@Octagon7711- But most people don't normally speak and interact with other player characters and non-player characters as if they are actually the character they are playing.
@Vermillion_Raventhal - There are actually such things as dictionaries which describe the commonly accepted usage of words and terms.
Defining a word is not defining it in use of something that comes down to an opinion. Role playing at its basics is simply using a character and defining his role. It could be 4th wall breaking asshole mass murderer but that's still a role.
You can try to define something however you like. People do it all the time. But if we don't use the commonly accepted usages of words found in dictionaries, then we'll end up creating new languages and not being able to understand each other after awhile. That actually did happen quite often in the past.
That's how language naturally develops. I watched a lecture given by a person who's job is to work on definitions for a major dictionary company. Basically she said that even among dictionary company's there are different versions of definitions for words and terms. She said their job is to keep up with the natural growth of language in defining language and not to police it. She compared modern language to earlier versions and how few people would be able to understand original English.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
Anyone playing an MMORPG using that character and making any decision for that character in that game world is satisfying the dictionary use if the word you presented.
role-playing - "an activity in which people do and say things while pretending to be someone else or while pretending to be in a particular situation"
Sure, but in the barest, most rudimentary, and piss-poor way imaginable. Almost to the level of saying that wearing a costume for a Halloween party is role-playing. I read the definition of role-playing as I'm pretending to be someone else, so I say and do things that the character would say and do, not what I would say and do while wearing the costume of my character. To me, role-playing means that I actually pretend to be the character. That's how role-playing works in drama or therapy. If I put on the uniform of a police officer and carry a badge and a gun, I can get arrested for impersonating a police officer, but I won't actually convince anyone that I am a police officer unless I say and do things that a police officer would. Acting, performing, and role-playing are closer synonyms than role-playing and impersonation. The kind of thing you're describing is impersonation, not role-playing.
But fine, if that's how you want to define role-playing, go right ahead. Have fun. Have a wonderful time. The creators and players of games like Dungeons & Dragons would probably disagree with you though.
(Quoting from Wikipedia) "The history of role-playing games begins with an earlier tradition of role-playing, which combined with the rulesets of fantasy wargames in the 1970s to give rise to the modern role-playing game.[1] A role-playing game (RPG) is a type of game in which the participants assume the roles of characters and collaboratively create stories. Participants determine the actions of their characters based on their characterization, and theactions succeed or fail according to a system of rules and guidelines. Within the rules, they may improvise freely; their choices shape the direction and outcome of the games. - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_role-playing_games
@Octagon7711 - Yes, I know that living languages can change over time. But I'm not interested in having a further semantic debate over this issue. You all go ahead and do whatever you want. I don't care.
If I picked up a doll and started to play with it I am role playing. Doesn't matter what I am doing.
Defining how one role plays and enforcing that is nearly impossible. Not just on deciding how it should be done but techincal aspect of actual enforcement between thousands of players.
Barely most rudimentary piss poor way in your opinion. Not fact. - Yes. You should not when try. Who are you to decide how other people should role play.
Have naming policies. Have anti griefing policies. But you should not tell people how they should role play.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
I wouldn't have told any of you how to role-play if you hadn't posted in my thread. I wouldn't tell any players how to role-play unless they chose to play on the server of my game that has enforced role-playing.
The Gamemasters would decide when to warn, reprimand, restrict, penalize, suspend, or ban players who didn't play according to the rules. But the benefits and rewards given for role-playing according to the rules would be equal to or greater than the consequences and penalties resulting from not role-playing according to the rules.
The rule I'm assuming says to role play. I'm asking about someone role playing in a way you don't like.
You will need to define acceptable role playing. Someone can role play breaking the 4th wall very easily. Actually anything you can imagine you can role play. Which is why it's practically impossible to enforce.
Heck they could just role play being insane which would allow them to do basically anything.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
@Keller - I've never found it difficult to come up with original names for characters, but I understand your dilemma. However, there are multiple websites online that list names in foreign languages or even possible fantasy names. It really isn't that hard to make or find an original name for a character (one that isn't being used on the server yet).
Not everyone need to role-play. I never said I wanted to make all games or all servers like this. How about just one game or one server on one game that tried it?
Nor do I have a problem to come up with names, but didn't want to take up too many names. I had all classes covered with a name and background. The other alts were just banks and crafters.
I'm cool with trying to improve RP experience. Poor GMs, I can only imagine how hard it can be at the end of the shift. The first 10 times it's not hard to make a witty remark and correcting the rolebreaker without giving him/her a penalty. But 800 conversations later and with still 1 hour to go before clocking out?
The only thing what I can think of is guild run cities. Officers can flag a player in their town who is offensive/annoying. Flagged players will be zapped by towers or killed by guards and are unable to return in the city for 1 hour (or permanent flagged). Abuse the flagging and the city will become unpopular by the rest of the playerbase and the city will become empty. Upkeep of the city requires unique player visits and over time the city can be picked up by another guild. I know when quest npcs are tied to that city, a player can be blocked from content. However if it only non essential quests are tied to guild cities, it is a nice dynamic reputation faction.
We did something similar in Darkfall. We had an open gate policy for everyone except our "warred" enemies. Minor infractions led to running laps around our city walls. Worst case punishment meant your guild being warred (red) and no longer access to our city. It was so funny to see the biggest pvp champions doing laps because they accidental beat someone to dead at the bloodwall (area where you could skillup attacks on afk naked players).
The rule I'm assuming says to role play. I'm asking about someone role playing in a way you don't like.
You will need to define acceptable role playing. Someone can role play breaking the 4th wall very easily. Actually anything you can imagine you can role play. Which is why it's practically impossible to enforce.
Heck they could just role play being insane which would allow them to do basically anything.
Okay, breaking the 4th wall would be prohibited. Being insane is possible, but there would have to be a good reason for it. Most insane people wouldn't survive for long if they were trying to go on adventures, fight monsters, or raid dungeons. Insane people usually end up homeless on the streets or getting locked away.
The rule I'm assuming says to role play. I'm asking about someone role playing in a way you don't like.
You will need to define acceptable role playing. Someone can role play breaking the 4th wall very easily. Actually anything you can imagine you can role play. Which is why it's practically impossible to enforce.
Heck they could just role play being insane which would allow them to do basically anything.
Okay, breaking the 4th wall would be prohibited. Being insane is possible, but there would have to be a good reason for it. Most insane people wouldn't survive for long if they were trying to go on adventures, fight monsters, or raid dungeons. Insane people usually end up homeless on the streets or getting locked away.
As a pen n paper rpg junkie i gonna tell - would never play with GM like you. The one that say "we can role play my way or wrong way". Get over yourself.
@Keller - Well, the thing is though, I wouldn't even try to do this with games the way they're mostly made now. It would only really work well in the kind of game I'm thinking of. A game that would actually encourage people to want to role-play. You would only be able to pay two characters per account in this game. But I don't think I would necessarily enforce role-playing anyway. Maybe on one server as an experiment. Also, the kind of game I want to make would largely put an end to griefers/gankers without having to resort to drastic measures. But I'm not going to explain it all here. I have other threads that I've posted my ideas in.
I mainly just started this thread because the idea occurred to me and I decided to see what people thought about it.
It seems that most people wouldn't want enforced role-play in the games they play now. I don't blame them. I don't even want to play any of the MMORPGs available to play right now. I finally quit the last one I was playing earlier this week. Or maybe at the end of last week, I can't remember now.
The rule I'm assuming says to role play. I'm asking about someone role playing in a way you don't like.
You will need to define acceptable role playing. Someone can role play breaking the 4th wall very easily. Actually anything you can imagine you can role play. Which is why it's practically impossible to enforce.
Heck they could just role play being insane which would allow them to do basically anything.
Okay, breaking the 4th wall would be prohibited. Being insane is possible, but there would have to be a good reason for it. Most insane people wouldn't survive for long if they were trying to go on adventures, fight monsters, or raid dungeons. Insane people usually end up homeless on the streets or getting locked away.
As a pen n paper rpg junkie i gonna tell - would never play with GM like you. The one that say "we can role play my way or wrong way". Get over yourself.
I'm just brainstorming. I really don't care too much about this thread to be honest. If you read my last post, you would see that I don't really want to enforce role-playing in the kind of MMORPG I would like to make. Anyway, if people make their own game and run their own server, they can make any rules they want. You get over yourself.
There Would Probably Be a Lot Less Griefers/Gankers in an MMORPG that Enforced/Required Role-Playing
Probably a little less griefing in a PvP or PvE MMO but nothing significant.
Yeah, it was just an idea I threw out there for fun really. It wouldn't really be my reason for ever experimenting with a Required Role-Playing server anyway.
EDIT: There I change the name of the thread to something more reasonable, lol.
Would There Less Griefers/Gankers in an MMORPG that Enforced/Required Role-Playing?
Anyway, I'm tired of arguing about this subject. It's a dead horse, and it's still being beaten severely. Poor thing. You all can continue to discuss this subject if you like. I'm done with it.
This stronghold is on a piece of land that has no more value to me at this time. Better to retreat, regroup, and deploy my forces elsewhere.
The rule I'm assuming says to role play. I'm asking about someone role playing in a way you don't like.
You will need to define acceptable role playing. Someone can role play breaking the 4th wall very easily. Actually anything you can imagine you can role play. Which is why it's practically impossible to enforce.
Heck they could just role play being insane which would allow them to do basically anything.
Okay, breaking the 4th wall would be prohibited. Being insane is possible, but there would have to be a good reason for it. Most insane people wouldn't survive for long if they were trying to go on adventures, fight monsters, or raid dungeons. Insane people usually end up homeless on the streets or getting locked away.
Or leaders of countries
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
How about even creating a system that rewarded or incentivized it? More Dungeon/Game Masters could be used. Paid ones with legal-and-binding contracts.
Roleplaying has no connection to griefers or gankers.
Roleplaying and griefers-gankers would be dealt with as separate matters, and I will say that both can certainly be dealt with and-or accomplished.
Do you have any ideas on how to reward or incentivize Roleplaying?
DM-GMs could be used perhaps. From the companies' perspectives however, they are more likely going to look for ways that include less employees, rather than more. From the companies' perspectives, they want bigger numbers of players as player characters, not to need players as DM-GMs. From the companies' perspectives, they see no way to implement Roleplaying in any meaningful way.
@VengeSunsoar - I knew you were going to say that. But the vast majority of the time, actually insane people only tend to become leaders of nations if their positions are hereditary. Some leaders might insane from an individual's perspectives, but just because someone does something other people might consider insane or illogical, that doesn't mean they are actually, clinically insane. Some people might think you or I were insane at times if they were able to watch a film that showed everything we said or did at any given moment of our lives. Truly insane people live in their own worlds and don't even realize they are insane. They never question whether or not they are crazy.
@ArtifceVenatus - Yes, I have ideas on how to incentivize role-playing, but I don't feel to need to list them all. I don't really care what companies want. All kinds of people want all kinds of things. Doesn't always mean they want what's best for them or that another way or method might not be better or preferable to the standard way of doing things. If companies see no way to implement role-playing in any meaningful way, perhaps they lack imagination. But I would never suggest that this should be done with all games and all servers at all times. All I might suggest is that someone does an experiment on one server on one game someday and see what happens. Also, it's not like DM/GMs would need to work 8 hour shifts. They could work 2, 4, or 6 hour shifts. Whatever you want. Sometimes, the only limits in life are those based on our own levels of intelligence, creativity, ability to problem-solve, and design/planning skills. Something is not impossible just because no one has done it or tried it before. Also, maybe it wouldn't help with griefers or gankers at all. Maybe it would have nothing to do with that at all. Maybe it would just make an mmorpg more fun. Who knows?
Okay, that's it. I'm really done with this thread now. A few of my soldiers were not at their posts when I gave the order to march. Had to send a small party back to locate them. But they were found healthy and whole, so everything's fine. My forces are departing this region for good.
@cantankerousmage Maybe you should take a look at Shards Online. Haven't been following it closely, but when they starter their kickstarter in 2014, they advertised with "set your own rules" on your own server (shard). Believe you can even build your own world.
Back then it was like a polished version of Ultima Online. Oh and they changed name to Legends of Aria?
@Keller - I don't really want to make a role-playing enforced server right now or in the near future. Maybe not ever, I don't know. Really, the idea just popped into my head, so I decided to make a thread about it to see what other people thought about it.
NEWS FLASH!"A bank was robbed the other day and a man opened fire on the customers being held hostage. One customer zig-zag sprinted until he found cover. When questioned later he explained that he was a hardcore gamer and knew just what to do!" Download my music for free! I release several albums per month as part of project "Thee Untitled" . .. some video game music remixes and cover songs done with instruments in there as well! http://theeuntitled.bandcamp.com/Check out my roleplaying blog, collection of fictional short stories, and fantasy series... updated on a blog for now until I am finished!https://childrenfromtheheavensbelow.blogspot.com/Watch me game on occasion or make music... https://www.twitch.tv/spoontheeuntitled and subscribe! https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCUvqULn678VrF3OasgnbsyA
Comments
That's how language naturally develops. I watched a lecture given by a person who's job is to work on definitions for a major dictionary company. Basically she said that even among dictionary company's there are different versions of definitions for words and terms. She said their job is to keep up with the natural growth of language in defining language and not to police it. She compared modern language to earlier versions and how few people would be able to understand original English.
"We all do the best we can based on life experience, point of view, and our ability to believe in ourselves." - Naropa "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are." SR Covey
role-playing - "an activity in which people do and say things while pretending to be someone else or while pretending to be in a particular situation"
Sure, but in the barest, most rudimentary, and piss-poor way imaginable. Almost to the level of saying that wearing a costume for a Halloween party is role-playing. I read the definition of role-playing as I'm pretending to be someone else, so I say and do things that the character would say and do, not what I would say and do while wearing the costume of my character. To me, role-playing means that I actually pretend to be the character. That's how role-playing works in drama or therapy. If I put on the uniform of a police officer and carry a badge and a gun, I can get arrested for impersonating a police officer, but I won't actually convince anyone that I am a police officer unless I say and do things that a police officer would. Acting, performing, and role-playing are closer synonyms than role-playing and impersonation. The kind of thing you're describing is impersonation, not role-playing.
But fine, if that's how you want to define role-playing, go right ahead. Have fun. Have a wonderful time. The creators and players of games like Dungeons & Dragons would probably disagree with you though.
"The history of role-playing games begins with an earlier tradition of role-playing, which combined with the rulesets of fantasy wargames in the 1970s to give rise to the modern role-playing game.[1] A role-playing game (RPG) is a type of game in which the participants assume the roles of characters and collaboratively create stories. Participants determine the actions of their characters based on their characterization, and theactions succeed or fail according to a system of rules and guidelines. Within the rules, they may improvise freely; their choices shape the direction and outcome of the games. - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_role-playing_games
Defining how one role plays and enforcing that is nearly impossible. Not just on deciding how it should be done but techincal aspect of actual enforcement between thousands of players.
-
Yes. You should not when try. Who are you to decide how other people should role play.
Have naming policies. Have anti griefing policies. But you should not tell people how they should role play.
You will need to define acceptable role playing. Someone can role play breaking the 4th wall very easily. Actually anything you can imagine you can role play. Which is why it's practically impossible to enforce.
Heck they could just role play being insane which would allow them to do basically anything.
Nor do I have a problem to come up with names, but didn't want to take up too many names. I had all classes covered with a name and background. The other alts were just banks and crafters.
I'm cool with trying to improve RP experience. Poor GMs, I can only imagine how hard it can be at the end of the shift. The first 10 times it's not hard to make a witty remark and correcting the rolebreaker without giving him/her a penalty. But 800 conversations later and with still 1 hour to go before clocking out?
The only thing what I can think of is guild run cities. Officers can flag a player in their town who is offensive/annoying. Flagged players will be zapped by towers or killed by guards and are unable to return in the city for 1 hour (or permanent flagged). Abuse the flagging and the city will become unpopular by the rest of the playerbase and the city will become empty. Upkeep of the city requires unique player visits and over time the city can be picked up by another guild. I know when quest npcs are tied to that city, a player can be blocked from content. However if it only non essential quests are tied to guild cities, it is a nice dynamic reputation faction.
We did something similar in Darkfall. We had an open gate policy for everyone except our "warred" enemies. Minor infractions led to running laps around our city walls. Worst case punishment meant your guild being warred (red) and no longer access to our city. It was so funny to see the biggest pvp champions doing laps because they accidental beat someone to dead at the bloodwall (area where you could skillup attacks on afk naked players).
Okay, breaking the 4th wall would be prohibited. Being insane is possible, but there would have to be a good reason for it. Most insane people wouldn't survive for long if they were trying to go on adventures, fight monsters, or raid dungeons. Insane people usually end up homeless on the streets or getting locked away.
As a pen n paper rpg junkie i gonna tell - would never play with GM like you. The one that say "we can role play my way or wrong way". Get over yourself.
Probably a little less griefing in a PvP or PvE MMO but nothing significant.
I mainly just started this thread because the idea occurred to me and I decided to see what people thought about it.
It seems that most people wouldn't want enforced role-play in the games they play now. I don't blame them. I don't even want to play any of the MMORPGs available to play right now. I finally quit the last one I was playing earlier this week. Or maybe at the end of last week, I can't remember now.
Yeah, it was just an idea I threw out there for fun really. It wouldn't really be my reason for ever experimenting with a Required Role-Playing server anyway.
EDIT: There I change the name of the thread to something more reasonable, lol.
Would There Less Griefers/Gankers in an MMORPG that Enforced/Required Role-Playing?
This stronghold is on a piece of land that has no more value to me at this time. Better to retreat, regroup, and deploy my forces elsewhere.
Or leaders of countries
Roleplaying has no connection to griefers or gankers.
Roleplaying and griefers-gankers would be dealt with as separate matters, and I will say that both can certainly be dealt with and-or accomplished.
Do you have any ideas on how to reward or incentivize Roleplaying?
DM-GMs could be used perhaps.
From the companies' perspectives however, they are more likely going to look for ways that include less employees, rather than more.
From the companies' perspectives, they want bigger numbers of players as player characters, not to need players as DM-GMs.
From the companies' perspectives, they see no way to implement Roleplaying in any meaningful way.
@ArtifceVenatus - Yes, I have ideas on how to incentivize role-playing, but I don't feel to need to list them all. I don't really care what companies want. All kinds of people want all kinds of things. Doesn't always mean they want what's best for them or that another way or method might not be better or preferable to the standard way of doing things. If companies see no way to implement role-playing in any meaningful way, perhaps they lack imagination. But I would never suggest that this should be done with all games and all servers at all times. All I might suggest is that someone does an experiment on one server on one game someday and see what happens. Also, it's not like DM/GMs would need to work 8 hour shifts. They could work 2, 4, or 6 hour shifts. Whatever you want. Sometimes, the only limits in life are those based on our own levels of intelligence, creativity, ability to problem-solve, and design/planning skills. Something is not impossible just because no one has done it or tried it before. Also, maybe it wouldn't help with griefers or gankers at all. Maybe it would have nothing to do with that at all. Maybe it would just make an mmorpg more fun. Who knows?
Okay, that's it. I'm really done with this thread now. A few of my soldiers were not at their posts when I gave the order to march. Had to send a small party back to locate them. But they were found healthy and whole, so everything's fine. My forces are departing this region for good.
Back then it was like a polished version of Ultima Online. Oh and they changed name to Legends of Aria?
NEWS FLASH! "A bank was robbed the other day and a man opened fire on the customers being held hostage. One customer zig-zag sprinted until he found cover. When questioned later he explained that he was a hardcore gamer and knew just what to do!" Download my music for free! I release several albums per month as part of project "Thee Untitled" . .. some video game music remixes and cover songs done with instruments in there as well! http://theeuntitled.bandcamp.com/ Check out my roleplaying blog, collection of fictional short stories, and fantasy series... updated on a blog for now until I am finished! https://childrenfromtheheavensbelow.blogspot.com/ Watch me game on occasion or make music... https://www.twitch.tv/spoontheeuntitled and subscribe! https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCUvqULn678VrF3OasgnbsyA