I don't get this whole declining notion...I log onto FFXIV it's packed and there are queues, I log onto Neverwinter it's packed, I log onto ESO it's a Ghost Town but that's Zo$ fault, I log onto GW2 it;s packed.
I think MMO's are doing ok personally
Agreed, anyone log in to classic, then try and tell me they are not popular, absolutly PACKED!!! and am on a low pop server ffs.
Problem is no one is making them triple A's anymore so we are all in what we have availaible, which ain't many options overall depending on your tastes.
So people are playing games like Classic for a lack of anything newer or better?
Sounds pretty much like an industry or genre in decline when everyone returns to their past when everything newer is shit.
The popularity is definitely not what it once was, if it was, there would still be another new mmorpg launched every other week.
Overall though there is still a very large number of followers, people still interested in mmorpg's.
I mention classic as i only play classic and SWG:Legends and some retail (well a lot of retail lately?) but that's all i can speak for atm. I guess my point was no matter your preference there is still a strong following.
SWG:L is hitting new concurrency numbers, Classic is always packed although some people and sites like to portray it's not which is silly as it's the most packed server i've seen since 2004 back when mmorpg's where hot af.
Today they are not hot af with the "majority" of gamers and the genre is pretty much dead, is dead. People still interested just chat by regurgitating the same f'ing mmorp's over and over and over again while they wait for that new mmorpg which ain't coming.
I mean i'm guilty of it too but finally realized, pick from what you got and make a home with what you have available and stop living in the past and waiting for a future that's never going to come, ok so using past mmorp's for a future with mmorpg's (WTF) sounds f'ed, but what other options do we really have?
Pin hopes on that new mmorpg like Chronicles of Elyria, or Torchlight Frontiers, or that new Dune mmor... errr wait right another survival game, hey maybe unchained or pantheon, so 2 that's it where they might be real mmorpg's and maybe launch, or can always just regurgitate talk about every old mmorpg we ever played and reminisce continually living in the past as a future in mmorpg's.
Or
Pick your preference, such as streamlined ESO/Retail, or more old school Classic/SWG type, the options are out there, when one realizes that new mmorpg isn't coming and probably never will, that you can start being an mmorpg player again.
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MMOs are not in decline, it is just people are not willing to play for games that are subpar, copycat, p2w, lackluster, or lacking content.
T
Then they are in decline because people aren't willing to pay for games that are subpar, copycat, etc etc.
I think people are getting too uncomfortable and thinking that "less interest" = "going away.
It doesn't.
So for example, I'm a huge classical music fan. And not only concert music but Ballet (mostly modern) and Opera as well as early music and hardcore 20th century.
But the interest in that is farrrrr less than popular music. The interest in all sorts of classical music has lessened over the years. But this doesn't mean it's going away.
It's just not going to have the numbers that pop performers have. And that's fine.
So mmorpg's are not going away. They are here to stay. They will just have their ardent fans and the studios willing to make them. Which, at the moment, with the exception of Amazon, are small indy studios.
It reminds me of the Point and Click Graphical Adventure decline of the late 90's early 00's.
They were huge, even Blizzard were developing one. They realised the market was in decline and scrapped it.
I suppose the players that don't like to read are the ones we find in general or zone chat asking how to complete a quest. When the text for the quest clearly tells them how to do it. These may be kids/teenagers or they may be less intelligent or studious adults as well. Or players asking how to do something that we know the game already explained to them earlier at some point.
Oh that drives me nuts.
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I suppose the players that don't like to read are the ones we find in general or zone chat asking how to complete a quest. When the text for the quest clearly tells them how to do it. These may be kids/teenagers or they may be less intelligent or studious adults as well. Or players asking how to do something that we know the game already explained to them earlier at some point.
Oh that drives me nuts.
It doesn't drive me nuts, but it does irritate me. Enough so that I've sometimes recommended that they should read the quest in a not-so friendly manner. And then another person pipes up and says that I don't have to be like that.
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Two idiots trying to talk about shit they know nothing about. Wow didn't start a revelation of mmorpgs nor did they define it. It released in 2004 and it never left that year to this date. The only people that get to talk about the state and future of mmo's are people that progress in that field and learn. If anything negative comes to the future of mmorpgs its because greed and idiocy, not because no one is interested. We also don't live in that future and we will get better and greater mmorpgs. In short, fuck this bitch.
What a joke..MMO games went to trash which is why noone plays. Those trash p2w from the East along with there rnd and grinds made everyone puke. Every game is built now on a cash shop first game second. Yes you Eso and Neverwinter. You want a good game don't go f2p don't have p2w don't have a cash shop. Have a sub or b2p to keep bots and scum out. Make levels count for something and have engaging boss mechanics and a high variety of items. Don't promote solo play...Eso all those people play with noone or maybe for 15mins for a dungeon and then it's solo same with gw2...in short have a community..you invest they invest...that's why mmo are declining
Lack of vision by Blizzard. Blizzard had 16 years after wow to make another MMO franchise, Mike Morhaime dropped the ball completely.
Diablo would have been easily transitioned to a PVE mmo, game would have been huge as an mmo. Starcraft PVP mmo 3 large armies/realms. I mean geez how could you see that wasnt perfectly setup to be a massive PVP mmo.
They should have had 3 unique experiences just like the original games had. People could have had all 3. Maybe have 1 or 2 like ESO where you could buy to play each xpac as you go, or sub for all of them...
MMO's are not dead, whats dead is Blizzards vision.
Lack of vision by Blizzard. Blizzard had 16 years after wow to make another MMO franchise, Mike Morhaime dropped the ball completely.
Diablo would have been easily transitioned to a PVE mmo, game would have been huge as an mmo. Starcraft PVP mmo 3 large armies/realms. I mean geez how could you see that wasnt perfectly setup to be a massive PVP mmo.
They should have had 3 unique experiences just like the original games had. People could have had all 3. Maybe have 1 or 2 like ESO where you could buy to play each xpac as you go, or sub for all of them...
MMO's are not dead, whats dead is Blizzards vision.
Not just lack of vision. Talent, care, passion, all gone.
Just look at Warcraft 3 remaster.
They could print money with a good Diablo or Starcraft MMORPG. They don't care about making a good game all they care about is making money. They have been clueless and tone deaf for a while now. Diablo Immortal anyone?
"You CAN'T buy ships for RL money." - MaxBacon
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
Those two genres 'stoled' a good chunk of the MMORPG market.
MMORPGs can still be really profitable, but Mobas and Battle Royales are much cheaper to make and mantain, and bring in just as much if not more money.
Fortnite cost a tenth of WoW to make but it's making the same kind of money.
Not just lack of vision. Talent, care, passion, all gone.
Just look at Warcraft 3 remaster.
They could print money with a good Diablo or Starcraft MMORPG. They don't care about making a good game all they care about is making money. They have been clueless and tone deaf for a while now. Diablo Immortal anyone?
Whats weird on one hand you are saying they could print money if they made a good MMO off their franchises Diablo/SC, but on the other hand I hear people say all they care about is making money.
I actually agree with you here. But it is contradictory.
Its like they are so worried about losing the WOW cash cow, they have destroyed their own franchises and future by being so risk adverse. Now 20 years later they have lost the ability to make great games they used to make.
Reminds me of Microsoft, some of their best products were 20 years ago, their lack of innovations since is disgusting. Most of the big competitors are slowly passing them by. But they are such a large monopoly they are in the way of all the small innovators.
If you took all of the people that are playing MMOs now and put them into a couple of games like they had in late 90s/early 2000s, then everyone would be impressed at how MMOs are booming.......
It's also true that many MMORPGs now have voice actors reading the quests while displaying the quest in text form at the same time.
Sometimes I skip reading quests (or even FMV/cut scenes) in an MMORPG or game that has a dull, uninteresting, or just plain stupid story. But I probably won't be playing that game very long if it doesn't have very good gameplay and overall design. Which most likely will not be the case. However, there is a lot more to read in MMORPGs besides quests.
Skill descriptions
Spell descriptions
Weapon, armor, and item descriptions
Help menus
All kinds of things really.
I suppose the players that don't like to read are the ones we find in general or zone chat asking how to complete a quest. When the text for the quest clearly tells them how to do it. These may be kids/teenagers or they may be less intelligent or studious adults as well. Or players asking how to do something that we know the game already explained to them earlier at some point.
Nope People are dumb, go try heroes of the strom, people there are so stupid they can't even figure out the level system.
What's your point though? Are you saying that MMORPGs should cater to stupid people?
"If everything was easy, nothing would be hard."
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We live in a dark age of MMO development plain and simple. Right now almost every game coming out is some BS designed around sandbox concepts, crafting being the focus, or the players building or determining the world.
That is a copout.
If you want players to pay for a game, which is what drives income and consistent quality development over time, you need to provide them with a rich world they can immerse themselves in, where they can build a unique character they feel a sense of identity with. That is the hook.
Meeting people and building friendships and venturing into danger with them, all that stuff that is also a hook is dependent on the above.
Twenty years from now MMOs will be a bigger part of the entertainment industry than they are now. The growth will happen, it just requires game developers who have a clue what is important. This downturn will serve as a great lesson for future game devs.
We live in a dark age of MMO development plain and simple. Right now almost every game coming out is some BS designed around sandbox concepts, crafting being the focus, or the players building or determining the world.
That is a copout.
If you want players to pay for a game, which is what drives income and consistent quality development over time, you need to provide them with a rich world they can immerse themselves in, where they can build a unique character they feel a sense of identity with. That is the hook.
Meeting people and building friendships and venturing into danger with them, all that stuff that is also a hook is dependent on the above.
Twenty years from now MMOs will be a bigger part of the entertainment industry than they are now. The growth will happen, it just requires game developers who have a clue what is important. This downturn will serve as a great lesson for future game devs.
Why would allowing players to build or determine the (what exactly, the direction?) of the game world be a cop-out?
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I stop listening to someone the moment they use World of Warcraft as a gauge for the MMO genre. The only reason anyone should mention WoW in an MMORPG discussion is to mention the fact that WoW destroyed the QUALITY of the genre. Some, but not all of those ways include: Bringing the battle.net kids and their bullshit to the genre and convincing developers that imitating WoW is the fast track to success with an MMO. WoW was popular because Blizzard had a huge following already, advertising, and because it's cartoon graphics would run on craptastic machines. WoW started the shift of the genre towards immediate gratification and pandering to the spoiled brat ADHD crowd.
A "classic" MMO would do just fine now days if it was done right. OR, if you want to push the genre and create something revolutionary add heavy survival elements (Conan Exiles/Rust/etc) to the game.
The thing that originally made MMOs popular wasn't all the homo-erotica in General Chat (there was no General Chat!). It was the fact that the genre was pushing the RPG into the realm of realism, AKA the world went on when you weren't playing, the world was shared by all, etc.
Oblivious. Everyone is playing "classic" versions of 15 year old MMO's for a reason.
Along with my wife. The crazy thing is playing classic with add ons? Retail WoW has most of them built in. I went to classic wow remembering what it was like to read and have to follow the directions instead of heading straight for the circle in map. I stick to retail WoW with one add on. Does anyone play classic with no add ons?
This post is intentionally written as to not make any sense what so ever. Thank You Very Much.
We live in a dark age of MMO development plain and simple. Right now almost every game coming out is some BS designed around sandbox concepts, crafting being the focus, or the players building or determining the world.
That is a copout.
If you want players to pay for a game, which is what drives income and consistent quality development over time, you need to provide them with a rich world they can immerse themselves in, where they can build a unique character they feel a sense of identity with. That is the hook.
Meeting people and building friendships and venturing into danger with them, all that stuff that is also a hook is dependent on the above.
Twenty years from now MMOs will be a bigger part of the entertainment industry than they are now. The growth will happen, it just requires game developers who have a clue what is important. This downturn will serve as a great lesson for future game devs.
There is a segment of the mmorpg population who believe the whole idea of having " rich world they can immerse themselves in, building a unique character" is so they can, you know, actually be a part of that world, interact with it, make their mark.
All the while "meeting people, building friendships and venturing into danger."
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Also, some people just shouldn't be playing rpgs or mmorpgs. They are not for everyone. People that don't like to think or read shouldn't be playing them. People that can't learn to like to think or read shouldn't be playing them.
What people shouldn't do is assume they are in a place to say what other people should do. They are for anyone that wants to play them.
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Post edited by [Deleted User] on
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
WoW caught lightning in a bottle. They had exceptional success such that
even with many years of decline they still have impressive population
compared to their fellows.
It is an outlier that somehow became confused with a standard.
There
has been a decline in MMORPG interest but there has also been a rise in alternatives in online gaming. It's not simply a case of MMORPGs are bad now.
Also, those interested in the genre are spread quite thinly. Aside from WoW, FFXIV, and ESO there are many other games that have carved out an enduring presence. Those interested in the genre are spread more
thinly than they once were.
There is a huge number of alternatives from the recent to the ancient players have gravitated to in accordance with their taste and preferences. New World is just around the corner and seems to have drawn some favour as well.
We are not starved for MMORPGs. The table is well laden with dishes from broad to varying narrow appeal. Many still feast on their meal of choice each and every day.
Oblivious. Everyone is playing "classic" versions of 15 year old MMO's for a reason.
HAHA, WTF is so Damn Funny is People playing WoW classic with al these add ons. Really? I Play WoW since pre order first ever. It was meant to be figured out, Not to stick add ons to it to do it for you. Hence Retail, they put almost all the add ons you could ask for. If youre playing classic with any addons your a fake.
This post is intentionally written as to not make any sense what so ever. Thank You Very Much.
Comments
Oh that drives me nuts.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
No one.
Diablo would have been easily transitioned to a PVE mmo, game would have been huge as an mmo.
Starcraft PVP mmo 3 large armies/realms. I mean geez how could you see that wasnt perfectly setup to be a massive PVP mmo.
They should have had 3 unique experiences just like the original games had. People could have had all 3. Maybe have 1 or 2 like ESO where you could buy to play each xpac as you go, or sub for all of them...
MMO's are not dead, whats dead is Blizzards vision.
"classification of games into MMOs is not by rational reasoning" - nariusseldon
Love Minecraft. And check out my Youtube channel OhCanadaGamer
Try a MUD today at http://www.mudconnect.com/Whats weird on one hand you are saying they could print money if they made a good MMO off their franchises Diablo/SC, but on the other hand I hear people say all they care about is making money.
I actually agree with you here. But it is contradictory.
Its like they are so worried about losing the WOW cash cow, they have destroyed their own franchises and future by being so risk adverse. Now 20 years later they have lost the ability to make great games they used to make.
Reminds me of Microsoft, some of their best products were 20 years ago, their lack of innovations since is disgusting. Most of the big competitors are slowly passing them by. But they are such a large monopoly they are in the way of all the small innovators.
That is a copout.
If you want players to pay for a game, which is what drives income and consistent quality development over time, you need to provide them with a rich world they can immerse themselves in, where they can build a unique character they feel a sense of identity with. That is the hook.
Meeting people and building friendships and venturing into danger with them, all that stuff that is also a hook is dependent on the above.
Twenty years from now MMOs will be a bigger part of the entertainment industry than they are now. The growth will happen, it just requires game developers who have a clue what is important. This downturn will serve as a great lesson for future game devs.
A "classic" MMO would do just fine now days if it was done right. OR, if you want to push the genre and create something revolutionary add heavy survival elements (Conan Exiles/Rust/etc) to the game.
The thing that originally made MMOs popular wasn't all the homo-erotica in General Chat (there was no General Chat!). It was the fact that the genre was pushing the RPG into the realm of realism, AKA the world went on when you weren't playing, the world was shared by all, etc.
Along with my wife. The crazy thing is playing classic with add ons? Retail WoW has most of them built in. I went to classic wow remembering what it was like to read and have to follow the directions instead of heading straight for the circle in map. I stick to retail WoW with one add on. Does anyone play classic with no add ons?
This post is intentionally written as to not make any sense what so ever. Thank You Very Much.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
What people shouldn't do is assume they are in a place to say what other people should do. They are for anyone that wants to play them.
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
It is an outlier that somehow became confused with a standard.
There has been a decline in MMORPG interest but there has also been a rise in alternatives in online gaming. It's not simply a case of MMORPGs are bad now.
Also, those interested in the genre are spread quite thinly. Aside from WoW, FFXIV, and ESO there are many other games that have carved out an enduring presence. Those interested in the genre are spread more thinly than they once were.
There is a huge number of alternatives from the recent to the ancient players have gravitated to in accordance with their taste and preferences. New World is just around the corner and seems to have drawn some favour as well.
We are not starved for MMORPGs. The table is well laden with dishes from broad to varying narrow appeal. Many still feast on their meal of choice each and every day.
MMO's will always be popular to me.
Proud MMORPG.com member since March 2004! Make PvE GREAT Again!
HAHA, WTF is so Damn Funny is People playing WoW classic with al these add ons. Really? I Play WoW since pre order first ever. It was meant to be figured out, Not to stick add ons to it to do it for you. Hence Retail, they put almost all the add ons you could ask for. If youre playing classic with any addons your a fake.
This post is intentionally written as to not make any sense what so ever. Thank You Very Much.