Writing ESO obituaries became quite fashionable during last two-three years, especially after launch. It is therefore natural that obituarists are increasing their activities with new launch approaching.
The game is not even a year old and is already in deep trouble. Two-three years? It was released in April 2014!
He is pointing out that people were bashing the game when all it had was a title, long before they learned anything about it.
If you think this change was because it was in deep trouble and not because of microsoft's keeping the live fees, then I assume you must think it will bomb terribly on consoles and sell under 3% of the copies skyrim moved. I personally think that is unlikely. Time will tell as the console release date nears.
People were bashing the game for various reasons, not just the racial faction locking that they introduced into a Elder Scrolls game, but also the limited exploration due to the 'factional' region locking, none of these things was ever really addressed except in a most superficial way, that only really aggravated those grievances than allay them.
That ESO did not achieve sustainability is now practically a certainty, the correlation between ESO and SW;TOR's launch is extremely high,even down to the timing, that their going with much the same business model in order to try and save the game, is extremely telling, though whether retaining the box price achieves anything remains to be seen, chances are they are just hoping that existing owners of the game will return once the game goes F2P, and the game is going F2P, calling the game B2P is disingenuous, its a F2P/P2P hybrid game, it will have a cash shop, just like SW;TOR has, and probably will have gated content, just like SW;TOR does, and if it works for them, we'll probably see the box price disappear, so that new players are encouraged.
What i would like to see happen, is for Zenimax to enable the PS4 players to be able to play on the PC servers, it might just encourage Microsoft to get realistic over the whole cross platform server issues they have such a problem with, FFXIV;ARR proves that cross platform not only works, but is extremely viable, even better you don't have to own PS+ in order to play the game, its time Microsoft got with the program instead of behaving in such a protectionist way over their console, it might even encourage more people to own one of the things.
TESO is not going F2P. They are moving from one P2P model to a second. This is VERY different from the SWTOR business model change, and is not likely to have the same results. Going from P2P to F2P is done in order to increase the number of customers, and to lower the CPA for those customers. Changing models within P2P, such as this move to B2P is about increasing the ARPU for your customers (making more off of them individually) rather than trying to get new customers.
The reality is that people who purchased TESO were not willing to pay a monthly fee for the game. In order to get more money from these people, they are moving to B2P (and not requiring a sub) so that they can attempt to sell DLC to these existing customers (not new customers).
It is possible that the PC version could transition to F2P if they don't make as much money as desired with B2P. However, a larger issue will be how much they make on the console version, vs the PC version. If they can make a lot more on the console, they will no longer be interested in maximizing the revenue on the PC, and will just leave it alone and focus on console.
The only thing that kept FFXIV off of xbox was Microsoft not wanting cross platform play, NOT Xbox Live+subscription fees...Dust not coming to xbox was also for the exact same reason, nothing to do with fees. Cross platform play was never affecting ESO, so bringing up FFXIV or Dust 514 as examples of why ESO ditched its subscription, is lieing to yoursefl, plain and simple...
...you are mistaking cause for consequence.
Cause: Microsoft does not allow or only very limited, access to their XBox Live network.
Consequence: No cross platform gameplay for FFXIV and Dust, and very likely it also affects payment processing and billing - all micro-transactions, subscription and account information would need to be kept separate and exclusively on XBox Live network.
All in all, there is way more behind Microsoft limitations. Things are not as simple as you think they are.
This was my thought also. Microsoft needing to control their subscription platform; therefore, no cross platform play. Therefore, despite Yoshi's strongly worded quote, MS refusing to allow crossplatform play may be directly linked to their refusing to waive the fees. Subscription is not mentioned in the article directly, but Yoshi is a tactful guy. The lack of crossplatform play exactly as he stated probably was HIS reason. Doesn't mean that was the only factor.
Microsoft is known for putting the screws to all its business partners (far and wide beyond the gaming industry). It's pretty obvious that Zeni and MS were in negotiations all this time and that Zeni threw in the towel and caved to MS in order to get their game out on consoles. There will always be a hardcore "fail" contingency who will never believe anything but that ESO is a failed game. I think it's much more interesting to try to understand the real forces driving the gaming world and the decisions devs are making rather than just reach for the nearest "fail" assumption.
ESO's console release date wasn't delayed because of the xbox live fees...the date was pushed back to deal with all of the issues and bugs presented with the PC version....ZOS was ready and willing to launch, and had all intentions of doing so, with the xbox live fee in place......to somehow try to imply that its even plausable that the xbox live fee is the sole reason, let alone even a factor, in the year long release delay and ZOS completely switching up their entire pricing and subscription model, is truly facinating.....
Writing ESO obituaries became quite fashionable during last two-three years, especially after launch. It is therefore natural that obituarists are increasing their activities with new launch approaching.
The game is not even a year old and is already in deep trouble. Two-three years? It was released in April 2014!
He is pointing out that people were bashing the game when all it had was a title, long before they learned anything about it.
If you think this change was because it was in deep trouble and not because of microsoft's keeping the live fees, then I assume you must think it will bomb terribly on consoles and sell under 3% of the copies skyrim moved. I personally think that is unlikely. Time will tell as the console release date nears.
People were bashing the game for various reasons, not just the racial faction locking that they introduced into a Elder Scrolls game, but also the limited exploration due to the 'factional' region locking, none of these things was ever really addressed except in a most superficial way, that only really aggravated those grievances than allay them.
That ESO did not achieve sustainability is now practically a certainty, the correlation between ESO and SW;TOR's launch is extremely high,even down to the timing, that their going with much the same business model in order to try and save the game, is extremely telling, though whether retaining the box price achieves anything remains to be seen, chances are they are just hoping that existing owners of the game will return once the game goes F2P, and the game is going F2P, calling the game B2P is disingenuous, its a F2P/P2P hybrid game, it will have a cash shop, just like SW;TOR has, and probably will have gated content, just like SW;TOR does, and if it works for them, we'll probably see the box price disappear, so that new players are encouraged.
What i would like to see happen, is for Zenimax to enable the PS4 players to be able to play on the PC servers, it might just encourage Microsoft to get realistic over the whole cross platform server issues they have such a problem with, FFXIV;ARR proves that cross platform not only works, but is extremely viable, even better you don't have to own PS+ in order to play the game, its time Microsoft got with the program instead of behaving in such a protectionist way over their console, it might even encourage more people to own one of the things.
TESO is not going F2P. They are moving from one P2P model to a second. This is VERY different from the SWTOR business model change, and is not likely to have the same results. Going from P2P to F2P is done in order to increase the number of customers, and to lower the CPA for those customers. Changing models within P2P, such as this move to B2P is about increasing the ARPU for your customers (making more off of them individually) rather than trying to get new customers.
The reality is that people who purchased TESO were not willing to pay a monthly fee for the game. In order to get more money from these people, they are moving to B2P (and not requiring a sub) so that they can attempt to sell DLC to these existing customers (not new customers).
It is possible that the PC version could transition to F2P if they don't make as much money as desired with B2P. However, a larger issue will be how much they make on the console version, vs the PC version. If they can make a lot more on the console, they will no longer be interested in maximizing the revenue on the PC, and will just leave it alone and focus on console.
^^ this. ESO didn't fail to maintain this model. They had a good number of subs and could certainly sustain themselves that way if they chose. I think this move will actually bring in more money for PC as players will return and use the cash shop (and DLC) as well as all the more money that they are able to make off console sales, which wouldn't survive with sub model.
Now Playing: Bless / Summoners War Looking forward to: Crowfall / Lost Ark / Black Desert Mobile
Some of you people are naive, and some of you are just plain nuts.
They're switching to b2p because the pc version has clearly shown them that the game doesn't have good retention levels, but it did have good initial sales so they're banking on it doing the same for consoles. And frankly, if they truly believed the game was hitting their profit goals via subs currently they would keep that model and eat the network fees as the console market has a good chance to be larger for them.
As for why it doesn't have good sub retention, that's pretty obvious to anyone who's played it. It's not a good game.
It doesn't give the same gameplay experience as other Elder Scroll games, especially during the first 10 levels or so. The starter zones were a HORRIBLE idea, they should have incorporated the important faction story bits into the tutorial and then just let players go off the rails if they chose. What amounts to a 2 hour long tutorial before the game opening up finally is just plain stupid.
Out of control phasing disrupting small group play, this was repeatedly reported during the beta, but nothing was done about it. And from what I understand, nothing continues to be done about it. Friends are one of the biggest, if not the biggest, draw to continued playing of an MMO. Making it difficult to play with friends in an MMO is brain dead.
The game just doesn't look or play well. The animations are lousy for a AAA game, to the point that you wonder if you're playing a 5 year old f2p Chinese mmo at times. And the combat, for being action combat, is woefully dull and clunky.
I bet you're going to play the hell out of it after the sub drops.
I plan on playing the sh*t out of ESO when it goes F2P. No game, ever, will ever, none, zero, zilch, nada will ever be worth a subscription. Why pay good money for something when I could play something else for free. It's one thing games like PoE, D3, Hearthstone and Neverwinter taught me. F2P is the best!
So what about all those reasons that you listed above as to why ESO sucks? So which is it? ESO sucks for reasons above or ESO sucks because you can't afford $15?
I'm waiting for people to come in here saying that nothing is wrong with the game, and that B2P is only happening because of the consoles...
Reality is hard to swallow for white knights...
The reality is that changing a business model does NOTHING to make the game better. If people do not play it now and invest money into the game they will not do it when the business model changed. Not saying there is nothing wrong with the game, just saying that changing a business model will not increase your income if the game is crappy. People will not play a crappy game for free either and even if they do they will not invest money into cosmetics!
Some of you people are naive, and some of you are just plain nuts.
They're switching to b2p because the pc version has clearly shown them that the game doesn't have good retention levels, but it did have good initial sales so they're banking on it doing the same for consoles. And frankly, if they truly believed the game was hitting their profit goals via subs currently they would keep that model and eat the network fees as the console market has a good chance to be larger for them.
As for why it doesn't have good sub retention, that's pretty obvious to anyone who's played it. It's not a good game.
It doesn't give the same gameplay experience as other Elder Scroll games, especially during the first 10 levels or so. The starter zones were a HORRIBLE idea, they should have incorporated the important faction story bits into the tutorial and then just let players go off the rails if they chose. What amounts to a 2 hour long tutorial before the game opening up finally is just plain stupid.
Out of control phasing disrupting small group play, this was repeatedly reported during the beta, but nothing was done about it. And from what I understand, nothing continues to be done about it. Friends are one of the biggest, if not the biggest, draw to continued playing of an MMO. Making it difficult to play with friends in an MMO is brain dead.
The game just doesn't look or play well. The animations are lousy for a AAA game, to the point that you wonder if you're playing a 5 year old f2p Chinese mmo at times. And the combat, for being action combat, is woefully dull and clunky.
I bet you're going to play the hell out of it after the sub drops.
I plan on playing the sh*t out of ESO when it goes F2P. No game, ever, will ever, none, zero, zilch, nada will ever be worth a subscription. Why pay good money for something when I could play something else for free. It's one thing games like PoE, D3, Hearthstone and Neverwinter taught me. F2P is the best!
So what about all those reasons that you listed above as to why ESO sucks? So which is it? ESO sucks for reasons above or ESO sucks because you can't afford $15?
Subscriptions prohibit players from truly enjoying and monetizing your experience in a way that fits your needs and wants out of a game. Plus it makes playing other games less appealing because you lose out on time from the subscription which makes your money spent on that subscription less rewarding.
Subscriptions were designed in an age when hosting servers cost companies millions of dollars a year, now it basically costs peanuts. Subscriptions have never been used to monetize content cause the lack of content in games like WoW or EVE are few and far between.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
I'm waiting for people to come in here saying that nothing is wrong with the game, and that B2P is only happening because of the consoles...
Reality is hard to swallow for white knights...
The reality is that changing a business model does NOTHING to make the game better. If people do not play it now and invest money into the game they will not do it when the business model changed. Not saying there is nothing wrong with the game, just saying that changing a business model will not increase your income if the game is crappy. People will not play a crappy game for free either and even if they do they will not invest money into cosmetics!
The game is far from crappy in its current state, but still isn't worth a subscription hence the change to bring in more revenue as more......MANY more will try the game and some of those will spend money in the shops if they enjoy themselves. Historicity proves F2P is the best model.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
I'm waiting for people to come in here saying that nothing is wrong with the game, and that B2P is only happening because of the consoles...
Reality is hard to swallow for white knights...
The reality is that changing a business model does NOTHING to make the game better. If people do not play it now and invest money into the game they will not do it when the business model changed. Not saying there is nothing wrong with the game, just saying that changing a business model will not increase your income if the game is crappy. People will not play a crappy game for free either and even if they do they will not invest money into cosmetics!
The game is far from crappy in its current state, but still isn't worth a subscription hence the change to bring in more revenue as more......MANY more will try the game and some of those will spend money in the shops if they enjoy themselves. Historicity proves F2P is the best model.
We all know they make more money on free games. But since this money never gets put into actual new content, how does the gamer benefit from a company making record profits?
Some of you people are naive, and some of you are just plain nuts.
They're switching to b2p because the pc version has clearly shown them that the game doesn't have good retention levels, but it did have good initial sales so they're banking on it doing the same for consoles. And frankly, if they truly believed the game was hitting their profit goals via subs currently they would keep that model and eat the network fees as the console market has a good chance to be larger for them.
As for why it doesn't have good sub retention, that's pretty obvious to anyone who's played it. It's not a good game.
It doesn't give the same gameplay experience as other Elder Scroll games, especially during the first 10 levels or so. The starter zones were a HORRIBLE idea, they should have incorporated the important faction story bits into the tutorial and then just let players go off the rails if they chose. What amounts to a 2 hour long tutorial before the game opening up finally is just plain stupid.
Out of control phasing disrupting small group play, this was repeatedly reported during the beta, but nothing was done about it. And from what I understand, nothing continues to be done about it. Friends are one of the biggest, if not the biggest, draw to continued playing of an MMO. Making it difficult to play with friends in an MMO is brain dead.
The game just doesn't look or play well. The animations are lousy for a AAA game, to the point that you wonder if you're playing a 5 year old f2p Chinese mmo at times. And the combat, for being action combat, is woefully dull and clunky.
I bet you're going to play the hell out of it after the sub drops.
I plan on playing the sh*t out of ESO when it goes F2P. No game, ever, will ever, none, zero, zilch, nada will ever be worth a subscription. Why pay good money for something when I could play something else for free. It's one thing games like PoE, D3, Hearthstone and Neverwinter taught me. F2P is the best!
So what about all those reasons that you listed above as to why ESO sucks? So which is it? ESO sucks for reasons above or ESO sucks because you can't afford $15?
Subscriptions prohibit players from truly enjoying and monetizing your experience in a way that fits your needs and wants out of a game. Plus it makes playing other games less appealing because you lose out on time from the subscription which makes your money spent on that subscription less rewarding.
Subscriptions were designed in an age when hosting servers cost companies millions of dollars a year, now it basically costs peanuts. Subscriptions have never been used to monetize content cause the lack of content in games like WoW or EVE are few and far between.
How much is the cost now to run servers and store data of every account ever made (not including overhead)?
Yeah, I also would like to know how much does running mmo servers cost nowadays. But I think the great cost to run a mmo is related to the continuous development and that's where I think only a subscription can assure a quality service and sustainable development.
My FFXIV ARR referral code for new EU accounts: 5JPF7ZQ3 Step into the amazing world of Eorzea! Use this reference code on a new account and we'll both get goodies for it!
on the other hand every p2p mmo that offers too much "singleplayer" is going to fail in it's bussiness model... no one likes to pay a monthly fee for singleplayers...
nowadays people forget that MASSIVELY MULTIPLAYER ONLINE GAMES (short MMOG's) are MULTIPLAYER games and not SINGLEPLAYER GAMES... so it doesnt make sense to add singleplayer instances in a mmo (like ESO did too much). just have a look at swtor.. just a singleplayer game with multiplayer option.. wtf?
on the other hand every p2p mmo that offers too much "singleplayer" is going to fail in it's bussiness model... no one likes to pay a monthly fee for singleplayers...
nowadays people forget that MASSIVELY MULTIPLAYER ONLINE GAMES (short MMOG's) are MULTIPLAYER games and not SINGLEPLAYER GAMES... so it doesnt make sense to add singleplayer instances in a mmo (like ESO did too much). just have a look at swtor.. just a singleplayer game with multiplayer option.. wtf?
I agree with you. Tough SWTOR has more tools to group and it's comon for people to group up to quest or farm some areas or to do heroic content. ESO feels much more a singleplayer game to me. I guess that gaming habits are changing. We old farts aren't on our 20's anymore with lots of time to waste. We're aproaching hte 40's and don't have time to take another "job" on a virtual world. I think that's why lately mmos have so much singleplayer content, because there's a demand for that. If I have just an hour to play, playing solo is great to have a fun break without to much fuss.
My FFXIV ARR referral code for new EU accounts: 5JPF7ZQ3 Step into the amazing world of Eorzea! Use this reference code on a new account and we'll both get goodies for it!
Comments
TESO is not going F2P. They are moving from one P2P model to a second. This is VERY different from the SWTOR business model change, and is not likely to have the same results. Going from P2P to F2P is done in order to increase the number of customers, and to lower the CPA for those customers. Changing models within P2P, such as this move to B2P is about increasing the ARPU for your customers (making more off of them individually) rather than trying to get new customers.
The reality is that people who purchased TESO were not willing to pay a monthly fee for the game. In order to get more money from these people, they are moving to B2P (and not requiring a sub) so that they can attempt to sell DLC to these existing customers (not new customers).
It is possible that the PC version could transition to F2P if they don't make as much money as desired with B2P. However, a larger issue will be how much they make on the console version, vs the PC version. If they can make a lot more on the console, they will no longer be interested in maximizing the revenue on the PC, and will just leave it alone and focus on console.
ESO's console release date wasn't delayed because of the xbox live fees...the date was pushed back to deal with all of the issues and bugs presented with the PC version....ZOS was ready and willing to launch, and had all intentions of doing so, with the xbox live fee in place......to somehow try to imply that its even plausable that the xbox live fee is the sole reason, let alone even a factor, in the year long release delay and ZOS completely switching up their entire pricing and subscription model, is truly facinating.....
^^ this. ESO didn't fail to maintain this model. They had a good number of subs and could certainly sustain themselves that way if they chose. I think this move will actually bring in more money for PC as players will return and use the cash shop (and DLC) as well as all the more money that they are able to make off console sales, which wouldn't survive with sub model.
Looking forward to: Crowfall / Lost Ark / Black Desert Mobile
So what about all those reasons that you listed above as to why ESO sucks? So which is it? ESO sucks for reasons above or ESO sucks because you can't afford $15?
The reality is that changing a business model does NOTHING to make the game better. If people do not play it now and invest money into the game they will not do it when the business model changed. Not saying there is nothing wrong with the game, just saying that changing a business model will not increase your income if the game is crappy. People will not play a crappy game for free either and even if they do they will not invest money into cosmetics!
Subscriptions prohibit players from truly enjoying and monetizing your experience in a way that fits your needs and wants out of a game. Plus it makes playing other games less appealing because you lose out on time from the subscription which makes your money spent on that subscription less rewarding.
Subscriptions were designed in an age when hosting servers cost companies millions of dollars a year, now it basically costs peanuts. Subscriptions have never been used to monetize content cause the lack of content in games like WoW or EVE are few and far between.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
The game is far from crappy in its current state, but still isn't worth a subscription hence the change to bring in more revenue as more......MANY more will try the game and some of those will spend money in the shops if they enjoy themselves. Historicity proves F2P is the best model.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
We all know they make more money on free games. But since this money never gets put into actual new content, how does the gamer benefit from a company making record profits?
How much is the cost now to run servers and store data of every account ever made (not including overhead)?
My FFXIV ARR referral code for new EU accounts: 5JPF7ZQ3
Step into the amazing world of Eorzea! Use this reference code on a new account and we'll both get goodies for it!
on the other hand every p2p mmo that offers too much "singleplayer" is going to fail in it's bussiness model... no one likes to pay a monthly fee for singleplayers...
nowadays people forget that MASSIVELY MULTIPLAYER ONLINE GAMES (short MMOG's) are MULTIPLAYER games and not SINGLEPLAYER GAMES... so it doesnt make sense to add singleplayer instances in a mmo (like ESO did too much). just have a look at swtor.. just a singleplayer game with multiplayer option.. wtf?
I agree with you. Tough SWTOR has more tools to group and it's comon for people to group up to quest or farm some areas or to do heroic content. ESO feels much more a singleplayer game to me. I guess that gaming habits are changing. We old farts aren't on our 20's anymore with lots of time to waste. We're aproaching hte 40's and don't have time to take another "job" on a virtual world. I think that's why lately mmos have so much singleplayer content, because there's a demand for that. If I have just an hour to play, playing solo is great to have a fun break without to much fuss.
My FFXIV ARR referral code for new EU accounts: 5JPF7ZQ3
Step into the amazing world of Eorzea! Use this reference code on a new account and we'll both get goodies for it!