Originally posted by MaggonI really do love GW2 - But I must agree with this, even talked to some of my guildies about it - well first of you had a lot of skills in GW1 to actually choose from - but having to go out and capturing the elites was exciting - though it actually required a bit of work, I do believe that was part of GW1's exploration, and could have had been part of GW2's as well.I don't really miss the dual-class system thing, at all, never really used it all that much, but to actually sit down and make builds was one of the things I did a lot of in GW1, and certainly miss doing that a lot in GW2, atleast it seems a lot more easy to do in GW2, just with fewer skills >_<
GW2's metagame has as much depth as GW1 Prophecies. I wonder if everyone who is saying that its way more shallow never really metagamed for PvP. GW1s PvE metaa was as easy as playing a warlock in WoW
Blow the whistle! An affliction lock may have been the toughest class you could play for pvp with the largest pve rotation.
oooooh you played a hunter huh? No hunter could beat a lock worth his weight in salt.
Originally posted by MaggonI really do love GW2 - But I must agree with this, even talked to some of my guildies about it - well first of you had a lot of skills in GW1 to actually choose from - but having to go out and capturing the elites was exciting - though it actually required a bit of work, I do believe that was part of GW1's exploration, and could have had been part of GW2's as well.I don't really miss the dual-class system thing, at all, never really used it all that much, but to actually sit down and make builds was one of the things I did a lot of in GW1, and certainly miss doing that a lot in GW2, atleast it seems a lot more easy to do in GW2, just with fewer skills >_<
GW2's metagame has as much depth as GW1 Prophecies. I wonder if everyone who is saying that its way more shallow never really metagamed for PvP. GW1s PvE metaa was as easy as playing a warlock in WoW
Blow the whistle! An affliction lock may have been the toughest class you could play for pvp with the largest pve rotation.
oooooh you played a hunter huh? No hunter could beat a lock worth his weight in salt.
Apparently you aren't aware of the warlock joke about strapping styrophoma to your head and rolling it on the keyboard to pwn everything
Originally posted by MaggonI really do love GW2 - But I must agree with this, even talked to some of my guildies about it - well first of you had a lot of skills in GW1 to actually choose from - but having to go out and capturing the elites was exciting - though it actually required a bit of work, I do believe that was part of GW1's exploration, and could have had been part of GW2's as well.I don't really miss the dual-class system thing, at all, never really used it all that much, but to actually sit down and make builds was one of the things I did a lot of in GW1, and certainly miss doing that a lot in GW2, atleast it seems a lot more easy to do in GW2, just with fewer skills >_<
GW2's metagame has as much depth as GW1 Prophecies. I wonder if everyone who is saying that its way more shallow never really metagamed for PvP. GW1s PvE metaa was as easy as playing a warlock in WoW
Blow the whistle! An affliction lock may have been the toughest class you could play for pvp with the largest pve rotation.
oooooh you played a hunter huh? No hunter could beat a lock worth his weight in salt.
Apparently you aren't aware of the warlock joke about strapping styrophoma to your head and rolling it on the keyboard to pwn everything
That joke has been made about every class at some point. Its really old and childish.
Elites that are harder to get aren't a bad idea. The rest of the OP's post makes no sense. You're still making builds with the trait system and anyone who has invested in GW1's meta knows that for the hundreds of skills available, there's less than a handful of builds per class that anyone actually used for the harder portions of the game, and for nerely all of competitive PvP.
As for dual classing, it's a gimmick. What separates two classes from one another are skills, which means you could remove classes all together for the same effect (which isn't going to happen, get over it), so basically this just boils down to "I want more skills". That'll come with time, but it's never going to reach the point of GW1 because it was impossible for them to balance that, leading right back to the argument about a handful of builds.
I do miss heroes, though. I'm fine with them being gone, mostly I just liked collecting something that could actually do something, as opposed to minis which just hang about. However, BECAUSE of heroes in GW1, people didn't team up. In GW2 I team up regularly, for both PvE and PvP, and not just for dungeons. People recruit for story instances often, as they can be a challenge if you're not overleveled and/or prepared. If we had heroes, we'd never see teams, probably not even for dungeons.
"Forums aren't for intelligent discussion; they're for blow-hards with unwavering opinions."
As a GW1 player with around 10K hours spent in the game
Just think, you probably could have started a multi-million dollar corporation with all of that energy or cured cancer.
Swing and a miss.
Also skill hunting is the one thing that I think will need to be added in the future. Or better yet let us hunt for skills from mobs that are the same profession that will add something to our current abilities. Would give the option to hunt for different "skill buffs" or maybe even skills that have "slots" in them to add 1 or more buffs depending on rarity of the skill or toughness of the mob you obtained it from?
Like your 1 skill for instance would be a prime slot for this as they already have 3 skill chains alot anyway. So you could hunt a new 1 skill and it would have slots to add buffs to it. Add combo fields or splash damage effects, HoTs or DoTs. You could even hunt for a second and third attack to make chains with.
As a GW1 player with around 10K hours spent in the game
Just think, you probably could have started a multi-million dollar corporation with all of that energy or cured cancer.
Swing and a miss.
Also skill hunting is the one thing that I think will need to be added in the future. Or better yet let us hunt for skills from mobs that are the same profession that will add something to our current abilities. Would give the option to hunt for different "skill buffs" or maybe even skills that have "slots" in them to add 1 or more buffs depending on rarity of the skill or toughness of the mob you obtained it from?
Like your 1 skill for instance would be a prime slot for this as they already have 3 skill chains alot anyway. So you could hunt a new 1 skill and it would have slots to add buffs to it. Add combo fields or splash damage effects, HoTs or DoTs. You could even hunt for a second and third attack to make chains with.
What skills to hunt? You first have to add skills to hunt. I don't think A.Net will add more skills or professions because when they did that in GW1 - the game became totally unbalanced and it took along time to get it back in balance.
As a GW1 player with around 10K hours spent in the game
Just think, you probably could have started a multi-million dollar corporation with all of that energy or cured cancer.
Swing and a miss.
No miss. People can accomplish amazing things with 10,000 hours (which is over 24 hours a day for a full year). Just saying it is worth thinking about what could have been done with that time.
No miss. People can accomplish amazing things with 10,000 hours (which is over 24 hours a day for a full year). Just saying it is worth thinking about what could have been done with that time.
ive probably spent over 3,000 hours on these forums in the last 9 years
- but its more an offtopic subject that applies to any diversion in life... especially something like watching TV
I miss mixing up heroes to maximize effectiveness.
GW2 should have:
Made elites harder to get.
Secondary classes.
The metagame in GW1 was far far FAR superior to GW2 metagame.
150+ hours
GW was designed in the beginning with co-op in mind then it was redesigned making pve easier to solo now thinking back to vanilla GW (the first month from launch) was far superior to GW now cuz it did require skill to play now it just requires heroe's an grind. GW 2 requires all the above just without the need to think of what skill's you want buy or capture and you dont have hundreds of skills to chose from(thank god). GW an GW 2 are two completely different game's with no similiarities to each other in anyway, hell Tyria in GW 2 was completely redone but I'm not going to get into that right now.
Remember that GW1 and GW2 are two completely different games, and what worked in one may not necessarily work in GW2. While I do miss GW1 skill system (and the benefit of both being B2P, I can enjoy both), there were some problems with it. There were a lot of duplicate skills, which created a lot of confusion. There were so many skills that it became literally impossible to balance them all.
Really no skill system is inherently bad, as long as it fits into the game. To just rip the skill system out of GW1 and put it into GW2, without designing GW2 with that in mind, would have been catastrophic.
And we never know, they may add skill capture in a future expansion or something. I do miss skill capture.
As a GW1 player with around 10K hours spent in the game
Just think, you probably could have started a multi-million dollar corporation with all of that energy or cured cancer.
Swing and a miss.
No miss. People can accomplish amazing things with 10,000 hours (which is over 24 hours a day for a full year). Just saying it is worth thinking about what could have been done with that time.
Yes miss. The examples you used of what could have been done with his time were an absolute miss.
First off I am not a fan of GW2 at all. But you guys are comparing a game thats been out many years to a game thats been out a few weeks. Right now GW2 is not worth playing IMO, end-game is laughable at best. The game needs atleast one expansion, and I am assuming devs makes a worthwhile expansion, otherwise it will take more than one.
Theres also another comment in this thread that called gw1 a co-opRPG, while acting like GW2 was better. Quite the contrary, atleast there was co-op play in GW1.
GW1 for me had ZERO human interaction other than PvP and dungeons. The entire game was easily done with hirelings and then heros. Other people were optional at best, and hireling healers did their job better than players for about the first year of GW1.
GW2 is the better game, but there are parts of GW1 I wish had been added to GW2.
Originally posted by drakaena I don't feel GW2 is an MMO either. It's 3 separate co-op games.
please explain to me how PVE is co-op
GW2 is a persistent world - theres no dungeonfinder wisking you away to dungeon instances
A persistant world with no need for anyone, that can t be replaced by heroes/mercs, whatever you want to call them.
Almost any MMO could add heroes/mercs and that would replace human teammates for many people. You are acting like GW2 is the ONLY game such a thing could happen in.
while i like the idea of hunting for elite skills (because i was a big big fan of epic wizard spells and priest quest spells in the earlier edition of ADnD with the Tome of Magic) I have to say spending points does make it a bit easier starting out.
They can add this later I'm not worried about it.
However the point system for improving the characters was so confusing in GW1 there's no way any standard gamer would just know instinctively what the heck to do without scowering the interwebs for hours looking for builds. Glad that and the crappy early edition of WoW's talents trees are gone too. Less time wondering which ability is best and more time actually playing i say. If i wanted to use spreadsheets I'd be playing EVE
While I did like the skill system in GW1 because it was like building a Magic The Gathering deck, I think you have rose coloured glasses on.
Some skills were better than others which rendered bad skills obsolete and what you were left with was a handful of builds, with some classes have one or two viable builds.
Guild Wars 2 offers so much more variety in the weapons, class and race skills and traits. Your playstyle drastically changes from one build to the other.
this and dont forget all the duplicate skills. I loved GW1 but I love GW2 for more reasons.
First off I am not a fan of GW2 at all. But you guys are comparing a game thats been out many years to a game thats been out a few weeks. Right now GW2 is not worth playing IMO, end-game is laughable at best. The game needs atleast one expansion, and I am assuming devs makes a worthwhile expansion, otherwise it will take more than one.
Theres also another comment in this thread that called gw1 a co-opRPG, while acting like GW2 was better. Quite the contrary, atleast there was co-op play in GW1.
There was no Co-op in GW1 - you could hench or Hero everything. Where is the 'CO-OP' in that?
Duh, like when you didn't do that and co-op'd. Most games then don't have co-op, you can just solo it. Weird comeback.
First off I am not a fan of GW2 at all. But you guys are comparing a game thats been out many years to a game thats been out a few weeks. Right now GW2 is not worth playing IMO, end-game is laughable at best. The game needs atleast one expansion, and I am assuming devs makes a worthwhile expansion, otherwise it will take more than one.
Theres also another comment in this thread that called gw1 a co-opRPG, while acting like GW2 was better. Quite the contrary, atleast there was co-op play in GW1.
GW1 for me had ZERO human interaction other than PvP and dungeons. The entire game was easily done with hirelings and then heros. Other people were optional at best, and hireling healers did their job better than players for about the first year of GW1.
GW2 is the better game, but there are parts of GW1 I wish had been added to GW2.
Almost all mmo's can now be done solo, same with GW2.
I never played GW all by myself. Always at least one other tag along. It is the players choice, if you wanted to do all hench, great it's a choice.
Remember that GW1 and GW2 are two completely different games, and what worked in one may not necessarily work in GW2. While I do miss GW1 skill system (and the benefit of both being B2P, I can enjoy both), there were some problems with it. There were a lot of duplicate skills, which created a lot of confusion. There were so many skills that it became literally impossible to balance them all.
I agree say of about 150 you could choose 40 were reasonble to choose from.
I felt their real situational skills always should have been available on a secondary bar which you could slot/unslot in quest. That is what I was hoping with GW2. So if you came across something specialized you could use thee very limited but specialized skills. To me it was the next step in the GW1 system.
I didn't see this huge ass problem of them balancing the skills, GW1 was a very balanced game compared to all the rest, less RPS. All games struggle a bit with this.
I miss the hunting for elite skills as well, I hope they implement it later.
Multiclassing on the other hand was not really good, in that case they might as well remove all classes instead. Yeah, I played GW1 for about 6 years and while I did ude the feature back then I think that it never really were a good idea.
As I see it now, GW2 needs more skills, particularly elite skills. The amount a single player habe to choose between aint enough, and some more regular skills as well.
Once again adding skill signets and letting bosses once again have eliteskills you can cap would not be that much work in an expansion.
Rugular skills works otherwise better than in GW1, except that they are far too few.
Comments
Blow the whistle! An affliction lock may have been the toughest class you could play for pvp with the largest pve rotation.
oooooh you played a hunter huh? No hunter could beat a lock worth his weight in salt.
Wish TESO would copy progression system from either of those instead of going with classes.
Apparently you aren't aware of the warlock joke about strapping styrophoma to your head and rolling it on the keyboard to pwn everything
Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher
That joke has been made about every class at some point. Its really old and childish.
Just think, you probably could have started a multi-million dollar corporation with all of that energy or cured cancer.
Elites that are harder to get aren't a bad idea. The rest of the OP's post makes no sense. You're still making builds with the trait system and anyone who has invested in GW1's meta knows that for the hundreds of skills available, there's less than a handful of builds per class that anyone actually used for the harder portions of the game, and for nerely all of competitive PvP.
As for dual classing, it's a gimmick. What separates two classes from one another are skills, which means you could remove classes all together for the same effect (which isn't going to happen, get over it), so basically this just boils down to "I want more skills". That'll come with time, but it's never going to reach the point of GW1 because it was impossible for them to balance that, leading right back to the argument about a handful of builds.
I do miss heroes, though. I'm fine with them being gone, mostly I just liked collecting something that could actually do something, as opposed to minis which just hang about. However, BECAUSE of heroes in GW1, people didn't team up. In GW2 I team up regularly, for both PvE and PvP, and not just for dungeons. People recruit for story instances often, as they can be a challenge if you're not overleveled and/or prepared. If we had heroes, we'd never see teams, probably not even for dungeons.
"Forums aren't for intelligent discussion; they're for blow-hards with unwavering opinions."
Swing and a miss.
Also skill hunting is the one thing that I think will need to be added in the future. Or better yet let us hunt for skills from mobs that are the same profession that will add something to our current abilities. Would give the option to hunt for different "skill buffs" or maybe even skills that have "slots" in them to add 1 or more buffs depending on rarity of the skill or toughness of the mob you obtained it from?
Like your 1 skill for instance would be a prime slot for this as they already have 3 skill chains alot anyway. So you could hunt a new 1 skill and it would have slots to add buffs to it. Add combo fields or splash damage effects, HoTs or DoTs. You could even hunt for a second and third attack to make chains with.
What skills to hunt? You first have to add skills to hunt. I don't think A.Net will add more skills or professions because when they did that in GW1 - the game became totally unbalanced and it took along time to get it back in balance.
No miss. People can accomplish amazing things with 10,000 hours (which is over 24 hours a day for a full year). Just saying it is worth thinking about what could have been done with that time.
ive probably spent over 3,000 hours on these forums in the last 9 years
- but its more an offtopic subject that applies to any diversion in life... especially something like watching TV
EQ2 fan sites
GW was designed in the beginning with co-op in mind then it was redesigned making pve easier to solo now thinking back to vanilla GW (the first month from launch) was far superior to GW now cuz it did require skill to play now it just requires heroe's an grind. GW 2 requires all the above just without the need to think of what skill's you want buy or capture and you dont have hundreds of skills to chose from(thank god). GW an GW 2 are two completely different game's with no similiarities to each other in anyway, hell Tyria in GW 2 was completely redone but I'm not going to get into that right now.
Evil will always triumph because good is dumb....
Yeah, maybe it will have a shit ton of skills per class though. I hope
Remember that GW1 and GW2 are two completely different games, and what worked in one may not necessarily work in GW2. While I do miss GW1 skill system (and the benefit of both being B2P, I can enjoy both), there were some problems with it. There were a lot of duplicate skills, which created a lot of confusion. There were so many skills that it became literally impossible to balance them all.
Really no skill system is inherently bad, as long as it fits into the game. To just rip the skill system out of GW1 and put it into GW2, without designing GW2 with that in mind, would have been catastrophic.
And we never know, they may add skill capture in a future expansion or something. I do miss skill capture.
Yes miss. The examples you used of what could have been done with his time were an absolute miss.
GW1 for me had ZERO human interaction other than PvP and dungeons. The entire game was easily done with hirelings and then heros. Other people were optional at best, and hireling healers did their job better than players for about the first year of GW1.
GW2 is the better game, but there are parts of GW1 I wish had been added to GW2.
Almost any MMO could add heroes/mercs and that would replace human teammates for many people. You are acting like GW2 is the ONLY game such a thing could happen in.
while i like the idea of hunting for elite skills (because i was a big big fan of epic wizard spells and priest quest spells in the earlier edition of ADnD with the Tome of Magic) I have to say spending points does make it a bit easier starting out.
They can add this later I'm not worried about it.
However the point system for improving the characters was so confusing in GW1 there's no way any standard gamer would just know instinctively what the heck to do without scowering the interwebs for hours looking for builds. Glad that and the crappy early edition of WoW's talents trees are gone too. Less time wondering which ability is best and more time actually playing i say. If i wanted to use spreadsheets I'd be playing EVE
this and dont forget all the duplicate skills. I loved GW1 but I love GW2 for more reasons.
I would have been happy with a skill system like GW1 but without the secondary professions, and with a free rez.
But I think the GW2 system has enough depth to be interesting as well.
Duh, like when you didn't do that and co-op'd. Most games then don't have co-op, you can just solo it. Weird comeback.
Almost all mmo's can now be done solo, same with GW2.
I never played GW all by myself. Always at least one other tag along. It is the players choice, if you wanted to do all hench, great it's a choice.
I agree say of about 150 you could choose 40 were reasonble to choose from.
I felt their real situational skills always should have been available on a secondary bar which you could slot/unslot in quest. That is what I was hoping with GW2. So if you came across something specialized you could use thee very limited but specialized skills. To me it was the next step in the GW1 system.
I didn't see this huge ass problem of them balancing the skills, GW1 was a very balanced game compared to all the rest, less RPS. All games struggle a bit with this.
I miss the hunting for elite skills as well, I hope they implement it later.
Multiclassing on the other hand was not really good, in that case they might as well remove all classes instead. Yeah, I played GW1 for about 6 years and while I did ude the feature back then I think that it never really were a good idea.
As I see it now, GW2 needs more skills, particularly elite skills. The amount a single player habe to choose between aint enough, and some more regular skills as well.
Once again adding skill signets and letting bosses once again have eliteskills you can cap would not be that much work in an expansion.
Rugular skills works otherwise better than in GW1, except that they are far too few.