I really don't see the competition between these two games either.
I think MMO fans like to pit "their game" against other games, but really ESO and WS aren't even targeting the same segment of the MMO market, and based on all the marketing and brand strength of ESO, I don't think WS is really even in the same class.
WS A or AA instead of ESO AAA maybe.
I wouldn't say that. The production value of WS is top notch. There is an NDA, but even by watching videos you can see that it isn't a second rate game. It is made by a core group of ex-Blizzard employees. I wouldn't say that is A or AA.....
James T. Kirk: All she's got isn't good enough! What else ya got?
I really don't see the competition between these two games either.
I think MMO fans like to pit "their game" against other games, but really ESO and WS aren't even targeting the same segment of the MMO market, and based on all the marketing and brand strength of ESO, I don't think WS is really even in the same class.
WS A or AA instead of ESO AAA maybe.
I wouldn't say that. The production value of WS is top notch. There is an NDA, but even by watching videos you can see that it isn't a second rate game. It is made by a core group of ex-Blizzard employees. I wouldn't say that is A or AA.....
But still there is clearly some Asian influence in the design team tooo...
for example classes only having acces to a single weapon is so typical asian RPG
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
The simple way to look at them is ESO is designed for box sales not long term play and wildstar is designed for long term play.
With the assurance of huge box dales from their IP ESO focused on eye candy and front loaded content with no endgame. Similar to what AoC, ToR and GW2 did in making short bterm games to maximize box sales. It's target audience is similar to ToR's not MMO players but singplers from outside the genre.
Wildstar is the direct opposite with its focus on endgame and long term subs appealing to EQ/Vanguard/DAOC and vanilla WoW old school players. Investing most of its resources in endgame not frontloaded content.
Sure there is crossover. But the two games are total different designs. Both companies are putting in huge amounts of money but with a completely different design focus.
One of the few things they share in common is they are both sub based. But then every AAA MMO ever released has been sub based with the exception of GW2.
I think this is a strange question. Not every game is for everyone, but I can't imagine everyone who plays one of these games will just ignore the other. They both look fun and are not scheduled to release at the same time. Eso sounds like it will have long term gameplay with the pvp they have planned, and they say they are going to be aggressive with making new content, we will have to see how that pans out. Wildstar on the other hand is actually more likely to go head to head with the new WoW expansion and that audience might be a little more split as a lot of the design philosophies seem similar.
Hm. Having played both, I think WS and ESO represent the very opposite of the spectrum each, in many aspects. So I can not imagine they "steal" each others crowd.
The only thin in common is, both WS and ESO are old gen games and none of them pushes the MMO genre forward. Only Everquest Next does. Wilstar and Elder Scrolls Online are just "more of the same". Good in their own ways, but merely the n-th manifestation of Themepark MMOs as we have seen many times. *shrug*
I place my bet on Everquest Next and count ESO and WS just as a snack on the road to the true next gen MMO.
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
Hm. Having played both, I think WS and ESO represent the very opposite of the spectrum each, in many aspects. So I can not imagine they "steal" each others crowd.
The only thin in common is, both WS and ESO are old gen games and none of them pushes the MMO genre forward. Only Everquest Next does. Wilstar and Elder Scrolls Online are just "more of the same". Good in their own ways, but merely the n-th manifestation of Themepark MMOs as we have seen many times. *shrug*
I place my bet on Everquest Next and count ESO and WS just as a snack on the road to the true next gen MMO.
Geeez at least with Wildstar and ESO people love or hate based on the little they have tried or seen. To crown EQnext as the next true next gen MMO is like investing in an international fund without knowing what countries the fund manager is investing in. You think you would have learned that from Archage.
Hm. Having played both, I think WS and ESO represent the very opposite of the spectrum each, in many aspects. So I can not imagine they "steal" each others crowd.
The only thin in common is, both WS and ESO are old gen games and none of them pushes the MMO genre forward. Only Everquest Next does. Wilstar and Elder Scrolls Online are just "more of the same". Good in their own ways, but merely the n-th manifestation of Themepark MMOs as we have seen many times. *shrug*
I place my bet on Everquest Next and count ESO and WS just as a snack on the road to the true next gen MMO.
And even EQ next makes mistakes like dumbing down the combat with to few realtime skills available and forcing people to use certain skilltypes in certain slots... its the same thing both ESO and WS do.. which removes a whole layer of tactical combat from the table... Character diversity was thrown out of the window, they force you to build a single purpose character, and thats what i dislike ..
Thats why i stopped following EQ Next for now...
On one side (world design) they are building a sandbox and on the other side(character development) they restrict peoples freedom
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
Hm. Having played both, I think WS and ESO represent the very opposite of the spectrum each, in many aspects. So I can not imagine they "steal" each others crowd.
The only thin in common is, both WS and ESO are old gen games and none of them pushes the MMO genre forward. Only Everquest Next does. Wilstar and Elder Scrolls Online are just "more of the same". Good in their own ways, but merely the n-th manifestation of Themepark MMOs as we have seen many times. *shrug*
I place my bet on Everquest Next and count ESO and WS just as a snack on the road to the true next gen MMO.
And even EQ next makes mistakes like dumbing down the combat with to few realtime skills available and forcing people to use certain skilltypes in certain slots... its the same thing both ESO and WS do.. which removes a whole layer of tactical combat from the table... Character diversity was thrown out of the window, they force you to build a single purpose character, and thats what i dislike ..
Thats why i stopped following EQ Next for now...
On one side (world design) they are building a sandbox and on the other side(character development) they restrict peoples freedom
Restricting use of a gazillion hotbars full of abilities is not dumbing the game down. Limited hotbars do 3 things:
Make the game easier to balance since you'll never be able to equip every overpowered skill.
less homogenization
Gives players the option in building a suite of skills in as much the same way as any CCG does.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
That may be because the western world isn't as relevant anymore. Is there a western subscription game, other than WoW, that actually makes more than Lineage or has a larger playerbase?
Those are two very different questions, since the pay structure for games in Asian countries is drastically different from the structure in western countries. I don't know if anyone has done the exact math, but the average western player is worth substantially more than several average eastern players.
Peace is a lie, there is only passion. Through passion, I gain strength. Through strength, I gain power. Through power, I gain victory. Through victory, my chains are broken. The Force shall free me.
That may be because the western world isn't as relevant anymore. Is there a western subscription game, other than WoW, that actually makes more than Lineage or has a larger playerbase?
Those are two very different questions, since the pay structure for games in Asian countries is drastically different from the structure in western countries. I don't know if anyone has done the exact math, but the average western player is worth substantially more than several average eastern players.
^this would be excellent to see broken down and provided in these forums (worth meaning - cost-wise to the player). I think it would be valuable to see and used to make a decision on which game you're getting into. I would do the research, but I'm not exactly sure where to start.
That may be because the western world isn't as relevant anymore. Is there a western subscription game, other than WoW, that actually makes more than Lineage or has a larger playerbase?
Those are two very different questions, since the pay structure for games in Asian countries is drastically different from the structure in western countries. I don't know if anyone has done the exact math, but the average western player is worth substantially more than several average eastern players.
^this would be excellent to see broken down and provided in these forums (worth meaning - cost-wise to the player). I think it would be valuable to see and used to make a decision on which game you're getting into. I would do the research, but I'm not exactly sure where to start.
Lineage numbers, just like wow asia numbers show active accounts.... Mostly that means all accounts that where active over the last two years or so and still have some playtime left...
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
Originally posted by moguy2 I really need to start making threads that people care about.
Yes more people should, because this forum on these boards is almost death... It should spice up a little.. A great game like wildstar deserves more attention then this.
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
I've personally decided I won't be playing 1 of these games, and I'm waiting to decide on the other. BUT I hope they both do well enough (as FF:ARR is apparently doing) to show that the market for Subscription MMO's is still alive and strong, and that just because other devs are releasing 20 f2p thrown together cash grabs a month doesn't mean the entire genre has to go that route.
Originally posted by moguy2 I really need to start making threads that people care about.
Yes more people should, because this forum on these boards is almost death... It should spice up a little.. A great game like wildstar deserves more attention then this.
I actually think most games would be better off with less attention, especially MMOs. The shorter the amount of time people are aware of a game before it comes out, the less likely they are to form unrealistic preconceptions and then be disappointed when the game doesn't match their fantasy of what it should have been.
Peace is a lie, there is only passion. Through passion, I gain strength. Through strength, I gain power. Through power, I gain victory. Through victory, my chains are broken. The Force shall free me.
Are you the type of player that doesn't care about crafting or give two shits about lore or storyline and click through quests as fast as possible... and only cares about combat gameplay? Are you a fan of small group PvP? This is a buddy of mine, he enjoys Wildstar. He find ESO questing to be too slow paced and boring.
Are you the type that listens to dialogue, enjoys storyline and lore, enjoys crafting, and enjoys an immersive world? Are you a fan of RvR? This is me, and I enjoy ESO. I find Wildstar's text based 2003 questing to be god awful terrible.
They're about as far away from each-other as two themeparks can get.
There really is not ESO vs Wildstar, but there seems to be on the forums. It looks like Wildstar is the victim from the backlash from all the negative hype prior to ESO NDA lift. I don't know how many articles and comments I have seen where people meticulously and carefully are trolling for Wildstar fans to bite. It is like a diversion to put down Wildstar and to get people to only look at the graphics between the two games.
Ultimately you sit at a pc, load up your favorite pc game, click buttons and stuff happens, graphics, crafting, instancing, rvr, pvp, raids, trinity,.......
Perhaps there are some people that need "realistic" vs "cartoony" graphics as a means of testimony to their adulthood.
Originally posted by Draemos Are you the type of player that doesn't care about crafting or give two shits about lore or storyline and click through quests as fast as possible... and only cares about combat gameplay? Are you a fan of small group PvP? This is a buddy of mine, he enjoys Wildstar. He find ESO questing to be too slow paced and boring.
Are you the type that listens to dialogue, enjoys storyline and lore, enjoys crafting, and enjoys an immersive world? Are you a fan of RvR? This is me, and I enjoy ESO. I find Wildstar's text based 2003 questing to be god awful terrible.
They're about as far away from each-other as two themeparks can get.
Yeah, same games have housing and world building and raids and some games dont have any of that. Cant compare them . But the games are so different that hopefully both will end up being wildly successful and keep the genre going strong
Comments
I wouldn't say that. The production value of WS is top notch. There is an NDA, but even by watching videos you can see that it isn't a second rate game. It is made by a core group of ex-Blizzard employees. I wouldn't say that is A or AA.....
James T. Kirk: All she's got isn't good enough! What else ya got?
But still there is clearly some Asian influence in the design team tooo...
for example classes only having acces to a single weapon is so typical asian RPG
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
The simple way to look at them is ESO is designed for box sales not long term play and wildstar is designed for long term play.
With the assurance of huge box dales from their IP ESO focused on eye candy and front loaded content with no endgame. Similar to what AoC, ToR and GW2 did in making short bterm games to maximize box sales. It's target audience is similar to ToR's not MMO players but singplers from outside the genre.
Wildstar is the direct opposite with its focus on endgame and long term subs appealing to EQ/Vanguard/DAOC and vanilla WoW old school players. Investing most of its resources in endgame not frontloaded content.
Sure there is crossover. But the two games are total different designs. Both companies are putting in huge amounts of money but with a completely different design focus.
One of the few things they share in common is they are both sub based. But then every AAA MMO ever released has been sub based with the exception of GW2.
Not all who wander are lost...
Hm. Having played both, I think WS and ESO represent the very opposite of the spectrum each, in many aspects. So I can not imagine they "steal" each others crowd.
The only thin in common is, both WS and ESO are old gen games and none of them pushes the MMO genre forward. Only Everquest Next does. Wilstar and Elder Scrolls Online are just "more of the same". Good in their own ways, but merely the n-th manifestation of Themepark MMOs as we have seen many times. *shrug*
I place my bet on Everquest Next and count ESO and WS just as a snack on the road to the true next gen MMO.
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
Geeez at least with Wildstar and ESO people love or hate based on the little they have tried or seen. To crown EQnext as the next true next gen MMO is like investing in an international fund without knowing what countries the fund manager is investing in. You think you would have learned that from Archage.
There Is Always Hope!
And even EQ next makes mistakes like dumbing down the combat with to few realtime skills available and forcing people to use certain skilltypes in certain slots... its the same thing both ESO and WS do.. which removes a whole layer of tactical combat from the table... Character diversity was thrown out of the window, they force you to build a single purpose character, and thats what i dislike ..
Thats why i stopped following EQ Next for now...
On one side (world design) they are building a sandbox and on the other side(character development) they restrict peoples freedom
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
I've tried both and Wildstar is without a doubt not my cup of tea. So that leaves ESO until EQN releases.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
Restricting use of a gazillion hotbars full of abilities is not dumbing the game down. Limited hotbars do 3 things:
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
I have not had a chance to try Wildstar out yet, but imo it seems a lot more "Fun" than ESO.
But then again, that is my opinion
Good luck to everyone, wherever you go.
Take the Magic: The Gathering 'What Color Are You?' Quiz.
Those are two very different questions, since the pay structure for games in Asian countries is drastically different from the structure in western countries. I don't know if anyone has done the exact math, but the average western player is worth substantially more than several average eastern players.
Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
Through passion, I gain strength.
Through strength, I gain power.
Through power, I gain victory.
Through victory, my chains are broken.
The Force shall free me.
^this would be excellent to see broken down and provided in these forums (worth meaning - cost-wise to the player). I think it would be valuable to see and used to make a decision on which game you're getting into. I would do the research, but I'm not exactly sure where to start.
Lineage numbers, just like wow asia numbers show active accounts.... Mostly that means all accounts that where active over the last two years or so and still have some playtime left...
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
Yes more people should, because this forum on these boards is almost death... It should spice up a little.. A great game like wildstar deserves more attention then this.
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
I actually think most games would be better off with less attention, especially MMOs. The shorter the amount of time people are aware of a game before it comes out, the less likely they are to form unrealistic preconceptions and then be disappointed when the game doesn't match their fantasy of what it should have been.
Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
Through passion, I gain strength.
Through strength, I gain power.
Through power, I gain victory.
Through victory, my chains are broken.
The Force shall free me.
Are you the type of player that doesn't care about crafting or give two shits about lore or storyline and click through quests as fast as possible... and only cares about combat gameplay? Are you a fan of small group PvP? This is a buddy of mine, he enjoys Wildstar. He find ESO questing to be too slow paced and boring.
Are you the type that listens to dialogue, enjoys storyline and lore, enjoys crafting, and enjoys an immersive world? Are you a fan of RvR? This is me, and I enjoy ESO. I find Wildstar's text based 2003 questing to be god awful terrible.
They're about as far away from each-other as two themeparks can get.
There really is not ESO vs Wildstar, but there seems to be on the forums. It looks like Wildstar is the victim from the backlash from all the negative hype prior to ESO NDA lift. I don't know how many articles and comments I have seen where people meticulously and carefully are trolling for Wildstar fans to bite. It is like a diversion to put down Wildstar and to get people to only look at the graphics between the two games.
Ultimately you sit at a pc, load up your favorite pc game, click buttons and stuff happens, graphics, crafting, instancing, rvr, pvp, raids, trinity,.......
Perhaps there are some people that need "realistic" vs "cartoony" graphics as a means of testimony to their adulthood.
Reminds me of the WoW vs EQ2 days. WoW is better! Its got style! No, EQ2 is better! Its more realistic and not cartoony!
Yeah, same games have housing and world building and raids and some games dont have any of that. Cant compare them