I know why I have strong feelings about SWTOR. Its just how it affects me, and I don't expect anyone to agree with me, or change their opinion to agree with me. Have your own opinions, I have mine.
I'm seriously disappointed with Bioware, they delivered a bad game in my opinion. Theres nothing to do outside waiting for warzone ques, and running the two raids. No mini games(other than space, which pisses me off twice as much), and seriously kotor their sprpg had more mini games than their mmo. Theres no customization and the outfits look rediculous(I never played WoW cause I believe only women from the 80's should wear shoulder pads)
This is the most linear mmo I've ever played. I didn't notice the capital ships in the sky on coruscant because I never looked up, I was following my bread crumbs to the next target(I noticed it in a screen shot, and had to go back to look, its actually kind of cool)
Look, if your mmo is going to be as diverse as Call of duty, have more $$$$ing maps! Three warzones? Open world pvp (Ilum) was so horribly imagined that someones job should be lost!
If you ask any question of bioware they tell you its on the wall of crazy. Here, let me interpret what wall of crazy means in developerese. It means, "its on the wall of shut the $$$$ up and keep paying your sub waiting for something thats not coming"
I mean seriously, the only modest developer over their is gabe amantegelo(Probably spelled wrong), but the rest of the developers Zoeller, Erickson especially are uptight arrogant $$$$'s.
I am a balanced mmo'er. Killer=I raced to warhero, got the bm gear and subbed out the mods to stack crit and surge, but I can't do it anymore. Its not fun, I can't take a week and do some other pvp cause there is none.
Achiever=I got everything, but I dont' want to roll 8 alts for a different story so I'm effectively done
Socializer=Bioware gave us guilds, which in their game is a friends list, nothing else.
Explorer=I have every datacron and never once did I feel like I was exploring, sigh.
I've never effectively done everything in an MMORPG before in my life, two months into TOR and I'm done, beat it?
Voice over was not worth all the cuts they had to make to content. This is not EA's fault, bioware thought story would carry the game, it will not.
Unreasonable expectations. I was a long time LOTRO player, at beta etc. If TOR had been what LOTRO was at launch, people would've shat more bricks then are currently being shat. It works, full voice acting, instances pvp, OPVP (Albiet horrendous OPVP), raids, operations. LOTRO launched with 4 (Or was it like, 6? 7? ..GB/GA/Fornost/CD/URU/BG)instances across all levels and 1 raid (helegrod)
In conclusion, people thought TOR would be the second coming. As a fan of this era in the Star Wars lore, I enjoy it. Anyone who says it isnt star wars was just execpting harrison ford and darth vader. It is profoundly star wars, and I think people's illness with prototypical MMO gaming made them hate everything more than it really should be hated.
That said, I look forward to Gw2 launching and seeing if it really does change anything, or, like RIFT, if it just makes everything look slightly different so trollers think it actually is different.
I will agree that the innovators all seem to be the indies... the problem with that is that EA eats every indy they can and stops whatever they were doing to keep things as is.
I will admit I loved SWG before the cu/nge... some days you want to kill womp rats, some days I crafted stuff, some days i focused exclusively on space...some days I just remodeled my houses.... I also like DAOC.... not quite a sandbox like swg was, but hell crafting was tops, your own decoratable houses, and really really good rvr.
Swtor has none of that, and thats fine for some people I suppose, the story is good once through for a faction and class stories are great... what do you do after you hear/see all the stories though and grind out your gear? I am guessing that "real" space is the big next project they are working on, great... however if crafting stays the same as it is, then so what....grind ground, then grind space for best loot... ok done with that, what now? No one gets to make a business for themselves where people say go visit so and so, he has great weap/armor/droids/engines or whatever...
At the end of the day though, it doesnt really matter... this post wont sway anyone, all it does is let people know how I feel about the game. Is the game dieing.... no idea other than of the people that I knew that got it... like 1 is still playing out of 12... but again that states nothing as we are all fairly like in our tastes so no brainer that we arent hooked into it.
If you bothered to read all that, the only thing to take from this is for 5 years of development and a god awful amount of money, I expected more... not just a online single player RPG that you can group with other people on. The game was billed as a full MMORPG with full voice acting and cut scenes.... its got the voice acting and cut scenes.... it missed the MMO part. There was supposed to be more than just combat to do... I suppose that is moderately true if you consider a bad clone of starfox with new graphics, and clicking to send your minions on missions for tradeskill items stuff to do....
As others have said, its unrealistic expectations. people get all hyped for a new game and unless its everything the hoped for they become bitter.
GW2 is a good example. It better be like the second coming or holy grail or all the fanbois will shred it on the forums
There's a distinct difference between GW2 and SWTOR. ArenaNet is releasing tons of video that shows uninterrupted game footage instead of their Dev's talking about the game. EA knew they had a bad product, so they limited the information and confined it to short clips or had their Devs talk about the game. They knew in advance and lied about the features of their game. (e.g. 100 v. 100 PvP on ILUM.)
If you watch the clip, look how quickly cut together the footage is. Look how the people have to rely on what the Dev is telling you the game will be like rather than showing you with extended footage.
Now watch this for contrast. Which looks more engaging? Also, the Devs admit how they're fixing mistakes prior to release.
As others have said, its unrealistic expectations. people get all hyped for a new game and unless its everything the hoped for they become bitter.
GW2 is a good example. It better be like the second coming or holy grail or all the fanbois will shred it on the forums
Funny
I see these "GW2 better be something like second coming" only from people like you warning others from getting hyped up...strange indeed
Real fans actually know what the game will offer, with all its imperfection(such as loading screens, cash shop, over the top particles etc) so they wont fall flat on their nose at all
It's just people like you who will invade the forums once the game comes out crying out loud that the game is not the Ambrosy of MMO gaming...not the fans (or at least the sane ones)
SWTOR is different case - it was based on one of the most famous IPs of all time and so even the most casual gamers bought it, because they were overhyped over the 4 fancy CGIs. I saw their joy, I told them not to hype themselves over it because I did my homework and I knew what the game will exactly offer (and boy was I right! even about the shitty PvP since I knew bioware has 0 experience in that field), they didnt listen, they had their "STARWARS AND BIOWARE cannost fail! I dont have to look into it, they just wont" attitude and thus they were dissapointed miserably - It was expected, really
GW2 on the other hand, build its hype on gameplay vids, word of mouth and fresh ideas and they walked the walk...they basicaly did the opposite and thats why(along with my knowledge of the game) I trust them
I think I actually spent way more time reading and theorycrafting about MMOs than playing them
As others have said, its unrealistic expectations. people get all hyped for a new game and unless its everything the hoped for they become bitter.
GW2 is a good example. It better be like the second coming or holy grail or all the fanbois will shred it on the forums
Funny
I see these "GW2 better be something like second coming" only from people like you warning others from getting hyped up...strange indeed
Real fans actually know what the game will offer, with all its imperfection(such as loading screens, cash shop, over the top particles etc) so they wont fall flat on their nose at all
It's just people like you who will invade the forums once the game comes out crying out loud that the game is not the Ambrosy of MMO gaming...not the fans (or at least the sane ones)
SWTOR is different case - it was based on one of the most famous IPs of all time and so even the most casual gamers bought it, because they were overhyped over the 4 fancy CGIs. I saw their joy, I told them not to hype themselves over it because I did my homework and I knew what the game will exactly offer (and boy was I right! even about the shitty PvP since I knew bioware has 0 experience in that field), they didnt listen, they had their "STARWARS AND BIOWARE cannost fail! I dont have to look into it, they just wont" attitude and thus they were dissapointed miserably - It was expected, really
GW2 on the other hand, build its hype on gameplay vids, word of mouth and fresh ideas and they walked the walk...they basicaly did the opposite and thats why(along with my knowledge of the game) I trust them
I'm not warning anyone about anything. I'm just stating how i see it. In fact i am hyped to the max for TSW
To me, if a new game is a let down, then i'm bummed. I move on. I certainly dont get all wigged out over it.
As others have said, its unrealistic expectations. people get all hyped for a new game and unless its everything the hoped for they become bitter.
GW2 is a good example. It better be like the second coming or holy grail or all the fanbois will shred it on the forums
It is not unrealisitc for customers to have expected a 2012 MMORPG, rather than a 2007 MMORPG with Cinematics. For the name and budget, people simple expected a higher quality.
Remove the Cinematics and the dialogue system (which basically is a paste from their older Kotor/ME/DA system), and the rest of the game feels like a simple reskin of WAR, a 2008 MMORPG).
So it is less about gamers being 'unrealisitc' and 'insatiable', and more simply about not producing the best quality product that they could have, compared to the rest of the market.
As others have said, its unrealistic expectations. people get all hyped for a new game and unless its everything the hoped for they become bitter.
GW2 is a good example. It better be like the second coming or holy grail or all the fanbois will shred it on the forums
There's a distinct difference between GW2 and SWTOR. ArenaNet is releasing tons of video that shows uninterrupted game footage instead of their Dev's talking about the game. EA knew they had a bad product, so they limited the information and confined it to short clips or had their Devs talk about the game. They knew in advance and lied about the features of their game. (e.g. 100 v. 100 PvP on ILUM.)
If you watch the clip, look how quickly cut together the footage is. Look how the people have to rely on what the Dev is telling you the game will be like rather than showing you with extended footage.
Now watch this for contrast. Which looks more engaging? Also, the Devs admit how they're fixing mistakes prior to release.
As others have said, its unrealistic expectations. people get all hyped for a new game and unless its everything the hoped for they become bitter.
GW2 is a good example. It better be like the second coming or holy grail or all the fanbois will shred it on the forums
There's a distinct difference between GW2 and SWTOR. ArenaNet is releasing tons of video that shows uninterrupted game footage instead of their Dev's talking about the game. EA knew they had a bad product, so they limited the information and confined it to short clips or had their Devs talk about the game. They knew in advance and lied about the features of their game. (e.g. 100 v. 100 PvP on ILUM.)
If you watch the clip, look how quickly cut together the footage is. Look how the people have to rely on what the Dev is telling you the game will be like rather than showing you with extended footage.
Now watch this for contrast. Which looks more engaging? Also, the Devs admit how they're fixing mistakes prior to release.
As others have said, its unrealistic expectations. people get all hyped for a new game and unless its everything the hoped for they become bitter.
GW2 is a good example. It better be like the second coming or holy grail or all the fanbois will shred it on the forums
There's a distinct difference between GW2 and SWTOR. ArenaNet is releasing tons of video that shows uninterrupted game footage instead of their Dev's talking about the game. EA knew they had a bad product, so they limited the information and confined it to short clips or had their Devs talk about the game. They knew in advance and lied about the features of their game. (e.g. 100 v. 100 PvP on ILUM.)
If you watch the clip, look how quickly cut together the footage is. Look how the people have to rely on what the Dev is telling you the game will be like rather than showing you with extended footage.
Now watch this for contrast. Which looks more engaging? Also, the Devs admit how they're fixing mistakes prior to release.
That's just two I found with a quick search on youtube. Both videos are at least ten minutes in length and is all gameplay footage.
It's okay not to like TOR, but don't lie and mislead. I followed this game for too long and still remember pre-launch very well.
Are you talking to me or EA? Logic would dictate that you're speaking to EA.
No logic would dictate that I'm refering to your post and that great lie you just told in it. Don't say that gameplay footage wasn't available when there was plenty prior to launch. At one time there was a stickied thread on the top of this forum that had many gameplay videos available for anyone to see so don't even try to play the revisionist historian, especially when we're talking about events that happened less than a year ago.
As others have said, its unrealistic expectations. people get all hyped for a new game and unless its everything the hoped for they become bitter.
GW2 is a good example. It better be like the second coming or holy grail or all the fanbois will shred it on the forums
There's a distinct difference between GW2 and SWTOR. ArenaNet is releasing tons of video that shows uninterrupted game footage instead of their Dev's talking about the game. EA knew they had a bad product, so they limited the information and confined it to short clips or had their Devs talk about the game. They knew in advance and lied about the features of their game. (e.g. 100 v. 100 PvP on ILUM.)
If you watch the clip, look how quickly cut together the footage is. Look how the people have to rely on what the Dev is telling you the game will be like rather than showing you with extended footage.
Now watch this for contrast. Which looks more engaging? Also, the Devs admit how they're fixing mistakes prior to release.
That's just two I found with a quick search on youtube. Both videos are at least ten minutes in length and is all gameplay footage.
It's okay not to like TOR, but don't lie and mislead. I followed this game for too long and still remember pre-launch very well.
Are you talking to me or EA? Logic would dictate that you're speaking to EA.
No logic would dictate that I'm refering to your post and that great lie you just told in it. Don't say that gameplay footage wasn't available when there was plenty prior to launch. At one time there was a stickied thread on the top of this forum that had many gameplay videos available for anyone to see so don't even try to play the revisionist historian, especially when we're talking about events that happened less than a year ago.
I never said that they never released videos, I said that the videos were highly edited. And in these two videos you can see how the Dev's chaperone the viewer throught the experience. At one point in the video, the Devs are asked to turn the gameplay sound up. Why did they start without sound? Did they do that intentionally? Yes. Yes, they did. Because, as we know now, SWTOR has very little ambience or ambient sounds.
The worlds are lifeless and dull. The gameplay is static. The only thing the game has going in its favor is a somewhat satisfactorily written B grade sci-fantasy story. That is why SWTOR is being judged so harshly. The Devs promised one thing and delivered another.
No logic would dictate that I'm refering to your post and that great lie you just told in it. Don't say that gameplay footage wasn't available when there was plenty prior to launch. At one time there was a stickied thread on the top of this forum that had many gameplay videos available for anyone to see so don't even try to play the revisionist historian, especially when we're talking about events that happened less than a year ago.
I never said that they never released videos, I said that the videos were highly edited.
This is what you said...
"EA knew they had a bad product, so they limited the information and confined it to short clips or had their Devs talk about the game"
Neither of those videos are highly edited. One is an operation from start to finish and the other is a world quest from start to finish. Plus, neither of those clips were short. So what if the devs are talking thru some of it? It's a story based game and the devs are explaining what is going on. When did that become a bad thing?
And in these two videos you can see how the Dev's chaperone the viewer throught the experience. At one point in the video, the Devs are asked to turn the gameplay sound up. Why did they start without sound?
Did they do that intentionally? Yes. Yes, they did. Because, as we know now, SWTOR has very little ambience or ambient sounds.
Wow. What a strawman you just pulled there. That's straight from the "6 degress of Kevin Bacon" school of logic. Know why ambient sounds wasn't talked about? Because they're doing videos about gameplay, the very thing you just got done claiming they tried to hide.
The Devs promised one thing and delivered another.
They promised a story based game and a story based game is what we got. Period. It was trashed before it was released for being a story based game and now it's being trashed for the same reason. Everyone on the face of the planet knew what this game was about. It was discussed ad naseum here for two years. Turning around and saying everyone was duped with all the information that was available just makes you look ridiculous.
Let me get this out of the way first: I didn't buy or play SW:ToR.
I didn't buy it precisely because of the information that was (and wasn't) available before the game released. At this stage of the game industry, there is zero excuse not to give plenty of information about what your game will be doing ahead of time unless the developer / publisher is trying to hide something from the consumer, not the competition. The long lead time in development means that there is no way that the competition can 'steal your thunder' by changing their plans midstream and pre-empt you.
EA/Bioware was willing to give plenty of information about the SW:ToR leveling experience but very little about the endgame activities or PvP. The problem is, it is the endgame and PVP experience which justifies a subscription fee. A storyline driven leveling game doesn't bother me, but I am not willing to pay a subscription fee just for that.
What raised red flags for me was the lack of information on endgame play, combined with the fact that Bioware had zero prior experience creating MMOs and the evasiveness displayed by Bioware employees when asked in interviews what effect (if any) WoW had on their design choices. Personally, I had zero desire to play another game where the endgame content was a WoW clone.
Every one of my friends who I have played MMOs with who did buy and play SW:ToR stopped playing after they hit the level cap, which leaves me rather relieved that I trusted my instinct to avoid this game.
In contrast, I DO intend to buy Guild Wars 2. Why? Because the Arenanet team is actually bothering to explain their thoughts, design philosophy, and game ahead of time to show me why I should spend my money and time on their product. If GW2 is a success, other publishers and devlopers might actually learn from the example and knock the genre out of the stale rut it is currently locked into.
Why would anyone plan to purchase a pay to win game like Guild Wars 2 and bash any other MMO?
It seems completely backwards.
Were you referring to my post?
If so I would like to point out a few things.
1) I said that I am not willing to pay a subscription fee on a game that will not hold my interest (or my gaming friends' interest) long term.
2) I explained that my decision on SW:ToR was based on the information that the developers/producers made available in advance on their game.
3) I believe that the industry as a whole would benefit from the approach of customer engagement and openness about their product that Arenanet has been following with Guild Wars 2. I would like to encourage this approach, hence I will buy the game. I will never buy a game again where the information regarding the game is basically 'its cool, trust us.' It is refreshing for me to see a company show "This is what we are doing, this is why we are doing it, this is exactly what you are going to get."
4) 'Pay to win' generally describes a version of the F2P model where a player can buy items which have a direct in-game effect on actual play, not cosmetic-only enhancements. Since Arenanet has specifically and repeatedly stated that their cash shop for GW2 is cosmetic only, it is a misrepresentation to call GW2 'pay-to-win' at this time. If the game goes live and the cash shop is NOT cosmetic only items will it justify a 'pay to win' label.
35% MMO of market standard + 65% Bioware Movie = SWTOR
I can't speak for anyone else but I think my mistake was imagining something more like this:
100% MMO of market standard + 35% Bioware Movie + Innovation in the future
I'll admit it, unrealistic.
They are trying to address the missing features, but I no longer hope for innovation in this game any time soon. At some point class story will extend (probably with 10 more levels), they will give players static items that go on pre-made hooks in spaceship. They will probably use existing ships for space but take the rails off. New planets will appear but will be the same thing as what exists now: a flow chart land of exhaustion zones and nothing to do except talk to the movie givers.
Every small feature introduced will get a movie with one of the dev talking heads acting like they just figured out the cure for cancer and built the pyramids in one day. Someone will say "the Emperor has no clothes on," and the crowd will immediately attack with the populist argument for why this model is just, realistic, and wanted by the masses.
Comments
I know why I have strong feelings about SWTOR. Its just how it affects me, and I don't expect anyone to agree with me, or change their opinion to agree with me. Have your own opinions, I have mine.
I'm seriously disappointed with Bioware, they delivered a bad game in my opinion. Theres nothing to do outside waiting for warzone ques, and running the two raids. No mini games(other than space, which pisses me off twice as much), and seriously kotor their sprpg had more mini games than their mmo. Theres no customization and the outfits look rediculous(I never played WoW cause I believe only women from the 80's should wear shoulder pads)
This is the most linear mmo I've ever played. I didn't notice the capital ships in the sky on coruscant because I never looked up, I was following my bread crumbs to the next target(I noticed it in a screen shot, and had to go back to look, its actually kind of cool)
Look, if your mmo is going to be as diverse as Call of duty, have more $$$$ing maps! Three warzones? Open world pvp (Ilum) was so horribly imagined that someones job should be lost!
If you ask any question of bioware they tell you its on the wall of crazy. Here, let me interpret what wall of crazy means in developerese. It means, "its on the wall of shut the $$$$ up and keep paying your sub waiting for something thats not coming"
I mean seriously, the only modest developer over their is gabe amantegelo(Probably spelled wrong), but the rest of the developers Zoeller, Erickson especially are uptight arrogant $$$$'s.
I am a balanced mmo'er. Killer=I raced to warhero, got the bm gear and subbed out the mods to stack crit and surge, but I can't do it anymore. Its not fun, I can't take a week and do some other pvp cause there is none.
Achiever=I got everything, but I dont' want to roll 8 alts for a different story so I'm effectively done
Socializer=Bioware gave us guilds, which in their game is a friends list, nothing else.
Explorer=I have every datacron and never once did I feel like I was exploring, sigh.
I've never effectively done everything in an MMORPG before in my life, two months into TOR and I'm done, beat it?
Voice over was not worth all the cuts they had to make to content. This is not EA's fault, bioware thought story would carry the game, it will not.
Unreasonable expectations. I was a long time LOTRO player, at beta etc. If TOR had been what LOTRO was at launch, people would've shat more bricks then are currently being shat. It works, full voice acting, instances pvp, OPVP (Albiet horrendous OPVP), raids, operations. LOTRO launched with 4 (Or was it like, 6? 7? ..GB/GA/Fornost/CD/URU/BG)instances across all levels and 1 raid (helegrod)
In conclusion, people thought TOR would be the second coming. As a fan of this era in the Star Wars lore, I enjoy it. Anyone who says it isnt star wars was just execpting harrison ford and darth vader. It is profoundly star wars, and I think people's illness with prototypical MMO gaming made them hate everything more than it really should be hated.
That said, I look forward to Gw2 launching and seeing if it really does change anything, or, like RIFT, if it just makes everything look slightly different so trollers think it actually is different.
I will agree that the innovators all seem to be the indies... the problem with that is that EA eats every indy they can and stops whatever they were doing to keep things as is.
I will admit I loved SWG before the cu/nge... some days you want to kill womp rats, some days I crafted stuff, some days i focused exclusively on space...some days I just remodeled my houses.... I also like DAOC.... not quite a sandbox like swg was, but hell crafting was tops, your own decoratable houses, and really really good rvr.
Swtor has none of that, and thats fine for some people I suppose, the story is good once through for a faction and class stories are great... what do you do after you hear/see all the stories though and grind out your gear? I am guessing that "real" space is the big next project they are working on, great... however if crafting stays the same as it is, then so what....grind ground, then grind space for best loot... ok done with that, what now? No one gets to make a business for themselves where people say go visit so and so, he has great weap/armor/droids/engines or whatever...
At the end of the day though, it doesnt really matter... this post wont sway anyone, all it does is let people know how I feel about the game. Is the game dieing.... no idea other than of the people that I knew that got it... like 1 is still playing out of 12... but again that states nothing as we are all fairly like in our tastes so no brainer that we arent hooked into it.
If you bothered to read all that, the only thing to take from this is for 5 years of development and a god awful amount of money, I expected more... not just a online single player RPG that you can group with other people on. The game was billed as a full MMORPG with full voice acting and cut scenes.... its got the voice acting and cut scenes.... it missed the MMO part. There was supposed to be more than just combat to do... I suppose that is moderately true if you consider a bad clone of starfox with new graphics, and clicking to send your minions on missions for tradeskill items stuff to do....
As others have said, its unrealistic expectations. people get all hyped for a new game and unless its everything the hoped for they become bitter.
GW2 is a good example. It better be like the second coming or holy grail or all the fanbois will shred it on the forums
There's a distinct difference between GW2 and SWTOR. ArenaNet is releasing tons of video that shows uninterrupted game footage instead of their Dev's talking about the game. EA knew they had a bad product, so they limited the information and confined it to short clips or had their Devs talk about the game. They knew in advance and lied about the features of their game. (e.g. 100 v. 100 PvP on ILUM.)
If you watch the clip, look how quickly cut together the footage is. Look how the people have to rely on what the Dev is telling you the game will be like rather than showing you with extended footage.
Now watch this for contrast. Which looks more engaging? Also, the Devs admit how they're fixing mistakes prior to release.
Re: SWTOR
"Remember, remember - Kakk says 'December.'"
Funny
I see these "GW2 better be something like second coming" only from people like you warning others from getting hyped up...strange indeed
Real fans actually know what the game will offer, with all its imperfection(such as loading screens, cash shop, over the top particles etc) so they wont fall flat on their nose at all
It's just people like you who will invade the forums once the game comes out crying out loud that the game is not the Ambrosy of MMO gaming...not the fans (or at least the sane ones)
SWTOR is different case - it was based on one of the most famous IPs of all time and so even the most casual gamers bought it, because they were overhyped over the 4 fancy CGIs. I saw their joy, I told them not to hype themselves over it because I did my homework and I knew what the game will exactly offer (and boy was I right! even about the shitty PvP since I knew bioware has 0 experience in that field), they didnt listen, they had their "STARWARS AND BIOWARE cannost fail! I dont have to look into it, they just wont" attitude and thus they were dissapointed miserably - It was expected, really
GW2 on the other hand, build its hype on gameplay vids, word of mouth and fresh ideas and they walked the walk...they basicaly did the opposite and thats why(along with my knowledge of the game) I trust them
I think I actually spent way more time reading and theorycrafting about MMOs than playing them
I'm not warning anyone about anything. I'm just stating how i see it. In fact i am hyped to the max for TSW
To me, if a new game is a let down, then i'm bummed. I move on. I certainly dont get all wigged out over it.
at least i actually got invited to swtor beta without having to pre order
It is not unrealisitc for customers to have expected a 2012 MMORPG, rather than a 2007 MMORPG with Cinematics. For the name and budget, people simple expected a higher quality.
Remove the Cinematics and the dialogue system (which basically is a paste from their older Kotor/ME/DA system), and the rest of the game feels like a simple reskin of WAR, a 2008 MMORPG).
So it is less about gamers being 'unrealisitc' and 'insatiable', and more simply about not producing the best quality product that they could have, compared to the rest of the market.
What a bunch of crap....
Gameplay released in August
Gameplay released in July
That's just two I found with a quick search on youtube. Both videos are at least ten minutes in length and is all gameplay footage.
It's okay not to like TOR, but don't lie and mislead. I followed this game for too long and still remember pre-launch very well.
Currently Playing: World of Warcraft
Are you talking to me or EA? Logic would dictate that you're speaking to EA.
Re: SWTOR
"Remember, remember - Kakk says 'December.'"
No logic would dictate that I'm refering to your post and that great lie you just told in it. Don't say that gameplay footage wasn't available when there was plenty prior to launch. At one time there was a stickied thread on the top of this forum that had many gameplay videos available for anyone to see so don't even try to play the revisionist historian, especially when we're talking about events that happened less than a year ago.
Currently Playing: World of Warcraft
I never said that they never released videos, I said that the videos were highly edited. And in these two videos you can see how the Dev's chaperone the viewer throught the experience. At one point in the video, the Devs are asked to turn the gameplay sound up. Why did they start without sound? Did they do that intentionally? Yes. Yes, they did. Because, as we know now, SWTOR has very little ambience or ambient sounds.
The worlds are lifeless and dull. The gameplay is static. The only thing the game has going in its favor is a somewhat satisfactorily written B grade sci-fantasy story. That is why SWTOR is being judged so harshly. The Devs promised one thing and delivered another.
Re: SWTOR
"Remember, remember - Kakk says 'December.'"
Currently Playing: World of Warcraft
this.
Unsatisfied customers spent $60 on a MMO only to find out they were playing primarily in their own instanced singleplayer game.
Let me get this out of the way first: I didn't buy or play SW:ToR.
I didn't buy it precisely because of the information that was (and wasn't) available before the game released. At this stage of the game industry, there is zero excuse not to give plenty of information about what your game will be doing ahead of time unless the developer / publisher is trying to hide something from the consumer, not the competition. The long lead time in development means that there is no way that the competition can 'steal your thunder' by changing their plans midstream and pre-empt you.
EA/Bioware was willing to give plenty of information about the SW:ToR leveling experience but very little about the endgame activities or PvP. The problem is, it is the endgame and PVP experience which justifies a subscription fee. A storyline driven leveling game doesn't bother me, but I am not willing to pay a subscription fee just for that.
What raised red flags for me was the lack of information on endgame play, combined with the fact that Bioware had zero prior experience creating MMOs and the evasiveness displayed by Bioware employees when asked in interviews what effect (if any) WoW had on their design choices. Personally, I had zero desire to play another game where the endgame content was a WoW clone.
Every one of my friends who I have played MMOs with who did buy and play SW:ToR stopped playing after they hit the level cap, which leaves me rather relieved that I trusted my instinct to avoid this game.
In contrast, I DO intend to buy Guild Wars 2. Why? Because the Arenanet team is actually bothering to explain their thoughts, design philosophy, and game ahead of time to show me why I should spend my money and time on their product. If GW2 is a success, other publishers and devlopers might actually learn from the example and knock the genre out of the stale rut it is currently locked into.
Why would anyone plan to purchase a pay to win game like Guild Wars 2 and bash any other MMO?
It seems completely backwards.
Were you referring to my post?
If so I would like to point out a few things.
1) I said that I am not willing to pay a subscription fee on a game that will not hold my interest (or my gaming friends' interest) long term.
2) I explained that my decision on SW:ToR was based on the information that the developers/producers made available in advance on their game.
3) I believe that the industry as a whole would benefit from the approach of customer engagement and openness about their product that Arenanet has been following with Guild Wars 2. I would like to encourage this approach, hence I will buy the game. I will never buy a game again where the information regarding the game is basically 'its cool, trust us.' It is refreshing for me to see a company show "This is what we are doing, this is why we are doing it, this is exactly what you are going to get."
4) 'Pay to win' generally describes a version of the F2P model where a player can buy items which have a direct in-game effect on actual play, not cosmetic-only enhancements. Since Arenanet has specifically and repeatedly stated that their cash shop for GW2 is cosmetic only, it is a misrepresentation to call GW2 'pay-to-win' at this time. If the game goes live and the cash shop is NOT cosmetic only items will it justify a 'pay to win' label.
Because some people will never fathom the fact that the MMO gaming world doesn't revolve around them.
Currently Playing: World of Warcraft
thank god
that game is dead and burried for a good reason
all hail MMO jesus
Stay on topic. Cut out the trolling and personal attacks.
35% MMO of market standard + 65% Bioware Movie = SWTOR
I can't speak for anyone else but I think my mistake was imagining something more like this:
100% MMO of market standard + 35% Bioware Movie + Innovation in the future
I'll admit it, unrealistic.
They are trying to address the missing features, but I no longer hope for innovation in this game any time soon. At some point class story will extend (probably with 10 more levels), they will give players static items that go on pre-made hooks in spaceship. They will probably use existing ships for space but take the rails off. New planets will appear but will be the same thing as what exists now: a flow chart land of exhaustion zones and nothing to do except talk to the movie givers.
Every small feature introduced will get a movie with one of the dev talking heads acting like they just figured out the cure for cancer and built the pyramids in one day. Someone will say "the Emperor has no clothes on," and the crowd will immediately attack with the populist argument for why this model is just, realistic, and wanted by the masses.
In the 5th stage of grief here. Acceptance
Survivor of the great MMORPG Famine of 2011