Dont complain about things we dont like if it serves other pruposes for others.
Dont complain about classes to be nerfed when we should ask for balances.
In other words, you are trying to teach us how to be contructive to the devs. Even though, you did that in a round about way by using SWG and turning other points into a wall of text, I think what you are trying to do is important. I personally think that Beta is over rated( other than testing lag, and finding glitches... for example changing mechanics based on certain kinds of feed back while others enjoyed it), and unless poeple have a basic understanding other than thier own bias on game mechanics, and can add something useful for the devs, personal opinion is only important becuase people or customers mostly only have that. So the devs go by what the customer is saying. Unfortunately, if the customer is silly to mostly want nerfs instead of balances, then the devs do that.
So you make an assumtoipn, that 1. We can become smart enough as customers to collectivelly add postive feed back.
2. The devs with a certain kind of feed back would benefit more.
3. THe nerfs or changes to the game are done for certain reasons, when it could be fore others. For example balancing a class instead of nerfng could mean balancing every other class as well instead of nerfing just one. Imo, the best thing for them to do is have a flavor of the month, and it rotates. It makes things more interesting, but again we should then teach people to play thier characters even if the month is not in thier favor and to read patch notes as well.
So even though the intention is good, you need to reach and educate a lot of people, which is a lot of work for a video game which is a past time for some. How many video gamers do you think even browse forums for the games that they play unless there is a technical issue?
So we are left at the mercy of the devs making the best interpretation of the feed back given to them, and knowing on how to implement depending on what that idea is. Like I said, if people complain about nerfing a character maybe the devs will decide to balance all classes, instead of enrfing one. Its up to them, and if they do, they are giving up an opportunity cost of doing something else with thier game as well.
You've got it exactly! Given what I remember about SWG, I'm trying to figure out how we as a community can be more constructive, and not contribute to the nerfstruction like I remember from SWG--and I'm not saying it was all our fault, but I do remember enough to know that we contributed, even if indirectly. Of course we're left to the mercy of the devs when it comes to how they decide to act on any type of feedback, but I'm hoping this time around, the community members support each other more than point fingers...fingers of nerfstruction lol. Tall order? Well, yeah--but it can and should start somewhere...vote MMO culture change 2012.
You may want to compress your thoughts a bit. I will not, nor will many people ever read this wall of text. Just a thought for the future.
The wall of text was the best part...it mentioned you. Compressing thoughts is over-rated, but I think there are text-to-speech programs out there that can help if eye strain is an issue.
Would you go for expressing them succinctly?
I could, but then it would read like a text book...did you manage to read it? Any thoughts?
I'm sorry that you and many other SWG fans are sad that you are losing a game you enjoyed. However, if you truely want to help SWTOR, encourage other SWG fans to pretend that there is no TOR. The vast majority of SWG vet posts have been hateful towards SWTOR and obviously meant to cause harm to the game and it's new community.
SWTOR does not need the help of bitter angry SWG fans. You need to move on, or collectively pool your resources to line up a developer and start-up money. Then you can contact George Lucas and talk to him about building a game the way you want to.
Please, just leave SWTOR alone. Move on. There are much more serious issues effecting peoples lives everyday.
"There is no emotion, there is peace"
"There is no passion, there is serenity"
Take a deep breath, relax and move on.
May the Force be with you.
"Don't corpse-camp that idea. Its never gonna rez" Bladezz (The Guild)
I'm sorry that you and many other SWG fans are sad that you are losing a game you enjoyed. However, if you truely want to help SWTOR, encourage other SWG fans to pretend that there is no TOR. The vast majority of SWG vet posts have been hateful towards SWTOR and obviously meant to cause harm to the game and it's new community.
SWTOR does not need the help of bitter angry SWG fans. You need to move on, or collectively pool your resources to line up a developer and start-up money. Then you can contact George Lucas and talk to him about building a game the way you want to.
Please, just leave SWTOR alone. Move on. There are much more serious issues effecting peoples lives everyday.
"There is no emotion, there is peace"
"There is no passion, there is serenity"
Take a deep breath, relax and move on.
Mat the Force be with you.
You were doing so well until you got to the last line.
You might not have meant to, but your post basically lays the blame for the NGE at the feet of the players when it was clearly SOE who was at fault. You can't expect paying customers to keep their mouths shut when they are angry at a product. That will never happen in the retail business. It is up to the company itself to read and filter what is useful information and what is pure bull.
SOE should have realized that they were catering to a different player base and worked to stabilize SWG. By sticking to their original vision of the game,and fixing everything that was broken, they would have provided a nice contrast to WOW. I doubt Bioware will be as wishy washy with their games direction as SOE was.
You're right, I don't want anyone thinking that what happened in SWG was all our fault, but WE all know the part SOE and LA played--and we can remember how much the players complained about so many issues. However, I also remember SOE telling us why they nerfed the way they did, and part of that was due to our input, and the rest was due to them being lazy know it alls LOL
What I'm thinking is, if we're a little more careful with how we voice our concerns, we might keep players from rage-quitting as a result of devs taking our feedback and blowing a class to bits LOL
I'm being a little selfish in my motivations for wanting a huge subscriber base (ie why I want to keep as many people happy with this game as long as we can)...I play during off-peak hours, and would rather not be playing solo all the time.
OP you do raise a valid point. (Though for the life of me I can't work out exactly how you dragged it out to be more than a few sentences). Hopefully the devs will pretty much ignore the forums be it the posts from vetinarians or from pig breeders. Hopefully they will rely on focus testers and testing leads. Hopefully they will not make knee jerk reactions to forum sentiment. Hopefully they will make incremental changes. What can you and your fellow vetinarians do ....nothing (except possibly contribute to the problem).
I'm sorry that you and many other SWG fans are sad that you are losing a game you enjoyed. However, if you truely want to help SWTOR, encourage other SWG fans to pretend that there is no TOR. The vast majority of SWG vet posts have been hateful towards SWTOR and obviously meant to cause harm to the game and it's new community.
SWTOR does not need the help of bitter angry SWG fans. You need to move on, or collectively pool your resources to line up a developer and start-up money. Then you can contact George Lucas and talk to him about building a game the way you want to.
Please, just leave SWTOR alone. Move on. There are much more serious issues effecting peoples lives everyday.
"There is no emotion, there is peace"
"There is no passion, there is serenity"
Take a deep breath, relax and move on.
Mat the Force be with you.
You were doing so well until you got to the last line.
I'm sorry that you and many other SWG fans are sad that you are losing a game you enjoyed. However, if you truely want to help SWTOR, encourage other SWG fans to pretend that there is no TOR. The vast majority of SWG vet posts have been hateful towards SWTOR and obviously meant to cause harm to the game and it's new community.
SWTOR does not need the help of bitter angry SWG fans. You need to move on, or collectively pool your resources to line up a developer and start-up money. Then you can contact George Lucas and talk to him about building a game the way you want to.
Please, just leave SWTOR alone. Move on. There are much more serious issues effecting peoples lives everyday.
"There is no emotion, there is peace"
"There is no passion, there is serenity"
Take a deep breath, relax and move on.
May the Force be with you.
It's always funny to read posts like yours because although it's addressed to me, it doesn't have ANYTHING to do with what I posted, and I'm left trying to figure out why you posted it...unless of course you didn't read my OP?...naaaah, that couldn't be it!
Given the right impetus, I can do nostalgia, but sad/bitter/angry?....sorry, wrong tree lol
OP you do raise a valid point. (Though for the life of me I can't work out exactly how you dragged it out to be more than a few sentences). Hopefully the devs will pretty much ignore the forums be it the posts from vetinarians or from pig breeders. Hopefully they will rely on focus testers and testing leads. Hopefully they will not make knee jerk reactions to forum sentiment. Hopefully they will make incremental changes. What can you and your fellow vetinarians do ....nothing (except possibly contribute to the problem).
Sometimes on forums when people try to be short, they come off as being short...almost confrontational--I throw in a little personality...more of a conversational tone if you will.
What's cool about it is that even though the way I post may cause some people to not read my thoughts initially--some will eventually engage in the discussion...with very little arm twisting. Of course then they have to throw a little jab before they finish lol, but that's only a minor annoyance
Here's hoping we don't get devs jerking their knees! What do you think about what Flirt brought up earlier, maybe they leave in the LOG OUT beta type questionnaires/surveys? Do you think casual non-forum following players would share their opinions, and hopefully balance out the shouting that might occur in the forums?
You might not have meant to, but your post basically lays the blame for the NGE at the feet of the players when it was clearly SOE who was at fault. You can't expect paying customers to keep their mouths shut when they are angry at a product. That will never happen in the retail business. It is up to the company itself to read and filter what is useful information and what is pure bull.
SOE should have realized that they were catering to a different player base and worked to stabilize SWG. By sticking to their original vision of the game,and fixing everything that was broken, they would have provided a nice contrast to WOW. I doubt Bioware will be as wishy washy with their games direction as SOE was.
You're right, I don't want anyone thinking that what happened in SWG was all our fault, but WE all know the part SOE and LA played--and we can remember how much the players complained about so many issues. However, I also remember SOE telling us why they nerfed the way they did, and part of that was due to our input, and the rest was due to them being lazy know it alls LOL
I remember those nerfs very well. The biggest problem first off was making jedi so overpowered. If they wanted an alpha class they should have left it the way it was originally designed: extremely tough to play with perma death. When they loosened the restrictions, they basically opened the floodgates for PVP to become a jedi fest because the only thing holding jedi players back at that point was time taken to full temp.
Second, SOE catered to this class WAY too much. Anytime a particuliar skill or template was found to be successful again jedi, the jedi base raged on the forums about it until it was nerfed. Not only did this affect bounty hunters, but also other classes. Jedi got two revamps and every patch seemed to give something to them while other professions like commando and smuggler were still broken. Is it really any wonder that so many were quitting long before the NGE ever came around?
Now many blame jedi and the players that it catered to but again this falls on SOE. SOE wasn't newbs when it came to MMORPGs. They already had experience with other mmos on how forums work and the REAL motivations that people have when they ask for nerfs. The majority of players will always be selfish and only care about what works best for them. It is the job of the company making the game to consider what is best for the community despite the complaints of the vocal minority.
That's the idea...What are your thoughts on how we can be more constructive in communicating with the devs, so that hopefully we can trick them into not nerfing every class into oblivion?...did I say "trick", I meant "convince them to make positive adjustments when needed"
I honestly don't follow your logic. I see absolutely no reason why having played a failed game should give anyone the ability/chance to save something. The points you mentioned pretty much are "common sense" rather than any quality or wished gained through having played a failed game. SOE never listened, a BIG part of the community feedback was far from constructive or even pretty idiotic. In addition to all the "TOR won't be SWG 2. Sucks!" whining I would much rather like to see people using their common sense and at best avoid to ever mention having played SWG.
Let's face it. When it comes to TOR the posts linked to SWG all follow this very same line:
"I played SWG <insert lots of blah> <insert whine> <insert yawn-inducing claims> <insert pointless argument while everyone should copy a failed game> <insert "themepark sucks!">"
I thought they changed the game because tons of people were already leaving. They gambled on trying to cater to the WoW-fan market, rather than trying to develop the game for the niche group that was staying, and slowly trying to grow the playerbase like EvE has.
I really dont think it had alot to do with players complaining. It added to the desperation on the part of the developers and LA, im sure, but I definately dont think it was the core cause.
Being refugees from the biggest MMO debacle in history, we have experience that could prove invaluable. We know first hand how a company can ruin a game, and so we are less likely to let our guard down there. The question however, isn't just about how SWTOR can be ruined by Bioware/EA, but more it's a question of what have we learned, about PLAYERS, that can negatively impact a game--and how we can TRY to keep it from happening to SWTOR.
Look, we all know, and mostly accept, that SWTOR is NOT SWG in ANY form, but whatever it is, people seem to like it...much like we liked our game back before...well, you know what happened. I say, even if we don't like this game, or don't subscribe very long, we can share our insight--and in doing so, maybe help the SWTOR community preserve their game.
What I'm looking for are your thoughts on how the SWTOR community can avoid the heartaches we endured even before the CU/NGE. The following is something I posted in another thread, that I believe was moved to the SWG forums, but it was written for the SWTOR audience. It's a warning, but I'm not saying that ANY MMO will ever be NGE'd again...by anybody. It focuses more on what the players should do or not do, you might agree/disagree, and there's nothing wrong with that--but try to keep in mind that this thread isn't just about what should be in this game--it's more about sharing advice with the people that are very excited about playing it...and want to stay that way.
There's no ONE reason that a lot of people quit playing SWG, but we can guess that the NGE did take a major toll lol. Some say players quit because of bugs, but how many quit out of boredom or frustration? Quitting from bugs?...I'm sure some did, but considering the changes they made to the game (NGE), the problem, they felt, was that people simply weren't enjoying their game.
I remember some of the complaints I'd read on the boards--and keep in mind this was my very first MMORPG--after a while I noticed a pattern that was later confirmed by SOE. If players complained that they couldn't do as well as other professions, the other profs got NERFED! In a game with skills that are extrememly hard to balance, SOE opts to take the easiest route--take away abilities from those that can do what you CAN'T, so that NONE of you can! (Except Jedi LOL--but even they got nerfed a time or two)...adding frustration to those being NERFED. Why didn't SOE just add capabilites to the weaker profs? Because then someone else would see that and swear that they were now overpowered...so SOE took the position that if enough players say they couldn't do something that the other prof could, then that prof was overpowered--so I begged people to STOP doing that! STOP saying someone else can do something you can't, and instead just ask for better abilities for your profession--NEVER MENTION OTHER PROFESSIONS...did anyone listen?...NO--FRUSTRATING...and so people were constantly complaining about getting nerfed--they'd rage quit--and then the strangest thing would happen on the boards--instead of support form other players, they'd get "Don't let the door knob hit you..." taunts. I remember thinking "wait a minute, these guys' profession was just nerfed to hell, and people are actually happy about that?...ummm, what happens when the nerf bat hits their profession and no other players support them?" So again, I tried to be the voice of reason, begging people to support each other even if the nerf bat didn't impact their gameplay...yet still no one cared, until it was their turn to rage quit.
Let's not forget good old fashioned boredom--SWG became nothing more than a graphical chat room to many--and honestly for the social gamer, there was nothing wrong with that. I'd log in sometimes just to see what people were talking about, but then I decided to get more involved in the GCW and PVP...IT WAS A BLAST! I sucked, but it was fun...having a group of coverts and just a few overts...setting the trap, and when a group of enemy overts jumped our overts...GAME ON!--only to find that they too had coverts...next thing you know you have 40 players fighting and even running for their lives! Too much fun. I remember trying to level up my faction rank, and getting TEF'd and having to run for my life when a group of enemy overts ambushed me!--definitely more challenging than mowing down a dozen Storm Troopers! Hell I even went overt if I saw someone attacking a rebel base, just to get killed with my fellow NPC rebs--still fun...then they changed the system because of complaints, and TEF's went the way of the dinosaur --COMPLETELY destroying the GCW...and boredom set in. I had 3 paying accounts and each one had a yearly subscription--had about 6 months left on them when I stopped logging in to the game--I'd check the forums to see if they were ever going to revive the GCW, but they never did, so I didn't renew.
Want to save SWTOR? I'm going to tell you how:
First, always encourage the devs to add more of what you like to do in the game, but never--and this is going to sound odd to some--but NEVER complain about the stuff you don't like to do, if you don't HAVE to do it. As an example, the flirt dialogue--if you want more opportunites for your character to flirt and get laid, ask that they add more flirtatious dialogue/scenarios--but if you don't give a rat's ass if your character ever gets laid, don't say "Hey devs, instead of stupid flirts, can we get some really evil options?"...instead, just ask for more evil or cruel dialogue options (go super darkside lol)--leave the flirt mechanic out of it, because others might actually enjoy it, even if it's a very small percentage of players.
Second, and you're really going to hate this, but don't even complain about stuff you DO have to do that you don't like, if others DO like it. For example, let's say that Bioware decides to make small instanced story quests that allow you to make major changes to the appearance of your character--so anytime you want to change your character's appearance, they've made that option available, but you have to run through a little story quest, so that your character change "enhances" the immersion--it gives a reason for any major change in appearance--it could be different for every class or planet that you're on. Now let's say that many people applaud this mechanic, while many others think it's completely lame and a waste of their time...they just want a "clicky". It sucks, but suck it up lol...and if you rage quit because your character is too lame to complete the quest or you don't have any friends that are willing to help you, then don't mention why you're quitting when they ask you...make up something like "school/work demands" or don't give a reason at all. That way, it doesn't jeopardize something others enjoy.
Third, and finally, don't ever complain--EVER--about what other classes can do! Don't tell them there's a problem with Guardians because Vanguard is a better tank than Guardian...I know, it's already started--which is why I know that nerf bats are at the ready. STOP EFFING DOING THAT PEOPLE!!! Instead, just make suggestions on how Guardian's tanking abilities can and should be improved--hold aggro, crowd control, etc--NEVER MENTION THE OTHER CLASSES...need I say it again?...EVER!!!!! If they see a bunch of people leaving the Guardian class, they might actually do something about it to make it better, but if they see a bunch of people complaining about how much better Vanguards are and that's why they're switching...well, then Vanguard is now a target for nerfdom--doesn't mean they will, but if history has taught us anything, it's that it's easier to take away from a class, than it is to add..."there, now Vanguards aren't better than Guardians--is it lunch time yet?"
Judging by the level of replies given to any random topic here, I hope this isn't falling on deaf ears. There aren't many that "think" before they post--they see an opportunity to say something like "wall of text" or "tldr", and think themselves clever.
And since people are going to complain about stuff that other people enjoy anyway...I hate to say it, but some sort of cash shop probably could have helped SWG. Don't like grinding faction points to rank up because of the TEF? Well, buy your rank--problem solved. Sounds ridiculous, but it could've saved the GCW. SWTOR may have to allow people to buy what they hate doing, so that it won't be taken away from those that like doing it.
was expecting your text to scroll up and float off into space
You might not have meant to, but your post basically lays the blame for the NGE at the feet of the players when it was clearly SOE who was at fault. You can't expect paying customers to keep their mouths shut when they are angry at a product. That will never happen in the retail business. It is up to the company itself to read and filter what is useful information and what is pure bull.
SOE should have realized that they were catering to a different player base and worked to stabilize SWG. By sticking to their original vision of the game,and fixing everything that was broken, they would have provided a nice contrast to WOW. I doubt Bioware will be as wishy washy with their games direction as SOE was.
You're right, I don't want anyone thinking that what happened in SWG was all our fault, but WE all know the part SOE and LA played--and we can remember how much the players complained about so many issues. However, I also remember SOE telling us why they nerfed the way they did, and part of that was due to our input, and the rest was due to them being lazy know it alls LOL
I remember those nerfs very well. The biggest problem first off was making jedi so overpowered. If they wanted an alpha class they should have left it the way it was originally designed: extremely tough to play with perma death. When they loosened the restrictions, they basically opened the floodgates for PVP to become a jedi fest because the only thing holding jedi players back at that point was time taken to full temp.
Second, SOE catered to this class WAY too much. Anytime a particuliar skill or template was found to be successful again jedi, the jedi base raged on the forums about it until it was nerfed. Not only did this affect bounty hunters, but also other classes. Jedi got two revamps and every patch seemed to give something to them while other professions like commando and smuggler were still broken. Is it really any wonder that so many were quitting long before the NGE ever came around?
Now many blame jedi and the players that it catered to but again this falls on SOE. SOE wasn't newbs when it came to MMORPGs. They already had experience with other mmos on how forums work and the REAL motivations that people have when they ask for nerfs. The majority of players will always be selfish and only care about what works best for them. It is the job of the company making the game to consider what is best for the community despite the complaints of the vocal minority.
LOL, you're bringing back memories...oh the forums were CRAZY then! It's actually kind of funny to think about now, but I wouldn't want a repeat of those days with this game...luckily this is a completely different type of game. Hopefully players and devs have evolved...and maybe a positive dev/player experience will emerge and usher in a new era...let's all join hands and sing...lol
Seriously though, you and others are right that it's ultimately the devs responsibility to make only positive adjustments when necessary, but I've learned over my 39 years on this planet, that we can sometimes influence how people respond to us, if we take just a little care...it's why I've NEVER had a bad customer support experience...and never been beat down by the cops lol. So maybe, just maybe, we can react a little differently about issues we experience in game, and that will help result in a more positive dev reaction.
I honestly don't follow your logic. I see absolutely no reason why having played a failed game should give anyone the ability/chance to save something. The points you mentioned pretty much are "common sense" rather than any quality or wished gained through having played a failed game. SOE never listened, a BIG part of the community feedback was far from constructive or even pretty idiotic. In addition to all the "TOR won't be SWG 2. Sucks!" whining I would much rather like to see people using their common sense and at best avoid to ever mention having played SWG.
Let's face it. When it comes to TOR the posts linked to SWG all follow this very same line:
"I played SWG "
Please, no more of that. Thank you.
Never said it wasn't common sense--I'm glad you picked up on that. The goal is for a positive outcome, yet for some I guess there's only pleasure when others are in pain...ie "NERF THE B*STARDS!"
As has been pointed out by others, not all of my suggestions were necessarily helpful, and unfortunately my only MMO experience derives from playing SWG--a game I at one time enjoyed--so I was calling on those that went through what I went through, to give their opinions or advice on what "WE" the players could do to help...coming from a game whose devs used our input against us it seemed--not that we didn't have a community of finger pointers too though.
If we discuss what we might have done to contribute, which is the only thing in our power we can change, maybe SWTOR goes through less heartache.
That's the idea...What are your thoughts on how we can be more constructive in communicating with the devs, so that hopefully we can trick them into not nerfing every class into oblivion?...did I say "trick", I meant "convince them to make positive adjustments when needed"
the game is fineit doenst need saving? There going to revamp the UI which seems to be the largest complaint that and the character creator.
There also going to revamp the space flight.
There adding in more guild functionality.
So it looks like they are moving forward and progessing.
I really like the way the game is now. So any serious changes would kill it for me. So if it aint broke dont fix it.
You want SWG 2 and you seriously want to push swtor a game not designed to be anything like it that way. it will not work.
Comments
You've got it exactly! Given what I remember about SWG, I'm trying to figure out how we as a community can be more constructive, and not contribute to the nerfstruction like I remember from SWG--and I'm not saying it was all our fault, but I do remember enough to know that we contributed, even if indirectly. Of course we're left to the mercy of the devs when it comes to how they decide to act on any type of feedback, but I'm hoping this time around, the community members support each other more than point fingers...fingers of nerfstruction lol. Tall order? Well, yeah--but it can and should start somewhere...vote MMO culture change 2012.
I could, but then it would read like a text book...did you manage to read it? Any thoughts?
Don't worry. TOR is a solid game.
I can't wait to start playing with my SWG guildies again.
Iron Circle (empire)
Knights of Iron (republic)
Vets are always welcome!
Scout Master,
I'm sorry that you and many other SWG fans are sad that you are losing a game you enjoyed. However, if you truely want to help SWTOR, encourage other SWG fans to pretend that there is no TOR. The vast majority of SWG vet posts have been hateful towards SWTOR and obviously meant to cause harm to the game and it's new community.
SWTOR does not need the help of bitter angry SWG fans. You need to move on, or collectively pool your resources to line up a developer and start-up money. Then you can contact George Lucas and talk to him about building a game the way you want to.
Please, just leave SWTOR alone. Move on. There are much more serious issues effecting peoples lives everyday.
"There is no emotion, there is peace"
"There is no passion, there is serenity"
Take a deep breath, relax and move on.
May the Force be with you.
"Don't corpse-camp that idea. Its never gonna rez"
Bladezz (The Guild)
You were doing so well until you got to the last line.
You're right, I don't want anyone thinking that what happened in SWG was all our fault, but WE all know the part SOE and LA played--and we can remember how much the players complained about so many issues. However, I also remember SOE telling us why they nerfed the way they did, and part of that was due to our input, and the rest was due to them being lazy know it alls LOL
What I'm thinking is, if we're a little more careful with how we voice our concerns, we might keep players from rage-quitting as a result of devs taking our feedback and blowing a class to bits LOL
I'm being a little selfish in my motivations for wanting a huge subscriber base (ie why I want to keep as many people happy with this game as long as we can)...I play during off-peak hours, and would rather not be playing solo all the time.
OP you do raise a valid point. (Though for the life of me I can't work out exactly how you dragged it out to be more than a few sentences). Hopefully the devs will pretty much ignore the forums be it the posts from vetinarians or from pig breeders. Hopefully they will rely on focus testers and testing leads. Hopefully they will not make knee jerk reactions to forum sentiment. Hopefully they will make incremental changes. What can you and your fellow vetinarians do ....nothing (except possibly contribute to the problem).
Haha! You win this thread!
Seriously why are you concerned how bioware can damage this game ?
Were interested in how bioware can make this game ace !
Thats all im interested in.
http://www.speedtest.net/result/1651869499.png
please dont save swtor like you all 'saved' swg.
It's always funny to read posts like yours because although it's addressed to me, it doesn't have ANYTHING to do with what I posted, and I'm left trying to figure out why you posted it...unless of course you didn't read my OP?...naaaah, that couldn't be it!
Given the right impetus, I can do nostalgia, but sad/bitter/angry?....sorry, wrong tree lol
That's actually the right mindset! KUDOS!
Sometimes on forums when people try to be short, they come off as being short...almost confrontational--I throw in a little personality...more of a conversational tone if you will.
What's cool about it is that even though the way I post may cause some people to not read my thoughts initially--some will eventually engage in the discussion...with very little arm twisting. Of course then they have to throw a little jab before they finish lol, but that's only a minor annoyance
Here's hoping we don't get devs jerking their knees! What do you think about what Flirt brought up earlier, maybe they leave in the LOG OUT beta type questionnaires/surveys? Do you think casual non-forum following players would share their opinions, and hopefully balance out the shouting that might occur in the forums?
vets from failed game trying to save game with 2 million pre-orders and going to be successful. other way around would make more sense.
Currently Playing: World of Warcraft
That's the idea...What are your thoughts on how we can be more constructive in communicating with the devs, so that hopefully we can trick them into not nerfing every class into oblivion?...did I say "trick", I meant "convince them to make positive adjustments when needed"
I honestly don't follow your logic. I see absolutely no reason why having played a failed game should give anyone the ability/chance to save something. The points you mentioned pretty much are "common sense" rather than any quality or wished gained through having played a failed game. SOE never listened, a BIG part of the community feedback was far from constructive or even pretty idiotic. In addition to all the "TOR won't be SWG 2. Sucks!" whining I would much rather like to see people using their common sense and at best avoid to ever mention having played SWG.
Let's face it. When it comes to TOR the posts linked to SWG all follow this very same line:
"I played SWG <insert lots of blah> <insert whine> <insert yawn-inducing claims> <insert pointless argument while everyone should copy a failed game> <insert "themepark sucks!">"
Please, no more of that. Thank you.
I thought they changed the game because tons of people were already leaving. They gambled on trying to cater to the WoW-fan market, rather than trying to develop the game for the niche group that was staying, and slowly trying to grow the playerbase like EvE has.
I really dont think it had alot to do with players complaining. It added to the desperation on the part of the developers and LA, im sure, but I definately dont think it was the core cause.
was expecting your text to scroll up and float off into space
LOL, you're bringing back memories...oh the forums were CRAZY then! It's actually kind of funny to think about now, but I wouldn't want a repeat of those days with this game...luckily this is a completely different type of game. Hopefully players and devs have evolved...and maybe a positive dev/player experience will emerge and usher in a new era...let's all join hands and sing...lol
Seriously though, you and others are right that it's ultimately the devs responsibility to make only positive adjustments when necessary, but I've learned over my 39 years on this planet, that we can sometimes influence how people respond to us, if we take just a little care...it's why I've NEVER had a bad customer support experience...and never been beat down by the cops lol. So maybe, just maybe, we can react a little differently about issues we experience in game, and that will help result in a more positive dev reaction.
Never said it wasn't common sense--I'm glad you picked up on that. The goal is for a positive outcome, yet for some I guess there's only pleasure when others are in pain...ie "NERF THE B*STARDS!"
As has been pointed out by others, not all of my suggestions were necessarily helpful, and unfortunately my only MMO experience derives from playing SWG--a game I at one time enjoyed--so I was calling on those that went through what I went through, to give their opinions or advice on what "WE" the players could do to help...coming from a game whose devs used our input against us it seemed--not that we didn't have a community of finger pointers too though.
If we discuss what we might have done to contribute, which is the only thing in our power we can change, maybe SWTOR goes through less heartache.
Some SWG fans want to play and hopefully become fans of SWTOR as well...doesn't take anything away from the good times we had in SWG.
the game is fineit doenst need saving? There going to revamp the UI which seems to be the largest complaint that and the character creator.
There also going to revamp the space flight.
There adding in more guild functionality.
So it looks like they are moving forward and progessing.
I really like the way the game is now. So any serious changes would kill it for me. So if it aint broke dont fix it.
You want SWG 2 and you seriously want to push swtor a game not designed to be anything like it that way. it will not work.
Lol... but don't quote it again!
An honest review of SW:TOR 6/10 (Danny Wojcicki)