The combat is the only decent part of this game. I like movement during "casting" i like to dodge, i like to aim AoE effects on the ground, etc, so the combat suits me well.
However, I agree with the OP in every other point. WHY ON EARTH is there a leveling system, and WHY is it even called an RPG, when there's barely any PROGRESSION at all, almost EVERYTHING scales to your level. This constant difficulty is killing the RPG aspect of the game. I want to see my character improving compared to the environment. The events and the replacement of a questing system is WORSE than the actual questing system, since in GW2, there's basically no story behind everything at all. You get one or two sentences for every activity and thats it. It's extremely repetitive, yes, even more than the actual questing system. I couldnt even get to cap level, left both characters at around level 30. GW2 is a great game if you want to get healed from MMO obssession. It's the most boring, unattractive and repetitive MMO ever made.
So you missed:
* Dungeons
* Crafting (Exo/Ascended)
* Fractals
And you complain of lack of progression...hmm.
No, he was smart enough to realize that everything else was a waste of time. I actually got to level 50 and I wish I had stopped at 30. There is no progression on GW2
The combat is the only decent part of this game. I like movement during "casting" i like to dodge, i like to aim AoE effects on the ground, etc, so the combat suits me well.
However, I agree with the OP in every other point. WHY ON EARTH is there a leveling system, and WHY is it even called an RPG, when there's barely any PROGRESSION at all, almost EVERYTHING scales to your level. This constant difficulty is killing the RPG aspect of the game. I want to see my character improving compared to the environment. The events and the replacement of a questing system is WORSE than the actual questing system, since in GW2, there's basically no story behind everything at all. You get one or two sentences for every activity and thats it. It's extremely repetitive, yes, even more than the actual questing system. I couldnt even get to cap level, left both characters at around level 30. GW2 is a great game if you want to get healed from MMO obssession. It's the most boring, unattractive and repetitive MMO ever made.
So you missed:
* Dungeons
* Crafting (Exo/Ascended)
* Fractals
And you complain of lack of progression...hmm.
No, he was smart enough to realize that everything else was a waste of time. I actually got to level 50 and I wish I had stopped at 30. There is no progression on GW2
Thats a strange feeling.
I can understand someone go all content and feel that there is nothing left to do(to progress on), but it sounded like "i don't like the game, therefore there's nothing to do..."
now: GW2 (11 80s). Dark Souls 2. future: Mount&Blade 2 BannerLord. "Bro, do your even fractal?" Recommends: Guild Wars 2, Dark Souls, Mount&Blade: Warband, Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning.
Originally posted by Kenaoshi Originally posted by RandaynOriginally posted by KenaoshiOriginally posted by ThillianThe combat is the only decent part of this game. I like movement during "casting" i like to dodge, i like to aim AoE effects on the ground, etc, so the combat suits me well. However, I agree with the OP in every other point. WHY ON EARTH is there a leveling system, and WHY is it even called an RPG, when there's barely any PROGRESSION at all, almost EVERYTHING scales to your level. This constant difficulty is killing the RPG aspect of the game. I want to see my character improving compared to the environment. The events and the replacement of a questing system is WORSE than the actual questing system, since in GW2, there's basically no story behind everything at all. You get one or two sentences for every activity and thats it. It's extremely repetitive, yes, even more than the actual questing system. I couldnt even get to cap level, left both characters at around level 30. GW2 is a great game if you want to get healed from MMO obssession. It's the most boring, unattractive and repetitive MMO ever made.
So you missed:* Dungeons* Crafting (Exo/Ascended)* FractalsAnd you complain of lack of progression...hmm.No, he was smart enough to realize that everything else was a waste of time. I actually got to level 50 and I wish I had stopped at 30. There is no progression on GW2Thats a strange feeling.
I can understand someone go all content and feel that there is nothing left to do(to progress on), but it sounded like "i don't like the game, therefore there's nothing to do..."
That's what I saw too. There is content and there is progression. Not liking it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
The combat is the only decent part of this game. I like movement during "casting" i like to dodge, i like to aim AoE effects on the ground, etc, so the combat suits me well.
However, I agree with the OP in every other point. WHY ON EARTH is there a leveling system, and WHY is it even called an RPG, when there's barely any PROGRESSION at all, almost EVERYTHING scales to your level. This constant difficulty is killing the RPG aspect of the game. I want to see my character improving compared to the environment. The events and the replacement of a questing system is WORSE than the actual questing system, since in GW2, there's basically no story behind everything at all. You get one or two sentences for every activity and thats it. It's extremely repetitive, yes, even more than the actual questing system. I couldnt even get to cap level, left both characters at around level 30. GW2 is a great game if you want to get healed from MMO obssession. It's the most boring, unattractive and repetitive MMO ever made.
So you missed:
* Dungeons
* Crafting (Exo/Ascended)
* Fractals
And you complain of lack of progression...hmm.
No, he was smart enough to realize that everything else was a waste of time. I actually got to level 50 and I wish I had stopped at 30. There is no progression on GW2
I'm about to rant as someone who actually likes the game and am leveling to max currently 65 on a few toons.
Quests are about as innovative as WoW's graphics are. They didn't change anything other than you don't go to a
Great, yes?
And you suggest ... what?
- I wouldn't lie to my player base and actually spend my time trying to make the generic quests I offer in some manner interesting
And you would change ... to what?
- I would actually have people from their massive development team spend actual time on the quests so we don't rehash them in every zone as that would create repetition. That would bore people and leveling in a MMO is bad enough without being mind numbing while doing so.
And which change do you suggest to be better?
- remove tab targeting completely, make it skill based similar to TERA with the speed of Neverwinter MMO which is really fluent and fast; I like that. It keeps action mobile and quick moving. Smaller health bars and more damage. Yet what I would do is pointless they game is already made and no one from their team cares...
- remove tab targeting completely, make it skill based similar to TERA with the speed of Neverwinter MMO which is really fluent and fast; I like that. It keeps action mobile and quick moving. Smaller health bars and more damage. Yet what I would do is pointless they game is already made and no one from their team cares...
etc etc ....
If you were actually as familiar with the combat in GW2 you'd realize that with the skills in the game you need a targeting system in place. Having the targeting actually adds more versatility to the skills than you'd get otherwise. For example, the mesmer utility Feedback. Basically it creates a bubble around your target that reflects projectiles back to whomever fired them. However, if you don't have a target feedback works differently... it will lay the bubble directly ahead of you at a set distance. So you have a choice... place the bubble around a target specifically or place it at a set location, say between you and a group of enemies about to fire at you. Removing a tab target system removes flexibility with the skills. Phantasms and clones are another that require a target (and that target to be in range). You select a target, fire off a couple clones and/or phantasms and you now have the option to switch targets while your little ones stay engaged on the initial target. Without a targeting system they wouldn't know who to attack or you'd have range considerations. Even if they always attacked what you were attacking that's again versatility removed from the game.
Having a combat that includes, but isn't reliant on, a targeting system actually gives you skills with far greater versatility and options and a target-free system or one that solely relies on a tab target.
GW2 would've have been a better single player game honestly. Players act just like bots running around assisting you with kills then never saying a word as they run to the next heart, which people seem to think are totally different from quest grinding for some reason.
Wow, started reading this thread, wanted to comment, went through sign up(which required a little more information than I thought needed), and it got 5 more pages added in that time, must be a topic close to many a gamers heart.
My problem with GW2 was I couldn't do the things I wanted to do, mainly dungeons, because I wasn't 80, I stopped at 76, just got tired of looking for dynamic events, and got tired of being forced to use a bow on my warrior to survive.
But yeah, you get to 36, or whatever level the 1st dungeon opens up, CONGRATULATIONS! You cannot run this dungeon because you are not an 80!!! come back when you've leveled up. No point pvping, because ur gear sucks, so you just get owned anyway.
So yeah my main issue is the down leveling, it really ruins the game for people leveling imo, because all I was able to do was quest look for events, both of which got old fast.
Originally posted by fantasyfreak112 GW2 would've have been a better single player game honestly. Players act just like bots running around assisting you with kills then never saying a word as they run to the next heart, which people seem to think are totally different from quest grinding for some reason.
Hearts were added after the fact because that's how players were trained in other MMOs, to run around like bots from one quest hub to the next, skipping any content they didn't have a quest for. The game originally didn't have hearts and people simply didn't realize they could get involved without a quest telling them to.
Combat is not innovative and barely skill based... I mean BARELY any improvement over the vintage style of spam.
I only played GW2 for around 2 months and I can tell you that you are wrong on this big. And before I explain, the reason why I only palyed for that amount of time was due to my guild not sticking around and getting deeper into TSWs raids at the time.
People stating that GW2s combat was not deep and just spam never figured out the F keys and the ability to switch stance/builds. I played an Elementalist all the way to 80 and that class was deep and very hard to master. Learning to continually swap all four elements to keep buffs up, heals going, CCs on while damaging was extremely difficult.
Not to mention watching those videos of one elementalist taking on around 10 people at the same time in WvW, holding them off for 8 minutes, killing most of them before finally dying.
Most people are so used to spam and face rolling that they never learned its real depth and flexibility.
I'm about to rant as someone who actually likes the game and am leveling to max currently 65 on a few toons.
Quests are about as innovative as WoW's graphics are. They didn't change anything other than you don't go to a hub before the quest start. Now you kill an unnumbered amount of people about 20-30 per heart I'd say; or the innovative part... you throw water on a cabbage or something... now you won't get loot or exp from doing that but you can technically complete the quest that way. As an example of course as there are over a hundred rehashed things to do.
and point B on the same subject... all they do are rehash the same quests from level 1-80... it's the same crap over and over and over... cabbage turns to pumpkin... ogre turns to bandit; On top of being one of the lowest least gratifying leveling experiences I've ever experienced.
Combat is not innovative and barely skill based... I mean BARELY any improvement over the vintage style of spam. Movement plays a role in but I've seen my fair share of attacks do 180 degree curves to hit me even though I roll. It's for the most part the vintage system without the ability to stand face to face with the enemy without taking substantially more damage; mostly noticed against veterans or such.
Removing the trinity was a complete joke because the only thing they removed... was the healer. That's it... you still build tanky to tank champions for groups. Only difference is you die because there aren't powerful ally heals on low cd. Bravo... So innovative.
I won't even get into PvP although there's plenty negative I could say I'll wait until I experience all aspects of it at 80.
Sorry I'm raging time to get back to leveling.
Could you give us an example of a game that does questing better?
The combat is the only decent part of this game. I like movement during "casting" i like to dodge, i like to aim AoE effects on the ground, etc, so the combat suits me well.
However, I agree with the OP in every other point. WHY ON EARTH is there a leveling system, and WHY is it even called an RPG, when there's barely any PROGRESSION at all, almost EVERYTHING scales to your level. This constant difficulty is killing the RPG aspect of the game. I want to see my character improving compared to the environment. The events and the replacement of a questing system is WORSE than the actual questing system, since in GW2, there's basically no story behind everything at all. You get one or two sentences for every activity and thats it. It's extremely repetitive, yes, even more than the actual questing system. I couldnt even get to cap level, left both characters at around level 30. GW2 is a great game if you want to get healed from MMO obssession. It's the most boring, unattractive and repetitive MMO ever made.
So you missed:
* Dungeons
* Crafting (Exo/Ascended)
* Fractals
And you complain of lack of progression...hmm.
No, he was smart enough to realize that everything else was a waste of time. I actually got to level 50 and I wish I had stopped at 30. There is no progression on GW2
Thats a strange feeling.
I can understand someone go all content and feel that there is nothing left to do(to progress on), but it sounded like "i don't like the game, therefore there's nothing to do..."
What is so impossible to understand. I was not saying there is not enough content I was saying there is no progression. Level 20 felt like level 30. I was using the same abilities and my character felt to have the same power compared to the environment, and even if i visited a lower level area, my character scaled down so i never felt too powerful, and the gameplay was flowing at the constant difficulty. Maybe it's fine for FPS players or action adventure players, but this scaling and lack of decisions throughout the leveling is an anti-RPG feature.
GW2 Made 22 million!!! Though! Yeah no. That isn't profit. If anyone actually knew how to read a financial report people would see that NCSoft is actually very disappointed with the way GW2 is performing, not pulling the numbers they had hoped it would.
Here we have him. The 24 years old forum poster who knows how to read a financial report better, and even if the numbers are very positive, is able to try making them sound negative.
I'm sure you have a lot of experience with international companies to support that little claim of yours, right?
Originally posted by Randayn
No, he was smart enough to realize that everything else was a waste of time. I actually got to level 50 and I wish I had stopped at 30. There is no progression on GW2
So stopping a game before even reaching max level and max equipment, and then complaining there's no progression, makes sense to you?
Hell, if you at least made that complain once at 80 with all gear slots maxed out, it would kinda make sense. But here, it sounds just doesn't make any sense it just looks like what it is: mindless game bashing. It sounds just as silly as going to a restaurant, eating only half of your plate, and then complaining there's not enough to eat.
Ill take back my "no progression" comment...what I meant was that although there is actual progression, it's hard to notice since you dont have much control over what progresses. Making skills pre-determined from the weapons you carry was the first mistake. Then the additional skills you could choose throughout the levels had 5 useless skills for every 1 so you were pigeon-holed. Add to that no trinity and you are actually pigeon holed more than any pro-trinity game would offer. You attack...and you attack alot...you use buffs, debuffs and cleanses....and then you attack again.
Such a brilliant post lol! The crew I game with are all disenchanted Darkfall players. We started screwing around with GW2 a few weeks back. I was one of the few that didn't already have a lvl80 toon. I finally checked out the WvW for the first time last night. Everything you say is soooooooo dead on. The WvW is complete trash. If anything it just made me miss group combat in Darkfall 1 even more.
Great job again sir.
In my opinion DF1 has the best pvp combat of any game I've played yet. I just wish instead of making DF:UW they improve DF1; now we have a dumbed down version of darkfall where you have to grind all over again.
Originally posted by STYNKFYST
That it's one of the best to come along in a LONG time and will be around for a while?
Seriously....people...you are NOT going to convince anyone that this MMO is failing and/or dying out. It's not happening nor will it for a long while. To keep posting this crap is just idiotic.
My guild of 100+ quit about 1-3months after launch and the population the servers are like 1/5 of what they were. They game probably won't die, unfortunately because fanbois will always try to promote and justify why they spent the money of the game. Every theme park mmorpg out there is basically the same core principals with different IPs and settings. Sure you'll get something with a unique feature here and there, but nothing substantial and I doubt it will change unless EQNext becomes massive. Then we will see the AAA sandbox era, which I hope isn't dumbed down to make it mainstream. There is a reason why peopel are restless, bored, and angry at the market these days.
Could you give us an example of a game that does questing better? My opinion? Runescape has hands down one of the most engaging, thought out and fun questing system of any mmorpg I've played. It actually feels like you are doing quests for a reason, instead of go here kill X, pick up X, drop off X.
To be honest, the only gripe I have is the Living Story content being taken away after it's over.
But you guys, you guys and the rest of the internet, really -hate- this game. And I don't understand why, to me it's the best MMO right now, it's fun, it has a crap-ton of content, yet people are saying it doesn't? So many dungeons, fractals, WvW, PvP, exploration, the game just feels so wide to me. There's never nothing to do, and a lot of the content is really challenging.
I don't get it.
But it's fine I guess. I'll be over here playing the game. Let's hope that Anet decides to leave the Living Story content -in- the game sometime soon though, it's getting tiring.
To be honest, the only gripe I have is the Living Story content being taken away after it's over.
But you guys, you guys and the rest of the internet, really -hate- this game. And I don't understand why, to me it's the best MMO right now, it's fun, it has a crap-ton of content, yet people are saying it doesn't? So many dungeons, fractals, WvW, PvP, exploration, the game just feels so wide to me. There's never nothing to do, and a lot of the content is really challenging.
I don't get it.
But it's fine I guess. I'll be over here playing the game. Let's hope that Anet decides to leave the Living Story content -in- the game sometime soon though, it's getting tiring.
Combat is not innovative and barely skill based... I mean BARELY any improvement over the vintage style of spam.
I only played GW2 for around 2 months and I can tell you that you are wrong on this big. And before I explain, the reason why I only palyed for that amount of time was due to my guild not sticking around and getting deeper into TSWs raids at the time.
People stating that GW2s combat was not deep and just spam never figured out the F keys and the ability to switch stance/builds. I played an Elementalist all the way to 80 and that class was deep and very hard to master. Learning to continually swap all four elements to keep buffs up, heals going, CCs on while damaging was extremely difficult.
Not to mention watching those videos of one elementalist taking on around 10 people at the same time in WvW, holding them off for 8 minutes, killing most of them before finally dying.
Most people are so used to spam and face rolling that they never learned its real depth and flexibility.
This ^. However, this only REALLY shines when you play PvP. The thing with most PvE is that you make the combat as deep as you want. You can find your build to faceroll with, ex. Thief bleeding and condition build, pull mobs, drop caltrops and then spam skill 3, go invisible and wait for mobs to die. OR you can create deep builds that utilize each skill type, ex, tricks, deception, signets, combined with acrobatics.
Fighting PvE is straight forward. Kill the NPC before it kills you. In PvP, in essence, you still want to kill them before they kill you but this is where the combat shines because the smarter player will win. The one who utilizes the skills and has mastered their skill synergies.
This is how I see it. I play with my cousin A LOT and he is the type who will run up to a mob and mash all buttons til mob dies, which works...majority of the time if the mob is 1v1 and not a veteran or champion. I play with tactics and die near 1/3 the time he does.
You kind of decide how you want to play the game, although the developers clearly had in mind for people to break off the faceroll mentality and pick up on mastering skill synergies.
Originally posted by Arskaaa "when players learned tacticks in dungeon/raids, its bread".
To be honest, the only gripe I have is the Living Story content being taken away after it's over.
But you guys, you guys and the rest of the internet, really -hate- this game. And I don't understand why, to me it's the best MMO right now, it's fun, it has a crap-ton of content, yet people are saying it doesn't? So many dungeons, fractals, WvW, PvP, exploration, the game just feels so wide to me. There's never nothing to do, and a lot of the content is really challenging.
I don't get it.
But it's fine I guess. I'll be over here playing the game. Let's hope that Anet decides to leave the Living Story content -in- the game sometime soon though, it's getting tiring.
Welcome to MMORPG.Com
Yeah it's google listing is free mmo list but what it should really read is.. If you hate mmos and no longer play any of them, this is the place for you!
To be honest, the only gripe I have is the Living Story content being taken away after it's over.
But you guys, you guys and the rest of the internet, really -hate- this game. And I don't understand why, to me it's the best MMO right now, it's fun, it has a crap-ton of content, yet people are saying it doesn't? So many dungeons, fractals, WvW, PvP, exploration, the game just feels so wide to me. There's never nothing to do, and a lot of the content is really challenging.
I don't get it.
But it's fine I guess. I'll be over here playing the game. Let's hope that Anet decides to leave the Living Story content -in- the game sometime soon though, it's getting tiring.
Welcome to MMORPG.Com
Yeah it's google listing is free mmo list but what it should really read is.. If you hate mmos and no longer play any of them, this is the place for you!
Lol, those two posts made me happy. But I guess that's what forums are for at the end of the day, right? To discuss, and discuss. From a commoner's point of view (mine) it just seems like a bunch of haters. But in reality, you guys are just having your own idea of fun lol.
I think I broke down the different types of WvW players quite nicely in my previous post. No amount of convincing will change the facts. I know how to play the game, and I'm no button masher that runs with zergs all day long. I'm one of the solo roaming engineers. Once a week (reset night) I zerg with my guild on Tarnished Coast. When playing SWTOR, Rift, or WoW, I do miss my evade button from GW2, but I find out quickly how playing GW2 has gimped my PVP skills. I can't be convinced some fields and less buttons are intricate and skilful, as the combat in GW2 is very dumbed-down from other MMOs. Sure, all of them have their downsides, and I do love the dodging and moving-while-casting of GW2, it still lacks the skill some of the other games require.
The fact is that small structured groups are usually just killing stragglers or smaller groups. The same dumb stun warrior train mechanics apply. Those of us who Guild V Guild are not really playing WvW at all. Sure it makes you look boss killing other guilds but it isn't proving anything in the overall effort in WvW. In fact, these GvG fights are kind of hilarious. They usually fight in an area where the hammer train doesn't have to run far to do its magic. The smart guilds are zerking out their back line DPSers while their stun pain train runs in circles stunning the unfortunate less organized guild.
If WvW actually had some tactical merit, as we have discovered it is purely about numbers and not strategy, it would be quite fun. Those players concerned about the next "point tick" will capture an area and then leave it to get the next. Thoughts of defense, choking supply and the rest died long ago. Most good tactical commanders have wimped out and gone to the GvG fights instead of working for the server. They got bored with the meta because it really is about who has the most players, and especially which server has the off-peak hour coverage (when other players are asleep). The top server aren't any more skilled than those below - they are simply overpopulated and have long queue times. Those lucky enough not to live in NA time zones play whack-a-door all night long without true combat. You go to sleep with a well-defended borderland and wake up the next day to find it was conquered by a bunch of people who aren't sleeping when you do.
Face it - Arenanet gimped WvW. It could be so much more but its just plain boring and broken. I can play the other parts of the game ok, its nothing special compared to other MMOs when it comes to PVE, but the end-game is boring as hell. WvW is what I played this game for.
I do, however, believe it can be done right. If players stopped caring so much about having some stupid reward system and demanded a tactical-based WvW where stragegy counts, we might get a better game. Hell, the first night a month or so ago when they put PVE rewards into WvW, the big hardcore WvW guilds on my server couldnt even get into the maps that night because all the PVE carebears were busy doing their carrot chasing.
I do, however, believe it can be done right. If players stopped caring so much about having some stupid reward system and demanded a tactical-based WvW where stragegy counts, we might get a better game. Hell, the first night a month or so ago when they put PVE rewards into WvW, the big hardcore WvW guilds on my server couldnt even get into the maps that night because all the PVE carebears were busy doing their carrot chasing.
First of all, I agree with almost if not everything the OP said too, but what I found this point above from Colbane interesting. Since for me, at least, WvW was the funniest thing to do on GW2, there were no problems (like lag, and I'm living very far from US atm). IMO, ANet should really focus on GW2 WvW (or new modes to play) rather than temporary content that after some time goes away forever, or the boring and repetitive PvE, where you farm all day.
But what really concerns me, it is the fact that even WvW on GW2, isn't that perfect. For example PvP in WvW is solely based on zerging stuff, the zerg with more players will almost always win, for this reason combat is almost non-skill dependent. About roaming, it isn't rewarding and you can't do much alone. My server is one that is very likely to get rolled on WvWs, and I've got a 80 AH Guardian with full Ascended, this is sad for me.
And about fractals, I don't know if this is a personal problem, but I have difficulties to find a group, even with my server being very-high populated, it seems like a dead land/desert.
I think I broke down the different types of WvW players quite nicely in my previous post. No amount of convincing will change the facts. I know how to play the game, and I'm no button masher that runs with zergs all day long. I'm one of the solo roaming engineers. Once a week (reset night) I zerg with my guild on Tarnished Coast. When playing SWTOR, Rift, or WoW, I do miss my evade button from GW2, but I find out quickly how playing GW2 has gimped my PVP skills. I can't be convinced some fields and less buttons are intricate and skilful, as the combat in GW2 is very dumbed-down from other MMOs. Sure, all of them have their downsides, and I do love the dodging and moving-while-casting of GW2, it still lacks the skill some of the other games require.
The fact is that small structured groups are usually just killing stragglers or smaller groups. The same dumb stun warrior train mechanics apply. Those of us who Guild V Guild are not really playing WvW at all. Sure it makes you look boss killing other guilds but it isn't proving anything in the overall effort in WvW. In fact, these GvG fights are kind of hilarious. They usually fight in an area where the hammer train doesn't have to run far to do its magic. The smart guilds are zerking out their back line DPSers while their stun pain train runs in circles stunning the unfortunate less organized guild.
If WvW actually had some tactical merit, as we have discovered it is purely about numbers and not strategy, it would be quite fun. Those players concerned about the next "point tick" will capture an area and then leave it to get the next. Thoughts of defense, choking supply and the rest died long ago. Most good tactical commanders have wimped out and gone to the GvG fights instead of working for the server. They got bored with the meta because it really is about who has the most players, and especially which server has the off-peak hour coverage (when other players are asleep). The top server aren't any more skilled than those below - they are simply overpopulated and have long queue times. Those lucky enough not to live in NA time zones play whack-a-door all night long without true combat. You go to sleep with a well-defended borderland and wake up the next day to find it was conquered by a bunch of people who aren't sleeping when you do.
Face it - Arenanet gimped WvW. It could be so much more but its just plain boring and broken. I can play the other parts of the game ok, its nothing special compared to other MMOs when it comes to PVE, but the end-game is boring as hell. WvW is what I played this game for.
I do, however, believe it can be done right. If players stopped caring so much about having some stupid reward system and demanded a tactical-based WvW where stragegy counts, we might get a better game. Hell, the first night a month or so ago when they put PVE rewards into WvW, the big hardcore WvW guilds on my server couldnt even get into the maps that night because all the PVE carebears were busy doing their carrot chasing.
Based on your post... you have much to learn, young padawan. Come to Jade Quarry and find out what you've been missing.
I think I broke down the different types of WvW players quite nicely in my previous post. No amount of convincing will change the facts. I know how to play the game, and I'm no button masher that runs with zergs all day long. I'm one of the solo roaming engineers. Once a week (reset night) I zerg with my guild on Tarnished Coast. When playing SWTOR, Rift, or WoW, I do miss my evade button from GW2, but I find out quickly how playing GW2 has gimped my PVP skills. I can't be convinced some fields and less buttons are intricate and skilful, as the combat in GW2 is very dumbed-down from other MMOs. Sure, all of them have their downsides, and I do love the dodging and moving-while-casting of GW2, it still lacks the skill some of the other games require.
The fact is that small structured groups are usually just killing stragglers or smaller groups. The same dumb stun warrior train mechanics apply. Those of us who Guild V Guild are not really playing WvW at all. Sure it makes you look boss killing other guilds but it isn't proving anything in the overall effort in WvW. In fact, these GvG fights are kind of hilarious. They usually fight in an area where the hammer train doesn't have to run far to do its magic. The smart guilds are zerking out their back line DPSers while their stun pain train runs in circles stunning the unfortunate less organized guild.
If WvW actually had some tactical merit, as we have discovered it is purely about numbers and not strategy, it would be quite fun. Those players concerned about the next "point tick" will capture an area and then leave it to get the next. Thoughts of defense, choking supply and the rest died long ago. Most good tactical commanders have wimped out and gone to the GvG fights instead of working for the server. They got bored with the meta because it really is about who has the most players, and especially which server has the off-peak hour coverage (when other players are asleep). The top server aren't any more skilled than those below - they are simply overpopulated and have long queue times. Those lucky enough not to live in NA time zones play whack-a-door all night long without true combat. You go to sleep with a well-defended borderland and wake up the next day to find it was conquered by a bunch of people who aren't sleeping when you do.
Face it - Arenanet gimped WvW. It could be so much more but its just plain boring and broken. I can play the other parts of the game ok, its nothing special compared to other MMOs when it comes to PVE, but the end-game is boring as hell. WvW is what I played this game for.
I do, however, believe it can be done right. If players stopped caring so much about having some stupid reward system and demanded a tactical-based WvW where stragegy counts, we might get a better game. Hell, the first night a month or so ago when they put PVE rewards into WvW, the big hardcore WvW guilds on my server couldnt even get into the maps that night because all the PVE carebears were busy doing their carrot chasing.
Based on your post... you have much to learn, young padawan. Come to Jade Quarry and find out what you've been missing.
yeah i agree, even on my mid tier European server of Aurora Glade, we have lots of tactical, and when we play with strategy or in tactical we often win against much bigger zergs, when we are not in a voice chat even if we deliver bigger numbers we fail hard ... its simple.
i dunno how is better a game were you just spam skills and dont care about positioning, were it is its skill? in how fast you will smash the buttons or which buttons you will choose ? there is only tactical decisions not skill ...
the only i agree is that Anet "gimped" WvW cause they wanted to make it for fun, cause for challenge and fair play they made sPvP, even their statements said that WvW from its nature it would be unbalanced ... i suppose ou have missed such statements .. but anyway : )
the game offers end game for casual gamers, and i am happy with that, actually thats the reason i still play it
the fun is the 1st page of this thread and its OP about how GW2 fell off ... i would like to bring proofs about that cause this value is simply false, probably they havent
Comments
No, he was smart enough to realize that everything else was a waste of time. I actually got to level 50 and I wish I had stopped at 30. There is no progression on GW2
Thats a strange feeling.
I can understand someone go all content and feel that there is nothing left to do(to progress on), but it sounded like "i don't like the game, therefore there's nothing to do..."
now: GW2 (11 80s).
Dark Souls 2.
future: Mount&Blade 2 BannerLord.
"Bro, do your even fractal?"
Recommends: Guild Wars 2, Dark Souls, Mount&Blade: Warband, Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning.
No, he was smart enough to realize that everything else was a waste of time. I actually got to level 50 and I wish I had stopped at 30. There is no progression on GW2
Thats a strange feeling.
I can understand someone go all content and feel that there is nothing left to do(to progress on), but it sounded like "i don't like the game, therefore there's nothing to do..."
That's what I saw too. There is content and there is progression. Not liking it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
video games in a nutshell, it's a waste of time
are you talking about the personal story quests? they were designed to be similar to GW1 missions but I don't think they hit that mark
for combat changes, that isn't going to happen
If you were actually as familiar with the combat in GW2 you'd realize that with the skills in the game you need a targeting system in place. Having the targeting actually adds more versatility to the skills than you'd get otherwise. For example, the mesmer utility Feedback. Basically it creates a bubble around your target that reflects projectiles back to whomever fired them. However, if you don't have a target feedback works differently... it will lay the bubble directly ahead of you at a set distance. So you have a choice... place the bubble around a target specifically or place it at a set location, say between you and a group of enemies about to fire at you. Removing a tab target system removes flexibility with the skills. Phantasms and clones are another that require a target (and that target to be in range). You select a target, fire off a couple clones and/or phantasms and you now have the option to switch targets while your little ones stay engaged on the initial target. Without a targeting system they wouldn't know who to attack or you'd have range considerations. Even if they always attacked what you were attacking that's again versatility removed from the game.
Having a combat that includes, but isn't reliant on, a targeting system actually gives you skills with far greater versatility and options and a target-free system or one that solely relies on a tab target.
Oderint, dum metuant.
Wow, started reading this thread, wanted to comment, went through sign up(which required a little more information than I thought needed), and it got 5 more pages added in that time, must be a topic close to many a gamers heart.
My problem with GW2 was I couldn't do the things I wanted to do, mainly dungeons, because I wasn't 80, I stopped at 76, just got tired of looking for dynamic events, and got tired of being forced to use a bow on my warrior to survive.
But yeah, you get to 36, or whatever level the 1st dungeon opens up, CONGRATULATIONS! You cannot run this dungeon because you are not an 80!!! come back when you've leveled up. No point pvping, because ur gear sucks, so you just get owned anyway.
So yeah my main issue is the down leveling, it really ruins the game for people leveling imo, because all I was able to do was quest look for events, both of which got old fast.
Hearts were added after the fact because that's how players were trained in other MMOs, to run around like bots from one quest hub to the next, skipping any content they didn't have a quest for. The game originally didn't have hearts and people simply didn't realize they could get involved without a quest telling them to.
Oderint, dum metuant.
Amen!
Could you give us an example of a game that does questing better?
What is so impossible to understand. I was not saying there is not enough content I was saying there is no progression. Level 20 felt like level 30. I was using the same abilities and my character felt to have the same power compared to the environment, and even if i visited a lower level area, my character scaled down so i never felt too powerful, and the gameplay was flowing at the constant difficulty. Maybe it's fine for FPS players or action adventure players, but this scaling and lack of decisions throughout the leveling is an anti-RPG feature.
REALITY CHECK
Ill take back my "no progression" comment...what I meant was that although there is actual progression, it's hard to notice since you dont have much control over what progresses. Making skills pre-determined from the weapons you carry was the first mistake. Then the additional skills you could choose throughout the levels had 5 useless skills for every 1 so you were pigeon-holed. Add to that no trinity and you are actually pigeon holed more than any pro-trinity game would offer. You attack...and you attack alot...you use buffs, debuffs and cleanses....and then you attack again.
In my opinion DF1 has the best pvp combat of any game I've played yet. I just wish instead of making DF:UW they improve DF1; now we have a dumbed down version of darkfall where you have to grind all over again.
My guild of 100+ quit about 1-3months after launch and the population the servers are like 1/5 of what they were. They game probably won't die, unfortunately because fanbois will always try to promote and justify why they spent the money of the game. Every theme park mmorpg out there is basically the same core principals with different IPs and settings. Sure you'll get something with a unique feature here and there, but nothing substantial and I doubt it will change unless EQNext becomes massive. Then we will see the AAA sandbox era, which I hope isn't dumbed down to make it mainstream. There is a reason why peopel are restless, bored, and angry at the market these days.
MurderHerd
To be honest, the only gripe I have is the Living Story content being taken away after it's over.
But you guys, you guys and the rest of the internet, really -hate- this game. And I don't understand why, to me it's the best MMO right now, it's fun, it has a crap-ton of content, yet people are saying it doesn't? So many dungeons, fractals, WvW, PvP, exploration, the game just feels so wide to me. There's never nothing to do, and a lot of the content is really challenging.
I don't get it.
But it's fine I guess. I'll be over here playing the game. Let's hope that Anet decides to leave the Living Story content -in- the game sometime soon though, it's getting tiring.
Welcome to MMORPG.Com
This ^. However, this only REALLY shines when you play PvP. The thing with most PvE is that you make the combat as deep as you want. You can find your build to faceroll with, ex. Thief bleeding and condition build, pull mobs, drop caltrops and then spam skill 3, go invisible and wait for mobs to die. OR you can create deep builds that utilize each skill type, ex, tricks, deception, signets, combined with acrobatics.
Fighting PvE is straight forward. Kill the NPC before it kills you. In PvP, in essence, you still want to kill them before they kill you but this is where the combat shines because the smarter player will win. The one who utilizes the skills and has mastered their skill synergies.
This is how I see it. I play with my cousin A LOT and he is the type who will run up to a mob and mash all buttons til mob dies, which works...majority of the time if the mob is 1v1 and not a veteran or champion. I play with tactics and die near 1/3 the time he does.
You kind of decide how you want to play the game, although the developers clearly had in mind for people to break off the faceroll mentality and pick up on mastering skill synergies.
Originally posted by Arskaaa
"when players learned tacticks in dungeon/raids, its bread".
Yeah it's google listing is free mmo list but what it should really read is.. If you hate mmos and no longer play any of them, this is the place for you!
Lol, those two posts made me happy. But I guess that's what forums are for at the end of the day, right? To discuss, and discuss. From a commoner's point of view (mine) it just seems like a bunch of haters. But in reality, you guys are just having your own idea of fun lol.
I think I broke down the different types of WvW players quite nicely in my previous post. No amount of convincing will change the facts. I know how to play the game, and I'm no button masher that runs with zergs all day long. I'm one of the solo roaming engineers. Once a week (reset night) I zerg with my guild on Tarnished Coast. When playing SWTOR, Rift, or WoW, I do miss my evade button from GW2, but I find out quickly how playing GW2 has gimped my PVP skills. I can't be convinced some fields and less buttons are intricate and skilful, as the combat in GW2 is very dumbed-down from other MMOs. Sure, all of them have their downsides, and I do love the dodging and moving-while-casting of GW2, it still lacks the skill some of the other games require.
The fact is that small structured groups are usually just killing stragglers or smaller groups. The same dumb stun warrior train mechanics apply. Those of us who Guild V Guild are not really playing WvW at all. Sure it makes you look boss killing other guilds but it isn't proving anything in the overall effort in WvW. In fact, these GvG fights are kind of hilarious. They usually fight in an area where the hammer train doesn't have to run far to do its magic. The smart guilds are zerking out their back line DPSers while their stun pain train runs in circles stunning the unfortunate less organized guild.
If WvW actually had some tactical merit, as we have discovered it is purely about numbers and not strategy, it would be quite fun. Those players concerned about the next "point tick" will capture an area and then leave it to get the next. Thoughts of defense, choking supply and the rest died long ago. Most good tactical commanders have wimped out and gone to the GvG fights instead of working for the server. They got bored with the meta because it really is about who has the most players, and especially which server has the off-peak hour coverage (when other players are asleep). The top server aren't any more skilled than those below - they are simply overpopulated and have long queue times. Those lucky enough not to live in NA time zones play whack-a-door all night long without true combat. You go to sleep with a well-defended borderland and wake up the next day to find it was conquered by a bunch of people who aren't sleeping when you do.
Face it - Arenanet gimped WvW. It could be so much more but its just plain boring and broken. I can play the other parts of the game ok, its nothing special compared to other MMOs when it comes to PVE, but the end-game is boring as hell. WvW is what I played this game for.
I do, however, believe it can be done right. If players stopped caring so much about having some stupid reward system and demanded a tactical-based WvW where stragegy counts, we might get a better game. Hell, the first night a month or so ago when they put PVE rewards into WvW, the big hardcore WvW guilds on my server couldnt even get into the maps that night because all the PVE carebears were busy doing their carrot chasing.
First of all, I agree with almost if not everything the OP said too, but what I found this point above from Colbane interesting. Since for me, at least, WvW was the funniest thing to do on GW2, there were no problems (like lag, and I'm living very far from US atm). IMO, ANet should really focus on GW2 WvW (or new modes to play) rather than temporary content that after some time goes away forever, or the boring and repetitive PvE, where you farm all day.
But what really concerns me, it is the fact that even WvW on GW2, isn't that perfect. For example PvP in WvW is solely based on zerging stuff, the zerg with more players will almost always win, for this reason combat is almost non-skill dependent. About roaming, it isn't rewarding and you can't do much alone. My server is one that is very likely to get rolled on WvWs, and I've got a 80 AH Guardian with full Ascended, this is sad for me.
And about fractals, I don't know if this is a personal problem, but I have difficulties to find a group, even with my server being very-high populated, it seems like a dead land/desert.
Based on your post... you have much to learn, young padawan. Come to Jade Quarry and find out what you've been missing.
yeah i agree, even on my mid tier European server of Aurora Glade, we have lots of tactical, and when we play with strategy or in tactical we often win against much bigger zergs, when we are not in a voice chat even if we deliver bigger numbers we fail hard ... its simple.
i dunno how is better a game were you just spam skills and dont care about positioning, were it is its skill? in how fast you will smash the buttons or which buttons you will choose ? there is only tactical decisions not skill ...
the only i agree is that Anet "gimped" WvW cause they wanted to make it for fun, cause for challenge and fair play they made sPvP, even their statements said that WvW from its nature it would be unbalanced ... i suppose ou have missed such statements .. but anyway : )
the game offers end game for casual gamers, and i am happy with that, actually thats the reason i still play it
the fun is the 1st page of this thread and its OP about how GW2 fell off ... i would like to bring proofs about that cause this value is simply false, probably they havent