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Guild Wars 2 is less P2W than the first game
Serelisk
Member Posts: 836
Hilariously, GW2 sells less competetive advantage than it's predecessor, despite people claiming GW2 is now perpetuating the tyrannical evils of a cash shop.
The items of tensions, as far as I'm aware of in this cash shop debate, are the various boosts that are to save time and be convienent. None of these things are pay to win because winning implies competition, and competition in MMO's is traditionally won with power. In traditional MMO's, time = power. In Guild Wars 2, you buy time. However, it does not equal power. Nothing you buy in the cash shop has any influence whatsoever on the competetive PvP game type.
Guild Wars 1, however, had item and skill unlock packs! These had a direct impact on PvP because it allowed players instant access to all the skills of the game. However, it was merely a conveinence item and the skills and items could be unlocked simply by playing through the game and PvP. But you could easily argue that being given all the utility of the game in a competetive setting allowed some miscontrued aspect of power... or something... lol
it's about as viable as the argument with boost items except it actuall affects the competetive setting.
Comments
Alot of people just assume all cash shops are the same and assume the worst not our fault if there one of those people and if they dont buy the game ebcause they dont like cash shops well then its there loss not ours i personly would rather not have a shallow person playing the game because it just does more harm than good.
Yeah I agree, I'm glad to finally see someone agree with my view of the skill-packs in GW1..
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
I always had this opinion, but it never bothered be because it's specifically for convienence and making ArenaNet money. In no way did I ever think this violated the inegrity of the game because, at the end of the day, it's skill that reigns when both players acquired the items necessary to perform their chosen builds. (Though some builds are geared towards countering others) >.>
well you still had to buy them in game
I don't really view those as a buy to win. I actually think the mercs fall into that category more.
And where the skill unlocks in the original cash shop when it came out?
So people with opinions other than yours are shallow? hmm That sounds a tad hypocritical to me.
Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.
The original was P2W? How so. Sure they sold skill packs, but you could get those same skill in a very short amount of time in game without paying a dime. If anything it was "we got some suckers to buy our skill packs that they realy didn't have to". I never paid a dime in GW1 and I was an awesome mesmer. I farmed feathers for an hour or two made like 50k. That's about 50 skills - roughly. It wasn't pay to win in the least. Gear ment so little in the game so not having EOTN or Nightfall (or any other expansion) didn't hurt you, because the end game gear there was the same as the gear in prophecies. Most end game gear was purely for aesthetics. Like obsidian armor - purely for looks
MMO's are the ark of the gaming world. Let it take us in new directions.
My point. People argue that GW2 is pay to win, yet GW1 was more so, and even saying THAT is laughable.
Let's discuss this when the game is released, we still don't know that much about how the cashshop will be by then.
There was close to zero pay2win factor in GW, I never spent a dime in it besides getting the campaigns and the expansion.
Well I have to admit, I bought some costumes but that was it for me.
Those skill packs were hilarious!
You still have to buy the skills with ingame gold. The only thing you paid for was to have the skills show up on all the skill vendors.
I just wish people understood the simple concept: Spend time getting stuff or spend money getting stuff. I mean seriously, how hard is it to understand. In GW2's case it's even better because now you can spend time getting cashshop items. I'll just think of GW2's cash shop turning people away from it, as an idiot filter.
The two main benefits for the skill packs were for your pvp character and your heros. If you bought it for your rpg character? Almost a complete waste of money.
It's not a lack of understanding, it's a lack of acceptance.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Let's be real. Most of the flack over the cash shop is just from haters who are excited to finally have something they can use to criticize the game that might be able to get some traction with the uninformed. There are a few things that could have been OP in certain conditions, but it looks like Arenanet is going to ban them from use in Dungeons, WvW and PvP, so they really aren't even a minor issue any more.
No one with an ounce of sense can say with a straight face that anything talked about from the cash shop even hints at Pay to Win. That they will say it anyway tells you everything you need to know about the motives of the poster.
Unfortunately, I think the NDA for this current event was counter-productive, since there was no outflow of positive impressions, or open discussion of potential cash shop adjustments made for the beta, which just provided very fertile ground for the manure that has been slung around the cash shop issue this week.
Hopefully the press participants will be able to change the focus come monday. This issue is getting tired.
Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated
I was legitmately excited about GW2 because it:
1) B2P
2) Abandons the holy trinity
3) Great art direction and probably great combat
Some of the items in the store really turn me off and go against what got me excited about the game. I don't want a F2P store in a B2P game. It's as simple as that.
D3 releasing at about the same time just made it easier to forget about GW2.
GW1 is not pay to win , there is nothing in the shop that can help you be better. gw2 on the otherhand has xp boosts.
Explain the exact items in red that could possibly turn you off from the incredible jewels listed in green.
Xp boosts don't help you become "better", because better means you're advancing in actual skill to utilize against other players in the context of GW2. This is a horizontal progression game, just like the first. Xp boosts are a completely optional item that allows you a faster route to level 80 and has virtually no impact on other players.
Until you can buy an item in the cash shop that can be used to aid you in the structured PvP, then Guild Wars 2 is NOT pay to win.
Nope. I've seen some of the most loyal defenders of GW2, turn against the game or at least voice their concerns about the CS. And they have a right to let Anet know their displeasure and hope to get some change. It is a topic people have strong feelings about and you don't have to be a hater to want to talk about it. And as for being tired of these countless threads arguing about game, buckle up. Until release, GW2 and all it's faults and good points are going to be the main topics here. I do have concerns about the gem for gold thing effecting the prices on AH, and the keys for locked loot, but will wait to see how these are handled.
What's your opinion on selling gems for gold then using gold to buy better weapons/gear on AH? Does that constitute spending cash for an advantage? To me none of these are deal breakers if the game is fun, as I ignore Cs's in games, but it seems to be a way around actually selling the itesm in the CS.
Hero Battles? Having All Skill Unlocks didn't affect those at all....
And that was a pvp format..
Good points all around. This is the type of thing that annoyed me during the TOR wars and many wars before them. At this point if someone mentions fanboi's or haters, I just stop reading there.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Yea because this: http://www.diablo3demo.com/diablo3screen6.jpg
Looks so much better than this: http://www.avatar3trailer.com/images/guild_wars_2/Guild_Wars_2_Guild_Wars_2_-306410115.jpg
Have it your way.
I never said it's pay to win, you are twisting my statement
Funny thing is the first game isn't really even P2W. The most imbalanced thing they had on the cash shop were the extra henchmen, and that's about it. The skill packs didn't give you any 'extra' skills that you could get in game, and skills weren't that difficult to acquire in GW1, once the expansions came out.
GW2's cash shop in many ways isn't necessarily less P2W (but it's definitely not more), but the advantages are shifted a bit towards chest unlocks / crafting & influence boosts.
Again, neither (out of either game) gives you an advantage in PvP. You can get all the gear you could ask for at the click of a button, and with a fairly minimal amount of PvE you can get enough skills to have a decent build set, the rest can be gained very quickly via PvP (elites taking the longest).