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Permadeath
Benjarro
Member Posts: 206
So yes Permadeath, it used to be something common. There are games like Diablo (HC) PoE (HC) or ROTMK and Salem wich came out in the near past. I for one see a trend comming and I for one hope it will continue.
So lets discuss Permadeath in MMOs. What do you think about the subject and what impact do you think its going to have on the near future of MMO's. Will it become a hit or do you think it's going to be something that some developers will try but will fail in because nobody is interested. And more importantly why do you think it !
Lets make a good list of pro's and con's about this subject because I am currious about your thoughts about it.
PS. I am not asking for games that have permadeath I want to have a discussion about the concept it self.
Comments
You are entitled to your opinion of course but I see one MMO (ROTMG) estrablishing a good player base in the least years. So keep an open mind on this, you can't predict the future.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
As someone has pointed out, if you were really that interested in permadeath you would delete your character every time you died.
Fact is you wouldn't have the nuts to do it, talking about it and actually doing it are to different things.
I haven't seen any indication of significant interest in it as an MMO feature. A niche MMO that's built around it might work, but then you're also talking about an MMO with a budget limited to what that audience can support.
.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Assassins/stealth class would dominate the player base.
No trinity system.
Melee class would be at a disadvantage once ranged classes kite if closing ability is limited.
Don't get caught AFK
If you have attention grabbing kids or significant other, NEVER have them around when playing a permadeath game.
Make sure you pay your internet bill on time and have a mobile hotspot (4G LTE) and back up generator in case the utility company breaks a line that can interfere with your permadeath game session.
If you have a tendency to nerd rage or taking steroids (roid rage) do not play or simply do not lose, ever. For your safety and the safety of others make sure you are cognizant of your actions in the event of virtual death. Case in point see "Angry German Kid" on YouTube.
DO NOT join groups of any size from party to raid size if you have Leroy Jenkins syndrome.
I'm not a fan of permadeath feature, but i wish bad play and stupid decisions would be punished in a long run.
I just don't know how this could be accomplished in practise.
But if you design your game around this feature and it makes dying only a minor hindrance on your way to the top, then why not.
What he said ^^^^
want 7 free days of playing? Try this
http://www.swtor.com/r/ZptVnY
Sorry it's not Opinion its fact that almost the entire market wouldn't play that game. Jedi's had Permadeath on SWG and guess what every person I knew in that game that ended up having a Jedi die quit the game. There was an entire guild with people who had Jedi's and all quit because the effort it took to get the Jedi leveled only to have to do it all again. No popular MMO is going with Permadeath that will have any decent population level because people will not re-grind shit, hell people will not even play Full PVP Loot games today. WHY because the market is not that hardcore anymore and never will be. You want Permadeath play with the what 5,000 people that play Salem at best. Sorry no Its not Opinion it's that you don't understand the market at all.
One positive thing about permadeath is exactly what you wrote in your first line of text. People will actually care about the life of there character and think before they act. Your character actually means something, getting good gear and awesome stats will mean nothing in current mmo's. It will simply mean that you know the game and you spend a lot of time in it.
With PD it a dif story. imo.
I think it has become a religion amongst people to not support permadeath.
It really comes down to the rules for permadeath hasnt been good enough in any game yet. I think it will come some day when a game designer smart enough will come up with the right solution.
Until then there wont be any MMOs with permadeath and a lot of fanatic players saying they dont like permadeath.
It's not matter. People will not play a Premadeath game period. Only people like you and the few people who support a game like trials of ascension that keep trying to talk people into Premadeath. 90% of the post that people respond to the TOA Permadeath deal say No they are not playing the game At All Ever with Permadeath. You just are wasting your time and everyone else's time for no reason it will not work.
Permadeath? no thanks... progress / uber gear / epeen does not mean anything to you? its main thing why peoples playing MMOs these days...
Ben,
You don't know MMO gamers then. Really they will care? I played FFXI before WOW came out and we would delevel if we died and lost too much EXP. Guess what that did not stop bad players from being bad and didnt make them care. Your seriously lost if you think PD will make people care. It will not they just will not play that game. The few thousand people who will play that game will make it a ghost town.
Just do it the same way Diablo etc. do it: On character creation, you can choose. Of course that means you can't grieve other players, but it's about the challenge of surviving anyways..right?
I'll wait to the day's end when the moon is high
And then I'll rise with the tide with a lust for life, I'll
Amass an army, and we'll harness a horde
And then we'll limp across the land until we stand at the shore
Actually, you can predict some particulars. Harsh death penalties in an MMORPG, depending on exactly how that is implemented, could in fact do quite well (even if it would be a niche title and not do well among the majority of MMO gamers). Consider if you died in an MMORPG, and could play as a ghost character and actually continue building as a ghost? Perhaps instead, you decide to be raised as an undead, and could continue building the character as an undead? But an MMORPG with permadeath would itself die. An MMO with permadeath, really depends on what other features, gameplay, etc that we are talking, as there are many possible varieties of MMOs. What is this ROTMG? More information would need to be given beyond just a single feature.
But all that is just time based, I can see allot of negative thought about it and people already losing their minds over the subject but it is there and it is in my opinion it's better then the Milking the cow mindless grinding stuff you see these days.
For this to work what would it take ? A new MMO that forces RPG and maybe even has no PVP at all. or something else? Lets continue ^^
Did you play a game called Shaiya , it's an MMORPG and have permadeath mode , though they ruin it latter .
Basically in permadeath mode your character stronger than normal player many time and have more unique skill , but when you die you lost all.
The permadeath should not forced , but a chose between risk vs reward .
Watched my character dying , when resurrection time down to 0 made me sad for few days .
If there are permadeath , it should be full drop for permadeath character , lost your character is one thing , but lost the equipment damage the player more that the dead of character.
Also it better for the game have some way to keep the permadeath character safe , have few "live" always good .
Prmadeath is something that works on characters/games you play for a shorter amount of time.. But parmadeath does not fit a generic MMO setting where people invest 1000s of hours in a character..
i am all for harsher death pennalties, old fashioned EQ or harder, much harsher, combined with harder content, more challenge... And better rewards for surviving those challenges...
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
I'm not a fan of permadeath but I've played games that had it. And I'd argue that it does not produce more attachment to your character since the answer to any and every death is "reroll".
For those who are very competitive and value twitch skills, I can see the appeal. Getting a character to cap is an achievement and bragging rights are a good hook. But it definitely doesn't have mass appeal, and I think would be impossible to make work in an mmo setting.