The first time i played wow back in 2004 it was magical(corny i know) but thats what it was to me, I enjoyed each and every expansion through the years with the exception of cataclsym, But this mess doesnt even feel like wow anymore. Between Garrisons and all the phasing /instancing in zones i feel like im playing a single player game with multiplayer tacked on. Already unsubbed, This XPAC was so bad it got me playing SWTOR again lmao
WOW is still the king, but it's more of a statement on how bad the MMO landscape is. The most recent AAA titles have all been basically failures, examples being Archeage, Elder Scrolls Online, and Wildstar. Even with this expansion WOW feels stale, but what else is there to play (in terms of MMORPGs)?
Originally posted by Bladestrom Honeymoon period almost Over - realisation will eventually dawn for the masses that inserting a single player side game into wow has nothing to do with rpg's and connecting with your in game avatar and th virtual world. Next step back to the raid race for gear for the next 2 years.
Oh please. I noticed the list of games you are currently playing. And I find your entire soapbox speech about "connecting with your avatar and virtual world" to be highly ironic.
My favourite games are ESO and LOTR, both for the virtual world and relaxed lore based game play, so maybe stick with the thread rather than your slimy little misplaced personal attacks.
But your slimy wide sweeping generalization attack was far better placed wasn't it?
im attacking the strategy of a company fleecing billions out of a stable customer base you fool, your just attacking people because you don't like their opinions. I answered your suggestion that im 'ironic'(?) by telling you what games i enjoy and why, you just like being nasty.
You do realize that one of the games you claim is your favorite basically defined fleecing in MMOs and now is nothing more than an online shopping mall. Hint: It has hobbits.
Been playing since June myself, and never ran out of things to do throughout beta. Even a month after release, I haven't done most of the things available. There are still raids that have yet to be released, on both Mythic and LFR as well. Made sure to get all my 90s from last expansion leveled up enough to have a dozen or so Mines, Gardens, resource gathering, follower item level workorders, profession work orders, etc. running 24/7 with the potential of making 50 to 100k a day in gold through those activities and others with some things that have changed.
Still treasure hunting and rare hunting, especially if they drop mounts; helping guild mates get such nightly, haven't touched half of the Garrison buildings that I want to for their permanent benefits much less their tier 3. Most buildings are tier three and I'm enjoying their benefits; loving the exploration, routes, puzzles, garrison perks that were allowed in due to no flying. Capping conquest each week on my favorite characters; tried Ashran, but that's just a mess. You're either ranged / a healer and enjoy it or melee and get stomped in two seconds flat if you get close to their boss or to the alliance in general. Then it's a mass race of people going to loot your body.
Enjoy helping players with Normal dungeons since they're overtuned and people get thrashed easily. Heroics are actually a lot easier than them, I've found. Very few wipes on Heroics since those are the things people do who have gear, where as undergeared tanks and healers keep on queuing for normals only to get one shot due to the difficulty spike. Waiting on my last expansion's Challenge Mode team to start running said modes in January; we'll likely sell gold runs like we did last expansion and make some hefty gold if people are interested in the title, mount and set of weapons.
Not a fan of the massive amounts of RNG in this game. It's always been there, but it's like their bread and butter now. Though that may be due to bad luck on my end. Did every world boss on every character, as well as LFR, Garrison Invasions for Gold Rating bags, etc. Not one piece of gear on 10+ characters since the game launched. Kept on getting nothing from dungeons until they changed it so that the last boss drops something. Did about 100 BGs and didn't get a single piece of gear from boxes, regardless of the quality. Just gold or honor. Well, aside from shoulders and capes. 600 ilvl shoulders dropped about 15 times straight; capes, probably about 9 times.
The main thing I don't like about this expansion is how much they changed Warriors. Protection was the only viable one up to a few days ago, and Fury -- even with buffs -- is having issues, mainly with people who didn't want to play it due to changes and lack of power (I mean, heck, they got a 33% attack increase on all their core abilities, in addition to +10% direct crit chance last tuesday) and now they don't have the gear to support it, since they focused on gladiator for so long (which was nerfed, despite only being middle of the pack already). Arms is still in trouble, both mechanically and in terms of power; warriors just feel extra squishy this expansion, save for the tanks.
Overall, the abundance of things to do -- some difficult, some not -- makes it so that I have that much more things to help friends with as a whole. More things for the guild to schedule and work on together as a team. It seems to be a perfect blend of things you can do by yourself, and what you can do with others, or who need help or would like company. Even Invasions is nice, as you are likely to get a higher rating with more players. We agitate level 100 mobs all night to get an invasion, then have an invasion day where we just do them on our mains and on our alts and such. In fact, nearly every day has something attached to it that we can do as a group; they really made it so it could be a social experience for those who are social themselves.
Due to frequent travel in my youth, English isn't something I consider my primary language (and thus I obtained quirky ways of writing). German and French were always easier for me despite my family being U.S. citizens for over a century. Spanish I learned as a requirement in school, Japanese and Korean I acquired for my youthful desire of anime and gaming (and also work now). I only debate in English to help me work with it (and limit things). In addition, I'm not smart enough to remain fluent in everything and typically need exposure to get in the groove of things again if I haven't heard it in a while. If you understand Mandarin, I know a little, but it has actually been a challenge and could use some help.
Also, I thoroughly enjoy debates and have accounts on over a dozen sites for this. If you wish to engage in such, please put effort in a post and provide sources -- I will then do the same with what I already wrote (if I didn't) as well as with my responses to your own. Expanding my information on a subject makes my stance either change or strengthen the next time I speak of it or write a thesis. Allow me to thank you sincerely for your time.
there's no race or top in PvE and it's too casual, yet guilds raid 24/7 ?
@JDis: I didn't realize we were discussing YOUR gameplay. The original post is not very clear. I thought we were discussing if WoW is still king. In a made-up kingdom of course.
Be careful arguing with Kopogero, I got banned because of it.
In WoD's case, i really don't think the honeymoon period applies, It's end game was simply poorly designed.
The questing was the best It's ever been, but at the end game once heroic gear is gotten, there is nothing to do but your garrison daily, sending your followers on missions, and your weekly raid.
Unless you're really into hunting Toys and Mounts, which after all these years many of us have already done, there is no reason to log on for more then 1 hour a day.
It's pretty sad. You'd think they'd have things figured out after so many years.
I think it's better for some types of players to just play what they enjoy out of each MMO expansion and move on rather than try and find lasting value and replayability in it. I've gotten to this point where I love many aspects of each major update in WoW but it gets old quick, and nothing wrong with any game that does that. Some of the best games only offer 15-20 hours of fun before you either grind out achievements, collectibles, or move on until the next DLC or update. That frees up more time to experience a range of great games instead of monopolizing years out of our gaming life like some MMOs can do. I'm happy with that setup and agree with those saying this is one of the best expansions so far.
Originally posted by Bladestrom Honeymoon period almost Over - realisation will eventually dawn for the masses that inserting a single player side game into wow has nothing to do with rpg's and connecting with your in game avatar and th virtual world. Next step back to the raid race for gear for the next 2 years.
Oh please. I noticed the list of games you are currently playing. And I find your entire soapbox speech about "connecting with your avatar and virtual world" to be highly ironic.
My favourite games are ESO and LOTR, both for the virtual world and relaxed lore based game play, so maybe stick with the thread rather than your slimy little misplaced personal attacks.
But your slimy wide sweeping generalization attack was far better placed wasn't it?
im attacking the strategy of a company fleecing billions out of a stable customer base you fool, your just attacking people because you don't like their opinions. I answered your suggestion that im 'ironic'(?) by telling you what games i enjoy and why, you just like being nasty.
You do realize that one of the games you claim is your favorite basically defined fleecing in MMOs and now is nothing more than an online shopping mall. Hint: It has hobbits.
Talk about irony...
I do 'realise' that the community i play with in LOTR does in fact have a great time in a game that does in fact have a great virtual world and RP and do not in fact get fleeced of any money.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
You do realize that one of the games you claim is your favorite basically defined fleecing in MMOs and now is nothing more than an online shopping mall. Hint: It has hobbits.
Talk about irony...
You really have your facts backwards. LOTRO has long been known for creating one of the best free-to-play models on the market, completely avoiding fleecing it's players for anything while still creating plenty of revenue for future expansion and upkeep. I don't enjoy it for other reasons, but I still know that's the last MMO deserving that type of criticism.
It was obvious that doesn't play Lotr and was Regugitating crap because he doesn't know any better - too excited about using the word irony and '...' together becuse he read it earlier in the thread.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
I just resubbed and having more fun than other games I recently played.
I find it funny when people try and say that wow is antisocial since I find it to be one of the most social games I have ever played. Maybe it has to do with the server type, I play on a rppvp server ( ED ) and I get random people roleplaying with me, random people talking to me, people helping each other in world pvp and more interaction in general. However I am reminded of where the term wow kiddie comes from when doing things that involve cross server interaction.
I just resubbed and having more fun than other games I recently played.
I find it funny when people try and say that wow is antisocial since I find it to be one of the most social games I have ever played. Maybe it has to do with the server type, I play on a rppvp server ( ED ) and I get random people roleplaying with me, random people talking to me, people helping each other in world pvp and more interaction in general. However I am reminded of where the term wow kiddie comes from when doing things that involve cross server interaction.
Finding a server with a decent community definitely has a lot to do with it. I recently changed servers and the style and demeanor of the new community couldn't be any more different. It's a shame that cross-server relations can't be disabled by preference sometimes. lol
I just resubbed and having more fun than other games I recently played.
I find it funny when people try and say that wow is antisocial since I find it to be one of the most social games I have ever played. Maybe it has to do with the server type, I play on a rppvp server ( ED ) and I get random people roleplaying with me, random people talking to me, people helping each other in world pvp and more interaction in general. However I am reminded of where the term wow kiddie comes from when doing things that involve cross server interaction.
Finding a server with a decent community definitely has a lot to do with it. I recently changed servers and the style and demeanor of the new community couldn't be any more different. It's a shame that cross-server relations can't be disabled by preference sometimes. lol
Best servers are the Role Playing ones. Even though I seldom RP, I look for these servers in any title that offers them. Most of the players are there for the game and what it is about. Sure, there are still a lot of the typical mutton heads spamming chat and what not, but I have found them to be a little nicer to play on.
Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.
Finding a server with a decent community definitely has a lot to do with it. I recently changed servers and the style and demeanor of the new community couldn't be any more different. It's a shame that cross-server relations can't be disabled by preference sometimes. lol
Best servers are the Role Playing ones. Even though I seldom RP, I look for these servers in any title that offers them. Most of the players are there for the game and what it is about. Sure, there are still a lot of the typical mutton heads spamming chat and what not, but I have found them to be a little nicer to play on.
I do the same. I would have done it on WoW but I have friends who play on a PvP server.
Now Playing: Bless / Summoners War Looking forward to: Crowfall / Lost Ark / Black Desert Mobile
Only thing kinda burning me out right now is I can't get into the combat long term anymore.
One thing that makes grinding tolerable or even fun is the combat. Which in slower games is the spectacle and flash of it all and strategy. Faster games obviously the action. Wow is at a point for me where it lost the flash it once had but it is no action MMO by a long shot.
It's tough... I might try an alt and see if that helps.
Finding a server with a decent community definitely has a lot to do with it. I recently changed servers and the style and demeanor of the new community couldn't be any more different. It's a shame that cross-server relations can't be disabled by preference sometimes. lol
Best servers are the Role Playing ones. Even though I seldom RP, I look for these servers in any title that offers them. Most of the players are there for the game and what it is about. Sure, there are still a lot of the typical mutton heads spamming chat and what not, but I have found them to be a little nicer to play on.
I do the same. I would have done it on WoW but I have friends who play on a PvP server.
So what? Want to do something with your friends? Have them invite you and boom, you're on their server or they're on yours. Only thing you miss out on is their guild chat.
Originally posted by Bladestrom Honeymoon period almost Over - realisation will eventually dawn for the masses that inserting a single player side game into wow has nothing to do with rpg's and connecting with your in game avatar and th virtual world. Next step back to the raid race for gear for the next 2 years.
Oh please. I noticed the list of games you are currently playing. And I find your entire soapbox speech about "connecting with your avatar and virtual world" to be highly ironic.
Agreed, he's playing GW2 and preaching about single player MMO's.
As far as I'm aware my guild holds weekly activities, uses vent, plays wvw as a team in GW2, same in ESO. In LOTR we tend to craft and level alts while chatting. What do you do and play?
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Originally posted by Bladestrom As far as I'm aware my guild holds weekly activities, uses vent, plays wvw as a team in GW2, same in ESO. In LOTR we tend to craft and level alts while chatting. What do you do and play?
You and your guild can play Baldur's Gate over vent also, doesn't make you any less of a hypocrite. Doing stuff as a guild does not an MMO make. ESO also discourages grouping from level 1 to max and LoTRO is the worst of examples for WoW clones.
Play a game like Project 1999 where community and grouping matters before you bag on WoW.
It's great, but my tastes in gaming have matured. I liked the questing and all the stories. It motivated me to pick up Dragon Age Inquisition - which I highly recommend. I have come to terms with the fact that I can not group up and play with people in an organized, scheduled, structured, and committed fashion. Now that I did all the questing - maxed out my pvp gear - bis all my pve gear pre Highmaul, I am just not motivated to keep grinding, especially when the questing and story was going so well.
Haven't you guys already got your "fun" out of the game. To complain about a game you have been playing for 5+ years means it's probably time to move on.
I'm definitely growing bored already. The Apexis daily is tedious but short. I do enjoy the missions and LFR once a week. But I'm actually getting the itch to return to Marvel Heroes after months away.
Left WoW after WotLK raiding was just not fun. Guild kinda fell apart. Came back from MoP and left after playing it for a few weeks. Just could not stand that expansion. WoD has brought me back to the love I first had for WoW. My wife and I are having a blast. Cant wait to get to raiding.
Getting bored out of my mind. I dislike garrisons greatly and tired of the raid grind. While I do enjoy raiding, I'd like end game content beyond that though. Take away garrisons and all you're left with is raiding. Crafting is pathetic and has been gutted for the sack of casuals and a slap in the face to all dedicated crafters. Classes were gutted and simplified beyond belief and are as a guildie puts it... "whack the mole" game with how procs are the center feature now.
WoW is riding on the "old-school" feel vibe of it's RTS days. This will quickly vanish as people reach end-game and realize the true nature of Warlords.
With monsters and PvE elements added into Landmark I'll prolly going to be checking it out for a while as what they are promising is what I want in a game world.
Comments
Aloha Mr Hand !
You do realize that one of the games you claim is your favorite basically defined fleecing in MMOs and now is nothing more than an online shopping mall. Hint: It has hobbits.
Talk about irony...
Been playing since June myself, and never ran out of things to do throughout beta. Even a month after release, I haven't done most of the things available. There are still raids that have yet to be released, on both Mythic and LFR as well. Made sure to get all my 90s from last expansion leveled up enough to have a dozen or so Mines, Gardens, resource gathering, follower item level workorders, profession work orders, etc. running 24/7 with the potential of making 50 to 100k a day in gold through those activities and others with some things that have changed.
Still treasure hunting and rare hunting, especially if they drop mounts; helping guild mates get such nightly, haven't touched half of the Garrison buildings that I want to for their permanent benefits much less their tier 3. Most buildings are tier three and I'm enjoying their benefits; loving the exploration, routes, puzzles, garrison perks that were allowed in due to no flying. Capping conquest each week on my favorite characters; tried Ashran, but that's just a mess. You're either ranged / a healer and enjoy it or melee and get stomped in two seconds flat if you get close to their boss or to the alliance in general. Then it's a mass race of people going to loot your body.
Enjoy helping players with Normal dungeons since they're overtuned and people get thrashed easily. Heroics are actually a lot easier than them, I've found. Very few wipes on Heroics since those are the things people do who have gear, where as undergeared tanks and healers keep on queuing for normals only to get one shot due to the difficulty spike. Waiting on my last expansion's Challenge Mode team to start running said modes in January; we'll likely sell gold runs like we did last expansion and make some hefty gold if people are interested in the title, mount and set of weapons.
Not a fan of the massive amounts of RNG in this game. It's always been there, but it's like their bread and butter now. Though that may be due to bad luck on my end. Did every world boss on every character, as well as LFR, Garrison Invasions for Gold Rating bags, etc. Not one piece of gear on 10+ characters since the game launched. Kept on getting nothing from dungeons until they changed it so that the last boss drops something. Did about 100 BGs and didn't get a single piece of gear from boxes, regardless of the quality. Just gold or honor. Well, aside from shoulders and capes. 600 ilvl shoulders dropped about 15 times straight; capes, probably about 9 times.
The main thing I don't like about this expansion is how much they changed Warriors. Protection was the only viable one up to a few days ago, and Fury -- even with buffs -- is having issues, mainly with people who didn't want to play it due to changes and lack of power (I mean, heck, they got a 33% attack increase on all their core abilities, in addition to +10% direct crit chance last tuesday) and now they don't have the gear to support it, since they focused on gladiator for so long (which was nerfed, despite only being middle of the pack already). Arms is still in trouble, both mechanically and in terms of power; warriors just feel extra squishy this expansion, save for the tanks.
Overall, the abundance of things to do -- some difficult, some not -- makes it so that I have that much more things to help friends with as a whole. More things for the guild to schedule and work on together as a team. It seems to be a perfect blend of things you can do by yourself, and what you can do with others, or who need help or would like company. Even Invasions is nice, as you are likely to get a higher rating with more players. We agitate level 100 mobs all night to get an invasion, then have an invasion day where we just do them on our mains and on our alts and such. In fact, nearly every day has something attached to it that we can do as a group; they really made it so it could be a social experience for those who are social themselves.
Be careful arguing with Kopogero, I got banned because of it.
In WoD's case, i really don't think the honeymoon period applies, It's end game was simply poorly designed.
The questing was the best It's ever been, but at the end game once heroic gear is gotten, there is nothing to do but your garrison daily, sending your followers on missions, and your weekly raid.
Unless you're really into hunting Toys and Mounts, which after all these years many of us have already done, there is no reason to log on for more then 1 hour a day.
It's pretty sad.
You'd think they'd have things figured out after so many years.
I do 'realise' that the community i play with in LOTR does in fact have a great time in a game that does in fact have a great virtual world and RP and do not in fact get fleeced of any money.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
You really have your facts backwards. LOTRO has long been known for creating one of the best free-to-play models on the market, completely avoiding fleecing it's players for anything while still creating plenty of revenue for future expansion and upkeep. I don't enjoy it for other reasons, but I still know that's the last MMO deserving that type of criticism.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
I just resubbed and having more fun than other games I recently played.
I find it funny when people try and say that wow is antisocial since I find it to be one of the most social games I have ever played. Maybe it has to do with the server type, I play on a rppvp server ( ED ) and I get random people roleplaying with me, random people talking to me, people helping each other in world pvp and more interaction in general. However I am reminded of where the term wow kiddie comes from when doing things that involve cross server interaction.
Finding a server with a decent community definitely has a lot to do with it. I recently changed servers and the style and demeanor of the new community couldn't be any more different. It's a shame that cross-server relations can't be disabled by preference sometimes. lol
Best servers are the Role Playing ones. Even though I seldom RP, I look for these servers in any title that offers them. Most of the players are there for the game and what it is about. Sure, there are still a lot of the typical mutton heads spamming chat and what not, but I have found them to be a little nicer to play on.
Death is nothing to us, since when we are, Death has not come, and when death has come, we are not.
I do the same. I would have done it on WoW but I have friends who play on a PvP server.
Looking forward to: Crowfall / Lost Ark / Black Desert Mobile
the game is 10 years old, i don't see how anyone can play it more than a couple hour a day anymore, i'm still only level 97 lol
then again, i haven't found any game that gets me addicted enough to where i play long sessions anymore, so it could just be me as well.
One thing that makes grinding tolerable or even fun is the combat. Which in slower games is the spectacle and flash of it all and strategy. Faster games obviously the action. Wow is at a point for me where it lost the flash it once had but it is no action MMO by a long shot.
It's tough... I might try an alt and see if that helps.
So what? Want to do something with your friends? Have them invite you and boom, you're on their server or they're on yours. Only thing you miss out on is their guild chat.
Agreed, he's playing GW2 and preaching about single player MMO's.
/facepalm
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
You and your guild can play Baldur's Gate over vent also, doesn't make you any less of a hypocrite. Doing stuff as a guild does not an MMO make. ESO also discourages grouping from level 1 to max and LoTRO is the worst of examples for WoW clones.
Play a game like Project 1999 where community and grouping matters before you bag on WoW.
Way I see it is...
Haven't you guys already got your "fun" out of the game. To complain about a game you have been playing for 5+ years means it's probably time to move on.
Getting bored out of my mind. I dislike garrisons greatly and tired of the raid grind. While I do enjoy raiding, I'd like end game content beyond that though. Take away garrisons and all you're left with is raiding. Crafting is pathetic and has been gutted for the sack of casuals and a slap in the face to all dedicated crafters. Classes were gutted and simplified beyond belief and are as a guildie puts it... "whack the mole" game with how procs are the center feature now.
WoW is riding on the "old-school" feel vibe of it's RTS days. This will quickly vanish as people reach end-game and realize the true nature of Warlords.
With monsters and PvE elements added into Landmark I'll prolly going to be checking it out for a while as what they are promising is what I want in a game world.