This was a legitimate claim against Wildstar and EQN but now I feel like you people are just being infantile. There hasn't even been a gameplay video released and you're already complaining.
Also the days of $200+ million MMOs are over. No one in the Western market in going to have the budget for ultrarealistic HD graphics anytime in the next 5 years.
Originally posted by Zushakon Funny, I'm off exactly the opposite opinion, haven't seen art as good as this game's in a long time, looks really great.
Compared to what games? the art might not be horribad in Crowfall, its certainly not going to be winning any accolades anytime soon, modern games tend to look better overall, FFXIV;ARR and SW;TOR even, and i certainly wouldn't put it up against GW2.
So you don't like the rather beautifully rendered and shaded concept art and immediately began to rage about graphics, which you misspelt like a toddler?
Since when have concept art or CGI trailers been any indication of graphical content?
Are you just being purposefully thick?
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I'm looking for a game, not a real life replacement. I'm completely fine with any art style developers choose to use, so long as the implementation is done well. I suppose if you're looking for a fantasy world to live in instead of a game, realism might mean more.
I personally feel that someone who says something is "childish" or "made for children", unless otherwise stated or with precedence, typically aren't that old themselves. Life experience teaches you the old "different strokes for different folks" and that bias perceptions or culture do not speak for the rest of the world. Indeed, and experiencing something first hand is much better than judging it by the cover, especially if one understands that people are different and they aren't the childish ones, the people calling them (or what they enjoy) more than likely are.
Then again people also typically mellow more as they age. What was important and shiny as a teenager becomes more about actual content and having fun with family or the time you have, while you have it.
Due to frequent travel in my youth, English isn't something I consider my primary language (and thus I obtained quirky ways of writing). German and French were always easier for me despite my family being U.S. citizens for over a century. Spanish I learned as a requirement in school, Japanese and Korean I acquired for my youthful desire of anime and gaming (and also work now). I only debate in English to help me work with it (and limit things). In addition, I'm not smart enough to remain fluent in everything and typically need exposure to get in the groove of things again if I haven't heard it in a while. If you understand Mandarin, I know a little, but it has actually been a challenge and could use some help.
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I don't understand how difficult it is for players to wrap their minds around the fact that large-scale combat with enviromental destruction is way too demanding hardware wise if you want realistic Unreal Engine 4 style- graphics. It just isn't possible with the current tech we have. The graphics CF is currently utilizing though? Stylish and doable, hopefully not that demanding hardware wise.
I don't understand how difficult it is for players to wrap their minds around the fact that large-scale combat with enviromental destruction is way too demanding hardware wise if you want realistic Unreal Engine 4 style- graphics. It just isn't possible with the current tech we have. The graphics CF is currently utilizing though? Stylish and doable, hopefully not that demanding hardware wise.
People in general and most of the people positing on the mmorpg.com forums in particular are excessively stupid and lacking in any kind of basic thinking. I'm always losing faith in humanity very rapidly as I read these boards and then I can't stomach coming back for a few months. It doesn't surprise me one bit that the peasant rabble here can't understand the trade off between large-scale and shiny/pretty graphics.
Seeing the concept and many screens on their website..
why do they chose these childish grafhics is really a big question for me..
What age is this company aiming for? do they wanne be a competitor of hello kitty online?
they say they are shadowbane material.. then they should know that the age of those players are now mid age gamers
whats your opinion about their visuals?
I didn't particularly like the art style from what I have seen so far, although it could look/feel a lot different when it is released. On the other hand I actually really like anime inspired graphics that many like yourself probably regard as for kids. I am not a big fan of Western cartoon-style art though which Crowfall seems closer to. Still I wouldn't say I got a "for children" vibe from it, and the gameplay looks awesome.
I don't mind the western cartoony art style so much. I can handle the SWTOR, Wildstar and Borderlands art style. What I can't handle are the anime and manga art styles and the JRPG flashy shiny flash flash combat. That stuff makes me want to retch.
I didn't even mind the art style in WildStar; it was the combat and animations that killed WS for me. The character models were cool and I didn't mind anything I saw in character creation, but as soon as I got in game and started floating around and shooting weapons that didn't feel like they had any real "ooomph" to them, then I was done.
As long as the animations aren't absurdly over dramatized and the combat feels brutal and solid, then I'm in. If the animations are JRPG'ish and the combat is floaty or flashy and has no impact, then I'll take a big pass on this title.
What I don't understand is why developers can't take a middle of the road approach and make a game that looks like Age of Conan. The game doesn't have to be polygon blocky and it doesn't have to be photo realistic Witcher 3. A good middle ground of cartoonistic realism that you see in Age of Conan is what I prefer the most. It's not like AoC is even remotely taxing on a modern computer anymore.
Originally posted by Pepeq Originally posted by ariesteOriginally posted by WellzyCGames that try for realism always feel clunky and buggy.
The games that don't try for realism also tend to feel clunky and buggy, but they don't look as nice doing it. I dislike the Crowfall artstyle, looks a lot like EQN, which i also dislike. But it seems to be the major direction games are going, I guess based on it being cheaper and less system intensive. Still paying attention to CF though because Raph Koster is on the team now. It actually has more to do with the fact that you accept slight flaws in movement from a stylized character but immediately pick up when something is wrong about a replica human. Nobody really knows what a dinosaur moves like... they've never seen one, but a human you see every day. You get something wrong with realistic and people notice it immediately... you get something wrong with stylized and they often fail to notice it or overlook it.
Nice theory but I'm skeptical. If what you say is true it would be impossible to draw a limp dinosaur. People wouldn't notice anything wrong with it
If you wish to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first invent the universe. - Carl Sagan
Stylized art is not going anywhere. Its easier to make, takes less server resources so less lag, game stands up better to the test of time so they dont have to spend as much money updating the graphics as often, and it tends to run better on lower end systems so that means more customers. For an MMO its really the best option.
CF artstyle is allowing for much rougher and uglier models than what we were shown - I hope we`ll have these, at least as a choice. Not the artstyle per se, but the choice of what to do with it so far is what makes it feel kinda kids friendly.
Now, I don`t have exactly Age of Conan fatalities in mind (thou I wouldn`t mind having these personally), but things such as deep scars, various wounds and burns (especially on faces), missing limbs/eyes or just ugly/evil/scary faces.
A couple of wild guesses: "Nice" models maybe have something to do with CF targeting parts of Todd`s previous Wizard 101 huge playerbase, with maturity rating or maybe even with some of CF artists being brought directly from Wiz 101!? Also, it might simply be connected to aiming for wider appeal - ie as wide as niche allows it.
I honestly think games with these types of stylized graphics are probably just easier to make or code. Hyper realism is really hard to design and requires a lot more system resources for both the dev and the player.
I don't really like it, I hated wildstar's graphics. But these games always seem more fluid.
Games that try for realism always feel clunky and buggy.
I agree, the high realism games don't seem as fluid as the more animated ones. I remember reading the cartoon like games don't seem as dated.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
Seeing the concept and many screens on their website..
why do they chose these childish grafhics is really a big question for me..
What age is this company aiming for? do they wanne be a competitor of hello kitty online?
they say they are shadowbane material.. then they should know that the age of those players are now mid age gamers
whats your opinion about their visuals?
I've always been a fan of "graphics don't make a game" but with that being said, Crowfall has more issues for me then its visuals. Namely it's MOBA like world, its reliance on non-consensual PvP, and class based system within a Sandbox World. 3 HUGE issues that will ever stop me from trying the game, let alone play it.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
Seeing the concept and many screens on their website..
why do they chose these childish grafhics is really a big question for me..
What age is this company aiming for? do they wanne be a competitor of hello kitty online?
they say they are shadowbane material.. then they should know that the age of those players are now mid age gamers
whats your opinion about their visuals?
I've always been a fan of "graphics don't make a game" but with that being said, Crowfall has more issues for me then its visuals. Namely it's MOBA like world, its reliance on non-consensual PvP, and class based system within a Sandbox World. 3 HUGE issues that will ever stop me from trying the game, let alone play it.
People who use the word "non-consensual PVP" need to stay as far away from Crowfall as possible.
Playing the game is consenting to PVP. Sheesh.
"As far as the forum code of conduct, I would think it's a bit outdated and in need of a refre *CLOSED*"
I've always been a fan of "graphics don't make a game" but with that being said, Crowfall has more issues for me then its visuals. Namely it's MOBA like world, its reliance on non-consensual PvP, and class based system within a Sandbox World. 3 HUGE issues that will ever stop me from trying the game, let alone play it.
Crowfall is not a sandbox.
All PVP is consensual by default.
Not sure what you mean with MOBA world, assuming limited time frame, but looking at the popularity of short vs long time frame environments in player conflict games, short term win by a massive margin.
Obviously these are personal issues that conflict with your ideal game, but it is what it is and this game won't be for everyone and I'm glad they are more than okay with that.
The cartoonish stuff is ugly for my eye. Lots of people are ok with it though, since the largest part of mmo gamers came to genre with world of warcraft. This is the norm for them.
I liked the EQ1 style graphics, especially the character models - even today it looks better than some mmo characters.
And also, i do not agree with an opinion cartoony graphics are targeted towards younger players. Younger players and kids would very much like realistic nice looking graphics as well.
I believe semi realistic graphics are possible to implement and be played on older computers just as well as cartoonish graphics.
I honestly think games with these types of stylized graphics are probably just easier to make or code. Hyper realism is really hard to design and requires a lot more system resources for both the dev and the player.
Actually there is a whole study about this. Not sure if I read it somewhere on these forums or someone told me IRL. However the more realistic the graphics the less forgiving people will be. It easier for your brain to spot the things, like movement, that are wrong if the games are realistic.
Comments
Darkfall Unholy Wars:
Zushakon Odi
I favor high detail ultra realistic graphics. PERIOD.
WOW like...child like...cartoon like graphics does not allow immersion for me
FOR ME...it suggest an appeal to an age group that accepts cartoon. like......low detail "tunes".
This was a legitimate claim against Wildstar and EQN but now I feel like you people are just being infantile. There hasn't even been a gameplay video released and you're already complaining.
Also the days of $200+ million MMOs are over. No one in the Western market in going to have the budget for ultrarealistic HD graphics anytime in the next 5 years.
The only ingame screenie i saw was the character creation menu here on site.
It looks like Hero Engine, same as SWTOR.
With that its zoning and limited players per instance.
And with that its instantly off my radar, sorry ^^
I like the visuals a lot. But more importantly, I think mature people are going to care much more about the game mechanics than the visuals.
The thing that drew my attention to the game is how clean and presentable it looks. Much better than sloppy archeage nonsense.
Compared to what games? the art might not be horribad in Crowfall, its certainly not going to be winning any accolades anytime soon, modern games tend to look better overall, FFXIV;ARR and SW;TOR even, and i certainly wouldn't put it up against GW2.
Since when have concept art or CGI trailers been any indication of graphical content?
Are you just being purposefully thick?
--Custom Rig: Pyraxis---
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Intel Core i5-4690 Processor - Quad Core, 6MB Smart Cache, 3.5GHz
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Kingston HyperX Fury Blue 16GB
I personally feel that someone who says something is "childish" or "made for children", unless otherwise stated or with precedence, typically aren't that old themselves. Life experience teaches you the old "different strokes for different folks" and that bias perceptions or culture do not speak for the rest of the world. Indeed, and experiencing something first hand is much better than judging it by the cover, especially if one understands that people are different and they aren't the childish ones, the people calling them (or what they enjoy) more than likely are.
Then again people also typically mellow more as they age. What was important and shiny as a teenager becomes more about actual content and having fun with family or the time you have, while you have it.
I don't understand how difficult it is for players to wrap their minds around the fact that large-scale combat with enviromental destruction is way too demanding hardware wise if you want realistic Unreal Engine 4 style- graphics. It just isn't possible with the current tech we have. The graphics CF is currently utilizing though? Stylish and doable, hopefully not that demanding hardware wise.
People in general and most of the people positing on the mmorpg.com forums in particular are excessively stupid and lacking in any kind of basic thinking. I'm always losing faith in humanity very rapidly as I read these boards and then I can't stomach coming back for a few months. It doesn't surprise me one bit that the peasant rabble here can't understand the trade off between large-scale and shiny/pretty graphics.
Darkfall Unholy Wars:
Zushakon Odi
I didn't particularly like the art style from what I have seen so far, although it could look/feel a lot different when it is released. On the other hand I actually really like anime inspired graphics that many like yourself probably regard as for kids. I am not a big fan of Western cartoon-style art though which Crowfall seems closer to. Still I wouldn't say I got a "for children" vibe from it, and the gameplay looks awesome.
I don't mind the western cartoony art style so much. I can handle the SWTOR, Wildstar and Borderlands art style. What I can't handle are the anime and manga art styles and the JRPG flashy shiny flash flash combat. That stuff makes me want to retch.
I didn't even mind the art style in WildStar; it was the combat and animations that killed WS for me. The character models were cool and I didn't mind anything I saw in character creation, but as soon as I got in game and started floating around and shooting weapons that didn't feel like they had any real "ooomph" to them, then I was done.
As long as the animations aren't absurdly over dramatized and the combat feels brutal and solid, then I'm in. If the animations are JRPG'ish and the combat is floaty or flashy and has no impact, then I'll take a big pass on this title.
What I don't understand is why developers can't take a middle of the road approach and make a game that looks like Age of Conan. The game doesn't have to be polygon blocky and it doesn't have to be photo realistic Witcher 3. A good middle ground of cartoonistic realism that you see in Age of Conan is what I prefer the most. It's not like AoC is even remotely taxing on a modern computer anymore.
It actually has more to do with the fact that you accept slight flaws in movement from a stylized character but immediately pick up when something is wrong about a replica human. Nobody really knows what a dinosaur moves like... they've never seen one, but a human you see every day. You get something wrong with realistic and people notice it immediately... you get something wrong with stylized and they often fail to notice it or overlook it.
Nice theory but I'm skeptical. If what you say is true it would be impossible to draw a limp dinosaur. People wouldn't notice anything wrong with it
If you wish to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first invent the universe. - Carl Sagan
CF artstyle is allowing for much rougher and uglier models than what we were shown - I hope we`ll have these, at least as a choice. Not the artstyle per se, but the choice of what to do with it so far is what makes it feel kinda kids friendly.
Now, I don`t have exactly Age of Conan fatalities in mind (thou I wouldn`t mind having these personally), but things such as deep scars, various wounds and burns (especially on faces), missing limbs/eyes or just ugly/evil/scary faces.
A couple of wild guesses: "Nice" models maybe have something to do with CF targeting parts of Todd`s previous Wizard 101 huge playerbase, with maturity rating or maybe even with some of CF artists being brought directly from Wiz 101!? Also, it might simply be connected to aiming for wider appeal - ie as wide as niche allows it.
NOPE
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I agree, the high realism games don't seem as fluid as the more animated ones. I remember reading the cartoon like games don't seem as dated.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
I've always been a fan of "graphics don't make a game" but with that being said, Crowfall has more issues for me then its visuals. Namely it's MOBA like world, its reliance on non-consensual PvP, and class based system within a Sandbox World. 3 HUGE issues that will ever stop me from trying the game, let alone play it.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
People who use the word "non-consensual PVP" need to stay as far away from Crowfall as possible.
Playing the game is consenting to PVP. Sheesh.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Crowfall is not a sandbox.
All PVP is consensual by default.
Not sure what you mean with MOBA world, assuming limited time frame, but looking at the popularity of short vs long time frame environments in player conflict games, short term win by a massive margin.
Obviously these are personal issues that conflict with your ideal game, but it is what it is and this game won't be for everyone and I'm glad they are more than okay with that.
I fully agree with OP here.
The cartoonish stuff is ugly for my eye. Lots of people are ok with it though, since the largest part of mmo gamers came to genre with world of warcraft. This is the norm for them.
I liked the EQ1 style graphics, especially the character models - even today it looks better than some mmo characters.
And also, i do not agree with an opinion cartoony graphics are targeted towards younger players. Younger players and kids would very much like realistic nice looking graphics as well.
I believe semi realistic graphics are possible to implement and be played on older computers just as well as cartoonish graphics.
It's not 2004 anymore.
Actually there is a whole study about this. Not sure if I read it somewhere on these forums or someone told me IRL. However the more realistic the graphics the less forgiving people will be. It easier for your brain to spot the things, like movement, that are wrong if the games are realistic.