"it’s clear that Sony has no intention of slowing down, setting its sights on claiming a piece of the free-to-play MMO market. Our early estimates for the US market put the total spending for 2013E at $2.5 billion, growing 57% year-over-year."
"said John Smedley: There is no purer way to see whether you have a good game or not than by saying 'this is free, do you want to play it?'"
More irrelevant "facts" from the leading seller of F2P "reporting and analysis".
Also from that blog quoted by narius:
"One point of weakness might be the saturation of fantasy-based MMOs and their specific mechanics. In recent years it has been titles like League of Legends and DotA 2 that have provided the momentum behind free-to-play MMOs. These games offer more accessible game play that take place in player-version player sessions, rather than focus on exploration, narrative and other key fantasy aspects."
So according to SuperDataResearch, LoL and Dota2 are providing the momentum behind F2P MMO (?) growth ! No wonder the F2P MMO market is booming...
Which other F2P "MMO's" are included in the $2.5B predicted revenue ? Angry Birds ?
Yes, but the fact that someone would play your game for free does not mean that the game is "good", does it.
Yes, it does. Why would one waste anytime on a game considered "not good"?
The only issue here is what "good" means .. which is subjective.
It's funny because you have recently admitted to having played a P2P MMO for a year or so that you described as "horrible" and "not fun (for me, of course)".
Apparently there are those that would actually pay for a "not good" gaming experience. What a wild world we live in, huh?
p2p makes the whole difference. It is the sunk cost fallacy. Plus, there are much fewer choices 14 years ago.
If there are so many f2p offerings today, i doubt i would be playing a sub-par sub games for a year. Heck, it wouldn't last 2 hours today.
Right, there were far fewer choices in those days. But according to you, when you find something to be not fun, you just move on to the next thing without looking back. You state this many times a day on a very regular basis.
And no, I don't buy that you kept playing for a bloody year because of the time and money you put into this "horrible" and "not fun (for me, of course)" game. Not for a second, lol.
It would appear that there are some pretty big glaring gaps in your logic.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
F2P is a sham. It is a way for corporations to suck out money from weakminded people who sink more and more money into a video game. Granted not all, I would say even most, F2P players are like that, but they are who are keeping F2P games up.
It used to be that you pay a moderate amount of money to play a game. Then subscription based games came and you paid a small monthly fee. Now F2P is giving you the illusion that you are paying for free where as in fact it is driven by a minority of people, paying huge amounts of money to get in game advantages and/or items. F2P is bad and should be forbidden.
F2P is a sham. It is a way for corporations to suck out money from weakminded people who sink more and more money into a video game. Granted not all, I would say even most, F2P players are like that, but they are who are keeping F2P games up.
Funny, You can say this exact same phrase almost word for word and be talking about p2p.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
2.5b for the US market sounds about as I'd expect.
One thing I do think is coming is increased regulation along with fees / taxes on operators. As the cookie jar gets bigger, the hand will find a way to get a share.
Ken Fisher - Semi retired old fart Network Administrator, now working in Network Security. I don't Forum PVP. If you feel I've attacked you, it was probably by accident. When I don't understand, I ask. Such is not intended as criticism.
Originally posted by nariusseldon http://www.superdataresearch.com/blog/everquest-next-claim-free-to-play-mmo/"its clear that Sony has no intention of slowing down, setting its sights on claiming a piece of the free-to-play MMO market. Our early estimates for the US market put the total spending for 2013E at $2.5 billion, growing 57% year-over-year.""said John Smedley: There is no purer way to see whether you have a good game or not than by saying 'this is free, do you want to play it?'"
Thanks for posting more garbage from that site which has been shown time and again here, through debate, that it's data are at best misleading and at worst categorically false. Though I've no interest in rekindling that debate here. Any interested parties can search the forums.
Luckily, i don't need you to like me to enjoy video games. -nariusseldon. In F2P I think it's more a case of the game's trying to play the player's. -laserit
Originally posted by VengeSunsoar Those are MMO's, just not mmoRPG.
I wouldn't call them that personally, as M stands for massive, then multiplayer....Having 10ish people max is not so massive imo....Sure the pool may be massive, but 10 at once isn't. I reserve massive for games where say 25, 50, 100 people can all be in the same zones, interacting/playing.
So sure, you can call them that, but if you just go by pool of players, you could argue a 1 vs 1 game that has a match making pool as a MMO. I think it loses it's meaning....RPG just means role playing game...I think the first part is the more important.
Originally posted by goboygo Its not free to play if they are projecting 2.5B in revenue now is it.
Ha, ha. Simple but brilliant observation.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
"it’s clear that Sony has no intention of slowing down, setting its sights on claiming a piece of the free-to-play MMO market. Our early estimates for the US market put the total spending for 2013E at $2.5 billion, growing 57% year-over-year."
"said John Smedley: There is no purer way to see whether you have a good game or not than by saying 'this is free, do you want to play it?'"
Thanks for posting more garbage from that site which has been shown time and again here, through debate, that it's data are at best misleading and at worst categorically false. Though I've no interest in rekindling that debate here. Any interested parties can search the forums.
Drown that eel, boy!
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
"it’s clear that Sony has no intention of slowing down, setting its sights on claiming a piece of the free-to-play MMO market. Our early estimates for the US market put the total spending for 2013E at $2.5 billion, growing 57% year-over-year."
"said John Smedley: There is no purer way to see whether you have a good game or not than by saying 'this is free, do you want to play it?'"
Thanks for posting more garbage from that site which has been shown time and again here, through debate, that it's data are at best misleading and at worst categorically false. Though I've no interest in rekindling that debate here. Any interested parties can search the forums.
Ever hear of the old adage "You don't get something for nothing" ?
Most people saying "I never pay anything, I play for free" are full of shit. And just like most things in life, most will play and pay moderately and a percentage have (dial 1-800-I-need-help-with-my-addiction) issues.
IMHO in F2P I think it's more a case of the game's trying to play the player's.
"it’s clear that Sony has no intention of slowing down, setting its sights on claiming a piece of the free-to-play MMO market. Our early estimates for the US market put the total spending for 2013E at $2.5 billion, growing 57% year-over-year."
"said John Smedley: There is no purer way to see whether you have a good game or not than by saying 'this is free, do you want to play it?'"
LOL, I think Smedley is engaging in a good bit of PR there. I think any product or service can be better judged upon whether someone is willing to spend some of thier hard earned cash on it.....and more importantly would they be willing to do so again after having had experience of the product or service. That is not to say that free things can't be good, even great......it's just not a particularly accurate criterea for judging anything. Something good could be available for free and you're playing it because it's the best thing since sliced bread.....something free could be barely passable and you are playing it simply because you aren't willing to or can't afford anything better.
Originally posted by laserit ...IMHO in F2P I think it's more a case of the game's trying to play the player's.
Best post of the day.
Originally posted by laserit It's not free Your CNN content is payed for by advertiser's which in turn is reflected in the cost of the products you buy.
Second best post of the day.
Luckily, i don't need you to like me to enjoy video games. -nariusseldon. In F2P I think it's more a case of the game's trying to play the player's. -laserit
"it’s clear that Sony has no intention of slowing down, setting its sights on claiming a piece of the free-to-play MMO market. Our early estimates for the US market put the total spending for 2013E at $2.5 billion, growing 57% year-over-year."
"said John Smedley: There is no purer way to see whether you have a good game or not than by saying 'this is free, do you want to play it?'"
Thanks for posting more garbage from that site which has been shown time and again here, through debate, that it's data are at best misleading and at worst categorically false. Though I've no interest in rekindling that debate here. Any interested parties can search the forums.
I laughed out loud....
MMORPG.com is that magical place on the internet where if you don't want it to be true, then it simply isn't true. The Backfire Effect not only lives here, it breeds and thrives.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
i believe that if a game is very good, not just decent, very good then its worth the cost. On the other hand, no matter how good or bad a game is, it isnt worth the milking. I have never supported subscriptions but i will always chose to purchase a game over getting milked by microtransactions in a "free" game. B2P forever, at least until the sub based ones get back to reality and evolve from the generic crap we keep getting every year for the same price.
I hope that we have to pay for each life we use as a character; I would really like to see a move back to the arcade era. I really liked the fact that when I died playing Pac Man I had to pay more money to keep playing the game.
I think that the MMO market is moving in the right direction. Game companies should offer the gameplay for free and allow the user to purchase things like allowing their character to have running animations and animations for when a character jumps: purely cosmetic things.
I really enjoy free to play games, and I enjoy them because said games allow me to play it my way. Free to play games do not force me to pay for cosmetic things that I find useless like spell effects or textures. Instead, I can get the important stuff for FREE (how awesome is that)!
Anyways, I am really looking forward to EQ: Next because I believe that it will everything that I am looking for in a game. I have always wanted to play an eight foot tall Ogre character with charmingly good looks that could sneak up on people and assassinate them, and no game has allowed me to do something like this before. I believe that EQ: Next will be the next WoW killer.
Your shoddy satire brought on apathy towards reading through the various pages of replies before deciding to post. People like you are continuing to hold back progression, and based off what: pay to play flash based browser games and failed free to play models of the past. If you were too unintelligent to realize that flash based games are PAY TO PLAY and not free to play, well...you deserved your anguish and utter frustration. Anyone with half a brain would realize that these models aren't free to play and are, in fact, pay to win models under the guise of free to play in order to rope people into paying for the items they NEED.
Guildwars 2 (Last I checked.) and Planetside 2 are completely free to play game models...the latter of which works great in combination with their new Player Studio concept that lets common players make money off things they, themselves, design for the game. T-Ray is a Nazi when it comes to what's incorporated, so he ensures that nothing enters PS2 that doesn't follow suit with the feel of the game.
A Free to Play model can be done, and done right...we know this.
Hell, you could probably fund an entire MMORPG off a well designed player Housing system by having shop options for furnature and other vanity items. I can guarantee you that it would rake in a substantial amount of cash if the entire player housing system was done right and with depth.
That's just one option.
You could also give unlimited server transfers to players who actually subscribe to the game, along with other non-gameplay oriented perks.
The potential is there.
Edit:
I will admit, Buy to Play is a far more stable model...which is what Guildwars 2 did. It's free to play once you've purchased the game, and I do feel that it's a much more stable free to play model. However, Planetside 2 seems to be doing quite well after a rushed launch that could have been held back a bit...
Still a great game, and looking better as time progresses.
I've a heart of pure black jade, beating forth the ebon ink of shattered dreams. So spread those thighs my darlings, and let me hear those lustful screams... For twisting coils and silken strands, my venom coursing through your veins. It's my bliss you seek, to ease those troubled pains...
F2P is a sham. It is a way for corporations to suck out money from weakminded people who sink more and more money into a video game. Granted not all, I would say even most, F2P players are like that, but they are who are keeping F2P games up.
Funny, You can say this exact same phrase almost word for word and be talking about p2p.
Nope. In a traditional P2P, not the one's which have a cash shop and thus double dipping, you pay a small fixed amount per month and every couple of years you pay a fixed amount for an expansion. So there is no way for them to charge you more than that, which you have in so called F2P games which are often built up in a way to nickle and dime you if you want this or that item/bonus etc.
Sure not everyone needs to pay, and thus get a less than ideal experience, but the fact that they are projecting a 2.5 billion revenue shows that a lot of people are.
Comments
More irrelevant "facts" from the leading seller of F2P "reporting and analysis".
Also from that blog quoted by narius:
"One point of weakness might be the saturation of fantasy-based MMOs and their specific mechanics. In recent years it has been titles like League of Legends and DotA 2 that have provided the momentum behind free-to-play MMOs. These games offer more accessible game play that take place in player-version player sessions, rather than focus on exploration, narrative and other key fantasy aspects."
So according to SuperDataResearch, LoL and Dota2 are providing the momentum behind F2P MMO (?) growth ! No wonder the F2P MMO market is booming...
Which other F2P "MMO's" are included in the $2.5B predicted revenue ? Angry Birds ?
Right, there were far fewer choices in those days. But according to you, when you find something to be not fun, you just move on to the next thing without looking back. You state this many times a day on a very regular basis.
And no, I don't buy that you kept playing for a bloody year because of the time and money you put into this "horrible" and "not fun (for me, of course)" game. Not for a second, lol.
It would appear that there are some pretty big glaring gaps in your logic.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
F2P is a sham. It is a way for corporations to suck out money from weakminded people who sink more and more money into a video game. Granted not all, I would say even most, F2P players are like that, but they are who are keeping F2P games up.
It used to be that you pay a moderate amount of money to play a game. Then subscription based games came and you paid a small monthly fee. Now F2P is giving you the illusion that you are paying for free where as in fact it is driven by a minority of people, paying huge amounts of money to get in game advantages and/or items. F2P is bad and should be forbidden.
My gaming blog
Funny, You can say this exact same phrase almost word for word and be talking about p2p.
2.5b for the US market sounds about as I'd expect.
One thing I do think is coming is increased regulation along with fees / taxes on operators. As the cookie jar gets bigger, the hand will find a way to get a share.
Thanks for posting more garbage from that site which has been shown time and again here, through debate, that it's data are at best misleading and at worst categorically false. Though I've no interest in rekindling that debate here. Any interested parties can search the forums.
Luckily, i don't need you to like me to enjoy video games. -nariusseldon.
In F2P I think it's more a case of the game's trying to play the player's. -laserit
I wouldn't call them that personally, as M stands for massive, then multiplayer....Having 10ish people max is not so massive imo....Sure the pool may be massive, but 10 at once isn't. I reserve massive for games where say 25, 50, 100 people can all be in the same zones, interacting/playing.
So sure, you can call them that, but if you just go by pool of players, you could argue a 1 vs 1 game that has a match making pool as a MMO. I think it loses it's meaning....RPG just means role playing game...I think the first part is the more important.
Ha, ha. Simple but brilliant observation.
"Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb
Drown that eel, boy!
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
I laughed out loud....
You are confused.
It is not free for the whales, but free for me. "Free" can apply to some.
So?
LoL is listed in the game list on this site, isn't it?
Ever hear of the old adage "You don't get something for nothing" ?
Most people saying "I never pay anything, I play for free" are full of shit. And just like most things in life, most will play and pay moderately and a percentage have (dial 1-800-I-need-help-with-my-addiction) issues.
IMHO in F2P I think it's more a case of the game's trying to play the player's.
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
LOL, I think Smedley is engaging in a good bit of PR there. I think any product or service can be better judged upon whether someone is willing to spend some of thier hard earned cash on it.....and more importantly would they be willing to do so again after having had experience of the product or service. That is not to say that free things can't be good, even great......it's just not a particularly accurate criterea for judging anything. Something good could be available for free and you're playing it because it's the best thing since sliced bread.....something free could be barely passable and you are playing it simply because you aren't willing to or can't afford anything better.
it is old and it is wrong.
I finished Marvel Heroes' story content a while back. 30 hours of free fun. I paid exactly zero. Tell me how i am not getting something for nothing?
Heck, every morning i read the CNN website, and i am paying nothing.
It's not free
Your CNN content is payed for by advertiser's which in turn is reflected in the cost of the products you buy.
"Be water my friend" - Bruce Lee
Not if i don't buy the products advertised on the CNN page.
Just like F2P games .. someone else (the whales) are paying for me.
Best post of the day.
Second best post of the day.
Luckily, i don't need you to like me to enjoy video games. -nariusseldon.
In F2P I think it's more a case of the game's trying to play the player's. -laserit
MMORPG.com is that magical place on the internet where if you don't want it to be true, then it simply isn't true. The Backfire Effect not only lives here, it breeds and thrives.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Your shoddy satire brought on apathy towards reading through the various pages of replies before deciding to post. People like you are continuing to hold back progression, and based off what: pay to play flash based browser games and failed free to play models of the past. If you were too unintelligent to realize that flash based games are PAY TO PLAY and not free to play, well...you deserved your anguish and utter frustration. Anyone with half a brain would realize that these models aren't free to play and are, in fact, pay to win models under the guise of free to play in order to rope people into paying for the items they NEED.
Guildwars 2 (Last I checked.) and Planetside 2 are completely free to play game models...the latter of which works great in combination with their new Player Studio concept that lets common players make money off things they, themselves, design for the game. T-Ray is a Nazi when it comes to what's incorporated, so he ensures that nothing enters PS2 that doesn't follow suit with the feel of the game.
A Free to Play model can be done, and done right...we know this.
Hell, you could probably fund an entire MMORPG off a well designed player Housing system by having shop options for furnature and other vanity items. I can guarantee you that it would rake in a substantial amount of cash if the entire player housing system was done right and with depth.
That's just one option.
You could also give unlimited server transfers to players who actually subscribe to the game, along with other non-gameplay oriented perks.
The potential is there.
Edit:
I will admit, Buy to Play is a far more stable model...which is what Guildwars 2 did. It's free to play once you've purchased the game, and I do feel that it's a much more stable free to play model. However, Planetside 2 seems to be doing quite well after a rushed launch that could have been held back a bit...
Still a great game, and looking better as time progresses.
I've a heart of pure black jade, beating forth the ebon ink of shattered dreams. So spread those thighs my darlings, and let me hear those lustful screams... For twisting coils and silken strands, my venom coursing through your veins. It's my bliss you seek, to ease those troubled pains...
Nope. In a traditional P2P, not the one's which have a cash shop and thus double dipping, you pay a small fixed amount per month and every couple of years you pay a fixed amount for an expansion. So there is no way for them to charge you more than that, which you have in so called F2P games which are often built up in a way to nickle and dime you if you want this or that item/bonus etc.
Sure not everyone needs to pay, and thus get a less than ideal experience, but the fact that they are projecting a 2.5 billion revenue shows that a lot of people are.
My gaming blog