people are insane about this game, it's hilarious. fighting and raging on both sides. i don't personally care what happens one way or another. i just wanted to say this fighting all over the internet about this is pretty amusing.
Good write up @Rhoklaw! I had never heard of Escapist before this hubub so it was good for me to hear some history about them. I just stick to the pure joy that is mmorpg. What are your thoughts about the id card fiasco?
What you guys fail to realize is the accusations of racism and ageism (discrimination) potentially opens up CIG to lawsuits from anyone that fits certain profiles. Now, I believe that the judge will let a case go forward against Escapist since all CIG has to do is prove that Sandi hired two African Americans that report directly to her to discredit these accusations.
Now, what you guys are also completely missing from this is CIG doesn't necessarily have to be the one filing the lawsuit. Sandi can do it personally with her own money.
There's a big difference between what works to "win" a casual argument between a couple of people and proving something in court.
Proving libel in legal proceedings is not like some schoolyard fight where someone says "Oh yeah? Prove it!" It's not black and white either. It's entirely possible that Sandi has hired a 50 yr old African American AND that she also said don't hire that black girl and joked about people 40+ being harder to fire.
People say all kinds of shit off the cuff when they think they're in a safe environment. We don't know if Sandi is racist and ageist or just has a poor sense of humour and not very smart about who she can joke around with.
I once worked with German-Canadian woman who, for some reason, thought she could speak freely to me, and she told me that she didn't believe the holocaust had actually happened and that it was just propaganda. She was just a co-worker so whatever... I just laughed at her and staid away from her after that. But had she been in any kind of supervisory position I might have taken it further.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
My question had nothing to do with the CIG and The Escapist. I was more interested in the responses in these threads......and that goes for both sides really. There are accusations thrown out there. My real question is, what makes people convicted in their own beliefs, taken to the extremes they've been taken too when there are no real facts offered.
I'm going to play devil's advocate here........What if Derek Smart was right and was acting on more than just a hunch? What if the Escapist truly did their due diligence prior to publishing and this all comes out in the end? What does that say about those who came blindly defending the project? Why? On what evidence? But it's not just the one side. There are those who have also vilified CR and CIG. What if you are wrong? Regardless of our opinions, the Truth is the Truth...whether we like it or not. Why wouldn't we want it to be revealed as is? If I were a firm believer in CR and CIG, I'd be wanting to see the truth too. So this can all go away and we can move on to something more important. If I have doubts, I would certainly want to see the truth.
The point is.....when this is over, no matter how this ends, some of you will have made complete fools of yourselves. And for what? Who have you helped? Who have you hurt?
My question had nothing to do with the CIG and The Escapist. I was more interested in the responses in these threads......and that goes for both sides really. There are accusations thrown out there. My real question is, what makes people convicted in their own beliefs, taken to the extremes they've been taken too when there are no real facts offered.
I'm going to play devil's advocate here........What if Derek Smart was right and was acting on more than just a hunch? What if the Escapist truly did their due diligence prior to publishing and this all comes out in the end? What does that say about those who came blindly defending the project? Why? On what evidence? But it's not just the one side. There are those who have also vilified CR and CIG. What if you are wrong? Regardless of our opinions, the Truth is the Truth...whether we like it or not. Why wouldn't we want it to be revealed as is? If I were a firm believer in CR and CIG, I'd be wanting to see the truth too. So this can all go away and we can move on to something more important. If I have doubts, I would certainly want to see the truth.
The point is.....when this is over, no matter how this ends, some of you will have made complete fools of yourselves. And for what? Who have you helped? Who have you hurt?
It will matter little. Those in the wrong (whichever side it will be) will most likely still come up with justifications or deflections in support of their faith/disdain. You see it in all aspects of life. Some egos just can't admit defeat or siding with the 'losing' team, so make up different arguments to 'save face'.
It's the nature of things...with David Suzuki (Had to).
There must be some sensitive people here, this is the first time i have ever had a warning on any forum saying that i am trolling. lol
I would like to know what they think i wrote was a troll, like i said to the message back to the person who sent the message, getting a point a across isn't trolling nor is writing negative posts, what i consider as trolling is someone who makes fun of a topic for their own amusement.
When did writing negative posts become trolling ?
I like to know what these negative comments from what i have posted are.
I only wrote this here because it's obviously something i wrote about Star Citizen
There must be some sensitive people here, this is the first time i have ever had a warning on any forum saying that i am trolling. lol
I would like to know what they think i wrote was a troll, like i said to the message back to the person who sent the message, getting a point a across isn't trolling nor is writing negative posts, what i consider as trolling is someone who makes fun of a topic for their own amusement.
When did writing negative posts become trolling ?
I like to know what these negative comments from what i have posted.
That's for a mod to answer, they are the ones that took that decision. Bringing it up here is pointless and looks more like playing the victim than trying to see and understand the reprimand.
There must be some sensitive people here, this is the first time i have ever had a warning on any forum saying that i am trolling. lol
I would like to know what they think i wrote was a troll, like i said to the message back to the person who sent the message, getting a point a across isn't trolling nor is writing negative posts, what i consider as trolling is someone who makes fun of a topic for their own amusement.
When did writing negative posts become trolling ?
I like to know what these negative comments from what i have posted.
That's for a mod to answer, they are the ones that took that decision. Bringing it up here is pointless and looks more like playing the victim than trying to see and understand the reprimand.
I am not playing the victim i am just looking for answers, i have sent a message back to the person who sent the warning but no reply as yet.
I am not playing the victim i am just looking for answers, i have sent a message back to the person who sent the warning but no reply as yet.
Then wait for an answer? Why bring it up as I said. You'll only get responses that will say, 'When you said X to Y it was considered trolling.' to which you'll most likely respond 'That's not trolling' and the ensuing circular argument won't end. My advice, don't worry about. Breathe, go about your day and forget about how someone took slight offense to one of your posts.
I am not playing the victim i am just looking for answers, i have sent a message back to the person who sent the warning but no reply as yet.
Then wait for an answer? Why bring it up as I said. You'll only get responses that will say, 'When you said X to Y it was considered trolling.' to which you'll most likely respond 'That's not trolling' and the ensuing circular argument won't end. My advice, don't worry about. Breathe, go about your day and forget about how someone took slight offense to one of your posts.
I was just shocked to come back to see this message in my mail, I even left a guild once in a game because someone kept trolling and flaming this other guild in world chat, i didn't want to be associated with that and told me a lot of the guild leader to let it carry on so decided to leave wasn't the guild for me.
Will SC have PeeeeeeeeeeeeVeeeeeeeeeeePeeeeeeeeeeeeeee?
Yes.
In that regard its a bit like a "Light" version of EVE Online.
PvP is - in principle - possible everywhere. But there will be a slider in the options section that carebears can push all the way to the PvE side, greatly reducing the possibility of a PvP encounter (keep in mind that 90 % of the encounters and 90 % of the ships you meet should be NPCs).
Also ... if they stay in the heavily (NPC) policed inner systems the advocacy will quickly join any fights on the side of the carebear ... and blast you out of the sky, like CONCORD in EVE.
Furthermore, a carebear can use stealth technology and various techniques ("silent running") to not be detected by PvP players and/or use advanced sensors to detect and avoid hostile encounters before they are detected themselves.
However ... A fat slow high signature merchant carebear ship in an outlying pirate invested border system can slide the PvE/PvP slider to whichever setting it wants, there IS a high possibility that (s)he is begging for a fatal PvP encounter. And the pilot will be smeared all over the cockpit window by a pirate boarding party acting with extreme prejudice. Unless they destroy him outright (shame, nice full cargo modules should not go to waste !).
As SC has a "Death of a Spaceman" permadeath mechanic (that allows only for a very limited amount of screen deaths) any death at the hands of pirates hurts. Expect something like death 1-3 to be ok (wake up in escape pod), death 4-5 to cost you a hand or a foot (wake up in hospital), death 6-7 an arm/leg/plate in your skull (Hello cyborg !, wakey wakey in your "Bacta tank") and death 8 means you finally kick the bucket forever. Your heir takes over all your remaining possession. The numbers are guesses at the moment, but plausible. Thats why its so important to have an Endeavor class "Hope" hospital ship or at least a Cutlass ambulance ship in the area, as it negates (full or partially) the death penalties.
In PvP you will also be able to do non lethal attacks, hacking attacks, boarding, smuggling yourself onto the ship in the cargo pods and killing the crew, go traitor and kill the crew, hit the self destruct and blow away the boarders etc.
Have fun
PS:
for the more competition minded not interested in the Persistent Universe PvP ...
the current Arena Commander dogfight module already has PvP fights - see leaderboards on SC homepage. Plus racing tracks for the non-violent PvP player.
The upcoming FPS module has a PvP arena (pirates vs marine, capture a space station) and a non-violent (kinda ;-) sports game called SATABALL (think of the zero g training scene in Enders Game).
I was just shocked to come back to see this message in my mail, I even left a guild once in a game because someone kept trolling and flaming this other guild in world chat, i didn't want to be associated with that and told me a lot of the guild leader to let it carry on so decided to leave wasn't the guild for me.
If that's true, then you have absolutely nothing to worry about since it was a misunderstanding. You can only control what you say not how others understand what you say.
I wouldn't worry about it. Wasted stress if you ask me.
Don't sweat it, everyone has been accused of troll posting around here. This is the age of being offended. Own what you need to own and let the rest go.
I was just shocked to come back to see this message in my mail, I even left a guild once in a game because someone kept trolling and flaming this other guild in world chat, i didn't want to be associated with that and told me a lot of the guild leader to let it carry on so decided to leave wasn't the guild for me.
If that's true, then you have absolutely nothing to worry about since it was a misunderstanding. You can only control what you say not how others understand what you say.
I wouldn't worry about it. Wasted stress if you ask me.
Yes it's true i was playing on a private server of allods online called allodspvp it turned into a big argument when i brought the subject up on our guild forum so i ended up leaving.
Yes it's true i was playing on a private server of allods online called allodspvp it turned into a big argument when i brought the subject up on our guild forum so i ended up leaving.
Well, I hope this little hiccup won't turn into that Allods one for you. The more, the merrier as the saying goes.
Yes it's true i was playing on a private server of allods online called allodspvp it turned into a big argument when i brought the subject up on our guild forum so i ended up leaving.
Well, I hope this little hiccup won't turn into that Allods one for you. The more, the merrier as the saying goes.
I don't play there any more i went to try FFIX, played the whitemage as i wanted to heal but for some reason when i was playing the game it kept shutting my computer off although it didn't happen any other time except from when playing FFIV, i also wasn't keen on the global cooldowns never played a game with that before so stopped playing after the first month of subscription.
I am playing on another private server of allods online at the moment called allods storm, which is mainly russian people but some speak english.
I am going to keep an eye on what pantheon produces i know they are going to have a cleric class but i am not going to donate.
This is something i did on allodstorm and i still got some criticism for it, it was a competition what i did for the faction i am in and was my own gold and people acted like it was an official competition.
So after all the fuss, will Chris Roberts and CIG file a lawsuit against The Escapist or not?
As far as the public knows, no. No, they did not file a lawsuit.
They better or this gets worse for everyone. We know a felony/or felonies were committed at this point. A: E is lying and made this up or a group lied to them. That's a conspiracy to commit fraud/blackmail whatever B: some/all the felonious allegations against RSI are accurate It only works two ways. And with the attention its starting to get in general and with the rank cowardice of other gaming media outlets involved in not either factually debunking or confirming the FTC among others almost have to start an inquiry at the minimum absent a lawsuit, their mandate almost demands it.
And if you think for a second such will stay isolated to E RSI in an industry as insular, inter-connected. un-regulated, and isloated as gaming you are naïve. In investigating those two it won't be able to avoid tripping over a few strings, then a few more.
Update:The Escapist, notwithstanding Cloud Imperium Games' notice and posting, stands by its coverage of Star Citizen and intends to continue to investigate the developing story. Since publishing our original stories, we have been contacted by, and are currently interviewing, additional sources corroborating a variety of the reported allegations. Additionally, if Mr. Roberts' offer for The Escapist to "meet the developers making the game and see how we're building one of the most ambitious PC games first hand" remains open, we take the opportunity to accept such invitation so as to hopefully provide the public with sufficient information and opportunity to vet such sources' allegations and claims for themselves. We have also communicated the foregoing directly to Cloud Imperium Games.
Or they won't file suit and nothing serious will happen, which I think is more likely.
Nothing will happen to the Escapist. Nothing will happen to CIG.
All the drama queens on here who are hoping for something to keep them entertained may be disappointed.
From what I can tell, this drama has only benefited both the Escapist and CIG. Escapist made a ton of money on clicks and CIG made a ton of money on donations (1 million in a week) and added a bunch more new backers. Why should either company care about negative publicity? Apparently it doesn't matter - they both make money regardless. More than normal, in fact.
Unless the money does run out (which is ridiculously unlikely considering that CIG could always get private investor funds or a line of credit), then the game will get made regardless of "image". This is the part I don't get by the crusaders against CIG. Unless you truly believe that it's a Bernie Madoff type scam, then nothing you say or do is going to adversely affect this game's development.
And if you do believe it's a scam, then I'm willing to bet that you also think you were abducted by aliens and anally probed.
Most of the sources who are riding on the Derek Deadman Smarts Train are sources who never covered S.C. and they ar eusing this hype to sell advertising page views.
A Law suit of defamation agains Deadman Smart and Ecapist would suceed with one demo of the game in court. As well as an outline of the entire processes that SC took to get to where they are.
Deadman Smart is building a lot of powerful enemies right now. I see him fading out of this sooner then later. Words only go so far in this world.
Yeah "Powerful enemies"/....
Arent you guys glad we have crowdfunding to get away from those evil publishers?
That aside, DS has the grass roots. And Powerful Enemies are going to come crashing down because they are unethical, unscrupulous and things are now beginning to come to light.
What happens when it comes out that Deadman Smarrt has been getting paid to cause this ruckus ? (speculation since that is what all of this is)
Paid by who?
Exactly ? Isn't a worthy question to ask if someone is getting some kind of kickback for trolling SC or causing the game to fail ? I can only think of a handful of games to cater to that audience...
I had a brief conspiracy theory moment earlier this week. I was thinking that a great scam would be to raise 90 million in non-enforceably-refundable crowdfunding, gin up some kind of controversy from a third party like DS, and then fold up shop due to "legal fees" or other company breaking issues such as unethical hiring practices. Then you simply abscond with tens of millions of dollars.
Unfortunately there's a few things that don't add up in my theory such as opening other studios in Austin. If you're planning on escaping with as much money as possible then you keep as small a team as you can and produce as little content as you can. Also, Chris Roberts is not Stanley Kubric; there's no way he could come up with a plan this complex.
Meanwhile a year from now:
*Sounds of waves gently crashing on a sandy shore - Fade in to Chris Roberts sitting on a beach chair overlooking the ocean in some non-extradition country while sipping an umbrella drink*
"I have to give it to you," Chris says to a man sitting in a chair next to him with a hat covering his face, "This worked out perfectly!"
"Remember what I said, Chris?' The man says as he removes the hat and takes a sip of his drink "What's that, Derek?" Chris inquires. *Camera pans to reveal Derek Smart as the man in the hat* "There is a sucker born every minute"
*Pan out and fade to black*
*Credits roll*
*insert Lizzy in a maid uniform serving the drinks saying " it is to ur liking mister smart?" in an juvenile voice and its perfect.
Comments
Proving libel in legal proceedings is not like some schoolyard fight where someone says "Oh yeah? Prove it!" It's not black and white either. It's entirely possible that Sandi has hired a 50 yr old African American AND that she also said don't hire that black girl and joked about people 40+ being harder to fire.
People say all kinds of shit off the cuff when they think they're in a safe environment. We don't know if Sandi is racist and ageist or just has a poor sense of humour and not very smart about who she can joke around with.
I once worked with German-Canadian woman who, for some reason, thought she could speak freely to me, and she told me that she didn't believe the holocaust had actually happened and that it was just propaganda. She was just a co-worker so whatever... I just laughed at her and staid away from her after that. But had she been in any kind of supervisory position I might have taken it further.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
I'm going to play devil's advocate here........What if Derek Smart was right and was acting on more than just a hunch? What if the Escapist truly did their due diligence prior to publishing and this all comes out in the end? What does that say about those who came blindly defending the project? Why? On what evidence? But it's not just the one side. There are those who have also vilified CR and CIG. What if you are wrong? Regardless of our opinions, the Truth is the Truth...whether we like it or not. Why wouldn't we want it to be revealed as is? If I were a firm believer in CR and CIG, I'd be wanting to see the truth too. So this can all go away and we can move on to something more important. If I have doubts, I would certainly want to see the truth.
The point is.....when this is over, no matter how this ends, some of you will have made complete fools of yourselves. And for what? Who have you helped? Who have you hurt?
You see it in all aspects of life. Some egos just can't admit defeat or siding with the 'losing' team, so make up different arguments to 'save face'.
It's the nature of things...with David Suzuki
I would like to know what they think i wrote was a troll, like i said to the message back to the person who sent the message, getting a point a across isn't trolling nor is writing negative posts, what i consider as trolling is someone who makes fun of a topic for their own amusement.
When did writing negative posts become trolling ?
I like to know what these negative comments from what i have posted are.
I only wrote this here because it's obviously something i wrote about Star Citizen
New players can get a welcome package and old/returning players can also get a welcome back package and 7 days free subscription time! Just click here to use my referral invitation
My advice, don't worry about. Breathe, go about your day and forget about how someone took slight offense to one of your posts.
In that regard its a bit like a "Light" version of EVE Online.
PvP is - in principle - possible everywhere. But there will be a slider in the options section that carebears can push all the way to the PvE side, greatly reducing the possibility of a PvP encounter (keep in mind that 90 % of the encounters and 90 % of the ships you meet should be NPCs).
Also ... if they stay in the heavily (NPC) policed inner systems the advocacy will quickly join any fights on the side of the carebear ... and blast you out of the sky, like CONCORD in EVE.
Furthermore, a carebear can use stealth technology and various techniques ("silent running") to not be detected by PvP players and/or use advanced sensors to detect and avoid hostile encounters before they are detected themselves.
However ... A fat slow high signature merchant carebear ship in an outlying pirate invested border system can slide the PvE/PvP slider to whichever setting it wants, there IS a high possibility that (s)he is begging for a fatal PvP encounter. And the pilot will be smeared all over the cockpit window by a pirate boarding party acting with extreme prejudice. Unless they destroy him outright (shame, nice full cargo modules should not go to waste !).
As SC has a "Death of a Spaceman" permadeath mechanic (that allows only for a very limited amount of screen deaths) any death at the hands of pirates hurts. Expect something like death 1-3 to be ok (wake up in escape pod), death 4-5 to cost you a hand or a foot (wake up in hospital), death 6-7 an arm/leg/plate in your skull (Hello cyborg !, wakey wakey in your "Bacta tank") and death 8 means you finally kick the bucket forever. Your heir takes over all your remaining possession. The numbers are guesses at the moment, but plausible. Thats why its so important to have an Endeavor class "Hope" hospital ship or at least a Cutlass ambulance ship in the area, as it negates (full or partially) the death penalties.
In PvP you will also be able to do non lethal attacks, hacking attacks, boarding, smuggling yourself onto the ship in the cargo pods and killing the crew, go traitor and kill the crew, hit the self destruct and blow away the boarders etc.
Have fun
PS:
for the more competition minded not interested in the Persistent Universe PvP ...
the current Arena Commander dogfight module already has PvP fights - see leaderboards on SC homepage. Plus racing tracks for the non-violent PvP player.
The upcoming FPS module has a PvP arena (pirates vs marine, capture a space station) and a non-violent (kinda ;-) sports game called SATABALL (think of the zero g training scene in Enders Game).
I wouldn't worry about it. Wasted stress if you ask me.
How much better though, if only.......idunno.........a little restraint maybe?
I am playing on another private server of allods online at the moment called allods storm, which is mainly russian people but some speak english.
I am going to keep an eye on what pantheon produces i know they are going to have a cleric class but i am not going to donate.
This is something i did on allodstorm and i still got some criticism for it, it was a competition what i did for the faction i am in and was my own gold and people acted like it was an official competition.
http://forum.allods-storm.ru/index.php?/topic/1971-competition/
Update: The Escapist, notwithstanding Cloud Imperium Games' notice and posting, stands by its coverage of Star Citizen and intends to continue to investigate the developing story. Since publishing our original stories, we have been contacted by, and are currently interviewing, additional sources corroborating a variety of the reported allegations. Additionally, if Mr. Roberts' offer for The Escapist to "meet the developers making the game and see how we're building one of the most ambitious PC games first hand" remains open, we take the opportunity to accept such invitation so as to hopefully provide the public with sufficient information and opportunity to vet such sources' allegations and claims for themselves. We have also communicated the foregoing directly to Cloud Imperium Games.
Looks like they're not only doubling down, but claiming they have more sources as well.
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/video-games/14727-The-Escapist-Explains-Its-Star-Citizen-Sources-Vetting-and-Respo
Nothing will happen to the Escapist. Nothing will happen to CIG.
All the drama queens on here who are hoping for something to keep them entertained may be disappointed.
From what I can tell, this drama has only benefited both the Escapist and CIG. Escapist made a ton of money on clicks and CIG made a ton of money on donations (1 million in a week) and added a bunch more new backers. Why should either company care about negative publicity? Apparently it doesn't matter - they both make money regardless. More than normal, in fact.
Unless the money does run out (which is ridiculously unlikely considering that CIG could always get private investor funds or a line of credit), then the game will get made regardless of "image". This is the part I don't get by the crusaders against CIG. Unless you truly believe that it's a Bernie Madoff type scam, then nothing you say or do is going to adversely affect this game's development.
And if you do believe it's a scam, then I'm willing to bet that you also think you were abducted by aliens and anally probed.