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Character Size = PVP Advantage

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  • LobotomistLobotomist Member EpicPosts: 5,981

    Race size is big problem in TERA PVP.

    In GW2 you still target via TAB, so i guess size is irellevant.



  • AlarahsAlarahs Member Posts: 5

    Originally posted by someforumguy

    Originally posted by Rabenwolf


    Originally posted by someforumguy


    Originally posted by Rabenwolf


    Originally posted by Valkaern


    Please point out where I am stating anything as fact? 

     

    It did somewhat come off this way as the title of the thread is:

    'Character Size = PvP Advantage'

    That sounds like a statement, though it's simply not true across the board.

    'Does Character Size=PvP Advantage in GW2?' would have changed the tone considerably.

    It doesn't seem to be any advantage at all in GW2 luckily, primarily for reasons already posted.

    I can understand that, and did consider the wording when writing a subject line. However, subject lines are just that, it is a topic direction, not a statement which reflects on the entirety of the content within.

    Foolish is the person who only reads the subject, which is limited by nature, and replies based on personal assumption and intent without actually reading the original post. 

    It seems to be a common problem in certain game forums.

    What I presented was a hypothesis. Size = pvp advantage. It could go both ways, since I do not elaborate on what that entails until the actual post. Its followed by asking for thoughts and responses.

    I appreciate your constructive response though. Cheers.

     

     

    You can turn on nametags which gives the same visibility for all characters.  For the AOE skills where you free aim, it doesnt matter if the hitbox is smaller as long as they are in the marked spot. So hitbox size doesnt matter at all in this combat type.

    In your OP you implied that NCsoft is developing the game by referring to them when you said that they were overlooking a critical PVP advantage. Which they cant, only Arenanet can do that because they are the developers. Of course I agree that this is not that important, so I wonder why you didnt simply admit your mistake instead of making excuses.

    This thread shouldve ended at the second post.

    That depends, if the minimap shows the enemy without you actually having to see them near your character, then yes it might not be a big deal at all. When designing a game, one has to consider how a player will react to a challenge mechanic or the act of identifying an opponent as well as the time it will take to do so.  In addition to this, while AOE might not matter as much, not all skills in the game are AOE.

    I implied both arena net and NCsoft is developing the game. I can promise you that Arena net obtained assets created by NCsofts artist in Korea for example. I can also explain again that Arena net is a subsidary of NCsoft and as such many resources as well as design influence can and often is shared. Finally I did admit to saying NCsoft out of habit, which it was then followed by in both the first and second post I made with arena net. Yes it doesnt matter so please drop it and there were no excuses given after the fact. Please read.

    If it should have ende dbyt he second post, by your logic, why respond now when its on page 2? Sigh, sometimes I dont get some of you.

    I hope size will not have as much as an impact as it potentially could in a pvp atmosphere.

    It shouldve ended because Master10k already answered your post. Still, you keep claiming the above bs.

    The red is simply not true. They have their own artists that won a lot of rewards. They created their own world engine and tools to add content. All from scratch. Please look it up for yourself. NCsoft has no part in this at all.

    Asking me to drop the NCsoft part now is kind of lame. You shouldnt have first claimed bs about arenanet then.

    I want to second the correct information here.  Arenanet developed both the Game engine and the Art Assets themselves.  You can actually see quite a bit about the development process at Arenanet's Blog.  http://www.arena.net/blog/   Dig through the Archives, they've been quite forthcoming over the years about how they make these things. 

     

    Arenanet's ownership by NCSoft is a bit of a red herring.  NCSoft has been making statements for years about stuff that Arenanet is doing and Arenanet has had to follow along afterwards and correct them and give the details for the general announcements.  From years of observation, NCSoft is very "Hands off" with Arenanet. 

  • gainesvilleggainesvilleg Member CommonPosts: 1,053

    Originally posted by Damzilla

    All of the races share exact same hitboxes. This is especially important in this game because you can make your character from 4 feet (Asura) to 9 feet (Norn) tall. Giving the advantage to smaller characters would be a huge flaw. There were similar incidents in some games, bu Anet is too smart for that. Don't worry, you can make a giant Norn and still be great. Remember, it's all about the skill. Besides, that 9 feet certainly add to the fear factor, don't they ?

    Tall/big characters are always at disadvantage in frenetic PVP as instinct might make you target what you see first.  This is an issue in any PVP game to be honest, but it is not a mathematical or formal advantage as in larger hitbox/etc.  I usually ignore this factor and choose to play a race I prefer, but always knowing it isn't optimal.  And as for GW2, the Asura is so ridiculously cutesy Asian manga crap I couldn't possibly ever play that race without feeling like a total putz LOL.

    GW2 "built from the ground up with microtransactions in mind"
    1) Cash->Gems->Gold->Influence->WvWvWBoosts = PAY2WIN
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  • moosecatlolmoosecatlol Member RarePosts: 1,531

    Originally posted by gainesvilleg

    Originally posted by Damzilla

    All of the races share exact same hitboxes. This is especially important in this game because you can make your character from 4 feet (Asura) to 9 feet (Norn) tall. Giving the advantage to smaller characters would be a huge flaw. There were similar incidents in some games, bu Anet is too smart for that. Don't worry, you can make a giant Norn and still be great. Remember, it's all about the skill. Besides, that 9 feet certainly add to the fear factor, don't they ?

    Tall/big characters are always at disadvantage in frenetic PVP as instinct might make you target what you see first.  This is an issue in any PVP game to be honest, but it is not a mathematical or formal advantage as in larger hitbox/etc.  I usually ignore this factor and choose to play a race I prefer, but always knowing it isn't optimal.  And as for GW2, the Asura is so ridiculously cutesy Asian manga crap I couldn't possibly ever play that race without feeling like a total putz LOL.

    HOW IS EVEN ASIAN? HOW?

    Tengu maybe, and I would the shit of the Tengu if they ever become a playable race.

  • NikkitaNikkita Member Posts: 790

    Originally posted by Master10K

    And you wonder why I got annoyed enough to seem rather snappy with my response. I wish I could say more but I've already had 3 warnings by the mods lately. image

    The way you reply to people..no surprise there.

    image


    Bite Me

  • ArquitetoArquiteto Member Posts: 228

    GW2 is a TAB target game. Other than the aoe skills. Character size has no advantage other than being easier to spot.

  • rdashrdash Member Posts: 121

    Originally posted by gainesvilleg

    Originally posted by Damzilla

    All of the races share exact same hitboxes. This is especially important in this game because you can make your character from 4 feet (Asura) to 9 feet (Norn) tall. Giving the advantage to smaller characters would be a huge flaw. There were similar incidents in some games, bu Anet is too smart for that. Don't worry, you can make a giant Norn and still be great. Remember, it's all about the skill. Besides, that 9 feet certainly add to the fear factor, don't they ?

    Tall/big characters are always at disadvantage in frenetic PVP as instinct might make you target what you see first.  This is an issue in any PVP game to be honest, but it is not a mathematical or formal advantage as in larger hitbox/etc.  I usually ignore this factor and choose to play a race I prefer, but always knowing it isn't optimal.  And as for GW2, the Asura is so ridiculously cutesy Asian manga crap I couldn't possibly ever play that race without feeling like a total putz LOL.

    Being targetted first isn't always disadvantage in PvP - it's actually more beneficial for the team if characters that are more capable of withstanding enemy attention get it. All sorts of tank/diversion based characters can benefit from larger size.

    Also, Asuras aren't manga crap. There are plenty of gremlin-like appearances available for them, and even the few cutesy looks female Asuras can pick from aren't that eastern. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BqWcn2Ua6lg

  • DigitallyEndowedDigitallyEndowed Member Posts: 125

     


    Let’s be honest here: There difference between class balance is always going to be considerably more noticeable than the incredibly minor, situational and subjective difference in balance between race size.


     


    Speaking hypothetically, if race size were to be normalised to give a better level of game balance, then it would only be logical to scrap every class but one; scrap any way of being able to specialise your class, removing traits, skill points etc; scrap all weapon types but one, and all armour sets but one; remove the option to dye gear, and scrap the idea of “costume” type gear. In fact, you would also have to make sure everyone has the same name, and make sure they are all running the game on the exact same system with the exact same hardware, internet connection etc. The list could likely go on for a while.


     


    I think my point is clear; there is always a reasonable level of balance to strive for. If you start going too far, you may as well min-max every single aspect of the game, reaching silly extremes in an effort to achieve “fair” play. 

  • austriacusaustriacus Member UncommonPosts: 618

    Originally posted by Rabenwolf

    Originally posted by Fir3line

    I never really thought it was harder to target a gnome or a goblin in wow over a tauren.

     

    /shrug

     

     

    And you shouldn't reffer to them as NCsoft, as it is a publisher for GW2 only.

    Or do you say Mass effect is a EA game, instead of a bioware game?

    Well that is in part due to the "tab" and auto target, something Arena net seems to get rid of (which is actually a great thing).

    Again, I said NCsoft out of habit because Arena Net is owned by them and it was just that, habit. If you continued to read I do refer to arena net. Again, there is no logical reason to nit pick this unless there is some elitism and peen comparing going on, and quite frankly that mindset is utterly stupid.

    To call a bioware game an EA game actually has a bit of truth to it. A few of my associates (im a digital artist) have worked for EA and Bioware is pretty much run by them. Last time I was at E3, it wasnt the Bioware booth and the developers were not wearing bioware gear...they were EA. EA has a bad insider reputation for controlling projects to the point of rediculousness.

    Ok here is the problem with the whole thread. The OP thinks there isnt any tab and auto target Where there is in fact auto target and tab targeting. Yes i know its hard to believe that a game that has such fluid and strategic combat has them. Dont worry though you still can dodge any atack.

  • Master10KMaster10K Member Posts: 3,065

    Originally posted by Nikkita

    Originally posted by Master10K


    And you wonder why I got annoyed enough to seem rather snappy with my response. I wish I could say more but I've already had 3 warnings by the mods lately. image

    The way you reply to people..no surprise there.

    Hey, what's the harm in having a bit of fun with some forum PvP. All I can do until I'm able to play some real MMO PvP. image

    image

  • DistopiaDistopia Member EpicPosts: 21,183

    Originally posted by Master10K

    Originally posted by someforumguy


    Originally posted by Rabenwolf


    *snip*

     

    I implied both arena net and NCsoft is developing the game. I can promise you that Arena net obtained assets created by NCsofts artist in Korea for example. I can also explain again that Arena net is a subsidary of NCsoft and as such many resources as well as design influence can and often is shared.

    And you wonder why I got annoyed enough to seem rather snappy with my response. I wish I could say more but I've already had 3 warnings by the mods lately. image

    Well he does have a point, where do you think they got their character creator? So yes they do share assets.

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • DataDayDataDay Member UncommonPosts: 1,538

    Originally posted by Master10K

    Originally posted by Nikkita


    Originally posted by Master10K


    And you wonder why I got annoyed enough to seem rather snappy with my response. I wish I could say more but I've already had 3 warnings by the mods lately. image

    The way you reply to people..no surprise there.

    Hey, what's the harm in having a bit of fun with some forum PvP. All I can do until I'm able to play some real MMO PvP. image

    Forum pvp? You mean acting like a child and trolling for the sake of your own self concieved ego. Your immaturity confounds me. Whats more sad is that Its almost as if you are proud of it.

    Furthermore, yes some asset creation and development has been OUTSOURCED. NCsoft pulls from its own developers and they work on NC published games. Do you know why? Because of Milestones. Do you know that is? In the industry its when you need to meet a certain level of completion. Arena net is a great studio, but they are still beholden to the publisher that owns them. GW2 is a massive project which will require some pulling of resources from which the publisher will provide.

  • El-HefeEl-Hefe Member UncommonPosts: 760

    Originally posted by Lobotomist

    Race size is big problem in TERA PVP.

    In GW2 you still target via TAB, so i guess size is irellevant.

    cant you also attack without tab-taget in gw2?  i thouhti saw a video when the guy just swung his sword and hit enemys without targeting them.  so hit-boxes would come into play.

    I've got the straight edge.

  • jacklojacklo Member Posts: 570

    Originally posted by brody71

    Originally posted by Lobotomist

    Race size is big problem in TERA PVP.

    In GW2 you still target via TAB, so i guess size is irellevant.

    cant you also attack without tab-taget in gw2?  i thouhti saw a video when the guy just swung his sword and hit enemys without targeting them.  so hit-boxes would come into play.

    I think that's an AOE attack.

  • TruthXHurtsTruthXHurts Member UncommonPosts: 1,555

    That's too bad they are all the same. I would like to see a game that allows for the strategy of making a huge tank to absorb damage, or a tiny rogue that can move unseen.

    "I am not in a server with Gankers...THEY ARE IN A SERVER WITH ME!!!"

  • JoekraJoekra Member Posts: 182

    Originally posted by TruthXHurts

    That's too bad they are all the same. I would like to see a game that allows for the strategy of making a huge tank to absorb damage, or a tiny rogue that can move unseen.

    Try Bloodline Champions, Tanks are huge and block projectiles when smaller characters hide behind them.

  • RizelStarRizelStar Member UncommonPosts: 2,773
    Originally posted by jacklo


    Originally posted by brody71


    Originally posted by Lobotomist


    Race size is big problem in TERA PVP.
    In GW2 you still target via TAB, so i guess size is irellevant.

    cant you also attack without tab-taget in gw2?  i thouhti saw a video when the guy just swung his sword and hit enemys without targeting them.  so hit-boxes would come into play.

    I think that's an AOE attack.

     

    Yea it is but to elaborate collision is just like Tera's what ever your attacks hit they damage so Tera and GW2 are the same in that regards.

    The only difference in Tera is a lot of skills you use stop your control in movement where as GW2 you can control your movements except for some that make sense. Other than that action was and feel should be the same unless you want to use auto attack. Tera is a bit easier due to the attacks being tied to the mouse and free aim. It might be latency that's effecting Teras combat but that's another story it's still fun as is Gw2. Umm but yea hope this help clears any debates I payed both any who know more feel free to correct me.

    I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.

    I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.

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    Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.

  • ammoniteammonite Member Posts: 113

    Originally posted by Rabenwolf

    Originally posted by Master10K


    Originally posted by Nikkita


    Originally posted by Master10K


    ...

    ....

    Hey, what's the harm in having a bit of fun with some forum PvP. All I can do until I'm able to play some real MMO PvP. image

    Forum pvp? You mean acting like a child and trolling for the sake of your own self concieved ego. Your immaturity confounds me. Whats more sad is that Its almost as if you are proud of it.

    LOLs, Master10K is like a cage fighter, feed him steriods and send him in first. Hope he's on our server in wv3

     

    image

  • Vore_TechzVore_Techz Member Posts: 122

    If character size is a problem beyond hit boxes into the realm of perception, then why don' we all just make midgets.

    Who needs variety?

    Everything being the same is interesting and fun!

    (>^_^)> MMO Veteran <(^_^<)
    Currently Playing: Tera Online

  • Loke666Loke666 Member EpicPosts: 21,441

    Listen, I seen plenty of how ANET do PvP balancing and if size really becomes a big problem they will find a way to balance it up.

    Letting smaller characters have a little less HP than large characters is an easy fix to mention one thing, and it is logical as well. I do have a hard time explaining why an Asura Guardian can take just as much punishment as a norn guardian.

    But there are other possibilities as well, if an unacceptable percentage of the best PvPers are all really small it will be balanced, things like that is why you have an beta.

  • SomsbalSomsbal Member Posts: 222

    Originally posted by ammonite

    Originally posted by Rabenwolf


    Originally posted by Master10K


    Originally posted by Nikkita


    Originally posted by Master10K


    ...

    ....

    Hey, what's the harm in having a bit of fun with some forum PvP. All I can do until I'm able to play some real MMO PvP. image

    Forum pvp? You mean acting like a child and trolling for the sake of your own self concieved ego. Your immaturity confounds me. Whats more sad is that Its almost as if you are proud of it.

    LOLs, Master10K is like a cage fighter, feed him steriods and send him in first. Hope he's on our server in wv3

     

    Throwing around some words on the internet isn't exactly what i would call a cagefighter on steroids.

    I'd say you can compare him more to something like this instead:

  • VolkonVolkon Member UncommonPosts: 3,748

    Originally posted by brody71

    Originally posted by Lobotomist

    Race size is big problem in TERA PVP.

    In GW2 you still target via TAB, so i guess size is irellevant.

    cant you also attack without tab-taget in gw2?  i thouhti saw a video when the guy just swung his sword and hit enemys without targeting them.  so hit-boxes would come into play.

    Yes, you can do both. You can also hit enemies you're not targetting while targetting someone else.

    Oderint, dum metuant.

  • eAzydamaneAzydaman Member Posts: 218

    No its not only AOE. If you dont select an enemy you can swing weapons freely. U'll hit whats in range. That doesnt apply to skills though i think. Its just your basic attack.

  • ZeroxinZeroxin Member UncommonPosts: 2,515

    Originally posted by Nikkita

    Originally posted by Master10K


    And you wonder why I got annoyed enough to seem rather snappy with my response. I wish I could say more but I've already had 3 warnings by the mods lately. image

    The way you reply to people..no surprise there.

    I reply to people quite snappily too but the only time you get warned is if you diss them directly. Indirect disses are allowed though (/sarcasm on this part).

    This is not a game.

  • Master10KMaster10K Member Posts: 3,065

    Originally posted by Zeroxin

    Originally posted by Nikkita


    Originally posted by Master10K


    And you wonder why I got annoyed enough to seem rather snappy with my response. I wish I could say more but I've already had 3 warnings by the mods lately. image

    The way you reply to people..no surprise there.

    I reply to people quite snappily too but the only time you get warned is if you diss them directly. Indirect disses are allowed though (/sarcasm on this part).

    I think my warnings were from threads created by Sanctum & MMOExposed. Anyone who's been here a while would know the kind of threads they make. :P

    image

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