This class also seems to encourage elitism as this posts shows. The sentiment on the forums is pretty much, if you don't like the Sent, find another class, which I find laughable. If it was a well designed class, you wouldn't have all these threads complaining about how bad the class is. The fact that pretty much 95% of the people that have no problem with this class are all running roughly the same build is a testament to the issues with this class. The other two specs are complete crap for the vast majority of the game. I'm really happy for you if you're able to succeed as you say; however, I am not. I raided in WoW as a hunter, so while I'm not exactly a professional gamer, I'm at least competent. I die frequently to elites and overpowered strong mobs, and I did have such a problem with the Bounty Hunter I played in a previous beta test.
I have a tendency to disagree. I've seen several well designed classes that were not "easy" to play well be gutted as a result of player complaints, and it never turns out well for the game overall.
I fail to see what I can do differently as a Sentinel to make my life easier against certain elite mobs that litter class quests and other solo quests. I can only interrupt so many abilities in a certain timespan, and I only have so many buffs and damage reduction abilities. That is where I think the greatest problem with this class is concerned.
I do believe that designing certain classes to be much more difficult to play well than others as bad game design, but I'll save that for another thread.
Do you have a snare? I kite elites on my assassin w/ Force Slow while my companion kills them
Everyone tells me to use Doc, so he gets the gear upgrades, and I can't imagine he's a very good DPS. That said, I don't view kiting as soloing, rather kiting is what you do when you actually cannot solo what you're fighting. Taking advantage of movement mechanics so that the mob can never actually hit you always felt like a borderline exploit to me.
What I expect out of elite mobs is for them to have certain abilities that do a LOT of damage if I don't run out of the target area or if I don't interrupt, and I expect to take a lot of damage through normal attacks if I don't through up my damage reduction abilities as well as pacify which reduces their accuracy by 90%. Many elites are tuned in such a way. Other elites can pratically spam their big damage attack to the point of where not even my interrupt can stop them, and enough big hits wipes my companion followed by my player character. Other mobs have less interruptable skills but do so much damage that they burn through my damage reduction abilities and pacify only affords a momentary advantage.
After having read this thread heres my take on this. You are very new to MMO's or just a very bad player. All class quests are soloable by that class. You have some issues with some very fundemental mechanics of MMO games. The class is not bad or under powered, the person behind the keyboard is.
If you want a new idea, go read an old book.
In order to be insulted, I must first value your opinion.
This class also seems to encourage elitism as this posts shows. The sentiment on the forums is pretty much, if you don't like the Sent, find another class, which I find laughable. If it was a well designed class, you wouldn't have all these threads complaining about how bad the class is. The fact that pretty much 95% of the people that have no problem with this class are all running roughly the same build is a testament to the issues with this class. The other two specs are complete crap for the vast majority of the game. I'm really happy for you if you're able to succeed as you say; however, I am not. I raided in WoW as a hunter, so while I'm not exactly a professional gamer, I'm at least competent. I die frequently to elites and overpowered strong mobs, and I did have such a problem with the Bounty Hunter I played in a previous beta test.
I have a tendency to disagree. I've seen several well designed classes that were not "easy" to play well be gutted as a result of player complaints, and it never turns out well for the game overall.
I fail to see what I can do differently as a Sentinel to make my life easier against certain elite mobs that litter class quests and other solo quests. I can only interrupt so many abilities in a certain timespan, and I only have so many buffs and damage reduction abilities. That is where I think the greatest problem with this class is concerned.
I do believe that designing certain classes to be much more difficult to play well than others as bad game design, but I'll save that for another thread.
Do you have a snare? I kite elites on my assassin w/ Force Slow while my companion kills them
Everyone tells me to use Doc, so he gets the gear upgrades, and I can't imagine he's a very good DPS. That said, I don't view kiting as soloing, rather kiting is what you do when you actually cannot solo what you're fighting. Taking advantage of movement mechanics so that the mob can never actually hit you always felt like a borderline exploit to me.
What I expect out of elite mobs is for them to have certain abilities that do a LOT of damage if I don't run out of the target area or if I don't interrupt, and I expect to take a lot of damage through normal attacks if I don't through up my damage reduction abilities as well as pacify which reduces their accuracy by 90%. Many elites are tuned in such a way. Other elites can pratically spam their big damage attack to the point of where not even my interrupt can stop them, and enough big hits wipes my companion followed by my player character. Other mobs have less interruptable skills but do so much damage that they burn through my damage reduction abilities and pacify only affords a momentary advantage.
After having read this thread heres my take on this. You are very new to MMO's or just a very bad player. All class quests are soloable by that class. You have some issues with some very fundemental mechanics of MMO games. The class is not bad or under powered, the person behind the keyboard is.
The entire premise for this thread was that Sent/Mara, and Jugg/guardian were broken and could not do class quests at higher levels as the class balance was broken. The fact that others can and do, clear this content solo, and can, and do solo content intended for a duo with these classes proves that the original supposition is wrong. If others can use the class to do the things you cannot, the fault is yours not the class, end of discussion, no ifs, and's, or buts.
All I see in this thread is whining about why the class does not play the way a couple of posters want it to, tailored to very particular lazy play styles, tough. The game was balanced and designed so that solo you use companions, the devs don’t care if you like it or not, that’s how it was designed, that’s how it will stay.
As for complaints about not adapting and using everything available to a class to achieve your goals /facepalm losers, sucks to be you. That is your flaw as a gamer, it has nothing to do with the game, or any class you may choose to play; learn to adapt, be flexible and improve, or continue on as bad players blaming everything else around you, I care not which.
My Colour Is Vomit green, I puke on the tards with stupid colour sigs. My symbol is ,,!, O ,!,, My enemies are any prat with a colour sig, a meaningless personality test, or a pointless list of games and classes.
After having read this thread heres my take on this. You are very new to MMO's or just a very bad player. All class quests are soloable by that class. You have some issues with some very fundemental mechanics of MMO games. The class is not bad or under powered, the person behind the keyboard is.
QFT. Seriously Super, as someone who has a lvl 42 jugg, level up a bit, get a few more abilities to play with, *learn your sodding class* and quit the qq. If your spec isn't working out, respec. If you still cannot figure it out, get someone who knows the class to hand-hold you through how to get the best out of it. A good guild will help you. Partying up will help you shine, god knows it is much much more efficient than solo'ing and there are bonuses on loot & xp for doing so, not to mention the social points.
The entire premise for this thread was that Sent/Mara, and Jugg/guardian were broken and could not do class quests at higher levels as the class balance was broken. The fact that others can and do, clear this content solo, and can, and do solo content intended for a duo with these classes proves that the original supposition is wrong. If others can use the class to do the things you cannot, the fault is yours not the class, end of discussion, no ifs, and's, or buts.
All I see in this thread is whining about why the class does not play the way a couple of posters want it to, tailored to very particular lazy play styles, tough. The game was balanced and designed so that solo you use companions, the devs don’t care if you like it or not, that’s how it was designed, that’s how it will stay.
As for complaints about not adapting and using everything available to a class to achieve your goals /facepalm losers, sucks to be you. That is your fault as a gamer, it has nothing to do with the game, or any class you may choose to play; learn to adapt, be flexible and improve, or continue on as bad players blaming everything else around you, I care not which.
If we're not all in the top 10 raiding guilds in a game with bleeding edge gear, does that mean we are bad players when we can't take down raid bosses within the first week they're launched? No. Just because some players are able to complete this content with relatively little issue, does that mean the class is not underpowered? No. It's not always if I can do it everyone can do it, and if you can't do it, you're a bad player and don't deserve to progress through my game.
If you are completing these with no issue, I'd like to take a look at your gear. Do you upgrade to bleeding edge mods every level range? Do you carry with you a lot of flashpoint gear or mostly what you pick up from quests? Do you visit the galaxy market to gear your companion? Are you above level? What spec are you? What is your strategy? Do you use stimpacks? Medpacks?
Like I said before, I'm not the most skilled player in the world, but I'm at least competant as are my friends who migrated over from WoW with me who have the same survivability issue. I don't care that you or anyone else finds this game to be a cakewalk, because I believe that if you were to play virtually any other class in the game, you would faceroll 4 times harder than you do now with half the effort. That doesn't change the fact that this class's survivability issues are only magnified by the fact that many elites in solo quests have overtuned abilities which do not compensate for the lack of comparable abilities possessed by the player.
Everyone tells me to use Doc, so he gets the gear upgrades, and I can't imagine he's a very good DPS. That said, I don't view kiting as soloing, rather kiting is what you do when you actually cannot solo what you're fighting. Taking advantage of movement mechanics so that the mob can never actually hit you always felt like a borderline exploit to me.
So in other words you don't want to take advantage of the abilities your character has? Got it.
Also, I have no idea what your doing wrong against "strong" mobs, but you obviously are. I see other Marauders rip through them.
You should not have to kite elites just to kill them. If you do, you've proved my point that the class is underpowered.
It's pretty obvious that BioWare intended for the snare to be a PvP ability.
I find it interesting that while you post constantly how difficult TOR is there are others that claim it is too easy. Personally, I think the game is just right on the challenge level and I hope bioware never changes a thing.
Agreed. Jedi Guardians, for example, are awesome in PvP Huttball. Just have to play as the main ballhandler, and instruct the healers to focus on topping you up.
As for PvE. I think a lot of people need to experiment with their companions and perhaps approach some of the class quest stuff at the higher end of the level range for the zone rather than the begining range. if you try an Elite boss it is much easier to do so at 28 than 24 for example.
Except Jedi Guardians get edged out by Shadows due to Force Sprint.
Originally posted by Draemos
Do you have a snare? I kite elites on my assassin w/ Force Slow while my companion kills them
There's a major issue when players are encouraged to play vicariously through their companions.
Everyone tells me to use Doc, so he gets the gear upgrades, and I can't imagine he's a very good DPS. That said, I don't view kiting as soloing, rather kiting is what you do when you actually cannot solo what you're fighting. Taking advantage of movement mechanics so that the mob can never actually hit you always felt like a borderline exploit to me.
So in other words you don't want to take advantage of the abilities your character has? Got it.
Also, I have no idea what your doing wrong against "strong" mobs, but you obviously are. I see other Marauders rip through them.
You should not have to kite elites just to kill them. If you do, you've proved my point that the class is underpowered.
It's pretty obvious that BioWare intended for the snare to be a PvP ability.
I find it interesting that while you post constantly how difficult TOR is there are others that claim it is too easy. Personally, I think the game is just right on the challenge level and I hope bioware never changes a thing.
SW:TOR isn't difficult aside from the occasional overtuned elite encounter.
Never experienced much of a problem in solo quests, mainly because doing both the class and planet quest lines, coupled with a couple other things like heroics and pvp, leaves you permanently 3-5 levels above the mob levels.
I'm just about to leave Tatooine for Alderaan and I'm 3/4 to lvl 33 wheras the level range of mobs on the planet is like what, 24-28?
I didn't even have to go back to Taris to do the bonus quests, I was at the level to do them when I finished the planet.
It's called doing the content and getting to know your class. Those of us not pro enough to beat elites of the same level get by just fine by simply outleveling them.
It is a bit of a challenge with the JK/SW classes cos they're kinda late bloomers. But once lvl 24+ start rolling in you get the bread and butter skills. Stasis, force push, overhead slash that increases crit ratings, dispatch etc... good times start rolling in. It's not underpowered. In skilled hands both guardians and sentinels dish out very very good damage, you see it often in warzones. With proper rotations to get crits rolling you land hits sorcerers and sages would be proud of.
But it's not a faceroll class, that much is true. Which is a good thing I feel.
34 Sent here. I have ZERO problems tearing through mobs or elites. There was a point in my early 20's when I had tried to rush into my class quests and the elites outleveled me by 2 and I died a few times. I pvp'd a little to even up my levels and grabbed some gear, I use T-7 as my tank. I am not having problem and can honestly say I am no where near the best player. MY old hands struggle with only 2 extra buttons on a razer mouse.....yes, I'm a clicker still sadly
Did the OP seriously say Juggernaut has trouble completing class quests. Hmm my main is one, and I ve never died doing them. Theres many skills that should not just be mashed, and used at appropriate times, as a Jug, but maybe you should learn those first before you say, anything is underpowered.
Everyone tells me to use Doc, so he gets the gear upgrades, and I can't imagine he's a very good DPS. That said, I don't view kiting as soloing, rather kiting is what you do when you actually cannot solo what you're fighting. Taking advantage of movement mechanics so that the mob can never actually hit you always felt like a borderline exploit to me.
So in other words you don't want to take advantage of the abilities your character has? Got it.
Also, I have no idea what your doing wrong against "strong" mobs, but you obviously are. I see other Marauders rip through them.
You should not have to kite elites just to kill them. If you do, you've proved my point that the class is underpowered.
It's pretty obvious that BioWare intended for the snare to be a PvP ability.
Wait! are people seriously suggesting that you should kite with your melee class?? If you have to play your class in a manor that's completely contrary to it's intended design thats sort of suggest that something seriously wrong with the class...
Everyone tells me to use Doc, so he gets the gear upgrades, and I can't imagine he's a very good DPS. That said, I don't view kiting as soloing, rather kiting is what you do when you actually cannot solo what you're fighting. Taking advantage of movement mechanics so that the mob can never actually hit you always felt like a borderline exploit to me.
So in other words you don't want to take advantage of the abilities your character has? Got it.
Also, I have no idea what your doing wrong against "strong" mobs, but you obviously are. I see other Marauders rip through them.
You should not have to kite elites just to kill them. If you do, you've proved my point that the class is underpowered.
It's pretty obvious that BioWare intended for the snare to be a PvP ability.
Wait! are people seriously suggesting that you should kite with your melee class?? If you have to play your class in a manor that's completely contrary to it's intended design thats sort of suggest that something seriously wrong with the class...
Um, you can kite in melee. Hit him and kite until your cooldoans are active againa nd hit him again, then kite some more. Are you seriously saying becuase melee can kite there is something wrong with the game? I call it a breath of fresh air when playing melee.
Back on topic. i level a merc, an operative, a juggernaut, and assassin all to mid 30's and been having fun with all four in pvp. i dont really see any over/under power with any of them., I can tell you thought like the above paragraph, melee has some nice starts to do (especially in pvp), that doesnt require you only to chase mindlessly people around hope to whack them with your sword a few times. Again, breath of fresh air!
Everyone tells me to use Doc, so he gets the gear upgrades, and I can't imagine he's a very good DPS. That said, I don't view kiting as soloing, rather kiting is what you do when you actually cannot solo what you're fighting. Taking advantage of movement mechanics so that the mob can never actually hit you always felt like a borderline exploit to me.
So in other words you don't want to take advantage of the abilities your character has? Got it.
Also, I have no idea what your doing wrong against "strong" mobs, but you obviously are. I see other Marauders rip through them.
You should not have to kite elites just to kill them. If you do, you've proved my point that the class is underpowered.
It's pretty obvious that BioWare intended for the snare to be a PvP ability.
Wait! are people seriously suggesting that you should kite with your melee class?? If you have to play your class in a manor that's completely contrary to it's intended design thats sort of suggest that something seriously wrong with the class...
Um, you can kite in melee. Hit him and kite until your cooldoans are active againa nd hit him again, then kite some more. Are you seriously saying becuase melee can kite there is something wrong with the game? I call it a breath of fresh air when playing melee.
Back on topic. i level a merc, an operative, a juggernaut, and assassin all to mid 30's and been having fun with all four in pvp. i dont really see any over/under power with any of them., I can tell you thought like the above paragraph, melee has some nice starts to do (especially in pvp), that doesnt require you only to chase mindlessly people around hope to whack them with your sword a few times. Again, breath of fresh air!
No, I'm saying if a melee class has to depend on kiting to complete class quest there is something seriously wrong with the class.
Everyone tells me to use Doc, so he gets the gear upgrades, and I can't imagine he's a very good DPS. That said, I don't view kiting as soloing, rather kiting is what you do when you actually cannot solo what you're fighting. Taking advantage of movement mechanics so that the mob can never actually hit you always felt like a borderline exploit to me.
So in other words you don't want to take advantage of the abilities your character has? Got it.
Also, I have no idea what your doing wrong against "strong" mobs, but you obviously are. I see other Marauders rip through them.
You should not have to kite elites just to kill them. If you do, you've proved my point that the class is underpowered.
It's pretty obvious that BioWare intended for the snare to be a PvP ability.
Wait! are people seriously suggesting that you should kite with your melee class?? If you have to play your class in a manor that's completely contrary to it's intended design thats sort of suggest that something seriously wrong with the class...
Um, you can kite in melee. Hit him and kite until your cooldoans are active againa nd hit him again, then kite some more. Are you seriously saying becuase melee can kite there is something wrong with the game? I call it a breath of fresh air when playing melee.
Back on topic. i level a merc, an operative, a juggernaut, and assassin all to mid 30's and been having fun with all four in pvp. i dont really see any over/under power with any of them., I can tell you thought like the above paragraph, melee has some nice starts to do (especially in pvp), that doesnt require you only to chase mindlessly people around hope to whack them with your sword a few times. Again, breath of fresh air!
No, I'm saying if a melee class has to depend on kiting to complete class quest there is something seriously wrong with the class.
Hmm, not going the direction of an argument , but seriously ,using the proper companion is a big plus, trying to toe to toe an elite with you're a dps class and not a tank class....is in no way showing lack of balance. A guardian with a dps companion, toe to toe all you want, not the reverse.
Everyone tells me to use Doc, so he gets the gear upgrades, and I can't imagine he's a very good DPS. That said, I don't view kiting as soloing, rather kiting is what you do when you actually cannot solo what you're fighting. Taking advantage of movement mechanics so that the mob can never actually hit you always felt like a borderline exploit to me.
So in other words you don't want to take advantage of the abilities your character has? Got it.
Also, I have no idea what your doing wrong against "strong" mobs, but you obviously are. I see other Marauders rip through them.
You should not have to kite elites just to kill them. If you do, you've proved my point that the class is underpowered.
It's pretty obvious that BioWare intended for the snare to be a PvP ability.
Wait! are people seriously suggesting that you should kite with your melee class?? If you have to play your class in a manor that's completely contrary to it's intended design thats sort of suggest that something seriously wrong with the class...
Um, you can kite in melee. Hit him and kite until your cooldoans are active againa nd hit him again, then kite some more. Are you seriously saying becuase melee can kite there is something wrong with the game? I call it a breath of fresh air when playing melee.
Back on topic. i level a merc, an operative, a juggernaut, and assassin all to mid 30's and been having fun with all four in pvp. i dont really see any over/under power with any of them., I can tell you thought like the above paragraph, melee has some nice starts to do (especially in pvp), that doesnt require you only to chase mindlessly people around hope to whack them with your sword a few times. Again, breath of fresh air!
No, I'm saying if a melee class has to depend on kiting to complete class quest there is something seriously wrong with the class.
you say like all skill have long CDs....
also try to upgrade your equips weapon and or armor, farm some tokens, normally I go for tokens when they give me the option to choose in quests rewards
Must sandboxers bring their garbage into each and every thread? This not is not about themepark vs sandbox, it's about the OP's whining about class balance. Keep in mind the balance is fine as it's been the same all through beta.
Member of Talon | www.lakexeno.com RIFT: Redcameo, Warrior, Faemist Server RIFT: Bluecameo, Mage, Faemist Server
There aren't nearly enough people at lvl50 to make even the most basic educated opinion on class balance for the game that for all intensive purposes has been officially released for all of 1 day.
Must sandboxers bring their garbage into each and every thread? This not is not about themepark vs sandbox, it's about the OP's whining about class balance. Keep in mind the balance is fine as it's been the same all through beta.
lol.
Which is why marauders have been getting pretty much constant buffs through beta yeah kk.
Everyone tells me to use Doc, so he gets the gear upgrades, and I can't imagine he's a very good DPS. That said, I don't view kiting as soloing, rather kiting is what you do when you actually cannot solo what you're fighting. Taking advantage of movement mechanics so that the mob can never actually hit you always felt like a borderline exploit to me.
So in other words you don't want to take advantage of the abilities your character has? Got it.
Also, I have no idea what your doing wrong against "strong" mobs, but you obviously are. I see other Marauders rip through them.
You should not have to kite elites just to kill them. If you do, you've proved my point that the class is underpowered.
It's pretty obvious that BioWare intended for the snare to be a PvP ability.
Wait! are people seriously suggesting that you should kite with your melee class?? If you have to play your class in a manor that's completely contrary to it's intended design thats sort of suggest that something seriously wrong with the class...
Um, you can kite in melee. Hit him and kite until your cooldoans are active againa nd hit him again, then kite some more. Are you seriously saying becuase melee can kite there is something wrong with the game? I call it a breath of fresh air when playing melee.
Back on topic. i level a merc, an operative, a juggernaut, and assassin all to mid 30's and been having fun with all four in pvp. i dont really see any over/under power with any of them., I can tell you thought like the above paragraph, melee has some nice starts to do (especially in pvp), that doesnt require you only to chase mindlessly people around hope to whack them with your sword a few times. Again, breath of fresh air!
No, I'm saying if a melee class has to depend on kiting to complete class quest there is something seriously wrong with the class.
Hmm, not going the direction of an argument , but seriously ,using the proper companion is a big plus, trying to toe to toe an elite with you're a dps class and not a tank class....is in no way showing lack of balance. A guardian with a dps companion, toe to toe all you want, not the reverse.
Not being argumentative but the dev's are aware of the issues with the Sith Warrior/Jedi Knight and it's subclasses, they have serious issues which the devs are working on, the Jugg/Guards have a update in the wing. If the devs themselves admit that the class is broken, then it's broken. No if and buts about it.
If you want class balance you shouldn't buy any MMO at launch.
Even Guildwars that both had the best launch and now have the best balance had problems with this at launch.
It takes a long time to get the balance right, most MMOs never really gets it, but it usually takes 6 months before they are at least relatively balanced.
We could say that w think the game should be perfectly balanced at launch but I am not sure that it is even possible since no one ever made it so.
1. Select the correct companion. This is really important. Companions are class abilities, you need to use the correct ability to progress. The correct one varies depending on your spec. An immortal spec Juggy (like myself) wants a dps companion so I stuck with Vette. A dps Juggy (*cough*lame*cough*) probably wants Quinn (healing) or Broonmark/Pierce (tanks). I have seen some dps Juggies complain they have had issues while attempting to use Vette, of course they are going to have issues.
2. Figure out how you level. This can make other choices easier or harder. If your the kind of person that does EVERY normal mission on a world as well as throwing in some pvp, space combat, heroics, flashpoints, etc. Then your going to be several levels above the world your on. This actually gives you a bit of breathing room in gear and companions as things won't be quite as hard. Some people can use companions that aren't optimal and level this way, several that have listed accomplishments on this thread likely have leveled this way as well. I leveled like this up until the later half of Tatooine where I said screw it because I was tired of always fighting green/gray mobs. I just did nothing but class quests through the last half of Tatooine and all of Alderaan. This put me at the perfect level for the next planet and I've been skipping just enough to keep at the correct level for planets.
If you happen to change how you level, realize you may need to adjust your spec/class/companion/gear. It was at this point that I stopped going for just Str/Endurance/Power gear and started focusing on the actual defense stat.
3. Gear is important for SW/JK and their companions. These classes rely heavily on their companions, some specs more than others. They also rely heavily on their and their companions gear. If your a Sent/Marauder using a heal or tank pet and they have crappy gear, they WILL be taking half their life in damage from an elites strong attacks and they WONT be able to keep you alive while you attempt tanking them. For Juggy/Guardian they are generally your dps so you can cover your companions bad gear by being able to live longer so they have more time to dps but the shorter the fight the more efficient you become. This means you should pick a route to gear up and keep yourself and your companion well equipped.
Having your companion in greens or without helmets/earpieces/implants when your companion is forced to fill in key positions like a tank or healer is asking for trouble leveling.
I myself gear up with the moddable gear route. I started off doing flashpoints/pvp/buying/using commendations to get a moddable piece of gear in every slot and I just use new commendations to buy mods for it now.
I also did the same with my Vette. Have gotten her a full set of moddable gear and use my commendations to keep her gear filled with up to date blue mods as well. This allows her to 2 shots normal mobs (2 abilities) and solo lieutenants if I use one of her 2min cooldowns. She does about twice as much damage as she would in the greens she gets from quests. I fully expect that anyone forcing a companion to tank or heal for them would need to have the companion in about the same level of gear for it to work out well. I for example can't see a tank npc losing 1/2 its life to an elite in an attack if it had full correct level blue gear since they use the same stat mods and such our characters have.
Don't treat your companion as a pet or some secondary citizen. They can damage or tank just as well as a player if you give them the gear to do it. I consider my character and Vette as a duo (may be easier as I actually like the Vette character). I'll choose a bigger upgrade for Vette over a smaller one for myself if it is an option because overall its a bigger upgrade for my leveling ability. Possibly harder to do if you actually hate your companion your forced to use cause of your class/spec.
Comments
This...
After having read this thread heres my take on this. You are very new to MMO's or just a very bad player. All class quests are soloable by that class. You have some issues with some very fundemental mechanics of MMO games. The class is not bad or under powered, the person behind the keyboard is.
If you want a new idea, go read an old book.
In order to be insulted, I must first value your opinion.
What is your class and level in SW:TOR?
The entire premise for this thread was that Sent/Mara, and Jugg/guardian were broken and could not do class quests at higher levels as the class balance was broken. The fact that others can and do, clear this content solo, and can, and do solo content intended for a duo with these classes proves that the original supposition is wrong. If others can use the class to do the things you cannot, the fault is yours not the class, end of discussion, no ifs, and's, or buts.
All I see in this thread is whining about why the class does not play the way a couple of posters want it to, tailored to very particular lazy play styles, tough. The game was balanced and designed so that solo you use companions, the devs don’t care if you like it or not, that’s how it was designed, that’s how it will stay.
As for complaints about not adapting and using everything available to a class to achieve your goals /facepalm losers, sucks to be you. That is your flaw as a gamer, it has nothing to do with the game, or any class you may choose to play; learn to adapt, be flexible and improve, or continue on as bad players blaming everything else around you, I care not which.
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QFT. Seriously Super, as someone who has a lvl 42 jugg, level up a bit, get a few more abilities to play with, *learn your sodding class* and quit the qq. If your spec isn't working out, respec. If you still cannot figure it out, get someone who knows the class to hand-hold you through how to get the best out of it. A good guild will help you. Partying up will help you shine, god knows it is much much more efficient than solo'ing and there are bonuses on loot & xp for doing so, not to mention the social points.
If we're not all in the top 10 raiding guilds in a game with bleeding edge gear, does that mean we are bad players when we can't take down raid bosses within the first week they're launched? No. Just because some players are able to complete this content with relatively little issue, does that mean the class is not underpowered? No. It's not always if I can do it everyone can do it, and if you can't do it, you're a bad player and don't deserve to progress through my game.
If you are completing these with no issue, I'd like to take a look at your gear. Do you upgrade to bleeding edge mods every level range? Do you carry with you a lot of flashpoint gear or mostly what you pick up from quests? Do you visit the galaxy market to gear your companion? Are you above level? What spec are you? What is your strategy? Do you use stimpacks? Medpacks?
Like I said before, I'm not the most skilled player in the world, but I'm at least competant as are my friends who migrated over from WoW with me who have the same survivability issue. I don't care that you or anyone else finds this game to be a cakewalk, because I believe that if you were to play virtually any other class in the game, you would faceroll 4 times harder than you do now with half the effort. That doesn't change the fact that this class's survivability issues are only magnified by the fact that many elites in solo quests have overtuned abilities which do not compensate for the lack of comparable abilities possessed by the player.
Sorcerers are pretty much forced down the Khem Val route. Companions seem to be integral to soloing?
So in other words you don't want to take advantage of the abilities your character has? Got it.
Also, I have no idea what your doing wrong against "strong" mobs, but you obviously are. I see other Marauders rip through them.
You should not have to kite elites just to kill them. If you do, you've proved my point that the class is underpowered.
It's pretty obvious that BioWare intended for the snare to be a PvP ability.
I find it interesting that while you post constantly how difficult TOR is there are others that claim it is too easy. Personally, I think the game is just right on the challenge level and I hope bioware never changes a thing.Currently Playing: World of Warcraft
Except Jedi Guardians get edged out by Shadows due to Force Sprint.
There's a major issue when players are encouraged to play vicariously through their companions.
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SW:TOR isn't difficult aside from the occasional overtuned elite encounter.
Never experienced much of a problem in solo quests, mainly because doing both the class and planet quest lines, coupled with a couple other things like heroics and pvp, leaves you permanently 3-5 levels above the mob levels.
I'm just about to leave Tatooine for Alderaan and I'm 3/4 to lvl 33 wheras the level range of mobs on the planet is like what, 24-28?
I didn't even have to go back to Taris to do the bonus quests, I was at the level to do them when I finished the planet.
It's called doing the content and getting to know your class. Those of us not pro enough to beat elites of the same level get by just fine by simply outleveling them.
It is a bit of a challenge with the JK/SW classes cos they're kinda late bloomers. But once lvl 24+ start rolling in you get the bread and butter skills. Stasis, force push, overhead slash that increases crit ratings, dispatch etc... good times start rolling in. It's not underpowered. In skilled hands both guardians and sentinels dish out very very good damage, you see it often in warzones. With proper rotations to get crits rolling you land hits sorcerers and sages would be proud of.
But it's not a faceroll class, that much is true. Which is a good thing I feel.
34 Sent here. I have ZERO problems tearing through mobs or elites. There was a point in my early 20's when I had tried to rush into my class quests and the elites outleveled me by 2 and I died a few times. I pvp'd a little to even up my levels and grabbed some gear, I use T-7 as my tank. I am not having problem and can honestly say I am no where near the best player. MY old hands struggle with only 2 extra buttons on a razer mouse.....yes, I'm a clicker still sadly
Did the OP seriously say Juggernaut has trouble completing class quests. Hmm my main is one, and I ve never died doing them. Theres many skills that should not just be mashed, and used at appropriate times, as a Jug, but maybe you should learn those first before you say, anything is underpowered.
Companion has alot to do with it as well.
Wait! are people seriously suggesting that you should kite with your melee class?? If you have to play your class in a manor that's completely contrary to it's intended design thats sort of suggest that something seriously wrong with the class...
I knew which were the weakest classes and which were strongest before i chose my class.
I knew Sith Inquisitor and to some extent BH were strongest
I knew Jedi Sentinel was weakest.
I chose Sentinel, because im awesome like that
Um, you can kite in melee. Hit him and kite until your cooldoans are active againa nd hit him again, then kite some more. Are you seriously saying becuase melee can kite there is something wrong with the game? I call it a breath of fresh air when playing melee.
Back on topic. i level a merc, an operative, a juggernaut, and assassin all to mid 30's and been having fun with all four in pvp. i dont really see any over/under power with any of them., I can tell you thought like the above paragraph, melee has some nice starts to do (especially in pvp), that doesnt require you only to chase mindlessly people around hope to whack them with your sword a few times. Again, breath of fresh air!
No, I'm saying if a melee class has to depend on kiting to complete class quest there is something seriously wrong with the class.
Hmm, not going the direction of an argument , but seriously ,using the proper companion is a big plus, trying to toe to toe an elite with you're a dps class and not a tank class....is in no way showing lack of balance. A guardian with a dps companion, toe to toe all you want, not the reverse.
you say like all skill have long CDs....
also try to upgrade your equips weapon and or armor, farm some tokens, normally I go for tokens when they give me the option to choose in quests rewards
Must sandboxers bring their garbage into each and every thread? This not is not about themepark vs sandbox, it's about the OP's whining about class balance. Keep in mind the balance is fine as it's been the same all through beta.
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There aren't nearly enough people at lvl50 to make even the most basic educated opinion on class balance for the game that for all intensive purposes has been officially released for all of 1 day.
lol.
Which is why marauders have been getting pretty much constant buffs through beta yeah kk.
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Not being argumentative but the dev's are aware of the issues with the Sith Warrior/Jedi Knight and it's subclasses, they have serious issues which the devs are working on, the Jugg/Guards have a update in the wing. If the devs themselves admit that the class is broken, then it's broken. No if and buts about it.
If you want class balance you shouldn't buy any MMO at launch.
Even Guildwars that both had the best launch and now have the best balance had problems with this at launch.
It takes a long time to get the balance right, most MMOs never really gets it, but it usually takes 6 months before they are at least relatively balanced.
We could say that w think the game should be perfectly balanced at launch but I am not sure that it is even possible since no one ever made it so.
42 Sith Juggy here
1. Select the correct companion. This is really important. Companions are class abilities, you need to use the correct ability to progress. The correct one varies depending on your spec. An immortal spec Juggy (like myself) wants a dps companion so I stuck with Vette. A dps Juggy (*cough*lame*cough*) probably wants Quinn (healing) or Broonmark/Pierce (tanks). I have seen some dps Juggies complain they have had issues while attempting to use Vette, of course they are going to have issues.
2. Figure out how you level. This can make other choices easier or harder. If your the kind of person that does EVERY normal mission on a world as well as throwing in some pvp, space combat, heroics, flashpoints, etc. Then your going to be several levels above the world your on. This actually gives you a bit of breathing room in gear and companions as things won't be quite as hard. Some people can use companions that aren't optimal and level this way, several that have listed accomplishments on this thread likely have leveled this way as well. I leveled like this up until the later half of Tatooine where I said screw it because I was tired of always fighting green/gray mobs. I just did nothing but class quests through the last half of Tatooine and all of Alderaan. This put me at the perfect level for the next planet and I've been skipping just enough to keep at the correct level for planets.
If you happen to change how you level, realize you may need to adjust your spec/class/companion/gear. It was at this point that I stopped going for just Str/Endurance/Power gear and started focusing on the actual defense stat.
3. Gear is important for SW/JK and their companions. These classes rely heavily on their companions, some specs more than others. They also rely heavily on their and their companions gear. If your a Sent/Marauder using a heal or tank pet and they have crappy gear, they WILL be taking half their life in damage from an elites strong attacks and they WONT be able to keep you alive while you attempt tanking them. For Juggy/Guardian they are generally your dps so you can cover your companions bad gear by being able to live longer so they have more time to dps but the shorter the fight the more efficient you become. This means you should pick a route to gear up and keep yourself and your companion well equipped.
Having your companion in greens or without helmets/earpieces/implants when your companion is forced to fill in key positions like a tank or healer is asking for trouble leveling.
I myself gear up with the moddable gear route. I started off doing flashpoints/pvp/buying/using commendations to get a moddable piece of gear in every slot and I just use new commendations to buy mods for it now.
I also did the same with my Vette. Have gotten her a full set of moddable gear and use my commendations to keep her gear filled with up to date blue mods as well. This allows her to 2 shots normal mobs (2 abilities) and solo lieutenants if I use one of her 2min cooldowns. She does about twice as much damage as she would in the greens she gets from quests. I fully expect that anyone forcing a companion to tank or heal for them would need to have the companion in about the same level of gear for it to work out well. I for example can't see a tank npc losing 1/2 its life to an elite in an attack if it had full correct level blue gear since they use the same stat mods and such our characters have.
Don't treat your companion as a pet or some secondary citizen. They can damage or tank just as well as a player if you give them the gear to do it. I consider my character and Vette as a duo (may be easier as I actually like the Vette character). I'll choose a bigger upgrade for Vette over a smaller one for myself if it is an option because overall its a bigger upgrade for my leveling ability. Possibly harder to do if you actually hate your companion your forced to use cause of your class/spec.