Five Pointed Questions About World of Warcraft - The List at MMORPG.com

SBFord · September 2015

Five Pointed Questions About World of Warcraft - The List at MMORPG.com

It would be difficult if not impossible to build any kind of reasonable case that World of Warcraft isn't the most influential MMORPG ever. As it approaches it eleventh anniversary this November, it can lay claim to some truly enormous numbers. For example, in 2012, it reportedly surpassed $10 billion in total gross revenue. Last year, it reached 100 million accounts created.

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jesteralways · September 2015

You are assuming that 40% of WoW players are in china, your assumption is like those who claim "only chinese gold sellers play WoW these days", which i can assure you is not the case. Both chinese and korean WoW players moved far away from WoW a long time ago, i would assume less than 500K players combined in those regions play WoW in pc bang/internet cafe or even personal computers, they have far better alternative to WoW unlike in NA/EU. And even those who play in internet cafe/pc bang pay a very high amount of cash to play WoW. I know several people in korea who used to be WoW players but stopped playing since pc bang charges extra cash for playing WoW and according to them it is same in china. So i would not discount 40% of sub number that way.

JDis25 · September 2015

Blizzard needs to do something with the Warcraft Franchise in the next 6-7 years. WoW can't last any longer than that and still maintain it's appeal/status/relevance within the games industry. They would either need to release a new Warcraft MMO or even an RTS. An RTS would be more probable, even a RTS/MOBA hybrid may be a possibility. I could imagine a Warcraft Destiny type game being a possibility to. Action oriented, not so massive world, but a streamlined action game. A Warcraft Sandbox with the technology of planetside 2's maps would be amazing. Being one soldier in a constant WAR...with crafting, some PvE thrown in, and an in-depth crafting system, Naval combat, Dogfights, mounted combat, swordfights, magic battles, ESO type stealth mechanics. That would be fantastic

Thorkune · September 2015

I still believe WoW is the best MMO out there right now, although that isn't saying much for the genre. Blizzard needs to quit trying to make radical changes to the game. I feel that the beginning of the end started right after cataclysm was released. They should have focused on new classes and expansions that helped enhance the story at the time, not introduce new cultures and continents that didn't make sense. /2cents

Xiaoki · September 2015

The tin foil hat guesstimating about Chinese subscribers makes this article/forum troll rant just pure GOLD. Did this really need to be an article MMORPG.COM? Also, it amazes me that people are still so hung up over WoWs numbers and 11 years later giving their best arm chair analyst prediction on how WoW can pull itself out of this death spiral. Well, I guess, for starters WoW could try not being an 11 year old game. Oh ...wait

laserit · September 2015

Depressing:

10 billion in gross revenue as of 2012 and look at the game today.

Imagine if they put 5% a year back into development... I wonder what type of game we would have today.

A company "Trumpf" that I purchase High-tech equipment from, invests 40% of revenues back into R&D and it shows.

Alverant · September 2015

The big problem is anything Blizzard does next in terms of an MMO will have to have everything WoW has now and WoW has been developing for over a decade now. So all those zones, daily activities, crafting, making helpless creatures fight each other for your amusement, housing, etc will have to be in any new game from the getgo or else people aren't going to like it. It's simply too big of a task even for Blizzard.

Bladestrom · September 2015

It wasn't too big a task for wildstar, the issue is greed.

Bladestrom · September 2015

Or eso or gw2

deniter · September 2015

Alverant said:

The big problem is anything Blizzard does next in terms of an MMO will have to have everything WoW has now and WoW has been developing for over a decade now. So all those zones, daily activities, crafting, making helpless creatures fight each other for your amusement, housing, etc will have to be in any new game from the getgo or else people aren't going to like it. It's simply too big of a task even for Blizzard.

I wouldn't mind if they just destroyed everything they have done in past 5-6 years. I could even consider subscribing again then.

Then they should continue the development keeping mind what made their game great in the first place.

But i agree, it's too big of a task for everyone, also for Blizzard. And the game is over 10 years old; it's not really worth it anyway.

danielmark · September 2015

As an long departed WoW subscriber with multiple toons that were max-level at the time, I keep being amazed at the 7 day free passes that I get from Blizzard from time to time. Either Blizzard has a poor marketing department failing to tap into a potential nostalgic market with unappealing offers (I don't even want to waste bandwidth for a download on a 7 day time frame let alone play time) or isn't really interested in expending any additional money for such gains - which may say something about their forecasts.

Warlyx · September 2015

laserit said:

Depressing:

10 billion in gross revenue as of 2012 and look at the game today.

Imagine if they put 5% a year back into development... I wonder what type of game we would have today.

A company "Trumpf" that I purchase High-tech equipment from, invests 40% of revenues back into R&D and it shows.

this x1000 with the amount of money WOW has made....and how little has got invested back...is a joke that we dont get new dungeons in expansions anymore because it cost money to do and ppl rush it and dont visit it after that......thats half true, half lie , until WoD ppl revisited dungeons for currency, is just simple greed and lazynes...scenearios were a fucking joke. And we dont even get that anymore...

creating content in wow is easy now , there are like 10 types of tree , 10 types of bulding , terrain is easyly generated , the only issue is the !$!$! quest text , i dont need 100 lines to tell me , please kill 10 boars again....

blizz is busy working on other projects and its have been showing , HOTS , D3/SC expansions , Overwatch , Hearthstone , and of course Legion that have been going when wod got released...

is funny because im sure they work for 1 year and then just do the min to keep raiders happy , some random hub of quests and done (oh some pets/mount in the cash shop while adding recolored crap to raids)....why ppl arent up in arms is beyond me.

Alverant · September 2015

Bladestrom said:

It wasn't too big a task for wildstar, the issue is greed.

I played W*. It took years to develop and most of the population left after the free month. I stuck with it until I could no longer stand the combat. You want greed, look at the players who want everything at once and the companies who try and cater to them.

IcyWiz · September 2015

Yes, they are still making money but they can't ever hope to reclaim the glory days with B2P games, especially GW2 which offers new story chapters on a regular basis. There's too many games to play for free or without a monthly sub for Blizzard to compete if they are going to wait so long between expansions. They are leeching their own subscribers with Hearthstone - people can stay in Azeroth by playing Hearthstone for free. I'm not calling Blizzard stupid or saying other games are perfect...but I don't think Blizzard will ever generate the same buzz, even for a new game, because they are letting WoW die a slow and agonizing death. JMHO,.

Xiaoki · September 2015

Skuall said:

laserit said:

Depressing:

10 billion in gross revenue as of 2012 and look at the game today.

Imagine if they put 5% a year back into development... I wonder what type of game we would have today.

A company "Trumpf" that I purchase High-tech equipment from, invests 40% of revenues back into R&D and it shows.

this x1000 with the amount of money WOW has made....and how little has got invested back...is a joke that we dont get new dungeons in expansions anymore because it cost money to do and ppl rush it and dont visit it after that......thats half true, half lie , until WoD ppl revisited dungeons for currency, is just simple greed and lazynes...scenearios were a fucking joke. And we dont even get that anymore...

creating content in wow is easy now , there are like 10 types of tree , 10 types of bulding , terrain is easyly generated , the only issue is the !$!$! quest text , i dont need 100 lines to tell me , please kill 10 boars again....

blizz is busy working on other projects and its have been showing , HOTS , D3/SC expansions , Overwatch , Hearthstone , and of course Legion that have been going when wod got released...

is funny because im sure they work for 1 year and then just do the min to keep raiders happy , some random hub of quests and done (oh some pets/mount in the cash shop while adding recolored crap to raids)....why ppl arent up in arms is beyond me.

I will never stop finding comments like this hilarious.

It's like people willfully do not understand how business works.

As a subsidiary company to Vivendi SA and now Activision Blizzard, Blizzard does not keep the revenue that WoW makes.

So, you can complain that Blizzard isn't investing that $10 billion back into an you want but all that you will accomplish is exposing yourself.

Also, just to stop any further ignorance I will also inform that Activision, Blizzard and Activision Blizzard are 3 separate companies.

nyxium · September 2015

From what I've observed from playing Warlord's of Draenor, it felt like Blizzard have deliberately destroyed their own game on purpose. It's like some big government agency or other sinister body told Blizz to keep flying out at WoD's launch, put everyone in a garrison prison Facebook game and live on player tears, it will be ok, make money from your other games.
And then Blizz did that, I don't think they were expecting so many sub losses and they literally crapped themselves and have now hurriedly put flying back in after doing their sums on how much cash they have lost and will lose, cursing whatever big higher up told them to deny player flight and stunt players experience with a garrison lock in.
That's what it feels to me. If they do the same for Legion, it could be the death knell swan song for WoW or perhaps F2P. I notice flying will be in Legion, or at least quests are that will eventually lead to player flight. But if trust is now broken in Blizz, irreparable trust, by the player base and quitters, it might be too late.
Also, Demon Hunters look half baked with only two races and two specs, having the cheek to call that a Hero class because it starts at high level when other classes will get a level 100 boost is laughable. It's a half class rather than a Hero class.

Wizardry · September 2015

I could build a case that WOW was not the most influential.
First of all i have never liked anything Blizzard has made.I also was not big on mmorpg idea,i was asked several times to play EQ and scoffed at the idea,i preferred fps's.Also i had no idea Blizzard was a popular developer,i really did not,i personally considered their stuff to be rank amateur game design.

It wasn't until a friend showed me some FF stuff that i said hmmm i like their game design.Then he mentions well they have a mmorpg coming out called FFXI,i was like oh yeah ,interesting.

Point being that Blizzard couldn't remotely catch my interest yet the FF franchise immediately did and i went out and bought all their games.Even after playing FFXI for a couple years,i got an itch to try more MMORPG's so when EQ2 and Wow came out ,i had to try them.Well i lasted al lof one day in WOW i was like this is garbage,nobody will like this,of course i didn't know Blizzard's fanbois following at that time.Geesh i never believed in the term fanbois,i simply sought out the best games to play,i couldn't care less who was making them.

Also Wow happened to benefit from internet becoming fully accessible and affordable and PC's in most homes.All that amounts to is a MUCH larger pool of gamer's to access,it has nothing to do with the game being any good.Then beside that point ,nobody knew weather the game was any good or not,they simply went out and bought it on a whim and being all new mmo gamer's they also had nothing to compare it to.

Last point is that whenever we hear chit chat about Wow,it is ALWAYS pointing at numbers NOT the game itself.There is a huge difference from millions buying a game and judging the actual game.Nobody seems to want to talk about the game but more so those numbers.

cyricson · September 2015

i am sorry to inform you my friend but ppl liked the game...surprise heh? And it was a very good game until mop. omg i was gonna answer every paragraph but the more i read, the more i understand you are just a hater. You played ONE whole day of WoW...amazing!

Kaneth · September 2015

@Wizardry Just because you had no idea what Blizzard was or what WoW was at the time doesn't reduce the influence the game has had on the genre. Additionally, the prevalence of the internet and PCs in the home is a much smaller factor to WoW's success than people think. The prevalence of the internet and PCs in the home benefited the gaming market as a whole, not just WoW. With all of that said, if WoW wasn't a good game in the eyes of millions it never would have reached the numbers it has over the years. Many will buy a game, you can look at sales for numerous flash-in-the-pan games and see that they could move boxes. However, people won't stick with a game if they don't find it fun. WoW was/is fun for millions, and ultimately 'fun' is the determining factor behind a good game. Yes you could attempt to build a case that WoW wasn't the most influential, but your case would be wrong. Looking at the history of the genre over the last decade shows how much influence WoW has had since it's release and stellar success. The only other mmo that could claim such large influence would be the original EQ. The influence of EQ is what spawned WoW.

laserit · September 2015

Xiaoki said:

Skuall said:

laserit said:

Depressing:

10 billion in gross revenue as of 2012 and look at the game today.

Imagine if they put 5% a year back into development... I wonder what type of game we would have today.

A company "Trumpf" that I purchase High-tech equipment from, invests 40% of revenues back into R&D and it shows.

this x1000 with the amount of money WOW has made....and how little has got invested back...is a joke that we dont get new dungeons in expansions anymore because it cost money to do and ppl rush it and dont visit it after that......thats half true, half lie , until WoD ppl revisited dungeons for currency, is just simple greed and lazynes...scenearios were a fucking joke. And we dont even get that anymore...

creating content in wow is easy now , there are like 10 types of tree , 10 types of bulding , terrain is easyly generated , the only issue is the !$!$! quest text , i dont need 100 lines to tell me , please kill 10 boars again....

blizz is busy working on other projects and its have been showing , HOTS , D3/SC expansions , Overwatch , Hearthstone , and of course Legion that have been going when wod got released...

is funny because im sure they work for 1 year and then just do the min to keep raiders happy , some random hub of quests and done (oh some pets/mount in the cash shop while adding recolored crap to raids)....why ppl arent up in arms is beyond me.

I will never stop finding comments like this hilarious.

It's like people willfully do not understand how business works.

As a subsidiary company to Vivendi SA and now Activision Blizzard, Blizzard does not keep the revenue that WoW makes.

So, you can complain that Blizzard isn't investing that $10 billion back into an you want but all that you will accomplish is exposing yourself.

Also, just to stop any further ignorance I will also inform that Activision, Blizzard and Activision Blizzard are 3 separate companies.

Perhaps you can explain how the fuck you get 10 billion out of 5% Or does your business savvy leave you with these kinds of math skills?

Cazriel · September 2015

First, Project Titan, Blizzard's next big MMO was scrapped last year. There isn't going to be another MMO from Blizzard. Second, Blizzard already has it's next gen games in place, Hearthstone, Heroes of the Storm, Overwatch. Third, I can make assumptions, too. I assume that a significant player base drops WoW's sub when they are done with new content and moves over to Hearthstone, HotS or Overwatch, where they are free to spend boodles on cards, heroes, mounts, etc. Lastly, this article is pure speculation, with the exception of the "subscriber" numbers, which Blizzard announces. There's nothing newsworthy here.

SavageHorizon · September 2015

Skuall said:

laserit said:

Depressing:

10 billion in gross revenue as of 2012 and look at the game today.

Imagine if they put 5% a year back into development... I wonder what type of game we would have today.

A company "Trumpf" that I purchase High-tech equipment from, invests 40% of revenues back into R&D and it shows.

this x1000 with the amount of money WOW has made....and how little has got invested back...is a joke that we dont get new dungeons in expansions anymore because it cost money to do and ppl rush it and dont visit it after that......thats half true, half lie , until WoD ppl revisited dungeons for currency, is just simple greed and lazynes...scenearios were a fucking joke. And we dont even get that anymore...

creating content in wow is easy now , there are like 10 types of tree , 10 types of bulding , terrain is easyly generated , the only issue is the !$!$! quest text , i dont need 100 lines to tell me , please kill 10 boars again....

blizz is busy working on other projects and its have been showing , HOTS , D3/SC expansions , Overwatch , Hearthstone , and of course Legion that have been going when wod got released...

is funny because im sure they work for 1 year and then just do the min to keep raiders happy , some random hub of quests and done (oh some pets/mount in the cash shop while adding recolored crap to raids)....why ppl arent up in arms is beyond me.

Its a freaking business and just because you don't agree with how they run it don't mean everyone else agrees with you. Fact is it's a winning formula so why freaking change it. I don't like it but many others do. The sooner people get off the "I hope WOW dies" the better it will be for the jaded.

Except that for the moment Wow isn't going anywhere.

SavageHorizon · September 2015

Wizardry said:

I could build a case that WOW was not the most influential.
First of all i have never liked anything Blizzard has made.I also was not big on mmorpg idea,i was asked several times to play EQ and scoffed at the idea,i preferred fps's.Also i had no idea Blizzard was a popular developer,i really did not,i personally considered their stuff to be rank amateur game design.

It wasn't until a friend showed me some FF stuff that i said hmmm i like their game design.Then he mentions well they have a mmorpg coming out called FFXI,i was like oh yeah ,interesting.

Point being that Blizzard couldn't remotely catch my interest yet the FF franchise immediately did and i went out and bought all their games.Even after playing FFXI for a couple years,i got an itch to try more MMORPG's so when EQ2 and Wow came out ,i had to try them.Well i lasted al lof one day in WOW i was like this is garbage,nobody will like this,of course i didn't know Blizzard's fanbois following at that time.Geesh i never believed in the term fanbois,i simply sought out the best games to play,i couldn't care less who was making them.

Also Wow happened to benefit from internet becoming fully accessible and affordable and PC's in most homes.All that amounts to is a MUCH larger pool of gamer's to access,it has nothing to do with the game being any good.Then beside that point ,nobody knew weather the game was any good or not,they simply went out and bought it on a whim and being all new mmo gamer's they also had nothing to compare it to.

Last point is that whenever we hear chit chat about Wow,it is ALWAYS pointing at numbers NOT the game itself.There is a huge difference from millions buying a game and judging the actual game.Nobody seems to want to talk about the game but more so those numbers.

Total rubbish lol, you really talk some nonsense.

Konfess · September 2015

When WoW loses subscribers, they don't go play some other game. They stop gaming, and gaming loses a percentage of its paying customer base. No game is waving a flag and cheering because they stole 5 million gamers away from WoW. The industry is quaking in its boots over the loose. They are desperate for the economy to improve, and for WoW's player base to return to gaming and bring their money back. The spending gaming community is made of WoW subscribers, WoW subscribers who spend money in the cash shop of F2P games (these Whales make up 80% of a games population), non WoW players who spend money on subs or in the cash shop ( <= 20% of population), and P4F (>= lost WoW gamers, gamers who now spend $0 on gaming, seen as lost to gaming). The approximately 6 mil do return to WoW as seen in the rise of WoD subscribers to 10 mil. Once their limited budgets are gone, so are these gamers. Gamers who don't spend money aren't playing anyones games, they are just wasting space that paying customers could occupy. These gamers lost to WoW are not spending what little money they have left on other MMOs. Other MMOs rely on the few remaining WoW subscribers to play their MMOs and spend money there as well.

daltanious · September 2015

Will repeat my previous posts, before Wod I had 22 alts, 11 hode, 11 alliance. Funny thing with Wod is that was very fun to play, enjoyed every minute being in game ... but after barely 1 month I had enough. usually with any expansion (MOP being for me second best slightly only to Wotlk) 6-7 months! I quit having only about 4 maxed out alts. Now I have returned for 2 months, got again grip on game ... and now have again 11 alliance alts + will have in short 3 more in horde .... BUT I have spent for this less then 3 months, with any other expansion to accomplish this I have spent at least 7-8 months!! Obviusly there is much less questing, must be smaller world, ... and they have increased incredibly xp gain. This is insane. And really DEEPLY HATE "new models", we wanted more detail, not plastic surgery for our characters. I have perma turned off new models. Garrisons are NOT housing which players wanted. And they are cause much less players in big cities, no need to gather in wilds, ....Fun at first glance but not good for Wow health. Dual talent spec is just BETTER THEN NOTHING, Blizzard should give players multiple builds. Rift had 6 as I remember since day 1. Now for half year since october I plan to be busy with Swtor, then maybe Gw2, ... waiting for Legion which looks to me being great next expansion. My current list goes Swtor, Wow, Gw2. But Wow is still great game to which newer games can not get even close for quality or fun. For me ESO, FF, Wildstar, TSW, ... are already past for long.

gervaise1 · September 2015

1. How many "$15" subs does WoW have. As a guide we can divide WoW's net revenue - that AB report in their SEC filings - by the average of subs at start of quarter / subs at the end of the quarter. It won't be precise especially as the net revenue number includes everything - subs, royalties, sales, paid transfers, cash shop etc. - but it will give a guide. (Note: net revenue is income after some costs.) Doing this (using the GAAP number for anyone interested) then pre-WoD the value was just under $9 per sub per month. End of 2014 the number was just over $10 - the impact of 3M or whatever WoD sales. Interestingly in the last quarter it was just over $11 - impact of tokens?. As a working hypothesis if there were 50% subs at $15 and 50% at $5 you would get a $10 average. Unknowns: the non-sub income means we could have a nominal $10 with fewer than 50% @ $15; whilst the exclusion of some costs from the net revenue number means we could have $10 and more than 50%. The two unknowns partly off-set each other. What a $9 to $11 number suggests is that Bill's stab at 50% is probably in the right ballpark; maybe 40%, maybe 60% but not 100%.