Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Its so weird to see so many cheering for the "bad guys."
Perhaps playing video games is harmful after all.
NCSOFT are the bad guys, they have been for years
No, they are not the bad guys. They are a company trying to make money. They make products and want to sell them. When they can't make enough money for what they need they shut down projects and invest in more viable projects.
Players need to learn to put things in perspective.
If they think things last forever then they need to reassess. It's unfortunate that our favorite games might not be around in 5 years let alone 1 year but they are not doing this because we are part of a club.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Its so weird to see so many cheering for the "bad guys."
Perhaps playing video games is harmful after all.
NCSOFT are the bad guys, they have been for years
No, they are not the bad guys. They are a company trying to make money. They make products and want to sell them. When they can't make enough money for what they need they shut down projects and invest in more viable projects.
Players need to learn to put things in perspective.
If they think things last forever then they need to reassess. It's unfortunate that our favorite games might not be around in 5 years let alone 1 year but they are not doing this because we are part of a club.
When all is said and done, more is always said than done.
Its so weird to see so many cheering for the "bad guys."
Perhaps playing video games is harmful after all.
NCSOFT are the bad guys, they have been for years
No, they are not the bad guys. They are a company trying to make money. They make products and want to sell them. When they can't make enough money for what they need they shut down projects and invest in more viable projects.
Players need to learn to put things in perspective.
If they think things last forever then they need to reassess. It's unfortunate that our favorite games might not be around in 5 years let alone 1 year but they are not doing this because we are part of a club.
Appropriate, a Lawful Evil Character. Not so different from Lawful Good, at least at the end of the day.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Remember back in the Napster /Limewire days when random average internet joes would get sued for like a 1/4 million dollars for a couple hundred sometimes less downloaded songs.
Remember back in the Napster /Limewire days when random average internet joes would get sued for like a 1/4 million dollars for a couple hundred sometimes less downloaded songs.
BMI and other music copyright enforcers are still very active these days.
They mostly restrict their lawsuits to bars and other public venues which actually have money to pay if they lose.
I suspect most individuals just quickly comply when contacted.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I find it interesting that the hottest MMORPG news this week has nothing much to do with what's coming, or what's playing, but the clandestine restoration of a game that has been closed down for seven years.
It tells me several things. It tells me that, whatever the publishers have been doing the past seven years, it was pretty pathetic. The technology has never been better. The distribution model has never been more accessible. And the marketing and monetization schemes have never been more optimized to make money hand over fist.
But the loyalty isn't there. The relationship isn't there. The support between publisher and fan isn't there. It isn't there, because it wasn't shown. And so it's becoming harder for big publishers to get the hype to stick. And so you get big projects like Anthem who can really say and do nothing to get fans interested in remaining loyal...why should they? Everybody knows by now that these people will throw you under the bus for the next guy, close up for any and no reason, break your games the please customers who don't exist, and so on.
The entire situation behind CoH's closure seven years ago was symbolic of the changing dynamic between publisher and fan. NCSoft said that CoH "wasn't profitable enough," but it was soon revealed through internal documents how CoH consistently was able to pay its bills, produce stable revenue above and beyond operating costs, with record levels of subscriber retention. But that didn't matter. The problem with CoH wasn't that its users couldn't make it a successful enterprise. The problem was that CoH attracted the wrong kind of users. What CoH attracted were enthusiasts and hobbyists, level-headed wholesome folk, families, and friends. What NCSoft wanted were addictive personalities, compulsive gambling types, and impressionable youth. See, CoH was designed as an amusement park, or a town square. The reason there's so much interest today behind this game seven years dead is that nobody seems very interested in offering that anymore. All publishers are interested in are casinos for compulsive gamblers.
Some folks here are concerned that NCSoft will enforce its legal prerogatives against the clandestine working group and the hosts. I think they had a better chance of doing that back when this industry at least had a thin vernier of legitimacy associated with it.
But when South Korea and China start to pass legislation to protect their youth from these games, when EU countries start to classify you as casinos, when the press reveals the nature of your DLC schemes and microtransactions, and when every interest group from the far left to the far right seems interested in making you a scapegoat for all of society's ills, you no longer look like an industry that deserves legal prerogatives. MMO publishers are increasingly looking like big tobacco, or off-track betting, or pornography: quasi-legitimate industries that only exist because the people haven't gotten around to killing you yet. Best not to give them an excuse.
The last thing any publisher is going to want to do these days is to get a disgruntled subscriber into a courtroom. NCSoft has too much to lose by pursuing legal action, and nothing (besides ill will) to gain. These people, and this game, no longer matter to NCSoft's business strategy. So they should let them go, like they did in 2012.
and 3 others.
__________________________ "Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it." --Arcken
"...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints." --Hellmar, CEO of CCP.
"It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls." --Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE
I find it interesting that the hottest MMORPG news this week has nothing much to do with what's coming, or what's playing, but the clandestine restoration of a game that has been closed down for seven years.
It tells me several things. It tells me that, whatever the publishers have been doing the past seven years, it was pretty pathetic. The technology has never been better. The distribution model has never been more accessible. And the marketing and monetization schemes have never been more optimized to make money hand over fist.
But the loyalty isn't there. The relationship isn't there. The support between publisher and fan isn't there. It isn't there, because it wasn't shown. And so it's becoming harder for big publishers to get the hype to stick. And so you get big projects like Anthem who can really say and do nothing to get fans interested in remaining loyal...why should they? Everybody knows by now that these people will throw you under the bus for the next guy, close up for any and no reason, break your games the please customers who don't exist, and so on.
The entire situation behind CoH's closure seven years ago was symbolic of the changing dynamic between publisher and fan. NCSoft said that CoH "wasn't profitable enough," but it was soon revealed through internal documents how CoH consistently was able to pay its bills, produce stable revenue above and beyond operating costs, with record levels of subscriber retention. But that didn't matter. The problem with CoH wasn't that its users couldn't make it a successful enterprise. The problem was that CoH attracted the wrong kind of users. What CoH attracted were enthusiasts and hobbyists, level-headed wholesome folk, families, and friends. What NCSoft wanted were addictive personalities, compulsive gambling types, and impressionable youth. See, CoH was designed as an amusement park, or a town square. The reason there's so much interest today behind this game seven years dead is that nobody seems very interested in offering that anymore. All publishers are interested in are casinos for compulsive gamblers.
Some folks here are concerned that NCSoft will enforce its legal prerogatives against the clandestine working group and the hosts. I think they had a better chance of doing that back when this industry at least had a thin vernier of legitimacy associated with it.
But when South Korea and China start to pass legislation to protect their youth from these games, when EU countries start to classify you as casinos, when the press reveals the nature of your DLC schemes and microtransactions, and when every interest group from the far left to the far right seems interested in making you a scapegoat for all of society's ills, you no longer look like an industry that deserves legal prerogatives. MMO publishers are increasingly looking like big tobacco, or off-track betting, or pornography: quasi-legitimate industries that only exist because the people haven't gotten around to killing you yet. Best not to give them an excuse.
The last thing any publisher is going to want to do these days is to get a disgruntled subscriber into a courtroom. NCSoft has too much to lose by pursuing legal action, and nothing (besides ill will) to gain. These people, and this game, no longer matter to NCSoft's business strategy. So they should let them go, like they did in 2012.
yeah I don't agree with any of this.
The reason why it's big news is the idea of a game, with a small but devoted following, operating in secret without anyone knowing is "enticing."
It also brings up the idea that there are people who would have loved to be a part of this but were never told about it because "reasons."
NC Soft is a business. They make money. Players are consumers. There is nothing beyond that. Oh sure, companies would love to have devoted customers and customers would love to buy from companies that gave them good value for the money. But when a product is no longer worth making by the company they have to move on.
It's because the product is more than just a vacuum or a lamp and has a whole social side that there seems to be some ambiguity.
And trust me, NC Soft would have NO problem getting a disgruntled subscriber into court with all their lawyers. It's easy peezy for them.
Quite frankly at this point I'd love to see it happen so that players can get a dose of reality and wake up.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
NCSoft can't do anything at this point; The code is out along with the necessary data files (missions, powers, etc). It's open-source and everyone and their mother who is interested in this thing has a copy.
The reason why it's big news is the idea of a game, with a small but devoted following, operating in secret without anyone knowing is "enticing."
It also brings up the idea that there are people who would have loved to be a part of this but were never told about it because "reasons."
NC Soft is a business. They make money. Players are consumers. There is nothing beyond that. Oh sure, companies would love to have devoted customers and customers would love to buy from companies that gave them good value for the money. But when a product is no longer worth making by the company they have to move on.
It's because the product is more than just a vacuum or a lamp and has a whole social side that there seems to be some ambiguity.
And trust me, NC Soft would have NO problem getting a disgruntled subscriber into court with all their lawyers. It's easy peezy for them.
Quite frankly at this point I'd love to see it happen so that players can get a dose of reality and wake up.
It's easy for NCSoft to get a subscriber in a courtroom. It is harder than ever these days for a company like NCSoft to control the results.
Back during the Napster days, there was no GoFundMe. There wasn't a lot of Twitter and Facebook interconnectedness. It was easy to isolate and intimidate the kid sharing files on a server. Those days are over.
First thing that'll happen once they file the case is that every fansite, industry news org, press service, and so on is going to cover it. A GoFundMe will go up, and within a few days a legal fund will acquire enough funds through contributions to make NCSoft know that this isn't going to be cheap or easy. It would not even surprise me if people could raise even more money than NC Soft will want to spend, given the number of people (many of which have deep pockets) who would just love to kick NC Soft in the nuts. And those aren't even the fans of CoH.
NC Soft would, if anything, get pressure from EA, Blizzard, and every other major publisher to drop the case. For if NC Soft loses this fight over property that isn't vital to them, a precedent will be set that will make all their property, like Lineage II, more difficult to protect. If, as you say, these companies are "all about money," there really isn't any of NCSoft's money that's at stake here by simply letting this go. It isn't like they are giving the source code of Lineage II or Aion away, code that is actually worth protecting, because it is making money.
And assuming they actually fight this tooth and nail, it will be a PR nightmare. Press coverage will be intense. It will be difficult for NCSoft to control the narrative. Should NCSoft win, do you think this will be the end of NCSoft's woes? It is a foreign company, after all. It wouldn't surprise me if the people who would lose in such a scenario, mainly the disgruntled American fans, would use something like that to back legislation restricting the ability of foreign software companies to do business in the USA, just to piss NCSoft off. To quote Apollo Creed's trainer in Rocky II, "We don't need this kind of man in our lives."
See, it is because NCSoft is "all about the money" that I expect them to do nothing if they are smart. Because the only thing that would be at stake is "the principle of the thing," namely operating code without their permission, but it isn't like there is any money at stake. The fans, however, will fight with every dollar their community can muster for their principles. Money is not an issue for them; their issue is with NCSoft.
NCSoft would gain very little but the satisfaction of kicking down some hobbyists who toyed around with the junk they threw away. They will lose time, money, good will, PR, and legitimacy doing it, even in the best case scenario.
__________________________ "Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it." --Arcken
"...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints." --Hellmar, CEO of CCP.
"It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls." --Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE
NCSoft can't do anything at this point; The code is out along with the necessary data files (missions, powers, etc). It's open-source and everyone and their mother who is interested in this thing has a copy.
I personally can't wait to try this as i missed the boat the first time around .
NCSoft would gain very little but the satisfaction of kicking down some hobbyists who toyed around with the junk they threw away. They will lose time, money, good will, PR, and legitimacy doing it, even in the best case scenario.
Well, we'll see. Because if they did win then EA Blizzard and whatever other companies have an interest in the outcome would rejoice.
Also, it's not like servers have never been shut down before. Like Blizzard shutting down those classic servers (which means there is precedent right?)
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
I miss COH, and I would love to see it back. NC Does not care about the IP but they do not want to sell it either. As was mentioned in the COH2 article (more so the Powerpoint Presentation in that article) it mentions the rise of Superhero movies and how that would help bolster the game. NC Not doing anything means they missed an opportunity and in the world of business, you snooze, you lose. If you throw something away, maybe you should not be upset that someone finds treasure in your trash.
Its so weird to see so many cheering for the "bad guys."
Perhaps playing video games is harmful after all.
NCSOFT are the bad guys, they have been for years
No, they are not the bad guys. They are a company trying to make money. They make products and want to sell them. When they can't make enough money for what they need they shut down projects and invest in more viable projects.
Players need to learn to put things in perspective.
If they think things last forever then they need to reassess. It's unfortunate that our favorite games might not be around in 5 years let alone 1 year but they are not doing this because we are part of a club.
Sorry, but no. In a world where corporations, governments, and politicians ignore law and ethics it is completely unreasonable to expect the consumer to exclusively toe the moral line. That's a load of NOPE! Consumer first, governments second, corporations last. I see your argument as an apology for predatory moentization and publishers promoting those practices. In no way do I feel obligated to adopt that perspective by default. Companies need to work harder for their money and people need to stop putting corporate interests ahead of personal interests.
NC had every right to shut this game down and cease operations. At that point they abandoned the project and property. They've not pursued it many years later. Their loss.
Regardless of how you see my arguments, that's really filtering through the "you" filter.
While I'm a liberal at heart and not a "small government libertarian" by any means, I'm not for government and companies saving us from ourselves all the time. Sometimes but not all the time.
In this case I don't see the predatory practice. NC Soft had a game, it didn't perform how they wanted it to and they stopped it.
They offered the game for customers based on x, y and z which was spelled out in their terms of agreement.
Just because some people can't read doesn't mean they are the bad guys. People don't like it? Don't buy their products and move on.
As opposed to "don't buy their products but hold the hate because this is eversoimportantandwehatzitforever!"
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
NCSoft would gain very little but the satisfaction of kicking down some hobbyists who toyed around with the junk they threw away. They will lose time, money, good will, PR, and legitimacy doing it, even in the best case scenario.
Well, we'll see. Because if they did win then EA Blizzard and whatever other companies have an interest in the outcome would rejoice.
Also, it's not like servers have never been shut down before. Like Blizzard shutting down those classic servers (which means there is precedent right?)
I don't think that EA, Blizzard, and the like lose much sleep over fans running greyshards from old products that have already served any useful purpose to monetize or writeoff as an expense.
What they lose sleep over is the increasing amount of scrutiny into their business models by regulatory agencies, consumer groups, activists, parents, governments, and the public at large. The last thing they want are accusations that they are cold, insensitive misers who don't care who they hurt, so long as they keep what they took. It's that kind of reputation that brings the regulators in, shuts down loot boxes and DLC schemes, and impacts their ability to do what they are doing.
No, what they want is to be seen as kind people. Good people. Giving people. They want to be seen as nice people who aren't ruthlessly exploiting people's good natures, fighting over every nickel in their pockets, like what their detractors claim they do. They want to be seen as the better man than those who accuse them of these bad things, and I can think of no better way to show this than to let stuff like the CoH thing go.
Because instead of letting their detractors say "look at this pathetic company that is so greedy that they are willing to spend money and time making an issue over the old crap they threw away seven years ago," they can say "look, we had every right to go after them, but we didn't, because we are, in our hearts, nice people who don't deserve the reputation that's been given to us."
__________________________ "Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it." --Arcken
"...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints." --Hellmar, CEO of CCP.
"It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls." --Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE
If they do not exercise their rights they will lose their rights. So they will act that is a given even if it is to make an example they will do it. What happened to Nostalrius is evidence of that.
No company is dumb enough to placidly lose their right to act.
Once the server reaches a critical size they will swoop down and tear it down like they do to WoW private servers. Most of them implode before that from mismanagement and greed so Blizzard has turned a blind eye but when they reach critical success they will shut it down.
Most individuals running these servers when faced with legal action will cave in. The aftermath of Nostalrius shutting down lead to a server that was run to the ground by the people running the server and its successor never achieved the success Nostalrius did.
Wouldn't they have to prove damages? As in lost income, not potential income?
And in this case there is no lost income.
I don't know? Is that true? I know there is an argument for potential income but what happens when that product is no longer available?
I think there is also an argument for damaging a brand. So having a "City of Heroes" game out there and having people play it and not have a good experience could be an argument for shutting the server down.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Wouldn't they have to prove damages? As in lost income, not potential income?
And in this case there is no lost income.
There is statutory damages. Plus cease and desist is not dependent on proof of damages.
That's true but that isn't a given. That could be awarded but since there isn't a case there is no award. They would have to prove infringement first, which seems pretty easy actually. Then the court would determine that based on the statute.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
Its so weird to see so many cheering for the "bad guys."
Perhaps playing video games is harmful after all.
NCSOFT are the bad guys, they have been for years
No, they are not the bad guys. They are a company trying to make money. They make products and want to sell them. When they can't make enough money for what they need they shut down projects and invest in more viable projects.
Players need to learn to put things in perspective.
If they think things last forever then they need to reassess. It's unfortunate that our favorite games might not be around in 5 years let alone 1 year but they are not doing this because we are part of a club.
They're attempting to make money off of CoH by not using it at all? And by paying lawyer fees anytime some gamers attempt to spin up a server to continue using their copies of the title?
That makes little sense. Doesn't seem to support your assertions.
Don't blame NCSoft for shutting it down. Would I blame them for wasting money on shutting down not-for-profit private servers for a game they've completely abandoned and one that is not playable AT ALL without such a server? Absolutely.
Doomcall about IP theft and virtue signal all you like, a private CoH server means jack shit to NCSoft's bottom line (nor, in any realistic manner, would it affect the health of a dead IP). That's the reality.
Its so weird to see so many cheering for the "bad guys."
Perhaps playing video games is harmful after all.
NCSOFT are the bad guys, they have been for years
No, they are not the bad guys. They are a company trying to make money. They make products and want to sell them. When they can't make enough money for what they need they shut down projects and invest in more viable projects.
Players need to learn to put things in perspective.
If they think things last forever then they need to reassess. It's unfortunate that our favorite games might not be around in 5 years let alone 1 year but they are not doing this because we are part of a club.
They're attempting to make money off of CoH by not using it at all? And by paying lawyer fees anytime some gamers attempt to spin up a server to continue using their copies of the title?
That makes little sense. Doesn't seem to support your assertions.
Don't blame NCSoft for shutting it down. Would I blame them for wasting money on shutting down not-for-profit private servers for a game they've completely abandoned and is not playable AT ALL without such a server? Absolutely.
Doomcall about IP theft and virtue signal all you like, a private CoH server means jack shit to NCSoft's bottom line. That's the reality.
It's not about making money off it "yet."
Companies sometimes have things they sit on until the time they want to use it again.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Its so weird to see so many cheering for the "bad guys."
Perhaps playing video games is harmful after all.
NCSOFT are the bad guys, they have been for years
No, they are not the bad guys. They are a company trying to make money. They make products and want to sell them. When they can't make enough money for what they need they shut down projects and invest in more viable projects.
Players need to learn to put things in perspective.
If they think things last forever then they need to reassess. It's unfortunate that our favorite games might not be around in 5 years let alone 1 year but they are not doing this because we are part of a club.
They're attempting to make money off of CoH by not using it at all? And by paying lawyer fees anytime some gamers attempt to spin up a server to continue using their copies of the title?
That makes little sense. Doesn't seem to support your assertions.
Don't blame NCSoft for shutting it down. Would I blame them for wasting money on shutting down not-for-profit private servers for a game they've completely abandoned and is not playable AT ALL without such a server? Absolutely.
Doomcall about IP theft and virtue signal all you like, a private CoH server means jack shit to NCSoft's bottom line. That's the reality.
It's not about making money off it "yet."
Companies sometimes have things they sit on until the time they want to use it again.
Explain to me how a CoH private server would prevent NCSoft from funding the development of a new title based on the IP, or how said server would realistically hinder their ability to successfully market or sell said new title.
It's already a 15 year old game. If NCSoft employs a dev team that's really so incompetent that it can't persuade lovers of the IP to drop a decade and a half+ old game for a newer title to the point it cripples their ability to make money off a new title, they've got much larger problems than a damn private server containing a minuscule amount of gamers.
I have always believed emulation should be allowed for shut down MMORPG. Offer the game at cost to consumer to run or source code.
I am heavily invested in Microsoft digital games because it is cheaper to buy digital most times than 2 disc in a dual Xbox household. What happens if MS decides to get out of console market. Will I lose rights to access all of my games?
Imagine Steam is forced to shutdown. Should they be forced to give there gaming services to the public to at least access their game library or are they just gone?
Comments
"Stick it to the man" and all that I guess.
Just doesn't sit so well with me as I've worked for "the man" most of my life.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Aloha Mr Hand !
They mostly restrict their lawsuits to bars and other public venues which actually have money to pay if they lose.
I suspect most individuals just quickly comply when contacted.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I find it interesting that the hottest MMORPG news this week has nothing much to do with what's coming, or what's playing, but the clandestine restoration of a game that has been closed down for seven years.
It tells me several things. It tells me that, whatever the publishers have been doing the past seven years, it was pretty pathetic. The technology has never been better. The distribution model has never been more accessible. And the marketing and monetization schemes have never been more optimized to make money hand over fist.
But the loyalty isn't there. The relationship isn't there. The support between publisher and fan isn't there. It isn't there, because it wasn't shown. And so it's becoming harder for big publishers to get the hype to stick. And so you get big projects like Anthem who can really say and do nothing to get fans interested in remaining loyal...why should they? Everybody knows by now that these people will throw you under the bus for the next guy, close up for any and no reason, break your games the please customers who don't exist, and so on.
The entire situation behind CoH's closure seven years ago was symbolic of the changing dynamic between publisher and fan.
NCSoft said that CoH "wasn't profitable enough," but it was soon revealed through internal documents how CoH consistently was able to pay its bills, produce stable revenue above and beyond operating costs, with record levels of subscriber retention. But that didn't matter. The problem with CoH wasn't that its users couldn't make it a successful enterprise. The problem was that CoH attracted the wrong kind of users.
What CoH attracted were enthusiasts and hobbyists, level-headed wholesome folk, families, and friends. What NCSoft wanted were addictive personalities, compulsive gambling types, and impressionable youth. See, CoH was designed as an amusement park, or a town square. The reason there's so much interest today behind this game seven years dead is that nobody seems very interested in offering that anymore. All publishers are interested in are casinos for compulsive gamblers.
Some folks here are concerned that NCSoft will enforce its legal prerogatives against the clandestine working group and the hosts. I think they had a better chance of doing that back when this industry at least had a thin vernier of legitimacy associated with it.
But when South Korea and China start to pass legislation to protect their youth from these games, when EU countries start to classify you as casinos, when the press reveals the nature of your DLC schemes and microtransactions, and when every interest group from the far left to the far right seems interested in making you a scapegoat for all of society's ills, you no longer look like an industry that deserves legal prerogatives. MMO publishers are increasingly looking like big tobacco, or off-track betting, or pornography: quasi-legitimate industries that only exist because the people haven't gotten around to killing you yet. Best not to give them an excuse.
The last thing any publisher is going to want to do these days is to get a disgruntled subscriber into a courtroom. NCSoft has too much to lose by pursuing legal action, and nothing (besides ill will) to gain. These people, and this game, no longer matter to NCSoft's business strategy. So they should let them go, like they did in 2012.
__________________________
"Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it."
--Arcken
"...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints."
--Hellmar, CEO of CCP.
"It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls."
--Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Back during the Napster days, there was no GoFundMe. There wasn't a lot of Twitter and Facebook interconnectedness. It was easy to isolate and intimidate the kid sharing files on a server. Those days are over.
First thing that'll happen once they file the case is that every fansite, industry news org, press service, and so on is going to cover it. A GoFundMe will go up, and within a few days a legal fund will acquire enough funds through contributions to make NCSoft know that this isn't going to be cheap or easy. It would not even surprise me if people could raise even more money than NC Soft will want to spend, given the number of people (many of which have deep pockets) who would just love to kick NC Soft in the nuts. And those aren't even the fans of CoH.
NC Soft would, if anything, get pressure from EA, Blizzard, and every other major publisher to drop the case. For if NC Soft loses this fight over property that isn't vital to them, a precedent will be set that will make all their property, like Lineage II, more difficult to protect. If, as you say, these companies are "all about money," there really isn't any of NCSoft's money that's at stake here by simply letting this go. It isn't like they are giving the source code of Lineage II or Aion away, code that is actually worth protecting, because it is making money.
And assuming they actually fight this tooth and nail, it will be a PR nightmare. Press coverage will be intense. It will be difficult for NCSoft to control the narrative. Should NCSoft win, do you think this will be the end of NCSoft's woes? It is a foreign company, after all. It wouldn't surprise me if the people who would lose in such a scenario, mainly the disgruntled American fans, would use something like that to back legislation restricting the ability of foreign software companies to do business in the USA, just to piss NCSoft off. To quote Apollo Creed's trainer in Rocky II, "We don't need this kind of man in our lives."
See, it is because NCSoft is "all about the money" that I expect them to do nothing if they are smart. Because the only thing that would be at stake is "the principle of the thing," namely operating code without their permission, but it isn't like there is any money at stake. The fans, however, will fight with every dollar their community can muster for their principles. Money is not an issue for them; their issue is with NCSoft.
NCSoft would gain very little but the satisfaction of kicking down some hobbyists who toyed around with the junk they threw away. They will lose time, money, good will, PR, and legitimacy doing it, even in the best case scenario.
__________________________
"Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it."
--Arcken
"...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints."
--Hellmar, CEO of CCP.
"It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls."
--Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE
Aloha Mr Hand !
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
NC Not doing anything means they missed an opportunity and in the world of business, you snooze, you lose.
If you throw something away, maybe you should not be upset that someone finds treasure in your trash.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
And in this case there is no lost income.
What they lose sleep over is the increasing amount of scrutiny into their business models by regulatory agencies, consumer groups, activists, parents, governments, and the public at large. The last thing they want are accusations that they are cold, insensitive misers who don't care who they hurt, so long as they keep what they took. It's that kind of reputation that brings the regulators in, shuts down loot boxes and DLC schemes, and impacts their ability to do what they are doing.
No, what they want is to be seen as kind people. Good people. Giving people. They want to be seen as nice people who aren't ruthlessly exploiting people's good natures, fighting over every nickel in their pockets, like what their detractors claim they do. They want to be seen as the better man than those who accuse them of these bad things, and I can think of no better way to show this than to let stuff like the CoH thing go.
Because instead of letting their detractors say "look at this pathetic company that is so greedy that they are willing to spend money and time making an issue over the old crap they threw away seven years ago," they can say "look, we had every right to go after them, but we didn't, because we are, in our hearts, nice people who don't deserve the reputation that's been given to us."
__________________________
"Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it."
--Arcken
"...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints."
--Hellmar, CEO of CCP.
"It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls."
--Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE
No company is dumb enough to placidly lose their right to act.
Once the server reaches a critical size they will swoop down and tear it down like they do to WoW private servers. Most of them implode before that from mismanagement and greed so Blizzard has turned a blind eye but when they reach critical success they will shut it down.
Most individuals running these servers when faced with legal action will cave in. The aftermath of Nostalrius shutting down lead to a server that was run to the ground by the people running the server and its successor never achieved the success Nostalrius did.
So stay small and you may stay alive.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
That makes little sense. Doesn't seem to support your assertions.
Don't blame NCSoft for shutting it down. Would I blame them for wasting money on shutting down not-for-profit private servers for a game they've completely abandoned and one that is not playable AT ALL without such a server? Absolutely.
Doomcall about IP theft and virtue signal all you like, a private CoH server means jack shit to NCSoft's bottom line (nor, in any realistic manner, would it affect the health of a dead IP). That's the reality.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
It's already a 15 year old game. If NCSoft employs a dev team that's really so incompetent that it can't persuade lovers of the IP to drop a decade and a half+ old game for a newer title to the point it cripples their ability to make money off a new title, they've got much larger problems than a damn private server containing a minuscule amount of gamers.
I am heavily invested in Microsoft digital games because it is cheaper to buy digital most times than 2 disc in a dual Xbox household. What happens if MS decides to get out of console market. Will I lose rights to access all of my games?
Imagine Steam is forced to shutdown. Should they be forced to give there gaming services to the public to at least access their game library or are they just gone?