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WoW and Blizzard lack of support for GLBT players.
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The internet is not america, and I'm not part of "this country" And as far as the rest of the world is conserned, your view is the minority.
Americans want nothing to do with gays.Look at all the polls.
In beastiality, same as pedophilia, one of the subejcts of the sexual acts does not consiously or willingly participate (or has no understanding of the nature of the act). However, a homosexual relationship is based on willing and consious involvement, much like a heterosexual one. It is therefore improper, if not misleading and propagandistic, to compare homosexual relationships to beastiality or other forms where one participant is being exploited.
Be it a form of conscious choice, sickness, genetic anomaly or whatever, the bottom line is that it's a relationship that concerns only the involved parties and does not disrupt society. As to this, there is no reason whatsoever for which they should not be part of society on equal basis and not discriminated upon.
Would it be too cliche if I said I feel sorry for etkiller007's children to have such a lousy parent?
Currently playing:
* City of Heroes: Deggial, Assault Rifle/Devices Blaster. Server: Defiant.
* City of Villains: Snakeroot, Plant/Thorns Dominator. Server: Defiant.
Look, its simple, they made they game, perhaps homosexuals and lesbians scare off players in their games, anyway, they spent many years in development, so they can boot you out for being a homo if they want. Similarly, if you make your own game, you can ban players for not being gay.
Wow. I just can't believe how many people *still* have problems with things different from "the norm".
If you read the ToS, it says something like, "you must be at least 13 years of age" in there. Not exactly a small child who doesn't understand about sex yet. So it's okay for your child to go to public school and hear other kids say derogatory heterosexual terms, but it's not okay for them to go online and hear nonderogatory homosexual terms?
It's just wrong. You let an online video game babysit your teen (who is not a small child, because if they were still younger than 13, he/she/you is violating the ToS, so your point is moot regardless). Back to my point. You let an online video game babysit your teen, and try to shelter your "child" from seeing that not everyone is like mom and dad? And complain when someone says something that your "child" may or may not understand to be referring to same-sex relationships?
A lot of people are missing the point. I played WoW for a while. I joined quite a few guilds. I left quite a few guilds because of people saying "that's gay" when they die, get ganked, wipe in an instance, etc. Or, "joking" with guildmates, saying, "You're such a fag! lol". I even got kicked once, for telling a guild leader that he shouldn't say offensive things like that. I am *NOT* gay, but even I got offended by the idiocy and blatant homophobia the majority of people in WoW present.
The person recruiting did NOT say "WE'RE FAGS! WE'RE CARPET MUNCHERS! JOIN US!" They did NOT say anything offensive. They are just trying to get away from the WoW community that would not accept them, or would say offensive things around them. It's much easier to create a guild of people you don't mind being around, than to report every person who says "that's gay" in general/party/other guilds/shout.
I think posting a link to more indepth criteria for your guild in your recruiting statement would work well, and in fact much better then advertising sexual orientation in a chatchannel. Only those truly interested would take the time to look, and you'd be able to screen them better without all the perverted tells.
Please don't crusade this and understand you can still get what you seek by using an alternate means as stated above.
Paks
YEEEEEEHAW!!!!!!!!
It is my honest belief that sexuality shouldn't even be an issue to begin with in this day and age, but obviously it is and read on for my view on the situation.
Blizzard does not allow the advertising of sexual orientation. This means that you cannot solicit in a public chat channel something pertaining to heterosexuality or homosexuality. In no way is Blizzard preventing a person from being in or creating a gay-friendly guild. They are only preventing the players from [publicly] advertising sexuality (publicly because Blizzard differntiates between public and private chat channels in their various documents of conduct.)
Furthermore, this isn't that hard to get around- simply advertise an acceptable non-sexual guild recruitment message in a public channel. Upon receiving a message from a soon-to-be guild member, merely tell them in private that the guild is either gay oriented or gay friendly.
If one really must require discussing his or her sexuality and the life that goes with it, then a person can seek out a gay-only/friendly internet forum. I've never talken about my sexual/ romantic life in guild chat (nor do I intend to) and I rarely speak about my life. I play World of Warcraft for World of Warcraft and that is what my discussions are over- World of Warcraft. I agree with Blizzard in that sexuality has little place (though I don't mind it) in World of Warcraft, but if one must have it, then one can have it. However, at this point it's just a matter personal preference. "Beat the system" by simply doing what I stated in my previous paragraph
.
Man you must be living in some America I don't know. Because I thought America was about doing what WE want to do, and not what those with power and priveledge tell us what to do.
Bartle predicts that WOW will end 2006 with less subscribers than it did in 2005. All I have to say is that if Blizzard keeps on allowing Christian fundamentalist preachers to recruit online into Christian fundamentalist guilds, and does not extend that priveledge to other guilds that only want to make it known that they are tolerant of those who are different, they WILL end up with less subscribers.
WOW has gotten too socially biased for my tastes and many other tastes, and there are plenty of other MMOs out there that aren't as blatantly biased.
Funny thing is man is that I'm not even gay. But just the thought of folks like you who play this game taking issue with something so obviously minor as this:
"OZ is recruiting all levels, but especially 50-60s! We are working on our
Onyxia Chains and will be doing UBRS and hopefully Onyxia soon! We are not
"glbt only", but we are "glbt friendly"! http://guilduniverse.com/oz"
SICKENS ME...And I'm straight and heterosexual. One might even call me a conservative. But if anybody thinks that this message is obscene enough to get all flustered about, then WoW attracts people I don't want to game with.
__________________________
"Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it."
--Arcken
"...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints."
--Hellmar, CEO of CCP.
"It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls."
--Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE
"Fear not death; for the sooner we die, the longer shall we be immortal."
Originally posted by Beatnik59
No...America partly was about allowing Private Organizations to retain their power, and not have to bend to the knee of the public.
The British Crown was the biggest private organization to ever exist on the Earth. Yet America was formed so we wouldn't have to "bend the knee" to the landed gentry, in favor of promoting the public good.
The world isn't a democracy. Voting process in America isn't even a true democracy. Get over yourself.
No its a republic, and a limited government. Pardon me though if I don't think this is an acceptable practice for those who mix politics and commerce in a way that helps neither.
Haha...
1. WoW will end with less subscribers in 2006 than it did in 2005 because well...IT"S GETTING OLD. Not because it won't bow a knee to your beliefs. Games get older, subscribers drop. It isn't a abstract concept. Don't be asinine. The world, especially WoW, doesn't revolve around you and the progenitors of this "following".
Maybe not, but I can say I won't be going there anytime soon. And apparently, others agree too.
2. They allow Christian guilds and not homosexual guilds for one reason...
One has an enviroment that they ascertain is good for the WoW world. The other is one they feel will cause disruption, conflict, and that they simply don't want it in their game.
They can make that choice. I don't think its smart. But they have caused much more disruption, as evidenced in here, by this strange and questionable policy against a harmless, easily dismissed caveat that would otherwise go unnoticed in any other game I have played.
Look man if you want to get on my case for my "kid" remarks, you have the right. But I don't think this thing is going to go away like many of us want it to. It's not a matter anymore of "stirring the pot." The pot has been stirred, so now what are we going to do?
I guess just log on and play. I can tell you this much though, I'm going to be a little bit more aware of what I play from now on. I didn't think things like this were much of a problem. Guess I was wrong.
__________________________
"Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it."
--Arcken
"...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints."
--Hellmar, CEO of CCP.
"It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls."
--Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE
Noone's claiming it's obsene as far as I can see... it's UNNECESSARY! The person who wrote that quote in the first place was pointing out how ridiculous it is... if I saw that in game I wouldn't feel disgusted, but I'd certainly be typing 'wtf?' straight into whatever chat channel it was spammed in.
Why make a big deal of the fact that your guild is 'GLBT friendly'... as I said before it's implicitly implied that all guilds do not discriminate against homosexuals, they just don't feel the need to advertise this in their recruitment message any more than they feel the need to advertise that they allow blacks in join.
This thread is utterly ridiculous: some people are clearly just trying to stir up trouble, others are using it as a chance to jump on their moral high horses. The bottom line is: STFU, Blizzard were right, you were wrong. Go try and cause trouble elsewhere.
Noone's claiming it's obsene as far as I can see... it's UNNECESSARY! The person who wrote that quote in the first place was pointing out how ridiculous it is... if I saw that in game I wouldn't feel disgusted, but I'd certainly be typing 'wtf?' straight into whatever chat channel it was spammed in.
Why make a big deal of the fact that your guild is 'GLBT friendly'... as I said before it's implicitly implied that all guilds do not discriminate against homosexuals, they just don't feel the need to advertise this in their recruitment message any more than they feel the need to advertise that they allow blacks in join.
This thread is utterly ridiculous: some people are clearly just trying to stir up trouble, others are using it as a chance to jump on their moral high horses. The bottom line is: STFU, Blizzard were right, you were wrong. Go try and cause trouble elsewhere.
youre also COMPLETELY missing the point if someone was friendly to a black person joining how would u ever even know they were black? no one goes around saying insulting black terms to anyone but they say things like "gay" or "fag" so what you said has no true point and obviously u must be either ignorant, immature, or a child just from the grammar errors in your post.
"Fantasy" games seem to get more "real world" every day.
(Personally, I've always wondered about Elves anyway.)
~ Ancient Membership ~
Originally posted by Aldaron
"Fear not death; for the sooner we die, the longer shall we be immortal."
sigh...
Blizzard is just looking out for themselves with this one. I'm sure some homophobe complained and Blizzard panicked and took the easy way out. GLBT players shouldn't be stopped from feeling proud about what they are.
That having been said, how would you feel about a Guild that proclaimed themselves to be "white only" and called themselves "White Power" or some such? That would certainly not be acceptable either, therefore I think a guild that chooses to include some and disclude others based on race, religion, creed or yes even sexual orientation is negative.
Did this crap actually just bleed over into my world of video games? Ack, just play the friggin' game people. When we're in game, we aren't us anymore anyway, we're a bunch of pixels trying to have fun. All this drama and stuff just isn't fun.
EDIT: Guess i should have read all of the previous ones before posting heh...
Americans want nothing to do with gays.Look at all the polls.
I'll assume that you can read...because you're here, so here's some intresting reading for you.
Sexual prejudice then and now.
One day people like you will only be featured in a museum.
One name: Matthew Stewart. Look it up.
One name: Matthew Stewart. Look it up.
Are you actually comparing ONE gay guy geting killed to hundreds of years of brutal torture and slavery blacks endured by whitey?There is no comparison.Isnt it funny gays talk about tolerance but themselves dont tolerate anyone who thinks homosexuality is wrong and calls them Rednecks,prejudice,belong in a museum,etc.?Also I like how you bash Christians every chance you get.
Americans want nothing to do with gays.Look at all the polls.
They're providing you with a single example.
You can find examples of gay bashing and sexual-orientation motivated murders and discrimination with even a cursory search of a news archive.
There's also a matter of demographics. 12% of the US population is (currently) black (I couldn't find historical information in a hurry) but even the most 'optimistic' of estimates places the alternate sexuality number of people at 10% and many of those will not be 'outed'. This can account for quite a lot of the disparity in the numbers.
People talk about tolerance yes, but the thing they can't tolerate is intolerance. Christians get mixed up in that because, for a religion that touts a compassionate Christ, they can be awfully nasty. IMO it is a mistake to paint all Christians with the same brush as some are models of tolerance but from my PoV believing wholeheartedly in the big sky fairy is dangerous primitivism much like your intolerant attitude.
Creating a *blank* friendly atmosphere is not the same as promoting something. Are you afraid that they'll somehow reach through the screen and corrupt your children with 'gay cooties' or something?
There's no suggestion of active promotion there.
Two quotes for you...
"Your right to swing your fist ends at my nose."
"I may not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it."
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