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why your mmorpgs are trash..
Cylaan2
Member Posts: 21
Okay, im not posting regulary on mmorpg.com but now i feel like postin something...
at the moment i`m looking for a new mmorpg to play and to get me addicted to it but all of the ones i played are wack trash....really.....so let`s start (feel free to correct me)
Asheron`s Call 1.... (playing time:years)
beatufiul...the only MMORPG i considered to be good,of course only on darktide and before macroing/duping became the thing-to-do.
Plenty of quests,plenty of charactertemplates because it is skillbased. probably the most dynamic and skillfull pvp-system a mmorpg has/had.
Asherons Call 2.. (playing time: 2 month)
junk....
everquest 1 (playing time: 3 month) (rallos zek)
first of all im not referring to carebear servers...seriously how can so called "roleplayers" play on servers where they have not the possibility to play-freely ergo to attack anyone they want and not being stopped by weird magical barriers...the game itself...exceppt that the skill/level system is totally dull....except with buffs any character runs the same speed...wtf is that?..the pvp itself is alright...except there was a 6 lvl restriction which is stupid...but in comparison to AC1 there has to be a lvl restriction in pvp because unlike in AC it is actually impossible to kill someone 10 levels higher( in AC if you were good you could easily kill someone 20 levels higher or with enough skill and luck even 40-50)
...did i mention any character runs the same speed?
Everquest 2 (playing time: 1 day)
...everquest 1 had pvp..why does EQ2 not have it so far?...Which leads me to the main question again..why would i play MMORPGs without pvp?....for the quests?...for the community..if i want community i usually talk to rl friends..!?...if i want to do pve and quests i play final fantasy....
city of heroes/villains (playing time: a couple of month)
now with city of villains i thought this is gonna rock....no..it doesnt..
repititive ,unbalanced.....repititive...
it`s nice to be a hero...unless everybody else is one too...
the pvp is self is...well...pvp without unannounced raids...screw that...if i want to duel someone i play..nevermind..dueling sucks...
conquer online...
well...it`s free...
eve online(free trial)
seems to be a nice game...the things i heard about that multithousand dollar scam seemed cool...but waiting days to increase my skills...bleh.....bleeeeh i say !
Dark age of camelot ( 2 month)
Actually quite ALright...but..to slow...sloooooooooow...skillbased mmorpgs> levelbased mmorpgs
PVP-system....bleeeh !
guildwars (a week)
is this actually considered to be a MMorpg?
Lineage2
id like to try this game..but it seems to have some unjustified airs and graces because it is the only mmorpg which doesnt offer a free trial...and the critics i read do not make me buy it seriously..
Lineage1,Legend of mir and other 2d mmorpgs
if i want to play 2d mmorpgs i go get ultima online which is by far the best but...listen..2d to 2006 is like parkinson desease to pick-up sticks(mikado)
Ragnarok online
this is the korean scam game right?
Rubies of eventide (2 days)
could be a nice game!.....but seriously...those grafics and interface and combat style.. ....you better get ultima online...
World of Warcraft(2 month)
duh....well...
Planetside (4 Month,planning to come back to it)
rocks ! ...but not the genre of MMO`s im currently talking about
Shadowbane...
lol i remember when i saw screenshots of shadowbane 1 year before it was released or so..i was so hyped...and when i finally got it....lol...JUNK...pvp is unbelanced...the environment is empty and boring..i tried it again to see if they improved the game since its release.....nope..they didnt
saga of ryzom
Since im german and this game had a full german communitiy i thought i joined it...eventually it turned out that they were all nazis.....and by nazis i mean carebears
ROSE,Graal, Knights Online
embarrasing and ridiculous... Diablo2 > all of those wanna-be mmorpgs!
have a nice day
beeeyatch
Comments
I find myself completely won over by your incredibly intelligent and well thought out arguments.
And you seem to have mistaken roleplay for 'acting like an ass'.
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What the hell is wrong with you?
I stoped reading after EQ2.
mmorpgs are all about the community, might aswel be playing CSS or something.
You say you like PVP and PS you said was great, why not get BF2?
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Don't click here...no2
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Originally posted by Jerek_
I wonder if you honestly even believe what you type, or if you live in a made up world of facts.
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You sir, 'Cyaan2' or whatever you call yourself, are an idiot.
You dispute your own ideas, Shadowbane PvP is not, as far as my own experiences go, unbalanced.
You call people who like PvE Nazis.
Is that worth a ban?
---------------------------------------
No Userbar here, sorry to disappoint.
All of you are too uptight. Parkinsons and pick up sticks haha.
I wonder how many times I'm gonna have to say this?
GO PLAY QUAKE!!!
Roleplaying has NOTHING to do with PVP... RPGs are about stats, adventure and RPing.
Your comments are the equivalent of someone saying about Counterstrike: "Why would anyone play a first person shooter where you can't kill monsters?"
Stop trolling.
Oh... Hm.
I didn't manage to read all that in the first post, and I would recommend the use of
make things infinitely more readable
<GameTitle>
I never made it to the part where the outright offensive statements were written.
But
"Roleplaying has NOTHING to do with PVP... RPGs are about stats, adventure and RPing."
Roleplaying is a rather open concept, really, although most of us have specific ideas about what is roleplaying / good roleplaying.
Personally I find the role of the warrior and the hero unrealistic and unsatisfying in an environment where everybody can take it without challenge or restriction, eventually rendering the role worthless. Furthermore there is the original reason for my seeking online games at all:
Scripts, predefined plots and villains in caverns "told" great stories, but if you had a great idea, something that would win the bad guy over to your side, if you were an excellent liar... the game creator would have to think of it in advance for you to take advantage of it.
I went out in search for a game that placed the tools in the players' hands to have the stories evolve. If I could not rise to a hero's role I was content to be one of those many doing their best and providing the world were great events took place.
PvP would be necessary because players would be bad guys, good guys, personal enemies and everything else. Threats might be a part of social interaction too. Well, you could say "Or I'll kill you" in a non-PvP game, and maybe, if you were dealing somebody who cared more for the role than the stats, he'd actually roleplay his character being scared by the threat.
But it would still be somewhat contrived. PvP does have something to do with roleplaying.
One of my most fun gaming experiences was Liero... (Not an MMORPG at all)
The future: Adellion
Common flaw in MMORPGs: The ability to die casually
Advantages of Adellion: Dynamic world (affected by its inhabitants)
Player-driven world (beasts won't be an endless supply of mighty swords, gold will come from mines, not dragonly dens)
Player-driven world (Leadership is the privilege of a player, not an npc)
clearly the OP is neither a nice guy nor a MMO player...I'd suggest BF2, CSS or Quake
Your criteria seems to be all for any Pvp games, yet you dismiss guild Wars with the reasoning its not a mmorpg. What is your criticism of its Pvp out of curiosity.
"Fear not death; for the sooner we die, the longer shall we be immortal."
What the hell is wrong with you?
he's just liek all the other ignorant jackass PVPers.
and they wonder why people don't like them
Just because he likes PvP doesn't mean he's some brainless Quake fan. PvP's a big part of MMOs. To be resticted to PvE or to only have consentual duels sort of defeats the purpose of playing a game online. Yes, we could play an online shooter instead. But, I'm sure you could find a nice single player game that lets you do quests and level up. If you play it in windowed mode you can even talk in a chat room while you do it. Problem solved, and you can stop ruining MMOs.
Anyone else played SWG in the begining? I hated some of those rebels more then anyone I've met in real life. I played for months just to kill more of 'em. I can play any game and kill generic monsters all day. I play online games for the competition. I want to beat other players, have more money then them, be more powerful, and have better equipment. PvP's essential for any online game. Not everyone that likes it is an 'ignorant jackass PvPer'. We're not all griefers, though most of us hate them just as much as anyone else.
Oh, and pretty sure he doesn't think carebears are actual Nazis. I think he just meant to insult them.
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Bissrok wrote:
To be resticted to PvE or to only have consentual duels sort of defeats the purpose of playing a game online.
So I take it you never bothered to play Co-op in Rainbow Six, Double Dragon, Contra, Quake, etc. This is quite frankly the dumbest statement I've ever read. If the point of online gaming is competition, then even team based play is pointless because there are people you can't kill.
I play online games for the competition. I want to beat other players, have more money then them, be more powerful, and have better equipment.
So you're compensating for your failings in real life. I notice that you didn't say anything about losing. I also notice that you didn't say anything about the challenge of PvP, or sharpening your own skills. Why? Because it's not about the PvP for you. It's about some vague sense of "dominance" that you can't seem to get anywhere else. I'd probably bet that you don't get it as often as you'd like from online gaming, or you'd be playing games that require skill, like Counter-Strike or Age of Mythology. You play PvP games that are about level and loot. It's alot easier to get that "pwnage" feeling when the player you're competing with is 20+ levels below you. As a PvPer, I'm calling you out as a PKer. Thanx for playing.
this guy is a griefer not a pvper, stop saying bad stuff agaisnt pvpers
i think mmorpgs are about the community, community includes competition tho :P
@OP: btw theres pvp in eq2 now, or so i read
also theyre trying to fix EvE that time=skill
i agree that GW isnt really a mmorpg, same with DDO
ragnarok online wasnt that bad, well it looked pretty good.
anyways its late and im tired -_-
?played: Nearly everything.
?waiting: *Darkfall*, Hero''s Journey
-In memory of Laura "Taera" Genender. Passed away on Aug/13/08-
|
RISING DRAGOON ~AION US ONLINE LEGION for Elyos
"Fear not death; for the sooner we die, the longer shall we be immortal."
Originally posted by Cylaan2
Okay, im not posting regulary on mmorpg.com but now i feel like postin something...
at the moment i`m looking for a new mmorpg to play and to get me addicted to it but all of the ones i played are wack trash....really.....so let`s start (feel free to correct me)
Asheron`s Call 1.... (playing time:years)
beatufiul...the only MMORPG i considered to be good,of course only on darktide and before macroing/duping became the thing-to-do.
Plenty of quests,plenty of charactertemplates because it is skillbased. probably the most dynamic and skillfull pvp-system a mmorpg has/had.
Yeah Asheron's call 1 was good, but the only one you consider good? Either you don't give other mmos a chance, or you haven't played a lot.
Asherons Call 2.. (playing time: 2 month)
junk....
Everything you got say after 2 months of play?
everquest 1 (playing time: 3 month) (rallos zek)
first of all im not referring to carebear servers...seriously how can so called "roleplayers" play on servers where they have not the possibility to play-freely ergo to attack anyone they want and not being stopped by weird magical barriers...the game itself...exceppt that the skill/level system is totally dull....except with buffs any character runs the same speed...wtf is that?..the pvp itself is alright...except there was a 6 lvl restriction which is stupid...but in comparison to AC1 there has to be a lvl restriction in pvp because unlike in AC it is actually impossible to kill someone 10 levels higher( in AC if you were good you could easily kill someone 20 levels higher or with enough skill and luck even 40-50)
...did i mention any character runs the same speed?
You repeart yourself and you say lots of incoherent sentences, seriously I only understand some fragments of what you're saying here.
Everquest 2 (playing time: 1 day)
...everquest 1 had pvp..why does EQ2 not have it so far?...Which leads me to the main question again..why would i play MMORPGs without pvp?....for the quests?...for the community..if i want community i usually talk to rl friends..!?...if i want to do pve and quests i play final fantasy....
There is no reason why there shouldn't be PvP. But no PvP doesn't make it technically a bad game. You just don't like the game design, while judged objectively, it's still a good design.
city of heroes/villains (playing time: a couple of month)
now with city of villains i thought this is gonna rock....no..it doesnt..
repititive ,unbalanced.....repititive...
it`s nice to be a hero...unless everybody else is one too...
the pvp is self is...well...pvp without unannounced raids...screw that...if i want to duel someone i play..nevermind..dueling sucks...
Only thing repititive here is you. Look at what you're writing.
conquer online...
well...it`s free...
I can follow you here. Didn't care for this game.
eve online(free trial)
seems to be a nice game...the things i heard about that multithousand dollar scam seemed cool...but waiting days to increase my skills...bleh.....bleeeeh i say !
Then try travelling in it..
Dark age of camelot ( 2 month)
Actually quite ALright...but..to slow...sloooooooooow...skillbased mmorpgs> levelbased mmorpgs
PVP-system....bleeeh !
Yeah, a bit too slow
guildwars (a week)
is this actually considered to be a MMorpg?
No. That's why me and other GW players flame people who say something like that. When people say GW sucks, it's mostly because: OMFG it's not even a MMORPG!
We F******* know! Read the gw build, any other board, the game box, the official website for christs sake! Nobody claims it be a MMORPG. You need a better arguement like: It's a good fast paced game design, but the instances aren't just my style.
[i]
Lineage2
id like to try this game..but it seems to have some unjustified airs and graces because it is the only mmorpg which doesnt offer a free trial...and the critics i read do not make me buy it seriously..
[b]Well you could always try a free server(I don't endorse them and so on)[/i]
Anyways, it has good PvP, but if you think DAOC is slow....[/b]
Lineage1,Legend of mir and other 2d mmorpgs
if i want to play 2d mmorpgs i go get ultima online which is by far the best but...listen..2d to 2006 is like parkinson desease to pick-up sticks(mikado)
Stupid comparison... no seriously, a person with parkinson can't play mikado, so in 2006 we can't play 2d MMORPG? Generally 2d mmorpgs has more soul that most 3d.
Ragnarok online
this is the korean scam game right?
Dunno
Rubies of eventide (2 days)
could be a nice game!.....but seriously...those grafics and interface and combat style.. ....you better get ultima online...
Gotta agree with you there. The concept was good, but it was executed poor
World of Warcraft(2 month)
duh....well...
...
Planetside (4 Month,planning to come back to it)
rocks ! ...but not the genre of MMO`s im currently talking about
Then don't mention it?
Shadowbane...
lol i remember when i saw screenshots of shadowbane 1 year before it was released or so..i was so hyped...and when i finally got it....lol...JUNK...pvp is unbelanced...the environment is empty and boring..i tried it again to see if they improved the game since its release.....nope..they didnt
Dunno
saga of ryzom
Since im german and this game had a full german communitiy i thought i joined it...eventually it turned out that they were all nazis.....and by nazis i mean carebears
Well correct me if I'm wrong... but the Nazis weren't exactly carebears? Then why compare them? Why even talk about nazis?
ROSE,Graal, Knights Online
embarrasing and ridiculous... Diablo2 > all of those wanna-be mmorpgs!
D2 is king. But I haven't played those games, so I wouldn't know if they were good.
--------------------------------------------
Aldaron wrote:
If you think games like Rainbow Six would have been nearly as popular, POPULAR ENOUGH, to have a seemingly endless amount of sequels, without direct competition, you're living in complete ignorance.
Fair enough. Then explain Double Dragon and Contra. I also didn't twist this guys words one bit. Multiplayer PvE is centered on co-op. Team based games are PvP, but the individual glory is less because you are working WITH a team. The person I criticized had no intrest in anything other than personal glory.
Ahahaha. "I notice that you didn't say anything about losing."
Oh that's classic. Wait...I got it, "I like PvP cause I like losing." Ahaha.
"I like playing games because I like to lose. Whoohoo. Fun."
A mature player may not like losing, but they will recognize the value of loss. You learn more about playing a game from losing than you do from winning. But since you're apparently the god of PvP, you already knew this <sneer>
You must of missed that wee little word called, "Competition."
Main Entry: com·pe·ti·tion
Pronunciation: "käm-p&-'ti-sh&n
Function: noun
Etymology: Late Latin competition-, competitio, from Latin competere
1 : the act or process of competing : RIVALRY: as a : the effort of two or more parties acting independently to secure the business of a third party by offering the most favorable terms b : active demand by two or more organisms or kinds of organisms for some environmental resource in short supply
2 : a contest between rivals;
Where in that definition does it say that compition has to be challenging. A midget can fight a 240 lb. cage fighter and it would be compitition. The poster just saying "compitition" doesn't mean that he's after challenge. If you had READ his post, you'd realize that he didn't want compitition. He wanted to grief in order to stroke his own weak ego.
So you're not a "carebear".
I'm a grown ass man. The fact that you're using the term "carebear" shows that you aren't. I don't care if you're 52, displaying the macho insecurity of a 14 year old places you firmly in the category of "boy".
Hrmm...To all "Carebears" out there, I apologize for associating you with this gentleman. Please forgive me.
I didn't think that my reply was rude in the slightest. I stated my opinion that I thought this person is a Pker rather than a PvPer and told why. If that hurt you in the process, then you have some personal issues to deal with.
And now you sir. Never call yourself a PvP'er again. It's callow schmuck's like you that give us a bad name.
I AM a PvPer. More than the person I replied to will every be. and I believe that the OP, the person that I replied to, and you give PvPers a worse name than I ever could. I compete for the sake of competition alone. I don't need to talk smack so that I win because my opponent will to be to upset to concentrate. I treat the people that I defeat with respect, regardless if they gave it to me. I take my losses like a man and tell the other player GG even if they're a total dick. I do everything I can to keep the competition balanced unless my opponent wants to play with a handicap. If good sportmanship is "weak" or "carebear" to you, then maybe you need to grow up. I'd rather play my best and lose a fair fight, than win at a totally one sided ass kicking any day. The individual that I replied to didn't care about any of that, he/she/it only wanted to be ahead of someone else. THAT, my friend, is NOT TRUE PVP.
Roleplaying games were never, and should never, be about competition but rather about cooperation and exploring the personality and accomplishments of your character.
PvP really needs to be hived off into a seperate genre or iteration as by and large the goals of the PvE and PvP communities are mutually exclusive.
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I think you're reading a little too far into my two paragraphs. That wasn't even my arguement. But either way you're working together with a group to kill an enemy. And just because it's PvE doesn't mean your fighting for someone else's glory, and PvP doesn't always mean that it's all about you. You're playing to kill the enemy and win. Co-op doesn't change that. PvP just makes it more interesting. Ever play BF2? Unless the other team sucks you're not going to win any games by yourself. It's about working together to win.
Again, you're reading what's not there. I even said something along the lines of 'everyone hates griefers. Even they hate them'. Not sure why you assumed that I need to compete against children in order to feel good about myself. Oh, and look on www.dictionary.com. I shortened it, but here's one of the definitions:
2) A test of skill or ability; a contest: a skating competition.
You said I beat up people weaker then me to make up for my failings it life. I took it as an insult. Maybe I misread it.
Sorry, you wrote a lot so I cut it down to the main bullshit. You took two paragraphs of me saying that I play games to win and that I like PvP to mean that I'm some narcissistic pre-teen. You just said you do the same goddamn thing in case you weren't paying attention. And what is all this aside from you trying to get some 'vague sense of domination'?
...Nazi.
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"Fear not death; for the sooner we die, the longer shall we be immortal."
Bissrok wrote:
I think you're reading a little too far into my two paragraphs. Either way you're working together with a group to kill an enemy. And just because it's PvE doesn't mean your fighting for someone else's glory. You're playing to kill the enemy and win. Co-op doesn't change that. PvP just makes it more interesting.
I'm going to say that PvP doesn't ALWAYS make it more interesting. The game has to be designed with PvP in mind. Most MMOs aren't and that's the problem with their PvP. No one is going to argue against a well balanced PvP game. You don't really hear alot of griping about Eve having broke ass elements to it. It's the insistance that:
1) Every game has to be PvP, even those that weren't designed for it.
2) Anyone that doesn't play PvP is "weak" or "carebear"
Those are the things that people a pissed about. People like different things. Live with it.
In any team situation, you share victory or defeat with the rest of your team. You can try for MVP if you like, but you still have to give some credit to your comrades. PvE in MMOs is meant to be co-op, so I used my demonstrations as such.
Again, you're reading what's not there. I even said something along the lines of 'everyone hates griefers. Even they hate them'. Not sure why you assumed that I need to compete against children in order to feel good about myself. Oh, and look on www.dictionary.com. I shortened it, but here's one of the definitions:
Again, a test of skill doesn't exactly mean it's a challenge. If I was to play a chess game with Kasparov, I would have my ass handed to me. I doubt it would be very challenging for Kasparov though.
I never said you had to compete against children. I said "people 20+ levels beneath you". We are all level 1 at the begining of a level based game, regardless of our actual age.
I did make the assumption that you had to "pwn n00b2" for an ego boost based on your reasons for playing PvP. I play for the game itself, not the rights to put on airs. I get more out of outsmarting an opponent than running around with more money, better equipment, or higher ranking. I'm about the play, and by your own admission, you're about the rewards.
You said I beat up people weaker then me to make up for my failings it life. I took it as an insult. Maybe I misread it.
Yeah, that was harsh. But what other impression should I get when you say:
I want to beat other players, have more money then them, be more powerful, and have better equipment.
Sounds like you're compensating to me. I'm probably wrong. But that is the impression you gave.
Sorry, you wrote a lot so I cut it down to the main bullshit. You took two paragraphs of me saying that I play games to win and that I like PvP to mean that I'm some narcissistic pre-teen. You just said the same goddamn thing in case you weren't paying attention. And what is all this aside from you trying to get some 'vague sense of domination'?
It's not that you play the games to win. It's WHY you play the games to win that lead me to say what I said. And no, I'm not trying to get some "vague sense of domination". I'm just plain sick of PKers coming in and jock struting about how PvP is "the only way" and everyone else is a "carebear" pussy. I gave most of that shit up in high school, and when I hear it now I just want to take the insecure little punk out behind the woodshed and beat his ass like his parents should have done. Or maybe I'm just getting old.
Aldaron wrote:
And yes, You did twist his words. He said RESTRICTED to PvE. And you go on a tangent talking about Co-op in multiplayer games.
To be resticted to PvE or to only have consentual duels sort of defeats the purpose of playing a game online.
In this line, he states that the ONLY reason to play games online is PvP. If this were true, there wouldn't be any co-op play.
I never saw anything about griefing...Now I did see something about winning. But wait, no. Of course. You again are twisting someones words to try to prove your own feeble-minded argument.
You can read through the discussion above for why I called Bissrok a PKer.
Therapy; you need it. Anyone who is oh so offended by a popular term in the game world referring to someone who is favorable to a type of gameplay, and also feeling the need to prove "I"m a grown ass man." by spouting it loudly...well, and you speak about others insecurities?
Offended? No. Tired? You betcha!! Carebear is a duragatory term. End of line. It's meant to degrade people who are favorable to a type of gameplay by labeling them weak or feminine. Not exactly the term that a "grown up" would use, is it?
Oh this is just adorable. Now we're resorting to grade-school tactics? Have some class boy. Ingenuity, that's what at least trying to insult someone is about. Not, "You're a moron." "Nuh uh. You are!"
I stated what I felt. I play for act of playing. He plays for the status. You support him, which implies that you play for status also. I think my way is PvP and your way is PK. And you shouldn't try to command people as to how to identify themselves. It makes you look like a megalomaniac.
Here we go again with the, "I'm trying to prove something." bit.
And you're not?