I played a warrior, an frankly there was only group content for me. I could solo the odd mob spawn, but it required alot of bandages, followed by a long, long sit down to regen hps. I tanked for groups, that's all I did. I'd sit at the zone line of a dungeon and look for group, for hours at times. Traveling could be such a nightmare that I wouldn't move for weeks, and only then if I could get a port to and from where I was exping.
It got to the point where it was just easier to kill me (played on Rallos, so my ranger friend would kill me at the zoneline), and drag my corpse to whereever we were grouping and my cleric brother could rez me there.
So hybrid classes looked pretty attractive to me at times. I did to be honest like a group that included an Enc/Cleric because I knew that all the cleric would really do is buff and heal (stun some maybe), and an Enchanter was going to buff me with good haste and mez, i never really got overly excited about who was in the rest of the group.
I really had only one way to get xp, so I never really wanted to risk other type of group compostions. I really freaking loved being a warrior though.
Originally posted by sanshi44 Originally posted by FoomerangId say Golden Age instead of Golden Trinity UO AC EQ DAOC SWG FFXI Those five titles defined what I thought mmorpgs would be about.
Those 6 titles you mean???
But yes i would agree with you there, (although i didnt play DAOC,SWG or FFXI) but i do agree with the first three, EQ was my favorite and realy hope they do it right again with EQ next, but we will need to wait and see next year when there gonna to let people try it at the fanfaire.
Originally posted by Ozmodan SWG did NOT have the trinity. I don't remember anyone ever playing a medic. Now most people added medic skills so they could self heal, but someone who's main class was medic, they just did not exist. For a good reason of course since you could only have one character per server, they had to have useful skills. Unless you pvp'd all the time, medic was not that useful a skill. After NGE when I had to turn my creature handler into a medic, I just quit the game, Medic was just a very unfun class.I respect your opinion, but the funny thing was how EQ's restrictive classes really turned me off, but I will agree you really had to group in EQ which was a good thing. Now a days, you turn on your looking for group flag, you might as well take a long nap.
You talking about NGE? Cu and pre-cu there were tons of doctors and doc hybrids. Remember you could max out doc and another profession and half of another even after that. Doctors not only healed and rezzed, but they could craft and sell buffs and stim packs as wel. it was a very diverse class with a lot of play options.
Originally posted by Ozmodan SWG did NOT have the trinity. I don't remember anyone ever playing a medic. Now most people added medic skills so they could self heal, but someone who's main class was medic, they just did not exist. For a good reason of course since you could only have one character per server, they had to have useful skills. Unless you pvp'd all the time, medic was not that useful a skill. After NGE when I had to turn my creature handler into a medic, I just quit the game, Medic was just a very unfun class.
I respect your opinion, but the funny thing was how EQ's restrictive classes really turned me off, but I will agree you really had to group in EQ which was a good thing. Now a days, you turn on your looking for group flag, you might as well take a long nap.
You talking about NGE? Cu and pre-cu there were tons of doctors and doc hybrids. Remember you could max out doc and another profession and half of another even after that. Doctors not only healed and rezzed, but they could craft and sell buffs and stim packs as wel. it was a very diverse class with a lot of play options.
I remember sitting in line for doctor buffs paying out my 100k and go hunting for good ingrediants for my Armor smithing....God I do miss SWG
No matter how cynical you become, its never enough to keep up - Lily Tomlin
All I ever hope for from every new MMO I play -- will it be as good as EQ. And every new game is a letdone, even a disaster.
Right path: EQ, DAOC, SWG; Wrong path: EQ2, AOC, War, GW2, Wow, UO, AC, everything else.
I am not saying those on the wrong path weren't fun for a time, but they never fufulled my desires. Each could only hold my attention for months -- not years.
EQ had the best classes ever. Period.
EQ had fun races, great grouping, the best dungeons (pre instancing and to an extent pre-raiding levels).
I would just like a DEV that redid EQ and added mechanics from DAOC and SWG.
DAOC added great melee mechanics (positionals, reactionaries, stealth, etc). DAOC had the best crafting and shop system system EVER. Home ownership. SWG took that home ownership to the next level, especially with being able to put it nearly anywhere in game and with the reasusability of nearly every item in the game in support of housing. SWG with addition of leasiure classes such as musician and dancer and medics (pre CU / pre NGE). Games need more of these classes.
The recipe for the next best game seems rather obvious to me. Yet we spent all our time building from the failures -- not the successes. Want the next big thing devs? Start with the pieces I describe above. Stop following the gimmicks. You'll never have players for years based on Wow, Rift, GW2 -- they just do not inspire anyone.
No apologies -- just how I feel.
And oh yeah -- the Holy Trinity is not Tank, Healer, and DPS. It is and always was Tank, Cleric, and Enchanter!!! And I like my gaming that way.
"I want something new, but it has to copy what I played ten years ago."
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Originally posted by Loktofeit "I want something new, but it has to copy what I played ten years ago."
Its been so long, it would be new again haha
Good point.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Originally posted by Ozmodan SWG did NOT have the trinity. I don't remember anyone ever playing a medic. Now most people added medic skills so they could self heal, but someone who's main class was medic, they just did not exist. For a good reason of course since you could only have one character per server, they had to have useful skills. Unless you pvp'd all the time, medic was not that useful a skill. After NGE when I had to turn my creature handler into a medic, I just quit the game, Medic was just a very unfun class.
I respect your opinion, but the funny thing was how EQ's restrictive classes really turned me off, but I will agree you really had to group in EQ which was a good thing. Now a days, you turn on your looking for group flag, you might as well take a long nap.
You talking about NGE? Cu and pre-cu there were tons of doctors and doc hybrids. Remember you could max out doc and another profession and half of another even after that. Doctors not only healed and rezzed, but they could craft and sell buffs and stim packs as wel. it was a very diverse class with a lot of play options.
Docs were buffers, they did not actually play. I can;'t ever remember grouping with one. They sat in starting areas and buffed people for money. Never saw a doc in a group, did not need them once you got their buffs. You would go to some kick off point, get entertainer buffs and doc buffs and you were good to go.
Originally posted by Ozmodan Originally posted by FoomerangOriginally posted by OzmodanSWG did NOT have the trinity. I don't remember anyone ever playing a medic. Now most people added medic skills so they could self heal, but someone who's main class was medic, they just did not exist. For a good reason of course since you could only have one character per server, they had to have useful skills. Unless you pvp'd all the time, medic was not that useful a skill. After NGE when I had to turn my creature handler into a medic, I just quit the game, Medic was just a very unfun class.I respect your opinion, but the funny thing was how EQ's restrictive classes really turned me off, but I will agree you really had to group in EQ which was a good thing. Now a days, you turn on your looking for group flag, you might as well take a long nap.
You talking about NGE? Cu and pre-cu there were tons of doctors and doc hybrids. Remember you could max out doc and another profession and half of another even after that. Doctors not only healed and rezzed, but they could craft and sell buffs and stim packs as wel. it was a very diverse class with a lot of play options.Docs were buffers, they did not actually play. I can;'t ever remember grouping with one. They sat in starting areas and buffed people for money. Never saw a doc in a group, did not need them once you got their buffs. You would go to some kick off point, get entertainer buffs and doc buffs and you were good to go.
Maybe you missed the concept of the game. You saw plenty of docs in hunting parties, they were the ones tearing it up as one of the brawler professions. Tk/doc was common. You only knew a doc as someone who buffed at the starport. Those same people also crafted all your stimpacks and when paired with a melle skillset, most likely outlasted you in battle. And you also needed them to get rid of health and action wounds. The fact that you called them medics leads me to think you primarily played nge so i cant fault you for not knowing about hybrids.
Originally posted by OzmodanSWG did NOT have the trinity. I don't remember anyone ever playing a medic. Now most people added medic skills so they could self heal, but someone who's main class was medic, they just did not exist. For a good reason of course since you could only have one character per server, they had to have useful skills. Unless you pvp'd all the time, medic was not that useful a skill. After NGE when I had to turn my creature handler into a medic, I just quit the game, Medic was just a very unfun class.I respect your opinion, but the funny thing was how EQ's restrictive classes really turned me off, but I will agree you really had to group in EQ which was a good thing. Now a days, you turn on your looking for group flag, you might as well take a long nap.
You talking about NGE? Cu and pre-cu there were tons of doctors and doc hybrids. Remember you could max out doc and another profession and half of another even after that. Doctors not only healed and rezzed, but they could craft and sell buffs and stim packs as wel. it was a very diverse class with a lot of play options.
Docs were buffers, they did not actually play. I can;'t ever remember grouping with one. They sat in starting areas and buffed people for money. Never saw a doc in a group, did not need them once you got their buffs. You would go to some kick off point, get entertainer buffs and doc buffs and you were good to go.
Maybe you missed the concept of the game. You saw plenty of docs in hunting parties, they were the ones tearing it up as one of the brawler professions. Tk/doc was common. You only knew a doc as someone who buffed at the starport. Those same people also crafted all your stimpacks and when paired with a melle skillset, most likely outlasted you in battle. And you also needed them to get rid of health and action wounds. The fact that you called them medics leads me to think you primarily played nge so i cant fault you for not knowing about hybrids.
Nope, started a month after the game was released and played until a week after NGE and I was serious, never played with a doc in a party, you might have, but the only thing we used them for was buffers. They were superfluous, with doc buffs and entertainer buffs you did not need a healer, hence there was no holy trinity in SWG. I stand by that statement.
No offense Oz, but you didnt play the same game as I. I grinded out 19 professions to get my Jedi unlock, and throughout most of the combat professions, I had doctor as my secondary (as did most other players).
Anyways, back to the original topic. I haven't tried MMO's after Wow:BC as they'd become too similar to inspire any sort of interest in the genre anymore. These days, I stick to popcorn games such as D3/LoL even though I'm primarily a PvE'er. I play them because I can rationalize that they aren't like WoW...
That being said, OP is entirely correct in that a game that mixed elements of EQ/SWG/DAOC and dashes of ARPG's (personal preference) would get me doling out cash yet again to this broke-diq genre of gaming. Anyways, I give it roughly 3 years till gamers finally hit that block I did. Then we'll finally have some decent games again...
I nearly re subed to a EQ progression server before I went Rift then SWToR and now for a month or so longer GW2. In my opinion what killed EQ was twinking, when I left I had absolutely everything and so sis all my alts on 4 different accounts. I do at this point in my life think EQ would be too harsh. Standing naked in PoK trying to find a necro that wasn't too busy, the death penalty REALLY sucked at higher levels and corpse runs naked would too many times end up in another corpse.
Anyway I totally agree original EQ was the best ever for me. I would sub again in a second and pay 25 to 35 bucks a month if they prevented twinks, updated the engine a bit and put in a LFG/player matching system. Oh yeah and mindwipe everyone that LDoN ever existed.
Originally posted by Ozmodan Originally posted by FoomerangOriginally posted by OzmodanOriginally posted by FoomerangOriginally posted by OzmodanSWG did NOT have the trinity. I don't remember anyone ever playing a medic. Now most people added medic skills so they could self heal, but someone who's main class was medic, they just did not exist. For a good reason of course since you could only have one character per server, they had to have useful skills. Unless you pvp'd all the time, medic was not that useful a skill. After NGE when I had to turn my creature handler into a medic, I just quit the game, Medic was just a very unfun class.I respect your opinion, but the funny thing was how EQ's restrictive classes really turned me off, but I will agree you really had to group in EQ which was a good thing. Now a days, you turn on your looking for group flag, you might as well take a long nap.
You talking about NGE? Cu and pre-cu there were tons of doctors and doc hybrids. Remember you could max out doc and another profession and half of another even after that. Doctors not only healed and rezzed, but they could craft and sell buffs and stim packs as wel. it was a very diverse class with a lot of play options.Docs were buffers, they did not actually play. I can;'t ever remember grouping with one. They sat in starting areas and buffed people for money. Never saw a doc in a group, did not need them once you got their buffs. You would go to some kick off point, get entertainer buffs and doc buffs and you were good to go. Maybe you missed the concept of the game. You saw plenty of docs in hunting parties, they were the ones tearing it up as one of the brawler professions. Tk/doc was common. You only knew a doc as someone who buffed at the starport. Those same people also crafted all your stimpacks and when paired with a melle skillset, most likely outlasted you in battle. And you also needed them to get rid of health and action wounds. The fact that you called them medics leads me to think you primarily played nge so i cant fault you for not knowing about hybrids.Nope, started a month after the game was released and played until a week after NGE and I was serious, never played with a doc in a party, you might have, but the only thing we used them for was buffers. They were superfluous, with doc buffs and entertainer buffs you did not need a healer, hence there was no holy trinity in SWG. I stand by that statement. If you played a month after release then you wouldve realized there were no entertainer buffs yet and doc buffs were crap because there werent enough quality resources in the game yet. Armor was garbage mostly bone available and some of the more advanced weapons werent even available on some servers because the resources hadnt spawned yet. So yeah docs were in high demand especially that first year because we didnt have the best gear being made yet and were pretty squishy on krayt hunts.
It;s remarkable...for the first several years of its lifetime, you actually had a tough time finding anyone willing to admit, in public, that they liked SWG.
It only gets more popular every day that it's gone.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Originally posted by Icewhite It;s remarkable...for the first several years of its lifetime, you actually had a tough time finding anyone willing to admit, in public, that they liked SWG.It only gets more popular every day that it's gone.
While I definitely enjoyed both EQ and DAoC immensely, I've gotta ask...what exactly do you think EQ did that other games need to go back to? DAoC? SWG?
I'm asking this, because it's easy to fall inlove with a game, and then just ask for a reskin of that same game. However, that doesn't really help anybody, and it certainly won't help developers create you better games.
There are some features that I agree all 3 did very well, but there are also others that I could point out some fairly clear problems with. Especially when it comes to the amount of longterm CC those games had.
I think Anarchy Online had some of the best originality. In many ways, SWG was and still remains unique in how you progressed your characters. But at the same time, I loved how everything in the original AO was stat based instead of level based.
While I definitely enjoyed both EQ and DAoC immensely, I've gotta ask...what exactly do you think EQ did that other games need to go back to? DAoC? SWG?
I'm asking this, because it's easy to fall inlove with a game, and then just ask for a reskin of that same game. However, that doesn't really help anybody, and it certainly won't help developers create you better games.
There are some features that I agree all 3 did very well, but there are also others that I could point out some fairly clear problems with. Especially when it comes to the amount of longterm CC those games had.
This is a fair question, i'll give my opinion on . Firstly, I think progression is far too rapid in todays MMO, admitaedly EQ was probably a little too extreme on the other end of the scale, however It seriously hurts long term appeal if you can literally be max level and have done everything in a month or so. Its fine to say "roll an alt" but most people have classes they prefer to play. Further if devs even try to keep up to this pace with new content the new content tends to be superficially different at best.
Next is grouping. I know MMOs are social games and "the content shouldn't force you to find a group", but todays MMO has gone the other extreme and makes grouping a pain in the arse more often than not (especially with the abundance of selfish/immature people playing these days. With quests/missions taking less time than you would take to form a group and no real gain except perhaps minor XP boost. Look at SWTOR, people join, do the mission and leave without saying a word. Now with GW2 no group is reuired to do "group events"... WTF? Just everyone in the area gets credit, I mean run by stick one arrow in something and get a bronze contribution which isn't terribly different from a rewards perspective than a gold. Remeber the effort to get your "Epic" in EQ? Many of the drops required were 15, 20 and 40 man raid events to get "part" of the stuff you needed for your epic...
There was another benefit to "forced grouping", idiots, griefers and selfish people were not so common because if they behaved poorly the community would sort it out (especially in the beginning with friendly fire on). Its more like people today want a single player game with lots of people to show off/brag to. Another problem is and has always been the rewards/loot. This is a tough system to design well but SWTOR was good for this the way the rolls were(for some reason no one really cared if you clicked need/greed whatver), Rift was probably better though, no one else even seen what you got. I am always so sick of hearing the arguments about who "needs" what more. Unless your a friend or its a guild raid, if I get something you "need"/want you are more than welcome to buy it from me at the auction house because I usually "need" in game currency. Seriously I played Wow for a couple of years when it first came out and I can't even count how many times I "had to" turn over an item to a character on the "need" argument only to later see that same person selling the item in the AH.
Still on the loot thing, "twinking" ruins games! This is one thing EQ made a mess of and I was one of the worst ofenders I knew. This is one of the things that kills the newbie zones, why would anyone hang around in a newbie zone? With a bank full of leet gear? You certainly have no real reason to hang around and group in that zone(with no "twinking" you'd need to try and get that leet drop for each character). Ive often thought a good way to handle "rare" drops would be to drop a class specific "equipment token and have it go directly to the persons inventory, "no drop" of course. It should also be character bound and NOT account bound. Sure keep the random trash loot, but that should be mostly tradeskill stuff IMO.
Oh and I almost forgot, "factions" are a must. One of my favorite EQ characters was an Erudite Necromancer and almost every city hated me and many guards I was KoS to start and had to work to gain faction to get in the city. It added another dimension that made you realize your actions had consequences. I used to kite the guards in Felwithe LMAO the noobs would try to kill me because they thought I was an NPC. Good times, my Bard friend and I could kite the entire zone.
All I ever hope for from every new MMO I play -- will it be as good as EQ. And every new game is a letdone, even a disaster.
Right path: EQ, DAOC, SWG; Wrong path: EQ2, AOC, War, GW2, Wow, UO, AC, everything else.
I am not saying those on the wrong path weren't fun for a time, but they never fufulled my desires. Each could only hold my attention for months -- not years.
EQ had the best classes ever. Period.
EQ had fun races, great grouping, the best dungeons (pre instancing and to an extent pre-raiding levels).
I would just like a DEV that redid EQ and added mechanics from DAOC and SWG.
DAOC added great melee mechanics (positionals, reactionaries, stealth, etc). DAOC had the best crafting and shop system system EVER. Home ownership. SWG took that home ownership to the next level, especially with being able to put it nearly anywhere in game and with the reasusability of nearly every item in the game in support of housing. SWG with addition of leasiure classes such as musician and dancer and medics (pre CU / pre NGE). Games need more of these classes.
The recipe for the next best game seems rather obvious to me. Yet we spent all our time building from the failures -- not the successes. Want the next big thing devs? Start with the pieces I describe above. Stop following the gimmicks. You'll never have players for years based on Wow, Rift, GW2 -- they just do not inspire anyone.
No apologies -- just how I feel.
And oh yeah -- the Holy Trinity is not Tank, Healer, and DPS. It is and always was Tank, Cleric, and Enchanter!!! And I like my gaming that way.
Didn't Smed say that EQ next would make SWG vets feel at home? Can someone get the exact quote, I think EQnext will have those elements in them; but until I find a source, don't quote me. I think he did an AMA on reddit.
I have to say I wouldnt have played SWG in the days. Everyone praises it, but when I went into the details of what that game was, it was in the core a boring treatmil game. I hate Tetris and I wouldnt have enjoyed SWG.
I also am surprised why UO didnt made this list. I thought that game was about as successful as EQ, and just like DAoC, it hasnt been remade ever since.
Lineage 2 has a special place too. Unfortunately, NCSoft has progressed L2 into an Aion clone now (which is ironic, since Aion came much later and wasnt as successful).
All I ever hope for from every new MMO I play -- will it be as good as EQ. And every new game is a letdone, even a disaster.
Right path: EQ, DAOC, SWG; Wrong path: EQ2, AOC, War, GW2, Wow, UO, AC, everything else.
I am not saying those on the wrong path weren't fun for a time, but they never fufulled my desires. Each could only hold my attention for months -- not years.
EQ had the best classes ever. Period.
EQ had fun races, great grouping, the best dungeons (pre instancing and to an extent pre-raiding levels).
I would just like a DEV that redid EQ and added mechanics from DAOC and SWG.
DAOC added great melee mechanics (positionals, reactionaries, stealth, etc). DAOC had the best crafting and shop system system EVER. Home ownership. SWG took that home ownership to the next level, especially with being able to put it nearly anywhere in game and with the reasusability of nearly every item in the game in support of housing. SWG with addition of leasiure classes such as musician and dancer and medics (pre CU / pre NGE). Games need more of these classes.
The recipe for the next best game seems rather obvious to me. Yet we spent all our time building from the failures -- not the successes. Want the next big thing devs? Start with the pieces I describe above. Stop following the gimmicks. You'll never have players for years based on Wow, Rift, GW2 -- they just do not inspire anyone.
No apologies -- just how I feel.
And oh yeah -- the Holy Trinity is not Tank, Healer, and DPS. It is and always was Tank, Cleric, and Enchanter!!! And I like my gaming that way.
Sorry but your wrong. The big 3 was UO, EQ and AC.
I disagree with everything you stated. I hated DAoC melee, it was fun, but it was slow and cumbersome. Never played SWG but I seen what it tried to do and I loathe virtual communities. I am here to play a damn game, not as a moisture farmer or cantina dancer. EQ sucked, it was boring, and had shitty classes with even shittier abilities. Not to mention you have invisible loading screens eveyr 30 feet which really took my immersion away. On top of this they made it forced grouping, and Spawn Camping has to be one of the stupidist design decisions since forever.
Asherons Call has the ultimate claim to fame from my point of view. They were ahead of their time when they did away with classes, forced grouping, and static spawn camping. To this day a company has yet to implement a questing system as robust and as indepth as AC. Also AC was the first and still only MMO that made the character feel like a true hero because he could take on 20+ mobs and if he was smart, used his resources wisely could come out on top. Plus the loot system is 2nd to none - to this day no one has come close to creating the perfect MMO as Turbine did with AC. AC was also the furst to implement what one could consider a perpetual leveling system as it took players years to reach the level cap. Endgame truely began at level 1 in AC. (its only negative at that time was the melee mechanics, although in depth with weapon switching, height and power indicator - it was mostly a boring 1 button press affair) If someone was to create an Asherons Call clone of 1999 with GW2 style combat I would be in heaven.
Playing: GW2 Waiting on: TESO Next Flop: Planetside 2 Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.
I agree and disagree with a lot of what has been said in this thread. I remember those games and the time spent in them, I long for something similar to come and grab me, hold me and not let me go... but returning to what they did is not going to provide that.
What I really want is a new massively multiplayer online game. I want someone to take a great game idea, great fun mechanics and then make it massively multiplayer. I don't want someone to go out an MMO using the same boring templates we've had for the last 15 years. I want something new, COMPLETELY new and refreshing.
Give me a massively multiplayer online game that is going to spark a new genre and a new generation. Give me that new feeling back!
Comments
I played a warrior, an frankly there was only group content for me. I could solo the odd mob spawn, but it required alot of bandages, followed by a long, long sit down to regen hps. I tanked for groups, that's all I did. I'd sit at the zone line of a dungeon and look for group, for hours at times. Traveling could be such a nightmare that I wouldn't move for weeks, and only then if I could get a port to and from where I was exping.
It got to the point where it was just easier to kill me (played on Rallos, so my ranger friend would kill me at the zoneline), and drag my corpse to whereever we were grouping and my cleric brother could rez me there.
So hybrid classes looked pretty attractive to me at times. I did to be honest like a group that included an Enc/Cleric because I knew that all the cleric would really do is buff and heal (stun some maybe), and an Enchanter was going to buff me with good haste and mez, i never really got overly excited about who was in the rest of the group.
I really had only one way to get xp, so I never really wanted to risk other type of group compostions. I really freaking loved being a warrior though.
SWG pre cu was the most fun MMO I've ever played.
It had total freedom and you could be whatever you wanted to be.
Yes, it had flaws but still, the best virtual world gaming experience to date.
I'm afraid we'll never see anything like it again.
But yes i would agree with you there, (although i didnt play DAOC,SWG or FFXI) but i do agree with the first three, EQ was my favorite and realy hope they do it right again with EQ next, but we will need to wait and see next year when there gonna to let people try it at the fanfaire.
hehe yeah I meant 6. musta been tired.
"Small minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas."
I remember sitting in line for doctor buffs paying out my 100k and go hunting for good ingrediants for my Armor smithing....God I do miss SWG
No matter how cynical you become, its never enough to keep up - Lily Tomlin
"I want something new, but it has to copy what I played ten years ago."
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Good point.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Docs were buffers, they did not actually play. I can;'t ever remember grouping with one. They sat in starting areas and buffed people for money. Never saw a doc in a group, did not need them once you got their buffs. You would go to some kick off point, get entertainer buffs and doc buffs and you were good to go.
Docs were buffers, they did not actually play. I can;'t ever remember grouping with one. They sat in starting areas and buffed people for money. Never saw a doc in a group, did not need them once you got their buffs. You would go to some kick off point, get entertainer buffs and doc buffs and you were good to go.
Maybe you missed the concept of the game. You saw plenty of docs in hunting parties, they were the ones tearing it up as one of the brawler professions. Tk/doc was common. You only knew a doc as someone who buffed at the starport. Those same people also crafted all your stimpacks and when paired with a melle skillset, most likely outlasted you in battle. And you also needed them to get rid of health and action wounds. The fact that you called them medics leads me to think you primarily played nge so i cant fault you for not knowing about hybrids.
Nope, started a month after the game was released and played until a week after NGE and I was serious, never played with a doc in a party, you might have, but the only thing we used them for was buffers. They were superfluous, with doc buffs and entertainer buffs you did not need a healer, hence there was no holy trinity in SWG. I stand by that statement.
No offense Oz, but you didnt play the same game as I. I grinded out 19 professions to get my Jedi unlock, and throughout most of the combat professions, I had doctor as my secondary (as did most other players).
Anyways, back to the original topic. I haven't tried MMO's after Wow:BC as they'd become too similar to inspire any sort of interest in the genre anymore. These days, I stick to popcorn games such as D3/LoL even though I'm primarily a PvE'er. I play them because I can rationalize that they aren't like WoW...
That being said, OP is entirely correct in that a game that mixed elements of EQ/SWG/DAOC and dashes of ARPG's (personal preference) would get me doling out cash yet again to this broke-diq genre of gaming. Anyways, I give it roughly 3 years till gamers finally hit that block I did. Then we'll finally have some decent games again...
Rompster
I nearly re subed to a EQ progression server before I went Rift then SWToR and now for a month or so longer GW2. In my opinion what killed EQ was twinking, when I left I had absolutely everything and so sis all my alts on 4 different accounts. I do at this point in my life think EQ would be too harsh. Standing naked in PoK trying to find a necro that wasn't too busy, the death penalty REALLY sucked at higher levels and corpse runs naked would too many times end up in another corpse.
Anyway I totally agree original EQ was the best ever for me. I would sub again in a second and pay 25 to 35 bucks a month if they prevented twinks, updated the engine a bit and put in a LFG/player matching system. Oh yeah and mindwipe everyone that LDoN ever existed.
Docs were buffers, they did not actually play. I can;'t ever remember grouping with one. They sat in starting areas and buffed people for money. Never saw a doc in a group, did not need them once you got their buffs. You would go to some kick off point, get entertainer buffs and doc buffs and you were good to go.
Maybe you missed the concept of the game. You saw plenty of docs in hunting parties, they were the ones tearing it up as one of the brawler professions. Tk/doc was common. You only knew a doc as someone who buffed at the starport. Those same people also crafted all your stimpacks and when paired with a melle skillset, most likely outlasted you in battle. And you also needed them to get rid of health and action wounds. The fact that you called them medics leads me to think you primarily played nge so i cant fault you for not knowing about hybrids.
Nope, started a month after the game was released and played until a week after NGE and I was serious, never played with a doc in a party, you might have, but the only thing we used them for was buffers. They were superfluous, with doc buffs and entertainer buffs you did not need a healer, hence there was no holy trinity in SWG. I stand by that statement.
If you played a month after release then you wouldve realized there were no entertainer buffs yet and doc buffs were crap because there werent enough quality resources in the game yet. Armor was garbage mostly bone available and some of the more advanced weapons werent even available on some servers because the resources hadnt spawned yet. So yeah docs were in high demand especially that first year because we didnt have the best gear being made yet and were pretty squishy on krayt hunts.
It;s remarkable...for the first several years of its lifetime, you actually had a tough time finding anyone willing to admit, in public, that they liked SWG.
It only gets more popular every day that it's gone.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Displacement sucks
While I definitely enjoyed both EQ and DAoC immensely, I've gotta ask...what exactly do you think EQ did that other games need to go back to? DAoC? SWG?
I'm asking this, because it's easy to fall inlove with a game, and then just ask for a reskin of that same game. However, that doesn't really help anybody, and it certainly won't help developers create you better games.
There are some features that I agree all 3 did very well, but there are also others that I could point out some fairly clear problems with. Especially when it comes to the amount of longterm CC those games had.
This is a fair question, i'll give my opinion on . Firstly, I think progression is far too rapid in todays MMO, admitaedly EQ was probably a little too extreme on the other end of the scale, however It seriously hurts long term appeal if you can literally be max level and have done everything in a month or so. Its fine to say "roll an alt" but most people have classes they prefer to play. Further if devs even try to keep up to this pace with new content the new content tends to be superficially different at best.
Next is grouping. I know MMOs are social games and "the content shouldn't force you to find a group", but todays MMO has gone the other extreme and makes grouping a pain in the arse more often than not (especially with the abundance of selfish/immature people playing these days. With quests/missions taking less time than you would take to form a group and no real gain except perhaps minor XP boost. Look at SWTOR, people join, do the mission and leave without saying a word. Now with GW2 no group is reuired to do "group events"... WTF? Just everyone in the area gets credit, I mean run by stick one arrow in something and get a bronze contribution which isn't terribly different from a rewards perspective than a gold. Remeber the effort to get your "Epic" in EQ? Many of the drops required were 15, 20 and 40 man raid events to get "part" of the stuff you needed for your epic...
There was another benefit to "forced grouping", idiots, griefers and selfish people were not so common because if they behaved poorly the community would sort it out (especially in the beginning with friendly fire on). Its more like people today want a single player game with lots of people to show off/brag to.
Another problem is and has always been the rewards/loot. This is a tough system to design well but SWTOR was good for this the way the rolls were(for some reason no one really cared if you clicked need/greed whatver), Rift was probably better though, no one else even seen what you got. I am always so sick of hearing the arguments about who "needs" what more. Unless your a friend or its a guild raid, if I get something you "need"/want you are more than welcome to buy it from me at the auction house because I usually "need" in game currency. Seriously I played Wow for a couple of years when it first came out and I can't even count how many times I "had to" turn over an item to a character on the "need" argument only to later see that same person selling the item in the AH.
Still on the loot thing, "twinking" ruins games! This is one thing EQ made a mess of and I was one of the worst ofenders I knew. This is one of the things that kills the newbie zones, why would anyone hang around in a newbie zone? With a bank full of leet gear? You certainly have no real reason to hang around and group in that zone(with no "twinking" you'd need to try and get that leet drop for each character). Ive often thought a good way to handle "rare" drops would be to drop a class specific "equipment token and have it go directly to the persons inventory, "no drop" of course. It should also be character bound and NOT account bound. Sure keep the random trash loot, but that should be mostly tradeskill stuff IMO.
Oh and I almost forgot, "factions" are a must. One of my favorite EQ characters was an Erudite Necromancer and almost every city hated me and many guards I was KoS to start and had to work to gain faction to get in the city. It added another dimension that made you realize your actions had consequences. I used to kite the guards in Felwithe LMAO the noobs would try to kill me because they thought I was an NPC. Good times, my Bard friend and I could kite the entire zone.
Didn't Smed say that EQ next would make SWG vets feel at home? Can someone get the exact quote, I think EQnext will have those elements in them; but until I find a source, don't quote me. I think he did an AMA on reddit.
Played - M59, EQOA, EQ, EQ2, PS, SWG[Favorite], DAoC, UO, RS, MXO, CoH/CoV, TR, FFXI, FoM, WoW, Eve, Rift, SWTOR, TSW.
Playing - PS2, AoW, GW2
I have to say I wouldnt have played SWG in the days. Everyone praises it, but when I went into the details of what that game was, it was in the core a boring treatmil game. I hate Tetris and I wouldnt have enjoyed SWG.
I also am surprised why UO didnt made this list. I thought that game was about as successful as EQ, and just like DAoC, it hasnt been remade ever since.
Lineage 2 has a special place too. Unfortunately, NCSoft has progressed L2 into an Aion clone now (which is ironic, since Aion came much later and wasnt as successful).
Sorry but your wrong. The big 3 was UO, EQ and AC.
I disagree with everything you stated. I hated DAoC melee, it was fun, but it was slow and cumbersome. Never played SWG but I seen what it tried to do and I loathe virtual communities. I am here to play a damn game, not as a moisture farmer or cantina dancer. EQ sucked, it was boring, and had shitty classes with even shittier abilities. Not to mention you have invisible loading screens eveyr 30 feet which really took my immersion away. On top of this they made it forced grouping, and Spawn Camping has to be one of the stupidist design decisions since forever.
Asherons Call has the ultimate claim to fame from my point of view. They were ahead of their time when they did away with classes, forced grouping, and static spawn camping. To this day a company has yet to implement a questing system as robust and as indepth as AC. Also AC was the first and still only MMO that made the character feel like a true hero because he could take on 20+ mobs and if he was smart, used his resources wisely could come out on top. Plus the loot system is 2nd to none - to this day no one has come close to creating the perfect MMO as Turbine did with AC. AC was also the furst to implement what one could consider a perpetual leveling system as it took players years to reach the level cap. Endgame truely began at level 1 in AC. (its only negative at that time was the melee mechanics, although in depth with weapon switching, height and power indicator - it was mostly a boring 1 button press affair) If someone was to create an Asherons Call clone of 1999 with GW2 style combat I would be in heaven.
Everything you need to know about Elder Scrolls Online
Playing: GW2
Waiting on: TESO
Next Flop: Planetside 2
Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.
I agree and disagree with a lot of what has been said in this thread. I remember those games and the time spent in them, I long for something similar to come and grab me, hold me and not let me go... but returning to what they did is not going to provide that.
What I really want is a new massively multiplayer online game. I want someone to take a great game idea, great fun mechanics and then make it massively multiplayer. I don't want someone to go out an MMO using the same boring templates we've had for the last 15 years. I want something new, COMPLETELY new and refreshing.
Give me a massively multiplayer online game that is going to spark a new genre and a new generation. Give me that new feeling back!