a mmo it would be the greatest thing sence sliced bread and if they added pvp id do something like this..
Full loot FFA PvP. It is not as popular as some seem to believe, and the proponents generally want to label it as "hardcore" to set themselves up on a pedestal.
I don't know about anyone else, but I think most people who enjoy Skyrim would not do so if there were much higher level monsters actively hunting them down and would lose all their gear when killed.
That certainly don't help, but I don't think it is the main issue for the game.
The mix of bad programmers and people who can't really make a good UI makes sure that DF wouldn't sell without full loot either.
The idea of Darkfall ain't bad, but the game just isn't made well enough. Blaming the thing on a single feature just isn't right here.
For some reason, this quote comes to mind:
Bentsen: Senator, I served with Jack Kennedy, I knew Jack Kennedy, Jack Kennedy was a friend of mine. Senator, you're no Jack Kennedy
Epic Music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAigCvelkhQ&list=PLo9FRw1AkDuQLEz7Gvvaz3ideB2NpFtT1
https://archive.org/details/softwarelibrary_msdos?&sort=-downloads&page=1
Kyleran: "Now there's the real trick, learning to accept and enjoy a game for what it offers rather than pass on what might be a great playing experience because it lacks a few features you prefer."
John Henry Newman: "A man would do nothing if he waited until he could do it so well that no one could find fault."
FreddyNoNose: "A good game needs no defense; a bad game has no defense." "Easily digested content is just as easily forgotten."
LacedOpium: "So the question that begs to be asked is, if you are not interested in the game mechanics that define the MMORPG genre, then why are you playing an MMORPG?"
I disagree the FFA PVP is the main issue. I think a lot more people would be playing DF if they weren't worried about getting ganked anytime they leave town.
people like danger but people don't want to feel like prey.
Because Darkfall is an awful game.
for me what puts me off darkfall is the grind, i hate grind i dont want to buy an mmo to have to grind for 3 months and pay for it just to start being able to enjoy it. I like pvp i like the danger aspect and risk vs reward of free open world pvp. But darkfall plays like a deathmatch fantasy game yet in order to become a part of that deathmatch you must grind like your playing a hardcore korean mmo.
It goes compeltely agaisnt the very nature of the game, to have to grind to be viable in a game thats all about pvp. if there was little to no grind like MO then i would be playing it, but i dotn have the time or patience to grind in an mmo and i beleive that goes for a large portion of the mmo community. I have no doubt that darkfall is fun when you have your skills grinded high and your pvping on a regular basis but it shouldnt be such a chore getting there.
there are 2 types of mmo, imitators and innovaters.
For my personal taste, for only three reasons:
1. EVERYBODY cheat / macro / afk skillgain and close to nothing is done about it.
2. It is impossible to play this game without third party software that automates the UI rubishness and you are forced to self-buff with 10 spells before any fight...
3. Everybody turn shadows off to see enemies from far away. Making it impossible for people to turn shadows off in Darkfall is a must, imo.
"Only in quiet waters do things mirror themselves undistorted.
Only in a quiet mind is adequate perception of the world."
Hans Margolius
Because for 1: the game is fairly crappy, 2: the game is open pvp which bascally means high level ganking newbies all day since they'll run from anyone who can put up a fight. 3: The game is full looting which deters even more people from wasting their time with it. I don't mind open pvp if I am not penalized item wise for getting killed. Its why I liked daoc and rising force onlines pvp so much. You cannot have a mmo without solid pve, its like a unwritten rule, almost all open pvp games never do well compared to mostly pve games. I played darkfall, never got ganked but I found the gameplay horrendously boring and it just was not fun at all.
Being a pessimist is a win-win pattern of thinking. If you're a pessimist (I'll admit that I am!) you're either:
A. Proven right (if something bad happens)
or
B. Pleasantly surprised (if something good happens)
Either way, you can't lose! Try it out sometime!
So in your opening sentence you make an assumption about high levels preying on new players, then in your final sentence you contradict your first sentence by explaining that you were never once ganked while you played....
As usual, a common misconception made by people who do not enjoy FFA PvP and need a way to justify that dislike without actually admitting that the playstyle is not for them.
I've killed players on a character with two week old skills, I've killed players on a character with one day old skills. It doesn't matter which character I use, people are still going to cry and claim that it was a vet preying on a noob.
...the strength of your skills isn't the only thing that makes you a "noob". For example, just knowing what skills to use in comparison to a new player makes all the difference. On top of that, it doesn't take repeated ganking to deter the majority here... all it takes is a couple times of losing items you felt were really important, or actually getting killed by someone you had no chance of beating just to be looted by them so they can take stuff they obviously didn't need....
I file FFA PvP.... I have played darkfall, but not for very long.. but I did spend a large amount of time recently in Fallen Earth. The major difference, fallen earth had other things to do that took away from the monotony of finding things to do in Darkfall, AND you didn't have to worry about losing all your shit.
quests. darkfall has virtually no quests and in skyrim quests are one of there strongest points
If someone is talking in general chat in a language you dont understand, chances are they're not talking to you. So chill out and stop bitching about it!
Because skyrim doesn't have any competition from other players that makes people realise they suck at the game and therefore less people blaming the game for why they suck. If skyrim was an mmo there would be just as much, if not more complaining about it.
Also, skyrim isn't a sandbox, it is a themepark that calls itself a sandbox.
After playing Darkfall I find single player games like skyrim to be boring. Darkfall seems to cater to those who prefer their game to be hardcore and skyrim caters to the majority demographic of gamers - instant gratification easymoders who like eye candy.
There are so many DF rejects who STILL don't "get it" and are in denial that DF wasn't designed for them. If you think DF is a game is a game where the focus is maxing your character so you can go around ganking newbies, you are ignorant.
After playing skyrim, I really found it boring. No possibility of danger lurking around every corner. No competition with other players. No meaningful death, no meaningful victories. Leading you, like a dog, to the prize.
This is the difference between the people Darkfall was meant for and the DF rejects who cry that game is fundamentally flawed and needs to change to accomomdate their narrow minded POV.
That would be fun!
I keep making threads to make Darkfall more like that. Random repeatable quests for example . .. the no health thing would be hard as hell though. Starting a character all over after one death would be insane LOL they would have to make the grind so that an end character could be attainable after 3 days or something or else nothing but macroed characters would be waiting for you as you try and start out.
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