After seeing all the footage of the game, the streams, Q&A and interviews I've started to grow a small concern...
VR always seems to refer to their own classes as if they were the same as they use to be in EQ - it's seems already given that a shaman roll will be his great slow of attack speed, enchanters to increase mana regeneration and CC, clerics to be the master healer, warriors to be tanks, wizards to nuke - then we can guess what the rest of the classes will do.
This may not be an issue, but I'm concerned that the classes will not diviate and you will feel you are playing same game on a different engine.
I hope they will add more diverse classes where the stereotype of EQ is broken up a bit. And VR may already be planing this with their special abilities coming through epic quest and so...
But the talk where EQ is mentioned nearly always when talking classes and rolls got me a bit concerned - what about you? Is it only me who have these butterflies in the stomach?
I think millions of us in the MMO world have been wanting the 'NEXT EQ'.
I really have no problem with Pantheon being that. I want the game to be meaningful in all ways. I want to earn my loot, earn my level, and make friends along the way building that teamwork that - to date- only EQ and nurtured.
Class-wise, I am a bit disappointed that so far the classes seem to be verbatim copies of EQ.
What I am concerned about is that I hope the classes aren't on the same power scale as EQ was.
Meaning,
-rangers are terrible (if anyone remembers when EQ 1st started they were super! then warriors complained about them and rangers got nerfed really hard)
-warriors are the only tank that really matters ( I never understood this at all, as EQ had terrible damage mitigation mechanics for players. Even warriors seem to take a ton of damage in EQ, the only mitigation that was worth anything was HP and heals)
-hybrids were watered down and underpowered versions of their parent classes: I sincerely hope that crusaders and dire lords will be equal in all regards to a warrior for tanking; just using different mechanisms to achieve it.
bards- this is the only class that I hope remains the same, especially the twisting. To date this is the most unique class of any mmo made.
My biggest concern with this game is that there seems to be a giant echo chamber among the fanbase that shouts down any deviation from EQ as terrible and should not be implemented. For example, people who think that 8 hour corpse recoveries are a good design. Sorry, I have a full time job, house, and girlfriend. Requiring me to stay up until 3 AM because something went wrong is not good design.
Likewise, I don't want 24 hour JBoot camps, spending 15 minutes to recover mana, sitting on by butt doing nothing because my group can't find a healer, etc. An EQ-like game is a welcome change, but seriously, people need to take off the rose-covered glasses and recognize that EQ had some SERIOUS flaws that we only tolerated back then because despite its flaws, it was still by far the best game available.
The only echo chamber is the one inside your head where you keep telling yourself this is the case. If you bothered to actually read threads started by people like me and dullahan and other fans of the project, you would realize we've NEVER ONCE advocated for a copy of EQ with a modern engine.
Most of us are smart enough to realize that EQ wasn't MMO perfection. However, we feel it had more right about it than current mmos do. What we want is a return to class interdependency and movement away from quest hubs, faceroll easy dungeons/content, teleporting everywhere, etc.
The rest of it is secondary. As long as they get those main points right I don't really care if the rest of it isn't EXACTLY what I personally want.
I don't see it this way at all. Almost every single post that even remotely suggests that 'a return to 1999 is a questionable idea' is met with derision and ridicule. It's this die-hard defense of the Pantheon project by fans and even developers that creates and perpetuates this echo chamber concept.
Yes, there's a lot of unrest in the MMORPG community. Posts pointing out those very same problems you acknowledge that contributed to EQ being perfection aren't attacks on any individual, but they do cause emotional responses in those who think the foundations laid down by EQ1 were perfect. Disagreement is being interpreted as being akin to assaulting someone's beliefs. That frequently isn't the case. Perhaps those who defend any perceived slight to their version of the gold standard are influenced by a rose-tinted view of history, perhaps not.
@sirphobos made a point about proponents 'shouting down deviation'. Your response introduced the concept that no has 'advocated a copy of EQ with a modern engine'. But, that is precisely what a 'new EQ with modern graphics' is, and that request / wish is everywhere on these forums. Your reply to him was essentially an attempt to shout down his idea, or at least bury it. So your response merely validates his observation.
Waiting is the main issue that @sirphobos seemed to be against. Overly long camps like the JBoots camp (I'd add the Ghoulbane camp as even worse), or waiting for mana, or waiting for the 'correct' class to join a group. Waiting is a concern for many people, myself included. Since Pantheon is going to include solo, group and raid content (per Brad somewhere in these forums), waiting will be an issue. How long will individuals wait to join a group / raid before they go off and solo something. When they do get a group invitation while they were soloing, how long will the rest of the group be asked to wait while this individual joins up?
Waiting is a tangible issue that could seriously threaten the success of Pantheon. I have not heard of any mechanism to remotely inject players with a serious dose of patience (nor would I want that). But waiting was the result of the large time commitments that playing EQ1 required. Using the same fundamental model is very likely to produce the same undesirable side-effect. That's the concern.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
My biggest concern with this game is that there seems to be a giant echo chamber among the fanbase that shouts down any deviation from EQ as terrible and should not be implemented. For example, people who think that 8 hour corpse recoveries are a good design. Sorry, I have a full time job, house, and girlfriend. Requiring me to stay up until 3 AM because something went wrong is not good design.
Likewise, I don't want 24 hour JBoot camps, spending 15 minutes to recover mana, sitting on by butt doing nothing because my group can't find a healer, etc. An EQ-like game is a welcome change, but seriously, people need to take off the rose-covered glasses and recognize that EQ had some SERIOUS flaws that we only tolerated back then because despite its flaws, it was still by far the best game available.
The only echo chamber is the one inside your head where you keep telling yourself this is the case. If you bothered to actually read threads started by people like me and dullahan and other fans of the project, you would realize we've NEVER ONCE advocated for a copy of EQ with a modern engine.
Most of us are smart enough to realize that EQ wasn't MMO perfection. However, we feel it had more right about it than current mmos do. What we want is a return to class interdependency and movement away from quest hubs, faceroll easy dungeons/content, teleporting everywhere, etc.
The rest of it is secondary. As long as they get those main points right I don't really care if the rest of it isn't EXACTLY what I personally want.
I never said you. I see a lot of it on Reddit and on the official forum. Anything that isn't 100% like EQ is considered terrible and anything that is pulled directly from EQ is automatically awesome.
I've had this concern for awhile. Graphic improvements appear to be the main selling point of this title, maybe with a bit of juggled abilities between classes and a thesaurus thrown at the terminology. I just do not believe that these are the tools to build a new captivating game.
I am afraid the experience will be too much 'exactly like' 1999, particularly all the social issues that EQ1 inadvertently introduced. Waiting 2 hours for a cleric because a shaman or druid can't do the job of healing, or waiting for an enchanter to finish crafting before joining us, or the warrior (not paladin or shadow knight -- they couldn't cut it) to find his way to zone X without dying half a dozen times. If there are only a few combat roles, with a very few classes that can perform those functions, simply reduce the number of classes or builds or whatever to accommodate the way the community is expected to play. If clerics, shamans and druids aren't interchangeable, get rid of the variations and make a single class, the healer, which has a better chance of becoming 1/6th of the population.
If people want to think that these type of flaws are the convention and are a desired element, that's their prerogative. To me, incorporating these issues is a mistake that could threaten the success of this game.
a lot of that is what made EQ really fun.
This also led to a robust PLAYER driven economy where people would shout in zone for a teleport, or clerics would offer then reduced exp penalty rezes for steep fees.
Druids would sell SoWs for steep fees.
I remember when, on Eci, the first player, Aaliyl become the only player that could make plate armor. And it cost a TON.
These are just a few of the things that make EQ really stand out IMO
The game does seem a bit like plagiarism to me. Completely shameless in the way they've basically cloned EverQuest.
You could make that argument about every MMO because EQ was the precursor to every other 3D MMO. Almost every game out there uses UI elements, controls, systems, quests mechanics, or fight mechanics... all originating from EQ.
If you really wanted to get technical about it, EQ "stole" the class and race designs from Dungeons & Dragons, or from Tolkein and Lord of the Rings.
All that aside, I'm not just unconcerned with the likenesses Pantheon has to Everquest in class design. I'm looking forward to it. While there are multitudes of games that have many of the same class backstories, none offer them in a gameworld with the mechanics I enjoy. Coupling original gameplay concepts with original class theories (mostly) is like a homecoming that I've been on the lookout for over a decade for.
just like WoW stole directly from Warhammer as well. Warhammer existed long before WoW came along.
I want the fear of death to become a reality in games again!! Corpse run, loot on corpse for only 1 day, and you lose all the exp you gained during that play session!!!! Lets make it happen!!!
After seeing all the footage of the game, the streams, Q&A and interviews I've started to grow a small concern...
VR always seems to refer to their own classes as if they were the same as they use to be in EQ - it's seems already given that a shaman roll will be his great slow of attack speed, enchanters to increase mana regeneration and CC, clerics to be the master healer, warriors to be tanks, wizards to nuke - then we can guess what the rest of the classes will do.
This may not be an issue, but I'm concerned that the classes will not diviate and you will feel you are playing same game on a different engine.
I hope they will add more diverse classes where the stereotype of EQ is broken up a bit. And VR may already be planing this with their special abilities coming through epic quest and so...
But the talk where EQ is mentioned nearly always when talking classes and rolls got me a bit concerned - what about you? Is it only me who have these butterflies in the stomach?
I think millions of us in the MMO world have been wanting the 'NEXT EQ'.
I really have no problem with Pantheon being that. I want the game to be meaningful in all ways. I want to earn my loot, earn my level, and make friends along the way building that teamwork that - to date- only EQ and nurtured.
Class-wise, I am a bit disappointed that so far the classes seem to be verbatim copies of EQ.
What I am concerned about is that I hope the classes aren't on the same power scale as EQ was.
Meaning, -rangers are terrible (if anyone remembers when EQ 1st started they were super! then warriors complained about them and rangers got nerfed really hard)
-warriors are the only tank that really matters ( I never understood this at all, as EQ had terrible damage mitigation mechanics for players. Even warriors seem to take a ton of damage in EQ, the only mitigation that was worth anything was HP and heals)
-hybrids were watered down and underpowered versions of their parent classes: I sincerely hope that crusaders and dire lords will be equal in all regards to a warrior for tanking; just using different mechanisms to achieve it.
bards- this is the only class that I hope remains the same, especially the twisting. To date this is the most unique class of any mmo made.
I agree with all of those assessments on classes. Hybrids were a bit underpowered in EQ. SK and paladin were both only useful as group tanks in the early years. I'd hope they can find ways to give them times to shine and be key in group and raid scenarios.
I also hope for bards at launch, because crowd control is an important job and I think it's necessary to have a class that can provide that besides the enchanter. Same situation as with EQ clerics, every role should have an alternative.
I want the fear of death to become a reality in games again!! Corpse run, loot on corpse for only 1 day, and you lose all the exp you gained during that play session!!!! Lets make it happen!!!
Yeah let's not, we're some that grew older, got less time and have a career and family...
After seeing all the footage of the game, the streams, Q&A and interviews I've started to grow a small concern...
VR always seems to refer to their own classes as if they were the same as they use to be in EQ - it's seems already given that a shaman roll will be his great slow of attack speed, enchanters to increase mana regeneration and CC, clerics to be the master healer, warriors to be tanks, wizards to nuke - then we can guess what the rest of the classes will do.
This may not be an issue, but I'm concerned that the classes will not diviate and you will feel you are playing same game on a different engine.
I hope they will add more diverse classes where the stereotype of EQ is broken up a bit. And VR may already be planing this with their special abilities coming through epic quest and so...
But the talk where EQ is mentioned nearly always when talking classes and rolls got me a bit concerned - what about you? Is it only me who have these butterflies in the stomach?
I think millions of us in the MMO world have been wanting the 'NEXT EQ'.
I really have no problem with Pantheon being that. I want the game to be meaningful in all ways. I want to earn my loot, earn my level, and make friends along the way building that teamwork that - to date- only EQ and nurtured.
Class-wise, I am a bit disappointed that so far the classes seem to be verbatim copies of EQ.
What I am concerned about is that I hope the classes aren't on the same power scale as EQ was.
Meaning, -rangers are terrible (if anyone remembers when EQ 1st started they were super! then warriors complained about them and rangers got nerfed really hard)
-warriors are the only tank that really matters ( I never understood this at all, as EQ had terrible damage mitigation mechanics for players. Even warriors seem to take a ton of damage in EQ, the only mitigation that was worth anything was HP and heals)
-hybrids were watered down and underpowered versions of their parent classes: I sincerely hope that crusaders and dire lords will be equal in all regards to a warrior for tanking; just using different mechanisms to achieve it.
bards- this is the only class that I hope remains the same, especially the twisting. To date this is the most unique class of any mmo made.
I agree with all of those assessments on classes. Hybrids were a bit underpowered in EQ. SK and paladin were both only useful as group tanks in the early years. I'd hope they can find ways to give them times to shine and be key in group and raid scenarios.
I also hope for bards at launch, because crowd control is an important job and I think it's necessary to have a class that can provide that besides the enchanter. Same situation as with EQ clerics, every role should have an alternative.
Honestly they just needed tweaks. I think the paladin/SK vs warrior paradigm was fine. The issue was mainly that nobody could function as a sole healer in a group other than a cleric (though this was fixed by PoP era with druids/shamans getting 70% heals, etc). Secondarily was that the only class that could "properly" CC was enchanters. Those are honestly relatively minor tweaks to fix. As dullahan said, bards could easily fill a full time CC roll with the right abilities, etc.
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
Can't see the problem here. It's more than common to have successors/remakes of successfull computer games. And EQ is now close to 18 years old and didn't age so well for many. So why not ?
Lol, there can never be to much of a mmo that has its roots in EQ. It's strange how so many people have opened there eyes to Pantheon who a year ago declared they would never touch this game.
Now the same people are actually seeing that this game is going to be a reality want to complain about the direction the game is taking.
Way I see it is, don't like it go play another mmo that caters to your needs.
Can't see the problem here. It's more than common to have successors/remakes of successfull computer games. And EQ is now close to 18 years old and didn't age so well for many. So why not ?
Neither can it, but as the starter of this thread, it was never my intention to label it as a problem, more a 'what do you guys think?' kind of discussion. People sharing their experiences and opinions shed light on what people hope for / exspect.
Lol, there can never be to much of a mmo that has its roots in EQ. It's strange how so many people have opened there eyes to Pantheon who a year ago declared they would never touch this game.
Now the same people are actually seeing that this game is going to be a reality want to complain about the direction the game is taking.
Way I see it is, don't like it go play another mmo that caters to your needs.
You ain't going to change anything.
I think you should have started by reading the threads first post, and you would see that the intention of this thread is not really what you comment on.
this was never ment to be a thread on "less EQ more something else" read my initial post, will you?
Some people just open a thread and start commenting like reading the headline but not what the thread is about... curious if you and many here actually read what I initially started the thread with...
so often these discussions derail because people read the headline and page 5 in the thread, but not what the discussion was initiated as...
I hope it plays just like EQ... don't want the combat to change at all.
I hope they just implement things to make the world better.... which it seems they are with perception system. Toss in a new UI and updated graphics...
That is all I ever wanted for the last 13 years...
After seeing all the footage of the game, the streams, Q&A and interviews I've started to grow a small concern...
VR always seems to refer to their own classes as if they were the same as they use to be in EQ - it's seems already given that a shaman roll will be his great slow of attack speed, enchanters to increase mana regeneration and CC, clerics to be the master healer, warriors to be tanks, wizards to nuke - then we can guess what the rest of the classes will do.
This may not be an issue, but I'm concerned that the classes will not diviate and you will feel you are playing same game on a different engine.
I hope they will add more diverse classes where the stereotype of EQ is broken up a bit. And VR may already be planing this with their special abilities coming through epic quest and so...
But the talk where EQ is mentioned nearly always when talking classes and rolls got me a bit concerned - what about you? Is it only me who have these butterflies in the stomach?
To be honest I do not mind an Everquest reboot at all with some changes but I simply loved the original game.
I've had this concern for awhile. Graphic improvements appear to be the main selling point of this title, maybe with a bit of juggled abilities between classes and a thesaurus thrown at the terminology. I just do not believe that these are the tools to build a new captivating game.
I am afraid the experience will be too much 'exactly like' 1999, particularly all the social issues that EQ1 inadvertently introduced. Waiting 2 hours for a cleric because a shaman or druid can't do the job of healing, or waiting for an enchanter to finish crafting before joining us, or the warrior (not paladin or shadow knight -- they couldn't cut it) to find his way to zone X without dying half a dozen times. If there are only a few combat roles, with a very few classes that can perform those functions, simply reduce the number of classes or builds or whatever to accommodate the way the community is expected to play. If clerics, shamans and druids aren't interchangeable, get rid of the variations and make a single class, the healer, which has a better chance of becoming 1/6th of the population.
If people want to think that these type of flaws are the convention and are a desired element, that's their prerogative. To me, incorporating these issues is a mistake that could threaten the success of this game.
Sheesh, as a shaman in EQ1, I was primary healer in a lot of situations. Someone who will sit there and not do a dungeon simply because a specific flavor of healer or specific flavor of tank was not available was being silly. Yes a cleric was somewhat better in the healing department, but I would rather have a good, well-equipped shaman healing a party than a lousy, poorly equipped cleric.
Thing is though, (as a shaman), I was better at keeping a group alive than a cleric would be in some situations. I was able to draw aggro midfight when necessary and then allow it to go back to the tank. I stopped so many wipes // avoided so many deaths in dungeons like HARD Ldon missions.
It made me wonder sometimes at people who specifically chose clerics for things like that.
What is odd is for normal LDON there were a few times where I had to act as a tank. (I was always interested in a high Armor value//# of hp as a shaman -- making it a bit more of a priority in my DKP choices than most shamen would do.)
I mean you have a Shaman, an Enchanter, a druid, and 3 DPS -- do you attempt it Y/N? I'd tank in that situation. Far better than just sitting around.
Probably because Shaman could not rez as well as a cleric . People took clerics not so much for the healing but that in case they died they would get the maximum rez possible with the maximum return of the experience they lost when they died. This was the reason earlier on then I think the pally class got the rez too and we would do content without clerics than quite easily. My experiences are from launch of Everquest up to Velious.
To put it in perspective,i was really intrigued by a mmorpg the first time someone introduced me to it and it was EQ1.When EQ2 came out i had no problem whatsoever leaving EQ1 for EQ2.So that pretty much says what i think of EQ1,too old and too many areas needed to be improved.
I actually saw ideas that were good and they dumbed them down,so it really proved they were aiming for an EASIER way to keep developing their games instead of better ways to improve and ADD to the game.It was ALWAYS a let's take something away or change it so it is more confusing so people can't see that we are dumbing down stats. I still remember having gear with retarded numbers like +120 stat/s but when came time for combat i could remove items and never felt much like they made any difference,so they did stats badly.Same thing for accuracy and types of damage,they always felt like meaningless stats.That is not what i want from my game even though i know all devs use stats as a FAKE way to keep players interested,they are always dumbed down in actual combat formula's.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Isn't EQ in a different skin what this has been about from the get go?...I thought people were tired of the WoW clones and wanted a game that was more old school?...Make up your minds.
Isn't EQ in a different skin what this has been about from the get go?...I thought people were tired of the WoW clones and wanted a game that was more old school?...Make up your minds.
Agreed. I believe as the game has become more and more popular, people are now trying to change it to fit their own preferences, rather than supporting the original vision of the game from 2014.
If the game tries to satisfy everyone, it will end up satisfying no one.
Isn't EQ in a different skin what this has been about from the get go?...I thought people were tired of the WoW clones and wanted a game that was more old school?...Make up your minds.
Agreed. I believe as the game has become more and more popular, people are now trying to change it to fit their own preferences, rather than supporting the original vision of the game from 2014.
If the game tries to satisfy everyone, it will end up satisfying no one.
I think you're kind of missing the point there. The point a lot of people, including myself, are trying to make, is that just pulling every feature from EQ, updating the graphics, and calling it a day is a mistake. I played EQ probably longer than just about anyone here. I loved the game. The prospect of playing an MMO with a classic feel excites me very much.
However, features shouldn't just be blindly pulled from EQ (or any other game for that matter). Any feature that gets added or not added to the game should be done so while asking the question of "does this make the game better?", not "does this make the game more like EQ".
There were a lot of things in EQ that people hated even back in 1999, but we just tolerated them. Copying them just for the sake of nostalgia is a mistake.
Was EQ good because of 24 hour camps? Was EQ good because of XP loss on death and corpse recoveries that could go into the early morning? Was EQ good because of 72 man raids and racing other guilds for content? Or was it good in spite of those things? Those are the questions that need to be asked.
Isn't EQ in a different skin what this has been about from the get go?...I thought people were tired of the WoW clones and wanted a game that was more old school?...Make up your minds.
Read what the thread is actually about, the first post made, instead of reading a headline and reply to you assumption of that.
Changed the the headline now since too many obviously just read and reply to that....
My perspective is simple. EQ was great, and a game just like EQ would be fun too. However, a game that improves upon EQ would be even more fun.
The key things I don't want to see changed are player interdependence, a greater commitment of time, a more dangerous world with a steep death penalty, and traditional combat that is more focused on knowledge, preparation and teamwork, than personal coordination and dexterity.
After that, put it through the "is this fun" test and go from there. I say that knowing some of the things above will not be fun to some players, but those are really the essentials that I believe made EQ a very different game than what is being offered today.
Comments
I think millions of us in the MMO world have been wanting the 'NEXT EQ'.
I really have no problem with Pantheon being that. I want the game to be meaningful in all ways. I want to earn my loot, earn my level, and make friends along the way building that teamwork that - to date- only EQ and nurtured.
Class-wise, I am a bit disappointed that so far the classes seem to be verbatim copies of EQ.
What I am concerned about is that I hope the classes aren't on the same power scale as EQ was.
Meaning,
-rangers are terrible (if anyone remembers when EQ 1st started they were super! then warriors complained about them and rangers got nerfed really hard)
-warriors are the only tank that really matters ( I never understood this at all, as EQ had terrible damage mitigation mechanics for players. Even warriors seem to take a ton of damage in EQ, the only mitigation that was worth anything was HP and heals)
-hybrids were watered down and underpowered versions of their parent classes: I sincerely hope that crusaders and dire lords will be equal in all regards to a warrior for tanking; just using different mechanisms to achieve it.
bards- this is the only class that I hope remains the same, especially the twisting. To date this is the most unique class of any mmo made.
.
Yes, there's a lot of unrest in the MMORPG community. Posts pointing out those very same problems you acknowledge that contributed to EQ being perfection aren't attacks on any individual, but they do cause emotional responses in those who think the foundations laid down by EQ1 were perfect. Disagreement is being interpreted as being akin to assaulting someone's beliefs. That frequently isn't the case. Perhaps those who defend any perceived slight to their version of the gold standard are influenced by a rose-tinted view of history, perhaps not.
@sirphobos made a point about proponents 'shouting down deviation'. Your response introduced the concept that no has 'advocated a copy of EQ with a modern engine'. But, that is precisely what a 'new EQ with modern graphics' is, and that request / wish is everywhere on these forums. Your reply to him was essentially an attempt to shout down his idea, or at least bury it. So your response merely validates his observation.
Waiting is the main issue that @sirphobos seemed to be against. Overly long camps like the JBoots camp (I'd add the Ghoulbane camp as even worse), or waiting for mana, or waiting for the 'correct' class to join a group. Waiting is a concern for many people, myself included. Since Pantheon is going to include solo, group and raid content (per Brad somewhere in these forums), waiting will be an issue. How long will individuals wait to join a group / raid before they go off and solo something. When they do get a group invitation while they were soloing, how long will the rest of the group be asked to wait while this individual joins up?
Waiting is a tangible issue that could seriously threaten the success of Pantheon. I have not heard of any mechanism to remotely inject players with a serious dose of patience (nor would I want that). But waiting was the result of the large time commitments that playing EQ1 required. Using the same fundamental model is very likely to produce the same undesirable side-effect. That's the concern.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
This also led to a robust PLAYER driven economy where people would shout in zone for a teleport, or clerics would offer then reduced exp penalty rezes for steep fees.
Druids would sell SoWs for steep fees.
I remember when, on Eci, the first player, Aaliyl become the only player that could make plate armor.
And it cost a TON.
These are just a few of the things that make EQ really stand out IMO
I also hope for bards at launch, because crowd control is an important job and I think it's necessary to have a class that can provide that besides the enchanter. Same situation as with EQ clerics, every role should have an alternative.
"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."
- Friedrich Nietzsche
Now the same people are actually seeing that this game is going to be a reality want to complain about the direction the game is taking.
Way I see it is, don't like it go play another mmo that caters to your needs.
You ain't going to change anything.
this was never ment to be a thread on "less EQ more something else" read my initial post, will you?
Some people just open a thread and start commenting like reading the headline but not what the thread is about... curious if you and many here actually read what I initially started the thread with...
so often these discussions derail because people read the headline and page 5 in the thread, but not what the discussion was initiated as...
Wouldnt that be an IP issue anyway?
I hope they just implement things to make the world better.... which it seems they are with perception system. Toss in a new UI and updated graphics...
That is all I ever wanted for the last 13 years...
I actually saw ideas that were good and they dumbed them down,so it really proved they were aiming for an EASIER way to keep developing their games instead of better ways to improve and ADD to the game.It was ALWAYS a let's take something away or change it so it is more confusing so people can't see that we are dumbing down stats.
I still remember having gear with retarded numbers like +120 stat/s but when came time for combat i could remove items and never felt much like they made any difference,so they did stats badly.Same thing for accuracy and types of damage,they always felt like meaningless stats.That is not what i want from my game even though i know all devs use stats as a FAKE way to keep players interested,they are always dumbed down in actual combat formula's.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
If the game tries to satisfy everyone, it will end up satisfying no one.
However, features shouldn't just be blindly pulled from EQ (or any other game for that matter). Any feature that gets added or not added to the game should be done so while asking the question of "does this make the game better?", not "does this make the game more like EQ".
There were a lot of things in EQ that people hated even back in 1999, but we just tolerated them. Copying them just for the sake of nostalgia is a mistake.
Was EQ good because of 24 hour camps? Was EQ good because of XP loss on death and corpse recoveries that could go into the early morning? Was EQ good because of 72 man raids and racing other guilds for content? Or was it good in spite of those things? Those are the questions that need to be asked.
Changed the the headline now since too many obviously just read and reply to that....
The key things I don't want to see changed are player interdependence, a greater commitment of time, a more dangerous world with a steep death penalty, and traditional combat that is more focused on knowledge, preparation and teamwork, than personal coordination and dexterity.
After that, put it through the "is this fun" test and go from there. I say that knowing some of the things above will not be fun to some players, but those are really the essentials that I believe made EQ a very different game than what is being offered today.