This is a completely false statement. GW1's playerbase has always consisted of more PvErs than PvPers. It's also the reason for Arenanet to change their plans about GW1, which was a PvP centric game at release to only adding PvE content with Nightfall and Eye of the North.
And even today, more than 6 years later the PvE community is still thriving and playing actively, which is sadly not the case with the PvP community.
And I agree with the above poster that says that GW1 is one of the hardest games I've played. I know for a fact that a lot of people gave up on the game back in 2005, because they couldn't make it past some of the zones. Of course, the game has suffered from power creep, because of the expansions, and thanks to stuff like wiki and tons of guides most people can complete pretty much everything in the game nowadays. It's still much harder and more complex than any MMO out there currently, imo.
i actually remember getting stuck on some content for a few days
some of the missions actually required some thinking from all party members which can turn out to be a problem. Anyway i hope GW2 will be the same where it's a challange to reach max level where you will meet new challanges. Most MMO's nowadays let you breez through the levels and then at max lvl your confront a brick wall. We'll see how it turn out.
Do people still play Guild Wars? Of course they do. My acknowledgement of that fact is enough to show that I'm not saying there won't be people who find GW2 to have enough content to keep them playing. By and large; however, most people are going to tell you that Guild Wars lacks the same amount of PvE content as a game like World of Warcraft or LotRO. Seeing as I'm typing these words, I shouldn't have to preface everything I say with "in my opinion." If I'm saying it, it's obviously my opinion. My opinion stands as it is. Purely from a PvE standpoint, unless there is a hook to keep people playing, I don't see what will keep people playing GW2 exclusively.
When has ANet every claimed to want to lock people to their game. The game is just not designed that way and probably never will be. They have said a number of times that they want their players to feel like they can enjoy any other game (not just other MMOs) and GW2 will always be there for them to return to. What's wrong with that? Why shouldn't I be able to put down GW2 for a month, when a game like Skyrim comes a long, without feeling that I'm not getting my money's worth. An MMORPG is a game, 1st and foremost, not a second life. Stop feeling the need to treat it like one.
I will treat GW2 as a game that will not consume my life, or the entirely of my gaming time, because that is how it designed. It just isn't designed to be a person's only game.
Well thank you for proving my point.
Generally speaking, if you're looking for a new MMORPG to call your permanent home, Guild Wars 2 will NOT be it.
Instead I might say... Specifically speaking, if SuperXero89 is looking for a new MMORPG to call his permanent home, Guild Wars 2 will NOT be it.
I think that's really what this is about, your personal feelings on the matter. Like I said in an earlier post, if a person likes sandbox games, they just accept that a themepark isn't for them and find another game. GW2 is trying something different by not having progression raiding. If you love progression raiding or want to have that kind of scheduled structured content, or want to have random loot, or whatever appeals to you about it, then GW2 just isn't the game for you.
I do really feel like there are a bunch of ways to keep advancing your character, but it's just not tiered gear progression. It's vanity items, titles, achievements, horizontal progression and breadth of abilities, maybe it's just making a reputation for yourself or being instrumental in helping the server win world PVP. But like I keep saying, if you need the carrot, that's fine, but you'll have to get it from another game.
I really think though that just in terms of the amount of content that people might be underestimating just how much is going to be here to sink your teeth into. There's 1500 dynamic events, and unlike quests they're all heavy in content (you can't really have a fedex DE). If it's 10 minutes to do it and then progress to the next part of the chain, that's 15000 minutes to see them all. At 20 hours per week, that's over 3 months of doing nothing but DEs.
There's explorable mode dungeons which are reported to be 3 hours of wipefest. That's like a raiding night right there. There's 24 of them (not even counting the 8 easier story mode ones). At 3 nights per week "raiding" the explorable mode dungeons, that's 2 months to see them all.
There's the personal story, which has enough branches for you to do it 3x per race and have a very different experience each time. That's not a full time thing, but that's a lot of replayability right there.
If leveling time builds up to 90 minutes per level and 80 levels, that's approximately 100 hours to level to cap. With 5 races, that would take 500 hours to level all 5 to cap to at least see each personal story once. Now, there might only be 250 hours of DEs, but filling in the personal story, dungeons, and world PVP, I think people would be ok repeating some things here and there. So that would be like 6 months of 20 hours a week to feel like you've at least gotten a taste of everything, and that doesn't even get into ANY of the potential character building stuff to do at cap.
And if, at the end of all that you do feel like you've had enough of it, just put the game down until an expansion. It's B2P, it's ok. You don't have to worry about keeping up with everybody else or worry about not being ready for the next tier.
WayTLDR: This might not be the kind of game that you think you can find a home with, but I think a lot of other people are going to keep finding reasons to play this, whether or not they feel they need to take breaks or not.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it."-Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
Oh you know people bash SWTOR, so why not come bash GW2, i dislike it. and everyone else should dislike it because i dislike it. Its the natural order of things. Also to be competely honest, im only trolling to see if MMORPG will ban me or not. And sorry SWTOR and GW2 are the hot topics, and i like SWTOR a bit more then GW2, i am just trolling you guys for now., Personally dont think the game is horrible, has nice features. But i cant say that , thats not trolling!.
So you can keep commenting back, or just ignore me to play with the MMORPG.com guys. Up to you
Your wasting your time, they only ban you on mmorpg forums for trolling World of Warcraft or maybe TOR, I don't know if they actually moderate the other forums at all.
And i could keep bashing the game, but i just know its going to be horrible. Dont need to explain it to people like you
You're absolutely right. You don't need to explain it to us. We get it. You know that this game is going to be horrible. We understand.
I would however, highly recommend going and telling the people in the SWTOR threads because some of them seem a little thick.
It just so happens he is very active in the TOR forums with mostly positive remarks on how great TOR is. Isn't that remarkable?
Just like how many are active on TOR forum with mostly negative posts and are GW2 fans. Isn't that remarkable? not really. You are one of them so you should know.
Why can't people just enjoy what they like and let others do the same?
Well you haven't been able to do it yet with the ammount of negative GW2 posts youve made so how about answering your own question.
Just like how many are active on TOR forum with mostly negative posts and are GW2 fans. Isn't that remarkable? not really. You are one of them so you should know.
Why can't people just enjoy what they like and let others do the same?
Well you haven't been able to do it yet with the ammount of negative GW2 posts youve made so how about answering your own question.
Care to show me my negative GW2 posts? i am actually looking forward to both but i won't let an oppertunity go where i get a chance to point out hypocricy and double standards of posters like you.
How many servers SWTOR will launch with on release?
ShredderSE - Umm how many do they need? Maybe 6. US, EU, Asian, France, German and Russian. Subs will be so low there is no need for more Snoocky-How many servers? The first 3 months a lot...after that 2 i guess, one for PVE and 1 for PVP...
Thorbrand - SWTOR doesn't have longevity at all. Might be one of the shortest lived MMOs.
Generally speaking, if you're looking for a new MMORPG to call your permanent home, Guild Wars 2 will NOT be it.
Whoa, that's one fat sweeping generalization you've got here. It's only true for hardcore players who play PvE exclusively, don't do alts, burn through content at high rate and consider something content only if they're forced to repeat it for a carrot on a stick. They're not numerous enough to generalize this conclusion to everyone, and they're not even GW2's primary target.
Generally speaking, if I'm looking for a new MMORPG to call my permanent home, and the devs deliver what they are saying and what I think It will be, Guild Wars 2 WILL BE it.
Gw2 will be superior to gw1... Its a real mmo, not a quest hub co-op.
Dosen't mean it will do any better....
I wouldn't say GW1 was a failure, would you?
GW2 will have Tons of players but I don't think it will be the SWTOR killer.
SWTOR hasn't established itself even remotely enough for it to claim status as to a game others will try to "kill". Let's see if it even survives with anything resembling significance first.
On a very serious note, Does it seem to easy, that you always get loot no matter what? Or did i read it wrong? And what do you do once you reach max level?
Now i know you think im trolling here, but those are serious questions because i just stop reading what was going on with GW2
Yes, you always get loot. Basically, let's say you join up in an ongoing dynamic event and start helping people already there and participating. When the conditions of the event are met, you're also rewarded, not just the people that were there from the outset. There's also no kill-tagging or kill-stealing... if you decide to help someone that killing, say, an ogre, when the ogre dies you both get full credit for the kill... all the loot doesn't only go to the guy with the first hit or gets diluted and split. One thing to keep in mind with this is scaling... the events, for example, will become more difficult as people join. You won't be able to have two people start and event then a dozen friends charge in and roll over it... it'll scale up in difficulty to be challenging for the now 15 people actively engaged in the event.
Then there's the matter of dungeons. When your group completes a dungeon there are no loot rolls and random odds on getting something. Everyone gets a token from the dungeon which they can use to get one piece of gear, weapon, etc. of their choice. You'll never have to grind dungeons for gear, never have run after run where someone that doesn't really need the item you've been trying weeks for beats your roll... you're guaranteed a piece of gear or weapon, and it'll be the one you choose.
Max level - although they haven't fully released all the details, there will be of course dungeons and the like for max level characters, but you need to keep in mind the side-kicking feature in GW2. If your max level character goes down to a level 20 zone, you're "downsized" to that zone level so that it maintains a respectable level of difficulty for you. You won't be able to go to low level zones and roll over them... you'll still have to earn your way through them. Then of course are the challenge mode dungeons. Imagine the dungeons on hard mode, and when you enter them you'll find not only three unique paths you can go down in that dungeon (with unique bosses, endings, etc.) but also dynamic events in the very dungeons themselves! Once time you may have a minotaur boss stumble on your party, other times you may not see him but something else happens, or not... you'll never know. As such, every trip through the dungeons will be different.
Its just people from SWTOR raging that they didnt get in the early access.
Its ok let them blow off the steam for having paid for early access and not getting it, I would be pissed too. O_O
just let them be !
The truth may be puzzling. It may take some work to grapple with. It may be counterintuitive. It may contradict deeply held prejudices. It may not be consonant with what we desperately want to be true. But our preferences do not determine what's true.
"GW2 will not be good because people think it will be really good."
And this has gone on for almost 8 pages? There's nothing to argue here...the OP has no argument.
I agree to a point.
Neither the OP or anyone else is able to empirically state that the game will fail at this point. It's pure speculation.
He does have a point though that hopes have become so high for this game that it can't possibly live up to all of the expectations being placed on it.
I'm excited for the game and think it will be an innovation in MMOs. I expect it will most likely usher in the next generation of Massive Multiplayer games. It production value and high quality graphics and mechanics will definitely change the way the average MMO subscriber views non-subscription MMO's.
That said, I don't expect it to slice bread or julienne (sp) carrots.
My concern is the buyer's remorse that will inevitably set in once players realize that although it's an innovative and dynamic game, it isn't perfect.
I see this type of sentiment a lot. And look, I'm not disagreeing that there exist people out there that have very unrealistic expectations for GW2. That aside though, nearly every GW2 fan I have talked to has a pretty good understanding of what the game's features are and how they will work.
I've followed a lot of games pre-release and I've been overhyped for a few of them as well. UO2, WAR, Darkfall, Mortal Online, just to name a few. But when I look back at these games, I realize something. They didn't really show much of anything pre-release, the hype was all built upon clever marketing and smoke and mirrors. I was always hyped for what I thought the game was going to be and not for what it actually was.
But with GW2, I think it's different. We have a whole lot of info about what GW2 is and how it will work from first-hand accounts of those who have played it. There's no smoke and mirrors here. You can watch hours of gameplay recorded at cons or other events and see exactly what the game will be like. So I think, for the most part, GW2 fans are excited because of what GW2 actually is and not what they imagine it to be.
That's why it's frustrating when people say things like "GW2 fans are overhyped, it will never live up to their expectations" and then give no other argument. If they could demonstrate that GW2's marketing is deceiving, or the fans are deluding themselves then that would be something, but they can't. And do you know why they can't? Because the marketing hasn't been deceptive.
I really think GW 2 is going to as good or just a little better than GW1. Now im not just saying this because i hate guild wars... I played GW 1 for 2 years straight played thruough all standalones and eyes of the north. Great game in my opinion.... but I really just think its gonna end up just like GW1 where the PVE was meh and the PVP was the prime of the game.
Yes its B2P but this gives even more reason to play other games along with GW2 which will help out. Saying that means that people are gonna do what they did with GW1 play their P2P MMO... it isn't going to steal subs if its basically free to play because it dosen't have a sub model to take away from another sub based MMO.
However u can argue that people will leave their MMO that is sub based for Guild Wars because it is pretty much free and don't want to pay a sub. There willbe quite a few of people like this but not as many as you think because paying for a MMO sub isn't expensive its 50 cents a day.
In all reality I think Guild Wars 2 is going to do very well tho.. I myself plan on playing it along side my P2P. Im just saying we need to have a realistic look on it rather than claiming it is going to be the next god of MMOs and it could end up that way, but if you let your hype get too high your going to find that you will be dissapointed.
SO...what you are saying is that players will eventually play through the pve and only have pvp left to entertain them until more content is released? BLASPHEMY! Such things should never be allowed to happen! No MMO before has ever commited such a hienous act!!!
OH BUT WAIT THERES MORE!
"However u can argue that people will leave their MMO that is sub based for Guild Wars because it is pretty much free and don't want to pay a sub. There willbe quite a few of people like this but not as many as you think because paying for a MMO sub isn't expensive its 50 cents a day."
So wait...you a game losing subs to a non sub based mmo and a mass amout of players dropping their subs to play a non sub based mmo....arent the same thing??? what?
It's like saying an apple is not an apple. If someone leaves an mmo that they pay for they generally unsub from it. I dont believe there are those out there who just want to throw money at someone because they felt like it or because its tuesday and they always throw money on tuesdays. So them leaving for GW2 and a game losing subs to GW2 are exactly the same thing.
</sarcasm>
Sarcasm aside...you also have to realize another, very important, dimension; Time. Not very many people have the time to devote to multiple mmo's(especially new ones). SWTOR is on the verge of release...and will be in the "new game" phase for quite some time...Most players will devote any and all free time to that. There are also several other mmo's F2P and P2P that are about to release as well. It's simple MMO logistics. A new game comes out...you devote atleast that first month solely to that...if you like it then you spend the next 2-3 years of your life locked away in some cave littered with ramen and pepsi cans.
GW2, though it is B2P, that doesnt mean you will play it subconciously...or run it on a VM while you watch anime....it still requires time like any other game. And with as many fans as the first game garnered and with the hype that has built up...I'm sure hundreds of hours will be poured into this game...I, for one, will save my vacation time for its release...so i can have a few weeks off to play it NON-FKING-STOP! I probably won't sleep...or bathe...or eat...and then I'll die knowing i was able to play a mesmer in GW2.
In the end theres no denying that other games(WOW, Rift, Lotro, DC Universe, and maybe even SWTOR) will lose subs to it...its inevitable. As is with any new release that looks promising. However whether or not those games will gain those subs back? That's the real question.
I dont mind losing a few thousand subs.....because I know ill get a few hundred thousand after i whip up a good expansion pack...or just throw some pandas together and call it a expansion.
MMO's are the ark of the gaming world. Let it take us in new directions.
"GW2 will not be good because people think it will be really good."
And this has gone on for almost 8 pages? There's nothing to argue here...the OP has no argument.
I agree to a point.
Neither the OP or anyone else is able to empirically state that the game will fail at this point. It's pure speculation.
He does have a point though that hopes have become so high for this game that it can't possibly live up to all of the expectations being placed on it.
I'm excited for the game and think it will be an innovation in MMOs. I expect it will most likely usher in the next generation of Massive Multiplayer games. It production value and high quality graphics and mechanics will definitely change the way the average MMO subscriber views non-subscription MMO's.
That said, I don't expect it to slice bread or julienne (sp) carrots.
My concern is the buyer's remorse that will inevitably set in once players realize that although it's an innovative and dynamic game, it isn't perfect.
I see this type of sentiment a lot. And look, I'm not disagreeing that there exist people out there that have very unrealistic expectations for GW2. That aside though, nearly every GW2 fan I have talked to has a pretty good understanding of what the game's features are and how they will work.
I've followed a lot of games pre-release and I've been overhyped for a few of them as well. UO2, WAR, Darkfall, Mortal Online, just to name a few. But when I look back at these games, I realize something. They didn't really show much of anything pre-release, the hype was all built upon clever marketing and smoke and mirrors. I was always hyped for what I thought the game was going to be and not for what it actually was.
But with GW2, I think it's different. We have a whole lot of info about what GW2 is and how it will work from first-hand accounts of those who have played it. There's no smoke and mirrors here. You can watch hours of gameplay recorded at cons or other events and see exactly what the game will be like. So I think, for the most part, GW2 fans are excited because of what GW2 actually is and not what they imagine it to be.
That's why it's frustrating when people say things like "GW2 fans are overhyped, it will never live up to their expectations" and then give no other argument. If they could demonstrate that GW2's marketing is deceiving, or the fans are deluding themselves then that would be something, but they can't. And do you know why they can't? Because the marketing hasn't been deceptive.
<applause>Thankyou, kind sir</applause> and i agree. There is no overhyping to GW2. We know what were going to get (Smart on Arenanet's part) They've shown us what's to come...They've let us play their game on multiple occasions and now CBT is on the horizon. It's kind of hard to say GW2 won't live up to the hype when it already has and now we're just waiting for them to give us the damn thing.
MMO's are the ark of the gaming world. Let it take us in new directions.
"GW2 will not be good because people think it will be really good."
And this has gone on for almost 8 pages? There's nothing to argue here...the OP has no argument.
I agree to a point.
Neither the OP or anyone else is able to empirically state that the game will fail at this point. It's pure speculation.
He does have a point though that hopes have become so high for this game that it can't possibly live up to all of the expectations being placed on it.
I'm excited for the game and think it will be an innovation in MMOs. I expect it will most likely usher in the next generation of Massive Multiplayer games. It production value and high quality graphics and mechanics will definitely change the way the average MMO subscriber views non-subscription MMO's.
That said, I don't expect it to slice bread or julienne (sp) carrots.
My concern is the buyer's remorse that will inevitably set in once players realize that although it's an innovative and dynamic game, it isn't perfect.
I see this type of sentiment a lot. And look, I'm not disagreeing that there exist people out there that have very unrealistic expectations for GW2. That aside though, nearly every GW2 fan I have talked to has a pretty good understanding of what the game's features are and how they will work.
I've followed a lot of games pre-release and I've been overhyped for a few of them as well. UO2, WAR, Darkfall, Mortal Online, just to name a few. But when I look back at these games, I realize something. They didn't really show much of anything pre-release, the hype was all built upon clever marketing and smoke and mirrors. I was always hyped for what I thought the game was going to be and not for what it actually was.
But with GW2, I think it's different. We have a whole lot of info about what GW2 is and how it will work from first-hand accounts of those who have played it. There's no smoke and mirrors here. You can watch hours of gameplay recorded at cons or other events and see exactly what the game will be like. So I think, for the most part, GW2 fans are excited because of what GW2 actually is and not what they imagine it to be.
That's why it's frustrating when people say things like "GW2 fans are overhyped, it will never live up to their expectations" and then give no other argument. If they could demonstrate that GW2's marketing is deceiving, or the fans are deluding themselves then that would be something, but they can't. And do you know why they can't? Because the marketing hasn't been deceptive.
Thankyou, kind sir and i agree. There is no overhyping to GW2. We know what were going to get (Smart on Arenanet's part) They've shown us what's to come...They've let us play their game on multiple occasions and now CBT is on the horizon. It's kind of hard to say GW2 won't live up to the hype when it already has and now we're just waiting for them to give us the damn thing.
absolutely this.
most people in full hype-mode for gw2 are jaded and i think what we're really zinging to is the overall philosophy of gw2 which promises to if not reinvent the wheel, then at least give it spokey dokeys.
every time i think i can't get more excited, anet release something new. or there's a new vid on youtube. and the most amazing thing is exactly what is mentioned here - that you can SEE what's coming. there's no smooth video movies. the videos are the game. and if that's not exciting enough, i reckon you've got no pulse.
personally, i'm just excited because for the first time in an mmo's pre-release, i get the feeling that anet is making a game just for me. they've watched me pvp my guts out in mmos and seen me rage when other teams have better gear and win solely on that. they've heard me pound my keyboard when i finally forget my last dungeon experience which has forced me to join a guild of people i don't know and who can't spell and like to say umadbrah and tell me i can't play my class because i didn't finish all the raids they did and who end up wiping because they're too busy talking about nonsense, then choose to blame each other, fight, and scream and maybe if you carry on and finish someone steals the loot anyway and you walk out feeling you just wasted two hours of your time and you never want to do it again. they heard me say i really want to just explore an mmo with my wife so we can kill together without being forced to join groups of 12yr old guildies who think it's cool to flirt with her because they finally KNOW a chick. anet has heard my gripes. and they've made a game just for me. and i love them for it.
overhyped? i don't think so. i know full well what we'll be getting. sure, we'll still "have" to team up now and then. but that's the point - we can team with people we like because we don't need to care about the grumpy healer or the tank who wants to prove he can dps. we don't have to go through the psychological warfare for a pair of boots.
no. we can actually do something we've always wanted to do.
He does have a point though that hopes have become so high for this game that it can't possibly live up to all of the expectations being placed on it.
...
...though, nearly every GW2 fan I have talked to has a pretty good understanding of what the game's features are and how they will work.
...
I think these are both very reasonable points of view on the subject. But with total sincerity, I think even the most expectant fans (be they rabid or reasonable) are incapable of imagining just how cool and fun this game is going to be in total. So, not only on average but even at the extremes I'd say the expectations are below the target.
Charr: Outta my way. Human: What's your problem? Charr: Your thin skin.
Just like how many are active on TOR forum with mostly negative posts and are GW2 fans. Isn't that remarkable? not really. You are one of them so you should know.
Why can't people just enjoy what they like and let others do the same?
I am and I am not negative on SW:TOR. It's going to be a great game, and I may play it as if it were an expensive single player RPG.
2/10 to the OP for getting eight pages out of this.
Originally posted by FrostWyrm
I, for one, don't want to "win the game" with an MMO.
I, for one, do.
See... there's a lot to life. A lot. You can't base your life around a single game, which is clearly what you want to do from your post. If there's no way to 'win' then you're not getting any sense of closure, it's just an arbitrary mechanic to keep you playing. Saying that you don't want to win a game (even an MMO, the genre is regardless) is like saying that you want to burn the last ten pages of a novel so you can read the twenty pages prior over and over and over again, because you don't want it to end.
But a story without an ending is a poorly written one, as everything inevitably must have a conclusion. The best storylines I've played in games have had a clearly defined beginning, middle, and end. There's a point where you just put it down, satisfied and fulfilled, knowing that you've achieved whatever there is to achieve in that game. Now the opposite view is yours, which is: Infinite Achievements! To you, the point of a game is solely compeition, you want the cheevos, you want to win. But you don't want to stop winning. You need to keep on winning. You need to be 'made of win,' as the MMO kids say.
Let's forget the damn hamster wheel, let's forget that need to win at everything, and let's just enjoy a really good game, with a really good story, and a really good ending. We play it until it's done, then we move on.
Basing my life around a single game...thats not what I want at all. I work full time; I have RL friends I hang out with from time to time; I have my own hobbies outside of gaming that I still enjoy. I do, however, want to feel like I'm getting some lasting value out of the game I'm playing and the character I've decided to sink my free time into.
Not every story has to be finite. This, at least for me, is what sets MMOs apart from other genres. Its why I dont mind paying a monthly fee instead of just buying the game and being done with it. As long as I'm forking over the cash in regular intervals, I'd like things to be kept fresh. If that doesn't happen, I stop subscribing.
I suppose for a game like Guild Wars it makes sense to have an "end" since there is no monthly fee involved. I wouldn't expect continuous content if I'm not paying extra for it. If they deliver it anyway, its definitely a bonus, but for me, it's to be expected from a P2P MMO.
Personally I'm more into experiencing new content than getting better at the same old content. That would be my primary goal for advancing. Once the new content stops coming, I'll generally move on to another game or not play anything at all until something interesting comes along.
Must we continue with these Stealth ( Guild Wars 2 Hate) Threads? Thank you for ressurecting this from the Graveyard FW, you are truly a master of Necromantic arts.
Originally posted by DexterMMO Gw2 will be superior to gw1... Its a real mmo, not a quest hub co-op.
Dosen't mean it will do any better....
I wouldn't say GW1 was a failure, would you? GW2 will have Tons of players but I don't think it will be the SWTOR killer.
And frankly SWTOR isn't a Wow killer either. SW:TOR will eventually fade out unless the developers of that game move toward a direction of improving and stream-lining the theme park experience they've created. As it stands now SW:TOR from a technical stand point doesn't do much outside of the cut-scene story telling. For example classes are still stuck on the "unholy trinty" of either being dps, tank, or healer on top of not being able to dual-spec or having access to a cross realm dungeon finder.
However in GW2 any class can play any role in the game neither dual-spec or cross realm dungeon finders are necessary at all. Furthermore the realm vs realm vs realm pvp is way more innovate then what there is in SW:TOR via their version of single server battle grounds. This isn't even mentioning the fact that GW2 will not be a traditional p2p monthly MMO.
Games I've played/tried out:WAR, LOTRO, Tabula Rasa, AoC, EQ1, EQ2, WoW, Vangaurd, FFXI, D&DO, Lineage 2, Saga Of Ryzom, EvE Online, DAoC, Guild Wars,Star Wars Galaxies, Hell Gate London, Auto Assault, Grando Espada ( AKA SoTNW ), Archlord, CoV/H, Star Trek Online, APB, Champions Online, FFXIV, Rift Online, GW2.
There is no such thing as a WoW killer. It is a made up myth that doesnt exist. SWTOR will never be a WoW killer. WoW has 11 mil subscribers, and the next best game Aion has 3 mil. NOTHING will ever kill WoW. WoW is already a niche game for the mentally challenged and they wont lose those precious subscribers to anybody, ever, period. Please realize that by calling a game a WoW killer, you are placing it in the same category as all the other MMO's that have never lived up to their potential.
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Oh my bad, thought you meant leveling. Very interesting on that part.
i actually remember getting stuck on some content for a few days
some of the missions actually required some thinking from all party members which can turn out to be a problem. Anyway i hope GW2 will be the same where it's a challange to reach max level where you will meet new challanges. Most MMO's nowadays let you breez through the levels and then at max lvl your confront a brick wall. We'll see how it turn out.
Instead I might say... Specifically speaking, if SuperXero89 is looking for a new MMORPG to call his permanent home, Guild Wars 2 will NOT be it.
I think that's really what this is about, your personal feelings on the matter. Like I said in an earlier post, if a person likes sandbox games, they just accept that a themepark isn't for them and find another game. GW2 is trying something different by not having progression raiding. If you love progression raiding or want to have that kind of scheduled structured content, or want to have random loot, or whatever appeals to you about it, then GW2 just isn't the game for you.
I do really feel like there are a bunch of ways to keep advancing your character, but it's just not tiered gear progression. It's vanity items, titles, achievements, horizontal progression and breadth of abilities, maybe it's just making a reputation for yourself or being instrumental in helping the server win world PVP. But like I keep saying, if you need the carrot, that's fine, but you'll have to get it from another game.
I really think though that just in terms of the amount of content that people might be underestimating just how much is going to be here to sink your teeth into. There's 1500 dynamic events, and unlike quests they're all heavy in content (you can't really have a fedex DE). If it's 10 minutes to do it and then progress to the next part of the chain, that's 15000 minutes to see them all. At 20 hours per week, that's over 3 months of doing nothing but DEs.
There's explorable mode dungeons which are reported to be 3 hours of wipefest. That's like a raiding night right there. There's 24 of them (not even counting the 8 easier story mode ones). At 3 nights per week "raiding" the explorable mode dungeons, that's 2 months to see them all.
There's the personal story, which has enough branches for you to do it 3x per race and have a very different experience each time. That's not a full time thing, but that's a lot of replayability right there.
If leveling time builds up to 90 minutes per level and 80 levels, that's approximately 100 hours to level to cap. With 5 races, that would take 500 hours to level all 5 to cap to at least see each personal story once. Now, there might only be 250 hours of DEs, but filling in the personal story, dungeons, and world PVP, I think people would be ok repeating some things here and there. So that would be like 6 months of 20 hours a week to feel like you've at least gotten a taste of everything, and that doesn't even get into ANY of the potential character building stuff to do at cap.
And if, at the end of all that you do feel like you've had enough of it, just put the game down until an expansion. It's B2P, it's ok. You don't have to worry about keeping up with everybody else or worry about not being ready for the next tier.
WayTLDR: This might not be the kind of game that you think you can find a home with, but I think a lot of other people are going to keep finding reasons to play this, whether or not they feel they need to take breaks or not.
"Gamers will no longer buy the argument that every MMO requires a subscription fee to offset server and bandwidth costs. It's not true you know it, and they know it." -Jeff Strain, co-founder of ArenaNet, 2007
Your wasting your time, they only ban you on mmorpg forums for trolling World of Warcraft or maybe TOR, I don't know if they actually moderate the other forums at all.
Well you haven't been able to do it yet with the ammount of negative GW2 posts youve made so how about answering your own question.
Care to show me my negative GW2 posts? i am actually looking forward to both but i won't let an oppertunity go where i get a chance to point out hypocricy and double standards of posters like you.
How many servers SWTOR will launch with on release?
ShredderSE - Umm how many do they need? Maybe 6.
US, EU, Asian, France, German and Russian.
Subs will be so low there is no need for more
Snoocky-How many servers?
The first 3 months a lot...after that 2 i guess, one for PVE and 1 for PVP...
Thorbrand - SWTOR doesn't have longevity at all. Might be one of the shortest lived MMOs.
Whoa, that's one fat sweeping generalization you've got here. It's only true for hardcore players who play PvE exclusively, don't do alts, burn through content at high rate and consider something content only if they're forced to repeat it for a carrot on a stick. They're not numerous enough to generalize this conclusion to everyone, and they're not even GW2's primary target.
Generally speaking, if I'm looking for a new MMORPG to call my permanent home, and the devs deliver what they are saying and what I think It will be, Guild Wars 2 WILL BE it.
SWTOR hasn't established itself even remotely enough for it to claim status as to a game others will try to "kill". Let's see if it even survives with anything resembling significance first.
Oderint, dum metuant.
Yes, you always get loot. Basically, let's say you join up in an ongoing dynamic event and start helping people already there and participating. When the conditions of the event are met, you're also rewarded, not just the people that were there from the outset. There's also no kill-tagging or kill-stealing... if you decide to help someone that killing, say, an ogre, when the ogre dies you both get full credit for the kill... all the loot doesn't only go to the guy with the first hit or gets diluted and split. One thing to keep in mind with this is scaling... the events, for example, will become more difficult as people join. You won't be able to have two people start and event then a dozen friends charge in and roll over it... it'll scale up in difficulty to be challenging for the now 15 people actively engaged in the event.
Then there's the matter of dungeons. When your group completes a dungeon there are no loot rolls and random odds on getting something. Everyone gets a token from the dungeon which they can use to get one piece of gear, weapon, etc. of their choice. You'll never have to grind dungeons for gear, never have run after run where someone that doesn't really need the item you've been trying weeks for beats your roll... you're guaranteed a piece of gear or weapon, and it'll be the one you choose.
Max level - although they haven't fully released all the details, there will be of course dungeons and the like for max level characters, but you need to keep in mind the side-kicking feature in GW2. If your max level character goes down to a level 20 zone, you're "downsized" to that zone level so that it maintains a respectable level of difficulty for you. You won't be able to go to low level zones and roll over them... you'll still have to earn your way through them. Then of course are the challenge mode dungeons. Imagine the dungeons on hard mode, and when you enter them you'll find not only three unique paths you can go down in that dungeon (with unique bosses, endings, etc.) but also dynamic events in the very dungeons themselves! Once time you may have a minotaur boss stumble on your party, other times you may not see him but something else happens, or not... you'll never know. As such, every trip through the dungeons will be different.
Hope this was useful.
Oderint, dum metuant.
just let them be !
The truth may be puzzling. It may take some work to grapple with. It may be counterintuitive. It may contradict deeply held prejudices. It may not be consonant with what we desperately want to be true. But our preferences do not determine what's true.
Carl Sagan-
I see this type of sentiment a lot. And look, I'm not disagreeing that there exist people out there that have very unrealistic expectations for GW2. That aside though, nearly every GW2 fan I have talked to has a pretty good understanding of what the game's features are and how they will work.
I've followed a lot of games pre-release and I've been overhyped for a few of them as well. UO2, WAR, Darkfall, Mortal Online, just to name a few. But when I look back at these games, I realize something. They didn't really show much of anything pre-release, the hype was all built upon clever marketing and smoke and mirrors. I was always hyped for what I thought the game was going to be and not for what it actually was.
But with GW2, I think it's different. We have a whole lot of info about what GW2 is and how it will work from first-hand accounts of those who have played it. There's no smoke and mirrors here. You can watch hours of gameplay recorded at cons or other events and see exactly what the game will be like. So I think, for the most part, GW2 fans are excited because of what GW2 actually is and not what they imagine it to be.
That's why it's frustrating when people say things like "GW2 fans are overhyped, it will never live up to their expectations" and then give no other argument. If they could demonstrate that GW2's marketing is deceiving, or the fans are deluding themselves then that would be something, but they can't. And do you know why they can't? Because the marketing hasn't been deceptive.
Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?
SO...what you are saying is that players will eventually play through the pve and only have pvp left to entertain them until more content is released? BLASPHEMY! Such things should never be allowed to happen! No MMO before has ever commited such a hienous act!!!
OH BUT WAIT THERES MORE!
"However u can argue that people will leave their MMO that is sub based for Guild Wars because it is pretty much free and don't want to pay a sub. There willbe quite a few of people like this but not as many as you think because paying for a MMO sub isn't expensive its 50 cents a day."
So wait...you a game losing subs to a non sub based mmo and a mass amout of players dropping their subs to play a non sub based mmo....arent the same thing??? what?
It's like saying an apple is not an apple. If someone leaves an mmo that they pay for they generally unsub from it. I dont believe there are those out there who just want to throw money at someone because they felt like it or because its tuesday and they always throw money on tuesdays. So them leaving for GW2 and a game losing subs to GW2 are exactly the same thing.
</sarcasm>
Sarcasm aside...you also have to realize another, very important, dimension; Time. Not very many people have the time to devote to multiple mmo's(especially new ones). SWTOR is on the verge of release...and will be in the "new game" phase for quite some time...Most players will devote any and all free time to that. There are also several other mmo's F2P and P2P that are about to release as well. It's simple MMO logistics. A new game comes out...you devote atleast that first month solely to that...if you like it then you spend the next 2-3 years of your life locked away in some cave littered with ramen and pepsi cans.
GW2, though it is B2P, that doesnt mean you will play it subconciously...or run it on a VM while you watch anime....it still requires time like any other game. And with as many fans as the first game garnered and with the hype that has built up...I'm sure hundreds of hours will be poured into this game...I, for one, will save my vacation time for its release...so i can have a few weeks off to play it NON-FKING-STOP! I probably won't sleep...or bathe...or eat...and then I'll die knowing i was able to play a mesmer in GW2.
In the end theres no denying that other games(WOW, Rift, Lotro, DC Universe, and maybe even SWTOR) will lose subs to it...its inevitable. As is with any new release that looks promising. However whether or not those games will gain those subs back? That's the real question.
I dont mind losing a few thousand subs.....because I know ill get a few hundred thousand after i whip up a good expansion pack...or just throw some pandas together and call it a expansion.
MMO's are the ark of the gaming world. Let it take us in new directions.
<applause>Thankyou, kind sir</applause> and i agree. There is no overhyping to GW2. We know what were going to get (Smart on Arenanet's part) They've shown us what's to come...They've let us play their game on multiple occasions and now CBT is on the horizon. It's kind of hard to say GW2 won't live up to the hype when it already has and now we're just waiting for them to give us the damn thing.
MMO's are the ark of the gaming world. Let it take us in new directions.
absolutely this.
most people in full hype-mode for gw2 are jaded and i think what we're really zinging to is the overall philosophy of gw2 which promises to if not reinvent the wheel, then at least give it spokey dokeys.
every time i think i can't get more excited, anet release something new. or there's a new vid on youtube. and the most amazing thing is exactly what is mentioned here - that you can SEE what's coming. there's no smooth video movies. the videos are the game. and if that's not exciting enough, i reckon you've got no pulse.
personally, i'm just excited because for the first time in an mmo's pre-release, i get the feeling that anet is making a game just for me. they've watched me pvp my guts out in mmos and seen me rage when other teams have better gear and win solely on that. they've heard me pound my keyboard when i finally forget my last dungeon experience which has forced me to join a guild of people i don't know and who can't spell and like to say umadbrah and tell me i can't play my class because i didn't finish all the raids they did and who end up wiping because they're too busy talking about nonsense, then choose to blame each other, fight, and scream and maybe if you carry on and finish someone steals the loot anyway and you walk out feeling you just wasted two hours of your time and you never want to do it again. they heard me say i really want to just explore an mmo with my wife so we can kill together without being forced to join groups of 12yr old guildies who think it's cool to flirt with her because they finally KNOW a chick. anet has heard my gripes. and they've made a game just for me. and i love them for it.
overhyped? i don't think so. i know full well what we'll be getting. sure, we'll still "have" to team up now and then. but that's the point - we can team with people we like because we don't need to care about the grumpy healer or the tank who wants to prove he can dps. we don't have to go through the psychological warfare for a pair of boots.
no. we can actually do something we've always wanted to do.
we can enjoy the game.
I think these are both very reasonable points of view on the subject. But with total sincerity, I think even the most expectant fans (be they rabid or reasonable) are incapable of imagining just how cool and fun this game is going to be in total. So, not only on average but even at the extremes I'd say the expectations are below the target.
Charr: Outta my way.
Human: What's your problem?
Charr: Your thin skin.
I am and I am not negative on SW:TOR. It's going to be a great game, and I may play it as if it were an expensive single player RPG.
Basing my life around a single game...thats not what I want at all. I work full time; I have RL friends I hang out with from time to time; I have my own hobbies outside of gaming that I still enjoy. I do, however, want to feel like I'm getting some lasting value out of the game I'm playing and the character I've decided to sink my free time into.
Not every story has to be finite. This, at least for me, is what sets MMOs apart from other genres. Its why I dont mind paying a monthly fee instead of just buying the game and being done with it. As long as I'm forking over the cash in regular intervals, I'd like things to be kept fresh. If that doesn't happen, I stop subscribing.
I suppose for a game like Guild Wars it makes sense to have an "end" since there is no monthly fee involved. I wouldn't expect continuous content if I'm not paying extra for it. If they deliver it anyway, its definitely a bonus, but for me, it's to be expected from a P2P MMO.
Personally I'm more into experiencing new content than getting better at the same old content. That would be my primary goal for advancing. Once the new content stops coming, I'll generally move on to another game or not play anything at all until something interesting comes along.
Must we continue with these Stealth ( Guild Wars 2 Hate) Threads? Thank you for ressurecting this from the Graveyard FW, you are truly a master of Necromantic arts.
Really?
Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.
And frankly SWTOR isn't a Wow killer either. SW:TOR will eventually fade out unless the developers of that game move toward a direction of improving and stream-lining the theme park experience they've created. As it stands now SW:TOR from a technical stand point doesn't do much outside of the cut-scene story telling. For example classes are still stuck on the "unholy trinty" of either being dps, tank, or healer on top of not being able to dual-spec or having access to a cross realm dungeon finder.
However in GW2 any class can play any role in the game neither dual-spec or cross realm dungeon finders are necessary at all. Furthermore the realm vs realm vs realm pvp is way more innovate then what there is in SW:TOR via their version of single server battle grounds. This isn't even mentioning the fact that GW2 will not be a traditional p2p monthly MMO.
Games I've played/tried out:WAR, LOTRO, Tabula Rasa, AoC, EQ1, EQ2, WoW, Vangaurd, FFXI, D&DO, Lineage 2, Saga Of Ryzom, EvE Online, DAoC, Guild Wars,Star Wars Galaxies, Hell Gate London, Auto Assault, Grando Espada ( AKA SoTNW ), Archlord, CoV/H, Star Trek Online, APB, Champions Online, FFXIV, Rift Online, GW2.
Game(s) I Am Currently Playing:
GW2 (+LoL and BF3)
A better question would be
Already?
"It has potential"
-Second most used phrase on existence
"It sucks"
-Most used phrase on existence
There is no such thing as a WoW killer. It is a made up myth that doesnt exist. SWTOR will never be a WoW killer. WoW has 11 mil subscribers, and the next best game Aion has 3 mil. NOTHING will ever kill WoW. WoW is already a niche game for the mentally challenged and they wont lose those precious subscribers to anybody, ever, period. Please realize that by calling a game a WoW killer, you are placing it in the same category as all the other MMO's that have never lived up to their potential.
I actuallly thought the first one sucked. Just my opinion. This may be good if its an mmo. Who know. I don't have high hopes. SWOTR until then.