Originally posted by Vutar I think the thing that always makes these models hilarious is that there are people still deceived into thinking the game is free to play. People on this site will defend to their grave the model called free to play when in reality it costs more to play than a sub game if you want the same benefits the sub game gives.
I think it's hilarious that after at least 4 years spent on this site and 600 posts later you still pretend that F2P is something other than "no sub required to logon". That is fricken hilarious.
What is it the P2P proponents always say? It's just $15/mo. That's only 50 cents a day and if you can't afford that then you should find another hobby. So why are they so cheap if it comes to spending more than that $15?
Because it is pay to win.
I wouldnt blink an eye if the sub was 60€ a month, if it has to be because the server costs/game/service etc plus a nice margin of profit for them costs that much, sure go for it.
But dont try to sell me a pay2win system in a competetive game, this is absolute bull.
As the Diablo 3 guys recently said, its about feeling good.
You do not feel good when you finally after tons of grinding crafted that epic item and the guy next to you tell you he bought the same or even better item for 5€.
This completely ruins your feeling of achivement!
A lot of devs and people then try it with the fstupid argument that the entry into the game is so hard without a p2w.
But that is even more bull, do not make the freaking char advancement vertical.
Give player more options and not more power per level!
"Arcs are tradable currency, and it can be earned from some game contents or trade with other users. User in need of Arcs can earn it by selling the items that they produced during their game play through auction or PvP trade system."
And thus, there will be a black market. Instead of "gold sellers" there will be "arc sellers".
They will bot/farm whatever is needed to trade for arcs, which they will then in turn sell for less than what they can be bought for from XLGames.
You cannot stop the sellers unless you just plain remove currency from the game or sell it so cheap yourself that it would never be worth their time.
I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson
I and my friend all ready decided that we will not play any of this bad Pay models and we were waiting for years this game when first trailer came out with some ships battles .
Except that Xlgame introduce some outrageous Pay models look at the updates in last 6 months
Dolphins pink with some avatar navis tentacles on head Teddy bear bear Pirate Teddy bear pirates teddy bear on a pink dolphin with navis tentacles or starbucks inns this game is broken...
Its no more lore relates it overhaul immersion feeling is destroyed game is filled with stupid cheat junk as in all cheap F2p pushed to western korean games.
This game should have became a legend but because of Asian community where a game like Blade and Soul with big plastic ass and boobs needs 120 servers to keep all people who wants to play.
Still Archage could be a huge success in EU USA for it European medieval style . But this won't happen because of XL game next patch are very Asian like with dump kawai shit with retarded armors from anime or from AION . So yeah game is a fail
I will not even download it EVEN IF IT WILL BE FREE even if XLgame I will pay me to play this game I will not play it.
AND yea there will be 1000 of bots farming rare junk to sell and make tons of arcs
it will start slow but after a while bots will farm so much mats that price and amount for them will be crazy.. this model is just a greedy way to steal money from brainless people. Also F2P model is even more favorable for bots.
In Silkroad I was a simple player not a gold seller and I was runing 20 + bots I had hundreds millions of gold and I was farming even more to keep with prices same will be with this game easy F2p game have no limit from this point of view and no danger because account is free so yeah spam bots all they say is a lie I've play mmo for 12 years Ive see lot of shit but this is over the limit FUCK XLGAMES
TRION Please listen to community some people most of their lives here played video games and we are the customers we know whats better and I talk about grown half of gameing community not about these kids who are bored of 2 days and wants all ready press 1 to kill boss press 2 to loot. After Ru Archage fail you're the only hope if you pick same model BB you lose your first customer.
i have never had a monetization system literally cause my brain to ooze out my skull until now.
I hope trion straightens that clusterf**k up a LOT for the american one. Or perhaps just implements a nice simple monthly fee? (wishful thinking)
RIP Ribbitribbitt you are missed, kid.
Currently Playing EVE, ESO
Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and not clothed.
I don't think I'll play this now, and it's a shame because I thought it would be the only good game since Lineage 2. This is WORSE than a botfest or pay to win.. I could always get what I wanted in other games.. these new currency systems and bind everything you pick up/equip sucks...
Now it just like a mashup of Lineage 2/WoW with Forsaken World's god awful pay to win cash shop system that makes it so you can't play without cash shopping. (literally - all the gold in FW is from cash shop, and ingame stuff doesn't really sell)
With F2P as the main model, a lot of the design in the game goes towards how they can direct people towards the cash shop. Not interested in ArcheAge anymore, unfortunately.
With F2P as the main model, a lot of the design in the game goes towards how they can direct people towards the cash shop. Not interested in ArcheAge anymore, unfortunately.
It's starting to get that way. It's going to be sad watching what was a promising change for the better copying the same failed tactics that got the genre into the rut it's in to begin with.
Seems like this game will make it very painful to advance unless you pay $$$. No thanks, Ill take a look when it comes out, and if they do have a sub that makes sense, maybe.... but I guess for now Wildstar seems like its on top simply cause it does not seem frustrating to play.
The hype for this game has slowly faded, along with my interest. The pvp was going to be the reason I played, but at this point ESO seems like it will launch sooner.
Haxus Council Member 21 year MMO veteran PvP Raid Leader Lover of The Witcher & CD Projekt Red
The game could have been fun surely.. But F2P means that i won't see this one installed on my system.
IMO F2P is made for those extremely stupid few who will throw money at whatever makes it easier for them.. Those kind of people that noone ever wanted to raid with or play with because they sucked so hard.
The ones who say "DERP DERPDIDERP DERP DERP" and have a permanent spot for their head up in their ass.
All this does is make gold nearly useless and made Arcs the currency of choice since it offers the only real in game power grab. Which will result in pvp guilds investing in property and rent. Since they can get whatever gear they need withouit gold their is no need to farm gold and the price of gold will be pennies or just piddly things. It also means open world raid bosses will of course be protected and camped and what exactly can you buy Arcs with on the Auction, real money or gold because essentially you will end up with a game of have property near to open world raid bosses constant pvp war to hold that resource as well as jack up your rental prices and buy up all the property.
Any game that uses more than 2 currencies immediately triggers my BS alarm.
Multiple in-game currencies is a sure sign that the developer is trying to hide the actual cost of game items by making it very complicated to calculate the real money cost of the item. This is usually an attempt to fool the player into spending more money than they would really be prepared to spend if they were paying real dollars and cents. The more "currency conversion rates" that exist in the chain, the more the real cost becomes hidden, because the conversion rates will typically not remain fixed, except at the initial entry point where real money is used.
A game using multiple currencies will need a team who are purely responsible for developing and administering the multitude of monetization options. The more currencies there are to manage, the bigger the monetization team will need to be. I can imagine that a group like that could quickly become very powerful in "suggesting" (dictating ?) game development priorities and new content, because their decisions will directly affect the company's earnings.
The programmers, artists and game designers may build a fantastic game that millions want to play, but it is the monetization team that will determine the ultimate success of the game, because THEY are the people that determine how much profit the game will make.
Welcome to F2P, where games are designed by Accountants...
We have now reached the sorry point in MMO history where a subscription MMO made in Korea is released as a F2P MMO in the West. Our appetite for subscriptions is so bad that's what they decided to do. Talk about a turn around.
I understand posters concerns that a triple currency system would hide true costs to players, but it does address the gold farming. I don't see how you could farm Arc's in the same way.
We have now reached the sorry point in MMO history where a subscription MMO made in Korea is released as a F2P MMO in the West. Our appetite for subscriptions is so bad that's what they decided to do. Talk about a turn around.
I understand posters concerns that a triple currency system would hide true costs to players, but it does address the gold farming. I don't see how you could farm Arc's in the same way.
id rather deal with gold farmers then this asinine f2p payment model.
Don't know why they think botter/farmers will be limited at all. They will simply bot crafting materials and undercut every legit player or use the materials for their crafting mains to sell equipment, then sell the Arcs in the usual spammy manner.
"If MMORPG players were around when God said, "Let their be light" they'd have called the light gay, and plunged the universe back into darkness by squatting their nutsacks over it." -Luke McKinney, The 7 Biggest Dick Moves in the History of Online Gaming
"In the end, SWG may have been more potential and promise than fulfilled expectation. But I'd rather work on something with great potential than on fulfilling a promise of mediocrity." -Raph Koster
Actually i think mmorpg.com is not sincere here, i researched this topic and i am sure that this is an old interview, because Teymurazov producer of aa in Russia has just confirmed that there is no plan for dual or triple currency economic system for ru or korean release.
So there are 2 possibilites, first that xl games tries to push this economic system on trion or this is just old interview and arcs are like Dinosaurs. It is interesting read about, but they are instinct and will never come back.
I can see why russia revolted against this horrible model. After playing a true pay 2 play game (darkfall uw) I think I'm officially off the ftp bandwagon. Ftp should never be considered for mmos with open pvp sandbox elements. Maybe some kind of highly restricted trial but that's it.
Comments
Step in the arena and break the wall down
Because it is pay to win.
I wouldnt blink an eye if the sub was 60€ a month, if it has to be because the server costs/game/service etc plus a nice margin of profit for them costs that much, sure go for it.
But dont try to sell me a pay2win system in a competetive game, this is absolute bull.
As the Diablo 3 guys recently said, its about feeling good.
You do not feel good when you finally after tons of grinding crafted that epic item and the guy next to you tell you he bought the same or even better item for 5€.
This completely ruins your feeling of achivement!
A lot of devs and people then try it with the fstupid argument that the entry into the game is so hard without a p2w.
But that is even more bull, do not make the freaking char advancement vertical.
Give player more options and not more power per level!
Quack. Quack, quack, quack, quack, quack. It's a quacked up quacking quack of quacking quackery. Quack off.
"Arcs are tradable currency, and it can be earned from some game contents or trade with other users. User in need of Arcs can earn it by selling the items that they produced during their game play through auction or PvP trade system."
And thus, there will be a black market. Instead of "gold sellers" there will be "arc sellers".
They will bot/farm whatever is needed to trade for arcs, which they will then in turn sell for less than what they can be bought for from XLGames.
You cannot stop the sellers unless you just plain remove currency from the game or sell it so cheap yourself that it would never be worth their time.
I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson
I and my friend all ready decided that we will not play any of this bad Pay models and we were waiting for years this game when first trailer came out with some ships battles .
Except that Xlgame introduce some outrageous Pay models look at the updates in last 6 months
Dolphins pink with some avatar navis tentacles on head Teddy bear bear Pirate Teddy bear pirates teddy bear on a pink dolphin with navis tentacles or starbucks inns this game is broken...
Its no more lore relates it overhaul immersion feeling is destroyed game is filled with stupid cheat junk as in all cheap F2p pushed to western korean games.
This game should have became a legend but because of Asian community where a game like Blade and Soul with big plastic ass and boobs needs 120 servers to keep all people who wants to play.
Still Archage could be a huge success in EU USA for it European medieval style . But this won't happen because of XL game next patch are very Asian like with dump kawai shit with retarded armors from anime or from AION . So yeah game is a fail
I will not even download it EVEN IF IT WILL BE FREE even if XLgame I will pay me to play this game I will not play it.
AND yea there will be 1000 of bots farming rare junk to sell and make tons of arcs
it will start slow but after a while bots will farm so much mats that price and amount for them will be crazy.. this model is just a greedy way to steal money from brainless people. Also F2P model is even more favorable for bots.
In Silkroad I was a simple player not a gold seller and I was runing 20 + bots I had hundreds millions of gold and I was farming even more to keep with prices same will be with this game easy F2p game have no limit from this point of view and no danger because account is free so yeah spam bots all they say is a lie I've play mmo for 12 years Ive see lot of shit but this is over the limit FUCK XLGAMES
TRION Please listen to community some people most of their lives here played video games and we are the customers we know whats better and I talk about grown half of gameing community not about these kids who are bored of 2 days and wants all ready press 1 to kill boss press 2 to loot. After Ru Archage fail you're the only hope if you pick same model BB you lose your first customer.
Trion if you fail at this game your dead
i have never had a monetization system literally cause my brain to ooze out my skull until now.
I hope trion straightens that clusterf**k up a LOT for the american one. Or perhaps just implements a nice simple monthly fee? (wishful thinking)
RIP Ribbitribbitt you are missed, kid.
Currently Playing EVE, ESO
Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and not clothed.
Dwight D Eisenhower
My optimism wears heavy boots and is loud.
Henry Rollins
I don't think I'll play this now, and it's a shame because I thought it would be the only good game since Lineage 2. This is WORSE than a botfest or pay to win.. I could always get what I wanted in other games.. these new currency systems and bind everything you pick up/equip sucks...
Now it just like a mashup of Lineage 2/WoW with Forsaken World's god awful pay to win cash shop system that makes it so you can't play without cash shopping. (literally - all the gold in FW is from cash shop, and ingame stuff doesn't really sell)
Plain subscription > Free To Play.
With F2P as the main model, a lot of the design in the game goes towards how they can direct people towards the cash shop. Not interested in ArcheAge anymore, unfortunately.
It's starting to get that way. It's going to be sad watching what was a promising change for the better copying the same failed tactics that got the genre into the rut it's in to begin with.
21 year MMO veteran
PvP Raid Leader
Lover of The Witcher & CD Projekt Red
But F2P means that i won't see this one installed on my system.
IMO F2P is made for those extremely stupid few who will throw money at whatever makes it easier for them.. Those kind of people that noone ever wanted to raid with or play with because they sucked so hard.
The ones who say "DERP DERPDIDERP DERP DERP" and have a permanent spot for their head up in their ass.
Any game that uses more than 2 currencies immediately triggers my BS alarm.
Multiple in-game currencies is a sure sign that the developer is trying to hide the actual cost of game items by making it very complicated to calculate the real money cost of the item. This is usually an attempt to fool the player into spending more money than they would really be prepared to spend if they were paying real dollars and cents. The more "currency conversion rates" that exist in the chain, the more the real cost becomes hidden, because the conversion rates will typically not remain fixed, except at the initial entry point where real money is used.
A game using multiple currencies will need a team who are purely responsible for developing and administering the multitude of monetization options. The more currencies there are to manage, the bigger the monetization team will need to be. I can imagine that a group like that could quickly become very powerful in "suggesting" (dictating ?) game development priorities and new content, because their decisions will directly affect the company's earnings.
The programmers, artists and game designers may build a fantastic game that millions want to play, but it is the monetization team that will determine the ultimate success of the game, because THEY are the people that determine how much profit the game will make.
Welcome to F2P, where games are designed by Accountants...
We have now reached the sorry point in MMO history where a subscription MMO made in Korea is released as a F2P MMO in the West. Our appetite for subscriptions is so bad that's what they decided to do. Talk about a turn around.
I understand posters concerns that a triple currency system would hide true costs to players, but it does address the gold farming. I don't see how you could farm Arc's in the same way.
I don't know for sure, as I didn't like GW2 enough to use their system, but sounds a little like their system.
I doubt people will revolt against it, seems about like everything else that is f2p.
id rather deal with gold farmers then this asinine f2p payment model.
"If MMORPG players were around when God said, "Let their be light" they'd have called the light gay, and plunged the universe back into darkness by squatting their nutsacks over it."
-Luke McKinney, The 7 Biggest Dick Moves in the History of Online Gaming
"In the end, SWG may have been more potential and promise than fulfilled expectation. But I'd rather work on something with great potential than on fulfilling a promise of mediocrity."
-Raph Koster
Actually i think mmorpg.com is not sincere here, i researched this topic and i am sure that this is an old interview, because Teymurazov producer of aa in Russia has just confirmed that there is no plan for dual or triple currency economic system for ru or korean release.
So there are 2 possibilites, first that xl games tries to push this economic system on trion or this is just old interview and arcs are like Dinosaurs. It is interesting read about, but they are instinct and will never come back.